Why Australia needs more censorship

From the comments

I should be able to formally complain to the new authority about a bad opinion here. There’s certainly no shortage of candidates, either in the main posts or in the comments (which in many cases here are downright abusive).

Unduly critical, abusive, ignorant opinionating must be accountable. This applies to popular blogs such as this one, Bunyip, Bolt, Quadrant and Blair. I’d like to see reciprocal legislation in other countries that bring bloggers like Delingpole, Phillips and Reynolds into the net as well.

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152 Responses to Why Australia needs more censorship

  1. Viva

    Dobbing people in – or “denouncing” as it has quaintly been called – was a popular passtime in Eastern Europe before 1989. Looks like it about to make a comeback in Australia.

  2. daddy dave

    Wow, I thought the passage was supposed to be parody. But the person who wrote that actually meant it.

  3. I’m still not convinced “Hammygar” isn’t trying to pull an Alene Composta. He/She/It is just that little bit too OTT, IMHO.

  4. Brett

    A link to an article I wrote at Menzies House that reminds us all how easily these things get out of hand:

    http://www.menzieshouse.com.au/2011/06/a-lesson-for-gillard-broken-promises-propaganda-wilsons-reign-of-terror.html

  5. duncan

    I’m telling you all, David Marr is on the case.

  6. Complaining is freedom of speech.

    Formally responding to the complaint is the opposite.

  7. m0nty

    I wouldn’t say Australia needs more censorship. This blog could do with better moderation. But that would be against the principles of the principals, so it’s understandable that it is as laissez-faire as it is.

    By “better moderation”, I mean something like Sinclair taking people like CL aside and explaining to them that calling someone a c*** is Just Not On. This is not censorship, per se, but an agreement between two adults for the good of the blog, so that it doesn’t attract a reputation of being a cesspit of abuse and hatred. Good moderators present a choice to a commenter about their behaviour in civil terms, and don’t impose it on them roughshod unless the commenter is being unreasonable about it.

    Of course, this is never going to happen here at the Cat under current management. What is worse, people like Sinclair encourage bad behaviour by posting inflammatory OPs and condoning the invocation of Godwin. Mods set the tone for the blog, and the tone here is “anything goes”.

    Having said that, I don’t think the solution (if this situation is worth changing) is “binding” quango intervention. The Cat is meaningless, really, in the wider scheme of things. It has a minuscule audience and does not influence anything. Its OP authors may be published elsewhere, but they act differently in other media, and nothing (that I can tell) seeps up from the Cat to the mainstream.

    It would be entertaining to see the mooted National Media Council force small poliblogs like the Cat into printing a retraction/apology, but it wouldn’t solve anything and would be a sideshow of nuisance value only. I am one who hopes that the NMC will never exist. If it does, it won’t change anything, but it will just cause unnecessary trouble in the culture wars. Finkelstein is barking up the wrong tree entirely there.

  8. Des Deskperson

    Daddy Dave, I’ve been following Hammygar’s work here and on other blogs for some time and I’m convinced that he/she is a brilliant satirist of ovine and sub-rational ‘progressivism’

  9. JC

    That’s hammy doing a poor impersonation of Huggy Chavez.

    Hamster, seriously go fuck yourself, your first rate douchebag.

    The scum bag would be a serial complainer too.

  10. Harrys on the Boat

    Daddy, it is a parody. This post isn’t necessary.

  11. Viva

    Daddy, it is a parody. This post isn’t necessary.

    Parody, schmarody – this is how a lot of people actually think.

  12. Harrys on the Boat

    Especially as its given mingey a platform to pontificate.

  13. I’m convinced that he/she is a brilliant satirist

    A “brilliant satirist” would not come off as a one-dimensional cartoon character.

    I loved Alene Composta. “She” got it. Hammygar is no Alene Composta.

  14. Montgomery, can you offer any evidence to support your assertions:

    This blog could do with better moderation.

    Good moderators present a choice to a commenter about their behaviour in civil terms

    calling someone a c*** is Just Not On

    I mean, aren’t you just another opinionated cunt trying to impose your values on everyone else?

  15. duncan

    Monty, you’re a cunt.

    Ooops.. did I just say that?

  16. m0nty

    David: yes, I am stating my opinion that this blog could do with better moderation. I am not calling anyone names, and I am trying to argue in good faith. What’s your problem?

  17. Ooh Honey Honey

    Monty, what’s “on” is moot.

  18. Ooh Honey Honey

    Here’s my idea what I wret to the paper:
    Dear Sirs,
    May I propose a simple form of regulation for newspapers? Every column must be either headed “Facts” or “Journalist opinion”. Stiff financial penalties and jail terms for editor if anything untrue is published as “fact”. Existing privacy and defamation laws to govern “journalist opinion” but otherwise complete freedom to write whatever they want. On the front page of every edition they must then print the respective percentages of column inches devoted to facts and journalist opinion. The market will then get the papers they want, and deserve.

  19. John Mc

    Completely reasonable. Dare I say, maybe the solution.

  20. Harrys on the Boat

    In your boring as batshit diatribe, you basically said that the cat needs to change because you don’t like it. That is exactly the vile thinking we’re fighting against.

  21. Harrys on the Boat

    Definitely with you on the need to distinguish fact from opinion.

  22. m0nty

    Hey Harry, your avatar looks like a pastel swastika.

  23. Pickles

    Well here we go then.

    I hope they make the laws as draconian as possible, with the watchdog having absolute unlimited retrospective power to shut down, prosecute, impose crushing fines, exemplary damages and imprisonment with no right of appeal.

    And may this apply to any blogger or commenter.

    The watchdog also needs the power to demand all email addresses from the blog sites and go behind proxy servers to enable identification of commenters.

