Living in a glass house: Things Clive Hamilton says

Clive Hamilton has an op-ed in The Age today bemoaning the Rinehart share raid on Fairfax. He says a lot of nice things about Gina and her father.

Last year Rinehart was named by Forbes magazine Australia’s richest person. She is reported to hold more than $20 billion in assets. Citigroup estimates she is on track to become the richest person in the world.
Rinehart inherited more than father Lang Hancock’s mining company; she took on his politics, too. Hancock was described by one journalist as “a swashbuckling right-winger who believed people and governments should bow to his will”. On workers’ rights, WA secession and special deals for mining, Gina is her father’s daughter. John Singleton, who has been close to both, said ”a conversation with Gina was a conversation with Lang. They both had the same fanaticism.”
Hancock was close to the authoritarian Queensland premier Joh Bjelke-Petersen, whom even Liberal Party MPs accused of running a police state. Bjelke-Petersen gave the eulogy at Hancock’s funeral. In 1975, Hancock launched John Singleton’s Workers Party, the forerunner of the new right in Australia. Gina was in attendance, soon after she had dropped out of the University of Sydney claiming the lecturers were communists.

So the worst that can be said is that they knew Joh Bjelke-Petersen?

Anyway he then launches into a bunch of people that Gina knows – the usual suspects and the usual complaints. It was this comment that really annoyed.

He [Monckton] is better known in this country for putting a swastika next to a photo of Ross Garnaut.

Monckton is known for that? He did do it but later apologised.

But I thought it might be useful to recall some of the things Hamilton has said over time. Mind you, it isn’t a complete list.

Here he glorifying (fictional) violence

When Watt, after disrupting a public lecture, followed Coghburn out of the venue haranguing, insulting and poking him in the chest, the scientist finally lost his rag and lashed out. Who hasn’t wanted to do that?

Here he is advocating the suspension of democracy

This is because the implications of 3C, let alone 4C or 5C, are so horrible that we look to any possible scenario to head it off, including the canvassing of “emergency” responses such as the suspension of democratic processes.

Here he is denying he advocated the suspension of democracy

Sometimes a lie is too good to discard even when it is known to be a falsehood. So The Australian continues to recycle the lie that I have advocated the “suspension of democracy” to tackle climate change.

Here he is comparing climate “denialists” to mass-murdering war criminals

Instead of dishonouring the deaths of six million in the past, climate deniers risk the lives of hundreds of millions in the future. Holocaust deniers are not responsible for the Holocaust, but climate deniers, if they were to succeed, would share responsibility for the enormous suffering caused by global warming.

Here he is expounding his approach to diversity of opinion

If Australia’s security services are not closely monitoring the activities of denialist activists then they are failing in their responsibilities.

As far as I’m aware Hamilton has yet to apologise for any of those statements.

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190 Responses to Living in a glass house: Things Clive Hamilton says

  1. m0nty

    So is Hamilton right about Rinehart funding the IPA, Sinclair? You didn’t address his claims in that area. Why didn’t you engage with his statements on the IPA?

  2. .

    Hamilton is a ^%$# who derides conspicuous consumption whilst being interviewed with a baby grand piano in the background.

    Can he even play the fricking thing?

  3. jtfsoon

    Someone needs to sic the Avian back on Clive again.
    Bird
    Get off your fat arse and get to work

  4. Sinclair Davidson

    The IPA is funded by voluntary donations from the public, memberships, and the sale of publications. Anyone who supports freedom of thought and free markets should donate.

  5. Biota

    Here he is denying he advocated the suspension of democracy

    Well of course he didn’t advocate that. He advocated suspension of the democratic process. /sarc

  6. .

    soon after she had dropped out of the University of Sydney claiming the lecturers were communists

    What does he mean by “claiming“? She made a prurient but utterly true observation.

  7. You’re on Twitter, Sinc. Start a “Shit Clive Hamilton Says” meme.

  8. C.L.

    Joh’s days were glory days of freedom compared to the police states inaugurated by the ALP.

  9. Fleeced

    Why do people keep calling it a share raid? Surely, under the circumstances, it’s a rescue.

  10. 1080

    Joh’s days were glory days of freedom

    Quite. Especially if you the wholesale corrupting of the police force, the Stasi-like Special Branch, Cedar Bay, The TAB affair, rampant cronyism, the midnight demolition of heritage sites, the lack of a Parliamentary Committee systen, the banning of public protests, perversion of the course of justice thanks to widespread verballing and failure to pursue charges against police thuggery. Ah yes, “glory days of freedom”. Compared to the police states of eastern Europe perhaps.

  11. 1080

    Should read Especially if you overlook the wholesale corrupting of the police force ..

  12. Gab

    I like to think of it as an intervention, Fleeced.

  13. JC

    Hamilton is a ^%$# who derides conspicuous consumption whilst being interviewed with a baby grand piano in the background.

    Yea Dot. I made the comment a few years ago when the gleaming bald galoot was advocating the suspension of democracy or tell kids to dob in their parents to authorities. That’s out ethicist.

    I bet the idiot can’t play it either and it just there for show.

  14. Fleeced

    Ah yes, “glory days of freedom”. Compared to the police states of eastern Europe perhaps.

    You’re repeating CL – he already said “compared to the police states inaugurated by the ALP.”

  15. JC

    Should read ….

    Metro, don’t even bother making a correction. I promise you very few people read your boring incoherent swill.

  16. Gab

    Oh leave the poor sod alone you two. 1o8o has been working very hard to get people’s attention, haven’t you pet?

  17. C.L.

    the lack of a Parliamentary Committee systen

    LOL. The ALP illegally abolished the Upper House.

    Labor’s Bundaberg Hospital holocaust was the worst public policy disaster in Queensland’s history.

    We now know that Bligh’s government was directly responsible for the destruction of large swathes of the state capital last year.

    Bligh has called an election without issuing writs, allowing the ALP to rob the treasury for four weeks.

    The health department pay debacle is the worst of its kind in Australian history.

    The Gordan Nuttal corruption affair is worse than anything ever seen in Queensland’s history.

    The Queensland ALP gave the state Keith Wright and Bill D’Arcy – continuing the ALP’s tradition of turning out convicted child molesters.

    The Beattie/Bligh years have been the most incompetent, corrupt and contemptuous of democracy in the state’s history.

    Joh’s days were glory days of freedom compared to the police states inaugurated by the ALP.

  18. 1080

    I promise you very few people read your boring incoherent swill.

    But I know you do pet and that’s all the counts. I own you. (Along with wayne, sando and metro of course.)

  19. .

    the midnight demolition of heritage sites

    Who. Gives. A. Fuck?

  20. 1080

    LOL. The ALP illegally abolished the Upper House.

    Didn’t realise the Upper House as a Parliamentary committee. Nor did anyone else, but you read it here first. By the way, that happened in the 1920s. Didn’t see Joh move to restore it.

    The Gordan Nuttal corruption affair is worse than anything ever seen in Queensland’s history.

    Yes, but gain, only if you overlook the jailing of Joh’s hand-picked Police Commissioner and half his upper echelon, the jailing of 4 Joh Cabinet ministers, oh and the charging of Joh himself, who would have been jailed himself but for the corruption of the jury system by one rogue National Party juror, Luke Shaw. Then there was that whole Fitzgerald Inquiry thing needed to clean out the filthy Augean Stables left by Joh.

  21. Rabz

    Someone needs to sic the Avian back on Clive again.

    My sentiments exactly.

    One of the most legendary instances of speaking troof to power evah:

    More from clive on that Climate of Hate™:

    As an author I am targeted too. A couple of months ago I opened my email to read this from someone calling himself “Graeme Bird”:

    “Let’s have that evidence then you Stalinist c**t. Either come up with the evidence or admit publicly that you are a fraud and kill yourself. What a complete c**t you are.”

  22. twostix

    Yea Dot. I made the comment a few years ago when the gleaming bald galoot was advocating the suspension of democracy or tell kids to dob in their parents to authorities. That’s out ethicist.

