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1,057 Responses to 'Wednesday Forum: November 14, 2012'

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1. 1st?

   

   Cold-Hands

   14 Nov 12 at 12:01 am
2. It’s me!

   

   kae

   14 Nov 12 at 12:01 am
3. Blast you, Cold Hands!

   

   kae

   14 Nov 12 at 12:01 am
4. Ha! Sorry kae.

   

   Cold-Hands

   14 Nov 12 at 12:02 am
5. 1st?

   Does it count as first if you use a question mark?

   

   Dangph

   14 Nov 12 at 12:03 am
6. Are not, Cold Hands.

   :/

   Now I’m really going horizontal.

   But before that I’ll be brushing my teeth and going to the toilet.

   *snort*

   

   kae

   14 Nov 12 at 12:04 am
7. LOL Dangph

   That means I’m first!

   Hurrah.

   zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

   

   kae

   14 Nov 12 at 12:05 am
8. While Janine Perrett rightly gets a brickbat for proudly saying she’s “agnostic” on the AWU issue due to not bothering to inform herself on the issue, Paul Murphy outs himself as sharing her opinion. Not really good enough for a so-called journalist.

   

   Cold-Hands

   14 Nov 12 at 12:06 am
9. Oi! Lizzie, Bunyip’s back!

   

   kae

   14 Nov 12 at 12:09 am
10. It’s probably just as well the old thread got put to bed. It was getting a little lowbrow.
    /mea culpa

    

    sdog

    14 Nov 12 at 12:09 am
11. “It’s not a love triangle. It’s a love Pentagon.”

    In fact, the whole polygon analogy seems woefully inadequate to describe the still developing scandal involving married Gen. David Petraeus, his married biographer Paula Broadwell, married “social liaison” Jill Kelley, a shirtless FBI agent, and now, another married general.

    Oy.

    And Barry and Hillary smile, because still no-one’s talking about Benghazi.

    

    sdog

    14 Nov 12 at 12:17 am
12. zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

    Sleep tight.

    

    Dangph

    14 Nov 12 at 12:18 am
13. I’m sure generals in the old days didn’t have mistresses.

    

    C.L.

    14 Nov 12 at 12:21 am
14. Wo.

    Hedley Thomas and Pia Akerman report:

    A UNION employee who was concerned about wrongdoing told the national head of the Australian Workers Union in June 1996 that he deposited about $5000 cash into Julia Gillard’s bank account at the request of her then boyfriend Bruce Wilson.

    The disclosure by Wayne Hem forms part of a contemporaneous and confidential 150-plus-page diary that was kept by the then AWU joint national secretary, Ian Cambridge, now a Fair Work Australia commissioner.

    The 1994-96 diary, which recounts hitherto unknown numerous events and conversations during the AWU fraud scandal, has been obtained and its authenticity verified by The Australian.

    In a statutory declaration signed in Melbourne on Sunday and in lengthy interviews with The Australian over the past fortnight, Mr Hem declared he had deposited the money after being given the account details of Ms Gillard along with a wad of $100 and $50 notes by Mr Wilson, an official in the AWU’s Victorian branch.

    Full report.

    

    C.L.

    14 Nov 12 at 12:26 am
15. Wow Petraeus was one busy man. Where did he find the time to be a General?

    

    Gab

    14 Nov 12 at 12:26 am
16. Sweet little tune from the late 1960s by legendary electronic music pioneer Delia Derbyshire.

    “Mattachin”

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3YudPg7cbR4

    

    Dangph

    14 Nov 12 at 12:29 am
17. Just mucking around before I go to bed: I see Julia Gillard no longer maintains a certificate to practice law in Victoria. Pity. It means she can’t be struck off if Independent Federal Candidate for Lalor James Johnson succeeds in having Gillard’s conduct in the AWU matter assessed by the Disciplinary Panel of the Board.

    

    Cold-Hands

    14 Nov 12 at 12:31 am
18. You don’t become a 4 star general if you can’t juggle a couple of Sheilas and invade Afghanistan.

    Although apparently this idiot couldnt handle the task. Fire him.

    

    Infidel Tiger

    14 Nov 12 at 12:32 am
19. I’m sure generals in the old days didn’t have mistresses

    What about Heads of the CIA?

    

    Cold-Hands

    14 Nov 12 at 12:32 am
20. More:

    Ms Gillard, who has at all times strenuously insisted that she did not do anything wrong and was unaware of the workings of the association, yesterday declined to answer questions from The Australian.

    The Prime Minister repeated her denial of any wrongdoing, but declined to comment directly on the alleged payment despite detailed questions being put to her.

    And get this from Gillard-appointed Cambridge:

    The June 7, 1996, diary entry by Mr Cambridge states: “During the course of the conversation with Wayne Hem he told me about an event that took place in about July last year (1995).

    “This event involved Bruce Wilson handing Wayne an envelope which contained approximately $5000 in $100 and $50 notes and Wilson instructed Hem to deposit this $5000 into a personal account of Julia Gillard.

    “I indicated to Wayne that given his knowledge of these things I would have a further chat with him once I had been up to the Industrial Relations Commission and that in all likelihood he may well be subpoenaed to appear in proceedings in the Industrial Relations Court, or elsewhere.

    “Hem said to me that that did not worry him and that he was quite prepared to tell what he knew about certain events involving Bruce Wilson and others.”

    The Australian has verified the authenticity of the diary with Mr Cambridge, who has described it as a “contemporaneous record of events and discussions that occurred during 1995 and 1996″.

    Mr Cambridge said the diary “included contemporaneous records of conversations with individuals about various matters, some of which were not within my direct knowledge and which I was unable to verify”.

    Mr Cambridge said his position as a member of a quasi-judicial tribunal made it inappropriate “to now offer any public comment about these issues”.

    How very convenient.

    Gee I wonder why she called a Royal Commission into something other than brown paper bags this week.

    

    C.L.

    14 Nov 12 at 12:33 am
21. Hedley Thomas and Pia Akerman report:

    Roll on Question Time. All the bluster over Royal Commissions into Abuse of Children won’t prevent further questions being posed to the Lying Slapper. Now that the AFR and The Age/SMH have joined The Australian and the Telegraph, it’s clear that blood is in the water…

    

    Cold-Hands

    14 Nov 12 at 12:37 am
22. Wow Petraeus was one busy man. Where did he find the time to be a General?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O8zGDY0aQZg

    

    .

    14 Nov 12 at 12:39 am
23. So Gillard may have received money in some unspecified capacity from someone who claims to do banking errands for Gillard’s previous boyfriend.

    So what exactly is the allegation? I can’t see any. If the money was so tainted why didn’t the boyfriend do his own banking?

    

    Scapula

    14 Nov 12 at 12:41 am
24. haha, Dot. Very good.

    

    Gab

    14 Nov 12 at 12:44 am
25. The completely innocent circumstances:

    In interviews with The Australian, Mr Hem described how Mr Wilson had visited the new casino in Melbourne and looked severely dishevelled at work the next day when he asked Mr Hem to deposit the cash.

    “He came into my office and then said to me, ‘Come down to my office in a minute’,” said Mr Hem, who left the AWU in 1997.

    “I went down and he handed me about five grand. He said, ‘There’s five grand there’, and I looked at it and said ‘Is this for me?’ He said ‘No, I want you to put it into a bank account.’ I said ‘OK’ then he said ‘Hang on, I’ll give you the bank -account name and number.’

    “I am still holding this wad of cash in my hand. By this stage Bill (Telikostoglou, aka ‘Bill the Greek’) had walked into the room and he said some strange Greek thing about how I must have had better luck than he did (at the casino) last night.

    “Then Bruce handed me a piece of paper with the account number and a name on it, and it was Julia’s name. He said, ‘Go put this in Julia’s account.’ I said OK.”

    

    C.L.

    14 Nov 12 at 12:48 am
26. How did Hedley Thomas get hold of this diary? It is unlikely to have come from the AWU where Cambridge was an office holder at the time… Is Cambridge leaking against Gillard?

    

    Cold-Hands

    14 Nov 12 at 12:48 am
27. Yes, Greeks really do say some strannge Greek things as what else can they say in a fervid melodrama narrated by a man in a kitchen from the fifties.

    There is no allegation as he knew nothing about the money in his capacity as an errand boy. Where’s the punch line?

    

    Scapula

    14 Nov 12 at 12:51 am
28. She can’t have done anything wrong. look, The Monthly had her picture on the front cover with the words blaring out at the startled reader

    An Honest Woman

    See?

    

    Gab

    14 Nov 12 at 12:53 am
29. So we now know that Old Slushy was tipped off that this veritable brown paper bag affair would break mid week and was ordered by McTernan to swamp the story with a new Emily’S List war on Catholicism.

    

    C.L.

    14 Nov 12 at 12:55 am
30. Aw, why the long face, Crapula?

    

    Abu Chowdah

    14 Nov 12 at 12:56 am
31. The fact that miscellaneous monies of uncertain provenance were deposited at least once into her account explains why Julia Gillard could not exclude AWU-WRA money being used to pay for her extensions in her S&G termination interview (apart from the brick fence Bill the Greek built for her for which she apparently never paid).

    

    Cold-Hands

    14 Nov 12 at 12:57 am
32. And the man has already been beatified by the putrid Murdoch Press as a whistleblower.

    I know Murdoch wants to be Abbott’s King-maker so he can further his commercial interests but really, please, bring back Turnbull.

    A story about five grand on a day when we heard about 100 million.

    

    Scapula

    14 Nov 12 at 12:58 am
33. Scrappy’s really jumping up and down lots now.

    

    Gab

    14 Nov 12 at 12:59 am
34. Wonder if the money was from the AWU slush fund she set up?

    

    Gab

    14 Nov 12 at 1:00 am
35. Yes, well, if this is what Gillard has done then she has a severe lack of imagination and criminal ambition and deserves to lose office.

    

    Scapula

    14 Nov 12 at 1:02 am
36. Sensitive!

    

    Abu Chowdah

    14 Nov 12 at 1:03 am
37. “Then Bruce handed me a piece of paper with the account number and a name on it, and it was Julia’s name.

    “He said ‘Go put this in Julia’s account’. I said ‘OK’.

    “He (Wilson) made a comment about not saying anything. I just went down to the bank, put it in, came back, gave him the receipt.

    “I didn’t know if it was for Julia or if the account was a private account or a Slater and Gordon account. It just had Julia Gillard’s name on it and I put it in the bank account.”

    

    Gab

    14 Nov 12 at 1:03 am
38. Why’s Latho gone bananas?

    

    Infidel tiger

    14 Nov 12 at 1:06 am
39. So we now know that Old Slushy was tipped off that this veritable brown paper bag affair would break mid week and was ordered by McTernan to swamp the story with a new Emily’S List war on Catholicism.

    Pure coincidence, CL.

    

    Gab

    14 Nov 12 at 1:06 am
40. He he he. Loving Crappie’s reaction to this. Gold!

    

    Abu Chowdah

    14 Nov 12 at 1:07 am
41. Bolt tipped it.

    

    C.L.

    14 Nov 12 at 1:09 am
42. Good to see, Abu, that you’ve also found nothing of interest in these allegations.

    

    Scapula

    14 Nov 12 at 1:10 am
43. Catholics breathe a sigh of relief as Murdoch saves the Church!

    

    Scapula

    14 Nov 12 at 1:11 am
44. Maybe Scrappy is Mad Latham.

    

    Gab

    14 Nov 12 at 1:13 am
45. The former ALP president in the back of a police car, Shorten admonished from the bench of the High Court, Roxon denounced by a judge for interfering in the administration of justice, Craig Thomson, the ALP fingered for stealing $100,000,000, brown paper bags dispensed by Bruce at the Bad-a-Bing! (Bill the Greek on the door)… The Australian Labor Party under Julia Gillard – a woman who, as a lawyer, makes Tom Hagen look like Atticus Finch.

    

    C.L.

    14 Nov 12 at 1:13 am
46. Still, while this looks bad and adds to the stink of dodgy dealings surrounding Gillard and Wilson, the cash might just have been the proceeds from a successful night at the casino and not slush fund money laundered through it.

    

    Cold-Hands

    14 Nov 12 at 1:14 am
47. Slipper. Don’t forget Slipper.

    

    Gab

    14 Nov 12 at 1:14 am
48. C.L. –
    Bolt, indeed!
    For all we know, this entire Catholic Church witchhunt RC distraction bullshit is because Bolt coulndn’t keep his mouth shut for a few days.

    

    roger

    14 Nov 12 at 1:24 am
49. Bolt! Bring back Santamaria. The right once had a brain.

    

    Scapula

    14 Nov 12 at 1:26 am
50. Fellow Cats -
    I’d really would like to know whether or not anyone else thinks hammy should be stopped from commenting here? I’m over his fucking shit.

    

    Nanuestalker

    14 Nov 12 at 1:26 am
51. Err… I think the fact that The Australian called gillard’s office with a new set of questions might have tipped gillard off. Bolt had nothing to do with it, roger.

    

    Gab

    14 Nov 12 at 1:27 am
52. Hmmm… *I

    

    Nanuestalker

    14 Nov 12 at 1:28 am
53. I don’t read what hammy writes all that much, nanu but if you have a complaint bring it to Sinclair’s attention via email. Just a suggestion.

    

    Gab

    14 Nov 12 at 1:30 am
54. The Liberals have told Abbott to put on his speedos, go to the beach and stay there for a very long summer. Good advice.

    

    Scapula

    14 Nov 12 at 1:32 am
55. I’ve always assumed Hamster was a piss-take.

    He doesn’t worry me.

    

    C.L.

    14 Nov 12 at 1:36 am
56. Good to see we are wasting our money on a good cause:

    CHINESE property development conglomerate Shanghai Zhongfu has won the sole right to develop 15,200ha of high-value irrigated agricultural land in northern Australia after the state and federal governments spent $510 million of taxpayer funds building road, irrigation, port and local community infrastructure to support the deal.

    

    Scapula

    14 Nov 12 at 1:43 am
57. A disgrace.

    

    C.L.

    14 Nov 12 at 1:49 am
58. If Obama had lost the election we would not have seen this purge of military officers, so thank God for that.

    

    Scapula

    14 Nov 12 at 1:57 am
59. Nanue, you’re letting Hammy get under your skin, and he’s not worth it.

    He’s just a low-rent Alene Composta wannabe. Ignore him.

    

    sdog

    14 Nov 12 at 2:00 am
60. CL thats quite a scoop.

    Might explain to that silly Jeanine Perrett woman where the story is.

    Let me get this right, obtained funds were deposited into a lawyers bank account. Why?

    Do they have the acount number?

    

    Jannie

    14 Nov 12 at 2:05 am
61. BTW that Latham interview with Chris Perrett is in his site at the Oz.

    I wonder why he is so defensive about it.

    

    Jannie

    14 Nov 12 at 2:10 am
62. Chris Kenny dammit, sorry. Jeanine Perrett is there too. Its really good entertainment.

    

    Jannie

    14 Nov 12 at 2:11 am
63. Hilarious watching Crapula transforming himself from Al Qaeda blower-up of decadent Westernism into Dogshit from the Brisbane Sewer Pipe – beta with small parts – defending a corrupt whorehouse mistress. Very unbecoming for a Marxist revolutionary.

    

    Tom

    14 Nov 12 at 3:49 am
64. I was nodding my head reading Janet Albrechtsen this morning and couldn’t help thinking of the earnest, dull, witless trolls who have invaded this blog:

    Alas, rational, cool-headed analysis is anathema to the New Puritans. And just as the 17th century Puritans were not always consistent in their “dour prudery”, our New Puritans are also inconsistent when it comes to taking offence.

    For example, in the same edition of The Sun-Herald it was entirely acceptable for the resident comic, Peter FitzSimons, to mock Mitt Romney for his Mormon beliefs. Equally, it’s called entertainment when the ABC’s Chaser boys poke fun at the Archbishop of Sydney and the Catholic Church as they did recently on The Hamster Wheel.

    Declaring a joke or a comment in poor taste is one thing. Confecting outrage for an ulterior motive is altogether another thing, which is what the New Puritans do when they selectively find offence and discrimination.

    Their purpose is entirely predictable: to censor words that challenge their beliefs.

    The consequences of this humourless, stifling atmosphere are neither minor nor momentary. The Australian’s Bill Leak said it best in a recent email to me. Without breaching any private confidence, Leak said: “Civility and mutual respect thrive on humour, just as they wither and die without it.”

    Apart from the fact that Australia is being run by a minority junta of the extreme left that is crawling with corruption, it is also the most humorless government in Australian history — an utterly ill-fitting national abomination.

    

    Tom

    14 Nov 12 at 5:01 am
65. THAT’S NOT FUNNY!

    

    sdog

    14 Nov 12 at 5:25 am
66. Tigers Tanked
    The decisive battles a few years ago where the Sri Lankans crushed the Tamil Tigers are to be re-examined by the UN, which is having a severe case of “we failed”. A report which has somehow found its way to the BBC (and will therefore be dutifully stenciled across ABC news & current affairs today) has the UN castigating itself for abandoning the field and allowing civilian casualties to accelerate.
    Personally, I saw the crushing of the Tamil Tigers as a good thing, and one which had taken far too long to happen. Given the way they operated, it could not be done without civilian casualties, just as Germany and Japan could not be hammered into unconditional surrender by gentler means.
    They same syndrome which we often see here from the leftist meme-ologists is at work again. It seeks to sheet home charges of war crimes against those who won the war by the only means such wars are winnable – by crushing the opposing force, which chooses to co-opt civilians as cover and coerce them as accomplices.
    We see the same attempt to retrospectively demonise the allies for their bombing during WW2, and we see the same “what about the civilians” every day in current Middle-eastern and other theatres of war. Afghanistan’s situation is bad because operations which involve civilian casualties attract approbrium form the Karzai government as well as here on the homefront from the “war is always bad” media, who note every grim milestone and see armed forces as ideally nothing more than UN blue-helmet fodder.
    Arafat Chance
    Curiusly, we hear little about the daily rain of missiles onto Israeli towns, where the inhabitants have a scant 15 seconds to take whatever cover is available.
    Instead, in talking point du jour number two from the BBC we’ll be regaled with breathless reverence as plans are hatched to exhume Arafat and take samples to determine whether the dastardly Israelis poisoned him with radioactive stuff, like the Russkies use on their bad boys.
    Who will have any faith in the outcome of that investigation? But for now it’s another sideshow brought to you by the BBC/ABC collective.

