Open Forum: Easter/Passover 2012 at Catallaxy Files

Open Forum: Easter/Passover 2012

1,029 comments

Written by Sinclair Davidson

April 6th, 2012 at 12:01 am

Posted in Uncategorized

1,029 Responses to 'Open Forum: Easter/Passover 2012'

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I saw the Crescent – you saw the whole of the…

Rabz

6 Apr 12 at 12:05 am
I acknowledge the Indigenous people, on whose lands we meet today.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 12:07 am
Actually what Jesus said was

All choppers are bastards. I should know!

Jesus H. Christ Bethlehem 20 AD

Peter Patton

6 Apr 12 at 12:07 am
This message was brought to you all by the CCC™

Rabz

6 Apr 12 at 12:08 am
I’ve just up on US Banking stocks. I better be freaking right or there will be a very angry JC here for the rest of the year.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 12:09 am
Oh FFS give it a rest, Peter.

Gab

6 Apr 12 at 12:12 am
(Yeah, Ah-Ah-Ah-Ah-Ah-Ark)
Oo-ooh-ooh, hoo yeah, yeah
Yeah, yeah
Yeah-ah-ah
Yeah-ah-ah
Yeah-ah-ah
Yeah-ah-ah
Yeah, yeah, yeah

7am, waking up in the morning
Gotta be fresh, gotta go downstairs
Gotta have my bowl, gotta have cereal
Seein’ everything, the time is goin’
Tickin’ on and on, everybody’s rushin’
Gotta get down to the bus stop
Gotta catch my bus, I see my friends (My friends)

Kickin’ in the front seat
Sittin’ in the back seat
Gotta make my mind up
Which seat can I take?

It’s Friday, Friday
Gotta get down on Friday
Everybody’s lookin’ forward to the weekend, weekend
Friday, Friday
Gettin’ down on Friday
Everybody’s lookin’ forward to the weekend

Party it, party it, (yeah)
Party it, party it (yeah)
Fun, fun, fun, fun
Lookin’ forward to the weekend

7:45, we’re drivin’ on the highway
Cruisin’ so fast, I want time to fly
Fun, fun, think about fun
You know what it is
I got this, you got this
My friend is by my right
I got this, you got this
Now you know it

Kickin’ in the front seat
Sittin’ in the back seat
Gotta make my mind up
Which seat can I take?

It’s Friday, Friday
Gotta get down on Friday
Everybody’s lookin’ forward to the weekend, weekend
Friday, Friday

Gettin’ down on Friday
Everybody’s lookin’ forward to the weekend

Partyin’, partyin’ (Yeah)
Partyin’, partyin’ (Yeah)
Fun, fun, fun, fun
Lookin’ forward to the weekend

Yesterday was Thursday, Thursday
Today i-is Friday, Friday (Partyin’)
We-we-we so excited
We so excited
We gonna have a ball today

Tomorrow is Saturday
And Sunday comes after… wards
I don’t want this weekend to end

R-B, Rebecca Black
So chillin’ in the front seat (In the front seat)
In the back seat (In the back seat)
I’m drivin’, cruisin’ (Yeah, yeah)
Fast lanes, switchin’ lanes
Wit’ a car up on my side (Woo! )
(C’mon) Passin’ by is a school bus in front of me
Makes tick tock, tick tock, wanna scream
Check my time, it’s Friday, it’s a weekend
We gonna have fun, c’mon, c’mon, y’all

It’s Friday, Friday
Gotta get down on Friday
Everybody’s lookin’ forward to the weekend, weekend
Friday, Friday
Gettin’ down on Friday
Everybody’s lookin’ forward to the weekend

Partyin’, partyin’ (Yeah)
Partyin’, partyin’ (Yeah)
Fun, fun, fun, fun
Lookin’ forward to the weekend

It’s Friday, Friday
Gotta get down on Friday
Everybody’s lookin’ forward to the weekend, weekend
Friday, Friday
Gettin’ down on Friday
Everybody’s lookin’ forward to the weekend

Partyin’, partyin’ (Yeah)
Partyin’, partyin’ (Yeah)
Fun, fun, fun, fun
Lookin’ forward to the weekend

Les Majesty

6 Apr 12 at 12:12 am
It’s gotta be a full moon.

Gab

6 Apr 12 at 12:13 am
I’m sure that’d be copyright ^.

kae

6 Apr 12 at 12:13 am
or there will be a very angry JC here for the rest of the year.

Everything you consume by mouth will have to laden with eccy then, squire.

Don’t make us do this, please – for your own sake.

Rabz

6 Apr 12 at 12:14 am
HAPPY EASTER EVERYONE!

JC dont’ worry about your banking stocks the US gov will just give them more handouts unless you are highly geared in which case you are crazy.

kelly liddle

6 Apr 12 at 12:14 am
Fuck off Les

Skuter

6 Apr 12 at 12:15 am
This will bring out the three race hucksters… Odumbo, Jackson and Sharpton.

It’s stupid nonsensical crap like this that slightly embittered me about the US.

Report: Banks Ignore Foreclosed Homes in The ‘Hood

Six of the nation’s largest banks have consistently failed to aggressively market and maintain foreclosed homes in communities of color, according to the results of a nine-month long investigation released Tuesday.

The investigation by the National Fair Housing Alliance, a Washington, D.C.-based nonprofit that investigates, tracks and researches housing discrimination, studied the way banks market and maintain vacant foreclosed homes in nine metro areas and found “overwhelming” and “troubling“ evidence that banks consistently market and maintain foreclosed homes in the nation’s predominantly white neighborhoods differently. The findings constitute a violation of federal civil rights law and show that blacks and Latinos are unfairly burdened with one of the worst aspects of the nation’s housing crisis, alliance officials said.

“This is not about income. It is about race. These were consistent patterns in low-income communities, middle-income communities and upper-income neighborhoods,” said Shanna Smith, the alliance’s president and CEO. “And besides that, nobody, regardless of their income, wants to live next door to a property that is filled with trash and overgrown weeds that grow and foster rodents. No one deserves that.”

I wonder if it’s because they know there’s only little land value in that junk, as no one is going to be buying them. I’m just guessing here.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 12:16 am
Don’t talk to me Kelly. I told told I was never going to talk to you again if you exchanged spit with Phil and I’m keeping my word.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 12:17 am
Detroit is 3 weeks from Bankruptcy. Another stunning Democrat success story.

Infidel Tiger

6 Apr 12 at 12:19 am
Coming before the crowd one last time, Pilate declares Jesus innocent and washed his own hands in water to show he has no part in this condemnation. Nevertheless, Pilate hands Jesus over to be crucified in order to forestall a riot (Matthew 27:24-26) and ultimately to keep his job. The sentence written is “Jesus of Nazareth, King of the Jews.” Jesus carries his cross to the site of execution (assisted by Simon of Cyrene), called the place of the Skull, or “Golgotha” in Hebrew and in Latin “Calvary”. There he is crucified along with two criminals (John 19:17-22).

From wikipedia

Lazlo

6 Apr 12 at 12:21 am
The Canberra Cat Collective is fucking well celebrating Rabz’s fucking birthday at Rabzville, ACT. We have been drinking some 20 year old red courtesy of EB, (fucking good cellar mate). Listening to the Waterboys watching Premier League. Skuter’s gone crazy with Van Morrison. WTF? More Sid Barret is needed. More fun in Canberra – thanks tax payers. Happy Birthday Rabz.

John Comnenus

6 Apr 12 at 12:23 am
Detroit is 3 weeks from Bankruptcy. Another stunning Democrat success story.

You could buy the whole city for 25K. Ever been there? I was there in winter once seeing a disgusting client. I told we expected a lot of commission coming our way for gone there and having dinner with him. It’s the sort of place you would pick to suicide in.

(Hammy there’s an idea if your reading this and still alive. Go to Detroit and pull the pin.)

JC

6 Apr 12 at 12:23 am
oops proof reading is disgraceful this evening.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 12:23 am
Detroit is the home of Iggy Pop fuckin’ JC. Back off. Dont dis Motown.

John Comnenus

6 Apr 12 at 12:24 am
Skuter’s gone crazy with Van Morrison. WTF?

Wow. Love Van Morrison too. Have all his albums and seen him twice. A third time was overruled unless I went by myself.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 12:25 am
Right, we are going full retard Iggy in Rabz town!

John Comnenus

6 Apr 12 at 12:26 am
JC, you maka my night…

Skuter

6 Apr 12 at 12:26 am
here comes Johnny Yen again…

John Comnenus

6 Apr 12 at 12:27 am
Oi! That’s enough of that!

Rabz

6 Apr 12 at 12:27 am
Detroit is the home of Iggy Pop fuckin’ JC. Back off. Dont dis Motown.

Don’t say I word unless you go there in the winter. Enjoy the ride into town from the airport. And if you want to avoid spinal surgery ask the cabby to try and miss the bigger potholes that are bigger then bomb craters.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 12:28 am
You could buy the whole city for 25K. Ever been there?

In 50 years it’s gone from global powerhouse to outhouse.

Swanny and Gillard should be made to spend a month in Detroit panhandling. They need to learn the lesson of how fleeting and temporary prosperity is.

Infidel Tiger

6 Apr 12 at 12:29 am
Lucky Rabz has got a convertible sports car (felt a bit gay driving to Rabz town with the wind blowing through my non existent hair driven by Rabz in a bespoke pin striped suit), friends with good cellars, good CD collection and a fuck off home entertainment system.

John Comnenus

6 Apr 12 at 12:30 am
JC, you maka my night…

Haha! So I wasn’t the only one who pictured Joe Pesci going to Motor City to shakedown some punk.

Infidel Tiger

6 Apr 12 at 12:30 am
If I buy Detroit for 25k do they throw in Iggy?

John Comnenus

6 Apr 12 at 12:31 am
In 50 years it’s gone from global powerhouse to outhouse.

True. It was the factory of the world. That city won world War 2 and tore the Nazis two extra arseholes. It’s tragic what they did to it…. the Demolition party I mean.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 12:31 am
Detroit fucked up after Iggy moved to L.A.

John Comnenus

6 Apr 12 at 12:34 am
So I wasn’t the only one who pictured Joe Pesci going to Motor City to shakedown some punk.

lol
We had Ford and GM as clients, you idiot. You couldn’t shake them down. In reality we groveled and I was just kidding him when I said that.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 12:34 am
Apologies for intoducing some historical / cultural context for Easter. Might as well go with The Prophet then..

Lazlo

6 Apr 12 at 12:34 am
We love Easter Lazlo. We’re all huge church goers here.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 12:37 am
Bwahahahahaha Rabz is 40 something……

John Comnenus

6 Apr 12 at 12:38 am
The absolute hide.

SBS will be running a story on Anita Hess’s and her taxpayer funded book Am I Black enough for you, a large portion of the book covers The Trial. SBS asked Bolt for comment on camera.

Bolt’s reply:

You may have missed it, but I am not free to express my opinion. Ms Heiss was part of a legal action to silence me.

So when she asks her question, it’s odd that she expects me to answer. Sadly, you are wrong to presume I have a right to reply…

Talk about rubbing the salt in the wounds.

Gab

6 Apr 12 at 12:38 am
Lazlo

Ironically, my first comment captures all the context quite nicely.

Peter Patton

6 Apr 12 at 12:39 am
What do you love about Easter JC?

Lazlo

6 Apr 12 at 12:39 am
Here’s a little Van Morrison to settle everyone down this evening…

I think the intro to this song is just brilliant.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G9iYkF6n70E&feature=related

JC

6 Apr 12 at 12:40 am
Happy Birthday, Rabz. Just for you. xx

Gab

6 Apr 12 at 12:40 am
Looking forward to doing the stations of the cross on Sunday with a hang over after seeing the Specials on Saturday night.

John Comnenus

6 Apr 12 at 12:42 am
Nice touch Gab. Do you sing like Marylin… Happy birthday Mr Rabzident…..

John Comnenus

6 Apr 12 at 12:43 am
If you are to be a religious relativist, then you play into the hands of the Islamist extremists

Lazlo

6 Apr 12 at 12:44 am
Lazlo..

I was kidding earlier.

Not much really as I’m not religious, but we do celebrate and the food is great. I’m culturally Catholic but I don’t partake.

I have a better feeling for Xmas really as I think it’s a far nicer time.

Since coming back home though I never got into either festive periods as much. I really think a winter’s Xmas preferably with snow is unbeatable and Easter is like the start of the warm season is also good.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 12:45 am
Lazlo, I’m serious…I will go to church on Sunday. But being a good catholic will have a hang over.

John Comnenus

6 Apr 12 at 12:45 am
Thanks Gab,

Very sweet of you.

Lots ‘o’ love, Rabz.

Rabz

6 Apr 12 at 12:46 am
Well you are getting in touch with your pagan past JC. These seasonal festivals were hijacked by The Christians.

Lazlo

6 Apr 12 at 12:48 am
Bullshit Lazlo, no one would know about them if it weren’t for the Catholic Church.

John Comnenus

6 Apr 12 at 12:49 am
Lazlo

Oh, but the RCs do the pagan thing far better than the olden day pagans could ever afford.

Peter Patton

6 Apr 12 at 12:50 am
So the Catholic church discovered the seasons?

Lazlo

6 Apr 12 at 12:51 am
Fuck. OFf. Peter.

Give it a bloody rest.

Gab

6 Apr 12 at 12:51 am
So the Catholic church discovered the seasons?

No, that was Vivaldi.

Infidel Tiger

6 Apr 12 at 12:52 am
I think the best holiday of the year we don’t have Thanksgiving. It’s a terrific celebration.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 12:52 am
Well PP, that’s the point with conquering religions we do it bigger and better..

Lazlo

6 Apr 12 at 12:54 am
We also have Labor Day as a secular holday. What about Capitalism Day?

Lazlo

6 Apr 12 at 12:57 am
All choppers are bastards. I should know!

Jesus H. Christ Bethlehem 20 AD

Well of course He’d know. The 12 apostles were all Catholics, after all – bishops, in fact, including Pope Peter.

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 12:58 am
I don’t know. The Protestants are very low rent when it comes to paganism.

Peter Patton

6 Apr 12 at 12:58 am
I don’t know.

No, you don’t. Have to agree with you there.

Gab

6 Apr 12 at 12:59 am
He is the Messiah, trust me, I’ve seen a few..

Lazlo

6 Apr 12 at 1:00 am
No, JC. Turkey is a bugger to cook properly. Once a year (Xmas) is enough.

squawkbox

6 Apr 12 at 1:00 am
John Comnenus

6 Apr 12 at 1:01 am
One up for the Prods Gab. With you there.

Lazlo

6 Apr 12 at 1:02 am
Speak up , John, we can’t hear you

Gab

6 Apr 12 at 1:03 am
Wifey does a splendid turkey, Squawk. There’s a knack to it and the gravy has to also be just right. There’s no better meal.

It’s mouth watering just thinking about it

JC

6 Apr 12 at 1:04 am
JC

You must have adjusted much better than I did. All these ‘holidays’ =Thanksgiving/Passover/Xmas – involving a mad fly across the country for a 2 hour meal, then madly fly back for work a day later, struck me as insane, and a crime against humanity. I was born and bred to believe that “Christmas” meat 5 weeks of surfing and sunbaking until the end of January. And I still do. One thing I noticed in the US – pointed out to me by actual Americans – was that Aussies, working in the US, had an uncanny ability to take way, way more than 2 weeks vacation per year.

It’s in our DNA.

Peter Patton

6 Apr 12 at 1:06 am
Your head is in ThanksGiving right? Today is Easter..

Lazlo

6 Apr 12 at 1:07 am
Tomorrow is fish n’chips not dry walking bird.

Infidel Tiger

6 Apr 12 at 1:09 am
Glad to hear it, JC. However, if your Thanksgiving also involves Brussels sprouts, I shall reluctantly be obliged to issue an official internet death threat(TM) against you

squawkbox

6 Apr 12 at 1:11 am
Yea it does involve brussels sprouts. Lol

I swear to God that is the eternal dinner argument in our home. Dinner is presented and those disgusting green objects are in a dish. Everyone starts whining about it and Wifey threatens it’s the last time she ever cooks again.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 1:14 am
PolitiFact: Obama Twice Wrong On Supreme Court.

Wrong and wrong. We rate the statement False.

So that’s settled.

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 1:17 am
Tomorrow is fish n’chips not dry walking bird.

Of course it is. I’m going to my mother’s place for a great Italian bouillabaisse like concoction she makes ever good Friday.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 1:17 am
Well, we are now in the holiest time of the Christian calendar. Whether you belive in it or not (and metaphysically I don’t), I suggest it needs our respect, because it underpins our culture. It is a welcome long weekend, but let us all commemorate (with or without going to church, and I am pissed off with churches who get this wrong, but that’s another story) the fundamental story of death and rebirth.

Lazlo

6 Apr 12 at 1:18 am
Former Obama Con Law Student Embarassed by His Former Teacher’s Ignorance.

Gab

6 Apr 12 at 1:20 am
And Greek Easter is next weekend so they get to celebrate twice.

Gab

6 Apr 12 at 1:21 am
I actually know the answer to that question. It’s no (well, technically yes…he didn’t). President Obama taught “Con Law III” at Chicago. Judicial review, federalism, the separation of powers — the old “structural Constitution” stuff — is covered in “Con Law I” (or at least it was when I was a student). Con Law III covers the Fourteenth Amendment. (Oddly enough, Prof. Obama didn’t seem too concerned about “an unelected group of people” overturning a “duly constituted and passed law” when we were discussing all those famous Fourteenth Amendment cases – Roe v. Wade, Griswold v. Connecticut, Romer v. Evans, etc.) Of course, even a Con Law professor focusing on the Bill of Rights should know that the principle of judicial review has been alive and well since 1803, so I still feel like my educational credentials have been tarnished a bit by the President’s “unprecedented, extraordinary” remarks.

Gab

6 Apr 12 at 1:22 am
Only once Gab, just a different date, and this is under threat. See Lydia on the Oz..

Lazlo

6 Apr 12 at 1:23 am
Well my Greek friends are certainly doing the feast this weekend and next, Laz. The rebels.

Gab

6 Apr 12 at 1:25 am
fill in blank as required

John Comnenus

6 Apr 12 at 1:25 am
If the SCOTUS goes against Odumbocare, he’s fucked. He has absolutely no accomplishments to show for. I know some you disagree with me, but Romney’s campaign will destroy him.

It’s a very mean campaign organization (Romney’s) and underneath that Mormon smile is pretty cold heart I reckon.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 1:27 am
Greeks like to party Gab. So if they can do two Easters.. enjoy. But I can assure you that they are having a bob each way re the Roman and Orthodox Easters..

Lazlo

6 Apr 12 at 1:29 am
Lazlo I like to party too!

John Comnenus

6 Apr 12 at 1:30 am
Yes I know that, Laz, as do they. Just a bit of feasting envy on my part. Was not meant to be deadly serious comment lol

Gab

6 Apr 12 at 1:32 am
So do I, but better half currently disagreeing..
Hauled off to bed..

Lazlo

6 Apr 12 at 1:34 am
Nigh Nigh Cats..

Lazlo

6 Apr 12 at 1:35 am
the consensus of the Rabz party is that Lazlo is allllllllright. Goodnight.

John Comnenus

6 Apr 12 at 1:36 am
Good night, Laz.

Gab

6 Apr 12 at 1:37 am
Detroit is the home of Iggy Pop fuckin’ JC. Back off. Dont dis Motown.

You mean was the home of Iggy Pop. Sensible guy; he got the hell out. Now he lives in Miami for most of the year, if I’m not mistaken.

Oh come on

6 Apr 12 at 1:56 am
What the hell is going on here. Here’s Randy Barnett, a rightie Georgetown law professor talking about having reviewed Odumb’s coursework when he was teaching law and suggests it was quite professional. As president he’s a leftwing partisan loon.

Just as a guess, does anyone think that if a leftwing professor was assessing a GOP candidate’s course work it would be as fair minded? No, you say? How come?

http://volokh.com/2012/04/05/president-obamas-legal-sophistication-in-the-classroom/

JC

6 Apr 12 at 1:57 am
I like Brussels sprouts. Really like ‘em, actually – one of my favourite veggies. Not overcooked, though. Should be a bit crunchy.

Oh come on

6 Apr 12 at 2:00 am
John C, if you haven’t read Iggy Pop’s concert rider, you are in for a treat. Comedy Gold.

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/backstage/arena-rock/iggy-pop

Abu Chowdah

6 Apr 12 at 2:05 am
fuck, we are watching godzilla. Its too dangerous.

John Comnenus

6 Apr 12 at 2:09 am
The Arab Spring.

NETANYAHU: Sinai now a ‘terror zone’…
EGYPT MUSLIM BROS. GO TO WHITE HOUSE…

ROCKET FROM EGYPT HITS ISRAEL

You know, Assad looks like a safer bet.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 2:17 am
Would we Australians ever tolerate people from other countries lobbing missiles at us?

I’d say wipe the floor with them.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 2:19 am
Where is Fisky? He enjoys opining on this kind of thing. He’s usually very moderate and even-handed, too.

Oh come on

6 Apr 12 at 2:20 am
Israel should lob a couple of dozen back into Cairo and see how those fuckers like it.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 2:21 am
Fucking Godzilla did what the Imperial Japanese Army couldn’t do – he destroyed the Sydney opera house. Fuck, lucky I’m in Canberra

John Comnenus

6 Apr 12 at 2:21 am
OK, so Egypt has torn up the peace treaty and is bombing Israel. As the MB have proven once again that they are a squalid bunch of Hitlerites, Israel has only one sensible course of action. Give two days prior notice that they are destroying the Aswan Dam, and then follow through.

Fisky

6 Apr 12 at 2:24 am
Give two days prior notice that they are destroying the Aswan Dam, and then follow through.

One day is enough. They’re able to get all the people out in a day.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 2:27 am
See?

Oh come on

6 Apr 12 at 2:28 am
We also have Labor Day as a secular holday. What about Capitalism Day?

Isn’t that what Boxing day is for? A day off so we can all go shopping?

Yobbo

6 Apr 12 at 2:30 am
If Israel bombs Egypt back tot he stone age they will only re arrange the rocks.

John Comnenus

6 Apr 12 at 2:34 am
He’s usually very moderate and even-handed, too.

What, that Fisk is evenhanded over this stuff. well of course he is. No rightful nation ought to endure attacks by another country without reprisal and in this case Fisk is showing he’s concerned about human life by suggesting they receive two notice.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 2:37 am
Obama’s anti-Jewish foreign policy is going well.

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 2:39 am
Israel must invade Egypt and install a Coptic dictatorship that applies sharia in reverse for 100 years until Muslims become a minority. That is the only way to long term peace.

Fisky

6 Apr 12 at 2:39 am
Obama’s anti-Jewish foreign policy is going well.

You know, when the media was getting all orgasmic about the Arab ~~winter~~ Spring and watching Rudd going all stupid, you were always warning that we didn’t seem to know nor understand who we were supporting over there and from a western perspective and the Gad may have been the better deal.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 2:43 am
White guy getting beating up by black mob and stripped of his clothes. Black women participate.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 2:48 am
Cue Obama: if I had a whole gang of illegitimate children, they’d look just like…

Fisky

6 Apr 12 at 2:54 am
Fisk is much smarter than James Carville.

Oh come on

6 Apr 12 at 2:54 am
Israel must invade Egypt and install a Coptic dictatorship that applies sharia in reverse for 100 years until Muslims become a minority. That is the only way to long term peace.

I tend to agree with that. It’s a great shame the old empire powers didn’t stay in control of the Middle East and work methodically to eradicate Islam. It’s no different to Christian missionaries eradicating head-hunting and cannibalism in New Zealand. Nobody’s decrying that as racist or anything are they?

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 3:08 am
It’s racist to even bring up that they used to be cannibals, CL.

Yobbo

6 Apr 12 at 3:11 am
Nobody’s decrying that as racist or anything are they?

We should all sensitive to all other cultural practices.

Jc　

6 Apr 12 at 3:14 am
Nobody’s decrying that as racist or anything are they?

We should all sensitive to all other cultural practices.

Jc　

6 Apr 12 at 3:14 am
Even thinking about it has got to be racist. Cleanse your thoughts. Assimilate into the collective.

Oh come on

6 Apr 12 at 3:14 am
And we shouldnt judge

Jc　

6 Apr 12 at 3:15 am
CNN reporter who popularised the idea that Zimmerman said “fuckin’ coons”:

‘Yeah, no. He didn’t.’

CNN Enhances Zimmerman 911 Again – And Reporter Now Doubts Racial Slur Used.

Zimmerman actually said: “It’s fuckin’ cold.”

“It sounds like … we‘re hearing the swear word at first and then the word ’cold.’ And the reason some say that would be relevant, is because it was unseasonably cold in Florida that night and raining.”

So that’s another lie nailed.

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 3:16 am
She looks kinda cute as far as lady cops go, even with a bashed in face.

Man that perp’s gunna get the book thrown at him, big time. Bail denied. Whammo.

Oh come on

6 Apr 12 at 3:17 am
And with that, by the way, the Federal civil rights angle on the shooting of Trayvon Martin (aka “No_Limit_Nigga”) is as dead as a door nail.

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 3:19 am
naaah nana naaah nana naaah nana nah nah!

women in uniform, sometimes they look so cold

Oh come on

6 Apr 12 at 3:25 am
Well lookee here. While the Kenyan is calling the Scotus out on potentially nullifying enacted law, his very own DOJ is asking the court to nullify one they don’t like.

Obama’s own Justice Department is asking the court to invalidate the Defense of Marriage Act, which passed the Senate 85-12 and was signed by his Democratic predecessor, President Bill Clinton.

Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/news/opinion/opedcolumnists/ugly_warning_Dd20jtY2yQLdXXaydVUjrL#ixzz1rBjoJffv

The left have no scruples. They’re just fucking liars. They just lie all the time.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 3:36 am
Doom for Santorum! Doom Doom Doom!

Romney takes the lead in Pennsylvania

Mitt Romney’s taken the lead in PPP’s newest poll of Rick Santorum’s home state of Pennsylvania. Romney has 42% to 37% for Santorum with Ron Paul at 9% and Newt Gingrich at 6%. The numbers represent a dramatic turnaround from when PPP polled the state a month ago. Romney’s gained 17 points, going from 25% to 42%. Meanwhile Santorum’s dropped 6 points from 43% to 37%, for an overall swing of 23 points in the last four weeks.

Fisky

6 Apr 12 at 3:47 am
He’s completely delusional!

Santorum to ‘Reengineer’ Campaign

Richard Viguerie, a veteran conservative activist and top Santorum supporter, tells National Review Online that Santorum is “reengineering” his presidential campaign.

“You can’t repeat the same behavior and expect different results,” he says. “We’ve got to do things different. We’ve got to reengineer the campaign. We’ve got to add things, take things out, and make changes. Everyone recognizes that, from the candidate on down.”

Earlier today, Viguerie, along with a group of movement leaders, met with Santorum at an office in northern Virginia. For over an hour, they discussed ways to revive his bid.

“We came up with a number of bold plans,” Viguerie says. “It’s obvious that we need to do things that aren’t minor tweaks. We need to make significant changes to the campaign.”

Santorum’s aides, Viguerie adds, do not expect Newt Gingrich to drop out of the race. Today’s meeting, he insists, was a brainstorming session, not a commiseration.

“It was upbeat,” he says. “Everybody was optimistic. We all see a path to victory. But in the next few days, we’ll be doing some neat and exciting things.”

Fisky

6 Apr 12 at 3:53 am
Romney’s a good closer.

Oh come on

6 Apr 12 at 3:58 am
“And besides that, nobody, regardless of their income, wants to live next door to a property that is filled with trash and overgrown weeds that grow and foster rodents. No one deserves that.”

I’ve seen neighborhoods & subdivisions with more than a few foreclosed homes, in both NC & FL. And it’s absolutely true that the banks don’t bother to invest much time or money maintaining them or fixing up the damage that vandals do to long-vacant houses, especially in lower-value areas.

But it’s neighbors who make or break a neighborhood, and in some neighborhoods the neighbors take it upon themselves to do what it takes to keep their street nice, even if that means kicking in and helping maintain (mow lawns, remove rubbish, prune shrubs, wash off or paint over graffiti, etc) an abandoned/foreclosed house.

Sometimes you’ve just got to drop the victim card, show a little initiative and do what needs to be done – even when it’s not “faaaaair” that it’s left up to you to do so.

sdog

6 Apr 12 at 4:02 am
Sometimes you’ve just got to drop the victim card, show a little initiative and do what needs to be done – even when it’s not “faaaaair” that it’s left up to you to do so.

If I had money, I’d have this engraved on desk plaques mailed to every leftist in the country.

Toxic

6 Apr 12 at 6:26 am
Hey, here’s someone else who refused to pull out the Victim Card:

Angels outfielder Torii Hunter takes a pass on creating a racial incident …

sdog

6 Apr 12 at 7:12 am
Jesus Saves!!!!!……………yes but Moses invests!

Splatacrobat

6 Apr 12 at 7:18 am
PolitiFact: Obama Twice Wrong On Supreme Court.

Wrong and wrong. We rate the statement False.

Response by liberals: ‘eh’.

CNN reporter who popularised the idea that Zimmerman said “fuckin’ coons”:

‘Yeah, no. He didn’t.’

CNN Enhances Zimmerman 911 Again – And Reporter Now Doubts Racial Slur Used.

Zimmerman actually said: “It’s fuckin’ cold.”

Response by liberals: ‘eh’

A pattern emerges.

dover_beach

6 Apr 12 at 8:49 am
I guess the Canberra Cats will be nursing sore heads for a few hours yet.

blogstrop

6 Apr 12 at 9:05 am
NO! Rabz at thread above, 8:35am
“When you’ve lost unfunnybel crabb…”

blogstrop

6 Apr 12 at 9:07 am
If you haven’t performed your morning ablutions yet, the moist gusset competition over Gemmel’s Oz article should open the sluices at both ends.

lotocoti

6 Apr 12 at 9:12 am
WSJ Op-Ed, Shelby Steele: The Exploitation of Trayvon Martin

The absurdity of Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton is that they want to make a movement out of an anomaly. Black teenagers today are afraid of other black teenagers, not whites.

Two tragedies are apparent in the Trayvon Martin case. The first is obvious: A teenager—unarmed and committing no crime—was shot dead. Dressed in a “hoodie,” a costume of menace, he crossed paths with a man on the hunt for precisely such clichés of menace. Added to this—and here is the rub—was the fact of his dark skin………

…the second tragedy that Trayvon’s sad demise highlights. Before the 1960s the black American identity (though no one ever used the word) was based on our common humanity, on the idea that race was always an artificial and exploitive division between people. After the ’60s—in a society guilty for its long abuse of us—we took our historical victimization as the central theme of our group identity. We could not have made a worse mistake.

It has given us a generation of ambulance-chasing leaders, and the illusion that our greatest power lies in the manipulation of white guilt. The tragedy surrounding Trayvon’s death is not in the possibility that it might have something to do with white racism; the tragedy is in the lustfulness with which so many black leaders, in conjunction with the media, have leapt to exploit his demise for their own power.

JamesK

6 Apr 12 at 9:26 am
Spot

But it’s neighbors who make or break a neighborhood, and in some neighborhoods the neighbors take it upon themselves to do what it takes to keep their street nice, even if that means kicking in and helping maintain (mow lawns, remove rubbish, prune shrubs, wash off or paint over graffiti, etc) an abandoned/foreclosed house.

I thought the same thing, why don’t the neighbours keep the place nice… the other thing is that it said:

“And besides that, nobody, regardless of their income, wants to live next door to a property that is filled with trash and overgrown weeds that grow and foster rodents. No one deserves that.”

That sounds like the trash-filled yards and vanadalised houses are the occupied ones!

kae

6 Apr 12 at 9:47 am
Simon Benson joins in the fun pointing out how ugly the next election will be for the lemmings Dullard is leading to cliff…

Denial is a sad refuge for party in death throes

PERHAPS the best way to demonstrate just what a political massacre looks like is to count the victims.

These are the 35 federal Labor MPs, including nine ministers, who could be first in the firing line next year if federal Labor doesn’t lift its game.

Token

6 Apr 12 at 10:01 am
Good piece.
George Will, Wa-Po: The drug legalization dilemma

Still, because the costs of prohibition — interdiction, mass incarceration, etc. — are staggeringly high, some people say, “Let’s just try legalization for a while.” Society is not, however, like a controlled laboratory; in society, experiments that produce disappointing or unexpected results cannot be tidily reversed.

JamesK

6 Apr 12 at 10:09 am
GOP readies itself for inevitable Romney betrayal:

Republicans brace for the Romney pivot against the House GOP.

We’ve already seen glimpses of this latent, hidden leftism, of course. For example, Romney declared George Zimmerman a murderer.

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 10:30 am
I am glad Simon Benson understands the impact of the FWA games, but truly I do hope Gillard stays the course and continues to trumpet how laws do not apply to the Labor Party.

Consider the debacle this week over the four-year Fair Work Australia investigation into the Health Services Union. The impact of this cannot be underestimated and it is why Tony Abbott is pushing so hard on it. The public watching on as this sordid affair plays out will come to only one conclusion – and it won’t be that Thomson has been denied natural justice.

Irrespective of the FWA’s supposed independence, the public will see two systems of justice being dished out – one for the Labor Party and one for everybody else.

Token

6 Apr 12 at 10:33 am
The Coalition seem to be picking up the tempo on this matter…

POLICE would be within their rights to raid Fair Work Australia’s offices if the workplace watchdog refuses to hand over its report into the Health Services Union, the Coalition says.

Opposition legal affairs spokesman George Brandis told The Australian Online that Victoria and NSW Police would be “justified” in seeking a search warrant for FWA’s premises.

“We now know that Fair Work Australia is in possession of documents relevant to both their investigations,” Senator Brandis said.

Will the state police & premiers show similar ticker?

Token

6 Apr 12 at 10:43 am
I do hope Gillard stays the course…

I wouldn’t be surprised if she does.
Perhaps labor is so close to bottoming out on primary percentages that there are no other volunteers with suicidal tendencies.

lotocoti

6 Apr 12 at 10:59 am
Israelis deploy new rocket blocker.

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 10:59 am
What a Happy Easter / Passover.

More reports are leaking out that the IPCC’s decision to change its tune:

The surprise absolution of human beings from the crime of triggering severe weather phenomena was handed down by none other than the United Nations Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC), leader of the campaign to sell the world on anthropogenic climate change. The IPCC’s Special Report on Extremes, released March 28, reads, “There is medium evidence and high agreement that long-term trends in normalized [property] losses have not been attributed to natural or anthropogenic climate change.” The breathtaking admission is a sign that objective science is reclaiming a leading role in the discussion.

Yet, that is not going to stop Green-bagging government agencies from continuing their religious campaign.

That damaging squalls are not anthropogenic surely will be unwelcome news to President Obama’s Environmental Protection Agency (EPA), which imposes drastic restrictions on the nation in the hopes of changing the weather. The EPA’s website features an Extreme Events page, which reads: “Human-induced climate change has the potential to alter the prevalence and severity of extremes such as heat waves, cold waves, storms, floods and droughts.”

Token

6 Apr 12 at 11:06 am
A market-friendly, economically rational solution to climate change: forget about capping emissions or any of that hard stuff, and adapt to a hotter planet by devolving into Morlocks. (Albeit vegan.)

m0nty

6 Apr 12 at 11:38 am
from your link Monster

They suggest humans could be modified to be smaller, dislike eating meat, have fewer children and be more willing to co-operate with social goals.

How about my suggestion. How about remaking humans to dislike, short, overweight leftwing idiots like you Monster. I’d gladly offer genetic material.

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/world/science/final-frontier-of-climate-policy–remake-humans-20120405-1wfo6.html#ixzz1rDj7cvn0

JC

6 Apr 12 at 11:44 am
I know its Easter, but If I can impose on you guys on holidays, I am looking for some information here. I seem to remember seeing something about it here earlier in the year. Over on the newest Jack the Insider blog on The Australian website, there is a thread going on (starts a few pages in where JtI refers to it in one of his comments) about the $110billion shortfall that is apparently making havoc with Swan’s budget. I went back and looked over the estimated and actual revenue, and while there is a $50bill or so downgrade in estimated revenue between 2008/9 and 2011/12 I can’t see $110bill. Swan’s economic notes seem to refer to it as $110bill drop in expected tax receipts over the last 5 years, and this seems a little misleading because revenue isn’t just tax and the revenue estimates/actual haven’t changed by that much. I thought that here of all places I might find an economic brainiac who does this kind of thing for fun and could explain to me where this $110bill number comes from and how important it is to the budget bottom line.
To an amateur like me, who has only been balancing an extremely tight household budget for 20 years and know all about rubbery figures (I also love shoes and what he doesn’t know about an occasional secret indulgence doesn’t hurt him) am finally bringing in an annual surplus 10 years earlier than expected, it looks a trifle vague. The Treasurer shouldn’t use terms like “tax receipts” and “total revenue” interchangeably, should he? I would really like to know. Have a happy Easter everyone.

Cath

6 Apr 12 at 11:53 am
They suggest humans could be modified to be smaller, dislike eating meat, have fewer children and be more willing to co-operate with social goals.

Maybe they might consider bonsai as a tool to make people smaller? I think there would be a few dubloons in grant money for some enterprising leftie.

Either that or dare I suggest a size tax on clothes and shoes to encourage downsizing with the slothenly rich oops sorry…….I don’t want to give any more ideas to Swan to attack Clive and Gina

Splatacrobat

6 Apr 12 at 12:06 pm
Cath, I don’t have the source documents for this article, but refer to this blog posting from BarnabyIsRight which has plenty of links.

If it is not Wayne Swan himself telling lie after lie about the economy, and the government’s financial record, then it is the mainstream media telling lies for him.

Here’s a classic example:

Last Thursday Wayne Swan said tax revenue had fallen $140 billion since the GFC, $90 billion of which has been due to lower company tax.

That was Alan Kohler in Business Spectator. Who we already picked up for inaccurate parroting of Wayne’s lies yesterday.

Alternately look at this article that explains why the % of GDP crap Swan carries on with is deliberate lying.

“As a percentage of GDP”.

Possibly the most common phrase of deception in the average Treasurer’s armoury.

In the case of the average economist, the most common phrase of self-deception.

Token

6 Apr 12 at 12:06 pm
Simon Benson joins in the fun pointing out how ugly the next election will be for the lemmings Dullard is leading to cliff…

These are the 35 federal Labor MPs, including nine ministers, who could be first in the firing line next year if federal Labor doesn’t lift its game.

If my math is OK, 72-35 = 37 seats. So close enough to my around 40. The Greens might snipe another seat, somewhere, and of course there are 3 independents seats up for grabs as well. But of course the swing won’t be uniform across states, so any figure we come up with is just a rough estimate. And WA and Qld can swing all they like, there are only 2 WA & 8 Qld Labor seats left to lose. Victoria, SA & Tas will probably not swing nearly as much.

But regardless,it won’t be like the Qld election. That kind of result was special and comes once in a lifetime. For it to have worked that way, Labor must have carefully drawn the Qld electoral boundaries to make lots of seats with small Labor majorities and a smaller number of very safe LNP seats.

Anthony Green, as always, has it covered, though the post is a few months old.

Tim Quilty

6 Apr 12 at 12:35 pm
As commented earlier, perhaps Detroit could go for more than $25k.

“AMERICA’S smallest town” has sold for $US900,000 ($872,000).

Today’s auction of Buford, Wyoming, attracted curious visitors from around the world — and by the end of it an unnamed Vietnamese bidder was the proud new owner of their very own town, KGWN-TV reported.

Buford’s properties and businesses were put up for sale by sole resident and self-proclaimed mayor Don Sammons, who after 20 years in town decided it was time to move on.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/world/one-man-wyoming-town-bought-for-us900000/story-fn3dxix6-1226320438500

Gab

6 Apr 12 at 12:47 pm
Phillip Coorey in the SMH:

‘Hey, you know who’s to blame for the Fair Work Australia go-slow scandal? Tony Abbott, that’s who.’

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 12:53 pm
Holder’s remedial Constitutional homework handed in to Judge Smith

The longstanding, historical position ofthe United States regarding judicial review of the constitutionality of federal legi slation has not changed and was accurately stated by counsel for the govenm1ent at oral argument in this case a few days ago. The Department has not in this litigation, nor in any other litigation of which I am aware, ever asked this or any other Court to reconsider or limit long-established precedent concerning judicial review of the constitutionality of federal legislation….

The President’s remarks were fully consistent with the principles described herein.

http://legalinsurrection.com/2012/04/doj-files-letter-with-5th-circuit-affirming-judicial-authority/

Gab

6 Apr 12 at 1:00 pm
They should have given Holder and/or Obama detention. They could have cleaned up the grounds, emptied the waste paper baskets – that sort of thing.

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 1:02 pm
Oh wait… is that… is that…?

http://img379.imageshack.us/img379/4244/thatsracistgm74ul6.gif

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 1:03 pm
You know it is, pachyderm.