    He also had a key hand in boosting the Internet Censorship scheme.

    Lovely chap.

  23. C.L.

    Didn’t realise the Upper House as a Parliamentary committee… Yes, but gain…

    Joh was also more adept with the English language than you.

    But yes, the Queensland ALP – of child molesters, flood disasters, hospital deaths, pay debacles, Nuttal corruption, illegal electioneering and treasury raids – is certainly the most corrupt and incompetent in the state’s history.

  24. .

    The solution is obvious. Carve up the corrupt and festering QLD corpse between NSW, NZ, PNG, SA, Fiji, the Solomons and the NT.

  25. Infidel Tiger

    The luvvies were expecting a government bailout for Fairfax, not some private citizen. This is an outrage.

  26. JC

    My sentiments exactly.

    One of the most legendary instances of speaking troof to power evah:

    No, there was an instance when he was referring the Happy Hamilton as a gleaming cue ball in another of Happy’s demented piece’s at The ABC’s Lunatics Unleashed. It was the one Happy was boasting (yea boasting) about his self-importance seeing he too also received a “death threat”…. like he had somehow joined an exalted group and wasn’t left out. But was only Bird.

  27. papachango

    Hamilton is a ^%$# who derides conspicuous consumption whilst being interviewed with a baby grand piano in the background.

    Yes but he’s a dangerous ^%$# too. Gawd help us if he gets anywhere the levers of power.

  28. JC

    Gawd help us if he gets anywhere the levers of power.

    He tried. Of course our Democracy loving Greens ran the bald twerp in Higgins which he lost. The Greens desperately desired some diversity in their party so they went with Rhiannon at the next election.

  29. m0nty

    The IPA is funded by voluntary donations from the public, memberships, and the sale of publications. Anyone who supports freedom of thought and free markets should donate.

    No answer, came the stern reply.

    Hamilton’s accusation that Rinehart has funded a big expansion in the IPA is there for all to see, Sinclair. Dodging it like that doesn’t make you look good.

  30. papachango

    IF I recall the ALP didn’t bother putting a candidate up. Thank F…. Kelly O’Dwyer got up.

  31. JC

    Monster,

    Seriously fuck off and get back under your rock, you fat headed child. Happy Hamilton never revealed his funding sources when the bald galoot was the unAustralia Institute.

    We’re still, even now, a free society and if the IPA chooses not to reveal their funding sources then so be it, you revolting little clown.

  32. JC

    Papa

    He actually got around 35% of the vote, I think, however that underscored how unpopular he actually was here in Higgins because the Liar’s Party never ran a candidate (as you said)

  33. Sinclair Davidson

    m0nty, two points: 1. hardly an ‘accusation’; speculation at best – he doesn’t actually know. 2. it is OT.

  34. papachango

    I have no idea if she has, but who cares if Rinehart donated to the IPA anyway ?

    Commie or militiant union nutters donate to leftwing think tanks or the Greens all the time, and according to the likes of m0nty or Happy Hamilton that doesn’t compromise their policies.

  35. Infidel Tiger

    No answer, came the stern reply.

    The IPA believes in the right to privacy mOnty. They are hardly going to disclose who donates to them.

  36. twostix

    No answer, came the stern reply.

    Hamilton’s accusation that Rinehart has funded a big expansion in the IPA is there for all to see, Sinclair. Dodging it like that doesn’t make you look good.

    Erm what difference does it make if she donated? Where’s your stern questioning over all the leftist organisations and their massive influxes of cash? Especially American cash.

    Also what is it with leftists and their juvenile need to have some comic book villians pulling the levers of the world? Koch Bros for the American left and now apparently Rinehart for the Australian left.

  37. JC

    The IPA believes in the right to privacy mOnty. They are hardly going to disclose who donates to them.

    Hey Monster, you moron. You have that silly game on the web…. pretend football. Please reveal all the names of people along with their addresss etc asap as you expect the IPA to do with their own sources.

    Go on. I fucking dare you, you fat headed child.

  38. badm0f0

    Joh’s days were glory days of freedom compared to the police states inaugurated by the ALP.

    Not even close.

  39. papachango

    35% in somewhere like Higgins is still a concern for a nutcase like Hamilton. Imagine if he’d run in Melbourne

  40. Token

    I have no idea if she has, but who cares if Rinehart donated to the IPA anyway ?

    Don’t you know the Da Murdoch “hate media” scare is old news, so 2011. Now the luvvies all have a new target for their populist rage, Gina Fever is the thing for every self respecting lefty.

  41. Token

    35% in somewhere like Higgins is still a concern for a nutcase like Hamilton. Imagine if he’d run in Melbourne

    As if the Watermelon greens would let a mad Green Green get near a seat where a person could get elected…

  42. JC

    Koch Bros for the American left and now apparently Rinehart for the Australian left.

    Envy. I mean wouldn’t you be a little embarrassed if you had former Nazi sympathizer, the shadowy George Soros funding your AstroTurf operations? I mean this is a guy who is 83 and using his money to bonk 20 year old, while our side has serious people for the most part.

  43. JC

    Happy Hamilton:

    This is because the implications of 3C, let alone 4C or 5C, are so horrible that we look to any possible scenario to head it off, including the canvassing of “emergency” responses such as the suspension of democratic processes.

    As revolting as it sounds, I think Happy gets seriously excited when he thinks about this sort of thing… suspending democratic freedoms. Regular normal dudes may look at porn, Happy thinks about suspending democracy and having Kids dob in their parents.

  44. Peter Patton

    Gina was in attendance, soon after she had dropped out of the University of Sydney claiming the lecturers were communists.

    The dopey bint shouldn’t have enrolled in Political Economy.

  45. sean

    Hamilton: ‘more hair than sense’

  46. C.L.

    Not even close.

    Right. Joh wasn’t even close.

  47. papachango

    Now the luvvies all have a new target for their populist rage, Gina Fever is the thing for every self respecting lefty.

    I thought their big whinge was about Da Murdoch owning too much media, something like 70% of circulation (which they falsely try to insinuate is market share).
    They should be very happy that Gina’s going to help provide some robust competition, as Fairfax weren’t doing terribly well on their own.

  48. badm0f0

    I mean wouldn’t you be a little embarrassed if you had former Nazi sympathizer, the shadowy George Soros funding your AstroTurf operations

    That a pretty despicable slur. A 14 year olf Hungarian Jew who poses as a Christian and cooperates in order to survive does not qualify as a sympathizer. I’m sure you can find plenty of other things wrong with Soros rather than resorting to this type of vile bullshit.

  49. C.L.

    Correction, JC.

    Soros wasn’t a Nazi sympathiser.

    He was a Nazi collaborater.

  50. Fleeced

    You have that silly game on the web…. pretend football.

    Slightly OT, but this reminds me of a comment I heard recently that fantasy football is like dungeons and dragons for jocks.

  51. Token

    They should be very happy that Gina’s going to help provide some robust competition, as Fairfax weren’t doing terribly well on their own.

    Yes, yes and yes.

    They should be happy that someone is willing to save the jobs of so many good people that have to work their guts out to carry the leaches.

    The thinking is amazing, but what we expect from the moronic left.

  52. JC

    Oh yea… Sorry. That’s true. He collaborated with the nazis in rounding up Jews. He may not have been sympathetic to them.

  53. JC

    Bado..

    Sorry, I used the wrong term. He also said in an interview that it was perhaps the most enjoyable time in his life. He was excited about it.

  54. C.L.

    Not merely collaborating to round Jews up.

    Soros was specifically involved in stealing their property on their way to the death camps.

    Lovely chap.

  55. badm0f0

    Right. Joh wasn’t even close

    Nice come back. The Bjelke-Petersen government was probably the most thoroughly corrupt administration in Australian history. That Nuttall was a despicably corrupt minister in no way diminishes Joh’s appalling record.

  56. JC

    Bado;

    I don’t think CL was excusing Joh. I read his comment to suggest Joh’s appalling record was superseded by the QLD Liar’s Party. Learn to read and comprehend please.