    

    blogstrop

    14 Nov 12 at 7:13 am
67. BBC seeks outsider to wipe slate clean.
    Oh, yes, the Jonathan Shier approach. Not good enough. They either end up in a big pot over a slow fire, or turn native.

    

    blogstrop

    14 Nov 12 at 7:48 am
68. The Sydney Morning Herald celebrates the achievement of a group of grinning IT students who worked out the algorithm that enables them to defraud Sydney public transport system.

    

    Tom

    14 Nov 12 at 7:58 am
69. Tom complaining about trolls being humourless? Well, true, unlike Mk50, they tend not to crack jokes about sex abuse scandals whether they be in the BBC or Australia. Nor do they call normal women sluts, or people they disagree with here perverts, virgins, gay or obese. This is, presumably, sometimes being done at least for self amusement.

    If that’s the sort of humour you’re missing Tom, you’re welcome to keep it all to yourself. And by the way, you’re rather on the chronically unfunny side yourself.

    And hello Blogstrop! That’s enough to make you wail, as far as I can tell.

    

    steve from brisbane

    14 Nov 12 at 8:17 am
70. Paul Kelly:
    “Consider the contrast with Kevin Rudd as opposition leader: he was promoted as a modern man with a modern family concerned about the “modern” agenda, climate change and education. The Liberal camp has missed multiple golden chances to promote the authentic Abbott – the volunteer, the community activist, the rare leader who spends days living and working in Aboriginal Australia.”
    No, Paul. It’s not the Liberal camp who have missed multiple opportunities, as you put it. The media have allowed all those good points to be blown away while they actively support the appalling lies and slurs, just as they in earlier luvvy times boosted Kev as the anti-Howard.

    

    blogstrop

    14 Nov 12 at 8:17 am
71. Somewhere inside this poorly explained gibberish, beneath a layer of propagandised wishful thinking, is an important story demanding to be told:

    ONE in four young Australians do not work or study despite Australia’s growing wealth, a national report to be released on Wednesday shows.

    The report also shows the government is well behind on its goal to double the number of working-age Australians with a higher-level qualification by 2020.

    The Council of Australian Governments reform council issued progress reports on education systems across Australia, and workforce participation.

    It said if Australia halved the number of people without a higher-level qualification by 2020, just 23.6 per cent would be without a qualification in eight years.

    Between 2008 and 2011, the number of 20 to 64-year-olds without a higher level qualification fell marginally.

    ”A projection of this trend would see around one in three working-age Australians without a Certificate III qualification or above in 2020,” the council said.

    ”We are yet to see any sign of the acceleration in the rate of qualification attainment that is needed to meet [the 23.6 per cent] target.”

    The council also raised concerns about young people disengaged from work and study.

    ”From 2008 to 2011, the national proportion of 18 to 24-year-olds fully engaged fell by 3.8 percentage points from 76.3 per cent to 72.5 per cent,” the reform council found. ”This was due to a fall in full-time employment … the largest decline from 2008 to 2011 in post-school participation in employment, education or training was for young people from the lowest socio-economic areas.”

    

    Tom

    14 Nov 12 at 8:17 am
72. “he deposited about $5000 cash into Julia Gillard’s bank account at the request of her then boyfriend Bruce Wilson.”

    Alas, nothing to see here.
    They were at a casino. Wilson has plausible deniability, casino’s don’t keep their CTV tapes to confirm actual winnings that long.
    Unless….Julia has previously denied accepting any money from Wilson.

    Still, another brick in the wall.
    Abbott vs Rudd looking likely.
    LibLabs lose unlosable election.

    

    Alfonso

    14 Nov 12 at 8:19 am
73. Personally, I saw the crushing of the Tamil Tigers as a good thing, and one which had taken far too long to happen.

    The Tamil Tigers were the plaything of a sociopath who rejected a very generous peace which would have given the Tamils all they dream because he didn’t want to lose control.

    The high command of the Tamil Tigers who developed the technique of suicide bombing civilians should be held accountable for those deaths.

    At the height of its power, the LTTE possessed a well-developed militia and carried out many high-profile attacks, including the assassinations of several high-ranking Sri Lankan and Indian politicians. The LTTE was the only separatist militant organization to assassinate two world leaders: Sri Lankan President Ranasinghe Premadasa in 1993 and former Indian Prime Minister Rajiv Gandhi in 1991.[9] Civilian massacres, suicide bombings and acts of ethnic cleansing[10][11] were integral parts of its pursuit to create a monoethnic Tamil Eelam in response to the nation-wide atrocities against the Tamil population.[12][13][14] The LTTE pioneered the use of suicide belts,[9] and used light aircraft in some of its attacks.[15] As a result of its tactics, it is currently proscribed as a terrorist organization by 32 countries, but has extensive support amongst the Sri Lankan Tamil diaspora in Europe and North America, and amongst some Tamils in India.[16] However, Human Rights Organizations such as University Teachers for Human Rights (Jaffna) alleges that the LTTE has killed at least 8000 fellow Tamils considered to be traitors to its cause.[17] LTTE founder Velupillai Prabhakaran headed the organization from its inception until his death in 2009.[18]

    Of course the ABC flushes these truths down the memory hole.

    

    Token

    14 Nov 12 at 8:19 am
74. Dogshit, why don’t you go and defecate on your own blog instead of spraying your excrement all over ours.

    

    Tom

    14 Nov 12 at 8:22 am
75. No, Paul. It’s not the Liberal camp who have missed multiple opportunities, as you put it. The media have allowed all those good points to be blown away while they actively support the appalling lies and slurs, just as they in earlier luvvy times boosted Kev as the anti-Howard.

    Who can forget David Marr making statements that the ultra-marathons Abbott does for charity was imparing Abbott’s judgement on Insiders as Barry Cassidy chortled on.

    

    Token

    14 Nov 12 at 8:22 am
76. “earnest, dull, witless trolls”

    Cf. SfB, 4 Nov 12 at 8:17 am

    

    sdog

    14 Nov 12 at 8:22 am
77. I don’t know, Tom. It was nice of him to provide an illustration of your observation, anyway.

    

    sdog

    14 Nov 12 at 8:23 am
78. sdog, your gunloving ways annoy me and I think you’re as insane as the next Republican for trying to blame the loss on the voters; but I do, from time to time, detect an element of good humour within you. Unlike Tom or blogstrop…

    

    steve from brisbane

    14 Nov 12 at 8:27 am
79. Good interview between Steve Kates & AJ this morning.

    

    Token

    14 Nov 12 at 8:29 am
80. The Sydney Morning Herald celebrates the achievement of a group of grinning IT students who worked out the algorithm that enables them to defraud Sydney public transport system.

    I’m surprised they didn’t follow this article up with a complimentary article about the way the cost of public transport keeps rising.

    

    Token

    14 Nov 12 at 8:31 am
81. If the money was so tainted why didn’t the boyfriend do his own banking?

    Do you really need to be told the obvious Bob. Piss off back to the blog of retards.

    

    Tiny Dancer

    14 Nov 12 at 8:37 am
82. The Australian Catholic priesthood has already started to eat its own.

    

    m0nty

    14 Nov 12 at 8:41 am
83. Stevieliar QC. Cook breakfast

    

    Tiny Dancer

    14 Nov 12 at 8:43 am
84. ONE in four young Australians do not work or study

    State education, come on down!

    Great effort, commies!

    But hey, let’s pour even more taxpayer billions into a disgraceful sham that not only leaves kiddies illiterate, innumerate and utterly ignorant of history, but also brainwashed with deranged leftist bullshit.

    What’s not to like?

    

    Rabz

    14 Nov 12 at 8:48 am
85. Pity that the Labor Party is wasting time on spin and policies it will never deliver and failing the people who vote for it.

    ONE in four young Australians do not work or study despite Australia’s growing wealth, a national report to be released on Wednesday shows.

    The report also shows the government is well behind on its goal to double the number of working-age Australians with a higher-level qualification by 2020.

    Good find Tom.

    

    Token

    14 Nov 12 at 8:51 am
86. Note the difference in tone from FauxFacts about the way we should all treat the Catholic Church and the BBC who promoted and covered up for a p3do for 30 years:

    Yes, the BBC got it wrong, but its journalism is as robust as ever

    Don’t get me wrong: Newsnight cocked up. Twice. In very close succession. This is obviously appalling for the innocent victims of those mistakes – the prey of paedophile Jimmy Savile, as well as Thatcherite politician Lord McAlpine who is definitely not a paedophile – but it should not be taken as an inevitable outcome of a corporation that has lost its way. They are results of very human errors that blight all institutions that are under constant external scrutiny and internal pressure to do more with less and faster.

    Got that?

    Catholic Church, rotten institution which should be held to account for all failings.

    BBC wonderful institution that cocked up as a result of human errors that blight institutions.

    Shameless.

    

    Token

    14 Nov 12 at 8:57 am
87. I have a comment in moderation comparing the different in approach at FauxFacts between the Catholic Church & BBC over similar issues.

    This is the disgraceful article. It quotes the “p” in the text.

    Please release.

    

    Token

    14 Nov 12 at 8:59 am
88. Note the difference in tone from FauxFacts about the way we should all treat the Catholic Church and the BBC who promoted and covered up for a p**doph**e for 30 years:

    Yes, the BBC got it wrong, but its journalism is as robust as ever

    Don’t get me wrong: Newsnight cocked up. Twice. In very close succession. This is obviously appalling for the innocent victims of those mistakes – the prey of p**doph**e Jimmy Savile, as well as Thatcherite politician Lord McAlpine who is definitely not a p**doph**e – but it should not be taken as an inevitable outcome of a corporation that has lost its way. They are results of very human errors that blight all institutions that are under constant external scrutiny and internal pressure to do more with less and faster.

    Got that?

    Catholic Church, rotten institution which should be held to account for all failings.

    BBC wonderful institution that cocked up as a result of human errors that blight institutions.

    Shameless.

    

    Token

    14 Nov 12 at 9:01 am
89. State education, come on down!

    Great effort, commies!

    I blame the educationalists. Look at the AQF and NSSC etc. These idiots literally create a state mandated way to learn everything.

    It is worse than kids go through at school. It also adds to egregious and destructive credentialism and onerous occupational licensing.

    

    .

    14 Nov 12 at 9:03 am
90. It was getting a little lowbrow.

    Bad grammar. Wrong tense. Better to use “always been” referring to the whole blog, not just one thread. Also wrong adjective “little” – “very” would be more accurate.

    

    hammygar

    14 Nov 12 at 9:04 am
91. as well as Thatcherite politician Lord McAlpine who is definitely not a p**doph**e

    The way they wrote that is borderline reckless.

    

    .

    14 Nov 12 at 9:05 am
92. BBC wonderful institution that cocked up as a result of human errors that blight institutions.

    A key point:

    under constant external scrutiny and internal pressure to do more with less and faster.

    A few gazillion more taxpayers’ pounds and these ‘errors’ would not have happened, dammit!

    

    Rabz

    14 Nov 12 at 9:06 am
93. Gerard Henderson has suggestions on the terms of reference for the royal commission into the Catholic Church sexual abuse of children:

    The media would be well advised not to adopt double standards when dealing with child molestation. It is now accepted the late Sir Jimmy Savile was one of the worst p**doph*les in British history.

    Yet the media initially engaged in a cover-up. Freelance journalist Miles Goslett could not get his article linking the long-time BBC star with attacks on young girls published and had to rely on The Oldie, where his article was printed last March. As is now known, the BBC spiked a Newsnight program on Savile’s criminality so as not to upset a program scheduled for Christmas 2011 praising the m*l*st*r.

    And then there is the case of the late Fairfax columnist Peter Roebuck. Roebuck’s work for the ABC as a cricket commentator increased after he was convicted of common assault on two young African men. There are now claims that Roebuck was a s*xu*l pr*dat*r who targeted young black males.

    Despite this, when Roebuck died last year he was lauded by journalists – particularly at Fairfax and the ABC. Even yesterday, sections of the media remembered the first anniversary of Roebuck’s death but conveniently forgot that he was an offender.

    The good news is that the proposed royal commission will cover all instances of child abuse and not just crimes committed by Catholic clergy. Tragically, it is not likely to stop attacks on young Aboriginal boys and girls.

    

    Token

    14 Nov 12 at 9:09 am
94. Cameron appointed Patten who appointed someone to head the BBC. So its yet another example of the Tory destruction of the BBC.

    

    Scapula

    14 Nov 12 at 9:41 am
95. Cameron appointed Patten who appointed someone to head the BBC. So its yet another example of the Tory destruction of the BBC.

    So Crapula is not happy that the cover up at the institutional cover up at the BBC of p**do Saville was exposed.

    You are a very sick person.

    

    Token

    14 Nov 12 at 9:46 am
96. not only leaves kiddies illiterate, innumerate and utterly ignorant of history

    Interestingly, new graduates applying for positions where i work are requested to submit their CV/Application in their own handwriting (typed applications are returned with a request for handwriting).

    The spelling is woeful, the sentence construction defies belief and the penmanship looks like something a pre-schooler would write.

    

    Carpe Jugulum

    14 Nov 12 at 10:07 am
97. The BBC’s journalism is ‘robust’? Random human error? What utter crap.

    The BBC just spent a fortune (six lawyers, at least 2 QCs) defending a FOI request from a British pensioner called Tony Newbury. Newbury wanted to know who attended a seminar at the BBC in 2006 about climate change reporting. The BBC had cited this seminar as an educational session which included scientists and experts, to inform the troops. But it refused to say who the ‘experts’ were.

    The BBC won the case, bizarrely because the judges panel (which included at least one climate change activist) decided that it was a private organisation, notwithstanding it receiving 4 billion quid a year from the British taxpayer.

    Now, it turns out that the list was available on the internet at the time, and a blogger called Maurizio Morabito used the Wayback Machine and got the list, which has now been published.

    Quelle surprise! The head of Greenpeace campaigns, a bunch of other climate activists, reps from the insurance industry and the finance sector, academics who have published extensively on how to get CAGW propaganda embedded in the media – oh, and three pro-CAGW scientists.

    The four people who have now been forced to vacate their jobs at the BBC were there too, along with most of the senior program managers.

    The objective was to infiltrate every aspect of BBC programming with climate propaganda – and it worked. No wonder they didn’t want to release the list.

    What’s more, the BBC executive who signed off on their submission to the FOI panel seems to have committed the odd terminological inexactitude. She is already in the poo because of the baseless slander against Lord McAlpine (that he was a kiddy-fiddler).

    More at:

    http://wattsupwiththat.com/2012/11/12/breaking-the-secret-list-of-the-bbc-28-is-now-public/#comment-1146446

    plus several posts at Bishop Hill.

    Robust journalism indeed. They spent a fortune to cover this up, and not one of them was computer literate enough to check and see whether the information was already available.

    

    johanna

    14 Nov 12 at 10:22 am
98. Kae, thanks for the news about Bunyip being back. I am flat out busy back in Sydney again for four days, but will try to keep up with his posts – they are always good reading.

    

    Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

    14 Nov 12 at 10:24 am
99. Credit where credit is due – I note Scapula referred to this much earlier this morning, sans linky thing.

    I just remind ( can’t find a link readily though ) the news earlier this year that Craig Emerson had been negotiating for a year ‘confidentially’ to grant exclusive access to the Ord to Chinese interests.

    The attached article indicates there was at least some competitive process to secure the Ord leases, one of the runners up being an Australian agricultural enterprise. You know – folk who grow things for a living.

    The objective was to ‘develop the second stage of the Ord irrigation scheme into a new Asian food bowl.’

    Where are we today ?

    The Chinese company plans to grow sugarcane across the entire region, and build a new sugar mill to process the cane into sugar and ethanol biofuel.

    Ummm – I kind of think rice, soy beans or pulses are food bowl, sugar is what kids put on their breakfast cereals and yuppies in Shanghai ladle into their frappacinnos ? But I am old fashioned.

    And who is the lucky winner ?

    …vice president of Shanghai Zhongfu, confirmed ….. a fortnight ago that the Chinese property developer wanted to grow sugar across a large swath of the East Kimberley.

    Shanghai Zhongfu has no agricultural projects in China and its winning Ord scheme tender will be its first investment in Australia from a company better known as a hotel developer and major property project player than a food and farming enterprise.

    Well that’s re-assuring – experience and core competencies obviously didn’t crack a mention in the tender.

    And Shanghai Zhongfu’s business case ?:

    “It’s just a good business opportunity for us; as our boss found it might be profitable,” Mr Yan said earlier this year.

    More re-assurance on longevity.

    Any Maaaates involved ?

    Shanghai Zhongfu also employed former prime minister Bob Hawke as its Australian lobbyist to push the Ord bid.

    Well, today’s theme song in the corridors of the ministerial wing and the hallowed halls of Club Maaaate.

    

    Myrrdin Seren

    14 Nov 12 at 10:38 am
100. Well, true, unlike Mk50, they tend not to crack jokes about sex abuse scandals…

     Steve joked about mass death in New York two weeks ago and once laughed about a little girl hospitalised after a horse-riding accident.

     

     C.L.

     14 Nov 12 at 11:01 am
101. “the penmanship looks like something a pre-schooler would write.”

     I’ve noticed a marked deterioration in my writing legibility during the almost two decades since I found I could type faster than I could write. No practice means skills are lost. If people use keyboards and keypads/touchscreens all the time, they’re unlikely to have calligraphic writing.

     

     Jarrah

     14 Nov 12 at 11:02 am
102. Ah yes, Peter Roebuck.

     One of the left’s iconic sex offenders.

     Forgot about him.

     It’s really a mystery he wasn’t offered an ALP leadership position.

     

     C.L.

     14 Nov 12 at 11:04 am
103. The Sydney Morning Herald celebrates the achievement of a group of grinning IT students who worked out the algorithm that enables them to defraud Sydney public transport system.

     Nonsense. They didn’t defraud anyone. They appear to have behaved ethically. They found a vulnerability and they brought it to the attention of Transport for NSW.

     The bad guys are Transport for NSW for using shit encryption that they invented themselves. That is really bush league stuff.

     (Also props to the SMH for a nice bit of science reporting.)

     

     Dangph

     14 Nov 12 at 11:06 am
104. “Consider the contrast with Kevin Rudd as opposition leader: he was promoted as a modern man with a modern family concerned about the “modern” agenda,

     Ah yes but promoting Abbott as a modern man with a modern family gets treated with derision and he gets labeled a misogynist for daring to even mention his wife and children. It’s a slight against Julia, you see, or something.

     

     Gab

     14 Nov 12 at 11:09 am
105. I predicted two days ago that the Aboriginal industry would avoid a Bolt-affirming blue-on-blue (lefty-on-lefty) firefight over Canberra academic Don Aitkin.