    When there is a change of government these protective and progressive powers can be used to identify and liquidate anyone who has ever made a comment that pisses me off on the Drum, Lavatory Rodeo or any other mouthpiece that I disagree with.

    We all want a fairer society and the first step is making sure that the Government (having been elected by the majority) is allowed to govern without constant negative sniping from an unqualified, uninformed and fundamentally ignorant and danerous commentairiat.

    Governments should be allowed to get on with the job. Voters get their chance for a say every few years and that is enough.

  24. JC

    I am not calling anyone names, and I am trying to argue in good faith. What’s your problem?

    that’s the problem, you never discuss something in good faith. Ever. This is why most people here are hard on you.

    Monster, you don’t have to be here, you know. It’s not as though you’re forced to comment or participate.

  25. Des Deskperson

    Spot, go and read all the Hammygar posts at the Professor’s blog, if they are still up, this dude/dudess manages cleverly to dig up and expose the whole gamut of ‘progressive’ group think. He/she isn’t as well rounded a persona as Arlene but it’s far more subtle – and the ‘one dimensionality’ is in fact a key element in this. Composta was brilliant but not subtle, there was no excuse for failing to see the joke, which is what made Tony Kevin’s and the Prof from UWA’s interactions with her so risable.

  26. Yes Pickles. Imagine if they get this organ installed, and then the Libs got in and started to use it. Well that would certainly be the shit on the other shoe, which in turn was on the other foot.

  27. JC

    Composta was brilliant but not subtle, there was no excuse for failing to see the joke, which is what made Tony Kevin’s and the Prof from UWA’s interactions with her so risable.

    Lol… the moment I saw it I knew it was being instigated by an evil, evil mind. I immediately thought of Professor Bunyip.

    I don’t think the hamster is at all like that. Ham posts this crap on right wing blogs whereas Arlene went straight for the throat and hooked idiots like Kevin and Snarly Sear.

    It was one of the best “punkings” I’ve ever seen.

    It’s a pity Arlene is no longer with us. I’m sure her death is attributable to her serious ongoing problem with genital warts as there’s not enough money spent on effective medical services in this country.

  28. Boy on a bike

    Stop being such a stupid cunt monty.

    Sorry if you feel offended by being called “stupid”.

  29. Sinclair Davidson

    While I agree m0nty brought it on himself, let’s not go overboard on the c-bomb.

  30. .

    It’s a pity Arlene is no longer with us. I’m sure her death is attributable to her serious ongoing problem with genital warts as there’s not enough money spent on effective medical services in this country.

    Contraception alone can cost $3000 a year.

  31. Jim Rose

    The remedy to bad speech is more speech.

    Free speech has been on balance an ally of those seeking change. Governments that want stasis start by restricting speech.

    Change in any complex system ultimately depends on the ability of outsiders to challenge accepted views and the reigning institutions. Without a strong guarantee of freedom of speech, there is no effective right to challenge what is.

    Australian Governments, when they had power over competition in the media, used that power to prevent new entry into mass media markets and suppressed cable TV and other competing viewpoints. This suppression of competition from new free-to-air and cable TV providers had rock-sold left-wing support.

    No government official, high or petty, should be able to prescribe what shall be orthodox in politics, nationalism, religion, or other matters of opinion or force citizens to confess by word or act their faith therein.

    One of the things that separates democracies from autocracies is our right to propagate opinions that the government finds wrong or even hateful.

  32. Winston Smith

    “We juggle priceless eggs in a variable gravity field here. Be careful.”

  33. C.L.

    Bob Brown’s willing executioners:

    I wouldn’t say Australia needs more censorship… But…

    By “better moderation”, I mean something like Sinclair taking people like CL aside and explaining to them that calling someone a c*** is Just Not On.

    I have never once in all my years blogging called anyone a c—, Monty, you dishonest loser.

    Apologise.

    …condoning the invocation of Godwin.

    Godwin’s law is the baseless reference to Nazism as an historical parallel. Contrary to popular belief, accurately making an historical parallel to Nazism is not contrary to the (idiotic anyway) Gowdwin’s ‘law.’

    When it comes to green extremists with a track record of hating Jews and now pushing for the banning of free speech, the allusion to Nazism is entirely justified and, indeed, important.

  34. nic

    Spot’s right. I think Hammygar is a poor attempt at Alene Composta.

  35. C.L.

    I should also point oout that Monty unlawfully slandered Andrew Robb last year, arguing he was a dangerous, mentally ill nut-case whose well publicised condition had rendered him unemployable.

    Will Monty withdraw and apologise?

    Of course he won’t.

    The Soros-like collaborater has stated plainly above that he wants the state to punish and censor his enemies for ‘entertainment,’ even as he himself trashes and defames anyone he likes.

  36. WB

    Yep, that’s my feeling too, Nic (and Spotty).

  37. Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

    Ham Person, the above thread demonstrates in a number of ways that squalor is a learned cultural and/or a reactive psychiatric condition. Ignoring the fact of squalor with regard to aboriginal people in disadvantaged circumstances thus becomes the real sin. You are guilty of it. What a pathetic piece of excuse-making you generate, guised in a typical leftist response of ‘dog whistle’ and ‘racism’. I wouldn’t offer you a jail term, though, for your disgraceful neglect of truth, because I’m not into legislated inquisitions for the sinful. I’ll just make do with sending you my sincere contempt.

    This is my response to Hammygar on Bunyip when he accuses all on the thread of a ‘dog whistle’ and ‘racism’ for approving of a photograph of a squalid situation accompanying a story on aboriginal disadvantage. He suggests all on the thread should be prosecuted and imprisoned for our views.

    Yet, he is the one who here now declares himself to have been subject to hurtful comments and viewpoints.

    So there is nothing hurtful about threatening to imprison people because you disagree with them?