Gab

6 Apr 12 at 1:04 pm
Apologies, that was a speciesist of me.

Gab

6 Apr 12 at 1:09 pm
Possum hasn’t updated his electoral simulator since February, when Labor’s numbers were better. But if we go back to Sept 11, we get results similar to where we are now.
Old Possum post with polling data similar to now

Tim Quilty

6 Apr 12 at 1:19 pm
Diary of greeny post-purchase dissonance.

Fully charged on a brisk March morning, the all-electric Mitsubishi i’s range meter estimated that the battery pack had enough energy to travel 56 miles. That’s plenty, I thought, for the several-stop route I planned to a neighboring town and back. But as I pulled out into traffic, I flicked on the heat and watched the range meter recalibrate, dropping the estimated range down to 37. I did a quick mental calibration: A few miles to the first stop, 12 miles on the highway, 12 to return, another five to the next location, and so on. I then had a choice to make: Either shiver in the car or risk getting stranded.

Green freeze.

Gab

6 Apr 12 at 1:34 pm
What a wonderful story Gab. It sounds like a post apocalyptic tale.

Counting our energy rations to see if we’ll freeze or starve first.

Token

6 Apr 12 at 1:43 pm
ROCKET FROM EGYPT HITS ISRAEL

You know, Assad looks like a safer bet.

Israel should be thanking the lord that Assad is currently under siege. All previous military attacks on Israel absolutely required full assaults from the south and north. The usual strategy is for Syria and Egypt to each try to suck all Israeli forces one direction or the other or split those forces.

As the purpose of the level of US financing of Israel (and Jordan and Egypt) is to ensure that Israeli military capability is at least as great as Egypt, Syria, and Jordan combined, Egypt hasn’t got a hope in hell.

Still, if Egypt adopts the Gazan strategy, and just keeps firing rockets into Israel, maybe Israel could be dragged into a land war, which would be dire, given that this time Egypt, on its own, does not have the limited focus of regaining land it had lost in the past. This time, there is no concentration of Egypt’s entire airforce only kilometres away from Israel to be wiped out in a few hours.

Still, if/when Assad goes, maybe some nuttie Iranian-funded military force might coordinate to the north, led by Hezbollah, to take Syria’s traditional role of the Muhammadan northern flank. One of the reasons Israel was able to prevail so spectacularly in 1967 was it had great intell (largely from heroic Israeli spies) about the Soviet-funded underground forces Syria had built up over years. The Syrians found in 1966, and executed the dude). Then again, we already know that Hezbollah has significant underground abilities to the north – in Lebanon. But how likely is it that a harmonious alliance among The Muslim Brotherhood, Hezbollah, and Iran could form?

The big difference this time is there is no Soviet Union to provide the money, the hardware, the diplomatic cover, and the egging-on. Is Iran big enough to fill those Soviet boots?

Peter Patton

6 Apr 12 at 1:54 pm
Would we Australians ever tolerate people from other countries lobbing missiles at us?

I’d say wipe the floor with them.

Bob Carr told Netanyahu that if Australias faced what Israel faces we would build a bloody wall too. I’d say, we’d do a lot more than that. Why the Israelis have pussy-footed around so much for so long is beyond me.

Peter Patton

6 Apr 12 at 1:58 pm
Diary of greeny post-purchase dissonance.

Is it a silly question to ask where the electricity is generated from that supplies the plug in station?

I don’t suppose it would be directly from a solar panel or a wind farm?

Splatacrobat

6 Apr 12 at 2:01 pm
Priest to the beautiful people, Fr Bob “Please Like Me, Lefties” Maguire, rounds on Anglican archbishop for not being communist enough.

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 2:12 pm
Oh woe, MLA and NFF have annointed Flim Flam to save sheep and cow farmers.

FFS

Helen Armstrong

6 Apr 12 at 2:12 pm
Juggling orchestrated race and gender wars, Commander-in-Chief opens new front:

Obama believes women should be admitted to Augusta.

Yes, he’s now picking fights with a golf club.

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 2:19 pm
President Ladies’ Tee is just hoping they’ll have red markers so he can he can play the course.

Infidel Tiger

6 Apr 12 at 2:21 pm
A few years back there was a cartoon showing Olmert listening at the wall. He turns to his companions and says excitedly “They’re talking peace!’
What they were actually saying was “When we have obliterated all the Jews, there will be peace.”

blogstrop

6 Apr 12 at 2:28 pm
No evident strategy here… much:

White House announces it will be hold a “National Women’s Issues Conference” on April 27-28 in Washington, D.C.

Krauthammer condemns hatemongering disgrace, Obama.

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 2:32 pm
Fr Bob “Please Like Me, Lefties” Maguire

So very sad.

dover_beach

6 Apr 12 at 2:34 pm
Krauthammer condemns hatemongering disgrace, Obama.

This explains the extraordinary characterization of this issue by Duffy, an executive editor for Time, on Lateline last night:

Well, far be it from me to totally understand this, but basically the Republicans for no reason that I can understand went out and had about a six-week conversation about contraception in the middle of a campaign that was supposed to be about the economy.

Yes, just out of no where, Republicans wanted to talk about contraception. This had nothing to do with health care legislation. Lying and dissembling comes so easily to liberals.

dover_beach

6 Apr 12 at 2:42 pm
There was always that whole problem about higher CO2 levels not preceding warmening.

What to do, what to do…

Research suggests that — contrary to some prior findings — CO2 led the prior round of global warming rather than vice versa…

“The end of an ice age, you have a sense in your bones what that means: a big, significant change for the planet,” Shakun says. “It’s a tangible example of what rising CO2 can mean for the planet over the long-term.”

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 2:42 pm
In one week President Fore has attacked Zimmerman, the SCOTUS and now Augusta National. The conspiracy theorist in me suggests he’s looking for distractions.

Infidel Tiger

6 Apr 12 at 2:44 pm
George Pell vs Richard Dawkins on Q&A this Monday night. Should be a hoot. Who wants to run a book on how many times Dawkins uses the word reason, with that hideous Anglican whining voice of his? I’ll wager he says ‘reason’ more than 100 times.

http://www.abc.net.au/tv/qanda/

Peter Patton

6 Apr 12 at 2:46 pm
Look, if a white male golfer clubs Tiger Woods to death in Augusta’s ladies’ lounge, Obama will literally pee his mom jeans with joy.

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 2:47 pm
New Jersey Democrats will protest in the state House wearing checked trousers and canary pullovers.

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 2:49 pm
Meanwhile, Sydney leaders of both the Catholic and Anglican churches have delivered their Easter messages, saying Easter is about having faith in eternal life.

Sounds like Mr. Locke circa 1670. At least they’re stayed consistent I suppose.

Peter Patton

6 Apr 12 at 2:50 pm
I’ll wager he says ‘reason’ more than 100 times.

I’m sorry, PP, but you’re just not being serious.

dover_beach

6 Apr 12 at 2:50 pm
The Anglican archbishop of Sydney, Dr Peter Jensen, says the story of Easter brings hope for everyone.

“He (Jesus) broke out of the tomb and showed that death is not the last word in life,” he said.

Hmmmm…It was a bit more complicated than that for Mr. Locke. But then again, Mr. Locke was not the greatest prose stylist.

Peter Patton

6 Apr 12 at 2:51 pm
“There is no-one on Earth who can really tell you what it’s like. That’s a fact. Well no it isn’t a fact. There is a man who has been there and come back. That man is Jesus Christ, the saviour of the world.”

I thought it was Kerry Packer.

Peter Patton

6 Apr 12 at 2:53 pm
“There is no-one on Earth who can really tell you what it’s like. That’s a fact. Well no it isn’t a fact. There is a man who has been there and come back. That man is Jesus Christ, the saviour of the world.”

What? Jesus is still on earth? Tell me where, I want his opinion on AGW.

John H.

6 Apr 12 at 2:55 pm
This explains the extraordinary characterization of this issue by Duffy, an executive editor for Time, on Lateline last night:

That interview was an absolute disgrace.

He described the Ryan Plan as dangerous and as something that Republicans don’t even support. FFS the Ryan Plan doesn’t even propose balancing the budget for another 20 years.

Tony Jones is the pits.

Infidel Tiger

6 Apr 12 at 2:58 pm
I want his opinion on AGW.

He’ll answer with a riddle and steer the conversation back to matters of salvation. He’s world-famous for it.

wreckage

6 Apr 12 at 3:02 pm
He’ll answer with a riddle and steer the conversation back to matters of salvation. He’s world-famous for it.

Didn’t know Jesus was a climate scientist.

John H.

6 Apr 12 at 3:04 pm
Thanks Token,12.06pm much appreciated. Confirms what I was thinking, for sure. What a great site, Barnaby is Right!

Cath

6 Apr 12 at 3:04 pm
The trouble for the demolition party in attempting to demonize Ryan is that he simply doesn’t look and say evil things. They can’t pin him.

Jc

6 Apr 12 at 3:08 pm
Didn’t know Jesus was a climate scientist.

Remember our reason is ‘god-given’, and as Richard Dawkins will explain on Monday night (more than 100 times), science is reason. I don’t think the good professor will finish the syllogism with, “therefore, climate science is god-given.”

Peter Patton

6 Apr 12 at 3:16 pm
That interview was an absolute disgrace….Tony Jones is the pits.

It was tough going, IT.

dover_beach

6 Apr 12 at 3:17 pm
Remember our reason is ‘god-given’

And I thought it was something mundane about operands. Oh well, I’ll just have to bow down in glory at the giver of reason.

John H.

6 Apr 12 at 3:18 pm
Romney declared George Zimmerman a murderer.

Link, CL?

Oh come on

6 Apr 12 at 3:20 pm
And I thought it was something mundane about operands.

There is nothing mundane about reasoning.

dover_beach

6 Apr 12 at 3:25 pm
John, I’ve always found the concept of ‘reason’ very confusing. It’s cleared up a bit lately. I think it just means ‘the knowledge humans learn just by banging-on to each other.’

Peter Patton

6 Apr 12 at 3:28 pm
John, I’ve always found the concept of ‘reason’ very confusing. It’s cleared up a bit lately. I think it just means ‘the knowledge humans learn just by banging-on to each other.’

You bloody behaviorists. Stop demythologising the human condition!

John H.

6 Apr 12 at 3:29 pm
Recently studying the toing-and-froing between early modern rationalists (reason) and empiricists has helped me reach that profound definition.

Peter Patton

6 Apr 12 at 3:30 pm
John, do you really mean that? I am a really a ‘behaviourist’, and a ‘bloody’ one at that? Thank you, thank you. I am so happy I could cry. I have been bereft since my last ‘…ist’ identity went AWOL some time ago.

Peter Patton

6 Apr 12 at 3:33 pm
Recently studying the toing-and-froing between early modern rationalists (reason) and empiricists has helped me reach that profound definition.

I pretty much think the same way, it is why I don’t like the use of “reason”, or even the idea that intelligence is a thing. We progress in insight by finding gems in shit. We make many more mistakes than insights, we stumble along, we get it together only to dissemble all over.

I loved the idea of the mathematician Chaitin, who argued from Godel’s work that even if we come up with a Theory of Everything, we can never know if it is the final Theory of Everything so maths can go on forever(sadly for Russell and Whitehead).

John H.

6 Apr 12 at 3:35 pm
John, do you really mean that? I am a really a ‘behaviourist’

You often strike me as coming from that perspective, which may explain your general cynicism towards modern psychology as it is popularly perceived. For eg. People think behaviorism is a model of behavior. Not true, it is a method of analysis. Autism treatment is now based very much on behaviorist ideas and has revolutionised the treatment of autism. So fuck Chomsky because he just didn’t understand Skinner’s Verbal Behavior, the conceptual foundation for modern autism treatment.

John H.

6 Apr 12 at 3:40 pm
OCO, we posted the clip of Romney declaring the shooting “uncalled for” and “unnecessary” a few times last week.

An uncalled for killing is homicide/murder.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QSzhxvAcjp8

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 3:46 pm
How do we recognize ‘mistakes’ if not by reasoning? Certainly the ‘banging on to each other’ helps but it alone does not explain the learning. How about reasoning or intelligence as activities? (I don’t know if anyone describes them as things.) It’s instructive that mechanism/ materialism has essentially banished those activities it has been unable to successfully render intelligible in its own terms rather than this failure having consequently undermined the intelligibility of mechanism/ materialism.

dover_beach

6 Apr 12 at 3:50 pm
Bollocks, CL. That’s a pretty low smear.

Oh come on

6 Apr 12 at 3:52 pm
Oh, you’re saying it was an “uncalled for” self-defence?

WTF was Romney the idiot talking about?

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 3:53 pm
CL: if I’m walking along the edge of a cliff and I accidentally slip and fall to my death, that’s also uncalled for and unnecessary. According to your logic, I murdered myself.

Oh come on

6 Apr 12 at 3:54 pm
“Unnecessary, uncalled for and inexplicable…”

It was none of these things – which is why the police brought no charges against Zimmerman.

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 3:55 pm
db

I certainly wasn’t having a go at reason, per se. I was having a go at the way Richard Dawkins and his ilk use the word ‘reason’. For example, theology is packed to the rafters with ‘reason’.

Peter Patton

6 Apr 12 at 3:56 pm
Oh, you’re saying it was an “uncalled for” self-defence?

No, all I’m doing is pointing out the your flagrant misrepresentation of what Romney said and the absurdity of your justification of this.

Oh come on

6 Apr 12 at 3:57 pm
It was none of these things – which is why the police brought no charges against Zimmerman.

OK, Romney was wrong. But he didn’t call Zimmerman a murderer.

Oh come on

6 Apr 12 at 3:58 pm
In other words, whatever Dawkins thinks he is opposing, he usually relies on that thing/idea’s not being based on reason. But he is usually wrong in characterisating his opponents in that way.

Peter Patton

6 Apr 12 at 3:59 pm
I certainly wasn’t having a go at reason, per se. I was having a go at the way Richard Dawkins and his ilk use the word ‘reason’. For example, theology is packed to the rafters with ‘reason’.

I remember long ago reading all of GC Berkouwer’s lectures in theology and he seemed to be struggling with reasonable explanations to account for theological positions!

John H.

6 Apr 12 at 3:59 pm
Sorry OCO, no. You’re stretching the English language to the point of invention. Nobody ever says the death of a person who accidentally fell off a cliff was “uncalled for.” It’s a phrase used almost exclusively to denote an action entirely gratuitous and unjust. Martin didn’t fall off a cliff. He was deliberately shot. Romney said the shooting was uncalled for. This places him on the same page as Al Sharpton.

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 4:00 pm
Who knows what Romney was talking about? He might have thought there should be a manslaughter charge. He probably got that wrong on the current evidence. He should focus his attentions on his inevitable and unstoppable nomination rather than taking Obama’s bait.

Fisky

6 Apr 12 at 4:03 pm
John, OK, well maybe theology is not quite ‘packed to the rafters’ with reason, more taking up the cheap seats.

Peter Patton

6 Apr 12 at 4:03 pm
John, OK, well maybe theology is not quite ‘packed to the rafters’ with reason, more taking up the cheap seats.

Ssshh. Francis Schaeffer might be reading.

John H.

6 Apr 12 at 4:04 pm
Look, I don’t mind if you want to declare to all the world that Romney called Zimmerman a murderer because he declared the shooting of a 16 year old “uncalled for” at a time when Trayvon was universally being declared an angel, a model student, a high school sports star etc.

Yes, you could certainly make the case that Romney was hasty to pass judgement. However, saying Romney called Zimmerman a murderer is a blatant example of “stretching of the English language” which is highly unlikely to work in your favour.

Oh come on

6 Apr 12 at 4:06 pm
flagrant misrepresentation

By “flagrant misrepresentation,” you mean – of course – a direct quote.

“Unnecessary, uncalled for and inexplicable.”

It was none of these things.

The shooting was necessary, called for and explicable – according to the police.

So what’s left?

According to Romney – and there is no other logical end-game – the shooting was illegal and prosecutorial authorities need to intervene.

That is, it was homicide/murder.

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 4:12 pm
Romney does this sort of thing all the time, of course. He supports abortion/no he doesn’t. He loves Reagan/no he doesn’t. He supports socialised medicine/no he doesn’t. He’ll say any dumb thing on a whim depending on the audience.

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 4:14 pm
Perhaps Romney has presented us with a very good example of why it is best to keep our mouths shut despite the MSM wanting to douse the fire with petrol.

Winston Smith

6 Apr 12 at 4:15 pm
Romney is someone more interested in presidency than policy. That can work over the short term with sound bytes etc but there is nothing short term about this. He should have stuck to his guns the coward.

John H.

6 Apr 12 at 4:19 pm
George Pell vs Richard Dawkins on Q&A this Monday night.

Interesting selection. Catholic v secular. As if they are the only choices.

So why only a Catholic? Is there noone in the Anglican and Uniting church with enough understanding of theology and reason to be on the stage with them?

Its Eastern Easter next week, why not a representative of the Orthodox community. How a Coptic bishop would be topical!

Further why no Rabbi (Passover)?

Without further details it looks like an anti-Catholic flim-flam by Snow Cone Tone

Token

6 Apr 12 at 4:19 pm
To be fair to Jones the problem with the interview was Duffy, editor of an once-relevant and formerly successful news magazine.

Duffy was a farcical propagandist from the Dems.

That Jones did not even further question some the more ludricous claims merely showed Jones’ confirmatory bias.

These past 4 weeks have been disastrous for Obummer but according to nimrod Duffy up is down and left is right.

Notice also, the manner in which Duffy speaks of Romney is similar to the way Jones & Co speak of Turnbull.

JamesK

6 Apr 12 at 4:20 pm
I think we could be onto something here. Santorum really might have a game changer if he comes out and accuses Romney of calling Zimmerman a murderer.

Fisky

6 Apr 12 at 4:22 pm
Nothing like a good bit of Catholic bashing to draw an audience, Token. The tweets should be enlightening too.

Gab

6 Apr 12 at 4:23 pm
I think we could be onto something here. Santorum really might have a game changer if he comes out and accuses Romney of calling Zimmerman a murderer.

I know this will be very, very, very difficult for ya Fisk….

but I’d like you to try, try, try not to be such an inane fvckwit.

JamesK

6 Apr 12 at 4:30 pm
PP, I know that, my response was directed to JohnH’s remarks rather than yours. Certainly, there is a lot of ‘reason’ in theology, but there is also a terrible lot of reason as well. Aquinas seems to me to be a particularly good example of the latter.

dover_beach

6 Apr 12 at 4:34 pm
Hmm

So the Currency Lad had now quote doctored Mitt Romney. Shameful, yet all too predictable.

Les Majesty

6 Apr 12 at 4:41 pm
Gab Snow Cone has form in trying to verbal Christians, I remember one of the few times I watched the show is when Gerard Henderson is on as he has so much fun with ABC luvvies…

TONY JONES: Very briefly, Gerard, the question at the end referred to bizarre thoughts and I suppose I just want to ask you as a modern Christian rationalist whether you believe in miracles?

GERARD HENDERSON: Well, who’s a modern Christian rationalist?

TONY JONES: Well, I’m assuming you are.

GERARD HENDERSON: I’ve only been on this show once and I said I was an agnostic, which is what I am, but, I mean, if you’re talking about bizarre views, have a look at the Green movement. Once upon a time, when people said, “The end of the world is nigh,” they were figures of fun. They were all Christians walking around in odd clothing. Now, people who walk around in odd clothing and say “The end of the world is nigh,” vote Green and often work at the ABC or somewhere else. It seems to me that anyone who thinks the world is going to end within the next six months or six years or 60 years or 600 years, is pretty bizarre to me and they’re not religious at all.

TONY JONES: Okay, let’s go to the next question.

Token

6 Apr 12 at 4:41 pm
Nearly as bad as when CL quote doctored Gen Mattis USMC and said he was using “Cindy Sheehan style code pink tactics”.

Les Majesty

6 Apr 12 at 4:42 pm
…and just because it is fun to watch.

Here is Gerard Henderson putting a young green-shirt in her place, who Tony Jones tried to use as a set up.

Token

6 Apr 12 at 4:44 pm
Hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah!!!!!!!

Rabz

6 Apr 12 at 4:47 pm
So the Currency Lad had now quote doctored Mitt Romney. Shameful, yet all too predictable.

brrrrnngg, brrrrnnngggg.

CL: Hello
LM: Hi Pot, this is the kettle, I’m calling to tell you, you’re black dude…

Token

6 Apr 12 at 4:48 pm
TONY JONES: Okay, let’s go to the next question.

That will Tony’s epitaph.

Infidel Tiger

6 Apr 12 at 4:48 pm
Gerard Henderson putting a young green-shirt in her place, who Tony Jones tried to use as a set up.

And Catherine Deveny (self-professed climate scientist) blamed coal mining for floods, cyclones and storms. Wish Brown would stop stealing her material.

Gab

6 Apr 12 at 4:57 pm
Once upon a time, when people said, “The end of the world is nigh,” they were figures of fun. They were all Christians walking around in odd clothing. Now, people who walk around in odd clothing and say “The end of the world is nigh,” vote Green and often work at the ABC or somewhere else.

He’s right of course. Hey, how’s the ABC’s “I can change your mind about the cause of climate events’ going?

7791 votes

67% Dismissive
12% Alarmed.

Gab

6 Apr 12 at 5:01 pm
67% Dismissive

I’m one of the dismissive and proudly so, Gab.

dover_beach

6 Apr 12 at 5:07 pm
Les – aka Mr Snip (recently appointed to the Royal College of Quote Doctorers) – is seeking an equaliser for his Storm Front, Lochner, “illegal statute” and Haditha 8 beclownings.

I understand, Les. Good luck with that.

But I posted the video of Romney, quoted him exactly and concluded, with unchallenged logic, that Romney believes George Zimmerman to be a murderer.

He said so – in his usual Mittenesque way.

So no, I’m right and you’re lying again.

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 5:13 pm
Me too, Dover. Though I admit to feeling a little blasphemous when completing the survey.

Gab

6 Apr 12 at 5:18 pm
lol he’s baaaaack:

John H, out of moral deficiency, thinks he needs divine help when it comes to the global warming fraud:

“What? Jesus is still on earth? Tell me where, I want his opinion on AGW.”

It must be understood that John H has all the necessary technical competence to be referring to the global warming scam as straight fraud. But he lacks the moral capacity. You don’t need to go to Jesus, Shiva, Nostradmus, Aristotle, or anyone else to understand the global warming lie. You just need to be able to think straight about the problem, without letting people bullshit you by sheer strength of advocacy.

Gab

6 Apr 12 at 5:22 pm
Very disappointed with the cowardly Easter ‘messages’ from church leaders.

But not surprised.

They all condemned politicians, da banks, da miners and da rich. They should have the courage to speak truths to their congregations; to speak about their greed, their wrongs, their materialism, their lack of constancy etc.

But no.

Ingratiate yourself with the Great Unwashed (yay, ‘relevant’ church) by setting up the Monty Burns tycoons du jour and letting them take the rap for the travails of the world.

Then congratulate yourself for speaking Troof To Power.

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 5:24 pm
They all condemned politicians, da banks, da miners and da rich.

It’s all someone’s elses fault. That was Jesus’s message wasn’t it?

Infidel Tiger

6 Apr 12 at 5:28 pm
Amen to that, CL.

dover_beach

6 Apr 12 at 5:29 pm
Gab,

1.

I most certainly do not have the technical competence to assess the AGW science. Bird thinks that “being smart” is enough. It is never enough, no matter how smart you are some things are extremely difficult to analyse if only because it takes so much time. If you rely on “being smart” you are an idiot.

2.

It was a joke Bird.

3.

I do accept the climate is warming and the latest data is only strengthening that position. I don’t care about the cause so much, the political solutions by everyone are crap. David Deutsch, the brilliant physicist who pioneered the conceptual underpinnings for quantum computer(though sadly decoherence may be the killer there) knows the solution and it isn’t found in the precautionary principle or in denying the warming, it is in preparing for unanticipated future contingencies. That’s why I am a techno-optimist.

John H.

6 Apr 12 at 5:32 pm
More Labor brilliance:

Plain packaging laws to be challenged at WTO

Infidel Tiger

6 Apr 12 at 5:33 pm
They should have the courage to speak truths to their congregations; to speak about their greed, their wrongs, their materialism, their lack of constancy etc.

Excellent point CL. So many problems we face are about personal behavior. By their fruits!

John H.

6 Apr 12 at 5:33 pm
IT, you know that linking to a picture of Roxon must include a warning but you did so without one anyway. Shame on you.

dover_beach

6 Apr 12 at 5:37 pm
I still maintain a picture of that steely glare from Roxon (see IT’s link)be placed on cig packets and watch sales slump.

Gab

6 Apr 12 at 5:39 pm
2.

It was a joke Bird.

I know. Side-splitting hilarious it was.

Gab

6 Apr 12 at 5:41 pm
I can’t wait for April 24. That’s when Santorum loses Penn. by over 10%. Will Rick cry at his concession speech? He just might!

Fisky

6 Apr 12 at 6:02 pm
Are there any Christians left in the Anglican Church?

You would never know it according to the Easter message from the Sydney Anglican honcho.

Pedro the Ignorant

6 Apr 12 at 6:06 pm
No there aren’t, Fisk. They’ve all gone to the Greens and heavily into Gaia worship.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 6:33 pm
JC, we have something really important in common. Can you guess what it is?

Kelly of Kenmore

6 Apr 12 at 6:42 pm
The only thing I can think of is that we both have penises Phil. Other than that I can’t imagine there’s anything else.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 6:47 pm
Are there any Christians left in the Anglican Church?

Pedro, I’m assuming you never saw that “Yes, Minister” episode from so many decades ago…

Although apparently this Sydney anglican does believe in an almighty deity, who’da thunk it…

Rabz

6 Apr 12 at 6:54 pm
The only thing I can think of is that we both have penises Phil.

You like to juxtapose and then impose on endless imaginary names one constant don’t you. What does that say about you?

But this did surprise me from you. I too am a Van Morrison tragic. And unless you are doing the John Howard thing of liking the music, not the lyrics, then you’re one conflicted dude.

Kelly of Kenmore

6 Apr 12 at 6:57 pm
For those interested in understanding the present situation in Europe, this is a must read – a short book by Phillipp Lucas and a free pdf can be downloaded from the Mises site via Tom Woods.

“After the collapse of Bretton Woods, the world was dealing in fluctuating fiat currencies. Governments could finally control the money supply without any limitation to gold, and deficits could be financed by central banks. The manipulation of the
quantity of money has only one aim: the financing of government
policies. There is no other reason to manipulate the quantity
of money.”

Unfortunately the socialists guests here probably will refuse to read it, but who knows, if Mises and others who were ardent socialists during their youth could change their minds, there may still be hope.

Louis Hissink

6 Apr 12 at 7:07 pm
Whoops,

Phillipp Bagus, not Lucas.

Louis Hissink

6 Apr 12 at 7:09 pm
Louis.

Europe is fucked because everyone lied to each other and introduced a fixed currency. In fact the opposite of what you think or that book suggests.

If Greece, Spain, Portugal and Italy had their own currencies it would have been impossible for them to borrow these large sums as the capital markets would have stopped lending to them ages ago.

Furthermore the book is obviously pushing for fixed currencies rates locked to gold I assume. If wages and prices are sticky how do you propose an adjustment takes place internally? Floating exchange rates without fully open markets have been our salvation, not our crucifix.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 7:17 pm
Spain didn’t borrow in large sums until the crisis. Its public sector debt levels were falling coming into 2008. Italy were running primary surpluses, their problem is largely legacy debt.

There are differing reasons as to why the PIIGS are pigs but they are all being crucified by the euro.

sdfc

6 Apr 12 at 7:38 pm
Oh FFS…

They all walked in with large amounts of debt on their books.. some more than others and then continued to borrow more euros to finance their gaps.

The debt levels for all of them would not have been as big if they maintained their own currencies.

They would also have been able to adjust through depreciation.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 7:45 pm
All he PIGS lied about their Debt levels. Ireland didn’t.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 7:46 pm
Ed Driscoll: The Week Obama Jumped the Shark.

What the president said, then, was so ill-informed, so ignorant, that people assumed he must know better. There’s no way we can know. But whatever the case, this has been quite a bad stretch for the president. His comments about the Supreme Court, when combined with his astonishingly dishonest attack on the House GOP budget (see here for more), portray a president who is living in a fantasy world — a place where facts and history are inverted, lies become truth, where everything is subordinated to ambition and you simply make things up as you go along. Nietzsche referred to this mindset as the “will to power.” In American politics it’s known as The Chicago Way.

I don’t know what the political effect of all this will be. But intellectually, this is the week where Barack Obama jumped the shark. In a deep, fundamental way, he is no longer a serious man. Nor an honest one. His public words are now purposefully bleached of truth. And that is a painful thing to have to say about an American president.

Nailed.

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 7:48 pm
Nobama sounds like the lying slapper. They both seem to live in a parallel universe of lies.

It seems the more far left the bigger the liar.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 7:51 pm
All he PIGS lied about their Debt levels. Ireland didn’t.

Bullshitting is just a way of life for you isn’t it.

sdfc

6 Apr 12 at 7:57 pm
CL

I am asking you this question sincerely, not as an opportunity to have a go at religion, or anything else, but once a baby is baptised Catholic, does that mean you are a Catholic forever, whether you like it or not?

Peter Patton

6 Apr 12 at 8:03 pm
By the way JC is there any futures market for equities opening in the US tonight?

sdfc

6 Apr 12 at 8:04 pm
What a pathetic attempt at lying, SDFC.

Just the usual leftwing like deflection away from the truth. You fuckers really need a new bag of tricks as lying, sneering and attempts at changing the frame doesn’t really work much anymore.

Greece, Italy, Spain and Portugal were all found to have done ever large amounts of swaps with banks prior to joining the Euro. Goldman Sachs last year was cited as Greece’s counterpart in these deals. Recall.

You always seem to resort to name calling when got out for being an idiot.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 8:06 pm
we know about Greece JC, where is the evidence that Spain or the others misrepresented the level of debt? You’re the one making the accusation.

sdfc

6 Apr 12 at 8:11 pm
Futures are open , not the stock exchanges.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 8:12 pm
Google it, SDFC. Or check out the numerous discussions on this very site where we talked about this.

You said I bullshitting yet you’re now admitting that Greece committed what can basically be called fraud. I presume that just a 90 deg turn from your accusation.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 8:15 pm
So no evidence then JC, just the usual bullshit. Come up with the goods. Or are you asking me to prove a negative?

sdfc

6 Apr 12 at 8:18 pm
What 90 degree turn JC? my statement was that the PIIGS took different routes to being pigs.

sdfc

6 Apr 12 at 8:19 pm
CL: I don’t have time now to transcribe what Romney said in that Youtube clip you posted, but I will do so later. And from that it will become pretty bloody clear from his comment in its entirety that he absolutely DID NOT call – or even infer – that Zimmerman was a murderer, and to say he did is an outrageous slur.

Seriously, it’s lucky you are anonymous when you say shit like that. If you made such an allegation about most people and put your name to it, you’d probably end up in court for defamation – and paying out, as well.

Oh come on

6 Apr 12 at 8:20 pm
And CL I probably agree with 95% of the stuff you write here. But coming out with this kind of nonsense hurts your credibility, which is regrettable from my perspective.

Oh come on

6 Apr 12 at 8:23 pm
Now you think Ed Driscoll blogs “nonsense” Oco?

JamesK

6 Apr 12 at 8:29 pm
James, please don’t waste my time with such comments if you’re not going to provide a link to illustrate your point.

Oh come on

6 Apr 12 at 8:35 pm
…once a baby is baptised Catholic, does that mean you are a Catholic forever, whether you like it or not?

It means you’re a Christian baptised in the Catholic Church and that baptism holds good forever. Nor is ‘re-baptism’ permitted in the Catholic Church (generally) if you were, say, baptised a Lutheran. So baptism has a forever-ness to it, yes.

As for whether you’re a full-fledged initiated Catholic on the strength of baptism alone, we would have to say no. The other sacraments of initiation – confirmation and eucharist – would be necessary for that. Were a baptised baby to grow up and become a member of another denomination or religion, we couldn’t meaningfully say that person was a Catholic. If an adult Catholic who had been baptised, confirmed and received communion left the Church he or she would be an apostate (or just ‘lapsed,’ in popular parlance). They would always be regarded as Catholic by the Church, even so, and would be welcome back any time. A baby or child who died between baptism and reception of the later sacraments is of course said to have been a Catholic (insofar as the question is of any meaningful definitional interest to anyone).

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 8:48 pm
CL: I don’t have time now to transcribe what Romney said in that Youtube clip you posted, but I will do so later.

Here ya go:

“What happened to Trayvon Martin is a tragedy. There needs to be a thorough investigation that reassures the public that justice is carried out with impartiality and integrity.”

“The shooting of Trayvon is a terrible tragedy, unnecessary, uncalled for and inexplicable at this point. What we’ve heard from the media reports suggest that it’s entirely appropriate for the district attorney to be looking into this and to have called a grand jury and find what the facts are. We hope that justice is done in this case as in all cases. But very tragic and our hearts go out to his family his loved ones his friends this shouldn’t have happened.”

The shooting of Martin was, said Romney, “unnecessary, uncalled for and inexplicable.” Furthermore, what the police regarded as self-defence should “never have happened.”

That is, according to Romney, this was a homicide/murder.

But it was none of these things.

According to the police, it was necessary, called for and explicable.

Romney then goes on to encourage investigative intervention by prosecutorial authorities.

This is exactly the same stance as Sharpton and Jackson.

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 8:56 pm
Note also the fulcrum of Romney’s call for prosecutorial intervention:

What we’ve heard from the media reports suggest that it’s entirely appropriate for the district attorney to be looking into this…

Fucking idiot.

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 9:00 pm
I really do wish Romney would have learned from Reagan instead of alternating between embracing him & throwing him under the bus depending on the audience.

He could do worse than learn some of his one liners like this which is very apt considering SDFC’s conversation with JC above:

A friend of mine was asked to a costume ball a short time ago. He slapped some egg on his face and went as a liberal economist.

Token

6 Apr 12 at 9:05 pm
How about this one:

Recession is when your neighbor loses his job. Depression is when you lose yours. Recovery is when ~~Jimmy Carter~~ Obama loses his.

Token

6 Apr 12 at 9:06 pm
Dawnslight at Roma
Feral pigs in the creeklines
Some are now no more

Plans change, gentle friends
Bones of ancient mountains call
At far Warrego

Mk50 of Brisbane

6 Apr 12 at 9:06 pm
I really do wish Romney would have learned from Reagan instead of alternating between embracing him & throwing him under the bus depending on the audience.

TouTubed.

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 9:10 pm
Note also the fulcrum of Romney’s call for prosecutorial intervention

Indeed. Th media has been so unreliable and tendentiousness as to itself warrant prosecution.

dover_beach

6 Apr 12 at 9:11 pm
Y

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 9:11 pm
Worries of the world
Made dust, by vivid siltstones
One billion years old

Thus you notice how
A glittering spiders web
Mocks the cares of men

Mk50 of Brisbane

6 Apr 12 at 9:12 pm
CL

Excellent, thank you! I only ask, because two friends recently had their daughter baptised – he was raised (including schooling) Catholic, his missus not. I was just asking him hypothetical questions about his daughter’s religious-identity for the rest of her life. My mate, said “too bad, we’ve [Catholics] got her for life now”. I found that response really weird.

My understanding was that – as you say – baptism applies across all christianity; maybe even a kind of insurance for the child’s sake. For if everything the church/Bible/believers claim turns out to be spot-on, then regardless of their beliefs as adults, baptised children will still be in the running for entry to Heaven (or whatever), whereas an unbaptised person will run into all sorts of problems. So in the case of the Catholic church, baptism is the price of entry for anyone wanting to progress through the various other sacraments, but in and of itself is not really enough, if your aim is to live a christian life according to the teachings of the Roman Catholic church.

The way my mate was explaining it was that even if his daughter grew up a devout atheist, pagan, or whatever, said she hated the pope, and worse, she could not escape being a Roman Catholic. I can understand the attitude “well, think yourself lucky we baptised you, coz even with all this carry on, God will still give you a hearing at the end”, but I can’t see why the Church would insist that baptism – and that baptism alone – trumps all other behaviour and beliefs of that person in their adulthood – binds them as Catholics forever.

Peter Patton

6 Apr 12 at 9:13 pm
but I can’t see why the Church would insist that baptism – and that baptism alone – trumps all other behaviour and beliefs of that person in their adulthood

It doesn’t.

dover_beach

6 Apr 12 at 9:21 pm
You know, Peter, for someone such as yourself who regularly denigrates the Catholic religion and the clergy – especially nuns – you seem to know very little about that which you calumniate.

Gab

6 Apr 12 at 9:27 pm
My mate, said “too bad, we’ve [Catholics] got her for life now”.

Leaving aside that he was probably being facetious, he’ll have to do more than arrange a baptism to bring his daughter up Catholic.

…whereas an unbaptised person will run into all sorts of problems…

Not necessarily. See “baptism of desire.”* Also, the Church has no doctrine on the fate of unbaptised babies. Which is really to say, in practice, that she believes they’re a special case – taken care of by God personally, as it were.

* I think this is a strong reality in the lives and thinking of a not inconsiderable number of people.

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 9:27 pm
Do you have to be baptised yourself to have a child baptised a catholic CL?

sdfc

6 Apr 12 at 9:36 pm
Do you have to be baptised yourself to have a child baptised a catholic CL?

No, I don’t think so. But implicit in the sacrament is the responsibility of parents and godparents to guide the child in Christian faith. So a priest would probably like to know more about where you’re at, where your spouse/partner/former spouse/partner is at etc. You do have to be a Catholic or a baptised non-Catholic Christian witness to be a godparent, however. You cannot be an atheist, a Muslim or a Jew, for example.

[Research here or ask an expert - which I'm not].

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 9:57 pm
I ask because the local anglican church said I had to be baptised for our kids to be baptised.

Though in honesty I cant remember it was merely a prerequisite for my participation in the ritual.

sdfc

6 Apr 12 at 10:01 pm
I ask because the local anglican church said I had to be baptised for our kids to be baptised.

Why bother. The Anglican Church no longer believes in God. You’re wasting you time and effort.

JC

6 Apr 12 at 10:17 pm
That’s rubbish JC.

sdfc

6 Apr 12 at 10:18 pm
sdfc

Did they say both you and your wife have to be baptised?

Peter Patton

6 Apr 12 at 10:19 pm
They did Peter. My wife was the driving force behoind the baptism. The was an active member in the church.

sdfc

6 Apr 12 at 10:21 pm
Thanks for that, CL.

The shooting of Trayvon is a terrible tragedy, unnecessary, uncalled for and inexplicable at this point. What we’ve heard from the media reports suggest that it’s entirely appropriate for the district attorney to be looking into this and to have called a grand jury and find what the facts are.

CL, how can you say that this means Romney’s calling Zimmerman a murderer? He’s saying nothing of the sort. Not explicitly, not implied. He’s saying he’s basing his knowledge of what happened on what he’s heard in the media, that it’s a terrible situation, uncalled for, inexplicable. I don’t think many would disagree with the “terrible situation” bit. “Uncalled for”, “inexplicable”, well…that’s understandable if you believed the MSM line being spun at the time – “at this point”. He also claimed there should be an investigation so that the facts can be known and justice can be done. This sounds like poli-speak boilerplate/grandstanding – yeah of course we all want the facts to be known and justice to be done, and in fact perhaps the facts have already been established and justice done. Again, he bought into the MSM narrative of the time. However he didn’t say anything about what that justice might be.

I certainly agree with you that Romney jumped the gun and should have been a little (a lot) less credulous when it comes to the MSM and their favoured narratives. He made a goose out of himself, no question.

But to claim he declared Zimmerman a murderer based on the above is simply preposterous.

Oh come on

6 Apr 12 at 10:24 pm
Well, I’m not here to tell folks about sucking eggs, but from an abstract “christian” position, you would think the church would be gladly lining up to baptise ANY person.

Peter Patton

6 Apr 12 at 10:25 pm
[Research here or ask an expert - which I'm not].

Research? Peh. You lot should have one of those awfully helpful websites like the Muhammadans.

Oh come on

6 Apr 12 at 10:26 pm
I can understand getting picky about performing marriage on status asymmetrical adults, but surely an ‘open house’ baptism policy would reduce the need to be picky later on?

Peter Patton

6 Apr 12 at 10:27 pm
I found the whole thing too preoccupied with ritual.

We were going to be without a priest one session and we were told we could have a meeting but no wine and biccies. I suggested a parishioner give the sacrament and was told in no uncertain terms she wasn’t eligible. WTF?

sdfc

6 Apr 12 at 10:34 pm
But to claim he declared Zimmerman a murderer based on the above is simply preposterous.

It’s what he said.

He didn’t, as you say, call the “situation” unnecessary, uncalled for and inexplicable.

He said the shooting was unnecessary, uncalled for and inexplicable.

It was none of those things.

To assert that it was is to assert homicide/murder.

C.L.

6 Apr 12 at 10:34 pm
There could also just be a simple principal-agent problem. Maybe your local Anglican church is a but dizzy at the minute? They seem completely at all over the shop at head office.