  57. C.L.

    The Bjelke-Petersen government was probably the most thoroughly corrupt administration in Australian history.

    LOL.

    They didn’t come within a bee’s dick of Whitlam, Bolte or Wran.

  58. JC

    Not merely collaborating to round Jews up.

    Soros was specifically involved in stealing their property on their way to the death camps.

    I think he was quoted as saying he “fondly” recalls this part of his life. I bet he did too.

  59. …claiming the lecturers were communists.

    I like her even more now.
    I have a copy of “Requiem for a species” and my 15 year old flipped through the first few pages and then looked up and said “Is this guy serious?”
    Of course I may have had something to do with his thoughts on this..

  60. twostix

    I think he was quoted as saying he “fondly” recalls this part of his life. I bet he did too.

    “No feeling of guilt?” asked Kroft. “No,” said Soros. “There was no sense that I shouldn’t be there. If I wasn’t doing it, somebody else would be taking it away anyhow. Whether I was there or not. So I had no sense of guilt.”

    Yet, even knowing all these gruesome details after the war, George Soros still described that year of the Hungarian Holocaust, during which his own hands had delivered “deportation” notices and confiscated Jewish properties, as “the most exciting time of my life.” Soros also told his biographer that for his family, the worst suffering had been their inability to obtain their preferred Titleist tennis balls.

  61. 1080

    The Bjelke-Petersen government was probably the most thoroughly corrupt administration in Australian history. The court records, the Corrective Services Department records and the Fitzgerald Inquiry report and records make that an open and shut case.

  62. C.L.

    LOL. The ALP illegally abolished the Upper House.

    Labor’s Bundaberg Hospital holocaust was the worst public policy disaster in Queensland’s history.

    We now know that Bligh’s government was directly responsible for the destruction of large swathes of the state capital last year.

    Bligh has called an election without issuing writs, allowing the ALP to rob the treasury for four weeks.

    The health department pay debacle is the worst of its kind in Australian history.

    The Gordan Nuttal corruption affair is worse than anything ever seen in Queensland’s history.

    The Queensland ALP gave the state Keith Wright and Bill D’Arcy – continuing the ALP’s tradition of turning out convicted child molesters.

    The Beattie/Bligh years have been the most incompetent, corrupt and contemptuous of democracy in the state’s history.

    Joh’s days were glory days of freedom compared to the police states inaugurated by the ALP.

  63. C.L.

    Joh was also a minnow compared to Whitlam – the corrupt buffoon who sought illegal monies everywhere, from Pakistani rug salesmen to Saddam Hussein.

  64. Adrien

    Anyone who supports freedom of thought and free markets should donate.

    Anyone who is simpatico with Bjelke-Petersen is highly unlikely to be a supporter of free thought or free markets.

  65. Sid Vicious

    Let’s not forget that Mr Hamilton is an Australian public intellectual and as such his word is good enough for me. He does seem to be an embodied paradox because he has an Order of Australia for “service to public debate…” yet he is a supporter of internet censorship in Australia. How can he be recognised for his service to public debate if he wants to silence those damn dissenting opinions.

  66. m0nty

    [Post edited for being OT. Sinc]

  67. 1080

    Not merely collaborating to round Jews up.

    Soros was specifically involved in stealing their property on their way to the death camps.

    Lovely chap.

    That is surely the most vicious, vile and slanderous anti-semtic remark ever posted on this site. By his own account, as a 14-year-old boy, Soros feld to the safety of a Christian family, the husband was a Hungarian puppet government official. On one occasion Soros occampanied him when he did the inventory of the estate of a Jewish family who had fled the country. And on this basis, Soros is labelled a “Nazi collaborator”? We might all ask ourselves what we would have done in the same circumstances.

    Sinclair, will you allow that to stand? I appreciate this is a robust forum, but surely some standards of ethics, morality and decency apply?

    Let’s just put that comment into context. Every Nazi death camp had a Sonderkommando of Jewish prisoners who fed the corpses of their kin and kind into the crematoriums. Were they Nazi collaborators? There were revolts by some of them, and a small few lived to tell the story. Would CL have the “courage” to stand before them and call them Nazi collaborators? Every Jewish ghetto had a Judenrat that was forced to assist the Nazis in liquidating them. Many try to alleviate suffering on the way and bring some order to the brutal and murderous chaos. Were they Nazi collaborators? Some Jewish officials worked with the Nazis, prior to the implementation of the Final Solution, to rid Europe of Jews by having them emigrate. Were they Nazi collaborators?

    The implications of this abhorrent comment are truly sickening. It is at one with the long-history of anti-semitic slanders on the Jewish people since the war: they were cowards who didn’t fight back; they helped in the murder of their own kind; they only have themselves to blame. It is vicious, it is vile, it is slanderous of Soros and the Jewish people and it is at heart, anti-semitic. I would be horrified to see it on a neo-Nazi white supremicist site, though it would be expected. It has no place on a libertarian site. It has no place in decent society. It should be taken down. Now.

    [1080 - As far as I can see the only person being anti-Semitic here is you. Everything you say in this post following "Let's just put that comment into context" is gratuitous and unnecessary. By that point you have already made your argument in defence of Soros' choices during WWII. Sinc]

  68. Adrien

    The ALP illegally abolished the Upper House.

    And introduced the malapportionment that made it almost impossible to vote the government out. Bjelke-Petersen’s first speech in parliament, I seem to remember, was hostile to the gerrymander. And so, when he became premier in ’68 he, um, made it worse.

    We now know that Bligh’s government was directly responsible for the destruction of large swathes of the state capital last year.

    Anna Bligh caused the flood?

    Joh’s days were glory days of freedom

    Doubleplusgood on the golden bullshit there old bean. You are the Master. Work in advertising?

  69. Infidel Tiger

    I appreciate this is a robust forum, but surely some standards of ethics, morality and decency apply?

    Obviously not if we allow you to post.

  70. C.L.

    Correct, Adrien.

    The gerrymander was introduced by the ALP.

    Joh’s days were glory days of freedom compared to the police states inaugurated by the ALP.

    ——————————–

    1080 – hysterical concern trolling doesn’t work here.

    George Soros was a Nazi collaborater. A cowardly turd who robbed Jews on their way to the death camps.

    Naturally, he’s an icon to the Democrat Party – a party whose third-in-line to the presidency until his last years was Robert Byrd – a Ku Klux Klansmen.

  71. 1080

    George Soros was a Nazi collaborater. A cowardly turd who robbed Jews on their way to the death camps.

    I will take no further part in this vile, slanderous and anti-semitic “debate”. But I will repeat here my public call for these comments to be taken down. If they are not, I will write directly to Sinclair and other members of the Catallaxy team drawing them to their attention. If the comments are still allowed to stand, I will draw them to the attention of the wider Austrlian Jewish community.

  72. JC

    It has no place in decent society. It should be taken down. Now.

    Get off your soap box, Metro, you clown.

  73. JC

    If they are not, I will write directly to Sinclair and other members of the Catallaxy team drawing them to their attention. If the comments are still allowed to stand, I will draw them to the attention of the wider Austrlian Jewish community.

    Get to work and start writing, metro. You got a lot of work to do, which means of course you won’t be posting here for a while.

    The fridge. Now!

  74. JC

    Oh and by the way, Metro. Soros was also indicted and found guilty of insider trading charges in France too. Suck that up your snout, you boofhead.

  75. Sinclair Davidson

    1080 – you ask a good question

    We might all ask ourselves what we would have done in the same circumstances.

    How well I remember Rabbi Berhard saying that, while we should always ‘choose life’, there were three kinds of traitor in this world …

  76. C.L.

    Soros not keen on Judaism:

    In fact, in the biography — aptly titled Soros, the Life and Times of a Messianic Billionaire — are scads of details that make Soros much more culpable than the Kroft interview. At age 72 — with 58 years for reflection — George Soros described his year of living under Nazi rule as “the most exciting time of my life.” That was the same year Soros’ own uncle, along with his wife and children, were “deported” to Auschwitz. But as Soros glibly recounted, his family had long ago abandoned Judaism — for a “cosmopolitan” pseudo-religion, for Esperanto, and for watching their fellow Jews, including family members, get carted off by the Nazis. It caused George no real grief. “We were somehow above them,” he told his biographer, his family having abandoned their “tribal” loyalties long ago.