    Take it where it hurts, Ham Person, and look into your own conscience as to why it does so.

  38. blogstrop

    Since the arrival on the media scene of a competitor in the shape of various blogs – now upgraded from “some guy typing in his pyjamas” to highly influential far right and probably evil – a control method has to be evolved.
    The idea of a leftist government stacked overseeing body must be a wet dream fantasy for the beleaguered leftoids, who continue to lament the considerable (and growing) following that all the conservatively inclined bloggers enjoy.

  39. wreckage

    Governments that want stasis start by restricting speech.

    It’s impossible to imagine a more knee-jerk, reactionary government than the ALP. They want the 1930′s back and they will stop at nothing to get them.

  40. Pickles

    OHH
    Yes it will be fun. We will be able to find out who belongs or has contributed money to our foes, who has solar panels on the roof, (from the rebate register) who drives a Prius, (from car rego details) and who subscribes to the Green Left Weekly or the Monthly.

  41. Biota

    Gotta say that on the whole leftoids seem to be emotionally delicate flowers. I think it is because they and their ideas are bereft of reason and so are easily put down with a bit of level-headedness. Low emotional IQ I reckon.

  42. m0nty

    I have never once in all my years blogging called anyone a c—, Monty, you dishonest loser.

    Apologise.

    I apologise, CL. I got you confused with Dot, who dropped the c-bomb on Steve the other day.

  43. m0nty

    I should also point oout that Monty unlawfully slandered Andrew Robb last year, arguing he was a dangerous, mentally ill nut-case whose well publicised condition had rendered him unemployable.

    This, meanwhile, is a terrible lie by you, CL. I did not say that.

    I’m perfectly happy for Robb to continue to be an MP and fulfil such relatively menial duties to the best of his ability. All I said was that I didn’t want him in a high-pressure senior cabinet position with his hands on the tiller of the nation. A man on strong drugs such as he is is liable to make bad decisions and adversely affect the judgement of those around him. I am not slandering anyone.

  44. m0nty

    While I agree m0nty brought it on himself, let’s not go overboard on the c-bomb.

    Sinclair’s moderation policy is hilarious. “It’s perfectly okay to call someone the most horrible names just because you don’t agree with them. Just don’t repeat it too many times, or else I’ll get a little huffy.”

  45. JC

    Finance, according the monster is a life and death struggle.

  46. Pickles

    Now there’s an idea, E health will enable me to check out who’s medicated and on what and for what so I can decide who is suitable only for menial tasks and who might be up for the more difficult stuff.

    I mean, mental illness isn’t a death sentence, it just means that you’re fucked up for life, cause the medication means that you can’t make good decisions and your mental illness will seep out and infest those around you..

  47. .

    monty you are a clown. You and Steve are dishonest to the point where it is truly sickening. I am a tolerant man but even I have my limits.

  48. JC

    It’s true Monster. You are thoroughly dishonest and about as popular as Stepford here.

    You two offer nothing to this site.

  49. .

    I should also point oout that Monty unlawfully slandered Andrew Robb last year, arguing he was a dangerous, mentally ill nut-case whose well publicised condition had rendered him unemployable.

    He couldn’t be worse than the terminally brain damaged “Dumb C**t”, Wayne Swan.

  50. ar

    You can’t hurt a robot.

  51. Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

    Just don’t repeat it too many times, or else I’ll get a little huffy.”

    Sinclair doesn’t mind outliers, he just doesn’t want this language to be the mean. I’m OK with that.

    Moderation has its place; moderately.

  52. m0nty

    monty you are a clown. You and Steve are dishonest to the point where it is truly sickening. I am a tolerant man but even I have my limits.

    Why don’t you call Steve a c*** again and show us what a big man you are, Dot.

  53. Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

    Over on the Open Thread people have been throwing around the C-bomb a bit, playgroup style, just to see what happens. Now everyone’s fed up with the game, end of story.

    What is more interesting to me is why that word is considered to be so awful. A lot of history there.

  54. .

    Why don’t you call Steve a c*** again and show us what a big man you are, Dot.

    Okay, Steve is a [edited. Sinc] and you are morbidly obese.

    Happy?

    [No. Come on. Sinc]

  55. m0nty

    Ooh, look at Dot the strong, confident man. He knows bad words. He must be right.

  56. JC

    Monster,

    hold that thought. What are you doing about taking off 40 kilos and going to the gym?

    Maybe I ought to enlist you in Australia’s Biggest Losers program. I’m happy to go on with you and act as your trainer with the full authority to beat you around a little if you don’t follow the exercise and diet regimen.

  57. .

    Of course I am. Steve is an outrageously duplicitous person for the sake of expanding Government expenses at the cost of taxpayers other than himself.

    He has no honour and will be treated as such.

  58. .

    minty,

    If you want to wear the beta male crown of thorns, I will bloody crucify you.

    Don’t martyr yourself for penis obsessed Steve – to wit the abominable name I call him seems fitting.

  59. m0nty

    Of course I am. Steve is an outrageously duplicitous person for the sake of expanding Government expenses at the cost of taxpayers other than himself.

    He has no honour and will be treated as such.

    You can argue that case without resorting to childish namecalling, Dot. It shows a lack of confidence in your position that you and others on this blog feel the need to add gratuitous insults to every post. You undermine your arguments by lacing them with foul language and schoolyard taunting.

    Pulling back from the constant abuse would not be an example of censorship. Maturity, that is what it would be. The tone here will continue to be infantile from the likes of Dot, CL and JC whilst Sinclair, Steve and the other mods not only allow them to act like spoilt brats, but encourage them with dogwhistling OPs.

  60. Fisky

    Unduly critical, abusive, ignorant opinionating must be accountable.