Peter Patton

6 Apr 12 at 10:35 pm
It is an pre-occupation with ritual over the word of God.

sdfc

6 Apr 12 at 10:38 pm
Or is that preoccupation. I never know what is hyphenated and what’s not.

sdfc

6 Apr 12 at 10:39 pm
Remarkably pateient of CL to point out the bleedin’ obvious on multiple occasions to Oco.

My last comment asked a question of Oco’s last post which followed CL’s Ed Driscoll post.

Apparently Oco is delighted to make a drama about wasting his time but is also apparently more than eager to waste other peoples’ time.

JamesK

6 Apr 12 at 10:49 pm
OCO, I’m sorry, but CL has you dead to rights here.

dover_beach

6 Apr 12 at 10:54 pm
Everyone here knows how much I (don’t) like Romney, but the claim that he called Zimmerman a murderer sounds like a bit of over-reach to me.

Yes, it was too soon for anyone to be making statements on the issue, but the media was pretty much demanding it. And the qualifiers he put in pretty much covered his ass.

sdog

6 Apr 12 at 10:54 pm
And yes, Romney was pandering when he made that statement, but that’s what pollies do. Bunch of fucking pandas the lot of them.

sdog

6 Apr 12 at 10:57 pm
sdfc, I’m not familiar with the consecration of the eucharist in the Anglican Church but I imagine its not mere ritualism that requires a priest to be present.

dover_beach

6 Apr 12 at 11:02 pm
test

sdfc

6 Apr 12 at 11:05 pm
Of course it is ritual dover. What else is to stop a parishioner from giving the sacrament?

sdfc

6 Apr 12 at 11:06 pm
Of course it is ritual dover.

Do you know the difference between mere ritualism and a ritual?

What else is to stop a parishioner from giving the sacrament?

The fact they are not a priest. Crazy, hey?

dover_beach

6 Apr 12 at 11:18 pm
CNN proves “beyond a reasonable doubt” why cases should not be tried in the media

Related: polls show the black community overwhelmingly believes he was murdered and that police let his killer get away due to racism.

As Wm Jacobson asks, “If the case ends with Zimmerman going free, where does the public anger go after the media already has convicted him?”

Hoo boy.

sdog

6 Apr 12 at 11:26 pm
As Wm Jacobson asks, “If the case ends with Zimmerman going free, where does the public anger go after the media already has convicted him?”

Two words: O.J.

Peter Patton

6 Apr 12 at 11:32 pm
the black community overwhelmingly believes he was murdered and that police let his killer get away due to racism.

But of course. Thanks Al, Jesse and Barry. Mission accomplished.

Pedro the Ignorant

6 Apr 12 at 11:39 pm
On April 7th, the New Black Panther Party in Florida declares they will conduct “county-wide and state-wide defense training and community patrols to protect against racial violence and attacks.” And the NBPP also declares a call to action slated for Monday April 9th, the day before a Florida Grand Jury will convene on the Trayvon Martin case to decide whether to indict George Zimmerman.

Whether you wanna hang somebody from a tree from a rope or shoot them with a gun, a lynching is a lynching. And at some point, enough is enough. And I think there is a large part of the community that not only appreciates some aggressive activism around this issue as opposed to the same old “let’s stand in front of microphones and give speeches and press conferences”–there has to be a call to action.

Not only trial by media but next up, a twitter campaign for sentencing. Oh wait…

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2012/04/05/new-black-panthers-plan-call-to-action-day-before-zimmerman-hearing

Gab

6 Apr 12 at 11:40 pm
To have clear understanding of Obummer’s ourageous request of Medvedev for space until after he’s won his “last election”, it’s worth reading the impressive Senator John Kyl in the WSJ

What’s at Stake in the Missile-Defense Debate?

The U.S. government has no higher moral obligation than to protect the American people from nuclear attack.

It appears the president is willing to compromise our own missile-defense capabilities to secure Russian support for another round of nuclear-arms reductions. To accomplish that, he may have to ignore or circumvent commitments he made to Congress to secure support for the 2010 New Strategic Arms Reduction Treaty (Start)—among them, that he would deploy all four phases of planned U.S. missile-defense systems for Europe, and that he would modernize the Ground-based Midcourse Defense (GMD) system for the protection of the U.S. homeland.

The president’s re-election prospects could suffer if concessions on these systems were to be openly discussed before the election

JamesK

6 Apr 12 at 11:50 pm
Check out the comments on this new grandstanding book about the Bolt trial. Makes me proud to be Australian…

http://www.randomhouse.com.au/books/anita-heiss/am-i-black-enough-for-you-9781742751924.aspx

Abu Chowdah

7 Apr 12 at 12:16 am
Peter Craven, The Age:

THE enigma remains but when we see a great filmmaker like Pasolini take to the Christ story in The Gospel According to St Matthew using a transfiguration of the very idiom of neo-realism, we know we are watching the recapitulation of a great story, but we also have the uncanny feeling of being in the presence of a docudrama. That’s where the legacy of Christianity leaves us, whether we’re atheists or Zoroastrians, and it’s a funny thing to ponder over the hot crossed buns and Easter eggs.

Who on earth reads that tripe?

Gab

7 Apr 12 at 12:27 am
Gosh Abu, I just finished reading this segment from Stringer …

10 out 12 specimens from Willandra Lakes and Kow Swamp, dated at circa 40,000 years, was claimed to be an outgroup of mtDNA in humans and Neandertals.

Paraphrase of text

Stringer, Origins of our Species. (If you want a recent update on findings this is a very good place to go. It was Stringer who played a large part in overthrowing the European origin of modern humans)
——

Further tests are being undertaken because the initial tests had some problems but if this holds up it may well cast a whole new light on being aboriginal. It would support my contention that aborigines are not a single group but represent something quite unique in human evolution.

Yes I know, very sad to be reading such material on such a night.

John H.

7 Apr 12 at 12:30 am
It would support my contention that aborigines are not a single group but represent something quite unique in human evolution.

John, I also think there’s something VERY different going on from what the ‘official’ guff we get.

Peter Patton

7 Apr 12 at 12:40 am
And given the astonishing exogamic instincts since 1788, the number of people who can get anywhere near cooee in describing themselves as ‘aboriginal’ would number in the low thousands.

Peter Patton

7 Apr 12 at 12:42 am
it’s a funny thing to ponder over the hot crossed buns and Easter eggs.

No it’s not. I don’t ponder over mine, I eat them. On Easter Sunday. I know what that’s about, have since Sunday School. Good Friday: A Green Hill Far Away.

Gone midnight. Bedtime. Now Easter Saturday and shops open. Woo Hoo.

Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

7 Apr 12 at 12:43 am
John, I also think there’s something VERY different going on from what the ‘official’ guff we get.

Be quiet, a judge might be reading this. Earlier in the text Stringer states what I have often read in texts by overseas anthropologists: aborigines often display archaic features. I aint saying no more!

Yes I will … It don’t matter if modern peoples are different. Take the IQ debate. The people who call people like Stringer a racist are the racists because they attribute humanity to possessing certain characteristics. Only half an hour I read his comment how because of his Out of African push he was threatened with legal action. It don’t matter how smart you are you are still human. So left wing attacks re claims of racism actually reveal their own prejudices. Fuck ém.

John H.

7 Apr 12 at 12:46 am
was claimed to be an outgroup of mtDNA in humans and Neandertals.

Extremely interesting. Must read it.

Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

7 Apr 12 at 12:48 am
Read a book recently called The Last Ten Thousand Years – suggesting continuing human evolutionary selective pressure has been strong particularly since the Neolithic.

Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

7 Apr 12 at 12:51 am
Have to wait Eliz. The first studies have some problems. Stringer says follow ups are being down and his text is dated 2011 so the results may not be in yet. I’ll go ahunting.

This is the primary research piece, full text, dated 2001

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC14622/

…
This timing of divergence implies that the deepest known mtDNA lineage from an anatomically modern human occurred in Australia; analysis restricted to living humans places the deepest branches in East Africa.
…

I disagree with that, I think there is another answer.

Note: the comments below are great. While certain sections of the Australian intellectual community are trying to push this barrow, the comments at this link clearly indicate Australians en masse have a much more enlightened attitude.

http://blogs.abc.net.au/nsw/2012/04/am-i-black-enough-for-you.html

Love this comment …

How can this be a ‘conversation’ when Mr Bolt cannot enter the ‘conversation’ without a law suit being filed against him.

What a biased joke you are ABC, and on our tax dime.

John H.

7 Apr 12 at 12:56 am
Read a book recently called The Last Ten Thousand Years – suggesting continuing human evolutionary selective pressure has been strong particularly since the Neolithic.

Yep, our EQ – encephalisation quotient, is lower than Cro Magnons, the cerebrum has shrunk some10% since then. Interestingly though the cerebellum has not shrunk. An old Russian friend of mine reckons the cerebellum is greatly neglected.

John H.

7 Apr 12 at 12:58 am
Liz,

AFter the Ice, by Steve Mithen, is worth a read.

http://www.amazon.com/After-Ice-Global-History-000-5000/dp/0674015703

John H.

7 Apr 12 at 1:02 am
Related: polls show the black community overwhelmingly believes he was murdered and that police let his killer get away due to racism.

That’s hardly suprising when even the white nominee-presumptive for the Republican Party asserts that Martin was 1) unlawfully shot; and b) that the police investigation of the first instance must be presumed to be dubious.

C.L.

7 Apr 12 at 1:17 am
Am I Black Enough For You?*

Certainly has received a poor reception judging by the comments at the publisher’s site.

*even the title is unoriginal.

Gab

7 Apr 12 at 1:21 am
Am I Black Enough For You?

No.

C.L.

7 Apr 12 at 1:23 am
abbott has a gay sister and he’s kept this out of the press for fours years until now when she decided to go public.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/close-to-home-what-tony-abbotts-family-taught-him-about-gay-relationships/story-fn59niix-1226320790650

JC

7 Apr 12 at 1:23 am
Re Christ Stringer, it is comforting to know that there are still soem rigorous scientifically-trained Anthropologists around. Most of those under the age of 40 think Anthropology is Edward Said’s Orientalism, and that any talk of chromosomes, and such, merely ‘part of the long-discredited 19th century racist biological measure of difference, blah, blah, blah.

Peter Patton

7 Apr 12 at 1:24 am
I presume all of those commenters will now be charged with a crime and dragged before ‘Judge’ Mordy and ‘Judge’ Fink.

No?

Why not?

C.L.

7 Apr 12 at 1:26 am
abbott has a gay sister

I want to see Gillard top that!

Gab

7 Apr 12 at 1:30 am
This is going to send the left apeshit crazy because it demonstrates to voterland Abbott’s strength character in not revealing it to the public for political mileage.

We could end up seeing a thelma and louise en masse by the left. In fact I’ve opened the JC leftie suicide hotline as I expect a demand surge.

Unable to reveal the personal dimension to this political fracas, Mr Abbott has been hostage to caricature, with critics lambasting his social conservatism and commentators suggesting he should get to know some gay people. Ms Forster wished at times she could have enlightened the community with her experience of his empathy.

When Julia Gillard hosted gay couples to a dinner at the Lodge, the event made headlines around the country. Mr Abbott and his wife, Margie, have welcomed Ms Forster and Ms Edwards to their home as a couple on countless occasions without fanfare or fuss. They know more about gay relationships than people think.

JC

7 Apr 12 at 1:30 am
Peter,

Stringer is great. Just read …

That is a crucial point to bear in mind as we trace the modern human diaspora towards Australia, because there we will search largely in vain in the earliest archaeological records for the markers of behavioural modernity that we have been discussing so far in this book.

p 215

Oh dear … Is that black enough for you?

John H.

7 Apr 12 at 1:31 am
suggesting he should get to know some gay people.

And how often has teh Left vilified Abbott as a homophobe? Sucked in lefties.

Gab

7 Apr 12 at 1:34 am
John, this comment from Victoria on the ABC thread is my favourite. Brutal and incisive:

It is interesting to hear the perspective of a white Aborigine on this interesting subject.

Abu Chowdah

7 Apr 12 at 1:47 am
Bad jobs numbers out of the U.S.

US Adds 120,000 Jobs; Unemployment Falls to 8.2%

That word, unexpected, rears it’s head again.

Alex Pundit

7 Apr 12 at 2:06 am
Disappointing number, Alex, although the previous two months numbers were revised up.

We now three months worth of numbers to show improvement or the Kenyan’s goose is well and truly cooked.

Once you get into June the conventions become the talk and by that time the polls pretty much firm up.

JC

7 Apr 12 at 2:21 am
“The drop in the unemployment rate, to the lowest level since January 2009, reflected a drop in the labor force. The separate household survey, from which the jobless rate is derived also showed a drop in employment.”

So just as many people or more are still unemployed, they’re just not counting them anymore.

Way to go, President Hopenchange.

sdog

7 Apr 12 at 2:23 am
Dog

Monthly payroll data is enormously volatile. Last night’s weekly claims presented lower suggesting this evening’s stat should have been better. It’s impossible to extrapolate with one month stats.

JC

7 Apr 12 at 2:27 am
He feels their pain:

Obama Speaks to Women – Jokes About Dry Cleaning (Video).

C.L.

7 Apr 12 at 3:09 am
WAR ON WOMEN: “Obama played 23 rounds of golf between January and October of 2009 before inviting a single woman to his foursome, the New York Times reported. This was emblematic of broader concerns over the president’s preference for the company and advice of men.”

sdog

7 Apr 12 at 5:25 am
Nothings changed with US economic activity. It was falling, continues to fall, and this will continue.

Jackson

7 Apr 12 at 6:48 am
“Obama played 23 rounds of golf between January and October of 2009

The lesson here is if more women want access to the President they need to take up playing golf.

Sucking up the boss 101…….get interested in what interests him/her. For example if you want to curry favour with Ms Gillard just fuck up a lot and the world will be your oyster.

Splatacrobat

7 Apr 12 at 7:00 am
Re Tony Abbotts sister:

When you find out something new about Abbott it adds to his character.

When you find out something new about Gillard it diminishes hers further.

Obio

7 Apr 12 at 7:39 am
The ABC’s Anita Heiss comments page is now closed. But wow, some great comments.

(Sorry if this has already been posted)

Capitalist Piggy

7 Apr 12 at 8:33 am
The ABC’s Anita Heiss comments page is now closed. But wow, some great comments.

(Sorry if this has already been posted)

Capitalist Piggy

7 Apr 12 at 8:34 am
JC,

When I look at this chart, I can’t help thinking the whole think is built on a house of cards, or a pile of Monopoly money.

Capitalist Piggy

7 Apr 12 at 8:42 am
“…whole thing..”

Capitalist Piggy

7 Apr 12 at 8:43 am
“Still, because the costs of prohibition — interdiction, mass incarceration, etc. — are staggeringly high, some people say, “Let’s just try legalization for a while.”

People think its enough to run an intellectual case. But when people who have influence over the government are in league with the drug-dealers themselves, then you can argue a case for rationality as long as you like and with no effect. After all many of the most influential, and politically connected families in the US made their money in the Chinese opium trade. We’ve just had the fast and furious allegations, and no official has been imprisoned. And of course the CIA’s involvement in drug trafficking could hardly be more well-known.

OscarW

7 Apr 12 at 8:47 am
Wen Jiabao just knocked the props from under Greg Combet in the worst way:

China will accelerate the use of new-energy sources such as nuclear energy and put an end to blind expansion in industries such as solar energy and wind power in 2012, Chinese Premier Wen Jiabao says in a government report published on March 5.

China is dumping on solar and wind…

Apologies if this is old news but Mr Combet was spinning how much China is doing as recently as a week ago, and I’d not seen this report before today.

ht Steve Milloy

Bruce of Newcastle

7 Apr 12 at 8:57 am
Obio,

They will be more unrelenting on Abbott now because ‘he didn’t tell all” earlier.

Mike

Mike of Marion

7 Apr 12 at 9:00 am
The CCC are quiet, oldies take 2/3 days to get over a piss up.

Jumpnmcar

7 Apr 12 at 9:29 am
George Megalogenis decides to show us all who really is intelligent, considerate and thoughtful

Newman’s axing of literary award spells return to bumpkin state

JamesK

7 Apr 12 at 9:51 am
Paul Kelly uses the c-word.

Yes, the Gillard government is corrupt.

Bolt is right:

And one day, when this despicable government is destroyed at the polls, this period of Labor’s history will be looked back at in shame. And the rest of us must also reflect: why did so many writers, journalists, politicians, academics, “civil libertarians” and the like not defend our free speech when it came under the most serious and sustained political attack in generations?

C.L.

7 Apr 12 at 10:11 am
It’s official: Australians couldn’t give a rat’s arse about ‘climate change.’

SUPPORT for the environment has slumped to new lows and Australians are increasingly sceptical of global warming, new research has found.

Quantum Market Research, which has interviewed 2000 Australians annually since 1992 to track social change, released its latest Australia SCAN in Adelaide this week.

When asked if Australians should all make sacrifices for the sake of the environment, the answer is increasingly “no”, Australia SCAN consultant David Chalke says.

The research underscores the problems faced by the Gillard Government as it tries to sell its carbon tax, which takes effect from July 1.

Mr Chalke said there was a clear trend of declining support for the environment, falling from a high of about 50 per cent in the mid-1990s to the current low of about 30 per cent…

“You can see why carbon tax isn’t particularly popular … They are confused by the science, they don’t understand it, they think it’s probably natural, maybe – is the carbon tax going to make any difference? No.”

Via Blair.

C.L.

7 Apr 12 at 10:14 am
I think any lingering doubts about the character of Abbott that I had have disappeared. He’s going to destroy this rabble at the next election.

tbh

7 Apr 12 at 10:26 am
Considering Mega’s ex is now opposition leader in Qld of a team of 8 7 members, Mega has decided to appoint himself as shadow minister for sneering and mis information.

Token

7 Apr 12 at 10:33 am
I don’t quite understand the idea that Abbott is now golden because his sister is a lesbian. What did people expect him to do, demand she leave the country or organise an honour killing? The starting premise being used even by his admirers strikes me as insulting and odd.

C.L.

7 Apr 12 at 10:41 am
Racialists twisting themselves into a pretzel:

NYT Op-Ed by Khalil Gibran Muhammad, director of the Schomburg Center for Research in Black Culture at the New York Public Library: Playing the Violence Card

EVER since the culture wars of the 1980s, Americans have been familiar with “the race card” — an epithet used to discredit real and imagined cries of racism. Less familiar, however, is an equally cynical rhetorical tactic that I call “the violence card.”

Here’s how it works. When confronted with an instance of racially charged violence against a black person, a commentator draws attention to the fact that there is much more black-on-black violence than white-on-black violence. To play the violence card — as many criminal-justice advocates have done since the Rodney King police brutality case of the early 1990s — is to suggest that black people should worry more about the harm they do to themselves and less about how victimized they are by others.

JamesK

7 Apr 12 at 11:05 am
Do any of them look like Obama’s son?

At one point, the victim recalled being lifted from the ground so one of the boys could “drop-kick” him in the chest.

One boy, he said, put his foot on the back of the victim’s neck, with another shouting, “Kill him.”

While Mr. Watts was down the boys kicked him, over and over, shouting, “[Get] that white [man]. This is for Trayvon … Trayvon lives, white [man]. Kill that white [man],” according to a police report.

The boys fled when a man shouted at them, according to the report.

The victim is a veteran who served in the US military for 11 years.

Gab

7 Apr 12 at 11:09 am
Cross removed as it’s offensive to Muslims.

As part of the agreement, however, the ruler of Ras al-Khaimah required Real Madrid to remove the cross from the crown on its logo for all promotional materials. The president of Real Madrid dutifully complied.

Gab

7 Apr 12 at 11:22 am
CL

I don’t quite understand the idea that Abbott is now golden because his sister is a lesbian. What did people expect him to do,

That’s the point, even when lambasted by every lefty with “homophobe “ect, he chose to respect his sister, even though it would shut em up if he blabbed.

Now any opponent who says he’ll ” say anything, do anything to get the Top Job ( Albo,Penny, Conroy i’m looking at you) will be laughed at.

Prediction; Abbott as preferred PM in next poll, up 3.

Jumpnmcar

7 Apr 12 at 11:27 am
My prediction is that the David Marr/Tony Jones set will segue effortlessly to the line that an ‘embarrassed’ Abbott – a ‘devout Catholic’ and ‘staunch opponent’ of ‘gay marriage’ – ‘kept quiet’ about his sister etc.

C.L.

7 Apr 12 at 11:29 am
The ABC’s Anita Heiss comments page is now closed.

Opened with first comment 9.38a.m…….. closed last comment 11.27a.m.

ABC’s commitment to free speech = one hour eleven minutes.

Now I know the reaction time of the luvvies to put their latte’s down and pull from the public feedback they don’t like.

Splatacrobat

7 Apr 12 at 11:32 am
I don’t quite understand the idea that Abbott is now golden because his sister is a lesbian. What did people expect him to do,

It could do Abbott the world of good. The mere identification will help dispel the ideas of some that Abbott is a mean spirited conservative who secretly hates those of other inclinations. Abbott is probably one of the most compassionate pollies in the govt. I say this not because of what he says but because of his social engagement background.

I think Abbott needs to stop hiding this under a bushel and shine his light upon the world. It will certainly help him with women voters and that remains a problem for him. And yes, if anyone can indicate to me why women seem to dislike Abbott I’d love to hear it.

John H.

7 Apr 12 at 11:32 am
Newsflash:

“Tony Abbott puts religion before rights of homosexuals”.

Gab

7 Apr 12 at 11:32 am
Oh FFS – somebody arrest these crooks:

FWA chief needs investigation time.

C.L.

7 Apr 12 at 11:32 am
Next thing you know Abbott will give up drinking baby’s blood.

Infidel Tiger

7 Apr 12 at 11:36 am
And Abbott counters with ” I don’t cast my religious beliefs on anyone, It’s my personal choice to be Catholic, everyone is free to follow a path or no path at all in Australia”

Up another 2 points.

Jumpnmcar

7 Apr 12 at 11:36 am
And yes, if anyone can indicate to me why women seem to dislike Abbott I’d love to hear it.

Abbott hates women. This is why he has surrounded himself with them.

Infidel Tiger

7 Apr 12 at 11:41 am
Over at LP:

So Tony Abbott must hate gay people in the collective sense even if he does not hate every individual gay person.

Newsflash:

“Abbott hates women and especially lesbians”.

Gab

7 Apr 12 at 11:53 am
AFter the Ice, by Steve Mithen, is worth a read.

Thanks John H. Colin Renfrew also recommends it. I have ordered it to my Kindle. Wish Barry Cunliffe’s new book Land Between the Seas was also on Kindle. Will have to consider forking out real dosh for it.

Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

7 Apr 12 at 11:56 am
JOhn H: Abbott’s modesty about his activities verges on frustrating. When Victoria was hit my huge bushfires in 2006, Abbott’s unit of the Rural Fire Service came south to help out. He worked his arse off for several weeks and the only favour he asked was that no one make a big deal about it, or go talking to the press.

He is a decent, tolerant man who leads by quiet example.

areff

7 Apr 12 at 11:56 am
Areff and it is precisely those type of people who should be leading political parties, not venal, narcissistic blowhards.

tbh

7 Apr 12 at 12:07 pm
I don’t quite understand the idea that Abbott is now golden because his sister is a lesbian. What did people expect him to do,

I don’t think it will be seen like that.

First off it will send the left wild because they aren’t able to suggest he’s out of touch.

It will be seen by voterland in a good light, in the sense that he never used something in his private life for spin.

That’s my view of it. Nothing to do with holding it up as a badge of honor.

JC

7 Apr 12 at 12:07 pm
Areff, form Wiki

People win hero awards for such stuff!

….

Beyond his involvement in student politics, biographer Michael Duffy, wrote that during his student days he once “saved a child who was swept out to sea. Another time, helped save children from a burning house next to a pub where he was drinking. On each occasion he disappeared before he could be properly thanked”.

John H.

7 Apr 12 at 12:08 pm
IT

Next thing you know Abbott will give up drinking baby’s blood.

Just for Lent, or on an ongoing basis? I was under the impression that was pretty much passé among Catholics nowadays. Only old-fashioned Jews bother anymore.

Peter Patton

7 Apr 12 at 12:09 pm
Abbott is probably one of the most compassionate pollies in the govt. I say this not because of what he says but because of his social engagement background.

Which frankly worries the shit outta me about him. That’s an indicator of big government conservatism.

JC

7 Apr 12 at 12:09 pm
Which frankly worries the shit outta me about him. That’s an indicator of big government conservatism.

Oh bollocks JC, one can be compassionate at the level of personal behavior without demanding that policy be so constructed. Abbott’s emphasis is always on personal behavior and responsibility so I fail to see how he will translate this into government intervention.

John H.

7 Apr 12 at 12:12 pm
Beyond his involvement in student politics, biographer Michael Duffy, wrote that during his student days he once “saved a child who was swept out to sea. Another time, helped save children from a burning house next to a pub where he was drinking. On each occasion he disappeared before he could be properly thanked”.

There’s a strong chance he is Batman.

Infidel Tiger

7 Apr 12 at 12:20 pm
It appears that Heiss’ book comments at Random House have fallen into the memory hole, and no further comments are being canvassed.

Funny how the comment box says 153, but you can’t access them.

kae

7 Apr 12 at 12:44 pm
A good defence of marriage from the lefty leftists loathe: Brendan O’Neill in da Oz:

‘I now pronounce you partner 1 and partner 2′: why gay marriage is bad for us all

The usefulness of gay marriage as a tool for attitude re-modification can be seen in the way it is being used to redefine relationships and families in bureaucratic terms. So Cameron’s consultation on gay marriage proposes erasing words such as “husband” and “wife” in official documentation and replacing them with “partner” or “spouse”.

This has already happened in Canada, where gay marriage became legal in 2005. There, the words husband and wife, even mother and father, have been airbrushed from official life, superseded by soulless terms such as “Parent 1″ and “Parent 2″.

This is social engineering; the renaming of relationships to suit the prejudices of our rulers. It also acts as an invitation to yet more state interference. Allowing the state to redefine ancient, organic relationships is a short step from allowing it to police them

JamesK

7 Apr 12 at 12:46 pm
Bunyip has posted a link to the cached comments at Random House.

areff

7 Apr 12 at 12:49 pm
That’s not unexpected, Kae. I checked the comments there earlier today and could see them so it’s only happened recently. No doubt Bolt posting and linking (again) to the Random House site has alerted the folks there.

Gab

7 Apr 12 at 12:50 pm
Random House needed to put all those clear & concise comments that focus on free speech, the politics if social division and economic exploitation by shonks such as Geoff Clarke in the memory hole to enable their smear of racism to get legs.

Bog standard tactics from the luvvie Australian community.

There were a number Of comments supporting an economic campaign against Random House, which also would have to be binned.

Token

7 Apr 12 at 12:50 pm
I don’t think it’s bollocks to be concerned with Abbott’s big government conservatism, JohnH.

JC

7 Apr 12 at 12:51 pm
I saved a screencap at 145 comments: http://ScrnSht.com/srsusi

sdog

7 Apr 12 at 12:56 pm
I don’t think it’s bollocks to be concerned with Abbott’s big government conservatism, JohnH.

I must have misunderstood you. My argument is that because he demonstrates compassion does not mean that drives his big govt conservatism. I don’t think Abbott will drive the big govt theme because his party won’t tolerate it.

John H.

7 Apr 12 at 12:57 pm
I don’t think Abbott will drive the big govt theme because his party won’t tolerate it.

Hahahahahahahahahha. Crack another one.

However, Abbott’s community engagement, extroverted personality (in the Myer-Briggs sense) and genuine interest in people is a perfect set of characteristics for the leader.

John Mc

7 Apr 12 at 1:03 pm
Headline and smack-down of the day:

Obama Plays Kissie-Kissie With Groups Who Shoot Women in the Head & Beat Them in Public… But He Supports Women.

Jim should have added that Obama passionately supports Planned Parenthood, which disproportionately slaughters girls and blacks.

C.L.

7 Apr 12 at 1:05 pm
Certifiable nutball James Hansen:

NASA scientist climate change is a moral issue on a par with slavery.

“The situation we’re creating for young people and future generations is that we’re handing them a climate system which is potentially out of their control,” he said.

Imagine it. The first generation to inherit a climate they can’t control. Shame on us.

C.L.

7 Apr 12 at 1:16 pm
One of the (many) chiefs of the Global Dictators Club calls for an investigation into the Zimmerman shooting while an investigation is currently underway.

Not very bright.

UN rights chief Navi Pillay on Thursday called for an “immediate investigation” into the circumstances surrounding the February death of an unarmed black US teen, shot by a neighborhood watchman.

Pillay made the comments about the controversial Trayvon Martin case at a press conference in Barbados, as she wrapped up a three-day visit to the Caribbean island nation.

http://pjmedia.com/tatler/2012/04/06/un-rights-chief-demands-trayvon-martin-investigation/

Gab

7 Apr 12 at 1:27 pm
Anita Heiss asks, “Am I Black Enough”? The answer luv, is, No. To the extent Ms Heiss’ self-delusions are encouraged by State literary awards, and such, Campbell Newman’s initiative can only help the brainwashed White Aborigines.

Peter Patton

7 Apr 12 at 1:29 pm
Mercurius’ head explodes at LP:

[Abbott] he was too busy using his wife and daughters for political point scoring, and a gay sister doesn’t fit with the suburban, male heterosexual, action-man, head-of-family image (worth maybe 5 points in the polls) he was chasing.

Moreover, your question presupposes that Abbott is the one who has the choice about this…it’s his sister’s life, and she is the one who has the prerogative to make herself into a public figure or not…of course your question presupposes that Abbott makes those choices on behalf of the women in his life (RU486, anyone?), and it’s not surprising you try to make a virtue out of how Abbott uses the women in his life.

Also, between praying for her soul to be rescued from eternal hellfire, it’s a bit much to expect her to be wheeled out for an interview too.

I would try to dumb this down for you, but it would be better all round if you smarten up.

C.L.

7 Apr 12 at 1:40 pm
Professor Bunyip has found another location where people can post their thoughts on the book. See his blog for the links as I note the spam filter is stopping comments that link there again.

Token

7 Apr 12 at 1:42 pm
PS: It appears Hammy is alive and well and has joined the campaign to comment at Random House. Seems he has more lives than a cat…

Token

7 Apr 12 at 1:43 pm
The IT people at (our) ABC and Random House are busy little bees today aren’t they?

Madly flushing and shredding comments re Comrade Heiss, alas to no avail.

Screencaps abound. Heh.

Pedro the Ignorant

7 Apr 12 at 1:48 pm
CL 1.20pm, yeah, He ( i think but only just) goes epileptic every time he reads a comment of mind. Poor thing’s been in school his entire life (bar the first 4 or 5). Zero street smarts.

Jumpnmcar

7 Apr 12 at 1:56 pm
Hammy is alive? And here I was thought he was past the organic stage six feet under.

What a big mouth.

Hey hammy, if you’re reading this…grow a set.

Jc

7 Apr 12 at 2:10 pm
The settled science of global warming alarmism?

http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/andrewbolt/index.php/heraldsun/comments/climate_study_er_what_man_made_warming/

http://www.onlineopinion.com.au/view.asp?article=13415

Rafe

7 Apr 12 at 2:24 pm
Screencaps abound. Heh.

#BreitbartIsHere

“…WAR.”

sdog

7 Apr 12 at 2:27 pm
“When you find out something new about Abbott it adds to his character.

When you find out something new about Gillard it diminishes hers further.”

So very well put, Obio. 10/10

Winston SMITH

7 Apr 12 at 2:54 pm
Abbott is probably one of the most compassionate pollies in the govt.

This is not the first time a light has been shone on Abbott’s humanity. When he discovered that the man he thought was his son was in fact fathered by someone else he was incredibly sensitive and understanding towards his former girlfriend and about the whole situation. In his personal relationships he quite the lovely guy. But this the screeching harridans could never permit themselves to acknowledge.

Viva

7 Apr 12 at 3:11 pm
My favourite, Spot.

C.L.

7 Apr 12 at 3:16 pm
OCO, I’m sorry, but CL has you dead to rights here.

No, I disagree. As I said earlier, Romney can certainly be criticised for basing his comments on information propagated by the MSM which prefers to shoot first and ask questions later when it comes to race – but he didn’t call Zimmerman a murderer. Not in word, nor as a “logical conclusion” of what he said. I have nothing more to add beyond what I’ve already written on this thread, specifically at 10.24pm. I guess CL and I are going to have to respectfully agree to disagree on this one.

However, I can’t say the same thing about the doltish JamesK, who has beclowned himself rather epically.

My last comment asked a question of Oco’s last post which followed CL’s Ed Driscoll post.

James, the reason I asked you for a link to the Driscoll post you were referring to was because we were discussing Romney’s reaction to the Trayvon Martin shooting, and seeing as though the Ed Driscoll post that CL linked to does not mention Romney once (let me give you a hint – the title of the post is “The Week Obama Jumped the Shark”), I figured you were talking about another post of Driscoll’s, because I didn’t think you’d be so hare-brained as to simply assume the post CL linked to was a response to me without checking it. Take a bazooka to your other foot, why don’t you.

And you really ought to stop being such a smug git, James. You don’t have the intellectual firepower to pull it off; consequently, you just look ridiculous.

Oh come on

7 Apr 12 at 3:23 pm
Republicans will vote for Romney and they will like it.

Fisky

7 Apr 12 at 3:24 pm
Abbott couldn’t even speak about Margaret Whitlam upon her death without having a go at her aged and grieving husband. Incredible.

And his treatment of the dying Bernie Banton AM was simply disgusting.

I’ve seen no evidence of his compassion in public life. Rather the obvious.

He’s a swaggering hairy ape and that’s a big reason why women can’t stand him.

Kelly of Kenmore

7 Apr 12 at 3:32 pm
Rather the opposite

And speaking of an actual compassionate Liberal, Malcolm Turnbull, there is a very interesting profile of him by Robert Manne in the latest Monthly.

Kelly of Kenmore

7 Apr 12 at 3:35 pm
No, I disagree. As I said earlier, Romney can certainly be criticised for basing his comments on information propagated by the MSM which prefers to shoot first and ask questions later when it comes to race – but he didn’t call Zimmerman a murderer. Not in word, nor as a “logical conclusion” of what he said.

Indeed, one possible conclusion is that if Zimmerman used excessive force, he could be indicted on the lesser charge of manslaughter (whether this is the case in Florida, I don’t know, but neither may Romney), not murder.

Still, I am happy for Santorum supporters to call Romney a murder-accuser, and I hope and pray that Santorum himself takes on this very devastating accusation. It might just resuscitate his dead parrot campaign.

Fisky

7 Apr 12 at 3:38 pm
I’ve seen no evidence of his compassion in public life. Rather the obvious.

And how much of your own time have you given up to volunteer work in indigenous communities, or pulling people out of rips? Oh that’s right, you’re a dirty fat tranny who would have a heart attack if you tried to be a surf lifesaver.

Hey Phil, speaking of compassion, what’s your take on Nidal the Fort Hood shooter? I’m sure you must have a strong opinion on this.

Fisky

7 Apr 12 at 3:42 pm
Abbott couldn’t even speak about Margaret Whitlam upon her death without having a go at her aged and grieving husband. Incredible.

No he didn’t, Phil.

“Margaret was a marvellous consort to a very significant Labor leader and an epochal Australian prime minister,” Mr Abbott told reporters in Brisbane.

“There was a lot wrong with the Whitlam government but nevertheless it was a very significant episode in our history and Margaret Whitlam was a very significant element in the political success of Gough Whitlam.”

He described Mrs Whitlam as a great patron of the arts and “a woman of style and substance”.

“We should mourn her passing as we extend our deep sympathies to her friends, to her family and especially to her husband,” Mr Abbott said.

Do continue with your outrageous outrage though. Hilarious.

Gab

7 Apr 12 at 3:43 pm
He’s a swaggering hairy ape and that’s a big reason why women can’t stand him.

And yet more women are going to vote for him than either Gillard or Bob Brown!

I truly can’t imagine why they would rather vote for Abbott than an adulterous homewrecker. No, really.

Fisky

7 Apr 12 at 3:44 pm
Abbott is also a smug and insulting sexist. The way he treats, speaks to and of female politicians including his own deputy is also another major reason by the women of Australia by a large majority do not like Tony Abbott and why therefore it is highly unlikely he will ever be PM.

Kelly of Kenmore

7 Apr 12 at 3:45 pm
It never ceases to amaze how teh Left deplore millionaires except for when it comes to Malcolm ‘Lefties love me’ Turnbull.

Gab

7 Apr 12 at 3:48 pm
A majority of women support Abbott in the polls. Suck it up, Phil – he’s going to be your PM, and women everywhere will vote for him and like it!

Fisky

7 Apr 12 at 3:48 pm
Abbott is also a smug and insulting sexist

Provide evidence that Abbott is smug and then evidence to the more serious assertion that Abbbott is sexist Kelly.

JamesK

7 Apr 12 at 3:49 pm
I note even the Australian chided Abbott for his boorish dissing of Margaret Whitlam’s life partner, on the occasion of her death, in fact immediately after it was announced.

Really, the man can be relied on all important occasions to act as a complete and utter vulgar, emotionally stupid and cruel oaf.

Kelly of Kenmore

7 Apr 12 at 3:49 pm
Here’s George M, a Leftist hack, on Campbell Newman.

The book and newspaper business in the Sunshine state generates an annual turnover of $930 million, based on the latest official data. Books account for about one-third, or $300m. Let’s take just 1 per cent off sales – $3m – as a very conservative estimate of what would happen without the sticker effect. The GST forgone would be $300,000 a year – $50,00 more than the $250,000 that Newman would save from his symbolic assault on the literary class.

George M is actually arguing that if people decide not to spend money on books, they won’t spend it on anything else and therefore that money will just disappear, never to be used. Is he an economist? It certainly doesn’t look like it.

Fisky

7 Apr 12 at 3:51 pm
Abbott is also a smug and insulting sexist. The way he treats, speaks to and of female politicians including his own deputy is also another major reason by the women of Australia by a large majority do not like Tony Abbott and why therefore it is highly unlikely he will ever be PM.

Unless you provide actual quotes we’ll just consider your remarks as that of a raving loony on speed.

Gab

7 Apr 12 at 3:51 pm
Really, the man can be relied on all important occasions to act as a complete and utter vulgar, emotionally stupid and cruel oaf.

Women are very forgiving people, though, so they’ll vote for him anyway. They already back him in the polls, and are just itching to throw the Lying Homewrecker out of the Lodge.

Fisky

7 Apr 12 at 3:53 pm
Margaret Whitlam a great consort: Tony Abbott
The Australian March 17, 2012 11:09AM

OPPOSITION Leader Tony Abbott has described Margaret Whitlam as a woman of style and substance following her death.

Mrs Whitlam died this morning aged 92. She had been in hospital since suffering a fall at home in Sydney last month.

“Margaret was a marvellous consort to a very significant Labor leader and an epochal Australian prime minister,” Mr Abbott told reporters in Brisbane.

“There was a lot wrong with the Whitlam government but nevertheless it was a very significant episode in our history and Margaret Whitlam was a very significant element in the political success of Gough Whitlam.”

He described Mrs Whitlam as a great patron of the arts and “a woman of style and substance”.

“We should mourn her passing as we extend our deep sympathies to her friends, to her family and especially to her husband,” Mr Abbott said.

JamesK

7 Apr 12 at 3:53 pm
Abbott couldn’t even speak about Margaret Whitlam upon her death without having a go at her aged and grieving husband

The old codger still hasn’t moved to cuba? better be quick, the pope is working hard to eliminate this workers’ paradise.

Irving J

7 Apr 12 at 3:57 pm
OCO,

As I said earlier, Romney can certainly be criticised for basing his comments on information propagated by the MSM which prefers to shoot first and ask questions later when it comes to race – but he didn’t call Zimmerman a murderer. Not in word, nor as a “logical conclusion” of what he said.

Indeed. There are other obvious possibilities.

Manslaughter in Florida

Manslaughter by Act: Committing an act that was neither excusable, nor justified that resulted in the death of another person.

Trayvon Martin Investigator Wanted Manslaughter Charge

The lead homicide investigator in the shooting of unarmed teenager Trayvon Martin recommended that neighborhood watch captain George Zimmerman be charged with manslaughter the night of the shooting, multiple sources told ABC News.

Romney certainly jumped the gun and probably got the facts wrong, but obviously he did not “logically” accuse anyone of murder. I think this is called the Fallacy of the Excluded Middle. If he was angling at an accusation of criminality, his comments pointed more closely to manslaughter than anything else.

But I’m delighted to see Santorum supporters accusing Romney of calling Zimmerman a murderer, and I trust the Great White Hope himself will run with it.