     Et voilà.

     

     C.L.

     14 Nov 12 at 11:11 am
106. “the penmanship looks like something a pre-schooler would write.”

     I skipped second grade, so I missed cursive writing. No one’s ever held it against me. I didn’t even know penmanship was still a thing.

     /he types

     

     sdog

     14 Nov 12 at 11:14 am
107. I didn’t even know penmanship was still a thing.

     Yes, it still gets a gig, for example a construction meeting with a client may have 4 of us representing the builder. We will all take notes and a report of the meeting is then put together by the head office staff from all participants.

     Legible writing that makes sense of points of discussion and the timelines of these discussions is actually very important especially with building programs, contract variations, extensions of time, requests for information & other issues.

     If a project begins to go pear shaped having a legible handwritten account at the time is a highly valuable tool.

     

     Carpe Jugulum

     14 Nov 12 at 11:23 am
108. Catallaxy’s sweetheart and science interpreter of interpretations,James Delingpole, caught running as a stalking horse for the Tories.

     It says a bit about the Tories that they were willing to try to use this blustering fool. Defeat in the by-election seems just reward.

     

     AndrewL

     14 Nov 12 at 11:35 am
109. We will all take notes and a report of the meeting is then put together by the head office staff from all participants.

     Don’t they have an option to type their notes into a computer?

     Touch typing is a more useful skill to have these days than good penmanship.

     

     Dangph

     14 Nov 12 at 11:37 am
110. C.L. – re Aitkin.

     As I said on the thread where this was raised, the local tribe (the Ngunnawal) despise Mortimer. I notice in the piece you linked they don’t even accept that he is Aboriginal.

     Looks like he may have to add this to his growing list of failed legal actions.

     

     johanna

     14 Nov 12 at 11:38 am
111. As I said on the thread where this was raised, the local tribe (the Ngunnawal) despise Mortimer. I notice in the piece you linked they don’t even accept that he is Aboriginal.

     The new Australian one drop of blood rule is as complex as its predescors in South Africa and the Old South.

     

     Token

     14 Nov 12 at 11:45 am
112. Don’t they have an option to type their notes into a computer?

     Probably, but construction meetings tend to get rather heated so being able to argue a point while pointing at drawings, building programs or other documents doesn’t really lend itself to typing, where being able to write notes fast, legibably with correct spelling just works better.

     Also a lot of these meetings are held on site so a battery failure could ruin your note taking (not enough plugs in a shed).

     

     Carpe Jugulum

     14 Nov 12 at 11:50 am
113. I haven’t read anything by Delingpole about his actions.

     

     Scapula

     14 Nov 12 at 11:51 am
114. legibably

     and on cue i fvk that up.

     

     Carpe Jugulum

     14 Nov 12 at 11:52 am
115. Of course, it has nothing to do with the idiots pulling the policy levers. Kohler:

     Australia’s version of Dutch disease is turning into an emergency; we might have survived the GFC, but the way things are going we won’t survive the SMBC – the small to medium business crisis.

     Yesterday’s monthly business survey from NAB should be setting off alarms in Canberra and through every bank and big company boardroom in the country: Australia’s non-mining businesses are in serious trouble just as the resources boom ends. There will be nothing to take its place.

     Businesses are reporting that all aspects of trading conditions in virtually all industries are weaker than they have been since early 2009, when they were recovering from the global credit crisis. Wholesale, retail, manufacturing, construction and even mining are all reporting that things are tougher than they have been since the GFC.

     

     Tom

     14 Nov 12 at 11:58 am
116. News.com.au reports that former Speaker Peter Slipper denies he was kicked out of a Sydney gay bar for being drunk.It seems that some gay-bar worker having perhaps mistaken Pete’s high spirits for intoxication claims ” just threw a drunken Peter Slipper out of my main bar”.Pete has told News.Ltd that the claim is untrue and highly defamatory. Let’s go to the video tape.

     

     Lew

     14 Nov 12 at 12:00 pm
117. My printing is fine, Jugs. Draftsman-like, even. I just don’t do handwriting/cursive.

     

     sdog

     14 Nov 12 at 12:02 pm
118. fair enough sdog, it just works in my work life.

     And yes i also print.

     

     Carpe Jugulum

     14 Nov 12 at 12:05 pm
119. sdog, i should have added, for obvious reasons Lady Jugs also doesn’t do cursive.

     

     Carpe Jugulum

     14 Nov 12 at 12:09 pm
120. where being able to write notes fast, legibably with correct spelling just works better

     Fair enough. Handwriting aside, I find that in my field, software development, writing ability correlates strongly with competence. People who write English well also tend to write good code. If it were up to me, I would get potential new hires to write a short essay. CVs and qualifications are often misleading.

     

     Dangph

     14 Nov 12 at 12:11 pm
121. Excellent stuff from you, Myrrdin at 10.38am. It reminds me of the AUSNET tender process that was also a sham.

     

     Gab

     14 Nov 12 at 12:14 pm
122. Important report from Jo Nova on the way the BBC turned Green.

     

     Poor Old Rafe

     14 Nov 12 at 12:28 pm
123. If it were up to me, I would get potential new hires to write a short essay. CVs and qualifications are often misleading.

     Dangph – A good suggestion, i’ll pass that on. Many thanks.

     

     Carpe Jugulum

     14 Nov 12 at 12:33 pm
124. The BBC has held a high-level seminar with some of the best scientific experts, and has come to the view that the weight of evidence no longer justifies equal space being given to the opponents of the consensus [on anthropogenic climate change].”

     A completely correct conclusion as to the matter of science, but it has nothing to do with ‘turning green’.

     

     Scapula

     14 Nov 12 at 12:34 pm
125. The Goose smacks down Judith Sloan:

     Letter to the Editor
     The Australian

     Dear Editor,

     Returning from Washington last week, I’ve been struck by the chasm between the complimentary views of the Australian economy offered by the likes of Ben Bernanke, Tim Geithner and Christine Lagarde and, on the other hand, attacks on our economy mounted by prominent figures in our own public debate.

     It is clear to me that Australia would not have built one of the strongest economies in the world without one of the strongest treasury departments in the world.

     Treasury can and should be applauded for its vital role in our undeniable economic success amid the worst global conditions since the Great Depression.

     It is regrettable that some commentators misunderstand the facts about the proper activities of Treasury, such as costing of policies in the public domain which took place under Peter Costello and were quite legitimately published in the pages of this newspaper as a useful way of advancing the public policy debate.

     I welcome contributions to the public debate from all quarters. It is a fact that Australia has avoided huge job losses and social destruction seen among our peers, and that our economy is 11 per cent larger than before the global financial crisis and will be 18 per cent larger by 2014.

     Given that Judith Sloan suggested that GDP growth should be the sole criterion of economic success, it is regrettable not to see this latter fact about our GDP performance under this government acknowledged (‘Treasury’s fall from grace started with wellbeing’, The Australian, 13/11/2012).

     More importantly, achievements like this are a remarkable endorsement of the fine men and women in Treasury, which is why I’ll always defend their hard work in the face of unfair attacks.

     Wayne Swan
     Deputy PM and Treasurer

     Does she even care?

     

     Econocrat

     14 Nov 12 at 12:35 pm
126. Given that Judith Sloan suggested that GDP growth should be the sole criterion of economic success,

     Did Professor Sloan actually say this?

     

     Gab

     14 Nov 12 at 12:37 pm
127. The BBC has held a high-level seminar with some of the best scientific experts, and has come to the view that the weight of evidence no longer justifies equal space being given to the opponents of the consensus [on anthropogenic climate change].”

     The BBC – an ‘organisation’ with some severe credibility problems.

     Or hadn’t you noticed, you frigging imbecile?

     

     Rabz

     14 Nov 12 at 12:44 pm
128. the complimentary views of the Australian economy offered by the likes of Ben Bernanke, Tim Geithner and Christine Lagarde

     Bwahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!

     

     Rabz

     14 Nov 12 at 12:45 pm
129. Some context on the BBC “experts” seminar:

     As Barry Woods notes at Watts Up With That, the scandal goes at least as far back as 2002 with this email (exposed in Climategate 2) by climate activist Mike Hulme.

     Did anyone hear Stott vs. Houghton on Today, radio 4 this morning? Woeful
     stuff really. This is one reason why Tyndall is sponsoring the Cambridge
     Media/Environment Programme to starve this type of reporting at source.

     .

     PS: Thanks for that article you posted from the Guardian, it really is just damp squib. Nothing anyone can run with there.

     

     Token

     14 Nov 12 at 12:47 pm
130. Given that Judith Sloan suggested that GDP growth should be the sole criterion of economic success,

     Did Professor Sloan actually say this?

     All Goose needs to do is whack a auggests on a statement and then he can say anything.

     What for the love media to quote Judith based upon this verballing by Labor. Bog standard trick.

     

     Token

     14 Nov 12 at 12:50 pm
131. It is clear to me that Australia would not have built one of the strongest economies in the world without one of the strongest treasury departments in the world.

     Yes, all the coal is located under their building.

     

     C.L.

     14 Nov 12 at 12:50 pm
132. The Goose comes out and defends Treasury performance. Talk about damned with faint praise.

     

     H B Bear

     14 Nov 12 at 12:51 pm
133. I think we are fogetting the personal distress that Judith must be going through right now knowing that the Goose does not like her.

     Maybe, somehow, she will find a way to go on with her life.

     

     Econocrat

     14 Nov 12 at 1:00 pm
134. I think we are fogetting the personal distress that Judith must be going through right now knowing that the Goose does not like her.

     If you listen closely you can hear her laughter in the distance.

     

     Carpe Jugulum

     14 Nov 12 at 1:09 pm
135. The Goose smacks down Judith Sloan

     Misogynist! Misogynist!! MISOGYNIST!!!

     Where are the M-bombers of Gal-Qaeda with their weapons-grade Victim Cards when we need them?

     Will no-one defend our fair Judith from the Labor government’s vile and frankly dangerous misogyny?!

     Someone page Jezebel STAT.

     

     sdog

     14 Nov 12 at 1:11 pm
136. Yes, the BBC was destroyed by the Tory Thatcher and now under the Tory Cameron has appointed another Tory called Patten who in turn has appointed someone who can’t run the show!

     

     Scapula

     14 Nov 12 at 1:22 pm
137. Scrofula is sounding more like Hammy.

     

     blogstrop

     14 Nov 12 at 1:58 pm
138. Don’t get stroppy!

     

     Scapula

     14 Nov 12 at 2:03 pm
139. Great post on Sri Lanka blogstrop.

     The decisive battles a few years ago where the Sri Lankans crushed the Tamil Tigers are to be re-examined by the UN, which is having a severe case of “we failed”.

     Yes. They failed yet the war was won and now there is peace.

     That is the lesson they should away.

     

     jupes

     14 Nov 12 at 2:06 pm
140. Yes, the BBC was destroyed by the Tory Thatcher and now under the Tory Cameron has appointed another Tory called Patten who in turn has appointed someone who can’t run the show!

     Seems like you’re flogging a dead horse actually.

     

     .

     14 Nov 12 at 2:18 pm
141. No surprise here – as I thought:

     The New South Wales coroner has handed down damning findings against police who acted “like schoolboys in Lord of the Flies” as they tasered a Brazilian student in Sydney’s CBD earlier this year.

     Roberto Laudisio Curti died after police fired Tasers at him 14 times – seven of them within 51 seconds – following a chase in the early hours of March 18.

     Handing down her findings today, coroner Mary Jerram said the actions of some police were reckless and excessive and constituted an abuse of police power.

     And she strongly recommended that disciplinary action be taken against five officers involved in the fatal confrontation.

     Curti’s family has welcomed that finding, but is pushing for criminal charges to be laid against the officers concerned.

     Police should face action over Taser death: coroner.

     One of the animals has since been promoted, despite lying to the coroner (a criminal offence):

     The five officers singled out for criticism ranged in rank at the time of the incident from PC to sergeant. One of the men, Greg Cooper, has since been promoted to inspector.

     “His failure to maintain any objectivity or sensible leadership, quite apart from the unreliability of his evidence, is abhorrent,” the coroner said of Inspector Cooper.

     

     C.L.

     14 Nov 12 at 2:29 pm
142. Wish we could get Thatcher to destroy Their ABC spatula..

     

     max49

     14 Nov 12 at 2:32 pm
143. the BBC was destroyed by the Tory Thatcher

     …Yet it’s still there behaving like an outlaw unto itself with its snout in the public trough. Now the ABC is aping the BBC, but without any of the professionalism or the slightest pretence that it’s anything but the propaganda division of the Australian Green Left political movement.

     There is indeed much for an incoming government to contemplate. The unsackable, unaccountable leftwing public service culture is entrenched and unchangeable. New owners would do it the world of good and would relieve the current owners from having shit contemptuously thrown in their faces on every channel in every hour of every day — not to mention the bonus of $1 billion-plus is annual savings.

     

     Tom

     14 Nov 12 at 2:38 pm
144. “I am still holding this wad of cash in my hand. By this stage Bill (Telikostoglou, aka ‘Bill the Greek’) had walked into the room and he said some strange Greek thing about how I must have had better luck than he did (at the casino) last night.

     Yay – Bill the Greek is back!

     

     Viva

     14 Nov 12 at 2:39 pm
145. Side benefits as the journalist refugees from Fairfax will have no where to hold up..win,win for decency all round..

     

     max49

     14 Nov 12 at 2:41 pm
146. Thanks jupes. Sure enough, heard it all replayed on the ABC News Radio station this afternoon (haven’t been listening apart from a little bit then). Also noticing how much use they’re making of Al Jazeera reports. That’s building your house upon the sand in more ways than one.

     

     blogstrop

     14 Nov 12 at 3:34 pm
147. Call me Paranoid but I am wondering if the Petraeus affair and the Lance Armstrong affair are the begining of a pattern where every month a new WASP alpha male gets the trial by media treatment?

     thoughts???

     

     Max

     14 Nov 12 at 4:33 pm
148. Richard North on TwentyEightGate:

     Neglecting the other delicious members, and focusing on the BBC, it seems we have a situation where the state broadcaster is a corporate member of the Media Trust which, in turn, is a member of the International Broadcasting Trust, which is paid by the Government (DFID) to lobby the … er … BBC about climate change. And so the circle closes.

     Well – Richard assumes you get the last part of the circle – which is that BBC agitprop is of course leveraged by the green lobby to reinforce their urging of government that there is a mass movement and no serious dissent to shut down the UK energy economy.

     As Ben Pile as repeatedly shown, European governments – national and the EU supra-national leviathan – distribute vast amounts of taxpayers largesse to be ‘pushed’ on policy by lobby groups.

     

     Myrrdin Seren

     14 Nov 12 at 4:50 pm
149. ‘More importantly, achievements like this are a remarkable endorsement of the fine men and women in Treasury’

     I can immediately find any stats on line, but my strong recollection is that Treasury’s Senior Executive Service includes very few women, at least by comparison both with other agencies and with the APS overall.

     

     Des Deskperson

     14 Nov 12 at 4:52 pm
150. One of the small joys of coming home early is watchings little kids TV . Especially play school. With Georgie Parker. Especially when she’s pretending to be a hippo wallowing in mud. In perfectly fitted jeans and t shirt. Andrew McFarlane being a scarecrow not so much.

     

     Pickles

     14 Nov 12 at 4:54 pm
151. On NewsRadio this minute they have a young sounding bloke informing how he wants to ‘raise awareness’ of asbestos related mesothelioma acquired when renovating old houses.

     His Mum contracted it that way.

     His method of raising awareness?

     Write a book? nope

     Walk around the City with an informative sandwich board? nope

     Youtube video promoted on Facebook? nope

     Him and a couple of mates will climb the highest mountain in South America funded by donations to his mesothelioma fund.

     Turd.

     

     DaveF

     14 Nov 12 at 5:04 pm
152. Yay – Bill the Greek is back!

     AKA the “big greek bullsh*tartist” and identified as such by a fellow bullsh*tartist…

     

     Rabz

     14 Nov 12 at 5:04 pm
153. LABOUR PARTY STRATEGY IS TO ANNIHILATE THE GREENS.
     Relax, i didn’t misspell, it’s only NZ.
     But WOW, have a gander at some of the policies they’re considering.

     Nationalisation of any partially sold assets
     A financial transactions tax
     Require all private boards to comply with a 50% gender quota within five years
     A universal child benefit so millionaires get paid money for having kids
     52 weeks paid parental leave (why stop there – go for 18 years I say!)
     Lower the voting age to 16
     A gender quota for the House of Representatives (why not a race and sexual orientation quota also!)
     Compulsory Te Reo Maori until age 15
     End all funding of private schools (which ironically will force them all to be integrated and go from 25% funding to 100%)
     Bring ban the food police to school tuckshops
     Ban seabed mining for minerals oil and gas
     Ban fracking
     A tax on aquaculture
     Ban all coal mining
     A mineral exports tax
     Ban plastic bags
     Fund a brand new commercial free TV broadcaster
     Fund a Pacific TV broadcaster
     A Super Gold card for transport for under 21s
     A rail link to the airport for Auckland (think how much taxes will be gong up to pay for all of this)
     A petrol tax to fund rail
     Set up a state owned insurance company to compete with private insurers

     

     jumpnmcar

     14 Nov 12 at 7:29 pm
154. But WOW, have a gander at some of the policies they’re considering.

     Good grief! Their idea is to annihilate the Greens by becoming the Greens.

     I’m not sure they’ve thought this one through.

     

     jupes

     14 Nov 12 at 7:35 pm
155. The only things missing are a policy guaranteeing a division one win in lotto each year, and a free unicorn for the backyard. The government will pick up the tab for the hay of course.

     Add those in and I might move the NZ vote for them!e

     

     Entropy

     14 Nov 12 at 7:36 pm
156. Wow, They make the Greens appear as complete pikers.

     

     JC

     14 Nov 12 at 7:39 pm
157. Yes, well, if you look at the official draft policy it looks nothing like the above.

     

     Scapula

     14 Nov 12 at 7:42 pm
158. C.L.

     says

     “The New South Wales coroner has handed down damning findings against police who acted “like schoolboys in Lord of the Flies” as they tasered a Brazilian student in Sydney’s CBD earlier this year.”

     Thats because they had gutless 55kg people recruited to be police and they fekt “threatened” when the Braxilian was on the ggrounf already and in handcuffs.