    I’d be delighted. For example, on this blog we have had people claim that the Czechs were better off under Communism. This is completely wrong, hurtful to Czechs, only serves to give succour to atavistic totalitarian movements, and may well constitute incitement to anti-democratic violence.

    Communist opinions should be banned from expression under a strengthened Press Council.

  61. Gab

    That’s a lovely sermon, m0nty, and befitting as it’s a Sunday (no, m0nty, Abbott won’t be calling for a censure motion today either). It’s also befitting that you call for censorship on this thread entitled “Australia needs more censorship”.

    Really, you ought to comment at LP where such robust debate is not tolerated. They’re more genteel over there. You should make it your home rather than here, especially as you often communicate just how much you deteast this blog and its commentariat.

  62. .

    No you idiot it shows that Steve is a rock solid troll. Are his comments about Tony Abbot’s penis really necessary? Childish namecalling? Steve is either a Get Up activist who is being dishonest and childish or a sexually confused arsehole. That is the truth. After about a week of that crap – he need to be told to shut up and argue the debate in good faith without constant penis references.

    Have you ever tried to have a “debate” with Nazi sympathiser Paxton?

    Being told you are wrong because of reference X, and giving academic courtesy to it, then finding out it was made up and someone has abused a source – minty, this is the academic equivalent of someone sleeping with your wife.

    They must be made a pariah at all costs.

    Pulling back from the constant abuse would not be an example of censorship.

    Which countermands what you said earlier. Are you just trolling yourself?

    Try arguing in good faith and you will be respected. You’re like a punk kid who goes around rolling old ladies, demanding “respect”.

    Why are you running interference for Steve?

  63. m0nty

    I have never quite grokked the flow of LP, Gab. They have way too many open/clippings threads, and not enough meat in the OPs.

  64. .

    The tone here will continue to be infantile from the likes of Dot, CL and JC

    You cannot keep in real debate or name calling.

    1. You have called uncle very shortly after you commenced to assault my character.

    2. Your expounding of economics was limited to biting your lower lip and looking up at the ceiling as you failed.

  65. m0nty

    Which countermands what you said earlier. Are you just trolling yourself?

    It doesn’t countermand anything I said. Stop lying.

    Try arguing in good faith and you will be respected. You’re like a punk kid who goes around rolling old ladies, demanding “respect”.

    I do argue in good faith. The fact that you have lost many arguments we have had – especially those on my home turf of tech and sport, where you are clueless – is clouding your judgement.

    Why are you running interference for Steve?

    Steve is big enough to stand up for himself. I am knocking you for your constant abuse, of which I have received more than my fair share from you and others.

  66. DavidJ

    “A man on strong drugs such as he is is liable to make bad decisions and adversely affect the judgement of those around him. I am not slandering anyone.”

    Bullshit. You are slandering him. How do you know what medication he may have taken? Besides, the public is likely better served by an MP under medical supervision taking the appropriate mood stabiliser, than say a MP suffering with untreated “…dysfunctional decision making and his deeply demeaning attitude towards other people”.

  67. I mean no disrespect, but you’re a c***. You’re a c*** now, and you’ve always been a c***. And the only thing that’s going to change is that you’re going to be an even bigger c***. Maybe have some more c*** kids.

    [Yobbo - was that really necessary? Sinc]

  68. m0nty

    Yes DavidJ, I don’t want Rudd running the country either. :)

  69. .

    It doesn’t countermand anything I said. Stop lying.

    Yeah right. You want to dictate editorial policy. Do you or do you not support the Fink’s enquiry?

    The fact that you have lost many arguments we have had – especially those on my home turf of tech and sport, where you are clueless – is clouding your judgement.

    Um, no. I HAVE NEVER LOST AN ARGUMENT TO YOU.

    Steve is big enough to stand up for himself. I am knocking you for your constant abuse, of which I have received more than my fair share from you and others.

    Stop bitching about it then and stop being a beta male.

  70. It’s a cultural reference Sinc, seemed appropriate to the thread.

  71. m0nty

    Yeah right. You want to dictate editorial policy. Do you or do you not support the Fink’s enquiry?

    I have said multiple times before that I don’t. Do keep up, Dot.

    Um, no. I HAVE NEVER LOST AN ARGUMENT TO YOU.

    You have lost every argument we have had on the NBN due to your technical cluelessness. Ditto for the infrequent discussion on AFL and NRL issues.

    Stop bitching about it then and stop being a beta male.

    So your response to me pointing out that you constantly abuse me is to abuse me again. Heckuva job, Dot.

  72. .

    The Doomlord is a philistine. Even I got the reference. It is said to Ralph Fiennes – so it has got to be classy.

  73. .

    You have lost every argument we have had on the NBN due to your technical cluelessness. Ditto for the infrequent discussion on AFL and NRL issues.

    Monty you idiot the NBN is going to lose money and it is nearly four years behind schedule, ON TOP OF the original loss making.

    You are a gullible dupe.

    You have never played football (especially AFL, fat people literally cannot play that game) or studied law at any level in your life. You only think you are correct because you go for a loser, bogan club. How are several Torana modifications going?

    Stop kidding yourself.

  74. m0nty

    Dot, how can a project announced less than three years ago be four years behind schedule? Does Mike Quigley have a time machine? Make some sense for once.

    Hawks for the flag 2012. :)

  75. twostix

    Pulling back from the constant abuse would not be an example of censorship. Maturity, that is what it would be. The tone here will continue to be infantile from the likes of Dot, CL and JC whilst Sinclair, Steve and the other mods not only allow them to act like spoilt brats, but encourage them with dogwhistling OPs

    “Pulling back” m0nties euphamism for “ban the people who I don’t like from making comments that I don’t like”.