Fisky

7 Apr 12 at 4:08 pm
All morons aren’t necessarily leftists as Fisky consistently demonstrates.

JamesK

7 Apr 12 at 4:14 pm
Oh, yes, that certainly excuses Romney’s remarks. He may not have accused Zimmerman, on the basis of nothing more substantial than media reports, of murder but ‘merely’ of manslaughter.

dover_beach

7 Apr 12 at 4:18 pm
You’ll have to take that up with CL, DB, because he’s the one who stated that Romney “logically” made an accusation of murder. BTW:

He may not have accused Zimmerman, on the basis of nothing more substantial than media reports, of murder but ‘merely’ of manslaughter.

That, and/or on the basis that the homicide investigator, Chris Serino, wanted a manslaughter charge. Which is a position that reasonable people may take, even if they are probably wrong.

Luckily, this is all irrelevant, because Romney is about to sweep to power.

Fisky

7 Apr 12 at 4:32 pm
You’ll have to take that up with CL, DB, because he’s the one who stated that Romney “logically” made an accusation of murder.

Well, his statement did not exclude the accusation of murder. It really was a bumbling performance from Romney.

Romney is about to sweep to power.

I hope so, but the only joy that can be derived from this is simply that he is not Obama.

dover_beach

7 Apr 12 at 4:45 pm
Awesome – Swannies in a close one beat the never say die dockers.

Rabz

7 Apr 12 at 4:53 pm
…he’s the one who stated that Romney “logically” made an accusation of murder.

Yes, I am.

Yes, he did.

It’s not even worth arguing about.

C.L.

7 Apr 12 at 5:04 pm
Romney certainly jumped the gun…

An homage to No_Limit_Nigga, perhaps.

C.L.

7 Apr 12 at 5:08 pm
See the Bombers fly up.

Sinclair Davidson

7 Apr 12 at 5:14 pm
It’s not even worth arguing about.

But you did make the argument, and, going by criminal lawyer Richard Hornsby’s explanation of manslaughter in Florida (“neither excusable, nor justified that resulted in the death of another person”), you clearly left out a logical explanation for Romney’s remarks. That is, he didn’t actually accuse anyone murder.

And now you’re stuck with him!

Fisky

7 Apr 12 at 5:18 pm
KOK

The way he treats, speaks to and of female politicians including his own deputy is also another major reason by the women of Australia by a large majority do not like Tony Abbott and why therefore it is highly unlikely he will ever be PM.

How would like you like ‘female politicians’ to be spoken to? How about like any other adult? Fortunately, Australians are a lot more sophisticated than the misanthropist cartoons imagined by the Eva Cox generation. You people simply never learn this lesson. Time to take the It’s Time poster down from the fridge, toots.

Peter Patton

7 Apr 12 at 5:28 pm
Also, KOK, compassion is expressed through actions, than media stunts.

Peter Patton

7 Apr 12 at 5:36 pm
Romney wasn’t making any reference to manslaughter.

The police found the incident was straight-out self-defence – which is why Zimmerman wasn’t charged.

The shooting was not “unnecessary, uncalled for and inexplicable.” That is, it wasn’t murder.

We can readily see why Republicans hate Mitt Romney and why, according to Gallup, the GOP enthusiasm rate has dropped precipitously since Romney emerged as the likely nominee. He favours socialism, denies Christ, is pro-abortion, despises Ronald Reagan and clearly has problems with the second amendment.

C.L.

7 Apr 12 at 5:38 pm
The police found the incident was straight-out self-defence – which is why Zimmerman wasn’t charged.

Right, so your contention is that if Zimmerman’s act was not straight-out self-defence, it must have been murder. There can be no other possibility.

Unfortunately, you were proven wrong a few weeks ago, indeed on the very day that Martin was killed.

Trayvon Martin Investigator Wanted Manslaughter Charge

Fisky

7 Apr 12 at 5:45 pm
Or, let’s look at this quote again: “unnecessary, uncalled for and inexplicable”.

That sounds very familiar. Rather like some legal advice I read somewhere.

Manslaughter in Florida

The crime of Manslaughter can be committed in one of three ways, either by:

Manslaughter by Act: Committing an act that was neither excusable, nor justified that resulted in the death of another person.

Manslaughter is not excusable or justifiable, according to a leading lawyer. It could even be said to be “unnecessary, uncalled for, and inexplicable”!

I think we might just have stumbled over the “Missing Middle”, as it were.

Fisky

7 Apr 12 at 5:51 pm
Beagles crunching the Demons…

Rabz

7 Apr 12 at 6:10 pm
A study of elements and compounds…

Rabz

7 Apr 12 at 6:16 pm
Fisky, I think you’re guilty of assuming that that definition satisfies this fact-situation. I’m struggling myself to think how this situation would fall into the category of manslaughter. Were Zimmerman’s actions reckless? Did he discharge his fireman recklessly? I don’t think so. The only conceivable options are: the firearm accidentally discharged in a struggle; he fired in self-defense during this same struggle; or he murdered Martin. I don’t see how options 1 and 2 can fairly be described as “unnecessary, uncalled for, and inexplicable”. Which leaves us with…

The sort of acts that fall into the category of acts that are “neither excusable, nor justified that resulted in the death of another person” would be shooting clay pigeons in Central Park, killing someone while speeding/ under the influence, running a meth lab in your garage that blows-up killing your neighbor, playing Russian roulette with friends, and the like.

dover_beach

7 Apr 12 at 6:18 pm
Fisky, I think you’re guilty of assuming that that definition satisfies this fact-situation. I’m struggling myself to think how this situation would fall into the category of manslaughter. Were Zimmerman’s actions reckless? Did he discharge his fireman recklessly? I don’t think so. The only conceivable options are: the firearm accidentally discharged in a struggle; he fired in self-defense during this same struggle; or he murdered Martin. I don’t see how options 1 and 2 can fairly be described as “unnecessary, uncalled for, and inexplicable”. Which leaves us with…

No, let’s go over this again. Firstly, manslaughter cannot be necessary or called for by definition.* Secondly, the homicide investigator DID want to charge him with manslaughter, but was overruled.

The extremist “fallacy of the excluded middle” position on this actually implies that manslaughter IS called for and IS necessary (to only say it MIGHT BE so would still give Romney a possible out)!

*Whether it can be “explained” or not is a separate matter; in one sense, even 1st degree murder can be “explained”, with reference to jealousy or revenge, but obviously not to anyone’s satisfaction.

Fisky

7 Apr 12 at 6:24 pm
Firstly, manslaughter cannot be necessary or called for by definition.* Secondly, the homicide investigator DID want to charge him with manslaughter, but was overruled.

Firstly, I never said it could be necessary or called for; secondly, so what? Moreover, the fact that he was overruled is significant.

The extremist “fallacy of the excluded middle” position on this actually implies that manslaughter IS called for and IS necessary (to only say it MIGHT BE so would still give Romney a possible out)!

No it doesn’t. It just appears that the facts in this case exclude the possibility of manslaughter. Rather, than concerning yourself with possible fallacies, maybe you could simply point to facts that indicate recklessness. Otherwise, I’m going to conclude you’re engaging in a filibuster. And you really should probably only do this with the ‘facts’ that Romney had to hand as gleamed from the media (which unfortunately for you did not point to manslaughter at the time).

dover_beach

7 Apr 12 at 6:37 pm
A disturbing trend in the US, honour killings being dressed up by the murderer as hate crimes:

Shaima Alawadi victim of honor killing, not “Islamophobic hate crime”

Token

7 Apr 12 at 6:43 pm
Drawing a cartoon in the world of the Arab Winter is a dangerous act.

Tunisia:

A Tunisian court has sentenced two young men to seven years in prison for publishing caricatures of the Prophet Mohammed, the justice ministry said Thursday.

Egypt:

An Egyptian court on Wednesday sentenced a 17-year-old Christian boy to three years in jail for publishing cartoons on his Facebook page that mocked Islam and the Prophet Mohammad, actions that sparked sectarian violence.

Token

7 Apr 12 at 6:47 pm
No no, we need to go over this one again.

Firstly, when Romney called Zimmerman’s actions “uncalled for…” etc, he was immediately accused by CL of implying that Zimmerman was a murderer. Obviously, that would only hold logically if A) murder was the only possible charge should self-defence not be accepted or B) if any lesser charge (such as manslaughter) were NOT unnecessary or uncalled for!

Secondly, I am not privy to the full range of evidence of the case and I have no idea what ALL the different possibilities are relating to Zimmerman’s actions. A lead investigator established to his satisfaction that Zimmerman committed manslaughter, but this was overruled. So a charge of manslaughter WAS possible, according to one significant authority. Which further makes a mockery of the charge that Romney must exclusively have accused Zimmerman of murder.

Fisky

7 Apr 12 at 6:49 pm
Filth:

Bilal Khar once again denied carrying out the acid attack in a TV interview following her suicide, suggesting a different man with the same name committed the crime. He claimed Younus killed herself because she didn’t have enough money, not because of her horrific injuries, and criticized the media for hounding him about the issue.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world/prominent-pakistani-acid-victim-fakhra-younus-commits-suicide-article-1.1051917#ixzz1qPxpmJkt

Ivan Denisovich

7 Apr 12 at 7:01 pm
Seeing you guys are discussing Trayvon, somebody finally takes responsibility for the race baiting edit on NBC:

The NBC producer responsible for the misleading edit of the George Zimmerman’s 911 call has been fired. The producer was reportedly fired Thursday, but the firing did not hit the press until this Friday evening, just before a holiday weekend. NBC News had no comment on the firing.

Strangely, other people at NBC have not suffered similar sanctions:

It is likely that, if not for conservative new media, the misleading edit, which inflamed racial tensions in the Martin case, and which was repeated by Stetler’s own New York Times, would have gone unnoticed and uncorrected. As it is, the producer responsible for the edit at Today has been fired, but the individual who made the same edit to the earlier MSNBC story (since corrected) has not been identified or disciplined. Nor has anyone at any other outlet or network — many of which made similar selective editing choices — been punished.

Token

7 Apr 12 at 7:07 pm
Obviously, that would only hold logically if A) murder was the only possible charge should self-defence not be accepted or B) if any lesser charge (such as manslaughter) were NOT unnecessary or uncalled for!

Fisky, you have to apply Romney’s claim that Zimmerman’s actions were “unnecessary, uncalled for, and inexplicable” to what was known about this particularly circumstance, not to some unknown general set of circumstances, which is what you’re doing in order to keep the dream of manslaughter alive.

Secondly, I am not privy to the full range of evidence of the case and I have no idea what ALL the different possibilities are relating to Zimmerman’s actions.

You don’t need to be, you simply have to apply what Romney gleamed from the media in order to understand what he could have meant by describing Zimmerman’s actions as “unnecessary, uncalled for, and inexplicable”. Hint, it wasn’t manslaughter.

dover_beach

7 Apr 12 at 7:08 pm
Fisky, you have to apply Romney’s claim that Zimmerman’s actions were “unnecessary, uncalled for, and inexplicable” to what was known about this particularly circumstance, not to some unknown general set of circumstances, which is what you’re doing in order to keep the dream of manslaughter alive.

No, all I am simply pointing to the fact that one department wanted to charge him with manslaughter. I have no idea what they based this on, but they certainly are more credible than anonymous internet trolls.

You don’t need to be, you simply have to apply what Romney gleamed from the media in order to understand what he could have meant by describing Zimmerman’s actions as “unnecessary, uncalled for, and inexplicable”. Hint, it wasn’t manslaughter.

The “media” means any news network, newspaper, website (out of perhaps millions) that has discussed the case, and that would be available to Romney. In order to prove the contention you are trying to defend, you would have to show that Romney did NOT access any information or evidence that raised the possibility of a charge of manslaughter in Romney’s mind.

As you obviously have no hope of doing this, you are therefore unable to show that Romney “logically” accused Zimmerman of murder.

Fisky

7 Apr 12 at 7:22 pm
Were Zimmerman’s actions reckless? Did he discharge his fireman recklessly?

No, that’s why he wasn’t charged and is a free man to this day.

Case closed.

Romney disagreed. He echoed the Black Panthers, Obama, Holder, Spike Lee, Jackson, Sharpton and the grievance media in concluding the angry white Hispanic of the New York Times’ imagination was actually a wilful killer.

Romney is an idiot – with a track record of flip-flopping and moral malleability as long as your arm.

C.L.

7 Apr 12 at 7:28 pm
And just wait! He’ll be the nominee of the party you support!!

Fisky

7 Apr 12 at 7:30 pm
Thank you for that link Token, what wonderful news. I hope
Zimmerman

Fisky

7 Apr 12 at 7:39 pm
…gets them for defo

Fisky

7 Apr 12 at 7:40 pm
Not biting, Kel. Too much evidence that you really are JC’s identified trannie, who loses it completely from time to time.

Tell us you are or are not. Go on, don’t leave it hanging in the air (if you still have it). Where did you come from, and who are you, if not just an avatar of gender-confused stupidity swinging left?

Other please note: Hairy Ape ™ to Lizzie.

Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

7 Apr 12 at 8:15 pm
- others (i.e not Kel who should be ignored).

Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

7 Apr 12 at 8:18 pm
hey Lizzie!

Rabz

7 Apr 12 at 8:28 pm
Bleep – digging Mel McLaughlin…

Rabz

7 Apr 12 at 8:32 pm
Is it any coincidence that Kelly’s rants align with full moons?

Either that or his Ritalin script ran out a few days ago.

Splatacrobat

7 Apr 12 at 8:36 pm
Thriller between Perth and Wellingtoni – 2 each, extra time to follow…

Rabz

7 Apr 12 at 9:29 pm
Rabz, that’s not a thriller, dear boy. Now, THIS a Thriller.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hG6oy46qKE4

Peter Patton

7 Apr 12 at 9:35 pm
Abbott for his boorish dissing of Margaret Whitlam’s life partner

Balls. He was neither disrespectful nor boorish.

Boorish would have been to call Whitlam’s government “a clusterfuck until recently uneclipsed in the entire history of Australian fuckupery.” Accurate but boorish.

By the way, KOK, are you still pretending to be nice, sensible, a mite sharpish but very sophisticated and also female? Because your periodic, volcanic meltdowns into bizarre and sometimes incoherent and quite misogynistic crudeness suggest this internet false-face game is not for you.

wreckage

7 Apr 12 at 9:35 pm
Phil is bipolar, wreckage.

squawkbox

7 Apr 12 at 9:38 pm
Abbott for his boorish dissing of Margaret Whitlam’s life partner

He was neither boorish nor was he ‘dissing’ (yo whad up homes) and i belive the term you are looking for is husband.

Carpe Jugulum

7 Apr 12 at 9:40 pm
Nice summary of how NBC, ABC & CNN have targeted a private citizen to save an inept Democrat president.

What Dan Rather and his cabal of left-wing media hit-men (and women) did eight years ago was serious, but not unprecedented. Every day of the week our corrupt media tells lies of commission and omission in order to damage Republicans and aid Democrats. What was different about Rathergate, though, is that the stakes were enormous. Dan Rather’s phony documents not only could have made the difference between Bush being re-elected or not (which was probably the idea), but CBS was caught red-handed. When a major network attempts to bluff a sitting president out of office, the story is impossible to ignore and the fallout inevitable.

While it might be a sexier story, that doesn’t mean, though, that Rathergate is a greater media sin than what’s become known as Editgate — which is shorthand for the duplicity and malicious behavior we’ve seen these past few weeks from ABC, NBC, and CNN with respect to the racially-charged story of George Zimmerman allegedly shooting 17-year-old Trayvon Marti

It looks like these ghouls won’t get it until someone dies from their lies.

Token

7 Apr 12 at 9:42 pm
Iz I bleck enuff fo ya?

Rabz

7 Apr 12 at 9:43 pm
Is that Anita Heiss?

Peter Patton

7 Apr 12 at 9:45 pm
I must disagree, wreckage.

I’m sure there are two ‘p’s in fuckuppery.

kae

7 Apr 12 at 9:49 pm
One of Anita Heiss’ early snaps taken at a corroboree.

http://images.allmoviephoto.com/2002_Ali_G_Indahouse:_The_Movie/2002_ali_g_indahouse_wallp_001.jpg

Peter Patton

7 Apr 12 at 9:50 pm
anita heiss is a vile, racist censorious bigot.

And no, she ain’t bleck enuff.

Rabz

7 Apr 12 at 9:56 pm
PP,

Linky no worky!

Rabz

7 Apr 12 at 9:57 pm
Hi Rabz, your link just made me laugh out loud.

Yep, Carpe Jugulum, the correct term is husband. Took The Ape a while but I am now an honest woman for the second time: a ‘trophy wife’ even, as some jealous woman called me. Woo hoo.

Isn’t Easter great? Four days off, and I am feeling happy and bouncy. Doing a lot of cleaning and packing, quite good to see the floor shine again. Always good to be bouncy. Happy Easter, all.

Peter Patton, I love it when you say ‘dear boy’. So Oscar. Such fun. Listening to Brubeck, “Take Five”. Your generation? Excellent stuff.

Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

7 Apr 12 at 9:57 pm
Anita Heiss’ hubris is just another nail in the coffin of the Aboriginal Industry. Australians are very reasonable people, but can spot a con a mile away, and they no rikey rikey.

Peter Patton

7 Apr 12 at 10:02 pm
Love Dave, Lizzie. Also George.

Gab

7 Apr 12 at 10:05 pm
OMG. They’re letting off fireworks over Sydney Harbour AGAIN. Aaaarrrrggghhhhh!!!

Peter Patton

7 Apr 12 at 10:09 pm
Perspective…

Bill Ayers and Bernadette Dohrn, who escaped prison for their post-Vietnam War terrorism, complained that American military personnel get to board the airplanes before they do.

Token

7 Apr 12 at 10:11 pm
Yep, can see them. They go off all the time, somewhere down over the Potts Point ridge. They burst up high enough for all to see them, and we can hear the boom, boom.

We are leaving Sydney for a while. I will miss them.

Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

7 Apr 12 at 10:12 pm
Fisky I think Zimmerman will be getting a nice payday if he survives this circus of hate:

No. 5, both ABC and NBC doctored tapes to incriminate Zimmerman. Considering NBC had to shell out $500,000 to Richard Jewell for its part in framing him, one would think the network learned its lesson.

Token

7 Apr 12 at 10:14 pm
Token, this comment about Ayers and Dohrn says it very eloquently:

whinyass punk commie….

Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

7 Apr 12 at 10:23 pm
Obama’s Forum on Women and the Economy: Turns out it was a campaign stunt.

The event coincided with the release of a White House report titled Keeping America’s Women Moving Forward, 70 pages of 2012 campaigning wrapped in administration policyspeak. It broke down how many women received Pell grants, thanks to the president; how much compensation has been obtained for victims of gender-based wage discrimination since January 2010, thanks to his administration; how many women on Medicare got improved prescription drug coverage, etc.

“The Payroll tax cut provided an average of $1,000 of tax relief for nearly 75 million women,” states the report. “…President Obama has committed to protecting Social Security for an estimated 30 million women beneficiaries.”

Does Obama steal Gillard’s lameass slogans or the other way around?

Gab

7 Apr 12 at 10:36 pm
I should run, on the dooble…

Rabz

7 Apr 12 at 11:04 pm
No, all I am simply pointing to the fact that one department wanted to charge him with manslaughter.

Would this be the department that finally judged that Zimmerman could not be convicted of manslaughter?

The “media” means any news network, newspaper, website (out of perhaps millions) that has discussed the case, and that would be available to Romney. In order to prove the contention you are trying to defend, you would have to show that Romney did NOT access any information or evidence that raised the possibility of a charge of manslaughter in Romney’s mind.

Not at all. Why would I need to prove a negative? You’re than one proposing that Romney was accusing Zimmerman of manslaughter. All I need to do is refer to media coverage at about the time of Romney’s statement.

dover_beach

7 Apr 12 at 11:13 pm
Keeping America’s Women Moving Forward

Hard to do when the country is standing still or going backwards. Similarly in Oz.

Moving forward – another of Labor’s lame slogan lies.

Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

7 Apr 12 at 11:17 pm
Moving forward – another of Labor’s lame slogan lies.

Do they have any slogans that ain’t lies?

Rabz

7 Apr 12 at 11:24 pm
Rabz – once I was young and free in Jamaica, and I also dyed my hair black (am a natural blonde) and danced around a bit. So I like this clip from Eliza Doolitle (Pack Up) for when I feel bouncy and it has a great steel band and very hip guys too. They do know how to party over there.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dzY0-I4Gq5w

Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

7 Apr 12 at 11:35 pm
Ooh, Lizzie, are you really Marianne Faithful, you little minx, you?

Peter Patton

7 Apr 12 at 11:41 pm
Thanks Token. But just to highlight it again. NBC has fired the journo responsible for the disgusting and false slur against Zimmerman.

Now, will the ABC live up to the same standards of responsibility?

(Ooops, dodging pig pooh from on high..)

On second thoughts: give that man a job in Gillard’s office.

Lazlo

7 Apr 12 at 11:41 pm
Rescued dogs are pretty fly.

86 year old gymnast, Johanna Quaas. Eightyfreakinsix!

lol Randall (of Badass Honey Badger fame) on the Stiffy Goats.

Gab

7 Apr 12 at 11:52 pm
Marianne? Have you seen her lately? Well, she has had a hard time on the horse, so explains all.

I am not a wrinkled up one yet, just not nineteen anymore, when I was full of bloom and extra bounce, not unlike Eliza. No hard drugs either, but I did two acid trips, one soulful and full of the love of humankind, the other like being inside a mix between a Kandinsky painting and an Escher etching. Angles all bleak and wrong and scary. Not nice. Won’t ever do it again. Didn’t smoke either, which was and still is a blessing. Had to munch the hash or try to inhale. O glory days.

Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

7 Apr 12 at 11:57 pm
Yaaaiiirsss, I’m afraid my trip experiences have been pretty much exclusively of your second kind. I was not a repeat buyer.

Peter Patton

7 Apr 12 at 11:59 pm
Mmmm Mars Bars..

Lazlo

8 Apr 12 at 12:01 am
Anyways, Happy Easter y’all. While I think all choppers are bastards, I’m mad about the Jesus dude.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvVr2uks0C8

Peter Patton

8 Apr 12 at 12:03 am
While I think all choppers are bastards,

What’s a helicopter ever done to you?

Gab

8 Apr 12 at 12:09 am
Sweet Ape says I am still full of bloom and bounce! Puts it down to my gym and jazz dancing and good English complexion – as King Kong he goes for the fragile blonde Fay Wray look. This is a song I regularly do a little routine to and it always cheers me up:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&v=oud4oMWqfLY&NR=1

Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

8 Apr 12 at 12:13 am
Now Lizzie, this merging of Jesus, the Church, and sauciness is MY kind of prayer!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cSVbwwsLPqw

Peter Patton

8 Apr 12 at 12:20 am
All the iconography, as only Madonna can do it. She always gets away with it. And gets off with it.

Signing off for tonight now.

Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

8 Apr 12 at 12:43 am
Lizzie, I’d forgotten about that film clip until tonight. FMD, did she nail it, or what!

Peter Patton

8 Apr 12 at 12:46 am
Hey Gab, before I go, that 86 year old gymnast was extraordinary. The dogs and the stiffy goats good too. Gotta just love late nites on the Cat.

Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

8 Apr 12 at 12:49 am
Oh how I hate Madonna. Is she dead yet? I’d hate to speak ill of the dead.

wreckage

8 Apr 12 at 1:03 am
Especially today wreckage!

Peter Patton

8 Apr 12 at 1:05 am
Peter, a couple of things…

First, your anti-Catholicism is obsessive and somewhat ostentatious. Along with your professed love for Hall & Oates and Bruce Springsteen, I suspect it dates back to when you cool – like about 1981.

Second, calling Catholics “rock choppers” is not offensive. It’s regarded by Australian Catholics the way the Rats of Tobruks regard their sobriquet. That is to say, fondly.

Stop embarrassing yourself.

C.L.

8 Apr 12 at 1:56 am
Humanae vitae was right (#1,9020,9373):

Germany set to tax the young.

GERMANY is proposing to levy extra taxes on the young to pay for the costs of the country’s growing numbers of old people, under government plans for a ”demographic reserve” levy.

Angela Merkel’s Christian Democrats have drafted proposals that, if law, would require all those over 25 to pay a proportion of their income to cushion Germany against a looming population crisis.

The German Chancellor’s ruling party is seeking extra sources of revenue to pay for soaring pensions and bills for social care costs as Germany’s ”baby boomer” generation ages amid a decline in the birth rate.

The proposals, to be adopted by Dr Merkel’s party cabinet after the Easter break, have not yet set a figure on the age tax but officials are considering a special levy of about 1 per cent of income.

Because of a slump in Germany’s population, as more ageing Germans retire there are fewer young workers to replace them as taxpayers to fund generous welfare and pension arrangements.

C.L.

8 Apr 12 at 1:59 am
More bad news for the grievance media, the Black Panthers, Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson, Barack Obama, Spike Lee and Mitt Romney:

George Zimmerman Passed Lie Detector Test Immediately After Shooting.

C.L.

8 Apr 12 at 2:03 am
Predictably, the gay lobby pounces on Christine Forster story:

The national convenor of Australian Marriage Equality, Alex Greenwich, said advocacy from loved ones was the most effective way of changing hearts and minds.

”It is clear Ms Forster supports same-sex marriage,” he said.

”She says as much. Ms Forster proves this issue is about family, love equality and not politics. It gives us hope that there is someone at the Abbott dinner table putting the case forward for same-sex marriage.”

Ms Forster’s coming out proves nothing of the sort.

Kevin Rudd’s sister came out of the closet as a trenchant foe of gay ‘marriage’.

C.L.

8 Apr 12 at 2:24 am
Anybody who likes the irredeemably untalented Springsteen AND the ineffably lame Hall and Oates must be a fag.

Not that there’s anything wrong with that. But it is important to acknowledge your musical tastes are deeply, deeply unfashionable and possibly retarded, Peter. If you don’t, then you have no chance of self improvement.

Abu Chowdah

8 Apr 12 at 3:29 am
I note that Heiss identifies herself as a membr of the Wiradjuri nation.

The what? A ragtag band of migratory tribes does not a nation make. The fact that the Australian government has for the last 40 years pandered to this cultural relativism is what has empowered minority interest groups whose objectives run counter to society at large. Like small children, the multitudes of gay, lesbian, transgendered, indigenous, religious, environmental and cultural self-interest groups need to be set clear limits.

Don’t touch that, dear, that belongs to the grown ups. Don’t make things up, darling, no one likes people who tell fibs. Don’t chew wit your mouth open, dear, it’s very common and uncouth.

No, there were no aboriginal ‘nations’. Not even one. There was no civilisation, no industry, no trade, no academia, no philosophy beyond crude creation myths. Stop empowering people to re-write the FACTS.

Abu Chowdah

8 Apr 12 at 3:36 am
Oh, good grief.

NO, heavily armed bands of Neo-Nazis have NOT occupied Sanford, Florida.

STOP LYING, YOU STUPID LYING MEDIA!

sdog

8 Apr 12 at 5:08 am
Somewtimes they tell the truth which then explains why they must lie:

Sen. Dick Durbin reacts to the tornadoes in Dallas, Texas earlier this week. Durbin calls for more laws regulating carbon output while he sends a dire warning that we must convert to hybrid cars or lose our life. Durbin says we must spend money now to fix the problem.

“It’s your money or your life,” he said a press conference. “We are either going to dedicate ourselves to a cleaner, more livable planet and accept the initial investment necessary or we’re going to pay a heavier price in terms of loss of human life, damage and costs associated with it.”

JamesK

8 Apr 12 at 7:41 am
Free speech icon Terry Jones is back in the news:

Pastor Terry Jones Calls Mohammad a “Liar, Pedophile & False Prophet” at Dearborn Protest.

True.

“I’m asking the imam of the Islamic Center here in Dearborn to work with me to free Minister Youcef,” said Jones, of Youcef Nadarkhani, currently facing death for preaching Christianity in Iran.

“If he isn’t freed, I will ask the world to burn the Koran in protest starting at 5 p.m. on April 28th in Gainesville, Fla.”

At least 30 of Jones’ supporters — some of them openly carrying weapons on their belts as did Jones — shouted an occasional “amen” or “preach it” as Jones spoke.

The controversial pastor denied accusations that he is a racist.

“Not true,” he said. “Islam is a religion, not a race. I am not a racist.”

C.L.

8 Apr 12 at 11:00 am
We must burn the Koran at once.

Fisky

8 Apr 12 at 11:04 am
Stunning:

CASH bonuses for families of up to $100 per child and $250 for pensioners will be deposited into bank accounts within weeks as the Gillard Government fights a public backlash over its carbon tax.

But taxpayers will be forced to pick up the tab for a public education campaign, with a multi-million dollar advertising blitz planned.

C.L.

8 Apr 12 at 11:06 am
Speaking of free speech, a must read state of play from Bunyip.

C.L.

8 Apr 12 at 11:15 am
No mention of the John Derbyshire racism kerfuffle over here? It was a dog vuvuzela, surely you lot would have heard it. Hmm.

m0nty

8 Apr 12 at 11:36 am
It was a dog vuvuzela,

This is why i tell my kids – Don’t smoke crack.

Carpe Jugulum

8 Apr 12 at 11:38 am
Interesting M0nty, so the Natonal Review named the person it sacked.

So when with NBC actually man up and do the same & name who tried to stir up racial hatred? When will ABC (US) and CNN follow the minded and appropriate satandard of TNRO & sack their lying clip editing race baiting staff?

Token

8 Apr 12 at 11:51 am
Thta’s sad. Derbyshire is a good writer.

Infidel Tiger

8 Apr 12 at 11:53 am
No mention of the John Derbyshire racism kerfuffle over here? It was a dog vuvuzela, surely you lot would have heard it. Hmm.

What did you think of the article and the subsequent repercussions faced by author, monty?

Gab

8 Apr 12 at 12:04 pm
No, I hadn’t heard about that. I was too busy wondering when a sitting government might be sacked for inciting race riots to care about an obscure magazine columnist.

Fisky

8 Apr 12 at 12:04 pm
I just had a very quick skim of the article. The most striking thing about it is that most of Derbyshire’s advice is already followed by the chattering classes, just that they don’t openly say so. If you took out a couple of the misanthropic points in there (such as not stopping to help a black person who is in bother), then it would be interesting to see how many of his critics, despite their denunciations, actually agree with him in their actions. I would bet the answer is, “nearly all of them”.

Fisky

8 Apr 12 at 12:11 pm
Was Derbyshire echoing Jesse Jackson?

The Reverend Jesse Jackson was walking alone at night in Washington DC. He heard footsteps behind him and was afraid he was about to be mugged—which is a common occurrence in Washington, especially at night, and especially when you are alone on a street. The Reverend turned around and saw a white man. Immediately he felt relief that he was not going to be assaulted. Then he felt shame because he had just stereotyped kindred black men. He understood during that split second of observation, that he had assumed the worst of his own race…

Duke, Lynn, “Confronting Violence: African American Conferees Look Inward,” Washington Post, January 8, 1994.

C.L.

8 Apr 12 at 12:12 pm
Jesse Jackson crosses the street when he sees black youths approaching.

Infidel Tiger

8 Apr 12 at 12:13 pm
In the UK Daily Mail:
Gravy-wrestling model suffers horrific facial injuries after being hit with monkey wrench when she interrupted a friend having sex.

C.L.

8 Apr 12 at 12:17 pm
Leaving aside the stuff he writes about group differences, here is Derbyshire’s substantive advice:

(10a) Avoid concentrations of blacks not all known to you personally.

(10b) Stay out of heavily black neighborhoods.

(10c) If planning a trip to a beach or amusement park at some date, find out whether it is likely to be swamped with blacks on that date (neglect of that one got me the closest I have ever gotten to death by gunshot).

(10d) Do not attend events likely to draw a lot of blacks.

(10e) If you are at some public event at which the number of blacks suddenly swells, leave as quickly as possible.

(10f) Do not settle in a district or municipality run by black politicians.

(10g) Before voting for a black politician, scrutinize his/her character much more carefully than you would a white.

(10h) Do not act the Good Samaritan to blacks in apparent distress, e.g., on the highway.

(10i) If accosted by a strange black in the street, smile and say something polite but keep moving.

Points c and g are difficult to prove, and h is pretty awful. But every other point on that list is already followed by white Leftists.

Fisky

8 Apr 12 at 12:21 pm
I nearly missed one:

(13) In that pool of forty million, there are nonetheless many intelligent and well-socialized blacks. (I’ll use IWSB as an ad hoc abbreviation.) You should consciously seek opportunities to make friends with IWSBs. In addition to the ordinary pleasures of friendship, you will gain an amulet against potentially career-destroying accusations of prejudice.

This is undeniable. Every liberal already follows this advice.

Seeing as the Left already agree with most of Derbyshire’s article, why are they denouncing him?

Fisky

8 Apr 12 at 12:23 pm
Ahoy, Spot:

PUDSY!

Simon Cowell finally sees the dog act he’s hoped for on Britain’s Got Talent.

C.L.

8 Apr 12 at 12:24 pm
This is undeniable. Every liberal already follows this advice.

Indeed.

Liberals like the US Democrat Party, for example.

Harry Reid spilled the beans on why Obama was acceptable to the party hierarchy. It was because he was a “light-skinned negro” who didn’t speak like a gang-banger.

C.L.

8 Apr 12 at 12:31 pm
Strange how Derbyshire could form such a view…

Former Washington, D.C. Mayor Marion Barry, after winning his primary on Tuesday for city council in Ward 8, ranted against Asian small business owners in the District and said, “they ought to go.”

“We got to do something about these Asians coming in and opening up businesses and dirty shops,” Barry said in remarks that were captured by a local television station. “They ought to go … and we need African-Americans to take their place.”

Token

8 Apr 12 at 12:34 pm
We got to do something about these Asians coming in and opening up businesses and dirty shops…

Asian business-owners have never been forgiven by the black grievance movement for what they did during the LA riots.

C.L.

8 Apr 12 at 12:42 pm
Every liberal already follows this advice.

Seeing as the Left already agree with most of Derbyshire’s article, why are they denouncing him?

Do you think perhaps Derbyshire knows this and was driving home that segregation – even that which is self-imposed out of fear – is alive and well, albeit reversed, in the US today?

Gab

8 Apr 12 at 12:47 pm
CL

Along with your professed love for Hall & Oates and Bruce Springsteen, I suspect it dates back to when you cool – like about 1981.

A couple of things…My ‘professed love for Hall & Oates’? ROFLMAO. They were as abominable as Justin Bieber is today. You really do just make stuff up don’t you? Best you pop in to confession for this ongoing habit you have acquired.

I have mentioned Bruce Springsteen about once in the context of live concerts. My first Springsteen concert was in 1988. I have never been ‘cool’.

Peter Patton

8 Apr 12 at 12:50 pm
charged with “extending his tongue”

In what meaningful way are ‘Judge’ Finkelstein and the Australian left different to the Palestinian Authority?

C.L.

8 Apr 12 at 12:50 pm
This is the view of one of the teachers who tried to enter a meeting discussing school choice (i.e. private schools):

“If charter schools were so good, why didn’t the white folks keep them for themselves?”

I’m sure you don’t need to watch the clip to see that she is not a white Hispanic.

(She does get warned at the beginning of the clip the person is filming, so this is no ambush)

Token

8 Apr 12 at 1:03 pm
Apologies if I misunderstood some reference or other you made to Hall & Oates, Peter. After the Springsteen reference, anything seemed possible, bad taste-wise.

And no, I don’t make anything up. You really are and your ABC luvvie behaviour especially crafted for Easter has proved it once again.

I have never been ‘cool’

.

I don’t doubt it.

C.L.

8 Apr 12 at 1:05 pm
Erratum: You really are an idiot.

C.L.

8 Apr 12 at 1:07 pm
Gravy-wrestling model suffers horrific facial injuries after being hit with monkey wrench when she interrupted a friend having sex.

If that article was satire, it would be a work of art.

Token

8 Apr 12 at 1:12 pm
Jealousy:

An Australian who disrupted England’s iconic Oxford-Cambridge boat race has been bailed and charged with a public disorder offence.

Trenton Oldfield will face the Feltham Magistrates’ Court on April 23, charged under section five of the public order act…

The 35-year-old Australian activist gave a warning of his protest online, which was titled “elitismleadstotyranny“.

It is believed Oldfield studied contemporary urbanism at the London School of Economics.

Australian protest swimmer wrecks Oxbridge boat race.

C.L.

8 Apr 12 at 2:08 pm
Shocking story video via InstaPundit:

BALTIMORE (WJZ)– Caught on camera – a tourist being beaten in downtown Baltimore and instead of helping him, a crowd laughs and steals his belongings.

The video shows a man being punched in the face in Downtown Baltimore. You can hear his head hit the pavement near the entrance to Courthouse East.

Instead of helping, people laugh.

Then, the crowd strips him naked and takes his car keys, watch, money and iPhone.

By “people” and “crowd,” they mean a gang of black males.

Oh yeah – the victim was white. So it’s all cool with Obama.

C.L.

8 Apr 12 at 2:43 pm
Hellloooooooooo…..

Rabz

8 Apr 12 at 6:55 pm
Roar march onwards – second successive Premiership looms.

Rabz

8 Apr 12 at 7:03 pm
This was a real hate crime, media response? Cover, divert, deny.

Big dumb fu

8 Apr 12 at 7:30 pm
A couple of things…My ‘professed love for Hall & Oates’? ROFLMAO. They were as abominable as Justin Bieber is today.

Methinks the lady doth protest too much.

Abu Chowdah

8 Apr 12 at 8:03 pm
Does this sound familiar?

For the fourth time, the president has proposed limiting charitable deductions. The proposal has received little notice from the mainstream press, though the nonprofit world continues to object. (See Charitable Deduction Central, provided by the Alliance for Charitable Reform.)

Michael Barone, Washington wiseman and co-author of The Almanac of American Politics, sees a connection between the desire to cut into charitable giving and another presidential desire, namely, raising taxes:

“The clearly intended result would be a massive transfer of money from the voluntary sector of society into government.”

Fewer citizens’ dollars would flow into either private charities or private investments. Instead, the central government would pick and choose who receives those dollars and for what purposes.

Token

8 Apr 12 at 8:05 pm
Barone warns that

Alexis de Tocqueville in the 1830s identified the voluntary sector as a unique feature of American democracy, one that gave it strength and character. He compared it positively with his own France, where centralized government stifled initiative and innovation.

The country must now choose between those who want “to make this country more like Tocqueville’s France,” and those “who want to keep it more like Tocqueville’s America.”

Tocqueville famously praised our nation in Democracy in America. Less often read are his criticisms of his beloved France, both before and after its bloody Revolution. In The Old Regime and the Revolution, Tocqueville described how a ravenous central government drained the life from civil society and suffocated the charitable impulse:

The government of the old regime had already taken away from the French any possibility, or desire, of helping one another. When the Revolution happened, one would have searched most of France in vain for ten men who had the habit of acting in common…

Token

8 Apr 12 at 8:08 pm
Oldfield studied contemporary urbanism

That sounds like a useful course of study……..not

Carpe Jugulum

8 Apr 12 at 8:18 pm
I see the (probably) Japanense are joining the fray at the Random House blog with Ms Heiss;

i have read the judgement by Mordy J, and all it did was enforce a right not to be potentially offended. You also failed to mention one of the litigants is a convicted rapist and alleged fraudster, my how Mr Bolts comments must have ‘potentially offended’ a self identifier such as this

As a side note, as an Australian with a Japanese wife you cannot self identify as Japanese, you are either a citizen or not, there is no middle ground. Persons with dual citizenship must choose their nationality by their 22nd birthday.

Carpe Jugulum

8 Apr 12 at 8:36 pm
Oh yeah – the victim was white. So it’s all cool with Obama.

Social justice! In the inverted world of the leftoid, social justice trumps natural justice every day.

Irving J

8 Apr 12 at 9:18 pm
A nice bloggy club sandwich from James Delingpole

with links amongst others to Richard North and Christopher Booker,

offering clues as to why the British political class will implement the most contentious legislation, with not a hat tip to the fact that their Sir Humphries are pressing the implementation of EU directives from the unelected, undemocratic technocrats in Brussels as the underlying reason.

One to keep in mind as folk like Bob Brown press their agenda for supra-national governing bodies.

Myrddin Seren

8 Apr 12 at 9:19 pm
Of course Obama wants to destroy the private charity sector. He’s a communist. He also hates Christian hospitals and orphanages for the same reason. He regards private charity and privately provided succour of any kind as an affront to the State.

C.L.

8 Apr 12 at 9:21 pm
Tim Blair’s Tatra link got me truck YouTubing.

Man, they do know how to build a truck in Eastern Europe. And their drivers push ‘em to the limit.

C.L.

8 Apr 12 at 9:23 pm
How he got in that closet

Token

8 Apr 12 at 9:24 pm
Random house must be so ecstatic to have bloggers still going strong on the Heisse link. Wonder if anyone will read that book.

Daisy

8 Apr 12 at 9:26 pm
Yo no-limit-niga how many time yo mama tell ya, when yo out for sum suga, don’t be no messing wit no heat packing puta madre chicos?

Irving J

8 Apr 12 at 9:33 pm
I’ll need support against the Keynesian scam-artists trying to pull the wool over the publics eyes. Because the employed economists are in a position that their low morals, or their employment prospects, will force them to come to the lying filth sdfc’s aid one way or the other.