    George Soros, Nazi Obsessive.

  77. JC

    How does Soros feel about what he did as a teenager? Has it kept him up at night?

    Steve Kroft of 60 Minutes asked him that. Was it difficult? “Not at all,” Soros answered.

    “No feeling of guilt?” asked Kroft. “No,” said Soros. “There was no sense that I shouldn’t be there. If I wasn’t doing it, somebody else would be taking it away anyhow. Whether I was there or not. So I had no sense of guilt.”

    A Nazi would steal the Jews’ property anyways. So why not him?

  78. Infidel Tiger

    Haven’t the Jews suffered enough without 1080 pestering them verbose, poorly written, dirge?

  79. m0nty

    “Post edited for being OT”. LOL.

    Catallaxy, home of freedom of speech!

    [You were warned - read the rules. You have a history of derailing threads. Sinc]

  80. JC

    Haven’t the Jews suffered enough without 1080 pestering them verbose, poorly written, dirge?

    I’ll say. Frankly they and other simply don’t deserve it.

  81. Gab

    “Post edited for being OT”. LOL.

    Catallaxy, home of freedom of speech!

    M0nty jumps the shark in full rodeo getup.

  82. JC

    M0nty jumps the shark in full rodeo getup.

    On a miniature pony.

  83. m0nty

    Apparently talking about the article that the OP is about is OT, Gab.

  84. Gab

    No, it’s you that’s OT, m0nty. You don’t seem to comprehend this fact.

  85. twostix

    That is surely the most vicious, vile and slanderous anti-semtic remark ever posted on this site. By his own account, as a 14-year-old boy, Soros feld to the safety of a Christian family, the husband was a Hungarian puppet government official. On one occasion Soros occampanied him when he did the inventory of the estate of a Jewish family who had fled the country. And on this basis, Soros is labelled a “Nazi collaborator”? We might all ask ourselves what we would have done in the same circumstances.

    Soros was thirteen years old in March 1944 when Nazi Germany occupied Hungary.[19] Soros took a job with the Jewish Council, which had been established during the Nazi occupation of Hungary to carry out Nazi and Hungarian government anti-Jewish measures. Soros later described this time to writer Michael Lewis:
    Quote:
    The Jewish Council asked the little kids to hand out the deportation notices. I was told to go to the Jewish Council. And there I was given these small slips of paper…It said report to the rabbi seminary at 9 am…And I was given this list of names. I took this piece of paper to my father. He instantly recognized it. This was a list of Hungarian Jewish lawyers. He said, “You deliver the slips of paper and tell the people that if they report they will be deported.”

    He worked for the Judenrat, which is why he’s labeled as a collaborator, because that’s what the Judenrat were: collaborators. See how that works?

    Later he took as mentor the infamous Francois Genoud: banker of the Nazis.

    Is there anything you’re not wrong about?

    Secondly who the fuck are you and why are you here bossing around the owner of this blog?

  86. Sinclair Davidson

    m0nty – we now have two (2) open threads per week to discuss ot matters.

  87. twostix

    I will take no further part in this vile, slanderous and anti-semitic “debate”. But I will repeat here my public call for these comments to be taken down. If they are not, I will write directly to Sinclair and other members of the Catallaxy team drawing them to their attention. If the comments are still allowed to stand, I will draw them to the attention of the wider Austrlian Jewish community.

    You’re such an amateur.

  88. JC

    Secondly who the fuck are you and why are you here bossing around the owner of this blog?

    Metro often has brain jerks and spasms, stix. It seems to be a monthly occurrence and could be related to the moon and tides. He generally goes batshit crazy with delusions of grandeur just after a full moon.

    As a fully qualified medical professional with expertise in these matters and relaevant field, my diagnosis is Werewolf activity in the left frontal lobe of his tiny and minute brain.

  89. Gab

    Secondly who the fuck are you and why are you here bossing around the owner of this blog?

    He’s the leader of the Olympic Dam Tribe, you racist.

  90. Gab

    [Edited. OT. Sinc]

    m0nty please stop with the whining. It’s unmanly.

  91. .

    Doubleplusgood on the golden bullshit there old bean. You are the Master. Work in advertising?

    C.L. makes his wife wash the dishes by hand. He’s our Don Draper.

  92. JC

    [Edited. OT. Sinc]

    Post it on the open thread and let us be the judge.

    [Edited. OT. Sinc]

    Which on this thread is irrelevant and another example of you fucking up another thread, Monster.

  93. Sinclair Davidson

    m0nty please stop with the whining. It’s unmanly.

  94. cohenite

    Hamilton is not above utilising children in his tirades:

    http://www.abc.net.au/unleashed/28372.html

    Other characteristics he shares with Greens are that he is implacably arrogant and, because he knows he has no message to sell only his ego, he will resort to condescention and usurpation; which he justifies by knowing the great unwashed are not his equal.

    He is a bastard.

  95. JC

    Good find Cohenite. I love Happy’s weather forecast.

    Droughts will be worse, and you won’t be able to have fun exploring the Great Barrier Reef because it won’t be there anymore

    Lol.

    It’s like.. the more swill you dish out the likelier it is the old swill will be buried by the mountain of new swill.

  96. .

    But he wears glasses and rests his head on his chin. He is therefore a left academic who just has to be correct!

  97. JC

    But he wears glasses and rests his head on his chin.

    You caught that too. Lol.

    Great pose, but his case spoiled by the obvious glare of the lights reflecting.

    It’s such a contrived pose I would have thought they’d have come up with a better one by now.

  98. Fisky

    I will take no further part in this vile, slanderous and anti-semitic “debate”. But I will repeat here my public call for these comments to be taken down. If they are not, I will write directly to Sinclair and other members of the Catallaxy team drawing them to their attention. If the comments are still allowed to stand, I will draw them to the attention of the wider Austrlian Jewish community.

    No, he was a Nazi collaborator, Wayne. And you are a Communist piece of shit.

  99. badm0f0

    No, he was a Nazi collaborator, Wayne. And you are a Communist piece of shit.

    No he wasn’t. It’s almost certain that you would have been though Fisky. Given your stated desire for the state-sanctioned persecution of “leftists” there is little doubt that you would have been enthusiastically reporting everyone from commies & trade unionists to social democrats. In fact it’s so likely that I think you should probably be tried for actual Nazi crimes.

  100. .

    baddie,

    Fisky is taking the piss when he says it.

  101. Sinclair Davidson

    I’m all nazi’d and soros’d out for the day. We’ve had this particular debate before and as far as I can see there is no new information since the last time.

  102. Token

    If someone said this to my child I’d be reporting them for grooming. I know the editor is Pinata Green at The Drum, but really what responsible editor would publish this sicko stuff?

    There’s something you need to know about your father.

    Your dad’s job is to try to stop the government making laws to reduce Australia’s carbon pollution. He is paid a lot of money to do that by big companies who do not want to own up to the fact that their pollution is changing the world’s climate in very harmful ways.

  103. JC

    Bado

    Yes he was. You’re delusional. What you’re saying that you refuse to believe his account and what he said about the times.

    You’ve excused it by highlighting his age, as though no 14 year old has ever been in front of a court before to answer charges of committing a crime.

  104. badm0f0

    I’m all nazi’d and soros’d out for the day.

    But we haven’t even got on to Keelhaul yet …

  105. JC

    It’s easy steps to go from the IPA to Soros, Bado.

    Lefties like you always manage to trip on the IPA rake.

  106. Les Majesty

    This is a great thread.

  107. badm0f0

    What you’re saying that you refuse to believe his account and what he said about the times.