    You never answer the question m0nty, if you don’t like it here then why do you persist in coming here? There’s millions of blogs in the world. Obviously the site owners are happy with the way things are but you of course in the typically agressive leftist way you don’t like something that everyone else is perfectly happy with so youdemand that everyone else change…or else.

  76. .

    Dot, how can a project announced less than three years ago be four years behind schedule? Does Mike Quigley have a time machine? Make some sense for once.

    Dickhead, look at the schedules our economic dream team of Rudd and Swan cooked up. 2017…now 2021, if not later.

    You are a gullible dupe. It loses money and now the NPV has an extra four years of amortisation.

    It is a disaster before it starts.

  77. Sinclair Davidson

    yobbo – sorry, I’m a philistine. No culture at all.

  78. JC

    Stix

    I asked the totalitarian loon that same question earlier, but he hasn’t manned up and answered it. I very much doubt he will do so it for you.

    But lets try again….

    You never answer the question m0nty, if you don’t like it here then why do you persist in coming here? There’s millions of blogs in the world. Obviously the site owners are happy with the way things are but you of course in the typically agressive leftist way you don’t like something that everyone else is perfectly happy with so youdemand that everyone else change…or else

  79. twostix

    Dot, how can a project announced less than three years ago be four years behind schedule? Does Mike Quigley have a time machine? Make some sense for once.

    If he had a time machine he could go back and revise the NBN co’s business plan stating that it would have 30,000 subscribers by last June down to the 4000 that it actually had.

  80. .

    monty,

    If you question the rough treatment Steve gets – remember once he tried to pull the utterly freakish scientologist’s tactic of declaring people fair game – he now squeals uncle when it is done to him. It’s hilarious to remind him of the fact.

    He wouldn’t get it so bad if he wasn’t so much of a c..onniving prick.

  81. m0nty

    “Pulling back” m0nties euphamism for “ban the people who I don’t like from making comments that I don’t like”.

    Rubbish 26, I have never advocated straight bans. Quiet words in shell-likes, sure. If people persist in being uncivil, then they would go the way of Bird.

    You never answer the question m0nty, if you don’t like it here then why do you persist in coming here?

    I believe I have said it before: I come here because I like to be challenged, and engage in robust debate with people I disagree with. It makes me a better communicator. Chattering with people I agree with sounds boring to me. I could do without the abuse, though.

  82. .

    Fine. A return to civility.

  83. JC

    Chattering with people I agree with sounds boring to me. I could do without the abuse, though.

    Think of the children and their childrens children..

  84. m0nty

    Dickhead, look at the schedules our economic dream team of Rudd and Swan cooked up. 2017…now 2021, if not later.

    You are a gullible dupe. It loses money and now the NPV has an extra four years of amortisation.

    Your maths are obviously bogus, Dot. You can’t count NPV from 2007, before NBN Co was even started. Lying must be involuntary for you, you must have a special gland for it by now.

    You stumble like a drunken sailor between posts, forgetting in the interim that you have already stepped in dog poo. Clean yourself up.

  85. Abu Chowdah

    Hey Harry, your avatar looks like a pastel swastika.

    You retard.

  86. hammygar

    I’m amazed at the deterioration of this thread to comment after comment of childish abuse. It’s confirmed my suspicion that right-wing people are suffering from arrested development syndrome. Stuck at about early secondary school level. My original comment should have been an introduction to a serious conversation, but look at where some of you have taken it. Appalling.

    I’m not advocating banning bad opinions. Just make their perpertators accountable, and if found guilty, suitably punished as an example to others and as a demonstration to the victims that they are valued members of society.

  87. .

    Your maths are obviously bogus, Dot. You can’t count NPV from 2007, before NBN Co was even started. Lying must be involuntary for you, you must have a special gland for it by now.

    You stumble like a drunken sailor between posts, forgetting in the interim that you have already stepped in dog poo. Clean yourself up.

    Go fuck yourself, imbecile.

  88. Abu Chowdah

    Your advocating a growth in the culture of victimhood, but only in the sense that those who share your political views have a right to feel offense and to seek retribution.

    You’re a disingenuous fascistic scum bag troll. You don’t deserve to be shown any respect because you are not a respecter of anyone’s right to free expression. Unlike you, I don’t seek to shut you down. Your views will be heard but not respected as serious.

  89. John Mc

    I’m not advocating banning bad opinions. Just make their perpertators accountable, and if found guilty, suitably punished as an example to others and as a demonstration to the victims that they are valued members of society.

    He’s not advocating banning bad opinions, just criminalising them with severe enforcement! That’s lefty logic??!!!

  90. Abu Chowdah

    Thought police, Godwin be damned.

  91. Fisky

    I’m not advocating banning bad opinions. Just make their perpertators accountable, and if found guilty, suitably punished as an example to others and as a demonstration to the victims that they are valued members of society.

    I totally agree. Lets start with the most worthless opinions at all, such as Communism, and work our way up from there.

  92. John Williams

    I take extreme offence at Monty being called a cunt.
    Hey, people use your spell-checker!!
    Clearly you meant “Count” …. useless prat, a figure of fun, a living,walking, talking caricature in innumerable comedies.
    Please do not sully my early teenage fantasies, my early adult fumblings or my licenced (State and Church) escapades of the past 50 years by trivialising something so dear to my mental and physical health.
    ‘Course you might have meant arsehole.

  93. Max Scream

    The great obfuscation machine cranks into action.

  94. Jazza

    In the other room, my TV is bringing the Greens idiot-in-chief, Brown, spouting about”the public interest” and “the Murdoch hate media”

    Well I am a member of the public and I’m NOT interested in the ABC’s left bias but I not only have to suck it up or use the remote, I know it is publicly funded,whereas the truth I find via Murdoch is in the free market and doing better

    That tells me this bloke n knows nothing of the “public interest”.

    People need to object to all this Marxism aimed at confining free speech nationally.