I don’t know how it is that this scam can keep going decade in decade out. But if all of you can get a handle on this scam, we may be able to get to a stage wherein the economists working in the field can no longer play along with it and keep a straight face.

I need your help. And do not underestimate the surpassing importance of this. Our most important ally has been destroyed on Keynesian lies. Millions of children starve daily being as Keynesian lies are all they have to eat.

Deficit spending cannot support total business revenues or else WHERE IS THE MONEY COMING FROM?

Ghost Of Midyear Christmas Past

8 Apr 12 at 10:32 pm
I’ve been a little lax today. A very Happy Easter to those celebrating today.

dover_beach

8 Apr 12 at 10:44 pm
and don’t think it didn’t go unnoticed either, Dover

Gab

8 Apr 12 at 10:47 pm
Happy Easter, Dover and Gab – at alia.

C.L.

8 Apr 12 at 10:49 pm
You too, cheesy Sao man, and Dover.

Hugs and kisses

Gab

8 Apr 12 at 10:51 pm
Erratum: et alia

Gab

8 Apr 12 at 10:52 pm
America the police state.

Glenn Reynolds (!) posts this link on “Proper Etiquette for When You’re Under Arrest.” It’s all about how you can avoid ‘making’ police seek their revenge on you for not being ‘respectful.’

If you have your identification with you (and you should, you’re an adult)…

Say what? You now have to carry papers in the USA?

They have a fetish for uniforms in America that’s positively Hermann Göring-like.

C.L.

8 Apr 12 at 10:57 pm
Spooky. I am just reading that, CL.

Gab

8 Apr 12 at 11:00 pm
If you have your identification with you (and you should, you’re an adult)

Only if you’re driving or buying smokes.

PS: NEVER TALK TO THE POLICE.

wreckage

8 Apr 12 at 11:27 pm
Never talk to the police.

I got it from a comment or blog here IIRC; it’s well worth watching. Funny stuff.

wreckage

8 Apr 12 at 11:29 pm
From way back in 2006, before Australia learned what Labor had become since it was last in power a decade before came this warning:

The confessed factional warrior of 32 years, who rarely speaks publicly, singled out his factional successor in Victoria, senator Stephen Conroy, and his left-wing counterpart, senator Kim Carr, as “factional Daleks”.

“The final trend is what I call the Stasi element. A whole production line of soulless apparatchiks has emerged: highly proficient and professional, but with no Labor soul; control freaks with tunnel vision; ruthless leakers in their self-interest; individuals who would rather the party lose an election than that they lose their place in the pecking order,” Senator Ray said.

Is it one of those things that you don’t undertand it until you’ve experienced it?

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/nation/factional-daleks-sabotaging-labor/story-e6frg6nf-1111112244420

twostix

9 Apr 12 at 12:23 am
I wonder why they need neighborhood watchmen in Florida. Mmm…

Florida police pose as giant bunnies to catch drivers not wearing seatbelts.

I love the comments on these American stories.

They’re still outraged by the fascist Nanny State in a way Australians no longer are.

C.L.

9 Apr 12 at 12:46 am
Finally! After literally months of searching, distorting and fabricating, the Media have found their White Defendants. I bet they are relieved (assuming they aren’t lying again)!

TULSA, Okla.— Police backed by a helicopter arrested two white men early Sunday and said they would face murder charges in the recent shootings that terrorized Tulsa’s black community and left three people dead and two others critically wounded.

Police spokesman Jason Willingham said the two men were arrested at a home just north of Tulsa about 2 a.m. Sunday and were expected to be charged with three counts of first-degree murder and two counts of shooting with intent to kill in the spate of shootings early Friday. He said police made the arrests after receiving an anonymous tip.

While police identified the men as white and all the victims are black, authorities have not described the shootings as racially motivated and declined to discuss that issue Sunday.

In case you didn’t read it in the first three paragraphs of the article, the KILLERS ARE WHITE and the VICTIMS ARE BLACK (phew!! it had to happen eventually!).

Fisky

9 Apr 12 at 1:20 am
Religious people are more likely to be leftwing, says thinktank Demos

Research undermines commonly held view that faith group members are more conservative

“We don’t do God,” Alastair Campbell famously insisted when journalists pressed the former prime minister, Tony Blair, on matters of faith.

But it appears that New Labour’s high command missed a trick by declining to talk up their religious convictions, for new research suggests they would have been preaching to the converted: people with faith are far more likely to take left-of-centre positions on a range of issues, including immigration and equality.

The research, revealed in a new report by the thinktank Demos, undermines the widely held view that members of religious groups are more likely to have conservative tendencies.

Its findings are exciting the interest of senior Labour politicians, who believe that attracting the faith vote will be crucial to the party’s fortunes.

The Faithful Citizens report also has implications for the aspiration of prime minister David Cameron for a “big society”. It finds that people who identify with a faith are more likely to volunteer, be politically engaged and to become active citizens in their neighbourhoods.

Prominent left-of-centre figures who have strong religious beliefs, like the comedian Frank Skinner, who has spoken out in favour of higher taxes and is a committed Roman Catholic, are rare.

But the Demos report suggests that the example of the outgoing archbishop of Canterbury, who combines deeply held progressive beliefs with his religious convictions, is not unusual.

“Rowan Williams may be far more representative of the religious community than many have suggested,” said Jonathan Birdwell, the author of the report. “Progressives should sit up and take note. Their natural allies may look more like the archbishop of Canterbury than Richard Dawkins.”

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/apr/08/religious-people-more-likely-leftwing-demos

Peter Patton

9 Apr 12 at 1:45 am
Jim Hoft has more on the white trash shooters in Tulsa story. Turns out it was what the media would otherwise describe as a ‘tragic cycle of violence.’

North Tulsa Shooting Suspect Arrested Two Years After Father’s Murder.

On Sunday, 19-year-old Jake England was arrested for murders committed on Good Friday, April 6…

Pernell Jefferson was arrested in Carl England’s death on April 7, 2010. He is currently incarcerated at William S. Key Correctional Center, Fort Supply but on charges of drug and firearm possession.

Pernell – a drug dealer and burglar – got off on a charge of “pointing a firearm” and successfully had his sentence suspended. Oddly, Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson didn’t call for a murder arrest. But perhaps there’s a reason for that.

C.L.

9 Apr 12 at 1:57 am
But the Demos report suggests that the example of the outgoing archbishop of Canterbury, who combines deeply held progressive beliefs with his religious convictions, is not unusual.

The former ‘archbishop’ of Canterbury’s progressive beliefs were not combined with religious convictions. They were his only religious convictions.

And I’m not sure where the report’s authors got the bizarre idea that it’s a “commonly held view that faith group members are more conservative.”

Yes, Prime Minister famously mocked the Church of England as a club for well-meaning atheists and clubbable lefty toffs more than 20 years ago.

C.L.

9 Apr 12 at 2:03 am
Ooo-la-la. The most beautiful Easter photograph I saw this year.

————————————————

Meanwhile: today in Islam…

At Least 50 Christians Murdered by Car Bomber at Easter Mass.

C.L.

9 Apr 12 at 2:18 am
No no, that wasn’t Islam that blew up the church. It was caused by “local conflict”. Other areas with similar “local conflicts” include Egypt, Sudan, Iraq, Pakistan, Indonesia, South Thailand…

Fisky

9 Apr 12 at 2:57 am
in other Easter News, the Baptist pope is expected to draw over 30,000 to his own Easter address

Yobbo

9 Apr 12 at 3:02 am
What a selfish, insignificant bastard that Australian is who disrupted the rowing in the UK today. Fucking arsehole. Sould strip him of his citizenship.

Abu Chowdah

9 Apr 12 at 4:02 am
@abu, agreed

Cory Olsen

9 Apr 12 at 6:36 am
Abu

A news report said that he was nearly decapitated by the rowers. Didn’t look so severe to me, but he should have got a good slap upside the head with the oars before they stopped.

Guess they were concerned about the oars being damaged.

And he’s an alumnus* of LSE!

*hope that’s correct.

kae

9 Apr 12 at 7:39 am
Mark Steyn, NRO: Our Contemptuous President

Obama can’t be bothered with checks and balances.

Headlines in which the executive “warns” the courts are usually the province of places like Balochistan, where powerful cabinet ministers are currently fuming at the chief justice’s determination to stop them kidnapping citizens and holding them for ransom — literally, that is, not merely figuratively, as in America. But, here as there, when Obama “warns” the Supreme Court “over health law,” it’s their health prospects he has in mind. He cautioned the justices — “an unelected group of people” — not to take the “unprecedented, extraordinary step of overturning a law that was passed by a strong majority of a democratically elected Congress.”

The eunuchs of the palace media gleefully piled on: As the New York Times sees it, were the justices to take an “unprecedented” step so unprecedented there are two centuries’ worth of precedents going back to 1803, they would be fatally damaging “the Court’s legitimacy.”

All that’s unprecedented here is the spectacle of the president of the United States, while the judges are deliberating, idly swinging his tire iron and saying, “Nice little Supreme Court you got here. Shame if anything were to happen to it.”

JamesK

9 Apr 12 at 9:23 am
And he’s an alumnus* of LSE!

*hope that’s correct.

That’s right. People do struggle with that one. Recently got some alumni newsletter which repeatedly referred to a former male student as an ‘alumna’. From his photo, didn’t seem like the type who’d appreciate that, either.

As for that muppet, look on the bright side. Even if he still has Australian citizenship, it’s one more rabid leftard we managed to ship abroad.

Toxic

9 Apr 12 at 10:25 am
Tox
Thanks, I’m chuffed I got it right, never did Latin.

kae

9 Apr 12 at 10:32 am
Via Bolt:

…it will be interesting to see what Heiss, her publisher or her supporters will do to stop the US-based Amazon site from publishing the kind of comments that have been removed in Australia by the ABC and Random House.

C.L.

9 Apr 12 at 12:02 pm
Mongo MacCallum: Gillard will be slaughtered at the next election because the public is stupid so it’s time to “go for broke.”

First order of business…

The starting point, of course, is to break another promise – the reckless undertaking to provide a budget surplus in 2013. This was never a particularly smart idea but in the changed circumstances of 2012 it has become close to insanity…

Freed up to borrow, hit the trail of social reform…

And who knows? The punters just might like it – a spot of genuine, bold reform, an honest acknowledgement of the pusillanimity of the past, a glimpse, at last, of the real Julia.

Labor should go hard or go home.

C.L.

9 Apr 12 at 2:52 pm
I always thought there would be calls to swing the bat to hit the ball hard if they looked like they were going to get the shit kicked out of them at the next election.

Go for it. You have 17 months and counting. Take the swing. Take the human beard’s advice and “Rex Connorize” the economy. That should leave you 8 seats.

JC

9 Apr 12 at 2:56 pm
Good thing for the elderly that the whole euthanasia thing never got off the ground:

Homes set to be the key to funding aged care, under moves to encourage reverse mortgages
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/homes-set-to-be-key-to-funding-aged-care/story-fn59niix-1226322083912

Toxic

9 Apr 12 at 2:58 pm
rafe,
whatever happened to your weekly updates of links and book reviews etc. I really enjoyed them.

Jim Rose

9 Apr 12 at 4:23 pm
What, Mongo didn’t recommend the nationalisation of the means of production, distribution and exchange followed by the wholesale liquidation of the bourgeoisie?

He’s getting soft in his old age.

squawkbox

9 Apr 12 at 4:34 pm
Tough but fair:

“The Gillard Government should be locked up for crimes against humanity,” she said.

C.L.

9 Apr 12 at 4:45 pm
It is great to seethe people who stay permanently employed due to the policy Gillard designed really do reward her with gratitude.

“The Gillard Government should be locked up for crimes against humanity,” she said.

Chris Bowen must be so chuffed that his political career will be stained with having to manage this mess Gillard designed then left him to clean up the logical result.

I get the feeling Gillard that in the long term will not be joining Gough on the podium of Labor deities.

Token

9 Apr 12 at 4:52 pm
Token

I’m not sure. There’s a smell of death around the Liars Party and this time it could be permanent. Of course a new left wing party of groupings will rise up, but this time I think we’re at the beginning of the end.

JC

9 Apr 12 at 4:55 pm
They say that every time, JC.

John Mc

9 Apr 12 at 4:57 pm
There are ways of actually helping to kill it off, John Mc.

All the libs need to do is ensure that union dues have to be accessed off the payroll and a large part of their funding is fucked.

Then also severely limit public sector unions in terms of what they can and cannot do.

JC

9 Apr 12 at 4:59 pm
I get the feeling Gillard that in the long term will not be joining Gough on the podium of Labor deities.

She will only ever be remembered as the first female PM.

History will put the Rudd/Gillard government in the bottom 25%. As JC says, they may well end up being remembered for being the low point of modern Labor, along with a couple of state ex-premiers.

The commies will be reborn. It will just take a long time.

John Mc

9 Apr 12 at 5:00 pm
Agreed, funding will be their big one. But to be honest, it’s what they need. The party is infested with hacks on the easy teet. The status quo won’t change while there’s still money to be had.

John Mc

9 Apr 12 at 5:01 pm
She will only ever be remembered as the first female PM.

And the last female PM for a very very long time. What she has done, with her incompetence on full display, will see to it that another female will not be PM probably for two or more generations or until the stench of her cowardly inept corrupt governance dissipates. Or whichever comes first.

Gab

9 Apr 12 at 5:04 pm
There’s a smell of death around the Liars Party and this time it could be permanent.

There is a place for a left wing party, look at Phil, with all that envy and hatred in his soul he craves a political party that provides a means to inflict that hatred on others.

The commies will be reborn. It will just take a long time.

I lived in Vic when Kennett came to power after the most incompetent bunch of nuff-nuffs drove the state to the edge, yet 8 years later they were back in power.

At the current time the choice is Lie-bore (funded by unions, etc.) or the Green-slimers (funded by unions, etc.). You choose which dung heap will be the largest in 5 years time.

Token

9 Apr 12 at 5:08 pm
Amazing how a black lunatic can get away with it and still prosper politically.

Which takes us to former DC Mayor Marion Barry. Mike DeBonis, blogging at the Washington Post reports on Barry’s remarks “a party celebrating his landslide victory in the Democratic primary race for the D.C. Council seat he’s held since 2005″ which expressed his determination to rid his area of dirty Asian businesses and replace them with quality African American ones.

WRC-TVcameras caught the remarks: “We’ve got to do something about these Asians coming in, opening up businesses, those dirty shops. They ought to go, I’ll just say that right now, you know. But we need African-American businesspeople to be able to take their places, too.”

JC

9 Apr 12 at 5:35 pm
This, from Newt Gingrich, is a good response to all the whiners complaining about Romney’s “dirty tactics”:

Newt Gingrich said Sunday that he and Republican presidential rival Mitt Romney were at peace — and that their attacks on each other were “part of the business” of running for president.

“I hit him as hard as I could, he hit me as hard as he could,” Gingrich said. “Turns out he had more things to hit with than I did. That’s part of the business.”

My emphasis. So that pretty much underscores my point about all candidates flinging the same kind of mud at each other, but Romney being able to afford a bigger catapault. Time for the whingers whingeing about Romney “dirty tricks” to grow a thicker skin.

Oh come on

9 Apr 12 at 6:11 pm
Only if you’re driving or buying smokes.

PS: NEVER TALK TO THE POLICE.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uj0mtxXEGE8

Chris Rock – How not to get your ass kicked by the police!

John H.

9 Apr 12 at 6:45 pm
“They’re probably too busy eating their watermelon and tacos.”

- The late Mike Wallace on blacks and hispanics.

Ed Driscoll remembers.

C.L.

9 Apr 12 at 7:05 pm
Great way to spend your long weekend…

More than 100 drunken revellers from a party boat fought at the Man-O’-War Steps near the Sydney Opera House last night, police say.

About 20 officers from the riot squad and three local area commands were called out to the brawl about 10.30pm, which started on a Sydney Harbour party boat, and had to use capscium spray to subdue the men and women, a police spokesman said.

Did they choose that location on purpose?

Token

9 Apr 12 at 7:31 pm
She will only ever be remembered as the first female PM.

She will be publically denounced, publically “diaganosed” as mentally unbalanced and unpersoned by the Labor/media machine in exactly the same way as Rudd and Latham were.

I kinda feel sorry for her because of that, that’s her future.

On the other hand she’d be happy if Labor dies but she achieves her life long goal of using it as a temporary vehicle to shove the country to the left, and a hard left party (the Greens) rose to take its place, so I suspect she doesn’t care one whit about what Labor think about her anyway.

twostix

9 Apr 12 at 7:32 pm
To be fair to the Labor/media machine, Rudd and Latham were – and I possibly shouldn’t be using the past tense here – mentally unbalanced.

What’s scandalous is that the ALP was never punished for once trying to foist a mentally unstable Prime Minister onto us, and once succeeding.

Oh come on

9 Apr 12 at 7:43 pm
The laurels for the first elected female prime minister are still available.

C.L.

9 Apr 12 at 7:50 pm
To be fair to the Labor/media machine, Rudd and Latham were – and I possibly shouldn’t be using the past tense here – mentally unbalanced.

To be fair? They were exactly the same people who were in love with those men just months before. The post-power soviet style unpersoning is a bog standard tactic of the contemporary Labor party now in dealing with old leaders.

Gillard’s life so far hardly shows the hallmarks of someone balanced and after the next election, or when Gillard is to knifed expect to then see “leaks” about the “real Gillard” from her colleagues.

twostix

9 Apr 12 at 7:51 pm
Total Commonwealth Government Securities
on Issue – $238,141m consisting of:
Treasury Bonds – $206,843m
Treasury Indexed Bonds – $15,679m
Treasury Notes – $15,600m
Other Securities – $19m
As at 5 April 2012.Updated weekly.
Face value amounts rounded to the nearest million.
Securities on issue subject to the limit under the Commonwealth Inscribed Stock Act 1911 total $233,554 million.

Winston Smith

9 Apr 12 at 7:52 pm
yet 8 years later they were back in power.

Client politics. Large swathes of the public service, arts community on the public teat, green carpetbaggers, the ABC propgandists, etc etc. A timid Coalition share a fair slice of the culpability for passive acceptance of the status quo. More Campbell Newman slash and burn, less Malcolm Turnbull accommodation please.

Ivan Denisovich

9 Apr 12 at 7:55 pm
Rudd and Latham were – and I possibly shouldn’t be using the past tense here – mentally unbalanced.

You’re being unfair to those with psycho pathologies. Rudd and Latham do not have a psycho pathology, they are just assholes. Nasty, bad people. That’s all. They are examples of people you should consciously make a point of ridiculing and attacking lest others decide to follow their lead.

Most people with psycho pathologies are nice.

John H.

9 Apr 12 at 8:38 pm
“You’re being unfair to those with psycho pathologies. Rudd and Latham do not have a psycho pathology, they are just assholes. Nasty, bad people” etc

Most people with psycho pathologies are nice.”

That’s seems such a lot of tosh, John. You usually seem so empathetic i like to read your stuff even though you don’t believe in God.

candy

9 Apr 12 at 8:49 pm
not that atheists don’t have important things to say i didn’t mean that, it’s just their field of reference is so very limited.

candy

9 Apr 12 at 8:55 pm
That’s seems such a lot of tosh, John. You usually seem so empathetic i like to read your stuff even though you don’t believe in God.

Candy, there is a wonderful book by a Harvard economist, The No Asshole Rule”. Unfortunately I lent my copy to someone and the asshole hasn’t returned it. He states that sometimes we have to be assholes, we have to be unpleasant. We may not like being that but demonstrating anger and vitriol can have beneficial reinforcing properties, as any parent knows. I can still see Latham shaking Howard’s hand after the election, when I heard about how Rudd’s behaves close to those around him I was disgusted. We have to be nice to each other but being nice to assholes is being nice to assholes and unkind to everyone else because it will reinforce their behavior.

I don’t believe in anything. I hate the idea of a scientific worldview because I consider that to be an oxymoron. There are too many questions that are not worth thinking about because I know my thinking will lead only to the same old tripe that has come down the ages. I aint no genius so I aint gonna waste my time over the Big Ideas.

John H.

9 Apr 12 at 9:04 pm
“I don’t believe in anything.”

why not? what are the Big Ideas please?

candy

9 Apr 12 at 9:11 pm
thank you for your honest response I meant to add as well, it’s so nice when someone engages kindly as you do.

candy

9 Apr 12 at 9:13 pm
Hey JohnH

Do you think vertical evolution is possible, as there’s a theory that there were basically parallel processes going on and that birds may not have come from the sea after all. In other words what was happening in the sea was a similar process that was happening in land for instance but they were independent.

I’m starting to think that is more likely combined with horizontal evolution.

JC

9 Apr 12 at 9:15 pm
Have people noted how useless the moderation is on news ltd blogs lately? It isn’t worth the bother commenting as by the time they get posted my pup would have had its second litter. A post can go days without any comments being added. It’s like the moderators treat it as a part time occupation that they get around to in between visits to the pub or something.

entropy

9 Apr 12 at 9:20 pm
It’s like the moderators treat it as a part time occupation that they get around to in between visits to the pub or something.

Where do I apply to get a job like that?

Gab

9 Apr 12 at 9:24 pm
Entropy

They are frightened stiff of judge Mordy.

JC

9 Apr 12 at 9:27 pm
Swan confirms government spends more on shredders than teaching staff to deal with FOI requests.

SWAN disputes the government spends more on shredding machines than on teaching staff to deal with freedom of information requests.

http://www.news.com.au/breaking-news/treasurer-doubts-cost-of-foi-shredders/story-e6frfku0-1226322191588

Gab

9 Apr 12 at 9:36 pm
They are frightened stiff of judge Mordy.

Same thing of Gillard. News Ltd thinks appeasing these wannabe thugs will save them.

twostix

9 Apr 12 at 9:37 pm
Fuck the ABC/Kerry O’Brien are biased dirtbags.

They had a story this evening about a number of people experiencing hard times with the CBA/BankWest during the aftermath of the GFC.

One couple lost all their money buying a dodgy hotel for $2.4 million. According to the former owners they never went to physically inspect hotel and simply took the word of the valuer/business broker. IT turned out to be a dump with dishonest accounts.

This glaring negligence was simply overlooked by the program as they continued to dump the remains of the septic tank over the banks.

Fucking amazing leftwingery. Fucking amazing.

JC

9 Apr 12 at 9:39 pm
Gab, that shredders story seems a bit like a ‘when did you stop beating your wife?’ tale.

Even though Swan deserves everything that can be thrown at him.

entropy

9 Apr 12 at 9:49 pm
I can’t believe Richard Dawkins just equated “Thatcherism” with Darwinism.

He’s a fucking lunatic.

JC

9 Apr 12 at 9:52 pm
I know a rather prominent identity that bankwest foreclosed on late last year. He seemed to think it was the bank’s fault he had faked his livestock numbers to get the loan.

entropy

9 Apr 12 at 9:54 pm
Tony Jones just jumped the shark.

dover_beach

9 Apr 12 at 9:59 pm
Tony Jones just jumped the shark.

Listen, he’s done that so often he ought to be the main feature at Seaworld.

Gab

9 Apr 12 at 10:06 pm
Ivan
After last Thursdays Qld Land Court decision it seems that Newman will have to burn just about every water license issued in Qld in the last 10yrs.

He’s got a lot of mess to clean up.

Pickles

9 Apr 12 at 10:07 pm
What did he say, Dover?

C.L.

9 Apr 12 at 10:08 pm
77 shootings in Sydney in the last year.

And then I see a smug australian pop-leftist on an American blog lecturing the yanks on how there’s no guns or gun crime in Australia.

Lying or pig ignorant stupidity?

twostix

9 Apr 12 at 10:11 pm
He said he believes in Darwinism but doesn’t believe we should carry it through to the N’th degree like under Thatcherism.

I’ll post the transcript tomorrow.

People have laughed at him twice and keeps asking why they laugh and looked upset.

He suggested nothing is something which caused laughter.

He’s basically a pompous dickhead.

JC

9 Apr 12 at 10:13 pm
Pell gets asked a question on climate change.

JC

9 Apr 12 at 10:15 pm
CL, from memory, Cardinal Pell, while referring to God’s choosing to address the Jews while still enslaved in Egypt as significant also added that they were intellectually run-of-the-mill when compared to contemporaneous cultures; this itself was added to bolster the significance of this choice. Tony Jones then pursued a snide line of questioning which appeared designed to try and ensnare Cardinal Pell in anti-semitic net. It was really too much.

dover_beach

9 Apr 12 at 10:37 pm
Hi Pickles
I’m behind the times, was there a news item on that?
Taa in anticipation.

kae

9 Apr 12 at 10:37 pm
Dover

I thought it was a terrible debate. I don’t think Pell debated well and I think Dawkins came across as a pompous lying little leftist prick after the Thatcher sneer and really surprisingly silly after suggesting nothing is something.

JC

9 Apr 12 at 10:42 pm
I thought it was a terrible debate. I don’t think Pell debated well and I think Dawkins came across as a pompous lying little leftist prick after the Thatcher sneer and really surprisingly silly after suggesting nothing is something.

It was another meaningless debatel. It exemplified why I do not like Dawkin’s approach though I can sympathise with him because after a while you get sick of people asking why questions. He had jet lag and should have learnt by now: bees to honey. Mitchell and Webb do a better job than he does. See:

There is No God

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZCL4dXUtblg

John H.

9 Apr 12 at 10:48 pm
John

Anyone that equates Thatcher’s free market economics with social Darwnaism/law of the jungle doesn’t deserve any space in the public forum as a serious person.

The pompous little limey is a total piece of shit.

JC

9 Apr 12 at 10:51 pm
What more can you really expect from the atheist vs religious debate? I think it was OK.

I personally believe the Cardinal should let his sharp wit out more and, rather than trying to justify questions from a scientific rationalist perspective, answer questions from the human experience perspective.

A really good example would be to rebuff Dawkins by saying it’s perfectly fine to tell children that choosing to do evil will get you to hell as your choices matter as God gave us free will, and what you choose determines where and how you end up at the end of your life.

John Mc

9 Apr 12 at 10:51 pm
Dawkins kiled himself stone dead when he said that seeking to find meaning in life is a silly question.

Viva

9 Apr 12 at 10:54 pm
JC, I think Pell did quite well considering his age and the fact that his academic background is church history. Certainly, there are other people I can think of that could have better exposed Dawkins’s facile approach to religion. But still, I think Pell did well nonetheless and Dawkins use of Krauss was an own goal and fabulously dealt with by Pell. And I have previously read the NYT piece and it demolishes Krauss’s claim with aplomb.

dover_beach

9 Apr 12 at 10:56 pm
Dawkins came across as a real lightweight. The jetlag excuse was really lame, and he struggled to differentiate purpose from process. A mind all over the place, dining out on atheism. I’m an atheist and could do much better than that.

Pell, from a slow start, with Jones attacking him, started to come through. He is not an expert in everything ABC smarty. But he stuck to his line, consistent with Darwin (who was much misrepresented by Jones and Dawkins), and sold a message of the unknown and faith.

They say that Ratzinger is dying. Pell apparently got a few votes in the first round last time. Pell for Pope!

Just an atheist having fun here..

Lazlo

9 Apr 12 at 10:56 pm
John mac

What more can you really expect from the atheist vs religious debate? I think it was OK.

Look I actually think Pell won the debate because he didn’t make too many mistakes although the neanderthal one was a biggie.

Dawkins came across as a prissy little princess and made some huge glaring errors.

Equating Thatcher….

Something is nothing.

Glaring inconsistencies making the Thatcher assertion and then denying anything bad has happened with atheists.

I actually thought he would be a better debtor but he was really fucking terrible.

JC

9 Apr 12 at 10:57 pm
John

Anyone that equates Thatcher’s free market economics with social Darwnaism/law of the jungle doesn’t deserve any space in the public forum as a serious person.

The pompous little limey is a total piece of shit.

JC

Couldn’t put it better..

Lazlo

9 Apr 12 at 10:59 pm
JC,

The problem with Dawkins is that Social Darwinism was and remains predicated on a fundamental misunderstanding about life processes. Organisms only compete when it becomes necessary to do so, for the very greater part they are avoiding competing and just trying to get on with feeding and fucking.

What is now becoming much clearer though was clearly so powerfully obvious in the Lynn Marguilis hypothesis and now generally excepted explanation for the presence of mitochondria, is that organisms benefit much more by mutually beneficial behaviors than by competition(trade anyone?). The seminal works of mathematical biologists like Stewart and Kaufmann, let alone the famous Rappaport win in the Conway LIfe contest, seems to have passed Dawkins by on his way to another rant.

So contrary to what Dawkins argues it may well turn out that a modern social darwinism could be a beneficial perspective through which to think about how we conduct our lives.

John H.

9 Apr 12 at 10:59 pm
The Thatcher jibe was pathetic.

John Mc

9 Apr 12 at 10:59 pm
I thought it was interesting that Dawkins more or less outed himself as a teleologist while at the same time misrepresenting what Aristotelians actually mean by teleology. A brilliant self-beclowning.

dover_beach

9 Apr 12 at 11:00 pm
But still, I think Pell did well nonetheless and Dawkins use of Krauss was an own goal and fabulously dealt with by Pell. And I have previously read the NYT piece and it demolishes Krauss’s claim with aplomb.

Oops yea, I forgot about that one. The prissy little Thatcher denialist leftwing prick was actually touting a theory that has been demolished and Pell rubbed his nose in it….. and he was at first big noting himself that was going to introduce it to people at the Sydney Opera house….. hahahahahhahaha

What a moron… he kept asking people why they were laughing at him. lol

I grant you that Pell is getting a little too old for this sort of setting.

JC

9 Apr 12 at 11:01 pm
and just trying to get on with feeding and fucking.

Hey, don’t judge my lifestyle choices!

John Mc

9 Apr 12 at 11:02 pm
Look Lazlo

Don’t get me wrong. I’m I really don’t care what people believe, so I’m not playing favorites here. I loved Hitch and have a great deal of respect for Al Button (Alain de Botton).

This little fucker really irritates the shit out of me and it nothing to do with what he believes.

The Thatcher comment came over that he’s an absolute fraud on this subject.

JC

9 Apr 12 at 11:06 pm
The Thatcher comment came over that he’s an absolute fraud on this subject.

Came over that he is a fraud on any subject, a light weight. But, give Pell some slack, he actually captured an audience thereon.

BTW In the spirit of Easter, do you know what happens at the point of conception and death?

Signed: A. Theist.

Lazlo

9 Apr 12 at 11:14 pm
George Pell is a die hard Richmond fan. If he were to become Pope I sense praying for a miracle wouldn’t seem so futile.

Infidel Tiger

9 Apr 12 at 11:16 pm
Lol… it’s so, so easy to knock this administration over all the time. They just make it so easy, which is a good reason why they need to go. They simply aren’t up to it.

In a shocking new video, James O’Keefe’s Project Veritas demonstrates to the Attorney General of the United States, Eric Holder, just why he should be concerned about lack of voter ID laws – by walking into Holder’s voting precinct and showing the world that anyone can obtain Eric Holder’s ballot. Literally.

The video shows a young man entering a Washington, DC polling place at 3401 Nebraska Avenue, NW, on primary day of this year – April 3, 2012 – and giving Holder’s name and address. The poll worker promptly offers the young man Holder’s ballot to vote.

Holder has continually said voter fraud is not a big deal in the US can’t be widespread. We know the reason of course.

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2012/04/08/DC-Polling-Place-Holder-Ballot

JC

9 Apr 12 at 11:27 pm
My question is motivated by statements from the fuckwit Dawkins who claims ‘the science’ on his side.

We have no idea…

Lazlo

9 Apr 12 at 11:30 pm
the Kenyan strikes again.

Texas engineer, whose wife sent Obama his résumé, still unemployed

FORT WORTH — More than two months after President Barack Obama asked for Darin Wedel’s résumé, the phone is quiet, e-mails are no longer flooding in and the long-sought-after job interviews — which had begun to be scheduled — have petered out.

“Not even recruiting companies are calling anymore,” said Jennifer Wedel, the Fort Worth mother of two who chatted online this year with Obama about her out-of-work husband.

Read more here: http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2012/04/09/144558/texas-engineer-who-sent-obama.html#storylink=cpy

JC

9 Apr 12 at 11:34 pm
BTW In the spirit of Easter, do you know what happens at the point of conception and death?

1. Life begins
2. Life ends

Beyond that is the question of what exactly is meant by “soul”. I think it’s hard to pin down to anything more specific than “who you are in the mind of God”.

wreckage

10 Apr 12 at 12:01 am
Duncan Hunter (R-CA) is pushing legislation to change the way the US govt measure unemployment.

link here

With that in place, we’ll never be fooled again.

Alex Pundit

10 Apr 12 at 12:19 am
Newspoll: Labor Party hated throughout Australia.

C.L.

10 Apr 12 at 12:37 am
Nothing quite matches your comments CL. Clean crisp and to the point.

They really are hated.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 12:38 am
The feeling is mutual: Australians hate Labor, and Labor hates Australians.

Fisky

10 Apr 12 at 12:44 am
That’s it.

C.L.

10 Apr 12 at 12:53 am
Death of a nano-myth: Al Sharpton abandons Trayvon Martin supporters.

It’s all over.

C.L.

10 Apr 12 at 12:54 am
Even in Tasmania? If they can’t get 2PP there they really are stuffed for the next 20-odd years, not just for the next election.

squawkbox

10 Apr 12 at 12:54 am
Well they will get an increased vote in the ACT, so not all is lot.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 1:07 am
Andrew Leigh will be their shadow treasurer until about 2030.

Fisky

10 Apr 12 at 1:10 am
Andother badass

Lieutenant Colonel John Malcolm Thorpe Fleming “Jack” Churchill, DSO & Bar, MC & Bar (16 September 1906 – 8 March 1996), nicknamed “Fighting Jack Churchill” and “Mad Jack”, was a British soldier who fought throughout World War II armed with a longbow, arrows and a Scottish broadsword. He once said “any officer who goes into action without his sword is improperly armed.”

Churchill resumed his commission after Poland was invaded. In May 1940, Churchill and his unit, the Manchester Regiment, ambushed a German patrol near L’Epinette, France. Churchill gave the signal to attack by cutting down the enemy Feldwebel (sergeant) with his barbed arrows, becoming the only known British soldier to have felled an enemy with a longbow in the course of the war.[1] After fighting at Dunkirk, he volunteered for the Commandos, unsure of what Commando duty entailed, but was interested because it sounded dangerous.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 1:13 am
WTF? I never realized the casino’s moved the odds for some players.

http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2012/04/the-man-who-broke-atlantic-city/8900/?single_page=true

JC

10 Apr 12 at 1:21 am
Remember that clown Brendan O’Neill on Q&A? Jeremy from Pure Poison destroys some silly anti-gay marriage rant The Australian felt compelled to publish from that dropkick:

http://blogs.crikey.com.au/purepoison/2012/04/07/brendan-oneill-in-the-oz-gays-getting-married-is-the-first-step-towards-totalitarianism111/

LaRouchite

10 Apr 12 at 2:46 am
Do the PP Boyz pay you to link-whore, or is it a labor of luuuuurve?

/enquiring minds…

sdog

10 Apr 12 at 3:12 am
Jeremy Sear destroys.

Ahahahahahaha.

C.L.

10 Apr 12 at 3:33 am
No, really, LaRouchite, are you suffering from advanced syphilis? Sears isn’t fit to sharpen O’Neill’s HB pencil.

Abu Chowdah

10 Apr 12 at 5:39 am
Didn’t even click the Crikey link. Knew it would be shithouse reasoning, poor writing and a feeble attempt to bump Crikey stats. Now, fuck off, you dunce.

Abu Chowdah

10 Apr 12 at 5:41 am
Newspoll: Labor Party hated throughout Australia

On those figures, the Libs would pick up the 3rd Senator in SA and we can assume Tas, and 4th senator in Qld, WA and maybe NSW. Which would give them the senate majority in their own right.

Of course, if the LDP took that 4th NSW seat, that would be even better…

Tim Quilty

10 Apr 12 at 6:17 am
db

I thought it was interesting that Dawkins more or less outed himself as a teleologist while at the same time misrepresenting what Aristotelians actually mean by teleology.

Ooh, what did he say about Aritotelian teleology? ‘Que, sera, sera, whatever we’ll be, we’ll be?’

Peter Patton

10 Apr 12 at 6:45 am
Larvatus Prodeo is closing down.

steve from brisbane

10 Apr 12 at 7:48 am
What a conceited valedictory. Clueless about their relevance until the last.

Abu Chowdah

10 Apr 12 at 8:35 am
“BTW In the spirit of Easter, do you know what happens at the point of conception and death?”

I’m a bit confused by this statement. How can something that stretches over 70 years be a point?

Winston SMITH

10 Apr 12 at 9:11 am
I refuse to click on SoBs links as I don’t want to add to anyones page views, but is the Lavatory really closing down?

Winston SMITH

10 Apr 12 at 9:26 am
I refuse to click on SoBs links as I don’t want to add to anyones page views

I’m like that re Pure Poison. Would love to read Sear’s ‘argument’ but simply refuse to reward LaRou’s pimping.

dover_beach

10 Apr 12 at 9:34 am
but simply refuse to reward LaRou’s pimping.

Ditto.

Gab

10 Apr 12 at 9:35 am
Ooh, what did he say about Aritotelian teleology?

I’ll provide the quotation once the transcript becomes available this afternoon.

dover_beach

10 Apr 12 at 9:55 am
Back from a 2 week holiday in Malaysia and Singapore, mostly visitng relatives.

My holiday coincided with Qing Ming, the annual Chinese visit to the gravesite of relatives so I had to attend a few of those.

For those unfamiliar with this concept, the Chinese concept of the afterlife isn’t very transcendent. Descendants of the dead have to make this annual visit to the gravesite to burn the paper equivalents of stuff that the dead might need in the afterlife. There is an economy in the afterlife, hence loads of so-called ‘hell money’ is burnt every year so the dead are not also poor. I suppose this provides another rationale for having lots of descendants so people can always visit your grave to keep you supplied.

Also papee equivalents of clothing, beer cans (yes beer cans burnt for my eldest uncle) and assorted paraphernalia. The carbon emissions would be horrendous. Apparently the latest trend is to burn paper effigies of ipad though there is a debate (yes seriously) about whether the elderly of past centuries would have the technological nous to use these.

jtfsoon

10 Apr 12 at 9:57 am
Obviously, the afterlife will have IT classes to educate the dead about the new iPads.

Speaking of dead people and Apple, it seems that the authorised biography of Jobs was a harsher assessment of him than I realised.

steve from brisbane

10 Apr 12 at 10:04 am
Contemplating the afterlife as a mere enhanced continuation of earthly life does have its problems. If I recall correctly, in Permutation City, a science fiction novel in which personalities continue for what they assumed was (effectively) an eternity once uploaded into gigantic computer servers, the society in cyberspace was described as one that was particularly susceptible to fad group activities. As soon as someone discovered something new to do in cyber eternity, everyone did it for a while, then got bored, and moved on to the next novel activity.

steve from brisbane

10 Apr 12 at 10:15 am
The Obama effect.

Supreme Court’s Approval Rating Jumps

Gab

10 Apr 12 at 10:20 am
Jeremy Sear destroys…

His cat’s life? Another pair of y-fronts?

Infidel Tiger

10 Apr 12 at 10:36 am
jason

I suppose this provides another rationale for having lots of descendants so people can always visit your grave to keep you supplied.

Couldn’t that also provide an incentive for all the living descendants to burn on the cheap?

Peter Patton

10 Apr 12 at 10:40 am
the SMH has an item on the paper ipads
http://www.smh.com.au/world/2-paper-ipads-make-an-afterlife-to-die-for-20120403-1wapu.html

jtfsoon

10 Apr 12 at 10:46 am
Science: women who use the Pill inadvertently choose beta males.

A recent study shows that women with lower testosterone levels – typically caused by the use of hormone-based oral contraceptives like the pill – are more attracted to men who also have low testosterone levels.

Previous studies have shown that the less testosterone a man has, the less likely he is to cheat, the more supportive he is, and the better he is at providing for his family. Sounds good, right?

Not quite. Previous studies have also shown that most women are historically more sexually attracted to higher testosterone levels. And the mothers in the study who eventually went off birth control post-wedding reported less sexual contentment than other women; they found their husbands less attractive and less sexually exciting once they went off the pill.

This explains a lot.

C.L.

10 Apr 12 at 10:59 am
Special Prosecutor: No grand jury in Trayvon Martin case.

C.L.

10 Apr 12 at 11:04 am
Dear DOJ

Why the racism?

“The Zimmerman family is in hiding because of the threats that have been made against us, yet the DOJ has maintained an eerie silence on this matter. These threats are very public. If you haven’t been paying attention just do a Google search and you will find plenty. Since when can a group of people in the United States put a bounty on someone’s head, circulate Wanted posters publicly, and still be walking the streets?”

http://dailycaller.com/2012/04/09/zimmerman-family-challenges-holder-on-new-black-panthers-says-no-arrests-based-solely-on-your-race/#ixzz1ray3LPyL

Gab

10 Apr 12 at 11:06 am
So now everyone’s trying to walk back their false claims of armed neo-nazis occupying Sanford.

Next meme?

sdog

10 Apr 12 at 11:25 am
Obviously, the afterlife will have IT classes to educate the dead about the new iPads.

LOL. I’m not sure this is what the Daoists intended.