     Lets just forget the BS equity and get women and lightweight new recruits otta da force. If they dont have the strength to overpower this guy without tasers and with paddy wagon and hancruffs they shouldnt be “in the force”. Its all bullshit. They hire young skinny wonmen and anyone they can get (children) and they give them tasers and guns and wonder why it gets all f/*** up like this.

     No Im not going to be piliticallly correct. If they dont have the muscle without tasers and guns, equaity and equality can go get stuffed.

     The poor brazilian bastard. He didnt deserve to be a victim of lightweights cowardice.

     

     Alice

     14 Nov 12 at 7:44 pm
159. scapula

     Yes, well, if you look at the official draft policy it looks nothing like the above.

     Which ones matey?

     

     jumpnmcar

     14 Nov 12 at 7:49 pm
160. Full of spelling mistakes above but not half as bad as the mistakes in the police force’s recruitment policies. They are damning.

     

     Alice

     14 Nov 12 at 7:49 pm
161. Yes, well, if you look at the official draft policy it looks nothing like the above.

     As jump asked…

     We’re waiting Bob.

     

     JC

     14 Nov 12 at 7:50 pm
162. There is also nothing for business.
     I suggest a guaranteed minimum price, plus an issue of free quotas to current producers, with no new quotas issued to new entrants to the market, which must be bought from existing producers. What could go wrong?

     

     Entropy

     14 Nov 12 at 8:00 pm
163. Scapula:

     They are ‘remits’ (wtf, I’ve never seen the word used this way) to be discussed and voted on.

     They are suggestions from NZLP people that may become policy. It isn’t a question of whether they are trying to snooker the Green Party it’s closer to a Green Party takeover of the NZLP.

     All of the other remits are being taken into account in these ways:
      In the development of the draft Policy Platform;
      In the development of detailed policy for the 2014 Manifesto;
      In the day to day work of spokespeople.

     2014 Policy Platform, eh. Hardly a repudiation.

     

     DaveF

     14 Nov 12 at 8:11 pm
164. The Brazilian was made crazy by self-administered illegal drugs. Police have to deal with all the crap thrown at them by criminals, drunks, drug adicts, “peaceful” islamic protesters, and assorted lunatics.
     I have seen nothing which sheets home any blame to the Brazilian for his actions; he was ultimately responsible for his bad behaviour up to the point where he was asked to stop and didn’t. After that they were dealing with a rampant drug-crazed idiot, and unless you have a better way of dealing with such things, ease off a little on the condemnation. Judges can rely on others to deal with such things. They get to pontificate in splendid isolation.
     And if you’re having trouble recruiting quality police, ask yourself why. PC and this sort of thing, where they’re asked to deal with an increasing level of dysfunction without any backing up from on high could be the answer.

     

     blogstrop

     14 Nov 12 at 8:13 pm
165. A very timely warning in this increasingly hysterical time. The man who accused Kevin Clash, the voice of Elmo, of sexual abuse of a child has now recanted his accusation.

     How long before Clash’s reputation recovers?

     

     Gab

     14 Nov 12 at 8:25 pm
166. Compulsory Te Reo Maori until age 15

     I have no idea what that means, could you explain that for me.

     

     Carpe Jugulum

     14 Nov 12 at 8:29 pm
167. now recanted his accusation.

     And should serve the time that could have been suffered by his accused.( even as lenient as judges give nowadays )

     

     jumpnmcar

     14 Nov 12 at 8:34 pm
168. Compulsory Te Reo Maori until age 15

     The teaching of Maori.

     

     DaveF

     14 Nov 12 at 8:37 pm
169. The teaching of Maori.

     Ok – thanx.

     

     Carpe Jugulum

     14 Nov 12 at 8:38 pm
170. M0nty – this you?

     

     Sinclair Davidson

     14 Nov 12 at 8:38 pm
171. Note that even the touchy feely NZ Education Department don’t allow the teaching of all subjects in Maori.

     Unlike the NT Education Department in regards to Aboriginal languages.

     

     DaveF

     14 Nov 12 at 8:45 pm
172. Can I answer for him sinc. Yep, it’s him. Get rid of the acidic fuck.

     Here’s the reality on Catallaxy over the US elections/ predictions.

     Out of regular writers.

     Sinc always kept an eye on the betting and continually suggested Obama was looking ok

     Steve K Steve believed Romney would win

     Samuel J thought Obama was going to win

     Judith Sloan No mention of US election.

     Alan Moron No mention of US election.

     So actually it appears there were

     1. Two Obama predictions

     2. one Romney prediction

     3. Two no interest

     So fat boy accusing da Catalllaxy of having it wrong is dishonest.

     Boot him Sinc. Give him the size 10.

     

     JC

     14 Nov 12 at 8:48 pm
173. Perhaps he’s just avoiding the question, JC. He’s currently sucking up to Sinclair.

     

     Gab

     14 Nov 12 at 9:02 pm
174. Yea I see that Gab. It’s pathetic and disgusting at the same time.

     

     JC

     14 Nov 12 at 9:03 pm
175. M0nty – this you?
     

     what an arsehole. Sits on our couch with his feet on the coffee table and then complains to the neighbours about our decor.

     

     Infidel Tiger

     14 Nov 12 at 9:06 pm
176. The post at Quiggan appears to be about comments after the election, rather than predictions before. And some of the comments under topics such as “Obama Re-elected” and “How did he do it?” certainly had the appearence that the commentor had become somewhat unhinged by the “unexpected” result.

     

     SteveC

     14 Nov 12 at 9:06 pm
177. You know who’s unhinged? The person that made this comment:

     Why don’t you just reprint every one of Steyn’s pieces on the Cat, and cut out the middle man.

     m0nty

     25 Oct 12 at 9:58 am

     Steve Kates quoted Steyn twice in the last six months.

     

     Gab

     14 Nov 12 at 9:29 pm
178. This is mOnty

     

     Tiny Dancer

     14 Nov 12 at 9:30 pm
179. This is what the racist little prick puts on twitter:

     Paul Montgomery
     @m0nty
     Bought takeaway bento. Stabbed myself in the cheek with a splinter from the chopsticks. F this S, in western civilisation we use forks.

     

     Token

     14 Nov 12 at 9:47 pm
180. Oh dear.

     In a thread about “denying reality” heavy hitting realist m0nty the ALP shill is in good company with supreme nutter Fran Barlow.

     Now do tell us m0nty which is the real m0nty? The straight talking m0nty here or the pretentious “intellectual” anthropologist m0nty there where you use masturbatory phrases like “some sort of strange attractor, or singularity of non-spatial existence”?

     Oh m0nty.

     

     twostix

     14 Nov 12 at 9:52 pm
181. Bought takeaway bento. Stabbed myself in the cheek with a splinter from the chopsticks. F this S, in western civilisation we use forks.

     Non philistines use wooden chopsticks or mother of peral cutlery not to spoil the taste of sashimi and ikura which metal cutlery would.

     

     .

     14 Nov 12 at 10:08 pm
182. Re Slushgate – someone obviously wants to do Gillard slowly.

     

     Viva

     14 Nov 12 at 10:13 pm
183. This is what the racist little prick puts on twitter

     So he jabs himself in the cheek, and he blames his self-inflicted injury on the Japanese. That is just appalling.

     

     Dangph

     14 Nov 12 at 10:13 pm
184. The Frogman’s Prophecies.

     Have you ever heard about the French Libertarian Party?

     Me neither. True, there’s a couple of pretenders to the title, but they are merely social clubs, where every now and then attendants get a tingling in the pants by quoting good old Ludwig Von Mises and Claude Frédéric Bastiat between connoisseurs. Their true distinctive feature when compared to the other French is that they won’t even bother entertaining any delusion of grandeur or relevance—they know they have no place in the French political process, and no chance to ever gain one.

     So hear this, Friends of Gary the Third Party and other Principled Abstentionists: by choosing ideological purity over strategic thinking, you’ve effectively hedged your own political future in the one competing force that is most capable of propelling you into irrelevance and oblivion—as we say in France: Bravo!

     Just as in France, once a majority of the US population—no matter how slim—has tasted the poisonous fruits of the State, they will demand the keys to the cornucopia and regard with disdain, scorn or hostility any soul brave or foolish enough to call it unsustainable and propose to lock the larder. The fact that you are right will not matter at all. Just as they do in France, the people will ask for more and tout de suite, never realizing or willing to acknowledge that they are effectively cannibalizing themselves and their offspring—as we’ve been saying in France for quite a while: Après moi le Déluge!

     Thank in no small part to you, Obama now has more time to multiply the locusts, thus depleting your future ranks. You shall keep fancying yourselves as The Smart Ones, when compared to those Neanderthaloid Conservatives and Liberal Zombies, until one of you wonders aloud why the lights went off in the Libertarian cave, and hears only the echo in answer.

     Understand this: I am not a US citizen nor a resident in the USA, so this is not the bitter retort of a sore loser. This is a prophecy from a foreigner who has seen your future because he lives in it: you, my friend, who didn’t oppose Obama today will be politically extinct tomorrow.

     

     CC

     14 Nov 12 at 10:15 pm
185. Non philistines use wooden chopsticks or mother of peral cutlery not to spoil the taste of sashimi and ikura which metal cutlery would.

     Hai. So desu.

     Japan Airlines provide wooden chopsticks with their excellent food in Executive Class and Premium Economy as well as in their Sakura Lounges.

     

     Septimus

     14 Nov 12 at 10:15 pm
186. Sinc

     You comment on Monty over ayt Quigs?

     Anyone that can put up with Fran as the majority poster lost my respec as a blog host long ago… and I think you know who I mean….

     

     Alice

     14 Nov 12 at 10:17 pm
187. Have you ever heard about the French Libertarian Party?

     Ever heard of the American multi-party system?

     

     .

     14 Nov 12 at 10:17 pm
188. Hey, remember Kwiggin predicting that Kevin Rudd would lead Labor into an era wherein the Liberals would cease to exist and never be elected again?

     Then, following Abbott’s historical triumph in 2010, Kwiggin quit blogging.

     

     C.L.

     14 Nov 12 at 10:19 pm
189. Blogstrop

     says
     ” Police have to deal with all the crap thrown at them by criminals, drunks, drug adicts, “peaceful” islamic protesters, and assorted lunatics.”

     And modern day police are too skinny and some too skinny and female to be up to the job.

     Im not afraid to say it. Instead they are armed and bloody dangerous – far more dangerous than a guy up to ears in whatever drugs he took AND JUST ONE OF HIM?

     are you kidding me. Sure it takes a team of more than a couple to subdue them but you dont have to kill them in the process.

     Instead we get weaklings who shoot until they kill an UNARMED man unhinged on drugs or 16 lying on top oh him till he suffocates???.

     Who’s fault is this? really lousy police recruitment policies and no fitness training?

     

     Alice

     14 Nov 12 at 10:22 pm
190. M0nty – this you?

     Sure is!

     what an arsehole. Sits on our couch with his feet on the coffee table and then complains to the neighbours about our decor.

     That’s quite a weird analogy if you think about it, IT. We are not sitting in Sinc’s living room. For which Sinc must be grateful.

     Non philistines use wooden chopsticks or mother of peral cutlery not to spoil the taste of sashimi and ikura which metal cutlery would.

     That’s all very well, but what’s with delivering chopsticks in twos stuck together so you have to rip them apart, like they’re those old icy poles with the dual sticks and the one icy bit. That’s where the bloody splinters came from, useless things!

     Now do tell us m0nty which is the real m0nty? The straight talking m0nty here or the pretentious “intellectual” anthropologist m0nty there where you use masturbatory phrases like “some sort of strange attractor, or singularity of non-spatial existence”?

     Of course it’s both, 26. I just used different language for different audiences. It’s something you learn as a journalist.

     

     m0nty

     14 Nov 12 at 10:22 pm
191. Alice – no I didn’t. My view is similat to ITs above. I have a lot of tolerance for people coming here and pulling our chain – too much according to most Cats – but to then enjoy our hospitality and then slag us is a bit rude.

     

     Sinclair Davidson

     14 Nov 12 at 10:23 pm
192. M0nty – journalist we can handle. Even fantasy sports web owner thing. But you sound like a sociologist who’d fit in at the old LP. (Remember them LoL)

     

     Sinclair Davidson

     14 Nov 12 at 10:27 pm
193. My God.

     I tend to avoid virtual sewers so I have not been at Quiggan’s for a long while.

     I did not realise that the ‘floaters’ from the LP sewer had found a new home there in toto.

     There’s a thread where they are earnestly discussing just how North Korea might be regarded as a ‘pure’ capitalist state!

     These people are unhinged.

     

     Mk50 of Brisbane

     14 Nov 12 at 10:27 pm
194. Mk50 – get with the program. Reality is over, they won. Or something.

     

     Sinclair Davidson

     14 Nov 12 at 10:28 pm
195. I have a lot of tolerance for people coming here and pulling our chain – too much according to most Cats – but to then enjoy our hospitality and then slag us is a bit rude.

     Considering the rudeness that is posted in my direction after every single post I make on this site, I have no sympathy for that view.

     Nevertheless, I don’t intend on making this a regular thing. The derangement syndrome that overtook this site post-election did merit some comment, as I found it extraordinary even by the Cat’s standards. Then again, I was never here during Peak Bird.

     

     m0nty

     14 Nov 12 at 10:29 pm
196. M0nty – you’re breaking me up. Any rudeness you experience is always tempered with love and affection.

     

     Sinclair Davidson

     14 Nov 12 at 10:33 pm
197. Sinc
     You seem to be in a wicked and mischievous mood.

     Have you finalised all your grades?

     

     kae

     14 Nov 12 at 10:35 pm
198. Kae – no teaching this semester. I doubled up last semester to get my annual teaching load done so I could go away for most of second semester.

     

     Sinclair Davidson

     14 Nov 12 at 10:37 pm
199. Steve Kates quoted Steyn twice in the last six months.

     Kates quoted Steyn in four posts in a week in late October, Gab.

     

     m0nty

     14 Nov 12 at 10:38 pm
200. I want to know more about the strange attractor and the singularity of non-spatial existence. What were they exactly? They sure do sound impressive.

     

     Dangph

     14 Nov 12 at 10:39 pm
201. M0nty – you’re breaking me up. Any rudeness you experience is always tempered with love and affection.

     Uh huh.

     

     m0nty

     14 Nov 12 at 10:40 pm
202. Japan Airlines provide wooden chopsticks with their excellent food in Executive Class and Premium Economy as well as in their Sakura Lounges.

     Ah, konbanwa septimu sama, nice to have you onboard.

     Welcome, asobi ni ikuyo.

     

     Carpe Jugulum

     14 Nov 12 at 10:41 pm
203. Oh, that explains it!

     We’re gathering results.

     Erk.

     

     kae

     14 Nov 12 at 10:41 pm
204. Kates quoted Steyn in four posts in a week in late October, Gab.

     Steve quoted Steyn twice in the last six months. He mentioned Steyn six times in the last seven months.

     You’re unhinged, monty, and a very nasty grub. A “journalist”, LOL.

     

     Gab

     14 Nov 12 at 10:42 pm
205. I want to know more about the strange attractor and the singularity of non-spatial existence. What were they exactly? They sure do sound impressive.

     I read too many science fiction novels, Dangph.

     

     m0nty

     14 Nov 12 at 10:42 pm
206. Steve quoted Steyn twice in the last six months. He mentioned Steyn six times in the last seven months.

     Erm… look back in the archives between October 24 and 27, four articles quoting Steyn. That was less than a month ago, Gab.

     

     m0nty

     14 Nov 12 at 10:44 pm
207. What’s wrong with Steyn?

     

     Sinclair Davidson

     14 Nov 12 at 10:45 pm
208. So? Still mounts to six mentions in seven months. Why are you ao paranoid?

     

     Gab

     14 Nov 12 at 10:46 pm
209. I read too many science fiction novels, Dangph.

     Oh, okay. They were just sciency sounding things to impress your lefty mates in the reality-based community.

     

     Dangph

     14 Nov 12 at 10:47 pm
210. What’s wrong with Steyn?

     Steyn is a bad man!

     

     Dangph

     14 Nov 12 at 10:48 pm
211. Steve quoted Steyn twice in the last six months.

     So? Still mounts to six mentions in seven months

     Gab, you are not making sense. October 24-27 is in the last six months.

     It is okay to say you got some minor thing wrong, you know. Your whole edifice of reality is not going to come crashing down around your shoulders.

     

     m0nty

     14 Nov 12 at 10:49 pm
212. Oh, okay. They were just sciency sounding things to impress your lefty mates in the reality-based community.

     By George, I think he’s got it.

     

     m0nty

     14 Nov 12 at 10:49 pm
213. Anyone get the feeling that Monty wants to stay here and not be stuck with deadshits..

     

     max49

     14 Nov 12 at 10:52 pm
214. Stop twisting facts, monty.

     You made (yet another) snarky and stupid comment on Steve’s post

     Why don’t you just reprint every one of Steyn’s pieces on the Cat, and cut out the middle man.

     m0nty

     25 Oct 12 at 9:58 am

     So I went and had a look at how many times Steve mentioned/quoted Steyn. Six times in seven months and you get your panties in a twist becuase he mentioned Steyn four times!! My God, FOUR TIMES!! in a week. You really are unhinged.

     

     Gab

     14 Nov 12 at 10:53 pm
215. m0nt, not to interrupt the toing and froings, but my curiosity was piqued by your comment: “anything is possible from the neocons.”

     What differences do you have with neocons? As far as I am aware you and neocons share the same social policies, i.e. socially permissive under the premise of rampant individualism, and neither the left nor the neocons can in any way be referred to as nationalist (unless it’s Israel’s nationalism, but that’s another subject).

     With regard immigration, you propose massive amounts of it with no particular selection process, whilst the neocons also promote massive amounts of it, for the benefit of the economy (which is a thing that floats free and unchained from a national people).

     The only difference I see is that you would be pro increased welfare for all and restrictions on civil liberties, whereas neocons are free-trade absolutists opposed to corporate taxation.

     But, I’m interested on your take, as you have me puzzled.

     Btw, I thought Catallaxy was a libertarian blog, with a strain of neocon in the comments section.

     

     Pat Hannagan

     14 Nov 12 at 10:54 pm
216. Steyn is a bad man!

     Dangph – didn’t you get the memo, Steyn is the anti-christ, the devil incarnate.

     How dare he expose the hypocracy of the left.

     Delta House would have delt with him in short order.

     Probably a stupid and futile gesture done on someone elses part, would have sufficed.