  95. Max Scream

    Marx was an advocate of free speech.

  96. Abu Chowdah

    And his adherents?

    There ya go, little feller.

  97. Alexander

    Frankly, and I say this without reading all the comments, if Australia gets censorship I will be the first to start having comments for here recommended for further review: Because the comments need the extra coverage a good investigation followed by civil disobedience will result in.

    I mean would kind of fool with a moth-eaten brain thinks you can censor people’s expression of their opinions? Seriously. It’s just daft. The Labor Party needs to be destroyed and they’re doing an excellent job of proving exactly why.

    I say again, any time a democratic government of a quasi-free country can seriously entertain the prospect of censorship and legislating opinions onto people it needs to become law just so we can prove to our foolish government, as Canute did to his foolish nobleman, just how empty and worthless the power of parliament is.

  98. Jc

    Mad dog brown is a really despicable individual.

    The entire party is made up of fascist scum. The absolute dregs of humanity.

  99. Alexander

    “I mean would kind of fool” should read “I mean what kind of fool”. An excellent place to make a foolish typing error.

  100. Reading the comments of M0nty, I finally can see the small type of person who would get perverse enjoyment of being informer to the polit-bureau.

  101. twostix

    I’m not advocating banning bad opinions. Just make their perpertators accountable, and if found guilty, suitably punished as an example to others and as a demonstration to the victims that they are valued members of society.

    Awww that’s a dead giveaway. I perfect troll until that last line. Even the most ridiculous leftist wouldn’t come here and say something as awful as that – to each other yes, but not in public.

    Hammygar’s just taking the piss.

  102. stevo

    I am utterly offended by hammygar’s opinion.

    I feel awful, angry, attacked even. I can no longer feel peaceful. I can’t sleep, nor enjoy my daily sustenance.

    My life is ruined by the feelings that opinion evoked in me.

    There should be a law against such opinionating !

  103. Carpe Jugulum

    An excellent place to make a foolish typing error.

    It’s ok in mOntyspeak that admission will make you a valued member of society for your contrition.

    That and 2 hail Gaias and a wad of cash to flanners

  104. Marx was an advocate of free speech.

    Really, it is strange how every state that implements the economic values he advocated in a “pure” form turned into a totalitarian hell.

    We all know he loved to speak freely about his views about Africans, he was truly a man of Victorian sentiments.

  105. lotocoti

    …that they are valued members of society.

    I think we might be getting an insight into hammygar’s world.

  106. Jc

    Elephant man..

    ” I am not an animal”.

  107. Kelly of Kenmore

    Elephant man was vegetable, or mineral?

  108. papachango

    The comment was from hammygar, and clearly a troll.

    That said, it’s not that far off how people like Clive Hamilton really think, and the fact that we’re even taking about this kind of censorship legislation is frightening.

  109. Spot, go and read all the Hammygar posts at the Professor’s blog, if they are still up, this dude/dudess manages cleverly to dig up and expose the whole gamut of ‘progressive’ group think.

    Bullshit.

    It was after his/her/its first comment at Bunyip’s that I called shenanigans on him/her/it.

    Stop trying to make Hammygar happen, Des Deskperson. S/he’s not going to happen.

  110. wreckage

    Sinclair’s moderation policy is hilarious. “It’s perfectly okay to call someone the most horrible names just because you don’t agree with them. Just don’t repeat it too many times, or else I’ll get a little huffy.”

    Yes, “You can say what you want, but I have standards which I request people keep” is clearly a bit too liberal for some.

  111. daddy dave

    Sinclair seems to draw the line at slander or abuse of people under their real names, such as journalists, or simply people who use their real name as a moniker.

    Bu if you come here and comment using a pseudonym (as most of us do but not all), then it’s pretty much open season.

  112. m0nty

    When Dot has nothing left, at least he’s got swear words.

  113. hammygar

    In the UK even little kids aren’t immune.

    Nor should they be immune. Racist attitudes DO originate in childhood, and need to be nipped in the bud. I’m quite disgusted that Phillips publicised these cases in a widely-read newspaper, and victimised school staff who were correctly doing their jobs. That’s straight out bullying. It’s no excuse to say she didn’t identify the teachers involved. Plenty of people would know who they were.

    If the proposed media laws to be introduced (soon I hope) into Australia were in force in Britain Phillips woud have been prosecuted and her licence to publish would hopefully have been suspended.

  114. JC

    Hamster:

    Are you losing weight? Envy and hate seem to be eating you from the inside out. Get yourself checked out.

  115. hammygar

    I suggest you’re projecting your own self image onto me, Joe. You’re the hating one. I’m full of empathy for the teachers in this case, where it should be.

  116. TerjeP

    Hammygar – you’re taking the piss aren’t you. Surely you are not serious.

  117. JC

    Hamster, fuck off, you pathetic loon.

    I don’t hate anyone, but do I find people like you to be despicable lowlives.

    Furthermore I suggested your insides are being devoured like a tumor by hate and envy, which is clearly the case.

    Stop doing it as it will end up killing you before your time.

  118. JC

    Hammygar – you’re taking the piss aren’t you. Surely you are not serious.

    No I don’t think he’s taking the piss. He posts the same sort of thing over at leftwing blogs, usually about the unfairness of people earning more than he does, which is some Centrelink benefit. The Hamster thinks no one should be earning more than he is, an idea that the Soviets ditched early in their experiment.

    He’s a retro leftwinger it seems.

  119. Mk50 of Brisbane

    Hmm. The troll handonhisgear might be an improvement over the pitiful fourth raters we seem to get these days.

    But probably not.

    Probably just another coarse pelted flea ridden lower hominid sort of troll with the intellect of a stromatolite, and even less personality than a vestimentiferan.