Token

10 Apr 12 at 11:28 am
What a riot it is to read Henry Ergas’ blog. He is in Lefty moron smackdown mode at the moment.

Yesterday: Megalogenis is beclowned

Writing in these hallowed pages, George Megalogenis (”Newman’s axing of literary award spells return to bumpkin state”) claims Campbell Newman’s axing of the Queensland Premier’s literary award “doesn’t make fiscal sense” because it will reduce the GST take.

That is absurd. To begin with, what does Megalogenis think consumers will do with the money they would have otherwise spent on award-winning books? Spend it all on (GST exempt) fresh food, hence reducing the GST take? In other words, is Megalogenis suggesting the closest substitutes for books that win the Queensland Premier’s literary award are cabbages?

Today: The Git

Reading Gittins’ recent outpourings, I could not help but be reminded of Samuelson’s jackass. For Gittins is constantly making claims about what “conventional economics” involves that – when I “lie down on the couch and recall in tranquility, upon that inward eye which is the bliss of solitude, what it was that I believed” – bear no relationship to anything that ever crossed my mind. In fact, they bear no relationship to ‘conventional economics’ – not even by coincidence.

Rather, the experience of reading Gittins on what ‘conventional economics’ involves is much as if one picked up the newspaper and found an ‘astronomy editor’ confidently claiming that ‘conventional astronomers’ believe the sun revolves around the earth, and that the moon is made of blue cheese. Only a small but plucky band of unconventional astronomers, he would go on to say, challenge those propositions, showing up the imbecile flatness of their ‘conventional’ colleagues.

There are 3 more days in the week. I can’t wait to see who gets served next.

Token

10 Apr 12 at 11:34 am
db

Am I particularly slow in not quite getting what Locke is doing by distinguishing ‘the soul’ and ‘consciousness’? I get that he needs consciousness – a person’s cogitations in the present, and memories of the past – so that after the resurrection, God can judge the whole life; for God will not condemn a man (or is it a person or a soul) for acts he can’t remember.

And while I get that, for Locke, a person is more than the physical body (substance) – indeed, the same person can have more than one body, over his lifetime – how can a person (as consciousness) turn up to Judgment Day in a different body, and remain consistent with scripture?

What work is Locke trying to do by separating the soul and consciousness here?

Peter Patton

10 Apr 12 at 11:35 am
I can’t believe Dawkins tried the old whopper about Hitler being a Christian/theist.

Sorry, athiest Taliban. The experiment of godless leadership you wanted was the twentieth century. Atheists were the worst mass murderers and obscurantists in human history.

Case closed. The science is settled.

C.L.

10 Apr 12 at 12:11 pm
Racism:

In a letter to Attorney General Eric Holder on Monday, obtained exclusively by The Daily Caller, a family member of George Zimmerman asked the nation’s top law enforcement officer why he has chosen to not arrest members of the New Black Panther Party for their rhetoric — some of which may fit the federal government’s definition of a hate crime — throughout the Trayvon Martin case.

The family member believes the reason Holder hasn’t made those arrests is because he, like the members of the New Black Panther Party, is black.

“I am writing you to ask you why, when the law of the land is crystal clear, is your office not arresting the New Black Panthers for hate crimes?” the family member wrote to Holder.

“The Zimmerman family is in hiding because of the threats that have been made against us, yet the DOJ has maintained an eerie silence on this matter. These threats are very public. If you haven’t been paying attention just do a Google search and you will find plenty. Since when can a group of people in the United States put a bounty on someone’s head, circulate Wanted posters publicly, and still be walking the streets?”

The New Black Panthers have issued ultimatums to the Sanford authorities, saying they want Zimmerman arrested “dead or alive.”

C.L.

10 Apr 12 at 12:13 pm
Some shits going down at NR over Derb’s firing. I reckon Steyn might walk.

Infidel Tiger

10 Apr 12 at 12:18 pm
Thank God for the Derbyshire dismissal, I would never have come across Taki’s Magazine and it is f**king balls to the wall hella-awesome. I wonder if that’s what was really going on here?

Top 10 Hatefacts

New Gold Dream

10 Apr 12 at 12:26 pm
On Dawkins’ excuse of “jet-lag”, that is lame and unprofessional. Presumably, the ABC flew him down here 1st/Business Class, put him up in a top hotel (or maybe he dossed at Maxine McKew’s place in Eastwood), and paid him a handsome stipend. It is his JOB to give a top performance. To say – while on the job – ‘oh, I can’t perform because I am jet-lagged’ – is no different to excusing yourself in the middle of an important equity-raising presentation/pitch, “oh, I’m sorry, I’m not really giving you good reasons to invest $100 million in our company, because I got pissed at lunchtime”.

One of the very first lessons we all learn about work – and especially as Australians – is how we individually cope with long-distance work travel. I remember one of my first work trips, involved a transfer to one of our offices on the US east coast. Flying from Sydney to Boston via LA, especially when you are in your early 20s, and think ‘free booze’ means you must not stop drinking until you land, is one lesson never forgotten. With all Dawkins’ experience, he had no no excuse.

Peter Patton

10 Apr 12 at 12:51 pm
What work is Locke trying to do by separating the soul and consciousness here?

The problem here lies in Cartesian dualism; Locke is trying to make sense of things following the break with Aristotelianism. For Aristotelians, body and soul are distinguishable but inseparable. Following the break, body and soul became two separable things. That is why Locke believes the same person can inhabit other bodies so long as the stream of consciousness is continuous. That is why Pell could say last night that the soul is not like the addition of gin to a drink, but a human being’s substantial form, or what he called, principle of life. Thus, all living things have a soul.

dover_beach

10 Apr 12 at 1:02 pm
Obama “creates” more jobs at $333,333 a pop.

The Obama Administration committed $5 million to use cow manure to heat an ethanol plant creating 15 jobs.

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2012/04/your-tax-dollars-at-work-obama-commits-5-million-to-go-green-with-cow-poop/

Gab

10 Apr 12 at 1:07 pm
Presumably, the ABC flew him down here 1st/Business Class, put him up in a top hotel

PP, I’m surprised you haven’ guessed. He’s here for ‘A Celebration of Reason’. I sort of guessed this when A. C. Grayling (with accompanying hairstylist, I presume) was announced as a member of the panel next week.

dover_beach

10 Apr 12 at 1:08 pm
db

I didn’t watch the program last night. Do you think I would have won my bet that Dawkins whined the word ‘reason’ at least 100 times?

Peter Patton

10 Apr 12 at 1:11 pm
Good question, PP; I don’t know. Once the transcript appears I’ll see how many appearances of ‘reason’ occur.

dover_beach

10 Apr 12 at 1:30 pm
the soul is not like the addition of gin to a drink, but a human being’s substantial form, or what he called, principle of life.

Pell also acknowledged that non human creatures also have an animal soul.

It has for a long time seemed to me implausible that any living being or entity could derive its being independent of the source of all life – hence in a real sense we are all extensions of the divine. IMO the difference between the run of humanity and the more spiritually advanced or sensitive individuals is that the latter may have a greater awareness of that divine connection which can then inform their thoughts and actions to a much greater degree.

As Eric Liddell says in “Chariots of Fire”.

I believe God made me for a purpose, but he also made me fast. And when I run I feel His pleasure.

Viva

10 Apr 12 at 1:31 pm
Pell also acknowledged that non human creatures also have an animal soul.

This is illustrative of Aristotle’s influence since he identified what he called a nutritive, sensible and rational soul. All living things, according to this view, have a nutritive soul. In addition, all animals also have a sensible soul. Finally, all human beings have, in further addition, a rational soul.

dover_beach

10 Apr 12 at 1:44 pm
The Obama Administration committed $5 million to use cow manure to heat an ethanol plant creating 15 jobs.

Let’s hope they don’t put that fuel in the Obama Volt.

We’re talking pong bombs exploding on streets throughout America.

——————————————-

CORRECTION: on about five streets in America.

C.L.

10 Apr 12 at 1:49 pm
Pell also acknowledged that non human creatures also have an animal soul.

Does anyone deny that PUDSY is heaven-bound?

C.L.

10 Apr 12 at 1:58 pm
Bluddee hell – I’ve only just found out about Derbyshire’s sacking.

Will have to do some reading, including the offending piece in Taki’s.

Although I have just read the gloatings of some loathsome twat over at Forbes about the ‘self immolation’…

Rabz

10 Apr 12 at 1:58 pm
Sad news for Malcolm Fraser:

Mugabe ‘gravely ill’ in Singapore hospital.

C.L.

10 Apr 12 at 2:03 pm
db

So after a person’s body has stopped (heart-stopped), and presuming no fancy freezing, teleporting, or co-opting the body of a cobbler, what does God judge – punish or reward – the soul or the consciousness? What appears before God?

(i) The bodily substance we died in, except all washed and cleaned exactly like the body substance we lived in?

(ii) Our – non-material – consciousness (with all our life’s memories), which presumably God can perceive in a way we cannot, given Locke’s insistence it is non-material substance?

(iii) Our soul?

Or 2 of these? Or all 3?

Early on, while only part the way through Book II, I predicted Locke might reunite the ‘soul’ and ‘consciousness’ (probably by subsuming consciousness within the soul, or make the two into one) once we had physically died. Then to be consistent with scripture, our now dead body would be spruced-up (including shampoo and manicure), dressed in its Sunday-best. This resurrected body substance would then appear before God with the soul inside, ready for Judging. Unless he is saying that the soul’s role is over once your bodily susbstance dies, and that it is your consciousness, which God evaluates.

OTOH, the soul accompanies your spruce-up resurrected body substance, with your consciousness subsumed by your soul, only to be used as a form of video-evidence of your life’s deeds.

Please explain, Mr. Locke?

Peter Patton

10 Apr 12 at 2:05 pm
What appears before God?

According to Locke? I don’t know. Presumably, (ii). Though, I have to say, I’m not sure how he distinguishes consciousness and soul.

dover_beach

10 Apr 12 at 2:23 pm
Thank God for the Derbyshire dismissal, I would never have come across Taki’s Magazine

Those top ten ‘hate facts’ are excellent. That’s what I like about the Cat, links to new stuff all the time plus the tossing around of ancient theologies and philosophies – and then there’s the economics and all of those things for which Tony Abbot is clearly to be held responsible and the funny animal clips (thanks Gab).

Pell was good last night – ‘a human being’s substantial form’ leaves considerable room for spiritual and theological interpretation; terribly necessary these days. It’s getting a bit arcane perhaps Peter P, when one has to trace all of this dualistic, deistic and idealist stuff back through the Englightenment and prior to it – arcane like the homoousios concept of the relationships within the Trinity, which so enthralled and fermented the market stall keepers of old Constantinople, the talk of the town during the great Nicean debate. Interestingly, homoousios means ‘of the same substance’ and was used by pagan writers such as Plotinus ‘to describe the relationship between the soul and the divine’ (see p.55 of Charles Freeman’s book AD381 which, as its thesis, argues an interesting, if contested, interpretation of the Imperial juggling that lay behind Christian theological dogma and its censorship of all else).

Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

10 Apr 12 at 3:04 pm
db

Then surely that is a HUGE problem. To the extent he is debating/rejecting earlier and contemporary views to him, he seems to be quite adamant in rejecting those who have – what they call – ‘individuated’ a man/human in his having the same soul from conception (?) to death.

L’s argument seems to be that if that soul is reincarnated, then its next possessor must be the same ‘man’ who has now died; the differences in bodily substance do not negate the continuous/single identity of that ‘man’. And if that man’s soul should then return in the body of a hog, then not only is that hog a ‘man’, but that hog is the same specific man who has just died, but who lived with the soul now in the hog.

So, in elevating ‘same consciousness over time‘ as the determining identity of a ‘person’, Locke seems to be downgrading a mere ‘man’ – who has a soul, and consciousness at any point in time – compared to the person who has consciousness relating him identically from the present right back to his youth.

So, in that elevation of ‘person’ over ‘man’ isn’t Locke in fact rejecting the soul, as being not even necessary to being a ‘person’, let alone sufficient?

Peter Patton

10 Apr 12 at 3:14 pm
BoltA has a link from the Press Council on how M0nty’s peers has turned the review process into a circus of victimhood:

Adjudication No. 1517: Penny Campton/Northern Territory News (December 2011)
A complaint that a front-page pointer to a court report of an incident that involved a single asylum seeker making a threat to kill Australians had erroneously referred to “asylum seekers” making the threats…

We can see what those bed-wetters are doing with all that time they have being on unemployment benefits…

Adjudication No. 1510: Andrew Robertson/The Daily Telegraph (September 2011)
A complaint that an article, by implying that climate scientists deserved abuse and death threats, was unfair and offensive. The Council did not uphold the complaint because it considered that the words in question were reasonably open to other interpretations

Token

10 Apr 12 at 3:15 pm
Lizzie

Just to clarify, I am asking db these questions in relation to a paper I am writing on the 17th century epistemology of John Locke. So, I am not discussing modern day particular church theology.

Peter Patton

10 Apr 12 at 3:18 pm
Token

I think Judge Mordy will be made a fool of by the Internet. We can see the popular pushback has already started on the Random House and Drum blogs on Anita Heiss’ exciting new book Am I Black Enough?

Peter Patton

10 Apr 12 at 3:23 pm
The walk-back continues:

Obama campaign hoodies sale canceled after controversy.

Funny how Al Sharpton, the Special Prosecutor and the Obama Administration no longer want to be associated with No_Limit_Nigga.

I wonder why.

C.L.

10 Apr 12 at 3:33 pm
PP – the comments section (via the Bunyip) at random house are now gone for a 2nd time.

Bugger

Carpe Jugulum

10 Apr 12 at 3:34 pm
I don’t quite follow this:

in elevating ‘same consciousness over time‘ as the determining identity of a ‘person’, Locke seems to be downgrading a mere ‘man’ – who has a soul, and consciousness at any point in time – compared to the person who has consciousness relating him identically from the present right back to his youth.

Surely, ‘person’ and ‘man’ here are one and the same thing. This would make a little more sense to me if by ‘man’ you mean ‘body’.

dover_beach

10 Apr 12 at 3:39 pm
The union movement moves to kill work experience programs

Now we know that it’s not lawful to agree to work for less than the minimum wage, so how can it be lawful, how should it be lawful to agree to work for nothing, even if you think it’s a way of getting a foot in the door

Matt

10 Apr 12 at 3:39 pm
I am asking db these questions in relation to a paper I am writing on the 17th century epistemology of John Locke.

Thanks PP, obviously your queries were to do with a particular interest; I was just reflecting on the nature of the arcane in philosophy and theology.

Pell did it well, he pitched to his audience not to theologians.

Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

10 Apr 12 at 3:45 pm
Herbal remedy blamed for high cancer rate in Taiwan: study

Don’t say I never warned people against the dangers of this crap.

http://ca.news.yahoo.com/herbal-remedy-blamed-high-cancer-rate-taiwan-study-204239835.html

JC

10 Apr 12 at 3:48 pm
Funny how Al Sharpton, the Special Prosecutor and the Obama Administration no longer want to be associated with No_Limit_Nigga.

I wonder why.

…but the Sun King chose to annoint as his defacto child the no_limit-nigga who boasted to his cousin about punching a bus driver.

Hard to back away from that.

Token

10 Apr 12 at 3:50 pm
Random House and the ABC may have deployed the Stalin airbrush but the untouchable US Amazon page is up and attracting comments about that book.

A FinkelMord has showed up and is very angry about the 1st Amendment:

In my opinion, the Amazon review system has been hopelessly compromised, at least in this case. The book has been attacked by the followers of an Australian blogger, notorious for his extreme right wing views. He is reluctant to make a personal contribution, (Google “Court case Bolt”), but he has a loyal band of fellow travellers who are only too happy to do his dirty work. I’ll wager that none of them actually read the book, they have another, darker, agenda.

C.L.

10 Apr 12 at 3:51 pm
Rafe
How is the hip?

kelly liddle

10 Apr 12 at 3:55 pm
Mark Steyn Vid: The left wants to celebrate diversity except when it comes to diversity of thought.

Gab

10 Apr 12 at 4:02 pm
db

No, Locke’s WHOLE THING is to clearly distinguish between a ‘man’ and a ‘person’.

Peter Patton

10 Apr 12 at 4:12 pm
Lizzie

I’m sure I’l get to the 21st century one day. But right now, I’m flat out with the image of God looking at his watch tssk-tssking the tardiness of a dude who was blown to bits by a bomb, whose soul is enroute to a hog, and whose consciousness is tapping its feet impatiently, while the bomb-splattered dude irons his shirt, hoping the bandaids will hold his once-splattered body together long enough for God to judge his life-work, as revealed by plugging his consciousness into God’s DVD player, while they review the dude’s life-time memories!

Peter Patton

10 Apr 12 at 4:22 pm
Ok, PP. I’ve done a little reading over at the SEP and what you’ve been saying has become a little clearer. As I said above, by ‘man’ Locke in some way does mean ‘body’ as in ‘body of a man’. More importantly, the difference between consciousness and soul seems to be the difference between person and man. Which then allows me to provide a tentative answer to your question:

So, in that elevation of ‘person’ over ‘man’ isn’t Locke in fact rejecting the soul, as being not even necessary to being a ‘person’, let alone sufficient?

No. He isn’t rejecting the soul because a person’s consciousness requires precisely this ‘thinking substance’. And you can see how this mirror’s his discussion of person and man. The same man may be difference persons (and vice versa) in much the same way that the same soul may be different consciousnesses (and vice versa).

dover_beach

10 Apr 12 at 4:43 pm
JC
I would encourage you to give your opinion on this weekly blog just cut out the swearing and personal insults and you can say what you want. It is one way to send a direct message to the politicians as at least one politician does read all the comments I think.

I would encourage anyone to post a comment there.

kelly liddle

10 Apr 12 at 4:50 pm
db

Thanks for that. I just tweaked myself, from reading further through the book, that L (and Descartes) have given ‘soul’ this ‘thinking substance’ meaning. But I’m still not quite clear on how L reconciles this with scripture.

Peter Patton

10 Apr 12 at 4:50 pm
Poor Cory. I saw you hassling him earlier in the year, Kelly.

Infidel Tiger

10 Apr 12 at 4:56 pm
IT
So do you post comments there and what is your screen name?

kelly liddle

10 Apr 12 at 5:01 pm
Soul stuff

the soul is felt when looking into the eyes of someone you love at certain times as we all have felt, it is felt as a connection, almost without time but only for an instant, as part of a greater whole. That’s cliched but i don’t know how else to express it.

also if you’ve been with someone close to you when they have died, immediately before they pass it may be like they are being taken, i like to think that is their soul passing on and being helped along

candy

10 Apr 12 at 5:03 pm
PP, here is Dawkins unwittingly channeling Aristotle even though a third of the way through he purports to distinguish non-random survival and reproduction from a teleology no Aristotelian has ever believed:

There is random genetic variation and non-random survival and non-random reproduction which is why, as the generations go by, animals get better at doing what they do. That is quintessentially non-random. It doesn’t mean there is a purpose in the sense of a human purpose in the sense of a guiding principle which is thought up in advance. With hindsight you can say something like a bird’s wing looks as though it has a purpose, a human eye looks as though it has a purpose but it has come about through the process of non-random natural selection. There is no purpose in the human sense. There is a kind of pseudo purpose but it’s not a purpose in the human sense of conscious guiding. But above all I must stress that Darwinian evolution is a non-random process. One of the biggest misunderstandings, which I’m sorry to say the Cardinal has just perpetrated, is that evolution is a random process. It is the opposite of a random process.

There is no clearer evidence of the shallowness of the New Atheism. If I were to make a video about the New Atheism it would be a homage to Zoolander.

dover_beach

10 Apr 12 at 5:06 pm
I see Cory Bernardi is a bit of a fitness freak.

That’d be right. It’s my rule of thumb that the more a politician is interested in fitness, the worse they are (as a politician.) Morbid obesity is also bad, as it indicates too much interest in food.

For political exercise, morning walking is acceptable, or perhaps some laps in a pool for half an hour. Anything more and it’s wasting time.

steve from brisbane

10 Apr 12 at 5:10 pm
Stepford:

I’d say that sort of comment would be music to Monster’s ears at the moment. He seems to dislike being a porker and I’m sure he’d love to read your comments about not caring much about appearance.

Tell him, not us.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 5:13 pm
Steve since you appeared from no where were you serious about meeting me for a few beers at the Pinkenba Hotel. If so then if you are not busy then how about this weekend or any day for that matter as I am not doing anything?

kelly liddle

10 Apr 12 at 5:14 pm
For political exercise, morning walking is acceptable, or perhaps some laps in a pool for half an hour. Anything more and it’s wasting time.

…we’ll take that as a comment. Next…

Token

10 Apr 12 at 5:15 pm
JC
I would encourage you to give your opinion on this weekly blog just cut out the swearing and personal insults and you can say what you want.

How about this Kelly?

You stick to driving cabs. Don’t offer me any advice and that would make two happy campers.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 5:15 pm
So anyway JC do you comment on Cory’s blog?

kelly liddle

10 Apr 12 at 5:15 pm
haven’t got the cab yet is a time for waiting for the phone call to say “you got the loan”

kelly liddle

10 Apr 12 at 5:17 pm
So anyway JC do you comment on Cory’s blog?

Never go there, Kelly, you idiot.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 5:24 pm
JC
You are the idiot. Want to carry on having a go at Steve and Monty. Gee that will achieve your political outcomes. Hale to JC the all powerful who can have a go at Steve and Monty and left wing strays that wander onto this site. How about if you actually believe what you are saying to let politicians know, you Nimbus.

kelly liddle

10 Apr 12 at 5:30 pm
Richard Dawkins on Q&A making an absolute limey dick of himself.

Here’s the transcript.

REBEKAH RAY: Okay, my question for you today is: without religion, where is the basis of our values and in time, will we perhaps revert back to Darwin’s idea of survival of the fittest?

TONY JONES: Richard Dawkins, you can answer that and I’ll bring in Cardinal Pell.

RICHARD DAWKINS: I very much hope that we don’t revert to the idea of survival of the fittest in planning our politics and our values and our way of life. I have often said that I am a passionate Darwinian when it comes to explaining why we exist. It’s undoubtedly the reason why we’re here and why all living things are here. But to live our lives in a Darwinian way, to make a society a Darwinian society, that would be a very unpleasant sort of society in which to live. It would be a sort of Thatcherite society and we want to – I mean, in a way, I feel that one of the reasons for learning about Darwinian evolution is as an object lesson in how not to set up our values and social lives.

The little prick makes the play that we got here because of evolution implying we’re soft and and hard wired that way and then in the same breath suggests we should avoid it at all costs for the betterment of humanity.

I’m leaving the Thatcher snipe alone as we dealt with it last night.

What a crudball this fucker is. I honestly thought he was better than this.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 5:31 pm
Kelly:

I don’t go to that site as I find it boring. Now go away and stop petering me. I post comments where I want.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 5:33 pm
PP – Wow. All this when I get back from the shops. God the Omniscient, clock-watching. A bit bored just hanging around Creating, I guess. Time for a bit of Judgement, if He and that piece of work called Man can just get it together.

Good luck with all that, PP.

Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

10 Apr 12 at 5:33 pm
JC
So you believe some bit of food turns into Jesus?

kelly liddle

10 Apr 12 at 5:33 pm
But did you notice how he dodges the heart of the question, which is, “without religion, where is the basis of our values”? He does this because he has no answer.

dover_beach

10 Apr 12 at 5:36 pm
kelly: as I was inviting the mysterious tree house loving, ocean swimming, wild river canyon climbing Kelly of Kenmore as well, I wasn’t being very serious. I don’t actually live close to Pinkenba at all, but people seem to find it funny that I find it an interesting area. Also, I thought it would be somewhat amusing to invite kelly from kenmore to go to a pub that seems to heavily feature semi naked women as an attraction. Assuming she is a woman, anyway.

That said, you seem to be a very decent person who would be one of the better ones from Catallaxy to have a drink with: I have no doubt about that.

steve from brisbane

10 Apr 12 at 5:37 pm
No kelly, you missed the point again you moron.

He’s basically suggesting that we could deny the impact of Darwinism by being more leftwing.

He’s also saying that Maggie’s policies turned the place into a law of the jungle kinda place.

It turns out he’s he’s a fucking idiot. Hitch and De Botton would never say something so fucking ignorant.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 5:39 pm
Steve
Well I would like to have a few beers with you so think about it if you are not busy for this weekend or the next as when or if I get a taxi I will be busy for a bit. I think I am somewhere in the middle I am proud to say the leftists and rightists have a go at me at times. Just thinking of the things I have been called by JC it covers from facist to fabian(that I did not understand had to ask my brother) and find it bizzare that I am called a leftie fairly regularly for saying that something that the coalition is doing is not fiscally conservative. A more accurate comment might be that I am a right wing nutter when it comes to debt and government expansion.

kelly liddle

10 Apr 12 at 5:48 pm
Life in the Old Dart under the leadership of a Turnbull clone:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/conservative/9194154/The-Tory-party-has-lost-sight-of-its-true-values.html

Someone branded the tories the “nasty party” and it seems they agreed. Never let the left define you in any way or this is how you end up (note bene Hockey et al.)

Viva

10 Apr 12 at 5:53 pm
Well I would like to have a few beers with you so think about it if you are not busy for this weekend or the next as when or if I get a taxi I will be busy for a bit.

Just a quick heads up, kelly. Although Steve is definitely our gayest commenter, he is actually a married heterosexual. However if what you are proposing is just two lads getting together to discuss manscapoing and carbon apocalypse, then carry on.

Infidel Tiger

10 Apr 12 at 5:53 pm
Whoops – nota bene

Viva

10 Apr 12 at 5:54 pm
He’s basically suggesting that we could deny the impact of Darwinism by being more leftwing.

JC
Now you are changing the subject and being confused. All he is suggesting is that if you allow such a system in modern society then it will crumble. You know as a trader you come not far behind politician and banker so in a law of the jungle type situation where you couldn’t buy police protection you will be wiped out. I quite like you and think you shouldn’t be culled.

kelly liddle

10 Apr 12 at 5:56 pm
He;’s not doing anything of the sort, Kelly you nimrod. He’s suggesting … making a direct link.. that Thatcher’s Britain was a Darwinst world.

He fucking said it, you moron. I’m not making it up.

All we find out about Dawkins is that he’s just another slimy leftard dick, that’s all. Thios stuff is far above his pay-grade and he needs to leave it to the experts.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 6:00 pm
IT, if you were in Brisbane, you could share male moisturiser tips over fluffy ducks all round.

(btw, I assume kelly’s fondness for XXXX is a sure sign that he wouldn’t want to me at the Wickham.)

steve from brisbane

10 Apr 12 at 6:00 pm
Yes, Kelly, IT is right. Stepford is our gayest commenter here and a raving metrosexual to boot. So tread carefully.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 6:02 pm
I’m leaving the Thatcher snipe alone as we dealt with it last night.

So either you are a liar JC or your memory is failing after only 30 mins.

kelly liddle

10 Apr 12 at 6:04 pm
btw, I assume kelly’s fondness for XXXX is a sure sign that he wouldn’t want to me at the Wickham.)

It has quite a lovely looking facade and the clientele look rahter friendly. Wonder if they do a chicken parmi special?

Infidel Tiger

10 Apr 12 at 6:05 pm
Kelly:

I was leaving it alone in reference to that comment, you 4 by 2 thick head, as I would only be repeating what was said last evening.

Go away and get the cab.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 6:06 pm
I might out do Steve as I have no concerns about drinking at the Wickham or The Beat. It doesn’t show anything about sexuality because if you are afraid to be near gay guys you must be quite a scared man. If you go back about 20 years some rough looking truck driver shouted me all night at the beat (I looked cute back then).

kelly liddle

10 Apr 12 at 6:10 pm
Wonder if they do a chicken parmi special?

You’d think they’d aim for retro-hip and do Chicken Maryland.

lotocoti

10 Apr 12 at 6:19 pm
Steve
Well I would like to have a few beers with you

I can’t help but think: and hilarity ensues.

Gab

10 Apr 12 at 6:24 pm
It turns out he’s he’s a fucking idiot.

He’d be better off explaining why we are capable of compassion, altruism and generosity; there may be good evolutionary reasons for this, especially in the intersection of genetic variation impelled by cultural pressures. He could have shown some understanding the conscious and intelligent human mind (and body) as an artifact of sexual selection (think peacock’s tail, not just a crude Darwinian ‘fitness’) and of the place of group relationships and a sense of the spiritual in forming our very being, including our ‘soul’ (long maturational period, neotenous form, exogamy, frontal lobe enhancement etc.).

In other words, he didn’t show much real understanding of evolutionary biology at all. And he should have just said: “There is ultimately no answer to the ‘why’ question, it may not even be a question (physics might unhelpfully say it’s a singularity), but we are understanding more and more of the ‘how did we come about and why do we think and feel as we do’ question”. He should admit that we, and science, have absolutely no idea what the ‘force’ of life is, only that life exists.

I’d have concluded by saying that morality emerges early in human history from the lived experience of organic human institutions such as the family and community and inter-group trade, and from the religious civilisations and thinkers humans later produced.

The Thatcher slur demonstrated well the reflexive tendency of the left to revert to analogies that assume others see things your way only.

Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

10 Apr 12 at 6:38 pm
Dawkins seems to have no time for Frank Tipler’s Omega Point theory, which seems a bit of an oversight.

Mind you, I’m not sure the Omega Point will survive once dark energy is properly understood, that is, if dark energy removes the possibility of life being able to manipulate the universe to a collapse.

steve from brisbane

10 Apr 12 at 6:43 pm
women who use the Pill inadvertently choose beta males.

You sure it’s not the other way around, a woman with a beta male doesn’t want his children?

kae

10 Apr 12 at 6:58 pm
Lizzie:

I thought the most telling bit about the slimeball was his behavior over something Pell said that caused some of the leftwing audience to boo him.

The limey little prick smiled in appreciation back the audience as though it was great to put the other side under pressure like that. He just appeared to be a disgusting leftwing sneering little sack of shit, especially after the Thatcher comment.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 7:05 pm
“I quite like you and think you shouldn’t be culled.”

Kelly that’s the funniest thing! you have a good sense of humour.

But if you are reaching out in friendship to these dudes it won’t happen.

Andrew Bolt’s site is conservative with some pretty nice people commenting, and the site doesn’t do the swearing stuff.

Only thing is you have to post early, and that’s hard with family and job etc. it be different from here

candy

10 Apr 12 at 7:06 pm
I thought the most telling bit about the slimeball was his behavior over something Pell said that caused some of the leftwing audience to boo him.

JC I agree with that but so what? Both Pell and Dawkins did not come off well. Yes they both laughed when they should not have. You can’t really comment unless you saw the ABC tapes what Dawkins did after the boos as the cut to him was during the laughing.

kelly liddle

10 Apr 12 at 7:13 pm
Both Pell and Dawkins did not come off well.

What did Pell do or say that did not come off well?

dover_beach

10 Apr 12 at 7:17 pm
db

OK. Now re-reading everything you’re said here – especially the commentary on Dawkins/Pell – I think it has become much clearer, especially this:

For Aristotelians, body and soul are distinguishable but inseparable

and this

This is illustrative of Aristotle’s influence since he identified what he called a nutritive, sensible and rational soul. All living things, according to this view, have a nutritive soul. In addition, all animals also have a sensible soul. Finally, all human beings have, in further addition, a rational soul.

It seems what I have been highlighting (my confusion that is) is precisely what Locke was trying to highlight – his own departure from Aristotelianism (and presumably Scholasticism and the Roman Catholic church, especially post-Galileo/Council of Trent). And it seems L is making these points with as much pyrotechnics as possible.

Also, L is not rejecting Aristotle entirely. He still sides with Aristotle (and Descartes) against Plato on the substances that make up the material world. L still rejects the Platonic forms. But L does not share Aristotle’s teleology that an acorn and oak tree share the same identity because the latter is the purpose/formal cause of the former. Instead what identifies the acorn with the oak tree, the colt with the horse, and the boy with the man is exactly the same thing that individuates ALL living things (except persons):

A participation of the same continued life

Just like plants and animals

6. The identity of man. This also shows wherein the identity of the same man consists; viz. in nothing but a participation of the same continued life, by constantly fleeting particles of matter, in succession vitally united to the same organized body. (II.XXVII.6)

And even though, L allies with Descartes against the Platonic forms, L also rejects Descartes ‘innate ideas’. And L is just as much at pains to distinguish himself from Descartes (and Cartesian skepticism in general) on that point, as he is at pains to distinguish himself Aristotle, Plato, the Scholastics, on specific points.

But I am still not sure about the relationship between the soul and consciousness. If the soul is ‘the thinking substance’, how does it interact with ‘consciousness’? And what is ‘thinking’? Does ‘thinking’ cover counting, classifying, fearing, logical processes? ‘Thinking substance’ can’t mean ‘reason/rationality’, because L banishes rationality as a necessary feature of a man

(i) Where Aristotle says “body and soul are distinguishable but inseparable”, L, not only disagrees, but distinguishes between the soul and consciousness as the core of a person’s identity.

(ii) L distinguishes a ‘person’ from a ‘man’ by denying the necessity of rationality in order for a substance to be a man. In fact, L says straight up that a ‘man’ is no more than animal with a human form. Contra Arsitotle – and Scholasticism – the trait of rationality is no more necessary to define a ‘man’ as it is an anmal:

An animal is a living organized body; and consequently the same animal, as we have observed, is the same continued life communicated to different particles of matter, as they happen successively to be united to that organized living body. And whatever is talked of other definitions, ingenious observation puts it past doubt, that the idea in our minds, of which the sound man in our mouths is the sign, is nothing else but of an animal of such a certain form.

And to emphasise this departure from A, L posits a “very dull irrational man” and a “very intelligent rational parrot”. This is trolling on steroids, for L is basically saying an animal – a parrot – could have a man’s soul, while a man might have only on animal’s soul, but still be a man!

Since I think I may be confident, that, whoever should see a creature of his own shape or make, though it had no more reason all its life than a cat or a parrot, would call him still a man; or whoever should hear a cat or a parrot discourse, reason, and philosophize, would call or think it nothing but a cat or a parrot; and say, the one was a dull irrational man, and the other a very intelligent rational parrot.

(II.XXVII.8)

In other words, I think we can safely say that Cardinal Pell would be no Lockean!

Peter Patton

10 Apr 12 at 7:22 pm
Kelly

As I said, I think there are better, far better people that are able to comment on the atheist side without the need for Dawkins. He’s simply good enough.

Indirectly tying atheism with leftism, as he did with the Thatcher comment shows this fucker to be a complete ignoramus.

He’s not worth the salt content in his body to the atheist cause. Stick to Al Botton who has a sharper mind and a more agreeable personality than this barking ignorant chiwawa.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 7:22 pm
What did Pell do or say that did not come off well?

I think he was a little too umm and ah and didn’t seem steady and entertaining. It’s possibly not his medium. However he won the debate.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 7:24 pm
But if you are reaching out in friendship to these dudes it won’t happen.

Candy
That is not true. With some of the attack dogs (not mentioning any names) if you just talk to them they will stop attacking in the same way. Find it bizzare that I am called a leftie fairly regularly for saying that something that the coalition is doing is not fiscally conservative. I completely laugh this off and find it very strange as I mostly attack from the right with the stupid coalition policies but get called a leftie.

What did Pell do or say that did not come off well?

DB
Bread is metaphysically the body of Jesus if given in a church and the explanation about going to heaven in the same body and we are descended from neanderthals.

kelly liddle

10 Apr 12 at 7:29 pm
they have another, darker, agenda.

Racist.

wreckage

10 Apr 12 at 7:35 pm
Indirectly tying atheism with leftism

He didn’t actually but as far as a debate goes it is better to stick to the issue. Unless you are saying evolution is only for atheists. That is another point that Pell did not come off all that well saying that one point in time humans were created.

Both Pell and Dawkins were nervous debaters and not comfortable or professional in the situation.

kelly liddle

10 Apr 12 at 7:35 pm
I’ve now watched most of the debate. I’m not surprised some observers gave it to Dawkins. After all, lefty commentators invariably declare ‘victory’ for the non-conservative participant in debates. The ABC and the SMH used to have their headlines and ‘victory’ stories ready before the debates featuring John Howard were even over.

No but yeah.

Pell was, by far, the winner. Dawkins’ performance was embarrassing.

I especially enjoyed his Aquinas/something from nothing debacle. Which was, of course, dishonesty. I’ve commented before on how modern cosmologlical physicists try to con the public into believing they’ve made a ‘discovery’ that explicates something from nothing. But they never have and they never will. The Angelic Doctor was right 700 years ago and he’s still right now.

The Hitler gaffe was of the same stripe. Outright lies masquerading as acceptable polemical case-making on the putatively vague, negotiable margins. The Atheist Taliban always try to muddy the waters regarding the high water mark of their ideological suzerainty in the twentieth century. It was their hey-day and their erstwhile icons of unbelief became the worst mass murderers and reason-obliterators in human history.

God phoned: said to congratulate George Cardinal Pell.

C.L.

10 Apr 12 at 7:38 pm
Kelly what he said was that there is a metaphysical change from wine and bread although they taste the same. That’s simply religious doctrine and clearly not scientific as he clearly explained.

His other comment about neanderthals was as follows.

ONY JONES: Sorry, can I just bring you, in a sense, to the point of the question? Do you accept that humans evolved from apes?

GEORGE PELL: Yeah, probably. From Neanderthals, yes. Whether…

RICHARD DAWKINS: From Neanderthals?

GEORGE PELL: Probably.

RICHARD DAWKINS: Why from Neanderthals?

GEORGE PELL: Well, who else would you suggest?

RICHARD DAWKINS: Neanderthals were our cousins. We’re not descended from them and we’re both descended from…

GEORGE PELL: These are extant cousins? Where will I find a Neanderthal today if they’re my cousins?

RICHARD DAWKINS: They’re not extant, they’re extinct.

GEORGE PELL: Exactly. That’s my point.

RICHARD DAWKINS: Your point is that because they’re extant they can’t be our cousins.

GEORGE PELL: I really am not much fussed.

RICHARD DAWKINS: That’s very clear.

GEORGE PELL: Something in the evolutionary story seems to have come before humans. A lot of people say it’s the Neanderthal.

TONY JONES: But can we say this: humans – you accept that humans evolved from non humans so let me put this to you as a question: at what point in this evolutionary scale was a soul imparted to the humans from God?

Well Pell is technically correct in theory. We did descend partially from neanderthals. There’s theoretical evidence that humanoid creatures and neanderthals mated as non-African groups may have neanderthal genes.

To suggest as Dawkins has that they are extinct is inaccurate.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 7:39 pm
Gee, those things didn’t come off well. Hmmm.

dover_beach

10 Apr 12 at 7:40 pm
Gee, those things didn’t come off well. Hmmm.

the something from nothing? Yea. The audience was laughing at him and he went all sneery at them.

He contradicted himself by suggesting we can get something from nothing by putting together matter and anti-matter. Well that’s not nothing.

What a complete embarrassment.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 7:45 pm
To suggest as Dawkins has that they are extinct is inaccurate.

Yes that is a very good technical argument and correct so far as I know which only makes both of them wrong. That is my main point.

kelly liddle

10 Apr 12 at 7:46 pm
They seemed both confused, however Pell was a tad more accurate. The Chiwawa went awl.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 7:47 pm
Carpe
the comments which have vanished are on the 2011 Heiss Deadly Award thread, the first lot of vanished comments were on the latest book thread for Heiss.

There’s still Amazon!

kae

10 Apr 12 at 7:50 pm
It’s not Dawkins’s fault completely. Krauss is himself passing-off this idea that a quantum field in which particles come in and out of existence is ‘nothing’. Poor Dawkins got hustled. Them streets is dangerous, fool.

dover_beach

10 Apr 12 at 7:50 pm
Here’s Dawkins something from nothing.

RICHARD DAWKINS: Well, something can come from nothing and that is what physicists are now telling us. I could give you – you asked me to give you a layman’s interpretation. It would be very, very layman’s interpretation. When you have matter and antimatter and you put them together, they cancel each other out and give rise to nothing. What Lawrence Krauss is now suggesting is that if you start with nothing the process can go into reverse and produce matter and antimatter. The theory is still being worked out. It is a very difficult theory, mathematical theory. I’m not qualified to answer the question but what I am sure about is that it most certainly is not solved by postulating an intelligence, a creative intelligence, who raises even bigger questions of his own existence. That certainly is not going to be the answer, whatever else is.

The blacked sentence is total fucking horsehit.

Here’s Pell destroying him.