    No, I don’t put any stock in the selective interpretations of what Soros said by various nutball commentators . The actual account he gave (a version of which is published on his site) is drastically different to that which has been attributed to him.

    As for his age, I don’t give him any more or less credit than I do the thousands of German kids who were forced by law to join the Hitler Youth at age 14. Many of them & their families faced persecution for refusing to obey. Soros and his family faced execution.

  108. badm0f0

    Lefties like you always manage to trip on the IPA rake.

    Where have I referred to the IPA?

  109. Les Majesty

    If Soros was a Nazi collaborator, what does that make 14 year old Hitler Jugend member Pope Benny?

  110. JC

    The other morons did. You went along for the ride.

    Monster, the resident had to bring up the alleged connection between da IPA and Gina as though it was equal to a charge of cannibalism.

    When I brought the shadowy types funding leftwing causes around the world along with their misdeeds, you were one of the first to defend him/them which is truly shameful and hypocritical.

    Let’s be clear on one thing. Big Gina has a lot of money. It’s her money and she is perfectly entitled to do what the fuck she wants with it and no amount of hollering or screaming by threatening to shut down opposition media is going to going that because all that will be reversed once the coalition return to power.

  111. JC

    If Soros was a Nazi collaborator, what does that make 14 year old Hitler Jugend member Pope Benny?

    You want to tag them by the same brush and suggest their actions were equal, then go ahead, Les.

    I have no issue with that.

    However let me say that Benny was dragged/conscripted into the army, while Uncle George chose to act (voluntarily). Keep in mind also that Uncle G has said he wasn’t in the least bothered, remorseful or feels any guilt by doing what he did. In fact it was a good time in his life.

  112. badm0f0

    My pointing out that you are full of shit doesn’t signal agreement with whoever you happen to be bullshitting.

  113. JC

    My pointing out that you are full of shit doesn’t signal agreement with whoever you happen to be bullshitting.

    But that’s not what you did. You just went in to bat for Monster and Metro without thought or reason.

    It could be seen in a different light if he felt guilt about what he did, but Uncle G doesn’t. Yet you still went in to bat for him…. And I’m full of shit?

  114. m0nty

    LOL, Sinc takes his bat and ball and goes home. Rather childish.

  115. badm0f0

    And I’m full of shit?

    Very much so.

  116. JC

    Monster, you derail almost every single thread with third rate bullshit. You’re unable to stay on point.
    It’s as though you want our constant attention and frankly it’s annoying, as you rarely have anything worthwhile to say..

    eg Da IPA for instance.

    Seriously, go think of ways to fix up that dogs breakfast of your site.

  117. Les Majesty

    However let me say that Benny was dragged/conscripted into the army, while Uncle George chose to act (voluntarily). Keep in mind also that Uncle G has said he wasn’t in the least bothered, remorseful or feels any guilt by doing what he did. In fact it was a good time in his life.

    Totally factually incorrect. Sheer nonsense.

  118. Fisky

    Sinclair, will you allow that to stand? I appreciate this is a robust forum, but surely some standards of ethics, morality and decency apply?

    Wayne, didn’t you used to rip off NYT behind-the-paywall columns and flog them to your subscribers? You really shouldn’t be talking about ethics, you thief.

  119. C.L.

    I was actually going to joke that lefties everywhere called Ratzinger a Nazi for being forced into military service but they’re OK with Democrat Party owner, George Soros, actually robbing Jews destined for the death camps.

    And no, Ratzinger was not a Juden-rat like Soros.

    Following his 14th birthday in 1941, Ratzinger was conscripted into the Hitler Youth — as membership was required by law for all 14-year-old German boys after December 1939 — but was an unenthusiastic member who refused to attend meetings, according to his brother. In 1941, one of Ratzinger’s cousins, a 14-year-old boy with Down syndrome, was taken away by the Nazi regime and killed during the Aktion T4 campaign of Nazi eugenics. In 1943, while still in seminary, he was drafted into the German anti-aircraft corps as Luftwaffenhelfer, (Air force child soldier). Ratzinger then trained in the German infantry. As the Allied front drew closer to his post in 1945, he deserted back to his family’s home in Traunstein after his unit had ceased to exist, just as American troops established their headquarters in the Ratzinger household. As a German soldier, he was put in a POW camp but was released a few months later at the end of the war in the summer of 1945.

  120. JC

    Actually no. It’s factually true.

    Here:

    Lets test the guilt issue.
    60 Minutes Interview.

    How does Soros feel about what he did as a teenager? Has it kept him up at night?

    Steve Kroft of 60 Minutes asked him that. Was it difficult? “Not at all,” Soros answered.

    “No feeling of guilt?” asked Kroft. “No,” said Soros. “There was no sense that I shouldn’t be there. If I wasn’t doing it, somebody else would be taking it away anyhow. Whether I was there or not. So I had no sense of guilt.”

    Exciting? Yep.

    George Soros described his year of living under Nazi rule as “the most exciting time of my life.” That was the same year Soros’ own uncle, along with his wife and children, were “deported” to Auschwitz.

    He sounds like a Honey Badger. He don’t give a shit.

    If you think these are factually untrue, you really have to take it up with him, Les as all we doing is quoting Uncle G. They are his words.

  121. C.L.

    “…the most exciting time of my life…”

    Wow. Imagine even being seen with such a low-life.

  122. Rabz

    As far as I’m aware Hamilton has yet to apologise for any of those statements.

    As far as I’m aware he’s also yet to apologise for his continued existence on this planet, a particularly egregious omission.

  123. Fisky

    So we are agreed that George Soros feels no regret over collaborating with the nazis?

  124. Les Majesty

    For the record, I don’t think that either Benny or Soros should be judged based on what they did as children during the extraordinary circumstances of WWII.

  125. JC

    Australian lefties are strange.

    They defend Uncle G, totally avoiding his words and actions and defend an unrepentant Stalinist sitting slap bang in the middle of our fucking senate well.

    Oh but Big Gina possibly giving a donation to Da IPA. That’s a fucking crime against “hermanity”.

    You fuckers are seriously all over the joint. There is not an ounce of serious reflection going on. Not a single ounce.

  126. Fisky

    No, but I do think that Soros should be judged for saying that he doesn’t feel any “difficulty” or “guilt” over robbing Jews on their way to the camps.

  127. C.L.

    For the record, I don’t think that either Benny or Soros should be judged based on what they did as children during the extraordinary circumstances of WWII.

    Ah, but the equivalency is false so your magnanimity is worthless. Ratzinger didn’t “do” anything calling down moral judgement.

    Soros did. And he admits that he loved it.

  128. Sinclair Davidson

    Sinc takes his bat and ball and goes home. Rather childish.

    ?

  129. Fisky

    I wonder if we should write to the local Polish community, drawing their attention to the fact that Sando is an supporter of Soviet collaborators (such as Lee Rhiannon).

  130. JC

    For the record, I don’t think that either Benny or Soros should be judged based on what they did as children during the extraordinary circumstances of WWII.

    I do. I personally think Benny’s actions were a bit slow although they don’t amount to much really.

    However I think Uncle G later reflections in both the 60 Minutes interview and other quotes are monstrous. No guilt? Sense of excitement? Absolutely fucking monstrous lack of feeling and emotions about his earlier life.

    Having said all that.. Australian Lefties consider Gina’s possible political support and financial activities as a crime against hermanity though.

  131. JC

    No, but I do think that Soros should be judged for saying that he doesn’t feel any “difficulty” or “guilt” over robbing Jews on their way to the camps.

    Triple bingo.

    And he is supposed to be financing part of GetitUP from what I read somewhere too I think.

    Who do you choose, lefties. Gina funding da IPA or (if true) uncle G funding GetitUP?

  132. Fisky

    Having said all that.. Australian Lefties consider Gina’s possible political support and financial activities as a crime against hermanity though.

    But they are totally fine with Labor-organised race riots. All of them.

  133. JC

    But they are totally fine with Labor-organised race riots. All of them.