  120. Winston Smith

    I had to look that one up, Mk50.
    Vestimentiferans rock!

  121. kae

    Stromatolites, all they have to do is hang on.

    They’re ancient, too.

  122. duncan

    Hammy must be doing something right..

    He’s got plenty of you in a lather.

  123. JC

    Here is the envy ridden troll over at lavatory Pronto wanting to nationalize da banks. Hamster wants to be able to access cheap loans with his Centrelink payments that he receives because of his sore back.

    What I object to is the report on tonight’s news about junior staff at the ANZ receiving luxurious cruises at the expense of loan borrowers. This is appalling waste by the ANZ and makes their 0.06% interest rate rise recently particularly unconscionable. Some of them aren’t even permanent employees I understand. What is it with these big banks that they think they can give the one-finger salute to customers, and reward insiders?

    I say nationalise them all.

    Here’s the little hamster confused between what is revenue/profits and bank deposits:

    You object to it being reported? Why? As long as it’s true, I’ve no problem with the report.

    At least you’re good at pedantry if nothing else.

    This is OUR money the bank is splashing out with abandon. Nationalise it.

    Here’s the hamster puttting on his professional economists hat also at that same boghole of a site.

    You seem to be implying that the Government isn’t spending its money well. That’s nonsense. They and they alone saved us from a deep recession in 2008/9 by their timely expenditure. I’m appalled at the lack of credit that’s given them for that, and the constant nagging about waste on the various programmes. Look at the big picture.

    Here’s Hamster as the education expert. He wants to introduce bussing.

    Of course Adele is absolutely correct. Private schools in this day and age are an anachronism, and should not only lose taxpayer funding, but should be gradually phased out. Sure, allow current private high school private students to complete their schooling where they’ve started but prevent new enrollees from now on.

    The USA had a good affirmative action programme many years ago called “bussing” whereby children from affluent and white areas were bussed into poor and/or black areas for school. We should introduce this idea here. Wealthy parents must realise that their bright children are a public resource and should be placed where they can be used to upgrade the education outcomes of children from disadvantaged areas.

    The notion that we should allow parents with above-average financial resources to artificially enhance their own children’s educational outcomes is one that works towards increasing the already appalling level of inequality in our society. It is surely extreme selfishness.

    Here’s Hamster saying he hates white folk.

    Of course it is, any white man in Australia today must suffer severe guilt because of suffering to aboriginals caused by those of many generations before.

    Not only white men (although they’re the worst, and their guilt should be greater), but any migrant at all (even those not white), for coming here at all and contributing to the dispossession of the aboriginals.

    I don’t want to be racist (although you’ll all accuse me of that), but we all have to face facts. I got into trouble with many commenters recently for expressing my own remorse, but we do have to be realistic, regardless of origin.

    Share the guilt says the Hamster.

    May, that’s a very right-wing (almost Howardian,) point-of-view. We all share the shame of our ancestors. Trying to wriggle out of responsibility because you may feel yourself blameless is pretty poor form.

    Here’s Hamster supporting Getitup and suggesting more and more he’s associated with this vermin.

    People join unions because it’s the only way to support their living wage. Industrial action by unions is almost always enthuisatically welcomed by the bulk of members. Without unions, workers would be ground into the dust like waterside workers were in the late 90s by Reith and Howard. Of course unions support organisations that can influence the public, like Get-Up, an heroic organisation

    Heroric. Lol.

    And then you end up with this, which may suggest he’s either a troll in the Composta mold or completely of his tree.

    Yes this form of subconscious racism has been noted regularly for many years. I’m not even sure that using the word subconscious is accurate. White people in the USA in particular seem to have an irrational loathing of black people that depicts the lingering racism in that country. Once again it appears to be more prevalent among the uneducated lower class whites, particularly in areas that vote Republican.

    Much the same phenomenon appears in Australia, particularly in those rural areas where aboriginals are more numerous. Whites in these areas blame aboriginals for misbehaviour (particularly drunkenness and violence) that can be directly traced back to the dispossession of their land.

    I am of anglo-saxon descent myself (several generations), and cannot seem to help my perpetual feelings of guilt about my existence here in their land. I would really like to migrate away from Australia. I’m ineligible for immigration to any other country because of my age, so I have thoughts that the only just decision on my part would be self-termination on the grounds of social justice.

  124. JC

    Hamster:

    ……so I have thoughts that the only just decision on my part would be self-termination on the grounds of social justice.

    Can I say from the bottom of my heart that if you have these thoughts, don’t let anyone inhibit what you want to do for social justice reasons. Be resolute about it, as you’ll feel better in the morning. I promise you.

    At the very least you’ll feel no guilt.

  125. JC

    Sean:

    The question I will be often asking the Hamster from now on is why he hasn’t self terminated for social justice reasons as the guilt would certainly go away. In fact we can safely say the Ham won’t be feeling a thing.

  126. Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

    Fruitloop? Or this is trolling, but s/he’s not terrily good at it; maybe a foundation member of the “Not Terribly Good Club”?

    Suicidal thoughts based on ‘social justice’, Hammy? No need for that. The internet is a problem for some and maybe it is for you. Ring Lifeline or talk to someone friendly about this now. Seriously.

  127. JC

    Keep the kitchen knives away from him.

  128. Sean

    someone perhaps went to the festival of dangerous ideas and found out the danger was in fact to anyone who actually believed all of them.

  129. Sean

    Sinc should bite the bullet. We know m0nty is a troll who constantly takes threads off topic. We also know that he get’s under people’s skin by constantly changing the topic when losing an arguement. Given he appears to lack ability to understand why he fustrates people so much, the best thing would probably be to ask him to tap him on the shoulder and ask him to leave.

  130. twostix

    I’m ineligible for immigration to any other country because of my age,

    Dude’s you’ll are being trolled by a 16 or 80 year old.