     

     Carpe Jugulum

     14 Nov 12 at 10:54 pm
217. Now do tell us m0nty which is the real m0nty? The straight talking m0nty here or the pretentious “intellectual” anthropologist m0nty there where you use masturbatory phrases like “some sort of strange attractor, or singularity of non-spatial existence”?

     hahahahahahaha

     And he was talking to Homer too. I noticed how they seemed to get on like a house on fire.

     

     JC

     14 Nov 12 at 10:55 pm
218. The derangement syndrome that overtook this site post-election did merit some comment, as I found it extraordinary even by the Cat’s standards.

     It was a measured response to the sanctimonious triumphalism of the middle class, hypocritical lefty trolls here.

     

     Lazlo

     14 Nov 12 at 10:56 pm
219. Anyone get the feeling that Monty wants to stay here and not be stuck with deadshits..

     Quite frankly I don’t know why he even comes here as all he does is complain, complain, complain about this place. And then he goes elsewhere and complains about this place. But then I don’t think anyone paid attention to monty over at Quiggan. So here’s back here, sucking up to Sinclair after trashing the place. Grub.

     

     Gab

     14 Nov 12 at 10:57 pm
220. So I went and had a look at how many times Steve mentioned/quoted Steyn. Six times in seven months and you get your panties in a twist becuase he mentioned Steyn four times!! My God, FOUR TIMES!! in a week. You really are unhinged.

     What else would be expected from a 40 year old virgin.

     

     JC

     14 Nov 12 at 10:57 pm
221. Sinc:
     

     Mk50 – get with the program. Reality is over, they won. Or something.

     Erm… no? Won’t. (Get with their program that is – I don’t want the double lobotomy that would require.)

     I agree though that in their eyes they have conquered reality in their own eyes by substituting narcissistic fabulism and insisting that it is ‘real’.

     This is an insistence on the actuality of the irreal.

     That’s a functional descriptor for insanity.

     

     Mk50 of Brisbane

     14 Nov 12 at 10:58 pm
222. I do not know if anyone has commented on the Latham attack on Bolt but it seems to me that the latham is back in the fold….

     Given his prior misogynistic, as redefined, comments about the current PM of Australia he’s now gone arse about.

     One of the greatest lessons I took away from the USA election washup was a comment made by a Democrat functionary that they targeted Romney a long way back.

     The LNP have got to start advertising NOW…

     All the way through the summer of cricket….

     In between commercial TV news ad breaks.

     Completely ignore print and internet. just teevee.

     And surely the alp leadership presents some of the best advertising the LNP could ever want.

     If the LNP do not then they believe Australia is the f*wit country.

     

     NoFixedAddress

     14 Nov 12 at 10:58 pm
223. Stop twisting facts, monty.

     You made a claim about the facts, I checked it, I stated the fact, you ran away from it screaming.

     I’m not sure why you won’t admit to a single thing you get wrong on this blog, Gab. You do get a few things wrong. I do too, like in that conversation with CC in the last OT, where I realised my mistake, apologised and withdrew.

     As Abbott says, sh*t happens. Don’t hide from it.

     

     m0nty

     14 Nov 12 at 11:00 pm
224. Work to do. Got some Madeira, Avantasia’s ‘The Scarecrow’ album on. Now to sort out the cock-up I have made of this thesis chapter…

     And so, good night.

     

     Mk50 of Brisbane

     14 Nov 12 at 11:01 pm
225. Pat Hannigan – do not try to use reason or logic with monty, you had best study the specis first.

     He is a relation of shane wand anitidae shriecus and without that insight i feel you may be too kind to him.

     Happy tpo help – cheers.

     

     Carpe Jugulum

     14 Nov 12 at 11:02 pm
226. Fat Boy

     I hope for your sake David J is away at the moment and doesn’t read the pretentious intellectual prose you posted over there.

     You know he’d be ruthless with you, yea?

     

     JC

     14 Nov 12 at 11:02 pm
227. Latham totally lost it on Sky on Monday night. Then he harasses Bolt both by phone, screaming at him, and then starts emailing him. All over gillard of all things.

     And at other times Latham seems quite reasonable and measured in his speech and tone. And then he goes off the boiler.

     I guess Latham and monty have that in common, that and they both need lithium medication STAT!

     

     Gab

     14 Nov 12 at 11:03 pm
228. you ran away from it screaming

     lol you’re such a liar.

     

     Gab

     14 Nov 12 at 11:07 pm
229. What differences do you have with neocons?

     I am an institutionalist. I believe society is only as strong as the institutions which define it, and keeping those strong and healthy goes a long way towards ensuring general society gets on. To the extent that you want to label me a lefty as a consequence, be my guest.

     Neocons are, by the definition I understand, anti-institutionalists. They share a lot of conservative values with traditional conservatives, but one on which they differ is that neocons want to dismantle large parts of the web of social institutions that go to make up social democracies. In the Australian context, neocons want to tear down a lot of the building blocks of society which Menzies laid in place.

     When people like JC set out the long list of government departments they would cut entirely, to raucous applause from the peanut gallery, that’s the sort of thing that defines this site as a haven of neocons, in addition to the libertarian elements.

     

     m0nty

     14 Nov 12 at 11:10 pm
230. “I read too many science fiction novels, Dangph.”

     What was the last one you read?

     

     Jarrah

     14 Nov 12 at 11:11 pm
231. @Gab 11.03

     I thought Latham had come in from the cold, so to speak, and admired some of his commentary.

     But this diatribe towards Bolt is straight back to the bovver boy of old.

     Some of his past comments about Julia Gillard were, revised dictionary, definite misogynistic.

     So he is either right back in the fold, or he is melting down with the publicity of potential corruption being exposed in NSW.

     

     NoFixedAddress

     14 Nov 12 at 11:14 pm
232. I wouldn’t like to hazard a guess as to Latham’s motivations and what ails him, NFA. He’s certainly a loose cannon.

     

     Gab

     14 Nov 12 at 11:16 pm
233. What was the last one you read?

     Iron Council by China Mieville. Also been reading Gibson, Egan and Hamilton.

     

     m0nty

     14 Nov 12 at 11:17 pm
234. Thanks for your reply m0nt. I wasn’t aware you had this position and thought you were a Labor man.

     I believe society is only as strong as the institutions which define it, and keeping those strong and healthy goes a long way towards ensuring general society gets on.

     Very good, and I agree. But how do you see the impact of immigration, both legal and illegal, on the continuance of our traditional institutions?

     With regard “They share a lot of conservative values with traditional conservatives” I don’t see that at all. Neocons are, as I say, socially in step with the left, it is only with regard economy that they differ (as well as some foreign policy objectives).

     For example, the left want to reduce all national institutions so as to supplant nations with a new layer of international government.

     Neocons however, seek to dismantle any impediment to free-trade, and of course any form of nationalism is that very thing.

     

     Pat Hannagan

     14 Nov 12 at 11:18 pm
235. I’m busy reading Great North Road.

     

     Sinclair Davidson

     14 Nov 12 at 11:19 pm
236. Mieville’s style just doesn’t grab me. Greg Egan? An incredible ideas man. I have everything he’s ever written.

     

     Jarrah

     14 Nov 12 at 11:20 pm
237. In short, national disintegration is just a by product of the neocon’s quest for wealth via free-trade.

     For the left, national disintegration is a prerequisite in their longer term political agenda.

     The motives differ, but the result is the same.

     

     Pat Hannagan

     14 Nov 12 at 11:21 pm
238. I am an institutionalist. I believe society is only as strong as the institutions which define it, and keeping those strong and healthy goes a long way towards ensuring general society gets on. To the extent that you want to label me a lefty as a consequence, be my guest.

     Lol… yea I can see that Fat boy. You’re such and enthusiastic “institutionalist” that you’re in total denial that the individual currently occupying the PM’s office increasingly appears to be a crook. One of the most respected institutions was the Federal Treasury under this government has basically become a toilet bowl.

     You fat blowhard, Fat boy.

     When people like JC set out the long list of government departments they would cut entirely, to raucous applause from the peanut gallery, that’s the sort of thing that defines this site as a haven of neocons, in addition to the libertarian elements.

     I should hope people here would applaud such ideas.

     

     JC

     14 Nov 12 at 11:21 pm
239. Greg Egan is tops. Him and Rudy Rucker are the only modern SF I’ve read.

     

     Dangph

     14 Nov 12 at 11:23 pm
240. that’s the sort of thing that defines this site as a haven of neocons, in addition to the libertarian elements.

     Fool, that is a feature, not a bug.

     Free discussion is what lets us be free politicaly.

     

     Carpe Jugulum

     14 Nov 12 at 11:31 pm
241. Thanks for your reply m0nt. I wasn’t aware you had this position and thought you were a Labor man.

     LOL, I am. These days Labor is the party of institutions.

     But how do you see the impact of immigration, both legal and illegal, on the continuance of our traditional institutions?

     Illegal immigration is a drop in the bucket, really. Australia has always been about immigration, I don’t see that as a long term problem. The issue for me is where they lob. Giving them a bus ticket to Rooty Hill isn’t good enough any more. Crazy Bob Katter has a point when he says the regions are crying out for people. But there aren’t any jobs there, and you risk turning the RARAs into distributed versions of Tasmania, relying too much on government investment. It’s getting very expensive for immigrants to live here, let alone buy a house.

     These are all intransigent problems which require detailed solutions. There are good ideas, like the one I heard in the US context the other day where foreign students are given an extended visa (whatever our equivalent of green card is) when they pass a degree. Overall, I think we can handle immigration just fine, we’re used to it… within reason.

     Neocons are, as I say, socially in step with the left, it is only with regard economy that they differ (as well as some foreign policy objectives).

     I wouldn’t agree with that at all. The Republican Party is made up of neocons and paleocons, neither of which is particularly leftist.

     For example, the left want to reduce all national institutions so as to supplant nations with a new layer of international government.

     Only conspiracy theorists seriously believe that tosh, Pat.

     

     m0nty

     14 Nov 12 at 11:32 pm
242. wouldn’t like to hazard a guess as to Latham’s motivations

     Being another notch in the bedpost for someone with a penchant for married men would be my hazarded guess..

     

     Lazlo

     14 Nov 12 at 11:35 pm
243. @JC 11.21

     One of the most respected institutions was the Federal Treasury under this government has basically become a toilet bowl.

     It’s where we are going that’s for sure.

     But…why is ATO not in the focus.

     Some of the most irresponsible sh*t that is dragging Australia down has come out of that place.

     They are the true virus of the, so called, ‘public service’.

     And that includes state and local government taxing agencies.

     I actually think all taxation should go back to the states.

     That way the greenslime can have The Devils Island to itself.

     Western Australia would boom even further.

     Victoria could sit around a campfire while the real workers got up and left.

     NSW should and could split into 3 States.

     Same with Qld.

     

     NoFixedAddress

     14 Nov 12 at 11:43 pm
244. m0nt, thanks once again for your reply, and whilst I find your concern for immigrants endearing and very compassionate, I fail to see how you can maintain these institutions you profess to love, whilst the people who created those very institutions are being replaced at an extraordinary rate.

     Do you believe that our institutions would remain intact at the current rate of immigration, both legal and illegal?

     It seems extraordinary to me that a diversity of people, from varying cultures, ethnicity and religions would all coalesce to maintain the institutions of this former nation. How do you see it working?

     I note you supply the usual leftist trope “Australia has always been about immigration”, without delving into what form that immigration took. You mean that for over 200 years of federation, all immigration was of the same cloth, seeing no variance in its type?

     Furthermore, if one considers the first 50 years of settlement, that immigration you speak of took a particularly enforced sort of form. So, it’s really one of those nothing throw away lines that prevent a depth of discussion.

     The Republican Party is made up of neocons and paleocons, neither of which is particularly leftist.

     There are no MSM paleocons within the GOP. The neocons were formerly Democrats who ran the paleocons out of the party. Pat Buchanan was the last MSM paleo in the party.

     Only conspiracy theorists seriously believe that tosh, Pat.

     Bob Brown is on record stating that as his goal.

     

     Pat Hannagan

     14 Nov 12 at 11:43 pm
245. The Greens’ hero [Bob Brown] was met with a standing ovation when he delivered the 2012 Green Oration, which called for a single global and democratic parliament.

     “Let us create a global democracy and parliament under the grand idea of one planet, one person, one vote, one value,” he said.

     (Source: http://www.themercury.com.au/article/2012/03/24/312341_tasmania-news.html)

     According to you, Bob Brown is a conspiracy theorist.

     

     Pat Hannagan

     14 Nov 12 at 11:48 pm
246. And don’t forget, your Labor party is in coalition with the Greens.

     So much for national institutions.

     

     Pat Hannagan

     14 Nov 12 at 11:51 pm
247. Do you believe that our institutions would remain intact at the current rate of immigration, both legal and illegal?

     Yes, I do. Pat, I detect in your comments a distinct tone of dog whistling. Are you insinuating that the immigration mix these days is from areas of the world you like less than those in previous decades? What would lead you to believe that Sudanese and Afghani immigrants would destroy our institutions where Vietnamese and Croatian did not in days of yore? Is there a particular kind of immigrant you want to exclude? Where are they from? What colour skin do they have? Explain yourself, Pat.

     According to you, Bob Brown is a conspiracy theorist.

     Bob Brown is welcome to his dream, but it has as much chance of being implemented as JC’s hit list of government departments. The Greens will always be a minor party in Australia.

     

     m0nty

     14 Nov 12 at 11:58 pm
248. When people like JC set out the long list of government departments they would cut entirely, to raucous applause from the peanut gallery, that’s the sort of thing that defines this site as a haven of neocons, in addition to the libertarian elements.

     Neocon

     And then Obama came along.

     Drone hitlist strikes;
     Unauthorised war;
     Maintain Gitmo;
     Support of is-lam terror proponents;

     neo = new
     con = trick

     American Democrats own the title of neo-con

     

     NoFixedAddress

     15 Nov 12 at 12:05 am
249. The Greens will always be a minor party in Australia.

     Tell that to the working class in Tasmania.

     You couldn’t give a shit about them. You are a hypocritical, posturing, middle class, leftist arsehole.

     

     Lazlo

     15 Nov 12 at 12:07 am
250. Now wait a minute, m0nt, you called me a conspiracy theorist for stating what is on record as a declared goal of the left. I am not a conspiracy theorist, Bob Brown and the Greens (and their Labor party coalition) *are* the conspiracy.

     As for “The Greens will always be a minor party in Australia.”, well, that minor party dictated taxation policy to your Labor party, which Gillard implemented. Oh to be a minor party like that.

     I detect in your comments a distinct tone of dog whistling Why do you detect that? Or is this just another handy Labor trope to throw out, like sand in the eyes?

     You said I am an institutionalist. I believe society is only as strong as the institutions which define it, and keeping those strong and healthy goes a long way towards ensuring general society gets on.

     I am questioning how you can maintain those institutions, whilst the society that created them is being rapidly transformed.

     It’s a fair and reasonable question. So much so, I ask it again: How does an “institutionalist” maintain institutions whilst transforming the society that created those institutions.

     Please don’t answer with a question, just state how you think it will work.

     For example, you could say, “All people are equal, and we should expect equal outcomes. If we were to trade the entire population of Australia with an equal amount from China, then the Chinese would maintain the Australian institutions, and the Australians would maintain the Chinese institutions.”

     

     Pat Hannagan

     15 Nov 12 at 12:09 am
251. @Lazlo 12.07

     I actually do give a shit about the “working class” of Tasmania.

     Bob Brown and The Greens have destroyed the “working class” of Tasmania.

     And they are trying to infect the rest of Australia.

     

     NoFixedAddress

     15 Nov 12 at 12:13 am
252. As for “The Greens will always be a minor party in Australia.”, well, that minor party dictated taxation policy to your Labor party, which Gillard implemented. Oh to be a minor party like that.

     If you think they can implement a world government with 10% of the vote in Australia, I’d like to hear how.

     I am questioning how you can maintain those institutions, whilst the society that created them is being rapidly transformed.

     What do you think it is transforming into, or being transformed by? That’s the thing missing from your question. Institutions are supposed to be resilient to general change, they merely stick to the principles on which they were founded. You’ll have to identify the specific threat before I can respond.

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 12:14 am
253. @mOnty 11.58

     I’ll buy in.

     Show me one good economic thing that PM Rudd or PM Gillard has done for Australia.

     

     NoFixedAddress

     15 Nov 12 at 12:18 am
254. I actually do give a shit about the “working class” of Tasmania.

     The comment wasn’t directed to you NFA.

     I agree with you 100%.

     It is green/left slime like monty who are promoting this outcome.. I despise them.

     

     Lazlo

     15 Nov 12 at 12:20 am
255. It’s not a poker game, NFA.

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 12:21 am
256. m0nt, I appreciate your ongoing diligence with the subject, but I don’t think you are dealing with it honestly.

     You identified the threat in your opening statement, which I produce again:

     I am an institutionalist. I believe society is only as strong as the institutions which define it, and keeping those strong and healthy goes a long way towards ensuring general society gets on.

     Key word = society

     I believe society is only as strong as the institutions which define it…

     Did the institutions define the society or did the society define the institutions?

     It’s not a chicken and egg question, for the answer is obvious: society creates the institutions.

     An “institutionalist” would preserve the society by maintaining their institutions. That is the definition of what it is to be a conservative.

     For a conservative, there is an unbreakable connection between society and their institutions. Change the society and you change their former institutions.

     So, now, once again, please tell me how you will maintain our institutions whilst rapidly replacing the society from which the institutions came?

     

     Pat Hannagan

     15 Nov 12 at 12:23 am
257. From the Australian’s intro to its latest episode in smearing and its backtracking:

     THE AWU official who first brought allegations that union money had been spent on renovations to Julia Gillard’s house to the attention of corruption fighter Ian Cambridge has now cast doubt on his recollections.

     

     Scapula

     15 Nov 12 at 12:26 am
258. Stop lying, Scrappy.

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 12:27 am
259. You asked me once to provide a reference, but I realized even then that this was just a way to avoid engaging the argument and you’ve proved that again even when provided with quotation and reference.

     

     Scapula

     15 Nov 12 at 12:32 am
260. That is not how I see it, Pat.

     Institutions can adapt to changes in society without losing sight of their mission. Take the Church, for example. Does its strength in South America and Africa these days mean it has abandoned its core meaning? Of course not. Does the fact that we integrate newer cultures into our schools mean the fabric of society has been rent asunder? Only a paleocon would babble so.

     Institutions are not a mechanism to reinforce stasis. They help us cope with change, and provide us with ways to embrace it.

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 12:33 am
261. Yes, I do. Pat, I detect in your comments a distinct tone of dog whistling.