    Tim Dunlop at ABC’s Lunatics Unleashed thinks “Hodgo” is a good bloke.

  134. Fleeced

    Tim Dunlop at ABC’s Lunatics Unleashed thinks “Hodgo” is a good bloke.

    They should dust off Ray Martin to do a new series of “Top Labor Blokes” – there’d be enough material, it need never end.

  135. Rex

    “One approach worthy of serious consideration would be to charge a fee for visitors to Kangaroo Island to hunt koalas.”

    Apparently this will enhance Koala conservation.

    I kid you not.

    http://www.clivehamilton.net.au/cms/media/documents/articles/Cashing_in_on_Koalas.pdf

  136. badm0f0

    I was actually going to joke that lefties everywhere called Ratzinger a Nazi for being forced into military service but they’re OK with Democrat Party owner, George Soros, actually robbing Jews destined for the death camps

    Except that he didn’t so, ipo facto, they aren’t :

    Soros was thirteen years old in March 1944 when Nazi Germany occupied Hungary.Soros took a job with the Jewish Council,which had been established during the Nazi occupation of Hungary to carry out Nazi and Hungarian government anti-Jewish measures.Soros later described this time to writer Michael Lewis:
    The Jewish Council asked the little kids to hand out the deportation notices. I was told to go to the Jewish Council. And there I was given these small slips of paper … It said report to the rabbi seminary at 9 am … And I was given this list of names. I took this piece of paper to my father. He instantly recognized it. This was a list of Hungarian Jewish lawyers. He said, “You deliver the slips of paper and tell the people that if they report they will be deported.”
    Later that year, at age 14, Soros lived with and posed as the godson of an employee of the Hungarian Ministry of Agriculture. The official once was ordered to inventory the remaining contents of the estate of a wealthy Jewish family that had fled the country; rather than leave the young Soros alone in the city, the official brought him along.

  137. C.L.

    20 December 1998 broadcast of 60 Minutes:

    KROFT: My understanding is that you went out with this protector of yours who swore that you were his adopted godson.

    Mr. SOROS: Yes. Yes.

    KROFT: Went out, in fact, and helped in the confiscation of property from the Jews.

    Mr. SOROS: Yes. That’s right. Yes.

  138. Adrien

    Joh’s days were glory days of freedom compared to the police states inaugurated by the ALP

    And how do you figure… that?

    I’d seriously like to know. I have some familiarity with Country Party types and AWU fatboys too and they’re basically the same kinda gorilla only one was born in Kowapaddi and the other one was born in Downahol.

    So what makes Joh’s (fucking) Qld such a bloody paradise? Remember I was there.

  139. Adrien

    That is surely the most vicious, vile and slanderous anti-semtic remark ever posted on this site.

    Ay carumba! There’s actually never been a truly anti-semitic remark made on this site I can recall anyway. (I may well have missed it.)

    But accusations, yeah.

  140. badm0f0

    Glenn Beck’s [i.e. CL's & JC's] description of George Soros’ actions during the Holocaust is completely inappropriate, offensive and over the top.  For a political commentator or entertainer to have the audacity to say – inaccurately – that there’s a Jewish boy sending Jews to death camps, as part of a broader assault on Mr. Soros, that’s horrific.
     
    While I, too, may disagree with many of Soros’ views and analysis on the issues, to bring in this kind of innuendo about his past is unacceptable.  To hold a young boy responsible for what was going on around him during the Holocaust as part of a larger effort to denigrate the man is repugnant.
     
    The Holocaust was a horrific time, and many people had to make excruciating choices to ensure their survival.  George Soros has been forthright about his childhood experiences and his family’s history, and there the matter should rest.

    Abraham H. Foxman, ADL [Anti-Defamation League] National Director and a Holocaust survivor.

  141. Adrien

    I’m sure it must be a downright lie of course. Clive Hamilton being the intellectual mastermind of a revolutionary movement to make of this nation an agrarian police state a la Pol Pot only the flag’s coloured Green. But did Gina Rinehart really want to use nuclear explosives for mining purposes? What a character.

    Anyway given her views on various things I’m sure that her inclusion on the Fairfax board will result in a much more robust and liberal free market of ideas in this country.

  142. Thomas Esmond Knox

    Try a street demo on the corner of George & Ann St Brisbane at peak hour on a working day & see how much sympathy you get from Mother Bligh or the public.

    Joh kept poker machines out of Qld & wiped out Death Duties in Qld.

    When he resigned, poker machines came in to the great profit of some people but so far Death Duties haven’t.

  143. Infidel Tiger

    JC, were you and your trader buds so personally upset with Uncle George that you refused his cash and kicked him where his stones should be?

  144. badm0f0

    Moderation seems an ironic term for awaiting approval on this thread …

  145. Jc

    Well of course not, IT. That’s a silly question. He was a very generous commission payer, or at least his trade execution desk was.

    We loved him like a generous uncle, hence the wall street name… Uncle George.

    Used to love that light going up, which I could see light on my line bank.
    Immediate thought was…. Goodie,, here’s a 100 G that just walked through the door all showered and shaved looking for a home.

  146. Abu Chowdah

    He does seem to be an embodied paradox because he has an Order of Australia for “service to public debate…

    Slimy hypocritical fucker.

    The one public figure I would enjoy punching in the throat. Who hasn’t wanted to do that?

  147. Jim Rose

    do the younger readers of the op-ed know either who Hancock and John Singleton’s Workers Party were?

    peterson is starting to be political junkie quiz question too. he lost power in 1989.

  148. M Ryutin

    History can be in dispute but facts matter.

    George Soros is not the haunted Jew, worried about anti-semitism at all, his actions show the opposite. His support for anti-Israel groups and, as has recently been highlighted, his major funding of groups which are even being called by the left for constant anti-semitism (eg ‘Israel Firsters’ and all the rest of their long-time anti-Jewish stereotypest) such as the Obama boosters Centre for American Progress and Media Matters for America.

    Also, Queensland had a history as probably the most corrupt of all the colonial governments. Very corrupt in labour disputes of the late 19th century, introducing virtual slavery (Kanakas)in labour disputes and really being the catalyst for the While Australia policy getting such strong support from the fledgling ALP of the day. In corrupt colonial states the upper houses were places particularly hated by that rising party. Only TJ Ryan in Qld (in 1916 or so) was able to carry out the long-held Labor principle of those days to abolish upper houses (a spectacular failure in NSW).

    The corruption of Bjelke-Petersen made it clear for me that having no upper house allowed such blatant gerrymandering and corruption to take place and I personally value upper houses now. Even though the gerrymander was started under the Hanlon ALP government it was honed by the country party and the Bjelke-Petersen government took it to the depths, where sheep got votes rather than people. A bit like South Australia, where under Playford seats ranged in size from 3,800 to 46,000 depending on whether it was a LCL or ALP seat. No-one can ever write an apologia for that!

  149. C.L.

    Only TJ Ryan in Qld (in 1916 or so) was able to carry out the long-held Labor principle of those days to abolish upper houses …

    It was carried out in 1922 under “Red” Ted Theodore who utterly ignored a referendum carried out on the question in 1917 (which the abolitionists lost badly).

    As for corruption, Joh’s mob were clumsy amateurs compared to Victorian and New South Wales governments, including Bolte’s, Wran’s and the one recently thrown out (which may have been the most corrupt state government in Australian history).

  150. Mk50 of Brisbane

    Gab:

    Oh leave the poor sod alone you two. 1o8o has been working very hard to get people’s attention, haven’t you pet?

    Dear lady Gab, who is 1o8o?

    There is an inbred genetic reject befouling the site; he is self-styled as 1080, apparently it’s a mindlessly pitiful jape about a vermin control poison, which is apparently its own ‘hero-in-his-own-lunchtime’ view of itself based on the impact it believes it has on we Catallaxy denizens.

    In reality, it’s like being subject to the endless whining of a particularly retarded toddler.

    I do believe it is married to its sister, and that the term ‘uncle Dad’ makes perfect sense in its family. Only multiple generations of incest (perhaps 30) explains its intellectual capacity.