    But whatever else Hammygar gets wrong, last november he said this:

    My confident prediction is that the next Newspoll will show the government ahead 52:48 on a 2PP. Turnbull will be back as opposition leader by February. Abbott’s finished.

    HAHAHAHAHAHAH

  131. Megan

    I would really like to migrate away from Australia.

    Pretty sure New Zealand would take you. And your age would only make you ineligible if you were under 18 and needing Mummy and Daddy’s permission.

  132. JC

    His immigration problem is the least of his worries. He needs to be placed on suicide watch. I’m worried about him.

  133. .

    You weak bastard minty you have nothing of substance to add other then a shitheaded, lame brained insult towards me regarding the value of my commentary – AFTER I made an offer of civility and you returned in kind with extreme incivility.

    Now you will be treated as such with extreme prejudice.

  134. .

    I take extreme offence at Monty being called a c***.
    Hey, people use your spell-checker!!
    Clearly you meant “Count” …. useless prat, a figure of fun, a living,walking, talking caricature in innumerable comedies.
    Please do not sully my early teenage fantasies, my early adult fumblings or my licenced (State and Church) escapades of the past 50 years by trivialising something so dear to my mental and physical health.
    ‘Course you might have meant arsehole.

    LOLs

    Can we settle on “obese toe rag”?

  135. m0nty

    You weak bastard minty you have nothing of substance to add other then a shitheaded, lame brained insult towards me regarding the value of my commentary – AFTER I made an offer of civility and you returned in kind with extreme incivility.

    I was composing that post while you posted your other one. It wasn’t in response to it. I didn’t mean to be impolite. I apologise for the juxtaposition of the two posts.

    If you want to call a truce or whatever, I’m up for that.

  136. .

    Okay.

    The idea that you keep NPV the same because you bring forward the project start date is erroneous.

  137. Gab

    . He needs to be placed on suicide watch. I’m worried about him.

    You’re such a caring guy, JC. You’re far too good to them.

  138. JC

    Gab, The hamster needs my help. He seems quite ill and I’m doing all I can to help the moron not end his life for social justice.

    I care deeply.

    Then again, having just thought about, it would at least (lets say) help assuage his guilt about the original owners issue that seems to be swirling around in around his brain stem.

    I’m really torn on this one. Perhaps we should have a poll.

  139. Gab

    See? There you go again, JC. You want to be meanspirited but just can’t quite manage it as your nurturing nature takes over.

    Really, Humanitarian Of the Year should be awarded to you.

    I’m really torn on this one.

    There, there. Your sensitive nature makes you prone to a deep empathy for your fellow man. Try not to get too personally vested; we each make our own path in life.

  140. JC

    Really, Humanitarian Of the Year should be awarded to you.

    Yea I know. I’m deeply humanitarian. Should have happened ages ago in fact. I ought to be Australian of the year.
    I’m actually thinking of offering Hamster my leftie suicide watch hotline in case he gets these big ideas.

    The nurturing side of me suggests we/I need to help the ham through this rough patch whereas the libertarian side says… Ham, you go for it son and make a big splash… pun intended.

  141. m0nty

    The idea that you keep NPV the same because you bring forward the project start date is erroneous.

    Extending the end date of a project by four years does not mean it is currently four years behind schedule. There have been delays measured in months to allow the Telstra deal to trickle through the ACCC approval process. That’s all. The contracts are all ready to go, ISPs have all released pricing plans, everything is in readiness.

    Don’t worry, as soon as Sims waves the chequered flag, the roll out will happen all through 2012 and 2013 to boost the economy and mop up any weakness in employment in the non-mining economy. Quite well-timed, really.

  142. JC

    Extending the end date of a project by four years does not mean it is currently four years behind schedule

    lol.. Dickhead.

  143. wreckage

    happen all through 2012 and 2013 to boost the economy and mop up any weakness in employment

    In other news, I shit unicorns and piss rivers of molten gold.

  144. Megan

    Extending the end date of a project by four years does not mean it is currently four years behind schedule

    Brags about his Gold Medal winning knowledge of technology and football but has NFI about project or risk management. If I tried telling this to a client I’d be sacked on the spot.

    The NBN is going to be the most massive failure, with all associated cost to the taxpayer, that this country has ever seen. Not because of technology or even the economics of it, though they are in the mix, but because the organisation put together to build it has not the hard won knowledge, skills or capability required. And every single thing I know about its performance to date proves it.

  145. How long till it’s illegal to make critical remarks about the NBN? We’re just about there in the case of the Carbon Tax.

  146. Winston Smith

    “You never answer the question m0nty, if you don’t like it here then why do you persist in coming here? There’s millions of blogs in the world. Obviously the site owners are happy with the way things are but you of course in the typically aggressive leftist way you don’t like something that everyone else is perfectly happy with so you demand that everyone else change…or else.”

    Monty is our very own Fluke person. He / she wouldn’t be here if we agreed with her. She’s on a mission to impose her beliefs on us, and we don’t have the right to refuse her. Monty is on the same mission, but being a buffoon, he’s continually stuffing it up.

  147. Winston Smith

    How long till it’s illegal to make critical remarks about the NBN? We’re just about there in the case of the Carbon Tax.

    Isn’t it illegal now to criticise it in terms of electricity price rises?

  148. Isn’t it illegal now to criticise it in terms of electricity price rises?

    Yes, but the odd thing is my American friends seem more horrified by that than my Aussie ones. At least they blog more about it, and in a much more alarmed tone of voice (tone of pixel?).

    “Freedom of speech beaten and left bleeding in Australia?”

    “Aussie Climate Alarmists Get Their Inner Fascist Groove On”

    The Australia of today is nothing like the Australia I knew in the 80s. What the f**k happened?

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