That’s the hypothesis you’ve got to wrestle with. The second thing is that Krauss says nothing about the big bang coming out of nothing and admittedly he comes clean about six pages from the end of his book and I don’t know whether Richard has read it that far because he gave it a forward. What he says is what Richard is describing as nothing is a sort of mixture of particles and perhaps a vacuum with electromagnetic forces working on it. That’s what Krauss is talking about under the heading of nothing and there’s a very good review of this in the New York Times, not a pro religious paper at all, where Krauss is absolutely denied and demolished, although especially by his supporters claiming that he says things come out of nothing. He doesn’t say that.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 7:52 pm
God phoned: said to congratulate George Cardinal Pell.

In the Latin: Veni, Vidi, Vici.

dover_beach

10 Apr 12 at 7:55 pm
There’s theoretical evidence that humanoid creatures and neanderthals mated as non-African groups may have neanderthal genes.

According to some studies on genetics, all non-African people groups have some proportion of Neanderthal in their history, I can’t remember how those numbers worked out. Google probably knows.

Anyways, to say any given European is descended from Neanderthals is not shockingly wrong and in fact may for that individual be entirely correct.

I think the Aristotle-Aquinas view gets by this “when is there a soul” question by the simple and consistent logic that it was always present but changed in character.

wreckage

10 Apr 12 at 7:57 pm
JC
Agreed in a debating sense Pell won that part. But in a logical calculation and further on in the debate Dawkins saying to explain an intelligent being is harder is also correct because both can’t be explained and one is more difficult to explain, the creation of an all powerful being.

kelly liddle

10 Apr 12 at 8:02 pm
But in a logical calculation and further on in the debate Dawkins saying to explain an intelligent being is harder is also correct because both can’t be explained and one is more difficult to explain

No, it isn’t. Only someone that is unfamiliar with and/ or misunderstands Aristotle’s argument from motion or Aquinas’s First Way, or the like, could argue this.

dover_beach

10 Apr 12 at 8:33 pm
Dawkins saying to explain an intelligent being is harder

Purely from his viewpoint. From the theistic viewpoint God is eternal and has no origin, in fact, to be God as conceived by Christians he must have no origin. In classical theism, which you can ask DB about or look for Edward Feser’s blog, being without cause or origin is absolutely necessary to the definition of God.

In other words it is hard for someone who does not believe in an eternal God to believe in an eternal God, but since Judaism that is exactly what the monotheists have believed in. To say Dawkins as an atheist doesn’t believe it is just tautology on his part.

wreckage

10 Apr 12 at 8:44 pm
Essential Research’s poll shows Labor’s support dropping to a disastrous 43 to 57 per cent (2PP) – which is where Newspoll had it last week.

The Coalition’s primary vote is an amazing 50 per cent.

Only 16 months to go.

Gab

10 Apr 12 at 8:45 pm
Meantime, the argument that vacuum states are unstable is a meaningless argument, since a vacuum state isn’t nothing, it’s a specific state of overlapping quantum fields, which are a thing.

It’s not that something coming from nothing is difficult, but that something coming from overlapping quantum fields is not something from nothing in any sense and so automatically fails.

wreckage

10 Apr 12 at 8:48 pm
Kelly

We found out last night that Dawkins should stick to his knitting, which is checking out small objects under a microscope and giving them names.

Anything to do with religion and why we’re here/how we ended up here…. and he’s nothing more than a angry barking chiwawa.

Al de Botton is the most centered atheist I’ve heard for awhile. Listen to him and you’ll do fine.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 8:49 pm
Essential Research’s poll shows Labor’s support dropping to a disastrous 43 to 57 per cent (2PP) – which is where Newspoll had it last week.

The Coalition’s primary vote is an amazing 50 per cent.

S’okay.

Gillard just needs some Clean Air to get The Message Out.

C.L.

10 Apr 12 at 8:53 pm
Only 16 months to go…

Which is ‘only’ going to feel like 16 years…

FFS, I’m sick of these embarrassing, obnoxious idiots.

Rabz

10 Apr 12 at 8:59 pm
A compassionate and caring Green:

At the forefront of Australia’s Reconciliation and anti-racism movements for many years, Michael [Quall] … passionately believes in the message of the Australian Greens, and strives in his own life, and to encourage others around him, to live the ideals of a compassionate, caring, and sustainable existence.

His tweets show a caring individual:

nomadiqueMC ‏
community development at the end of my fist. anger is a gift.

And Bolt has a few more of his tweets here

The unAustralian Greens: angry stupid poseurs.

Gab

10 Apr 12 at 9:00 pm
Um, excuse me.

But Greens candidate Michael Quall has openly called for Andrew Bolt to be killed.

Anyone shirtfronting Bob Brown about this?

C.L.

10 Apr 12 at 9:03 pm
Snap.

C.L.

10 Apr 12 at 9:05 pm
all atheists call out for God at times of severe troubles, or at the end. it just comes from within, innate.

candy

10 Apr 12 at 9:06 pm
The funny thing is I didn’t flinch about the death threat/incitement to violence from Quall. I just expect that sort of behaviour from the Greens now. And the Left in general.

Gab

10 Apr 12 at 9:07 pm
all atheists call out for God at times of severe troubles, or at the end. it just comes from within, innate.

Hitch never did. He was principled like that. I bet the squealing little chiwawa would though.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 9:10 pm
all atheists call out for God at times of severe troubles, or at the end

How do you know this? Have you spoken to “all atheists” and they’ve told you this?

Gab

10 Apr 12 at 9:10 pm
db

But did you notice how he dodges the heart of the question, which is, “without religion, where is the basis of our values”? He does this because he has no answer.

I am an atheist, and have been since I was 5 years old. But I have concluded that ‘morals/morality’ is a subject that was born with religion, and cannot be extricated from religion. It is easy (and hopefully correct) for an any individual atheist – such as myself or Richard Dawkins – to get all sniffy and shirty if told we can never be moral, blah, blah, blah. But our individual actions at this particular point in history is not the point.

The point is that people like us were born into a species/kind at a time where religion-based discourses/beliefs/guides of ‘morals/morality’ completely saturate our cognition, our language, our institutions, our cultural practices, so much so that it would be impossible to abstract ourselves from religion’s imprint, and talk about ‘atheist morality’. I have a very strong intuition that one of the features of our evolutionary trajectory has been selecting for ‘the god gene’; especially since the Neolithic. Now, the corollary of that is, that we are currently ‘moving through’ a ‘religious phase’. But that is one hypothesis even Richard Dawkins would concede is beyond ‘science’s’ ability to determine.

When I say I am atheist/don’t believe in god, that does nothing to change the irrefutable fact that I was born into, walk, talk, sleep, dream, and self-reflect in a leviathan of Xian (or Judeo-Xian/Abrahamic/blah) morality. And that goes double for Richard Dawkins, coz, unlike me, he was educated from 4-18 in staunchly Xian [Anglican] schools, including chapel 5 days a week. Not only is he baptised, but confirmed. And his chosen professional field has been part of that Xian mindset for millenia.

That is why it is so effortless – indeed natural – for a 21st century Professor of Biology to connect his work to just about any part of Judeo-Xian-Hellenic thought over the past 2,500 years. He is an inescapable product of Xian morality, and even a walking/talking/jetlagged evangelist of that Xian morality. There is nothing whatever ‘out-of-this-world’ about not believing in the Xian god. The whole moral force of that religion is premised precisely on a world filled with people of precisely that ilk.

Peter Patton

10 Apr 12 at 9:10 pm
This is amazing, but I never know if I can believe these stories:

The mural was meant to depict the life of a man and it ended with the scene with the man, woman and a child. The student artist, 17-year-old Liz Bierendy, said that she depicted the man and woman has married with wedding rings. According to Horoshack’s press release the scene was painted over because “some of the members of the Pilgrim High School community suggested that the depiction of a young man’s development from boyhood through adulthood as displayed may not represent the life experiences of many of the students at Pilgrim High School.”

Token

10 Apr 12 at 9:11 pm
not believing in the Xian god.

Peter, is he the one that lives in China?

Gab

10 Apr 12 at 9:12 pm
But Greens candidate Michael Quall has openly called for Andrew Bolt to be killed.

Anyone shirtfronting Bob Brown about this?

But Bob cares about the ‘vironment.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 9:13 pm
It’s worth reading his tweets to see just what an angry irrational man is this Greens candidate. He’ll fit right in with the rest of the Earthians.

Gab

10 Apr 12 at 9:17 pm
Can the ALP get under 40% primary vote?
Maybe some are going Green which is holding their support on 11% when they should be going down as well.

Rafe

10 Apr 12 at 9:18 pm
Gab
Chinese one

LOL

For some reason that abbreviation kinda annoys me, can’t put my finger on it, but I pronounce it as
ex – ian.

But now I will see it as Shi-an, which is how X is pronounced in Chinese.

LOL

kae

10 Apr 12 at 9:18 pm
Yeah, it annoys me too, Kae, but what can one do about it? Nothing. Except mock occasionally.

Gab

10 Apr 12 at 9:21 pm
More from the postracial president’s former pastor.

Rev. Jeremiah Wright delivered three fiery sermons about faith, race and politics at Metropolitan Baptist Church in Charleston, West Virginia
Wright said Supreme Court Justice Clarence Thomas worships “some other God” outside of “Allah and Yahweh” (who are the “same” he says)
Obama’s former pastor called Thomas Jefferson “a pedophile”
He sees “white supremacy” driving “world policy”
Wright condemned the U.S. military, saying, “fighting for peace is like raping for virgin

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/rev-wright-unleashes-new-racially-charged-sermons-justice-clarence-thomas-is-worshipping-some-other-god/

JC

10 Apr 12 at 9:24 pm
Peter, is he the one that lives in China?

No, he’s the one Peter thinks he’s insulting by refusing to name. Which is very self-beclowning – and typically clueless of POP (Poor Old Pete) – because using the Crux Decussata or the Chi Rho have been holy, acceptable and sometimes necessary shorthand for Christ since Apostolic times.

Peter also thinks “rock choppers” (RCs) is insulting to Australian Irish Catholics. Which must be why we memorialise chained, praying convicts in stained glass at St Mary’s.

C.L.

10 Apr 12 at 9:27 pm
Can the ALP get under 40% primary vote?

I believe that’s their 2012 Q3 target, Rafe.

Gab

10 Apr 12 at 9:28 pm
George Zimmermann set up his own website:
The Real George Zimmerman

On Sunday February 26th, I was involved in a life altering event which led me to become the subject of intense media coverage. As a result of the incident and subsequent media coverage, I have been forced to leave my home, my school, my employer, my family and ultimately, my entire life. This website’s sole purpose is to ensure my supporters they are receiving my full attention without any intermediaries.

JamesK

10 Apr 12 at 9:34 pm
Of course, there is always the much less paranoid explanation. Fewer key strokes.

Peter Patton

10 Apr 12 at 9:36 pm
Is there anything the Sun King can not achieve?

When the US prisons under the Bush-Hitler hold terrorists, they are sub-human hell-holes.

When the exact same US prisons hold the exact same prisoners under Nobel Laureate and lefty luvvie hero Obummer, they are “a fitting repository”.

Judges at the European Court of Human Rights appear to have had something of an epiphany. They have looked closely at the American penal system and found, much to their surprise no doubt, that it is not the barbaric hell-hole they imagined it was. They decided this morning that an American “SuperMax” prison was a fitting repository for a group of terrorist suspects – including Abu Hamza – who are currently detained in British prisons.

Token

10 Apr 12 at 9:37 pm
James but how do we know that is the real Zimmerman?

Gab

10 Apr 12 at 9:37 pm
New York Post, Dick Morris: O’s losing strategy
It’s all fear and envy, no hope

The shape of President Obama’s re-election strategy is coming clear. The key elements:

1) Don’t run on your record; run as if there were no incumbent

2) Stress class warfare; exploit fear of Republican spending cuts. Harp on the negatives.

3) Hide the negatives about your record in a miasma of general pessimism. (Medicare was broken before we got here; headwinds slowed the economy.)

It’s hard to see how this works. Economic populism has never been able to reach more than about 40 percent of the American electorate. And the only modern incumbent to run away from his record and win was Harry Truman in the aftermath of World War II and the Roosevelt era.

So what are the people around Obama thinking?

They seem to be betting that a decided shift in our political culture in the past decade has transformed class envy and save-government-spending demagoguery into a way to win a majority.

JamesK

10 Apr 12 at 9:38 pm
not believing in the Xian god.

Peter, is he the one that lives in China?

Why not, it is very appropriate, the growth in Christians in China outstrips the growth in any other part of the planet. How culturally sensitive of you Peter

Token

10 Apr 12 at 9:41 pm
But if it genuinely distresses you so much, just say so, and I will type long-hand from now on. But, CL, given that you actually seem to understand where I get ‘Xian’ from – a knowledge of history – then god knows what you’re on about.

Peter Patton

10 Apr 12 at 9:41 pm
token

Or perhaps I’ve just got Jesuit-envy!

Peter Patton

10 Apr 12 at 9:42 pm
I get the impression Peter is not talking to me. This makes me sad.

Gab

10 Apr 12 at 9:43 pm
Maureen Dowd, one of the NYT’s space cadet leftists:
What Would Jesus Do at the Masters?

THERE was a boys’ club, of course, a band of ardent, jockeying disciples. But as his fame grew, the messiah was also surrounded by women and talked about women with great respect. With his father far away, the golden boy was most influenced by his strong mother and the women in his inner circle.

I’m talking about the real messiah, not Barack Obama, although it applies to both.

Short version:

1.Saudi Arabia, the Pope, Republicans and the Masters Golf Club

2.What do they have in common?

3.Answer: hatred of women.

JamesK

10 Apr 12 at 9:45 pm
Gab, the first part was to you. I am sorry, I only realised the second part was just for CL, forgetting to include you in the introduction. Love and kisses.

Peter Patton

10 Apr 12 at 9:47 pm
Lol

This hate women shtick is really getting old now.

I always thought the GOP-hates-polar-bears was a pretty decent twist sure to get new mileage, but since climategate that one has gone off the boil..no pun intended.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 9:50 pm
Interesting to speculate – if there is the possibility of other universes in other dimensions perhaps the big bang occurred at the death of some other cosmos which provided the raw material for the birth of ours.

Viva

10 Apr 12 at 9:51 pm
all atheists call out for God at times of severe troubles, or at the end. it just comes from within, innate.

Bullshit.

Quentin George

10 Apr 12 at 9:56 pm
Who knows Viva. However if you ask Dawkins he’s got it down pat. Get a flask full of nothing, stick some antimatter in there and you get nothing which then turns to something ans you have the origins of our universe according to him.

Then when you’ve done that and you end up with humans make sure you don’t vote for a right winger like Maggie Thatcher as that gets us back to how we ended up here.

What an annoying unpleasant little man he is.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 9:59 pm
This guy’s mo’ gets the big No from the followers of the big Mo’.

There is no finer mark of a Pakistani man than a fully oiled, waxed and twirled moustache. For 18 years, Amir Muhammad Afridi’s vast handlebar moustache, curling as high as his forehead, made him a celebrity throughout the rugged, tribal lands that border Afghanistan.

But that was until his luxuriant facial hair came to the attention of Lashkar-i-Islam, extremists who are fighting to impose hardline Sharia in the Khyber agency where Mr Afridi lived.

For the past two years he has braved death threats, intimidation and been forced to flee his home all in the name of a moustache that demands 30 minutes of grooming every morning. (It’s a highly specialised regimen involving almond oil, hairdryers and a secret wax that no amount of pleading will make him reveal.)

“They arrested me in broad daylight, put me in their car,” he told me. “They took me to a religious scholar who declared the moustache un-Islamic and ordered it removed.

At least you are legally allowed to be an athiest here Peter. Imagine what they would do to you in Pakistan?

Token

10 Apr 12 at 10:02 pm
Can the ALP get under 40% primary vote?

Shouldn’t that be two party preferred?
I reckon Jules is good for a 23% primary/36% 2PP.

lotocoti

10 Apr 12 at 10:04 pm
I doubt I’d be an atheist if I lived there. They get you from the bottle, munching on carpet with your ass to Paradise FIVE fricking times a day. And the only words you utter from most of your childhood are the ones between the covers of The Koran. They would’ve had control of me before I was 5.

Peter Patton

10 Apr 12 at 10:06 pm
NBC: Trayvon Martin call was “mistake, not deliberate”

NBC News’ decision to air an edited call from George Zimmerman to police in the moments before he shot Trayvon Martin was “a mistake and not a deliberate act to misrepresent the phone call,” according to the president of the network’s news division.

Short version: Two lowlies fired, executives knew nada and are totally innocent and it’s all been a mistake or somesuch

JamesK

10 Apr 12 at 10:08 pm
India: Islamic seminary issues fatwa against beauty parlors, saying they’re against Sharia

…What’s more, it isn’t just these Muslim authorities in India who are getting Islam all wrong. Jihadists have attacked beauty parlors in Nigeria, and Islamic supremacists implementing Sharia have closed beauty parlors in Aceh in Indonesia and Fallujah in Iraq, as well as in Kashmir.

“Deoband issues fatwa against running beauty parlours,” from The Indian Express, April 4

* At each of the places highlighted people have attacked beauty parlours in the name of the prophet

Token

10 Apr 12 at 10:08 pm
No distress, Peter. I just know how much you detest Christians and Catholics in particular. You’ve mentioned it many many many times and amp up it on Christian holidays. Not that i want you to change or anything. But just occasionally I have the “right” to snark back at your comments.

Gab

10 Apr 12 at 10:13 pm
Facebook buys instagram for one billion dollars. This is not any sort of valid commerce. This is a dog and pony show.

Ghost Of Midyear Christmas Past

10 Apr 12 at 10:26 pm
Another Occupier Exposes Herself (Himself) to Minors

Like the multiple rapes, exposing oneself is also fast becoming a trend amongst the now-fizzled Occupy movement.

Token

10 Apr 12 at 10:35 pm
But, CL, given that you actually seem to understand where I get ‘Xian’ from – a knowledge of history – then god knows what you’re on about.

I do know about history, Peter, yes.

I also know you’re bullshitting when you claim that your ‘X’ was really marking the historical spot.

C.L.

10 Apr 12 at 10:37 pm
“Who knows Viva. However if you ask Dawkins he’s got it down pat. Get a flask full of nothing, stick some antimatter in there and you get nothing which then turns to something ans you have the origins of our universe according to him….’

That is the problem for sure. The people allegedly sticking up for science and atheism making such a hash of things. Of course Dawkins is usually pretty fast on his feet. But I was astonished to find that after all this time he hadn’t jettisoned the Big Bang and most of his dim-witted mates that are on his team.

Ghost Of Midyear Christmas Past

10 Apr 12 at 10:38 pm
NBC: Trayvon Martin call was “mistake, not deliberate”

Also a lie.

PJTV (video): How NBC Edited Racism Into the George Zimmerman 911 Call. In an edit bay, demonstrating why this wasn’t a simple “mistake.”

C.L.

10 Apr 12 at 10:41 pm
NBC: Trayvon Martin call was “mistake, not deliberate”

Also a lie.

Sure his, NBC’s history:

After all, under Capus’ leadership, NBC News has twice before maliciously edited newscasts in order to inflame racial division and attack conservatives–all, of course, in an effort to help Barack Obama.

…In August of 2009, NBC’s Contessa Brewer (who still has the same job) used deceptive editing so that that MSNBC viewers wouldn’t know that the man carrying firearms to a Tea Party was a black man. After all, under Capus’ leadership, NBC News has twice before maliciously edited newscasts in order to inflame racial division and attack conservatives–all, of course, in an effort to help Barack Obama.

In August of 2009, NBC’s Contessa Brewer (who still has the same job) used deceptive editing so that that MSNBC viewers wouldn’t know that the man carrying firearms to a Tea Party was a black man. This allowed Brewer to then host a segment about how racist the Tea Party is towards President Obama and how this racism might just lead to the unthinkable–the assassination of our President…

Which probably explains why just a couple years later, NBC’s Ed Schultz did the exact same thing to Texas Governor Rick Perry, who was then a candidate for the GOP presidential nomination.

Token

10 Apr 12 at 10:45 pm
It’s official now. The president of the US is a first rate dickhead.

http://www.whitehousedossier.com/2012/04/09/white-house-basketballs-emblazoned-image/

JC

10 Apr 12 at 10:53 pm
Is there anything the Sun King can not achieve?

When the US prisons under the Bush-Hitler hold terrorists, they are sub-human hell-holes.

When the exact same US prisons hold the exact same prisoners under Nobel Laureate and lefty luvvie hero Obummer, they are “a fitting repository”.

Not quite. It’s actually worse than that as a concocted figleaf especially made for Obama. The UK Tele reporter played the wrong – which is to say, simplistic – angle.

Republicans had sought to ban terror detainees being imprisoned and tried anywhere but Cuba. Sending them to domestic supermaxes was considered inappropriate because they weren’t criminal defendants but terrorists and unlawful combatants. The Democrats were the ones pushing for places like the Florence Supermax as part of their attempt to mainstream terrorists as Miranda-worthy ‘defendants.’

C.L.

10 Apr 12 at 11:01 pm
George Zimmermann set up his own website:
The Real George Zimmerman

Sorry, but I call bullshit.

sdog

10 Apr 12 at 11:01 pm
“I have created a Paypal account solely linked on this website as I would like to provide an avenue to thank my supporters personally and ensure that any funds provided are used only for living expenses and legal defense, in lieu of my forced inability to maintain employment. I will also personally, maintain accountability of all funds received. I reassure you, every donation is appreciated.”

And what’s to say the money’s not going to a Syrian Lesbian in Edinburgh?

sdog

10 Apr 12 at 11:04 pm
all atheists call out for God at times of severe troubles, or at the end. it just comes from within, innate.

So when someone’s last words are “Oh shit” are they calling from a deeply spiritual place within for the miraculous intervention of The Great Turd?

Look, I believe in God. I don’t believe there can be a coherent universe either of physics or metaphysics without God. But I think it’s a bit low, and possibly beside the point, to tell people they’ll wish there was a God right before their car ploughs into a tree.

wreckage

10 Apr 12 at 11:09 pm
White House basketballs emblazoned with the face of the US Emperor-in-waiting. FMD.

I fully expect to a Saddam Hussein like statue of His Majesty erected in the grounds of the White House before this preening impostor is turfed out on his (prominent) ear.

I had thought the foam Greek altar thing at Obama’s inauguration was the hight of tastelessness, but I could be wrong. Plenty of opportunities going begging before eviction day.

Pedro the Ignorant

10 Apr 12 at 11:13 pm
all atheists call out for God at times of severe troubles, or at the end. it just comes from within, innate.

Candy, I am taking a guess that you have been close to people who have found some comfort in this way, perhaps you work as a nurse or something similar. I think you are right, and that it is within us all to have half a hope at times, although we dreadful non-believers are a bit wry about it with ourselves and shake out of it after the moment. It’s the old ‘no atheists in a foxhole’ syndrome. Personally, as PP says, I find our Judeo-Christian heritage lives on in thought and language. For instance, I always invoke the Lord’s name, although taking it very much in vain, in desperate circumstances on the road or when misjudging with hammer and nail, thus allowing a brief credence in assistance from above.

Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

10 Apr 12 at 11:16 pm
But I think it’s a bit low, and possibly beside the point, to tell people they’ll wish there was a God right before their car ploughs into a tree.

Yeah well people call out “Oh God” at other times in their lives. Doesn’t necessarily mean they believe in God.

Gab

10 Apr 12 at 11:17 pm
The Democrats were the ones pushing for places like the Florence Supermax as part of their attempt to mainstream terrorists as Miranda-worthy ‘defendants.’

And to make the FBI and domestic Police forces both combatants in a very dirty war and prison-camp guards ala WW2. There are very, very good reasons to keep the Police/ FBI/ Judicial system out of this kind of filth (terrorism, espionage, counter-espionage), and one of them is that very rarely does contamination not flow both ways.

If it comes down to beating the hell out of a prisoner or watching a US city hit by, say, a dirty bomb or suitcase nuke, you do not want regular cops doing the beating. You don’t want them doing any of the “enhanced interrogation” either.

There are things that it is acceptable to do to enemy combatants in war – like bomb their base of operations, or strafe crowds of them with machine guns – that are never acceptable against mere domestic criminals.

Ensuring that the responsibilities and acceptable actions of warfare versus policing are as wholly and cleanly divided as possible is imperative. Keep the Police out of military matters* and the Army out of civilian policing matters, or you’re courting disaster.

*an offence by a military person against a domestic civilian is clearly not a military matter, just in case anyone jumps on this.

wreckage

10 Apr 12 at 11:20 pm
What to buy Gab.

I’m thinking of turfing some money into the fertilizer producers.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 11:20 pm
when misjudging with hammer and nail

Hey, that sounds like it offends my religion! THAT’S RACIST against Scottish Presbyterians.

wreckage

10 Apr 12 at 11:22 pm
Well, JC, WNR is not going so well and the general buzz is that you were right to dump the stock. (And buy later when price is lower).

fertilizer producers.

I hear there’s increasing demand given all the bombings.

Gab

10 Apr 12 at 11:24 pm
I’m thinking of turfing some money into the fertilizer producers.

Isn’t coal-seam gas etc really dropping their cost of production? S’what I heard.

wreckage

10 Apr 12 at 11:25 pm
If you could Chinese rare earth minerals shares you’d be on a winner, JC.

Gab

10 Apr 12 at 11:29 pm
Yea, I mentioned that a little while ago.

I’m also thinking of cummins engines but I can’t do it. I bought that stock in 09 at 35ish. let it go at 58 and it’s now 115 after hitting just under 130 bucks a share.

They have a great suite of truck engines and some are now convertible to gas.

But I can’t touch it up here.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 11:29 pm
one minute to go before the open. We open down now again!

JC

10 Apr 12 at 11:30 pm
lol you love it when that bell rings.

Gab

10 Apr 12 at 11:32 pm
Lizzy

I always invoke the Lord’s name, although taking it very much in vain, in desperate circumstances on the road or when misjudging with hammer and nail, thus allowing a brief credence in assistance from above.

I’m pretty sure you’re supposed to say it before you whack your thumb with the hammer/have the accident.

kae

10 Apr 12 at 11:32 pm
Blast, forgot quotes.

kae

10 Apr 12 at 11:32 pm
Fuuuuuck Apple hits all time of 642 bucks a share. Who needs Jobs.

http://www.google.com/finance?q=NASDAQ:AAPL

The stock has been going one way since he’s gone.

Where’s Lester to celebrate.

That thing is hitting 1000 bucks a share before we’re done and lots people who think that’s where it’s gone are not on board.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 11:35 pm
Here, kae:

sdog

10 Apr 12 at 11:37 pm
As Apple is exploding higher this comes out.

Sony Revises Expected Loss to $6.4 Billion
New York Times – 1 hour ago

TOKYO – Sony more than doubled its projected net loss for the past financial year to ¥520 billion, its worst loss ever, as an additional tax expense hurt a company already battered by heavy losses in its television business,

Battered TV market/ Sony doesn’t know what battered means until later this year when Apple comes out with iTV which will revolutionize the Television.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 11:38 pm
Any thread which quotes me in the OP is beneath me to respond to.

m0nty

10 Apr 12 at 11:45 pm
Oh Monty, do not sulk. Please.

Gab

10 Apr 12 at 11:48 pm
Let him sulk. It’s beneficial and lets him free up some emotional energy.

Monster, you keeping sulking you big baby.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 11:49 pm
Maybe Palin was right about those ‘death panels’.

The NYT is acting like this is sort of posh. But one look at the headline — “For the Elderly, Emergency Rooms of Their Own” — and my “Death Panels!” red flag went up. Let’s make them very comfortable, let’s palliate, but let’s not save them. The heroic treatments are in that other emergency room, the one for the people who are still useful.

http://althouse.blogspot.com.au/2012/04/trend-watch-segregated-hospital.html

Gab

10 Apr 12 at 11:54 pm
I am so not sulking. I have had an awesome week and am in a very good place in my life right now. You have no idea.

m0nty

10 Apr 12 at 11:55 pm
Hey Gab

This has to be the biggest dummy spit since Stepford went bonkers that time and left the Cat, promising never to return (we all cheered of course).

I think it’s a bigger dummy spit in some ways as he’s still bawling.

JC

10 Apr 12 at 11:56 pm
Kae – no, when I am being the Hammer of the Scots (self-injury Wreckage, not Edward Longshanks hoeing into Alba, I was born in Glasgow and have bad aim) it’s in the agony period post-incident that I invoke the Lord, as in O Jesus Effing Christ, that huuuurts. Seems to make it better, too. However, when a State Transit bus swipes me off the road, as happened recently (I hate public transport even more now), I reach for O God, O, effing hell, a prior or at least coterminus call for divine aid as the disaster unfolds in slow motion. (I am being polite with the f-word tonight, I say it outright in situations as above).

Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

10 Apr 12 at 11:57 pm
Look Monty, you’ve done nothing but derail threads complaining about your treatment here. Now you have a thread in your honour in which you can quetch to your heart’s content without derailing.

I say go for it.

Gab

10 Apr 12 at 11:58 pm
I have had an awesome week and am in a very good place in my life right now. You have no idea.

So you’ve been going to gym, training, eating less? What?

JC

10 Apr 12 at 11:59 pm
An excellent set of reasons why I shouldn’t be there, Gab.

m0nty

10 Apr 12 at 11:59 pm
This has to be the biggest dummy spit since Stepford went bonkers

Oh I don’t know about that. It was pretty awesome…and then there was Tillman’s meltdown too.

You’re asking Monty to fill some pretty big shoes in the tantrum stakes.

Gab

11 Apr 12 at 12:00 am
Tell you what JC. I’ll go to the gym if you commit to producing something of worth to society, instead of the parasite you have been all your life. Go!!!

m0nty

11 Apr 12 at 12:02 am
Lol…

Monster, just take my advice and get some of that lard off. You’ll feel happier, become more mobile and with a decent set of new clothes could attract decent talent, which at your age is what you ought to be doing and aiming for.

It’s good advice and could end up saving your life too, you numbskull.

Now get to a gym.

JC

11 Apr 12 at 12:07 am
JC’s never worked at the ABC, Monty.

Gab

11 Apr 12 at 12:07 am
JC, do you remember that lefty that staged a walk-off simply because he didn’t appreciate that many reasonable people would have supported Barborossa, not having the benefit of retrospective knowledge?

There was a fundamental inability to appreciate the idea that history happens but one day at a time.

Ghost Of Midyear Christmas Past

11 Apr 12 at 12:08 am
JC’s never worked

Quite, Gab.

m0nty

11 Apr 12 at 12:11 am
God, I miss Hitch.

Eh, not a bad idea. Hey, god, prove you exist – restore Hitch to full health and rambunctious contrariness!

Abu Chowdah

11 Apr 12 at 12:12 am
Take Monty, god. He has no prospects and contributes nothing. Not even wit. I’ll gladly lay down the Monty to restore the Hitch. We reaaaaaally, miss him, Yahweh, old fruit.

Abu Chowdah

11 Apr 12 at 12:13 am
Smite him! He’s cool with it, as the Left has a thing for violence.

Abu Chowdah

11 Apr 12 at 12:14 am
No Birdie. I don’t recall that. Anyways I think operation Barb is a sore point here. Since you were… err left the site.. it comes up frequently leaving body parts strewn all over the place.

I think Lester is one side of that argument.

JC

11 Apr 12 at 12:15 am
An excellent set of reasons why I shouldn’t be there, Gab.

No, you’re being a chicken. Monty, like a typical bully you run when confronted.

Gab

11 Apr 12 at 12:15 am
Yea hitch was good value. I kinda miss him too. The dude was really a libertarian but didn’t know.

JC

11 Apr 12 at 12:16 am
Sinc has posted a whole thread devoted to the mob reassuring him that he’s a good bloke and he should keep on enabling their incivility. Good luck to him, but it’s a thread for his benefit, not mine.

m0nty

11 Apr 12 at 12:17 am
.. if you commit to producing something of worth to society ..

I am struggling to understand what you are getting at here mont. So please give us some examples of such products of worth, especially those for which you have been responsible.

Lazlo

11 Apr 12 at 12:18 am
Oh I think he knew, JC.

Abu Chowdah

11 Apr 12 at 12:18 am
God! God! There he is! Popped his dough-like face up just a minute ago. Smite him good and proper! Smite him for six!

Abu Chowdah

11 Apr 12 at 12:20 am
Oh I think he knew, JC.

I read an interview with Hitch in Reason going back perhaps 7 years ago and I think he didn’t believe he was. Perhaps he progressed.

I’ll try and dig up the interview.

JC

11 Apr 12 at 12:20 am
devoted to the mob reassuring him that he’s a good bloke

LOL Sinclair strikes me a one who really doesn’t give a toss what others think of him. You’re way off base Monty and possibly just projecting.

Gab

11 Apr 12 at 12:21 am
Sinc has posted a whole thread devoted to the mob reassuring him that he’s a good bloke and he should keep on enabling their incivility.

No it’s not. He’s making light of your idiocy.

Good luck to him, but it’s a thread for his benefit, not mine.

Coward.

Look Monster, this site isn’t generally moderated and therefore free flowing.

If you don’t like it then seriously, just fuck off and not come back.

JC

11 Apr 12 at 12:24 am
I am struggling to understand what you are getting at here mont. So please give us some examples of such products of worth, especially those for which you have been responsible.

I have created a Web site based around products of original journalism which is now getting 300,000 unique visitors per week. I made that site myself out of nothing.

JC has produced… what? Anything? No, liver disease doesn’t count. Bile is not a saleable product.

m0nty

11 Apr 12 at 12:24 am
JC has produced… what? Anything?

A couple of upstanding decent human beings who contribute to society.

Top that, Monty.

Gab

11 Apr 12 at 12:26 am
Yep, really miss him. His piece on why women can’t do comedy was so accurate it hurt. We can be smart and sassy but just can’t tell jokes properly. The Hairy Ape is so good with the one-liners, he cracks me up, and he can blarney a tale to a very successful end, whereas I always muck up the story and muddle the punch line. So do all my girlfriends, and girls just don’t do pub jokes like that, we do different jokes when we’re at coffee, knowing in-jokes about guys, and weight loss and how a bargain purchase turned out not to be a bargain at all, etc.

Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

11 Apr 12 at 12:26 am
A couple of upstanding decent human beings who contribute to society.

I’m not going to drag his family into a debate. That’s too personal.

m0nty

11 Apr 12 at 12:29 am
I have created a Web site based around products of original journalism which is now getting 300,000 unique visitors per week. I made that site myself out of nothing.

And I offered you some advice once. It looks like a dogs breakfast and you refuse to get it fixed.

JC has produced… what? Anything?

Yea Monster I have, responsible for trading groups and my own trading contribution that produced around $500 million in gross profits during the 24 odd years I was running trading desks.

No, liver disease doesn’t count. Bile is not a saleable product.

Look, you continue derailing threads, post worthless swill, refuse to answer points of order and nothing will change.

Change your behavior and it might. might only.

JC

11 Apr 12 at 12:30 am
I have created a Web site based around products of original journalism which is now getting 300,000 unique visitors per week. I made that site myself out of nothing.

Had the web been around in the 1930′s I’m sure Heydrich could have made the same claim. He would have fervently believed it to of worth to society.

Your point is?

Lazlo

11 Apr 12 at 12:31 am
If JC is a trader, he contributes daily to both the efficient allocation of capital and to providing invaluable signalling to the market.

Speculators, to be successful, have to provide both accurate signalling (buying when something is about to go up, selling when it is about to go down, so to speak, thus driving early price-signals) and market smoothing: if they buy at top and sell at bottom they fail to make a profit. The more they smooth the market, the more profit they make and the more stable the market is.

wreckage

11 Apr 12 at 12:34 am
INDONESIAN authorities have forcibly removed the group of Afghan asylum seekers from a tanker moored at a port on western Java island.

They were loaded on to two buses under armed guard and taken to a hotel in Merak, ending a standoff that began on Sunday.

As police began to remove them, one of the asylum seekers began to bash himself in the head with a metal fitting he had picked up off the deck.

The group of about 120 males, all from Afghanistan, were picked up on Sunday by a Singaporean-flagged tanker after a distress call and were taken to the port of Merak.

Of the 120 asylum seekers, 20 are under the age of 18 and the youngest is 14.

Earlier they seemed to agree to leave the ship after authorities said they would take them to a hotel in Merak and not a detention centre.

Four members of the group had left the vessel to inspect the hotel, but on their return, following a discussion with the rest of the group, they decided to stay on the vessel.

One of the asylum seekers then yelled from the deck, “We don’t trust them,” adding: “We don’t want to go to the jail”.

Indonesian police started removing their bags as the asylum seekers remained seated on the deck in a large group with their arms linked to thwart any attempts to remove them.

The men had refused to disembark from the vessel unless they are resettled in Australia.
…

“We want to meet with Australian officials,” he said.

Ali also said conditions aboard the tanker had deteriorated, but that the group would not give up on their quest to make it to Australia.

“We don’t have food, we don’t have enough water. We sleep out in the open on the deck like animals,” he said.

“But some of us have paid $5000 to go to Australia. We don’t want to be in Indonesia.”
…
The group rescued on Sunday say they fear that if they stay in Indonesia, it will take years before they are resettled.

But it’s okay for the others who don’t have the money to stay in the queue. Not for them a quick trip to into the arms of the softheaded Australian givernment.

Gab

11 Apr 12 at 12:35 am
Seriously Lazlo? You are Godwinning on that basis?

Tomorrow: Steve from Brisbane remarks on what a lovely day it is, gets accused of having the same reaction Hitler would to the same weather.

m0nty

11 Apr 12 at 12:35 am
Reading some of the comments from the god believers I find it unfair that athiests must prove how the universe exists but the religious do not have to prove how god exists.

Having morality has nothing to do with religion even though it is a part of religion.

Self preservation and logic is possibly a better way to teach morals.

Take just this one simple arguement on “Thou Shall Not Kill”

This will in most cases increase your chance of survival and should make wars etc much less likely so no reason to say because god said. If people start killing each other their wealth on average will be reduced due the the effort required to have defences and money spent on personal protection which is wasted production. So with most “Moral” positions it is only common sense and god does not need to be brought into the picture.

One thing that Pell said I did like and that is that athiests should be able to go to heaven and I was surprised to hear this from him.

kelly liddle

11 Apr 12 at 12:35 am
And this “shosiety” schtick is so fucking fascist, Monster. It’s so criminally fascist that it’s even offensive to read such gunk.

I have no responsibility to anyone in this shosiety. I pay my fucking taxes and obey the rules that are set. Nothing is expected of me and I don’t expect anything from you or others.

If I was broke I’d get a job in 3 hours tops and it wouldn’t matter if I was washing dishes. Now get lost.

JC

11 Apr 12 at 12:37 am
but the religious do not have to prove how god exists.

Aquinas did.

Gab

11 Apr 12 at 12:38 am
Seriously Lazlo? You are Godwinning on that basis?

No idea what you are talking about. But if your claim to sanctity compared to JC is putting up a web site, then I am calling pompous bullshit.

Lazlo

11 Apr 12 at 12:40 am
Yea Monster I have, responsible for trading groups and my own trading contribution that produced around $500 million in gross profits during the 24 odd years I was running trading desks.

JC this could mean you are a failure if you do not include further explanation. It has to be compared to the market. So did you outperform the market? It is only the out performance which can be considered created by you.

kelly liddle

11 Apr 12 at 12:41 am
One thing that Pell said I did like and that is that athiests should be able to go to heaven and I was surprised to hear this from him.

Why do you care?

JC

11 Apr 12 at 12:41 am
Gab
I don’t know who Aquinas is but it is not possible to prove that god exists just as it is not possible to prove how a universe is created.

To just accept at this stage we are here and it is not possible to know how or why we are here is ok by me.

kelly liddle

11 Apr 12 at 12:44 am
JC this could mean you are a failure if you do not include further explanation. It has to be compared to the market. So did you outperform the market? It is only the out performance which can be considered created by you.

Outperform the market? We were part of a bank, so you can’t say compare with a stock index.

However return capital deployed was very high as trading groups of our type used very little capital in comparison. In fact under Basle our capital needs that were devoted to trading was perhaps no more than $30 million. This is why banks love good trading operations.

JC

11 Apr 12 at 12:46 am
I don’t know who Aquinas is

Google is your friend.

Gab

11 Apr 12 at 12:47 am
oops wasn’t very high…

JC

11 Apr 12 at 12:47 am
If JC is a trader, he contributes daily to both the efficient allocation of capital and to providing invaluable signalling to the market.

Speculators, to be successful, have to provide both accurate signalling (buying when something is about to go up, selling when it is about to go down, so to speak, thus driving early price-signals) and market smoothing: if they buy at top and sell at bottom they fail to make a profit. The more they smooth the market, the more profit they make and the more stable the market is.

That is rubbish, wreckage. Consider the extreme scenario whereby all stock prices stayed the same from year to year. There would be no profit to make at all by speculators, and there would be no need for them. They make more money when there is more volatility. Change means profit. Creative destruction.