  151. Pedro the Ignorant

    Joh’s Queensland was a wonderful place if you were;

    a. a Nat politician,
    b. a farmer/grazier in the Kingaroy district,
    c. a stipendiary magistrate,
    d. a commissioned police officer.

    Everyone else just snoozed in the afternoon sunlight.

  152. Gab

    Mk50, it appears you know him/her too well. I confess I don’t read past one line anymore. I just noticed the splotches left all over Catallaxy and thought he must be working very hard for someone, anyone, to notice him. Felt sorry for the poor pet – but got over that quickly.

  153. Jim Rose

    the Left wanted to get ride of upper houses because they think they are the face of the future, rather than just another political party that will hold power as often as not.

    The Left forgot that the rotation of power is common in democracies, so it is wise to design constitutions to minimise the damage done when the crazies to the right or left of you get their chance in office, as they will.

    In a unitary unicameral parliament, those crazies to the right or left of you are tempered by an occasional general election only every 3 to 5 years.

    Privatisation and deregulation is a lot slower in a federal system with an effective upper house elected by proportional representation.

    Power is spread over different levels of federations, with different parties in power at various levels all worried about losing office by ignoring what the majority wants.

    The will of the people is constantly tested and re-measured in a federal system with elections at one level or another every year or so contested on local and federal issues.

  154. Alex Pundit

    Boy did Metro become unhinged.

    Btw, why are we calling him Metro? Is the 1080 a bus route or something?

    Lol.

  155. Jim Rose

    Clive Hamilton is the gift that keep giving. nothing he says will persuade anyone who does not already agree with him, and he puts off the undecided with his intolerance.

  156. JC

    Alex

    Long story why he’s been called Metro. But what a great, great mental spasm though hey? Lefties always seem go berserk at this site. The number that end up in mental asylums or years of group therapy is staggering.

  157. M Ryutin

    C.L. 2 Feb 12 at 7:01 pm
    Surely you couldnt leave out Bob Askin! Living through that (and possibly the worst of the worst in NSW because of the sheer breadth of its rottenness, the recently removed ALP government) I am biassed I suppose, but to have lived through two such regimes as an adult is quite enough to go on with!

  158. Tom

    Jim, Hamilton might as well wear a clown suit. He is a figure of fun. That he won the title “professor” by tearing open enough Wheetie packets tells the downtrodden that they too can aspire to respectability through academia. The common misconception is that you have to be talented or intelligent to acquire a professorship. Stephan Lewandowski is another who disproves the theory.

  159. Alex Pundit

    “Long story why he’s been called Metro. ”

    I like long stories.

    :)

  160. Jim Rose

    Robin Askin was one of several state premiers who was just lucky at the races. one even sued and won when the contrary was suggested in the media. he must have kept the betting slips.

  161. Mk50 of Brisbane

    The number that end up in mental asylums or years of group therapy is staggering.

    Even funnier are the ones who wind up in that special luvvie therapy bongs, a sweat lodge six other naked sweaty luvvies, … and a drum of vaseline.

  162. C.L.

    Yeah, Ryutin – I forgot about Askin.

  163. squawkbox

    I attribute Metro’s meltdown to job-related stress as JC’s ‘carbon slave’. As a conscientous employer/owner, JC, I hope you are offering him counselling.

  164. John Comnenus

    Jim,

    Your detail is wrong re Joh. The Nats under Mike Ahearn got ousted in 1989. Petersen resigned at the end of 1987. I was living in North Queensland during these tumultuous times and even got to see the lady who started the chain of events that eventually brought down the Government – Fi Fi the French Maid.

  165. wayne of middle earth

    Many things I remember about Joh.. “I will not put a tax on cigarettes, alcohol or petrol as that is a tax on the working man.

    Thus he never did, he also had free hospital and dental care and when eventually labor got in to power there was money in the bank. I would rather a well run state with a bit of corruption than what we have, which is a federal government badly run and totally corrupt.

  166. Entropy

    Just watched the 7:30 coverage of the floods commission. Things do not look good. Unless they can show documents recording dam release flow rates backing up their stories, those four hydrology engineers (one of which I know) are done for, and whoever wins government next election will have one mother of a class action to pay out. And Headly Thomas deserves a Pulitzer or Nobel or something (not a crappy Walkely).

  167. Entropy

    One of the more classy bits of the Joh years was how Russ Hinze got to be police minister. Apparently he was caught DUI or some such, and the solution was make him police minister and get the charges dropped. I guess you could say at least they were up front about it.

    Hinze’s best line?

    “that’s not a conflict of interest! It’s more like a convergence of interest!”
    Heady days.

  168. Mk50 of Brisbane

    Hmm. Squawkbox, I agree.

    JC, you MUST offer Metro the Carbon Slave proper and appropriate counselling!

    Personally, I recommend the ….counsellor… made of 16 plait kangaroo hide. Price is reasonable too.

    50, 60 bracing applications of the counsellor should give you a reasonable aerobic workout, as well. Oh, that’s per arm, and you can aim for an aesthetically pleasing crosshatch pattern on his back.

  169. C.L.

    There are two seminal acts of gangsterism in Queensland’s history that have made it different in an unflattering, Huey Long sense.

    But things aren’t as morally clear-cut as they might seem. Let me explain.

    The first is the act of immoral bastardy committed by Labor’s ‘Suicide Squad’ in 1921. The 1917 referendum on the abolition of the Queensland Legislative Council (its Upper House) was lost badly by the Labor side (179,105 votes to 116,196). Not to worry – Labor decided to overrule the people anyway. By manipulating the Governor, the Council was stacked and the ginned up majority voted the chamber out of existence.

    Now when Labor protested that the QLC was a bastion of pastoral and agricultural interests that were hostile to the agenda of Labor governments, they were not far wrong. So they got around that conundrum.

    Second is the so-called gerrymander. (Incorrect terminology for what Labor and then the Country Party did but we’ll let that go for now). When the Country Party argued that a state of such huge proportions was essentially governed by urbanites unsympathetic to rural interests (which rural interests bankrolled the state and its infrastructure) – mostly located in the South-East corner – they were also right. So they got around that conundrum.

    Both rationales for the Huey Long maneuvers were not wholly bereft of moral logic but in a democracy governed by the rule of law, such tactics are of course unacceptable.

    Nevertheless, it could be said that without the weakening of the old rural socialists in the 1920s and without the weakening of neanderthal unionists in Brisbane, Queensland by the turn of the century (2000/2001) would not have been the advanced economy it was. It would more likely have resembled contemporary California.

    Also, things got done and built and developed in the Joh era because he didn’t give a shit what greenies and ratbags said. In the Hinze years, no yellow-footed ‘endangered’ frog ever stopped a project. That’s because the government couldn’t have cared less about the yellow-footed frog.

    I am not defending the corrupt Labor and Country/National Party governments of yesteryear but, rather, providing some perspective.

    Criticism from modern Labor personalities is laughable, that goes without saying. It was state Labor governments in Victoria and New South Wales that introduced police sniffer dogs to your railway stations and music concerts; and there was nothing like the Bundaberg Hospital bloodbath on Joh’s watch. Whitlam used to mock Joh but Joh wasn’t trying to get money in brown paper bags from Pakistani rug merchants and Saddam Hussein.

    By the way, the Fitzgerald Inquiry was convened by the National Party government itself – something that should be of interest to those who watch agog the corrupt secretiveness, obstruction of justice and stonewalling that is a hallmark of the Rudd/Gillard governments.

    —————————

    Incidentally, the Queensland Upper House still exists just as it was when it was shut down at 8:37 p.m. on 27 October 1921. Here it is in all its simple, Victorian beauty. Note fondly the limited number of seats.

  170. JC

    Hmm. Squawkbox, I agree.

    JC, you MUST offer Metro the Carbon Slave proper and appropriate counselling!