     The only one who hears the dog whistle is the dog, mUnty.

     It’s no-one’s problem but yours that you are a racist.

     Get help.

     

     sdog

     15 Nov 12 at 12:34 am
262. You asked me once to provide a reference, but I realized even then that this was just a way to avoid engaging the argument and you’ve proved that again even when provided with quotation and reference.

     Nope. I already read the story.

     It’s not rocket science to copy and paste the link to the source, you know. And it is customary to cite the source.

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 12:35 am
263. It’s no-one’s problem but yours that you are a racist.

     He is.

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 12:36 am
264. @m0nty 12.21

     It’s not a poker game, NFA.

     But it is mZero.

     Our current PM has played that many ‘poker’ games and aided and abetted so many ‘poker’ games that it comes to a ‘point’ that you have to wonder what happens when the ‘chips’ are down.

     Just Brown Bag it I suppose.

     

     NoFixedAddress

     15 Nov 12 at 12:37 am
265. Ease up on him, NFA lest he runs screaming in fear. Look, you asked a perfectly reasonable question. You get no sensible reply becuase he can’t provide one and we all know why.

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 12:40 am
266. and mZero

     answer my f*king question….

     just in case you were playing ‘poker’ here it is again,

     Show me one good economic thing that PM Rudd or PM Gillard has done for Australia.

     

     NoFixedAddress

     15 Nov 12 at 12:41 am
267. ‘Its an old inaccurate history’ that union money paid for Gillard’s renovations, says someone the Australian does not dignify with the word whistleblower:

     The Australian has also obtained the brief handwritten note that Mr Cambridge made during the conversation with Mr Gries, just prior to a more detailed Dictaphone entry. Mr Gries, now retired in Melbourne, has denied telling Mr Cambridge union funds were used to pay for renovations at Ms Gillard’s house. “If that conversation had occurred, I would have remembered,” he said at his home in Altona North. “Ian was a reasonably honest person, he would have had no ulterior motives. I can’t see the point in Ian thinking that or saying that if it wasn’t factual. I can’t believe I’ve forgotten, if I knew, that there were renovations going on at Gillard’s place. If I did know (about union money being used for Ms Gillard’s renovations), I would have told Wilson and I probably would have taken steps at the highest level because I disliked the Greek intensely because he did a lot of damage to the union.

     “It’s inconceivable that I could forget that. Maybe I’m wrong – I mean, no one is infallible.”

     Mr Gries asked if part of the diary could be left with him to review. He sent an email two days later stating he did not want to be quoted on anything, adding that the diary note related to him informing Mr Cambridge was “old inaccurate history”.

     

     Scapula

     15 Nov 12 at 12:41 am
268. Well Bob

     That’s pretty easy to find out what happened and if there was cash that went into the slappers bank account.

     Lets have a looksee, hey.

     waddaureckon Bobsey? Shall we take a look?

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 12:44 am
269. @Gab 12.40

     Sorry Gab.

     ‘point’ taken, so to speak.

     

     NoFixedAddress

     15 Nov 12 at 12:44 am
270. Stop clogging up the thread with your stupid quotes. Are you going to copy and paste the link or just keep quote doctoring, Scrappy, you serial pest.

     Here, you dimwit:

     http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/investigations/union-official-who-first-raised-julia-gillard-renovation-claims-now-doubts-his-own-story/story-fng5kxvh-1226516991591

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 12:45 am
271. “Institutions are not a mechanism to reinforce stasis. They help us cope with change, and provide us with ways to embrace it.”

     Perhaps not statis, but institutions certainly perform an inertial role.

     “how you will maintain our institutions whilst rapidly replacing the society from which the institutions came?”

     This overstates the threat of immigration. Your comment about the various forms over the centuries is an important point, but I don’t see much evidence that our institutions are particularly under threat by the current rate and composition of immigrants.

     

     Jarrah

     15 Nov 12 at 12:45 am
272. Institutions can adapt to changes in society without losing sight of their mission.

     With all due respect m0nty, you have that arse about. It is an example of where the left and the neocons follow similar paths of logic.

     To explain the matter in another context, Lee Harris notes, “Intellectuals tend to forget that ethical ideals do not pop up out of the human head but first manifest themselves in practice.”

     Harris’ example is that of the modern notion that Adam Smith “invented” capitalism, whereas, what happened, was that when Smith discussed the manufacture of pins in The Wealth of Nations, “he is delineating the essential component of an actual process that had evolved as a way of making more pins in the same amount of time.”

     So, just as Smith did not invent capitalism, but rather he noticed it about him and wrote about it, institutions were not invented, or provided by revelation, but are the formal instituting of the already existing practices, of a particular type of people.

     Thus, culture extends from ethnicity. Institutions are the formal expression of a people’s practices, their culture.

     Have you not noticed the variety of cultures that extend from the variety of ethnic communities (nations) throughout the world?

     Of course you have, but you are asserting your own ethnocentric world view, that of liberalism, on people who do not, and will not, share it, expecting that those people will maintain the institutions that your ancestors created.

     

     Pat Hannagan

     15 Nov 12 at 12:47 am
273. If there is an allegation made she might need to think about that, but the Australian is clear that it is making no allegation.

     It merely has a fact corroborated by a diary and today it has another diary entry on union funds paying for Gillard’s renovations denied by the man who supposedly made the accusation in the first place.

     

     Scapula

     15 Nov 12 at 12:48 am
274. Go away, Scrappy. Adults and monty are having a discussion. Stop interrupting.

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 12:49 am
275. Drab Gab, your link is to a pay wall so don’t bother in future with delivering nothing. We all know that in advance, anyway.

     

     Scapula

     15 Nov 12 at 12:51 am
276. @Pat Hannagan 12.47

     So, just as Smith did not invent capitalism, but rather he noticed it about him and wrote about it, institutions were not invented, or provided by revelation, but are the formal instituting of the already existing practices, of a particular type of people.

     Perhaps some people can disagree with you by saying it was the ‘people’ whom invented the ipad/iphone.

     

     NoFixedAddress

     15 Nov 12 at 1:01 am
277. Scapula,

     McTernan must have authorised penalty rates for you to be lurking around here at this time of night.

     So, we have (tell us where I have got this wrong):

     The Slapper admitting that she did unauthorised (by the client, the AWU) legal work for her lover, an officer of the AWU, but not by its legal officer’s consent.

     That the Slapper did the legals to set up an incorporated entity (the AWU Workplace Reform Association) on behalf of her lover, without reference to the client of Slater and Gordon, the AWU, but nonetheless using the name of the AWU without their consent.

     The Slapper did not open a file at S&G on any of these activities, contrary to codes of professional conduct.

     The Slapper also conceded in interview prior to her abrupt departure from S&G that she could not be sure that she did not benefit personally from the proceeds of Wilson’s ‘sluh fund’ (her words.)

     Are you disputing any of the above? I am sure you cannot, because the Slapper has not disputed any of it.

     We can next proceed to further allegations for which there is documentary evidence (unlike the childish smears put out about Abbott, on the direction of your boss McTernan)

     

     Lazlo

     15 Nov 12 at 1:01 am
278. but I don’t see much evidence that our institutions are particularly under threat by the current rate and composition of immigrants.

     You have just had the American elections demonstrate to you the power of ethnic voting blocs.

     Obamacare has been foisted on the majority White population, which is an institutional change for the traditional American society.

     I would similarly expect the same changes here with our current historically high rates of immigration (begun under Howard). This year saw for the first time in our history non-White (Chinese) immigration overtake British immigration.

     With these changes in demography, so will our nation change. Demography is destiny.

     

     Pat Hannagan

     15 Nov 12 at 1:02 am
279. “Thus, culture extends from ethnicity.”

     Not necessarily. ‘A particular type of people’ may be defined by religion, by geography, or – if you’re into historical materialism – by their mode of production, all without sharing an ethnicity.

     

     Jarrah

     15 Nov 12 at 1:03 am
280. Do you have any examples Jarrah?

     

     Pat Hannagan

     15 Nov 12 at 1:07 am
281. “You have just had the American elections demonstrate to you the power of ethnic voting blocs.”

     Ethnic voting blocs operating within the institutions of democracy is hardly a threat to same.

     “Obamacare has been foisted on the majority White population, which is an institutional change for the traditional American society.”

     Steady on. Lots of white people voted for Obamacare. And I don’t think ‘institutional change’ is accurate, considering the hodge-podge that is the US healthcare system.

     “With these changes in demography, so will our nation change.”

     Sure, but not very fast. Partly thanks to our institutions and their inherent inertia.

     

     Jarrah

     15 Nov 12 at 1:07 am
282. @Pat Hannagan 1.02am

     I would similarly expect the same changes here with our current historically high rates of immigration (begun under Howard). This year saw for the first time in our history non-White (Chinese) immigration overtake British immigration.

     With these changes in demography, so will our nation change. Demography is destiny.

     I would nudge the demographic shame and blame back to Fraser.

     And let us now lay waste to the White Australia Policy that is still being attributed to the LNP and sheet it home to where it belongs….the ALP.

     

     NoFixedAddress

     15 Nov 12 at 1:14 am
283. “Do you have any examples Jarrah?”

     Religious institutions knit together diverse ethnicities. Institutions at the heart of nation-states operate within geographical boundaries, not ethnic ones. Socio-economic systems engender certain practices (that become institutionalised) regardless of the colour of people’s skin.

     

     Jarrah

     15 Nov 12 at 1:19 am
284. Scapula,

     Perhaps your time on penaly rates approved by McTernan tonight has come to an end. But, for your response, in addition to the the above which is uncontested by The Slapper we now have:

     A Power of Attorney, which was also set up without file note, for her lover to shield her lover from identification with dodgy financial transactions. Said PoA was also signed as being witnessed by The Slapper, as an Officer of the Court, while not actually in the presence of the PoA signatory. No advice was given by the Slapper to the PoA signatory.

     The Slapper was clearly involved in the conveyancing for the purchase of a property in Fitzroy. A cheque from the slush fund was processed by S&G. This could not have happened without The Slapper’s involvement. She also wrote off any fees for the transaction.

     Invoices for renovations on The Slapper’s own property were paid for out of Wilson’s slush fund, to Town Mode.

     The owner of Town Mode, the stupid Fat Greek, blew the whistle when he turned up with an invoice for the renovations at the AWU office. This was the first time the AWU leadership knew about it. This prompted a rigorous pursuit of the truth by Ian Cambridge.

     Subsequently an official of the AWU called Bill Shorten said that Cambridge should be called off, because we could ‘all go down the gurgler’

     Which parts of the above would you dispute, McTernan”s bum boy?

     

     Lazlo

     15 Nov 12 at 1:34 am
285. A Power of Attorney, which was also set up without file note, for her lover to shield her lover from identification with dodgy financial transactions.

     Which was likely not witnessed by Gillard. Then a loan was taken out under that dubious PoA.

     Likely fraud on that.

     

     DaveF

     15 Nov 12 at 1:44 am
286. @DaveF 1.44

     I have no hesitation in describing you as a sexist misogynistic thug.

     Oh. Sorry. I thought you were that Tony Abbott.

     

     NoFixedAddress

     15 Nov 12 at 2:13 am
287. One of the most intriguing aspects of the whole AWU, HSU, CFMEU, NSW Labor Party….and it was a parteee, is why do they have access to workers pay and why isn’t the LNP now running advertising in prime time to highlight the corruption.

     

     NoFixedAddress

     15 Nov 12 at 2:24 am
288. The Irish anti-abortion laws have just tortured then killed another woman.

     

     Scapula

     15 Nov 12 at 2:56 am
289. The well-worn arguments about malfeasance continue as if labor can do no wrong and Libs are bad because they exist at all, but particularly bad if they actually say something, because that demonstrates bad thoughts, or something.
     Really, this place has sunk to a new low with someone complaining about Steyn quotes. As to putting feet onnthe coffee table, there are at least six people here who deserve to be thrown out the door for uninvited and contemtuous behaviour. They exist simply to trail their cloaks, pretend to be interested in an exchange of views but are dedicated to nothing more than being spoilers and pests. Then they wail about us being rude or humourless towards them.
     A bit of banning might improve their manners, thereby allowing some discussion of issues without the distraction of low class trollery.

     

     Blogstrop

     15 Nov 12 at 6:26 am
290. Hmmm. Gaza sent 120+ rockets over the border last week, and has been doing so for a long, long time – but it’s Israel’s rather better targetted counter-attack that the Palidiots call a “declaration of war’.

     

     blogstrop

     15 Nov 12 at 7:17 am
291. MEMO TO “BAN THE TROLLS” WHINGERS:

     You could always start up your OWN blogs, then you could ban WHOMEVER YOU WANT to ban.

     

     interested bystander

     15 Nov 12 at 7:21 am
292. The ALP backbench rabbits are getting jumpy:

     The prospect of Mr (Ralph) Blewitt in a tell-all session with fraud squad detectives will add to growing nervousness among Labor MPs.
     Government figures yesterday said there was “talk” that ALP party elders may have to confront the Prime Minister to ensure the ongoing scandal does not undermine next year’s election campaign.
     “The Libs are clearly saving something up (for the campaign),” one senior Labor figure said.
     Another caucus figure said there was “growing anxiety” among Labor MPs about the union fraud’s impact on voters.
     Labor MPs were “bewildered and scratching their heads” after they observed a steady stream of media articles emerging – some containing fresh allegations about the 17-year-old scandal.

     

     Tom

     15 Nov 12 at 8:06 am
293. Hi blogstrop! Is there ever a day you don’t wake up and think “must…complain…at…Catallaxy…about…people…who disagree…with…others…at…Catallaxy”?

     Just wondering!

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 8:13 am
294. Labor MPs were “bewildered and scratching their heads” after they observed a steady stream of media articles emerging

     Is it acceptable for these idiots be out in public without adult supervision?

     laybore – a collective of morons.

     

     Rabz

     15 Nov 12 at 8:16 am
295. I see no reason why the former Speaker of the House of Representatives should not be able to see out his term with distinction as the chief satirist of the 43rd federal parliament of Australia:

     THE Oxford St bar at the centre of claims Peter Slipper was thrown out for being drunk has launched an investigation into the alleged incident.

     Mr Slipper strenuously denied the incident occurred at the bar, which is popular with the gay community, after Ray Hadley aired the claims on 2GB.

     Bar staff at the Oxford Hotel claim night manager Stuart Cairns was involved in an incident with the former speaker, when he asked him to leave the pub.

     Soon after he claimed to have ejected Mr Slipper, Mr Cairns took to Facebook where he posted about asking a “drunken Peter Slipper” to leave the premises.

     Bar owner Jay Mooney later denied anyone was asked to leave the premises on Tuesday night.

     “At no stage, on the evening of November 13, due to intoxication or any other reason, was any patron asked to leave,” he said.

     

     Tom

     15 Nov 12 at 8:17 am
296. Link.

     

     Tom

     15 Nov 12 at 8:18 am
297. but it’s Israel’s rather better targeted counter-attack that the palidiots call a “declaration of war”.

     Yep, get ready for the usual tiresome, “disproportionate Israeli response” meme, leavened with a few fabricated “genocidal atrocities”.

     

     Rabz

     15 Nov 12 at 8:18 am
298. laybore – a collective of morons.

     Gee, coming from a thread full of people lining up to lose money on Romney (were you one of them? I forget) I would have thought a bit of temporary modesty might be warranted.

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 8:18 am
299. Hey semenblogger shitferbrains!

     Is there ever a day you don’t wake up and think “oh time to go and get roundly abused by a bunch of people who are absolutely fucking sick of me and think I’m a staggeringly stupid, arrogant, narcissistic, sexual deviant wrongologist?”

     Just wondering, dick head!

     

     Rabz

     15 Nov 12 at 8:22 am
300. Mortar fire into Israel from Gaza and Syria threatens to spark a major conflict in the region.

     “Many in southern Israel were saying similar prayers Monday as anti-Israel terrorists in Gaza launched 10 more rockets at neighborhoods by mid-day. The Israeli Defense Forces said more than 110 rockets had hit Israel since Saturday.

     Israel has struck targets from the air in the past two days and on Monday warned the Palestinian Islamist group Hamas, which controls Gaza and is designated a terrorist entity by the USA and European Union, that it will strike with “ever-growing intensity” if the attacks do not cease.

     “Hamas is responsible for the rocket fire and all other attempts to harm our soldiers and civilians, even when other groups participate. And it is Hamas that will pay the heavy price,” Israeli Defense Minister Ehud Barak said.

     The rockets, coupled with a mortar attack Monday into Israel from Syria to the north, threatens to spark a major conflict in the region. Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu said Sunday that a ground offensive by Israel may be inevitable if Hamas is not stopped.

     “The world must understand that Israel will not sit idly in the face of attempts to attack us,” Netanyahu said Sunday. “

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 8:22 am
301. Guys, SoB is very worried.

     It is clear that SoB’s panties are in a knot, notice the panicky indignant hand waiving?

     Clear signs we are dead on target.

     

     Token

     15 Nov 12 at 8:26 am
302. No excitement here at all, Token. Yesterday I calmly pointed out potential explanations suggested by the evidence regarding the $5000, even if it did truly end up in her account.

     It’s a free service I provide: pointing out the obvious to people who can’t see it.

     For what it’s worth, unless there is further evidence to come, I think that Julie Bishop spending more than brief time on this in Parliament is likely to backfire with the public.

     But you’re too blindly partisan to see that.

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 8:37 am
303. $5000, even if it did truly end up in her account.

     Why would an AWU member lie about events which he complained about at the time to Ian Cambridge, the then head of the AWU?

     Why doesn’t gillard just answer the question on this? If it was all above board then what does she have to hide?

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 8:40 am
304. Thus, culture extends from ethnicity. Institutions are the formal expression of a people’s practices, their culture.

     I’m not sure that’s strictly true. Institutions are largely set down in law, and in some cases in the constitution. Societies can change in ethnic mix but the constitution does not, mostly, and laws can only change to the extent that they adhere to the constitution.

     Immigration has not heretofore destroyed our way of life because our constitution and our laws have been upheld through our institutions. I don’t see any particular threat which will change this. Only crazy wingnut cranks would faff on about immigrants forcing us to implement sharia law or a world government, Pat.

     Assimilation will happen. It may not happen with the first generation of Sudanese or Afghani immigrants, but it will get done in the schoolyards and sporting grounds of Australia, like it always has. Keep calm and eat your goat curry.

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 8:42 am
305. If it was all above board then what does she have to hide?