The real problem is that speculators like JC have long since moved on past their role of serving the market, and the market now serves them. They are the alpha predators. Which is another name for parasites.

m0nty

11 Apr 12 at 12:47 am
Why do you care?

Well this to me seems to be an advancement in religion accepting that belief in god is not important and therefor morals are more important. This is a better position to have than to tell others that they are going to hell because they do not believe what I believe. So I think this position is better for society the one I live in as I don’t think there is any afterlife.

kelly liddle

11 Apr 12 at 12:48 am
You sound like you’re jealous of JC, Monts.

Gab

11 Apr 12 at 12:49 am
I do believe that ranty Greens MP has yanked his comment and profile from amazon. Unless I am not using the search function properly. Does anyone have a link to his profile.

It would be in keeping for him to shit everywhere then cover it up, the coward.

Abu Chowdah

11 Apr 12 at 12:49 am
No idea what you are talking about. But if your claim to sanctity compared to JC is putting up a web site, then I am calling pompous bullshit.

You compared me to a Nazi, Lazlo. You are the one spinning bullshit. Look up Godwin’s Law. You’re a primary example of the sort of brainless idiot who doesn’t realise how lame you sound.

m0nty

11 Apr 12 at 12:50 am
Monster, the only parasite I see is you, preying on young kids playing stupid games on a computer when they ought to be outside getting some fresh air and strengthening bones etc.

You’re such a well girthed pathetic dickhead.

that’s why you cop a host of shit here. It’s because of stupid ill considered third rate crap like that.

JC

11 Apr 12 at 12:50 am
I am not jealous of ticks, flies or remoras, Gab.

m0nty

11 Apr 12 at 12:51 am
No, I couldn’t find it on Amazon either, Abu. He’s also wiped his tweets calling people who don’t just love Heiss’ book, as ‘c***s.

Gab

11 Apr 12 at 12:52 am
Monty what are you expecting to achieve here?

Gab

11 Apr 12 at 12:53 am
Monty what are you expecting to achieve here?

For you to say something original and interesting. Still waiting after all these months.

m0nty

11 Apr 12 at 12:55 am
You compared me to a Nazi, Lazlo. You are the one spinning bullshit. Look up Godwin’s Law. You’re a primary example of the sort of brainless idiot who doesn’t realise how lame you sound

Perhaps nazi is too harsh. But leftwing fascist stooge would be closer to the mark.

Anyone who says shit like “what did you contribute to shosiety”, is basically a fascist or a primitive harking back to the days of the hunt and bringing back a deer for the rest of the tribe to devour.

That’s the kind of talk you hear from less developed groups around the world. When a villager succeeds the rest of the group or family/clan wants in no matter what.

Successful aboriginals continually complain about that sort of thing and how the clan strips them even before they have the resources.

It’s the sort of primativism you share with the Greens, Monster.

JC

11 Apr 12 at 12:57 am
Why does the Atheist Taliban continue to shove their beliefs down other people’s throats?

We don’t care what you believe, Kelly.

C.L.

11 Apr 12 at 12:58 am
For you to say something original and interesting. Still waiting after all these months.

And I’m waiting for the day when you stop with the inane bitchin’ and moanin’ about this site and how the boys bully you. Waaah waaah.

You really are very dull.

Gab

11 Apr 12 at 1:00 am
Yup looked up Godwin’s ‘law’ (it is not a law, by any definition of that word). But in deference to the PC I will withdraw and rephrase.

Your media publishing readership numbers could have occurred in any society or phase of history, including Mao’s China, Stalin’s CCCP, Churchill’s UK, Roosevelt’s USA etc. In itself it would still not make you morally superior.

There, is that de-Godwinned enough?

Lazlo

11 Apr 12 at 1:05 am
Not holding much hope for you, Gab. You show no signs of inspiration.

m0nty

11 Apr 12 at 1:06 am
The real problem is that speculators like JC have long since moved on past their role of serving the market, and the market now serves them. They are the alpha predators. Which is another name for parasites.

Have to stick up for JC on this one while the market may not be perfect that is actually more as a result of the left wing economic theories and the gov pumping money in. JC is not responsible for this and might take advantage of it.

Another term that is often used is vulture for someone who is a good stock picker. If the vulture was not there then a company will be much more likely to collapse. The common person on the street has no idea and those on the left such as unions wish to keep those in poorer countries poor. If I tell someone in the cab that I have some investments overseas the first reaction is that I am a tax evader when in fact I am being taxed at a much higher rate if you count company taxes as taxes paid by the investor. So is it beneficial for me to invest in Thailand? If I am correct and the market there outperforms the market here over time then I will pay more tax here. For Thailand having someone willing to risk their money in the market increases the stability and availability of risk capital which will lift living standards in that country in general.

kelly liddle

11 Apr 12 at 1:07 am
“Unjust and unfair.”

Salvos condemn carbon dioxide tax, say it will hit charity sector hard.

Gillard now at war with the Salvos, condemnations of SA leaders as 1 percenters and Clive Palmer stooges by noon.

C.L.

11 Apr 12 at 1:07 am
Neither you, monty, unless of course whining is considered an art form. In that you excel.

So far today has been Monty’s therapy day. You owe the Cat $5000 for the consultation, monty.

Gab

11 Apr 12 at 1:09 am
Manufacturing is slowly moving back to the US. I guess it was the imposition of a 23 buck carbon tax. No wait, that’s not happening there.

Michelin Plans South Carolina Factory
Wall Street Journal – 25 minutes ago
By JEFF BENNETT French tire maker Michelin plans to spend $750 million to build its first new North American plant in 15 years and expand an existing factory, amid rising global demand from the construction and mining sectors.

I’ll choke on a biscuit if I ever see that headline about someone setting up a plant here soon under this regime.

JC

11 Apr 12 at 1:10 am
Yup looked up Godwin’s ‘law’ (it is not a law, by any definition of that word). But in deference to the PC I will withdraw and rephrase.

Your media publishing readership numbers could have occurred in any society or phase of history, including Mao’s China, Stalin’s CCCP, Churchill’s UK, Roosevelt’s USA etc. In itself it would still not make you morally superior.

There, is that de-Godwinned enough?

Not sure if serious.

m0nty

11 Apr 12 at 1:10 am
French tire maker Michelin plans to spend $750 million to build its first new North American plant in 15 years and expand an existing factory, amid rising global demand from the construction and mining sectors.

Construction will start next week on a new plant in Anderson County, S.C., for the production of heavy tires used in road construction and mining. A nearby factory in Lexington also will be expanded to increase earthmover tire output. The two projects are expected to create 500 jobs.

The company didn’t disclose annual production figures but distribution from the two sites will be split between North America and overseas markets. The tires, which can run up to 63-inches tall, are used on a variety of equipment including dump trucks and can sell for as much as $250,000 a piece.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702304587704577335602200937084.html

Never let it be said we couldn’t attract these sorts of firms to set up here. Those are decent jobs.

With the right policies and no fear of attacks from the left they could migrate here. It would be an inundation but it could count for something.

The question we need to ask is why there and not here.

JC

11 Apr 12 at 1:13 am
Postie loses his job over viral video hit – or, more precisely, a destroyed motorcycle:

Daredevil Postie.

Doofus.

C.L.

11 Apr 12 at 1:13 am
Lazlo

Godwin’s law is a leftist bait and switch. When the trail gets too hot for them as there may be a valid comparison they always bring out Godwin in the hope of clearing the trail.

Don’t fall for that shit.

JC

11 Apr 12 at 1:16 am
Lazlo

Godwin’s law is a rightist bait and switch. When the trail gets too hot for them as there is never a valid comparison they always bring out Godwin in the hope of clearing the trail.

Don’t fall for that shit.

m0nty

11 Apr 12 at 1:21 am
It was bound to happen under this Union government:

THE nation’s weakest superannuation funds would be locked away from billions of dollars in annual contributions under a radical plan to boost employee savings and ease pressure on the pension system.

Workers would have their retirement savings channelled only into the top funds in a reform pursued by powerful industry funds that want performance benchmarks applied for the first time since the Keating government set up the system.

Gab

11 Apr 12 at 1:21 am
Monster:

Stop being a fucking idiot all the time. No rightie ever calls out …”look, look Godwin” and a bunch of sniveling beta males go all gooey eyed in agreement.

It’s a leftist invention created to prevent the trail from getting to hot.

You boofheaded dipstick, Monster.

JC

11 Apr 12 at 1:25 am
Workers would have their retirement savings channelled only into the top funds in a reform pursued by powerful industry funds that want performance benchmarks applied for the first time since the Keating government set up the system.

That is a very scarey idea as it is said that the industry funds outperform the other funds at times because they have more non-listed investments which are not valued by the market and as such it is only a matter of time before some are found to be fraudulent with unrealistic valuations of non-listed property investments.

kelly liddle

11 Apr 12 at 1:27 am
Remembering news “icon” Mike Wallace – the man who told a televised round-table discussion that if he was reporting from the North [Vietnamese] side he would rather have the footage of an American platoon being machine-gunned than warn his countrymen if he could:

In the Atlantic: Why Americans Hate the Media.

C.L.

11 Apr 12 at 1:30 am
And the industry funds are tied in with Labor ex pollies and their union buddies. It’s just one step closer to the government getting their hands on our super.

Gab

11 Apr 12 at 1:31 am
Righties just go “look, look Nazi” and all their fellow wingnuts nod in collective agreement.

m0nty

11 Apr 12 at 1:36 am
Good piece by Caroline Overington.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/opinion/its-not-about-being-black-enough-its-about-need/story-e6frg73f-1226323244907

JC

11 Apr 12 at 1:39 am
The issue is whether those benefits designed to assist Aboriginal people out of their desperate poverty should be more sharply targeted at those with a genuine need.

Which was Bolt’s point and that landed him in court.

Gab

11 Apr 12 at 1:46 am
Yea, but Caroline did it differently. She didn’t name anyone in the particular, so Mordy wouldn’t need to adjudicate.

JC

11 Apr 12 at 1:49 am
She doesn’t have to name anyone. Bolt did that already but in a way Caroline is ‘pointing the bone’ at Heiss.

Gab

11 Apr 12 at 1:52 am
She doesn’t have to name anyone. Bolt did that already but in a way Caroline is ‘pointing the bone’ at Heiss.

Yes, but not enough to get her in front of judge Mordy.

JC

11 Apr 12 at 1:58 am
Righties just go “look, look Nazi” and all their fellow wingnuts nod in collective agreement.

Righties and Lefties are just as bad at name calling but monty if you think the righties are better at it then that could be seen as a compliment. Noticed you used the word wingnut, how offensive to the body of the supreme leader on the Australian centre right.

kelly liddle

11 Apr 12 at 2:14 am
I don’t think Overington is being entirely straight there. The issue is not merely whether assistance meant for Aborigines is received by those with “a genuine need,” to the exclusion of considerations of what Aboriginality is. For it’s possible that white Aborigines may also be in genuine need. That’s not the point. No, Bolt was questioning whether people who are not in any meaningful way Aborigines at all should receive Aboriginal ‘benefits.’ And one criterion of whether people are Aborigines is surely whether they are racially Aboriginal in the full – actually black – sense. It’s not true to say that Bolt was simply journalistically means-testing Aboriginal welfare, as it were. He ran a series of posts with photographs whose intent was to question the racial Aboriginality of people who weren’t discernibly or familially Aboriginal, period.

C.L.

11 Apr 12 at 2:19 am
This is no kidding. the Kenyan really is a fucking socialist. Even more so than what people think.

http://ibankcoin.com/news/2012/04/10/73-just-the-beginning-for-obama/

73%–Just the Beginning for Obama
Buffett Rule tax just the start for Obama

JC

11 Apr 12 at 2:38 am
I am so not sulking. I have had an awesome week and am in a very good place in my life right now. You have no idea.

m0nty, if that means you are down to only three chins, I’m happy for you dude.

Fisky

11 Apr 12 at 2:41 am
It’s not true to say that Bolt was simply journalistically means-testing Aboriginal welfare,

After re-reading his articles, I stand corrected.

Gab

11 Apr 12 at 2:44 am
This is no kidding. the Kenyan really is a fucking socialist. Even more so than what people think.

It is true that many US companies do not pay enough tax and recieve a lot of handouts (many of which were given by Obama along with previous administrations) it would be better work on this first before even considering raising any taxes. Sounds a bit like our government subsidizing car makers to make gas guzzlers while putting on a carbon tax.

kelly liddle

11 Apr 12 at 2:50 am
That screencap I caught of the Random House thread when it had 145 comments (it was killed at 153) has had like thousands of hits & downloads in the last 48 hours.

I’m half-wondering when Random House Australia is going to track me down and give me a kill notice.

sdog

11 Apr 12 at 3:07 am
Kelly, you ignoramus, they’re talking about hitting personal income, not corporate tax and a huge number of people that file under personal are doing do as small business, using sub chapters corporations. This means the miserable prick wants to hit small business hard and give the stolen loot to his constituency.

Will you please stop talking about shit you don’t know and understand even less.

JC

11 Apr 12 at 3:08 am
JC
I know but corporate welfare in various forms is rife in the US and is the place to start. US gov is broke you know and something has to be done but a slow collapse seems almost inevitable. What sort of a government would have lending and insurance to the value of one third of the budget. If Gillard and Co did that in Aus we would be up in arms. The $10 billion green fund is bad enough.

I like the Aus tax system much better but think that foreign income should be taxed differently. I also think that US should reduce the tax for repatriating profits and apply a smaller tax to all foreign profits, not to tax workers and not tax foreign profits unless they are repatriated as the case is now.

kelly liddle

11 Apr 12 at 3:17 am
Okay, his lawyers have apparently confirmed that it’s actually Zimmerman’s site & Zimmerman to whom the PayPal money goes. But, still. Can’t say as I feel moved to help him out. Too many other competing Good Causes going at the moment. Let him sue the deep pockets who’ve been slandering him to recoup his losses, a la Richard Jewell.

http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/04/09/11104813-george-zimmerman-takes-to-web-to-raise-money-for-legal-costs-lawyers-confirm

sdog

11 Apr 12 at 3:44 am
This is a more satisfying cause, because you get a two-fer: helping a people and helping an animal.
http://blog.petsforpatriots.org/category/stories/

sdog

11 Apr 12 at 3:46 am
Santorum suspends campaign:

http://edition.cnn.com/2012/04/10/politics/campaign-wrap/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

Fisky

11 Apr 12 at 4:45 am
It’s over. Santorum has quit.

http://philadelphia.cbslocal.com/2012/04/10/presidential-candidate-rick-santorum-announcement/

“We were very concerned about our roles as being the very best parents has we can be to our children,” Santorum said. “We made a decision over the weekend while this presidential race is over to for me and will suspend our campaign effective today – we are not done fighting.”

…

“Against all odds we won 11 states, millions of votes,” said Santorum, who said he found more support and a deeper love for this country than he could imagine. “It was a love affair for me, going state to state, and seeing the difference. I care deeply about where this country is going and the people who are feeling left behind or hopeless.”

Romney has won! And by quitting at the right time, Santorum has shown his decent side.

Romney-haters must get behind Romney at once!

Fisky

11 Apr 12 at 4:49 am
Question without notice: who was that notorious AGW spoiler who rewrote wiki and was banned for it?

Abu Chowdah

11 Apr 12 at 5:31 am
And by quitting at the right time, Santorum has shown his decent side.

No he hasn’t, he has shown he is a liar as he said he would be in it until the end.

kelly liddle

11 Apr 12 at 6:25 am
Abu – William M Connolly or some such

pete m

11 Apr 12 at 8:17 am
Snackman to the rescue

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Erlw-ODVZxU

jtfsoon

11 Apr 12 at 8:22 am
Santorum?

Where is James K?

.

11 Apr 12 at 8:25 am
What the fuck Soon?

Was she being creeped or was she just nuts?

.

11 Apr 12 at 8:32 am
It’s unfortunate that I am running out of the nuttier Presidential candidates to ridicule.

steve from brisbane

11 Apr 12 at 8:42 am
No he hasn’t, he has shown he is a liar as he said he would be in it until the end.

His kids dying. Cut him slack.

Infidel Tiger

11 Apr 12 at 8:48 am
From a story about Santorum pulling out:

The survey, from Washington Post/ABC News, showed 51% of Americans would choose Obama if the election were held now, compared to 44% for Romney.

According to the polling data, Americans are divided on which candidate would best handle economic issues: Forty-seven percent favored Romney while 43% named Obama. When asked which man would be better at creating jobs, 46% named Obama and 43% said Romney. Both margins were within the poll’s 3.5 percentage point sampling error.

Voters were less divided on other key issues. Fifty-three percent said Obama was best poised to handle international affairs, compared to 36% who said Romney. Conversely, when asked which man would do a better job of reducing the federal deficit, 51% said Romney and 38% said Obama.

steve from brisbane

11 Apr 12 at 8:58 am
Why do Catallaxians seem to think that Obama is polling so atrociously and has no support in matters like foreign affairs? Answer: echo…echo……echo

steve from brisbane

11 Apr 12 at 9:01 am
Reading some of the comments from the god believers I find it unfair that athiests must prove how the universe exists but the religious do not have to prove how god exists.

I don’t know who Aquinas is but it is not possible to prove that god exists

Kelly, how about simply googling Aquinas as Gab suggested? (I even pointed to his first proof, the First Way, there are another four.) Then you wouldn’t be so foolish as to repeat the first statement or so ignorant as to repeat the second. But, again, this is of a piece with anything the New Atheists, including Hitch, say on religion.

Take just this one simple arguement on “Thou Shall Not Kill”. This will in most cases increase your chance of survival and should make wars etc much less likely so no reason to say because god said.

This is nonsense. Setting aside the dispute over whether the above commandment should be “Thou shall not murder” rather than “Thou shall not kill”, there is no reason to think that following either should increase our chances of survival. Moreover, you’re not even following that commandment, but the alternative, “I will do what I must in order to survive”, and this doesn’t exclude “killing, stealing, lying,” in some circumstances.

dover_beach

11 Apr 12 at 9:31 am
d-b, are you suggesting that Aquinas’ proofs are beyond criticism and should lead all people to accept God as a logical necessity?

steve from brisbane

11 Apr 12 at 9:58 am
George Zimmerman is asking for donations and says

“On Sunday February 26th, I was involved in a life altering event”

a life altering event - bizarre wording if he wrote that himself – the lawyers into things by the sound of it – but still -

candy

11 Apr 12 at 10:02 am
That poll is bullshit Steve:

http://hotair.com/archives/2012/04/10/wapoabc-poll-adds-seven-points-to-dem-advantage-in-sample/

Infidel Tiger

11 Apr 12 at 10:20 am
http://www.foxbusiness.com/on-air/stossel/index.html#/v/1549733450001/glenn-becks-war-on-tv/?playlist_id=87530

Glenn Beck’s pay per view internet TV is a winner. Monty would approve of the business model.

.

11 Apr 12 at 10:33 am
d-b, are you suggesting that Aquinas’ proofs are beyond criticism and should lead all people to accept God as a logical necessity?

Beyond criticism? No. Rationally necessary? Very nearly. But above, I was simply demonstrating, contra Kelly, that here is a theist, Aquinas, and not the only one, who id indeed provide rational arguments for God’s existence.

dover_beach

11 Apr 12 at 10:42 am
Interesting.

What’s Drudge suggesting with his new lead?

SHOCK PHOTOS: Obama, Thin And Wasting Away…

C.L.

11 Apr 12 at 10:59 am
Fun with WaPo Polling…

BREAKING: WaPo/ABC Poll: More than half of Americans love to eat dog food. (Sample incl Dog +11)
—
Stephen Green (@VodkaPundit) April 10, 2012

But see the outrageous reaction from ThinkProgress: RAAAAACIST!

Seriously.

sdog

11 Apr 12 at 11:06 am
Silliest nomination race ever is over

Bolt must have been asleep during the 2008 Democrat primary – the most comical, mentally damaged and bizarre line-up in American history, which ended with the worst president in American history. The ensemble included a man who stole poo-filled nappies during the race.

———————————-

I see Bolt has also embraced the Overington piece – whose contention that he was writing about “genuine need” rather than genuine black Aboriginality is a complete invention. Also, his ongoing claim that ‘I’d like to comment/quote/link but I fear I can’t’ is now coming across as pathetic.

Staying on free speech, Hal Colebatch has a piece in the American Spectator on Gillard’s plans to ban free speech in Australia. There is this timely reminder about a certain left-wing traitor:

To make matters worse, the opposition Liberal Party’s media spokesman, Malcolm Turnbull, instead of rejecting the proposal out of hand, as he should have done, has been ambiguous and equivocal, claiming that “It has been said that the legal arrangements at present” (that is, ordinary freedom of speech) “do not adequately advance the public interest.”

C.L.

11 Apr 12 at 11:10 am
No more excuses for Mitt The Inevitable, then.

He MUST now streak to to an impressive and unstoppable lead over Obama or something will have to be done at the convention.

C.L.

11 Apr 12 at 11:14 am
LOL, this morning Combet’s calling the carbon tax an emissions trading system because it has become so toxic politically.

By acting now – and by acting in the most efficient way by making an emissions trading system the lynchpin of our strategy to address climate change – we are making sure that we secure prosperity for the long term.

Searching his speech for “carbon tax”.

“Reader has finished the searching the document. No matches were found”.

New Gold Dream

11 Apr 12 at 11:27 am
Australia sucks

http://www.leftlanenews.com/car-quote/?f_name=first+name&l_name=last+name&zip=zip&email=email&phone=telephone+%28no+dashes+or+spaces%29&mk=BMW&mdl=M3+Convertible&year=2012&trim_1=M3+Convertible&layout=carpageoverlay

BMW M3 price: $68k

http://www.carpoint.com.au/showroom/details.aspx?__Qpb=1&__Nne=15&Cr=1&R=629650&__Ns=p_IsSpecialOffer_Int32%7C1%7C%7Cp_Year_String%7C1%7C%7Cp_ReleaseMonth_Int32%7C1%7C%7Cp_Make_String%7C0%7C%7Cp_Family_String%7C0&__N=4294965352%204294964888%204294843832%202994%202951&silo=1408&seot=1&trecs=2&__sid=136A12A128CE

BMW M3 price: $180k

The tax system enforces inequality to boot.

.

11 Apr 12 at 11:33 am
our strategy to address climate change

So Combet is saying the carbon dioxide tax will cool the earth.

C.L.

11 Apr 12 at 11:34 am
Take me out of moderation. That is absurd.

Basically the take home message is a BMW M3 in the US new costs $68k whereas here it costs about $180k.

The tax system enforces artificial inequality. Why should the hard working Australian be subjected to buying a fucking Holden?

.

11 Apr 12 at 11:35 am
What we can got here in Aus for a slightly higher price

http://www.carpoint.com.au/showroom/results.aspx?Ns=p_IsSpecialOffer_Int32%7C1%7C%7Cp_Year_String%7C1%7C%7Cp_ReleaseMonth_Int32%7C1%7C%7Cp_Make_String%7C0%7C%7Cp_Family_String%7C0&N=2994+3296+4294955531+4294843436+4294905675&TabID=2607999&tsrc=sr-landing-search&Nne=15

Yep, a HSV Clubsport POS.

.

11 Apr 12 at 11:40 am
Or this one, Dot.

http://www.mercedesheritage.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/SLS-AMG-Roadster-render-2.jpg

Listen to the engine on this one. It has to be on e of the most beautiful sounds ever invented.

JC

11 Apr 12 at 11:50 am
gab

Are you on drugs? No, seriously.

I just know how much you detest Christians and Catholics in particular.

ROFLMAO. What a hoot. I was once banned from a blog for being too much of a christian apologist, and now you come out with this idiocy. You ‘know’ no such thing. I do not ‘detest’ anyone (or at least not many people), and if I did/do, it is for reasons peculiar to them, nothing to do with Christianity or Catholicism. Even just on this thread, the evidence is clear, you can only be confusing my posts here for things posted by other people.

I think I have made it quite clear I live among a lot of Christian (mostly Roman Catholic) friends and family. I was even – gasp! – in a church two weeks ago celebrating a baby girl’s baptism! I am fascinated by religion, period. Not as something to while away the hours happily ‘detesting’ but because I am passionate about history, which makes religion unavoidable. My main enthusiasm is for ancient history, and particularly the Roman part of Roman Catholicism. If you don’t like that, tough titties. I ain’t discussing the stuff with you.

and amp up it on Christian holidays

.

Er, I think you will find that any peak in this blog’s discussion of matters Chistian follows the religion, not my alleged ‘detesting’ of its followers.

I note you never get your knickers in a twist when I post about Islam – and I have posted a hell of a lot more ‘detestable’ things about Islam, than I ever have about all other religions combined – or Hinduism. So please don’t bore me with your concern trolling, particularly when you have to distort and misrepresent my posts to do so.

Peter Patton

11 Apr 12 at 11:51 am
Cool, the carbon tax will improve our competitiveness:

The Government‟s Clean Energy Future Package – which is the Carbon Price and its range of associated programs – is a critical driver in the effort to improve and maintain Australia‟s economic competitiveness.

Is there nothing a carbon tax can’t do? I mean, apart from speak it’s own name?

New Gold Dream

11 Apr 12 at 11:51 am
This is nonsense. Setting aside the dispute over whether the above commandment should be “Thou shall not murder” rather than “Thou shall not kill”, there is no reason to think that following either should increase our chances of survival.

DB
What are you on about if people start killing each other there will be less people therefor lower chance of survival. Your extra arguement about in some circumstances is neither here nor there.

kelly liddle

11 Apr 12 at 11:52 am
Aquinas’ First and Second Ways are the same – there must be a first mover or first cause, therefore there must be God (science has no answer to this conundrum).

This reasoning cannot avoid the accusation that it sweeps the problem under the carpet. If we ask who/what caused God, Aquinas replies “Nothing, that’s why it’s God.” It’s a non-answer that relies on a simultaneous rejection and embrace of infinity. He simply assumes it can’t be turtles all the way down (that’s natural given the scale at which humans operate, and how our brains have evolved to think about things, but there’s no actual reason to believe it’s true), and then places God as the “unchanging source”, outside of cause and effect, and essentially fulfilling the same role as the infinite.

His Third Way is rather odd, seeming to assume that if things can not-be, then there MUST be a point in time when nothing was in existence, which doesn’t follow at all. Unless he’s using one of the principles of infinity – all states that can occur, will occur – and joining it to his previous rejection of infinity.

The Fourth Way is not logic at all, but a statement of his philosophical belief that goodness is an objective quality, coupled with the nonsensical assertion that “the maximum of any genus is the cause of all in that genus”, which has as much validity as Aristotle’s ideas about elements and ‘natural’ motion.

The Fifth is simply scientific ignorance, currently called Intelligent Design, but that’s not his fault, given when he was writing.

So much for these ‘proofs’.

Jarrah

11 Apr 12 at 11:57 am
I am fascinated by religion

I’m currently reading “The Evolution of God” by Robert Wright. Beside that book is “Origin of Our Species” Chris Stringer. Go figure! History and religion are intertwined. History changes religion and vice versa. Peter, you might enjoy The Evolution of God because the author writes about these linkages.

John H.

11 Apr 12 at 12:00 pm
My main enthusiasm is for ancient history, and particularly the Roman part of Roman Catholicism.

Christianity was a Judeo-Roman religion. Why is that a surprise though?

http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Daniel+2%3A34-35&version=NIV

A devout person may conclude that it was part of the “great plan” to use the Roman State and/or common culture/language as a means to spread the new religion.

I actually don’t think Mr Patton ought to be queried on this. Sometimes I think Christians are removed from their own latent Judaism. Particularly Americans.

31 “Your Majesty looked, and there before you stood a large statue—an enormous, dazzling statue, awesome in appearance. 32 The head of the statue was made of pure gold, its chest and arms of silver, its belly and thighs of bronze, 33 its legs of iron, its feet partly of iron and partly of baked clay. 34 While you were watching, a rock was cut out, but not by human hands. It struck the statue on its feet of iron and clay and smashed them. 35 Then the iron, the clay, the bronze, the silver and the gold were all broken to pieces and became like chaff on a threshing floor in the summer. The wind swept them away without leaving a trace. But the rock that struck the statue became a huge mountain and filled the whole earth.

36 “This was the dream, and now we will interpret it to the king. 37 Your Majesty, you are the king of kings. The God of heaven has given you dominion and power and might and glory; 38 in your hands he has placed all mankind and the beasts of the field and the birds in the sky. Wherever they live, he has made you ruler over them all. You are that head of gold.

39 “After you, another kingdom will arise, inferior to yours. Next, a third kingdom, one of bronze, will rule over the whole earth. 40 Finally, there will be a fourth kingdom, strong as iron—for iron breaks and smashes everything—and as iron breaks things to pieces, so it will crush and break all the others. 41 Just as you saw that the feet and toes were partly of baked clay and partly of iron, so this will be a divided kingdom; yet it will have some of the strength of iron in it, even as you saw iron mixed with clay. 42 As the toes were partly iron and partly clay, so this kingdom will be partly strong and partly brittle. 43 And just as you saw the iron mixed with baked clay, so the people will be a mixture and will not remain united, any more than iron mixes with clay.

44 “In the time of those kings, the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that will never be destroyed, nor will it be left to another people. It will crush all those kingdoms and bring them to an end, but it will itself endure forever. 45 This is the meaning of the vision of the rock cut out of a mountain, but not by human hands—a rock that broke the iron, the bronze, the clay, the silver and the gold to pieces.

Cue Catholic triumphalism from C.L.

.

11 Apr 12 at 12:06 pm
Police are investigating the “racially motivated” beating of a 27-year-old man who was walking home from midtown bars early Saturday when he said he was jumped by five to eight men who shouted “Trayvon” before the attack.

The exclamation was an apparent reference to Trayvon Martin, a 17-year-old from Miami who was shot and killed in February walking back to his father’s girlfriend’s house in Sanford.

That last part is obviously false. Martin was not shot while walking back to anyone’s house – he was shot while bashing Zimmerman’s head against the ground.

Again, by lying about this incident, the media are inciting acts of racist violence against whites.

Fisky

11 Apr 12 at 12:24 pm
What are you on about if people start killing each other there will be less people therefor lower chance of survival. Your extra arguement about in some circumstances is neither here nor there.

Kelly, most people do not kill without a motive. In fact, people often “kill, lie, or steal” for reasons of survival, or at the very least they think they do. If you can’t see that this defeats your claim then it isn’t my fault.

Jarrah, I’ll address your stock ‘refutations’ after lunch. I’ll add here that given a choice between Aquinas and yourself I’ll go with the former every time. At the very least, he attempts to refute the strongest version of the argument in his sights rather than mere caricatures (i.e.the idea that the Fifth Way is an “Intelligent Design” argument, is really a piece of studied ignorance).

dover_beach

11 Apr 12 at 12:27 pm
To those who “believe” in god or gods it is only a belief. A belief is not a statement of truth only something that you might think. I could believe in the big bang theory or catastrophic global warming these are all beliefs as they are theories and not proven beyond all reasonable doubt. The number of people who believe whole heartedly in any particular religious teaching is extremely low like the 2% of catholics in the US who believe using birth control is a bad thing. The bar must be lowered to believe that you must go to heaven or is it that you can commit sin so long as you go to church? Religions seem to follow culture rather than culture following religion otherwise a particular religion has a chance of becoming irrelevant if no body will believe its teachings in a free society.

kelly liddle

11 Apr 12 at 12:27 pm
Kelly:

STFU. No one here cares what you believe in. Go pray in front of a goat and I promise you no one here would bat an eye except possibly to snigger behind you back at times.

JC

11 Apr 12 at 12:33 pm
Kelly, stop dribbling.

Christians go to church with a full knowledge they aren’t perfect but are trying to be like it.

http://bible.cc/luke/14-27.htm

And anyone who does not carry his cross and follow me cannot be my disciple.

It’s not easy being a devout Christian.

.

11 Apr 12 at 12:35 pm
Jarrah, I’ll address your stock ‘refutations’ after lunch. I’ll add here that given a choice between Aquinas and yourself I’ll go with the former every time.

That’s an excellent display of good first base (default) judgement, DB.

JC

11 Apr 12 at 12:35 pm
Newman!

Newman axes corporate boxes.

Taxpayer-funded corporate boxes at major Queensland sports stadiums will be axed, or leased out to private users, in the state government’s latest bid to save money.

Premier Campbell Newman says the order applies to boxes held by the state government and government-owned corporations.

C.L.

11 Apr 12 at 12:36 pm
Newman is looking good having only been in power a short time he is cutting stuff.

kelly liddle

11 Apr 12 at 12:38 pm
Draft Newman to Canberra now!

JC

11 Apr 12 at 12:39 pm
Greens candidate calls for murder of Andrew Bolt:

Andrew Bolt is a vile dog who should be put down.

http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/andrewbolt/index.php/heraldsun/comments/are_we_censored_enough_for_you/#commentsmore

It always ends in murder with the Left.

Fisky

11 Apr 12 at 12:40 pm
Draft Newman to Canberra now!

QLD is more broke than the federal government we need him here.

kelly liddle

11 Apr 12 at 12:40 pm
Greens candidate calls for murder of Andrew Bolt:

Mad Dog bob of course is silent on the matter.

JC

11 Apr 12 at 12:43 pm
Newman: swingeing cuts. It will be very unpopular and QLD will go into a recession. Homer Paxton learned that in 1973 at Mac Uni so it must be true.

.

11 Apr 12 at 12:43 pm
Andrew Bolt is a vile dog who should be put down.

He also wrote:

andrew bolt is a vile cunt of a man, i openly condone hunting him down and beating him within an inch of his life

This should now be a police matter.

C.L.

11 Apr 12 at 12:44 pm
At the forefront of Australia’s Reconciliation and anti-racism movements for many years, Michael … passionately believes in the message of the Australian Greens, and strives in his own life, and to encourage others around him, to live the ideals of a compassionate, caring, and sustainable existence.

Some good examples of Michael Quall’s compassion:

Andrew Bolt is a vile cunt of a man. i openly hunting him down and beating him within an inch of his life.

[Mild edit. Sinc]

Fisky

11 Apr 12 at 12:45 pm
eligions seem to follow culture rather than culture following religion

It is a two way street Kelly but the point your making is often forgotten. Religious doctrine is substantially altered by the realities of the time. I can remember a time when christians were arguing that rock n roll was the devil’s music. Christian rock music is now the single biggest category of rock music. The book I previously mentioned, The Evolution of God, strongly argues that to fully appreciate the development of religious doctrines you must examine the context in which those doctrines arose.

John H.

11 Apr 12 at 12:46 pm
Andrew Bolt is a vile dog who should be put down.

He also wrote:

andrew bolt is a vile c— of a man, i openly condone hunting him down and beating him within an inch of his life

This should now be a police matter.

C.L.

11 Apr 12 at 12:46 pm
Cutting the corporate boxes is a sign of deep , deep austerity. dot.

QLD will undoubtedly fall into recession now as there’s no stimulus.

JC

11 Apr 12 at 12:47 pm
Very clever politics from Newman too. He’s saying it’s not just luvvies being hit. Mooching sports boofheads slurping beer on the public dime are also being frogmarched out of the trough.

C.L.

11 Apr 12 at 12:49 pm
Death threats.

Is Bolt a climate scientist?

.

11 Apr 12 at 12:51 pm
Homer’s right. For every dollar Campbell Newman cuts, GDP in Queensland will fall by twenty.

Fisky

11 Apr 12 at 12:52 pm
The bloke who is planning to murder Bolt has 8 kids. They must be removed fromhis care immediately.

Infidel Tiger

11 Apr 12 at 12:53 pm
8 kids?? He is probably filling their fragile minds with violence. They must be taken away from him in dramatic circumstances at once.

Fisky

11 Apr 12 at 12:56 pm
JC
Loan approved but settlement may go over the 30 April date.

kelly liddle

11 Apr 12 at 12:57 pm
Kelly

Speed the fucking thing up please. Please.

JC

11 Apr 12 at 12:57 pm
Sinclair, it’s your blog, but my view is that if someone is going to call for murder and violence, we should have every right to advocate a relatively unhygenic rebuke.

Fisky

11 Apr 12 at 1:02 pm
Queenslanders don’t call him can-do for nothing.

candy

11 Apr 12 at 1:06 pm
News just in the government is going to have local content requirements for mining.

kelly liddle

11 Apr 12 at 1:20 pm
Source please, Kelly L.

.

11 Apr 12 at 1:22 pm
a snippet on ABC 24 so don’t know the details

kelly liddle

11 Apr 12 at 1:27 pm
A belief is not a statement of truth only something that you might think.

To paraphrase Tony Jones: I’ll take that as a statement of belief.

dover_beach

11 Apr 12 at 1:27 pm
“(i.e.the idea that the Fifth Way is an “Intelligent Design” argument, is really a piece of studied ignorance).”

The fifth way is taken from the governance of the world. We see that things which lack knowledge, such as natural bodies, act for an end, and this is evident from their acting always, or nearly always, in the same way, so as to obtain the best result. Hence it is plain that they achieve their end, not fortuitously, but designedly. Now whatever lacks knowledge cannot move towards an end, unless it be directed by some being endowed with knowledge and intelligence; as the arrow is directed by the archer. Therefore, some intelligent being exists by whom all natural things are directed to their end; and this being we call God.

Open and shut.

Jarrah

11 Apr 12 at 1:44 pm
Open and shut.

Jarrah, if only you actually understood what was meant by the parts you’ve bolded then you might understand how the above might be distinguished from, say, Paley’s design argument. The argument is not especially directed at explaining how an eye or ear comes about by why anything at all exhibits an inherent nature. Thus it is directed at explaining how there can be anything like causal regularities or powers like a strong force or gravity at all in the universe. It is thus, not merely one explanation among many, but speaks to what must be presupposed by all possible explanations; namely, that things like natural bodies “act for an end, and this is evident from their acting always, or nearly always, in the same way”.

dover_beach

11 Apr 12 at 2:14 pm
Newman is looking good having only been in power a short time he is cutting stuff.

Not according to Mumble the Red

Lazlo

11 Apr 12 at 2:35 pm
Yea but Mumble is a fucking idiot. News ought to do a prisoner exchange and send him over to Fairfax.

JC

11 Apr 12 at 2:37 pm
Mumble really is an arseclown. His musings would make Comical Ali blush.

Infidel Tiger

11 Apr 12 at 2:40 pm
Mumble is off his head. Three weeks in, Campbell Newman is a failure – for cutting things the electorate wanted him to cut?

.

11 Apr 12 at 2:43 pm
db/jarrah

How have you two learnt about Aquinas? University, Bible Study group, private reading? He was part of an undergrad History of Science course I took. I wrote a paper (a tute paper I think) on evidence that Aquinas learnt his Aristotle through Latin translations of Arabic translation. But those Arabic translations contained a lot of Platonic inflections, they must have picked up between Late Antiquity and 12th century; inflections that were absent from the Greek originals of Aristotle that were discovered subsequently.

I suddenly had to stop myself, send all books back to the library, and turn my computer off, when I realised that to get through even a peak of Aquinas would take all year, let alone the subtlety of the toing-and-froing between town and gown in Paris, between prince and priest, theologian and natural philosopher, and between bishop and pope. I’d just started reading about the differential effects on the Theology versus the Arts faculties at the University of Paris of the Bishop of Paris’ Etienne Tempier Condemnations of certain Aristotelian propositions in 1270 (?) I’d devoted a year once before to trying to understand the Israel-Arab conflict, which was very worthwhile, but I couldn’t see that in St. Thomas. Still, I think I got enough. I realized that watching the Dawkins/Pell debate.

That whole debate was actually very focused on a very small number of points to those who had some Aquinas under their belts, and knew the links from Aristotle. If you didn’t have that, imagine the debate looked a whole lot different.

Peter Patton

11 Apr 12 at 2:45 pm
One reply to anyone criticising the QLD government for any cut $62 billion debt and projection of $85 billion in the next few years. Much worse on a per capita basis than the federal debt and much higher interest payments.

kelly liddle

11 Apr 12 at 2:47 pm
Anyone know what’s happened to Shiny’s blog, Deltoid?

The varmint hasn’t updated since January. There hasn’t been one single obsessive Monckton thread since 2011 and the only post he’s put up this year was some nutball crap by John Mashey, the North Californian lunatic and AGW bedwetter.

I’m guessing… and just guessing that the Sydney uni decision may have something to do with it.

Perhaps and I can’t say for sure, but obsessive Monckton stories /block quotes from other blogs like the New Zealand truffle farmer’s don’t count as scholarly research. Of course I’m being wildly speculative here.

JC

11 Apr 12 at 2:47 pm
So monty comes up with…

That is rubbish, wreckage. Consider the extreme scenario whereby all stock prices stayed the same from year to year. There would be no profit to make at all by speculators, and there would be no need for them. They make more money when there is more volatility. Change means profit. Creative destruction.

The real problem is that speculators like JC have long since moved on past their role of serving the market, and the market now serves them. They are the alpha predators. Which is another name for parasites.

So he creates an ‘extreme scenario’ that would cause the stockmarkets destruction were it to come about.
No ones going to pick him up on the stupidity?

Winston SMITH

11 Apr 12 at 4:07 pm
mOnt

now getting 300,000 unique visitors per week

people get lost on the web, too.

kae

11 Apr 12 at 6:27 pm

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