    You know what, he’s actually a first rate scumbag in the vilest way. The prick was on another thread recently, defending Rhiannon like it was his grandma. This is the person leading the charge for anti-Semitic actions against Israel.

    Here he is now on this thread suggesting that even the mere accusations of collaboration by Uncle G is anti- Semitic and he threatens the site owner if they/he doesn’t bend to his demands.

    There’s something seriously disturbing about him in the creepiest way.

    Metro, I know you’re reading this. You don’t frighten nor intimidate anyone. Get that Idea entirely out of your minute brain, you wanker.

  171. Mk50 of Brisbane

    JC, a convincing argument. There ARE sites that sell a very nice cat’o'nine tails.

    Some even have the knotted ends knotted around lead shot. So very traditional, like a flagrum on crystal meth.

    Messy, though, with all those little gobbets of flesh flying about…. you could really f**k up the carpet (and walls, curtains and ceiling) with one of those as you counsell your Carbon Slave.

  172. entropy

    So if we were to reintroduce an upper house in Qld, how could it be designed to avoid the pitfalls of self interested party machinations?

    How about nobody under 55 can run, and can only serve for a maximum of six years. And nobody can stand if they have been an MP in the past 5 years, and a senator cannot hold a ministerial post.
    they can automatically be called The Worthy Senator though :)

    Their only job is to review legislation passed by the lower house.

  173. Mk50 of Brisbane

    Hmm. I was wondering about Metro/1080. As I understand it, he is a snaggle toothed seven-toed (three on one, four on the other) beast, his brother’s son by the daughter his father produced when he knocked up his own mother.

    Does that make him his own:

    - son
    - brother
    - say what?

  174. entropy

    Another bit of class from the [post] Joh years:
    in 1988 at the end of a drought, a local stock inspector wrote some letters to local landholders seeking advice from local producers on whether or not they thought drought subsidies should be ended.

    The Minister went ballistic and transferred the stockie to Thargominda because the mere thought of the removal of handouts helping hands was anathema to the agrarian socialists that dominated Qld politics.

    To Premier Ahern’s credit he launched a Parliamentary Inquiry, which led to the exoneration of the stockie, the discredit of the still serving Minister, and significant change to drought policy, recommending in the dying days of the Ahern Government the removal of the rorts the Ag Minister wanted to defend. The ALP’s Ed Casey got to implement them though.

  175. Jarrah

    “the Left wanted to get ride of upper houses because they think they are the face of the future”

    No, they wanted to get rid of upper houses because they identified them as anti-democratic, an inherited relic from the House of Lords. Which is true, but they also failed to realise that democracy needs checks and balances to prevent majoritarianism.

    So I guess I’m agreeing with the rest of your comment. That’s twice in one day, what’s going on?

  176. wreckage

    brother’s son by the daughter his father produced when he knocked up his own mother

    So, metro’s dad D knocks up metro’s grandmother G producing metro’s mother M. D then also knocks up M to produce metro (lower case m).

    metro is therefore only D’s half-brother, not brother, as well as nephew, grandson, and son. He is grandson to G twice and great grandson once. He is M’s son, half-brother, and nephew.

  177. wreckage

    Jarrah; to truncate the quote, “Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on who to eat for dinner”; in short, you need some anti-deomcratic institutions and not the least reason for that is to make democracy actually function.

    The rule of law is anti-democratic, too.

  178. wreckage

    Sorry, I missed the question

    Does that make him his own:

    cousin twice over, and possibly cousin-once-removed, which makes him his own cousin three times, possibly four, but usually any other relationship overrides “cousin”, since everyone is also broadly speaking “cousin” to their own siblings by virtue of common descent.

    He might be his own “quarter brother” but such a relationship normally wouldn’t have a category. If such a category does exist, or if he counts as his own half-brother, then his multiple and unusual self-cousin relationship would be ignored.

  179. wreckage

    Here is a helpful diagram, and I will now cease derailing the thread.

    Cousins

  180. .

    As for corruption, Joh’s mob were clumsy amateurs compared to Victorian and New South Wales governments, including Bolte’s, Wran’s and the one recently thrown out (which may have been the most corrupt state government in Australian history).

    When Wran dies a lot of shit on him will be released and it will be mind blowing.

    Except that it is public knowledge just never mentioned openly.

  181. JC

    I suppose Metro will show under a new alias now. How about 1081. I’m sure that will confuse people.

  182. Rococo Liberal

    Jarrah

    It is unfortunate that western countries refer to themselves as ‘democracies,’ as they are not really democratic in all their institutions at all. A true democracy is a polity in which the government is carried on by all of the citizens voting on all matters.

    A representative democracy is one where the people elect representatives to legislate. But even that doesn’t really fully describe most western governments.

    As the ancients argued, the best polity is one which takes the strengths of all three main types of government: Monarchy, oligarchy and democracy. Here in Oz these three are represented by the Queen, the Cabinet and the elected MPs. Of course it is now the fact that we elect our legislators to advise the Monarch, which means that the democratic element is the predominant one in our political settlement. Hence, why in shorthand we talk of Australia being a democracy.

    But democracy in itself, like all other forms of government has its pitfalls and is not an unalloyed good. That is why it is necessary to have an admixture of Monarchical and oligarchical elements in a successful polity.

    Australia is a Constitutional Monarchy. If we ever move to a Republic, I suggest that on the models that have been previouslty proposed, Australia will still be in effect a Constitutional Monarchy, except that the Monarch, instead of becomong sovereign by hereditary right, will be chosen by the electors (be they the people or the Parliament). The elected Head of State will still exercise monarchical power, but may think, due to lack of tradition and experience, that he or she somehow has the legitimacy to make active rather than passive use of that power. That is why the change to a ‘republic’ is either a complete waste of time and money or a journey into unknown and dangerous constitutional waters.

    All successful polities have awhat I call the necessary grit of illegitimacy in them which prevents them becoming too cocky. Ours is the undefined power of monarchy. We need to keep things a bit muddy so that the monarchical element doesn’t take over.

    I suggest too that we also need to start questioning the whole legitamacy of government at all, because the legitimacy of ‘democracy has led to the inexorable intrusion of government into our lives at the cost of liberty, efficiency and economic wellbeing.

  183. HH

    By the way, the Fitzgerald Inquiry was convened by the National Party government itself – something that should be of interest to those who watch agog the corrupt secretiveness, obstruction of justice and stonewalling that is a hallmark of the Rudd/Gillard governments.

    This requires some clarification. It’s not as though the National Party as one decided that an inquiry would be a good idea – especially since at least two influential ministers (Russ Hinze and Don Lane) were up to their neck in corruption.

    The Fitzgerald Inquiry was initiated by acting premier and police minister Bill Gunn while Bjelke-Petersen was out of the country (Disneyland, according to the Courier Mail). Gunn said “I’m not going to have these allegations hanging over my head.” After the Four Corners “Moonlight State” story ran, he rang future High Court judge Ian Callinan for his opinion on the program’s allegations; Callinan recalls saying to Gunn, “I think that if half of it is true, it’s very serious and very worrying.” Callinan drew up the terms of reference for the inquiry.

    Bjelke-Petersen opposed Gunn’s inquiry; the bush-bred premier warned his colleagues that when you lift an old piece of tin you are likely to find a dead cat or an angry snake. As they began to find much worse, there was some wobbling among the Nationals.”

    In the introductory words of the Fitzgerald Report itself [PDF, 3.92MB],

    The general expectation was that the inquiry would be brief and ineffectual, and was primarily a device to ease the political pressure on the Government. The inquiry was not given the status of a Royal Commission but appointed by Order in Council. The initial terms of reference, prepared by the Justice Department and published in the Queensland Government Gazette on 26 May, 1987, were mainly limited to matters arising out of the “Moonlight State”.

    It took one good man, Gunn, to do the right thing off his own bat when by chance he had the opportunity to do so. The scale of corruption in Qld through the 1970s and 1980s is beyond compare with the mere incompetence and secrecy of the current Federal Government.

  184. HH

    Sorry, link for the Fitzgerald Report PDF.

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