     “I’ve already dealt with these misogynist allegations”

     Repeat, ad nauseam…

     

     Rabz

     15 Nov 12 at 8:42 am
306. “I’ve already dealt with these misogynist allegations”

     Repeat, ad nauseam…

     With the killing season arriving on Monday week we can expect the people backing Rudd to keep feeding stories.

     Though he is a hopeless executive, as we saw in the 2007 and 2010 election, Rudd is a master of running insurgency campaigns and getting the fanclub in the Stenographers Guild to carry water for him.

     I really get the feeling the Stenographers like Rudd more than Gillard, and so do the cabinet members who trashed Rudd in Feb.

     

     Token

     15 Nov 12 at 8:54 am
307. Hem may be mistaken, Gab; not lying.

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 8:56 am
308. Gee, coming from a thread full of people lining up to lose money on Romney (were you one of them? I forget) I would have thought a bit of temporary modesty might be warranted.

     You guys won a coin toss, and now you think you are the cleverest people who have ever lived.

     

     Dangph

     15 Nov 12 at 8:58 am
309. Steve, it was Abbott’s answer to the alleged punch that excited you. The lying slapper’s answer is even worse but no excitement for you. Why don;t you go back to your blog of oblivion. Do you not get it that people aren’t interested in your vomit.

     

     Tiny Dancer

     15 Nov 12 at 9:05 am
310. Hem may be mistaken, Gab; not lying.

     So when he went to Cambridge in 1995 to tell of the $5000 Wilson asked to be deposited into gillard’s account he was mistaken? It’s not a complicated story now is it? And I don’t believe the issue, at the time, was gillard, rather it was about $5000 of what seemed to be AWU money being redirected to another account. He was suspicious and rightly raised his concerns with the national head of the AWU at the time.

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 9:05 am
311. Shame! Shame! Shame!

     VICTORIA’S Secret has been forced to apologise for putting a Native American-style headdress on a runway lingerie model.

     Karlie Kloss wore the floor-length, replica headdress with leopard print underwear and high heels during the luxury label’s fashion show in New York last week.

     The outfit sparked a furious response from Native American leaders, who have accused the company of “spitting” on their culture.

     I’m tipping the American Indian women loved it.

     

     Tom

     15 Nov 12 at 9:06 am
312. Gab, no doubt someone in the alp mafia has got to him. But in any case shut up . Because it’s different when they do it.

     

     Tiny Dancer

     15 Nov 12 at 9:07 am
313. Back in July…

     Australia’s Deputy Prime Minister and Treasurer Wayne Swan has denied that Australia’s economy is at risk of a Spain-like economic crisis, calling the thesis put forth by the former chief Asia-Pacific economist for Morgan Stanley, Andy Xie “absurd”.

     Today:

     Australia risks losing its AAA credit rating if it is unable to get its federal budget back to surplus by 2014, according to the global director of public finance at Standard & Poor’s Financial Services.

     The official, Kyran Curry, has been a long-time primary credit analyst for Australia and told The Australian Financial Review that there are similarities between Australia’s relatively indebted banking system and Spain’s position before it began its rapid descent into its debt crisis.

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 9:07 am
314. I’d like to know who supplied Hedley with Ian Cambridge’s diary, a diary that has been authenticated by Cambridge…

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 9:10 am
315. Institutions are largely set down in law, and in some cases in the constitution. Again with your deus ex machina.

     The constitution of the U.S.A. is a vastly different beast to that of our own country. Why would that be, m0nt?

     “The law” itself is an evolving effect from the traditional practices of the people whose law it belongs to.

     You talk about these things as if they existed before the people themselves existed.

     There are a variety of legal systems and constitutions throughout the world, each reflecting the cultural practices of the people from whence they came.

     Societies can change in ethnic mix but the constitution does not, mostly, and laws can only change to the extent that they adhere to the constitution.

     You’ve obviously been asleep whilst stacking of the US Supreme Court has led to constitutional changes.

     Immigration has not heretofore destroyed our way of life because our constitution and our laws have been upheld through our institutions.

     Our immigration policy reflected the principles of the White Australia policy, right up to the 1970s. So, if you see that immigration “has not heretofore destroyed our way of life” then you should equally note the particular *type* of immigration which had been mandated for 70 years at least, and continued in effect till recently.

     Only crazy wingnut cranks would faff on about immigrants forcing us to implement sharia law or a world government, Pat.

     Show me where I have “faffed”, and I will show you where I have treated you with courtesy and respect. Furthermore, certain Muslim groups have been calling for sharia law, and, as demonstrated, the Greens do have an agenda of one world government. It is not faffing to back up one’s assertions with statements of fact.

     On the other hand, you are champing at the bit to abuse me for arguing my points with you.

     Assimilation will happen. It may not happen with the first generation of Sudanese or Afghani immigrants, but it will get done in the schoolyards and sporting grounds of Australia, like it always has.

     Statements of faith are no substitute for a well founded argument. I have demonstrated that if you drastically change a community’s ethnic demographics you will inevitably change that community’s institutions and cultural practices. My argument is based in a reasoned argument, built on observation. You are articulating liberal dogma.

     Keep calm and eat your goat curry.

     Again with the sneer.

     

     Pat Hannagan

     15 Nov 12 at 9:16 am
316. So when he went to Cambridge in 1995

     1996, Gab. And the deposit was made mid 1995, I think he says. He did not keep a record of the account number.

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 9:19 am
317. You guys won a coin toss

     LOL, you lot still think it was a coin toss. The denial is all pervasive.

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 9:19 am
318. I’m tipping the American Indian women loved it.

     Why do you say that? What cultural signification do the headdresses have?

     

     Dangph

     15 Nov 12 at 9:22 am
319. As reported in the US:

     However, overall President Obama not only won the electoral college vote but the popular vote as well by a margin of 50.6% to 47.8% across the United States.

     According to CNN, the totals for each candidate were 62,604,855 votes cast for President Obama and 59,128,902 votes cast for Governor Romney, for a difference of 3,475,953 votes between the two candidates.

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 9:22 am
320. VICTORIA’S Secret has been forced to apologise for putting a Native American-style headdress on a runway lingerie model.

     Karlie Kloss wore the floor-length, replica headdress with leopard print underwear and high heels during the luxury label’s fashion show in New York last week.

     The outfit sparked a furious response from Native American leaders, who have accused the company of “spitting” on their culture.

     The only thing that matters is that the gorgeous Doutzen Kroes looked like an absolute Goddess.

     That is all.

     

     .

     15 Nov 12 at 9:25 am
321. 
     

     I’d like to know who supplied Hedley with Ian Cambridge’s diary, a diary that has been authenticated by Cambridge…

     Gab
     15 Nov 12 at 9:10 am

     
     Obviously, if not Cambridge himself, someone in the AWU or ALP. Likely both. I could guess that their name might start with M, but really there are no doubt quite a few people sick of the deceit.

     

     Entropy

     15 Nov 12 at 9:26 am
322. MEMO TO “BAN THE TROLLS” WHINGERS:

     You could always start up your OWN blogs, then you could ban WHOMEVER YOU WANT to ban.

     Own your own blog and I’ll start listening.

     

     .

     15 Nov 12 at 9:27 am
323. I am an institutionalist. I believe society is only as strong as the institutions which define it, and keeping those strong and healthy goes a long way towards ensuring general society gets on. To the extent that you want to label me a lefty as a consequence, be my guest.

     Neocons are, by the definition I understand, anti-institutionalists. They share a lot of conservative values with traditional conservatives, but one on which they differ is that neocons want to dismantle large parts of the web of social institutions that go to make up social democracies. In the Australian context, neocons want to tear down a lot of the building blocks of society which Menzies laid in place.

     When people like JC set out the long list of government departments they would cut entirely, to raucous applause from the peanut gallery, that’s the sort of thing that defines this site as a haven of neocons, in addition to the libertarian elements.

     monty you are confused and believe in a load of crap. You think cutting waste and having civil liberties is “nuts”.

     

     .

     15 Nov 12 at 9:29 am
324. 1996, Gab. And the deposit was made mid 1995,

     Yes I confused Helmut for Hem.

     The diary reveals that on September 25, 1995, Mr Cambridge received a telephone call from AWU official Helmut Gries, who told him of allegations that union funds, controlled by Ms Gillard’s then boyfriend, union official Bruce Wilson, had been used for Ms Gillard’s renovations – and The Age newspaper was on to the story.

     The disclosure by Hem to Cambridge came eight months after concerns were first raised publicly by a Liberal minister, Phil Gude, in Victoria’s parliament, about Gillard allegedly getting a benefit in relation to the renovation of her house. Gude wanted a probe into what he was told at the time. He has insisted union officials had been to see him with evidence that Gillard was a beneficiary of union money.

     Gude told the Victorian parliament in October 1995 that Gillard had been forced to leave her law firm; that she was directly linked to the misappropriation of union funds; that she had benefited from renovations to her own house; and that she had to pay money back to the AWU so that she and Wilson could “cover their tracks”.

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 9:32 am
325. Ah good times

     http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2012-11-14/why-troikas-forecasts-are-total-joke-one-easy-chart

     Gab

     You ought to keep bringing this up. People are already running interference.

     Shut up that’s why.

     

     .

     15 Nov 12 at 9:39 am
326. “The law” itself is an evolving effect from the traditional practices of the people whose law it belongs to.

     As are institutions. The Chinese and Irish came, Australia didn’t fall apart. The Italians and Greeks came, Australia didn’t fall apart. The Vietnamese and Lebanese came, Australia didn’t fall apart. The Sudanese, Iraqis and Afghanis are coming, Australia won’t fall apart.

     You’ve obviously been asleep whilst stacking of the US Supreme Court has led to constitutional changes.

     The SCOTUS doesn’t change the constitution, Pat.

     Our immigration policy reflected the principles of the White Australia policy, right up to the 1970s. So, if you see that immigration “has not heretofore destroyed our way of life” then you should equally note the particular *type* of immigration which had been mandated for 70 years at least, and continued in effect till recently.

     What is that supposed to mean? You support the White Australia policy to preserve our way of life? You’re not dog whistling now, you’re whistling Dixie.

     Show me where I have “faffed”, and I will show you where I have treated you with courtesy and respect. Furthermore, certain Muslim groups have been calling for sharia law, and, as demonstrated, the Greens do have an agenda of one world government. It is not faffing to back up one’s assertions with statements of fact.

     If you are advocating a return to the White Australia policy, that is going to get criticised. It doesn’t matter how nicely you say it. Just because Muslim clerics say something in a madrassa doesn’t mean it is going to happen. And the Greens have as much chance of instituting a world government as the religious right does of banning abortion: that is to say, none.

     Statements of faith are no substitute for a well founded argument. I have demonstrated that if you drastically change a community’s ethnic demographics you will inevitably change that community’s institutions and cultural practices. My argument is based in a reasoned argument, built on observation. You are articulating liberal dogma.

     I was talking about the schoolyard being the catalyst for establishing societal norms. This is a completely non-controversial theory of sociology.

     You have not constructed a reasoned argument. You have stated in a roundabout way that you think multiculturalism will enable a world government with sharia law, and that you would prefer a return to the White Australia policy. This is nonsense, Pat.

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 9:41 am
327. monty you are confused and believe in a load of crap. You think cutting waste and having civil liberties is “nuts”.

     No and no, Dot.

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 9:42 am
328. Yes I confused Helmut for Hem.

     There Gab, now doesn’t that feel better? It’s good for the soul.

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 9:43 am
329. monty you are confused and believe in a load of crap. You think cutting waste and having civil liberties is “nuts”.

     No and no, Dot.

     Yes.

     

     .

     15 Nov 12 at 9:44 am
330. The Chinese and Irish came, Australia didn’t fall apart. The Italians and Greeks came, Australia didn’t fall apart. The Vietnamese and Lebanese came, Australia didn’t fall apart. The Sudanese, Iraqis and Afghanis are coming, Australia won’t fall apart.

     Are you trying to atone for your racist tweet last night?

     

     Dangph

     15 Nov 12 at 9:44 am
331. There Gab, now doesn’t that feel better? It’s good for the soul.

     You’re very big on the sneer, monty. Fuck off.

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 9:45 am
332. Florida professor: Obama an ‘apostle’ sent to create ‘heaven here on earth’

     Yeah, no. That’s not freaky at all. AT ALL.

     

     sdog

     15 Nov 12 at 9:46 am
333. You’ve taken an important first step today, Gab. Kudos to you.

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 9:49 am
334. m0nty whined:

     Considering the rudeness that is posted in my direction after every single post I make on this site,

     Considering your sneers and rudeness, it’s no wonder you cop short shrift.

     You don’t like the way you get treated then look at your own behavior first.

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 9:52 am
335. You just dropped the F-bomb on me and you’re lecturing me about rudeness, Gab? Oh dear.

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 9:54 am
336. mUnty’s a ham-fisted racist freak who hates Asians.

     I for one am glad chuckleheads are allowed to exercise their free speech. How better to see what congenital fuckwits they are than through their own words?

     

     sdog

     15 Nov 12 at 9:56 am
337. You’ve got enough of my attention for today, m0nty, you’re not getting any more.

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 9:56 am
338. You just dropped the F-bomb on me

     and earlier this week you were telling me to fuck off. Get off your soapbox, it’s not that strong.

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 9:58 am
339. I am an institutionalist. I believe society is only as strong as the institutions which define it, and keeping those strong and healthy goes a long way towards ensuring general society gets on.

     This isn’t a philosophy that defines anything. It’s the creed of the idiot who doesn’t know he’s talking about. This exact creed can justify anything but an individualist approach to society, which it deliberately refuses to consider. It’s the lefty creed to justify taxpayer funded community centres, unreasonably powerful unions and gay marriage while still being the conservative creed for justifying church, marriage, military service and traditional family. All the time ignoring that the institutions are always going to be composed from the individual citizens within that society and reflect the values they personally hold. But we can never acknowledge that, we must always consider the ‘macro’ level, lest consideration of the individual be brought to the fore!

     

     John Mc

     15 Nov 12 at 9:59 am
340. The Chinese and Irish came, Australia didn’t fall apart. The Italians and Greeks came, Australia didn’t fall apart. The Vietnamese and Lebanese came, Australia didn’t fall apart. The Sudanese, Iraqis and Afghanis are coming, Australia won’t fall apart.

     m0nty, there is no need for hysteria. At no stage have I asserted an apocalypse from immigration. I’ll not repeat again my argument above, for you obviously aren’t listening.

     I’ll just point out that the Irish, for instance, since you mention them and “Australia falling apart, were a decisive influence with regard conscription in World War I. As a result of Irish agitation, the anti-conscription forces won the day in this country.

     So, it’s not a matter of “falling apart”, (as I say, your hysterical style of argument is getting the better of your reasoning faculties), it is a matter if demography influencing, and changing, a nation’s institutions, laws, culture etc. This change may happen slowly, or it may happen quickly, determined by the rate at which the ethnic community changes.

     I have explained that culture extends from ethnicity. You assert that culture is a deus ex machina.

     I guess we should leave it at that.

     My final point, with regard your defamatory style of argument:

     You support the White Australia policy to preserve our way of life? You’re not dog whistling now, you’re whistling Dixie.

     …

     If you are advocating a return to the White Australia policy, that is going to get criticised.

     The discussion is with regard immigration changing a nation’s institutions. You asserted the leftist trope of “we are an immigrant nation”. I pointed out it was a particular type of immigration, noting the historical consequences of the White Australia policy on immigration. Once again you descend into name calling.

     Have a good day m0nt.

     

     Pat Hannagan

     15 Nov 12 at 10:04 am
341. Maybe monty you can tell me why reforming welfare so that we don’t waste $100 bn on churn every year would destroy “institutions” other than middle class welfare and generational poverty.

     Why would you oppose such a reform? The churn has only costs and no benefits.

     Maybe you want to tell us why abolishing inefficient taxes like payroll taxes which hurt employment would be bad for us all.

     Can you also tell me why privatising Australia Post would destroy it? Maybe it should be left to fend for itself – considering the level of protectionism it exists under.

     Maybe you can tell me why repealing some of the anti terrorism legislation and odious things like majority jury verdicts would destroy institutions like our system of common law rights or the jury system itself.

     Maybe you can tell us why privatising the ABC (I would give it away rather than sell it) would destroy it.

     Libertarians believe in stuff like this. Please have a go at attacking them.

     Please, tell as many people as possible that you are 100% rock solid against everyone of those principles or proposals.

     Menzies was no hero. His 1963 election policy was a bribe to the Catholic church. The State of NSW starting attacking the church and they didn’t fight back, they were coddled by Menzies.

     The church is no stronger because of that, it is weaker. It is a client. Institutions are not strong because they lean on the State. They are strong because they have a right to tell the State to leave it alone – as unanimous jury verdicts or civil rights should have been similarly defended and constitutionally circumscribed.

     Please have a go at being critical of that as well, given that you are an “institutionalist” and also a Statist. You have really just confused institutionalism with statism.

     As to immigration Australia boomed with open immigration in colonial times, except there was a (at the time) fairly enlightened, pluralist dispensing of justice done by the British Empire.

     Sudanese immigrants do have problems. Their native culture treats women with very little respect. They seem to have high incidences of violence when they move into poor areas where there are a lot of Aborigines. It makes Julia Gillard look like the bawling schoolgirl and lying crook she really is.

     

     .

     15 Nov 12 at 10:06 am
342. I’ll just point out that the Irish, for instance, since you mention them and “Australia falling apart, were a decisive influence with regard conscription in World War I. As a result of Irish agitation, the anti-conscription forces won the day in this country.

     A few of them should have been hanged without mercy for treason, sedition and terrorism during colonial times however.

     

     .

     15 Nov 12 at 10:07 am
343. and earlier this week you were telling me to fuck off.

     Evidence please, Gab. I don’t recall swearing at anyone like that.

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 10:10 am
344. m0nty, there is no need for hysteria.

     Hysteria is his default setting.

     All those imaginary dog whistles he keeps hearing day & night might could have damaged him in some way beyond our ken.

     

     sdog

     15 Nov 12 at 10:10 am
345. This isn’t a philosophy that defines anything.

     It is a pragmatic philosophy, that is true John Mc. I don’t see that as being a bad thing. Strict adherence to ideology in the modern age is usually fraught with danger.

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 10:11 am
346. More wisdom from the 1980s

     Heather Gillard. Shades of Arthur Miller.

     http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DRnluLJXtVk

     Actually explains a lot about politicians and Samuel J’s rants about hubris.

     

     .

     15 Nov 12 at 10:17 am
347. Evidence please, Gab. I don’t recall swearing at anyone like that.

     Yes, I should have said “fuck you” not “off”.

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 10:19 am
348. SCHIFF REPORT ROUNDUP

     THE FSICAL CLIFF

     
     

     Fresh from his victory, the President took time today to let the nation know how he proposes to avoid the cliff: to raise taxes on those Americans who make more than $250,000 per year. He made clear that no one making less than that will be asked to pay any more. The two percent of taxpayers that the President is targeting earn 24.1% of all income and pay 43.6% (as of 2008) of all personal federal income taxes. Sounds like a fair share to me. But the four or five percent tax increases on those earners that are being proposed would only yield around $30 to $40 billion per year in added revenue, a drop in the federal bucket. Even if they were to double the amount that they pay our deficit would only be cut by about one third (even if those increases did not trigger an economic slowdown).

     So what exactly is this looming menace, and why is it so dangerous? Stripped of its rhetorically charged language the fiscal cliff is simply a legal trigger that will trim the deficit in 2013 by automatically implementing spending cuts and tax increases. In other words, the government will spend less, and more of what it does spend will be paid for with taxes rather than debt. Isn’t this exactly what both parties, and the public, more or less want? The fiscal cliff means that the federal budget deficit will be immediately cut in half, shrinking to approximately $641 billion in 2013 from the approximately $1.1 trillion in 2012. What is so terrible about that? I would argue that there is a greater danger in avoiding the cliff than driving over it.

     CALIFORNIA JOINS LIST OF LATIN AMERICAN FAILED STATES, MIMICS COLLAPSE OF ROME AFTER DIOCLETIAN’S REFORMS

     The biggest headlines go to the passage of Proposition 30 which raises the sales tax by ¼ percent for four years and retroactively increases state income taxes for seven years on the three percent of California taxpayers who make more than $250,000 annually. California’s top tax rate now goes to 13.3%, by far the highest in the country. Interestingly, Proposition 30 was competing for passage with another measure, Proposition 38, which would have raised all state income tax rates. By rejecting the broader measure and choosing to soak only those earning more than 250,000, California voters have shown that class warfare is alive and well as a winning electoral strategy.

     In addition to the income tax increase for the wealthy, voters also agreed to protect unions’ ability to use payroll-deducted funds for political purposes (Prop 32) and to raise taxes on multi-state businesses by approximately $1 billion annually, spending a large portion of this money on “energy efficiency and alternative energy projects” (Prop 39). This is despite the fact that coal remains by far the cheapest source of energy in the world. Combined with higher taxes, higher energy prices, a higher corporate tax bill, and a continued ability for labor unions to influence policy, this will likely act as a deterrent for businesses to create jobs in the state.

     But perhaps the most ominous election development was within the California State Legislature. After the votes were counted, Democrats now control two thirds “super majorities” in both the Assembly and the State Senate. Combined with the power of famously left wing governor Jerry Brown, the Democrats can now completely set the agenda in the state. The small Republican minority will not be able to prevent Democrats from unilaterally raising taxes or increasing spending. Progressives are chomping at the bit to raise more revenue through the destruction of the decades old Proposition 13, which limited rates by which local governments could assess property taxes.

     In California, more than in just about every other state, many people have come to believe that the Democratic Party is firmly in the pocket of gargantuan public sector unions including the teachers, prison guards, police, and municipal workers. These interests have never shown the slightest regard for the needs of business or for fiscal sanity. It seems their only agenda is to secure higher pay and fewer work requirements for their members.

     The last time any party in California held the governor’s chair and a supermajority in both houses was in 1933. But Democrats have for decades controlled the legislature, albeit without a supermajority. In addition they have had to deal with a series of Republican governors, including the most recent “Governator”, Arnold Schwarzenegger. Despite these obstacles, Sacramento has managed to make California one of the least competitive states in the nation. They now have the ability to approve spending and tax increases without any Republican support.

     In Washington, Democrats have not enjoyed that kind of power since 1978. In fact, the last time any party was so firmly in control was during the Johnson Administration in the 1960′s (and to a lesser, and briefer, extent during the first half of the Carter Administration).The ruinous policies of Johnson’s “Great Society,” which many believe laid the foundation for today’s fiscal disaster, would not have been possible if Republicans could have mustered 40 filibuster votes in the U.S. Senate. Republicans finally got that 40th vote in 1978 and have not lost it since.

     For those of you who may have missed the news: California is in serious trouble. According to Forbes magazine, pensions for the state and local government employees are underfunded to the tune of $650 billion. That comes to roughly $17,000 per Californian. The state’s yearly operating budgets over the last decade have featured deficits larger than the budgets of twenty states. California now boasts the third highest unemployment rate in the nation (10.2%) and some of the highest rates of home foreclosures in the nation. The Wall Street Journal reports that the state has also borrowed $10 billion from the Federal Government to pay for jobless benefits. In the last year, five major California municipalities have either filed bankruptcy or took steps to do so. Forbes also reports that since 1998, 4.4 million taxpayers have left the state in search of better economic climates.

     

     .

     15 Nov 12 at 10:35 am
349. On a lighter note Gab, something to add to the Bucket List?

     Dragon’s Breath Zipline, Labadee, Haiti

     Great fun. I did it 2 years ago while on a Royal Caribbean cruise (Freedom of the Seas).

     

     Septimus

     15 Nov 12 at 10:35 am
350. I’ll just point out that the Irish, for instance, since you mention them and “Australia falling apart, were a decisive influence with regard conscription in World War I. As a result of Irish agitation, the anti-conscription forces won the day in this country.

     And what is your problem with that? What exactly is wrong with that? If we were sending all our Sudanese refugees to Afghanistan to fight the Taliban, you can bet they’d ark up too.

     Culture is not a deus ex machina. It does have some relationship to institutions. Correlation does not imply causality, however. You are assuming that to change one would be to change the other. This is not true. The courts in Australia have not changed much in the face of multiculturalism, for example. I can take you to a bunch of private schools in major cities in Australia which are still very much whitebread in their student intake.

     The discussion is with regard immigration changing a nation’s institutions. You asserted the leftist trope of “we are an immigrant nation”. I pointed out it was a particular type of immigration, noting the historical consequences of the White Australia policy on immigration.

     What is your point, then? Sounds to me like your point is that to move Australia away from the White Australia policy is an unacceptable change that threatens our institutions. That is what I reacted to with such revulsion.

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 10:36 am
351. I am an institutionalist. I believe society is only as strong as the institutions which define it, and keeping those strong and healthy goes a long way towards ensuring general society gets on.

     Yes, Monty and the government he loves are steeped in strong institutional traditions:

     1. Promising bipartisan “conservative” economic management in 2007 to get elected. What actually happened: creating a union mates club to oversee industrial relations, sending productivity backwards; record debt, record government spending, a record government deficit in 2011-12 and record cumulative government deficit 2008-13; government’s credit rating now facing another downgrade.
     2. Using a witchhunt against the Catholic Church in an attempt to destroy the Opposition leader.
     3. Destroying the authority of the office of Speaker of the House of Representatives by appointing a renegade who was about to be disendorsed by the Liberal Party for corruption in order to cling to power.
     4. Mocking parliamentary standards through the “expulsion” of a corrupt former union official MP, while retaining his vote in order to cling to power.
     5. Destroying the impartiality of the public service by using Treasury as an attack dog against the Opposition.
     6. Stonewalling accusations of professional impropriety against the PM that got her sacked from her only job outside politics before entering parliament.
     7. Attacking one side of US politics and tearing up the convention of declining to attack the domestic Opposition from outside the country.

     I’m sure I’ve left many more out.

     

     Tom

     15 Nov 12 at 10:39 am
352. One of the most absurd memes I see here lately is the claim that quite restrained commenters like mOnty and me* are being “hysterical”, when we clearly are not. Gab, on the other hand, goes berko at mild sarcasm, and she’s just being reasonable, I suppose?

     It’s all part of the reality disconnect that makes these threads so fascinating at times.

     (*Sure, I was abusing Mk50 thoroughly yesterday, but he deserves special abuse for being a lying, pompous halfwit.)

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 10:41 am
353. By the way Gab, is that your ovaries talking this morning?

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 10:43 am
354. It is a pragmatic philosophy, that is true John Mc. I don’t see that as being a bad thing. Strict adherence to ideology in the modern age is usually fraught with danger.

     But that’s not a philosophy at all. How do you decide what is a good institution and what is a bad one?

     

     Dangph

     15 Nov 12 at 10:50 am
355. Whatever you do, Dogshit, don’t ever change your gravatar. It so beautifully and eloquently and pathetically describes what a weedy little beta male you are. When will you tell your children what you really do all day instead of lying to them about it? Do you not worry you that, instead of being their role model and bread winner, you’re demonstrating to them what not to be when they reach adulthood?

     

     Tom

     15 Nov 12 at 10:51 am
356. The kind of ‘man’ the man-fearing Julia Gillard prefers:

     WHEN he’s not running her bath, fetching the newspaper or blowdrying her hair the Prime Minister’s partner, Tim Mathieson, is often flopped on the couch at The Lodge watching her in parliament.

     

     C.L.

     15 Nov 12 at 10:51 am
357. One of the most absurd memes I see here lately is the claim that quite restrained commenters like mOnty and me* are being “hysterical”, when we clearly are not.

     Oh fuck off, you pair of flouncing princesses.

     

     sdog

     15 Nov 12 at 10:51 am
358. Time to threaten Gab with a bashing again, Steve?

     

     C.L.

     15 Nov 12 at 10:52 am
359. Dot: of course I support in principle eliminating welfare churn, improving genuinely inefficient taxes, privatising public utilities where efficiencies can be proven, and repealing repressive laws. Your examples are mostly biased towards dismantling things rather than improving them, though. Your agenda is to destroy pillars of social democracy, in favour of liberty at all costs. This is an extremist view that you hold.

     The Catholic Church is not a national institution, it is supra-national and not ultimately beholden to any government. Its independent wealth means it is not a client of any state.

     I don’t think institutionalism is equivalent to statism. Institutions can be funded and maintained by private enterprise, private charity or public charity and be founded on shared tenets – you only have to look at the education system to prove that.

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 10:55 am
360. The fruitcake brought to us by Dog @9.46am:

     “Yes, Barack had worked tirelessly on behalf of the American people, especially those who elected him in 2008. His followers needed to re-elect him to a second term, so that he could continue to accomplish the promises he made, thus, realizing his vision of America as a more perfect political union or heaven here on earth.”

     The electorate rightly doesn’t trust Obama with money, so they elected a Republican majority in the House. The next four years will be a war with Congress. He is a lame duck. Good.

     

     Tom

     15 Nov 12 at 10:57 am
361. sdog, you’re reacting a tad hysterically to a politely worded observation.

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 10:59 am
362. Yes, I should have said “fuck you” not “off”.

     LOL! The phrase “google fu” is an adaptation of “kung fu”, as in Neo of the Matrix saying “I know kung fu”. It is not an abbreviated cuss word! You would have discovered that quite easily if you had exercised your google fu even a little.

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 10:59 am
363. How long till Flouncey McButt-Hurt goes crying to that other blog about us being MEEEEEAAAAAN!!!11!!eleventyone!! to him?

     

     sdog

     15 Nov 12 at 11:00 am
364. Your agenda is to destroy pillars of social democracy, in favour of liberty at all costs. This is an extremist view that you hold.

     “liberty at all costs”

     Well actually I value freedom over anything else. When I am free, I am free to decide what is best for me.

     Social democracy has demonstrably and empirically failed. You have said how you agree with most of the libertarian agenda. Social democracy should be destroyed because it gives rise to generational poverty, welfare churn and chronic unemployment.

     The Catholic Church is not a national institution, it is supra-national and not ultimately beholden to any government. Its independent wealth means it is not a client of any state.

     You have a puerile understanding of how the church works.

     I don’t think institutionalism is equivalent to statism. Institutions can be funded and maintained by private enterprise, private charity or public charity and be founded on shared tenets – you only have to look at the education system to prove that.

     Yes you do. You agree with the libertarian agenda and then attack libertarians for wanting to end social democracy, which creates the poor outcomes you agree ought to be eliminated.

     You are either confused or a statist, or both. You have no utilitarian or pragmatic reason to disagree, only your ideology where freedom is a low priority and social democracy ranks higher. You think prioritising freedom is fanatical despite agreeing with most of a checklist of the libertarian agenda.

     

     .

     15 Nov 12 at 11:03 am
365. OIC: criticising spouses partners for being (allegedly) lazy when it’s a Labor politician is OK, CL? Didn’t you use to complain about Labor sneering about Mrs Howard?

     Good to see you’re above that. [/sarc]

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 11:03 am
366. By the way, my comment goes for Andrew Bolt too.

     He loves a good smear lately: as long as it is against a Labor aligned person.

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 11:04 am
367. Monty, are you going to bathe and eat today or would that cause you to miss a vital rebuttal on Catallaxy?

     

     C.L.

     15 Nov 12 at 11:04 am
368. WHEN he’s not running her bath, fetching the newspaper or blowdrying her hair the Prime Minister’s partner, Tim Mathieson, is often flopped on the couch at The Lodge watching her in parliament.

     Shorter SfB: Hey, I resemble that remark!

     

     sdog

     15 Nov 12 at 11:06 am
369. The Catholic Church is not a national institution, it is supra-national and not ultimately beholden to any government. Its independent wealth means it is not a client of any state.

     Upthread this wingut dismisses evidence from Bob Brown for One World Government with a Strawman, then M0nty rolls out the old Papist plot to show who is the true tin-foiled hat conspiracy theorist..

     

     Token

     15 Nov 12 at 11:06 am
370. sdog: I know you and most here have been psychically damaged by the Obama loss.

     But I see it as part of my role to point out when people are not making any sense, at all.

     Hug your guns, and you’ll feel better I’m sure…

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 11:06 am
371. It says a lot about Gillard, psychologically, that she’s frightened of a man like Tony Abbott – preferring a beta step ‘n fetch it.

     It screams insecurity.

     

     C.L.

     15 Nov 12 at 11:08 am
372. Monty, are you going to bathe and eat today or would that cause you to miss a vital rebuttal on Catallaxy?

     Aww, poor Lad, he’s not the centre of attention like usual. Diddums.

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 11:09 am
373. QED.

     

     C.L.

     15 Nov 12 at 11:09 am
374. BTW STeve is that your arse talking again thiis morning?

     

     Rococo Liberal

     15 Nov 12 at 11:10 am
375. Upthread this wingut dismisses evidence from Bob Brown for One World Government with a Strawman, then M0nty rolls out the old Papist plot to show who is the true tin-foiled hat conspiracy theorist..

     Can someone explain to monty how the church works?

     In terms of settling disputes and in terms of doctrine and communion, it is supranational/(transnational for some other churches). In terms of property and legal incorporation, it operates locally.

     Most Christian denominations work this way.

     

     .

     15 Nov 12 at 11:10 am
376. Oh Good Lord: CL, you think a married man holding hands with his wife in public, wearing a wedding ring, or being beside her at the birth of his children, are all unmanly and embarrassing.

     You are officially the Last Person On Earth to be pretending you have any insight into psycho-sexual analysis of others.

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 11:12 am
377. Hug your guns, and you’ll feel better I’m sure…

     Dear Princess SfB: BOO!

     

     sdog

     15 Nov 12 at 11:14 am
378. In terms of settling disputes and in terms of doctrine and communion, it is supranational/(transnational for some other churches). In terms of property and legal incorporation, it operates locally.

     Is the royal commission going to recommend confiscating the Church’s property? No. Is it going to criticise Church doctrine and dispute resolution? Yes. Is the Church beholden legally to change its doctrine and dispute resolution? No.

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 11:18 am
379. In your language M0nty it is clear this dicussion is too personal – its the Church, the Church, the Church…

     As Gerard Henderson noted yesterday and this writer notes in the Tele today, the anti-Catholic sectarian obsession will mean the investigation misses other crimes that should be addressed:

     WHEN I saw Prime Minister Julia Gillard on TV announcing there would be a royal commission into child abuse in churches and other institutions I was overwhelmed.

     I wept uncontrollably. I became breathless. I walked the floor struggling to breathe, trying to comprehend what I had heard.

     It was later I realised it was about time the truth was revealed, perhaps it was time for hope and happiness, not sadness.

     I lived in the Church of England North Coast Children’s Home in Lismore from 1949 to 1964. Most of those years were full of hatred, bloody brutal floggings, bashings, starvation and sexual abuse. It was a home of hell and fury.

     

     Token

     15 Nov 12 at 11:23 am
380. Shitfer and Lady Les Mathieson should get together and compare notes.

     It seems impossible but Matho is possibly more of a man.

     

     Infidel Tiger

     15 Nov 12 at 11:23 am
381. Is it going to criticise Church doctrine…? Yes.

     Well, that would be interesting.

     

     dover_beach

     15 Nov 12 at 11:24 am
382. M0nty, I am less than clear about what you mean by ‘institution’. Does this include marriage? Free speech? Property rights? All of which have come under attack in recent times. And from you. How do you claim to be an institutionalist?

     

     DrBeauGan

     15 Nov 12 at 11:27 am
383. On Church stuff, I thought Pell’s statement about declining to hear confession if he knew a priest had an allegation of child abuse against him was a bit odd and controversial.

     What if the guy gets hit by a bus on the way to the police station, after Pell’s refusal?

     He’s on his way to Hell because George wouldn’t hear a confession?

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 11:29 am
384. He’s on his way to Hell because George wouldn’t hear a confession?

     Being a bit over familiar here aren’t you Shitfer?
     Particularly to Catholics such as yourself, Cardinal, Father or even Doctor would be more appropriate, no?

     

     Huckleberry Chunkwot

     15 Nov 12 at 11:35 am
385. sdog: my son used to be very keen to have toy guns, and I did nothing to discourage this. I used to like the old pistol gun when I was a kid too.

     And yet I still think American gun laws are nutty, and the number of gun deaths, both deliberate and accidental in that country are a disgrace. I think Australian gun laws are good and deservedly well supported by our voters.

     Can you fit your brain around that?

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 11:37 am
386. Is the royal commission going to recommend confiscating the Church’s property? No. Is it going to criticise Church doctrine and dispute resolution? Yes. Is the Church beholden legally to change its doctrine and dispute resolution? No.

     ‘

     I never mentioned the RC. You seem a bit obsessed with your crazy crusade to make Gillard, who is a crook, more popular than Tonee Yabbot.

     

     .

     15 Nov 12 at 11:42 am
387. And yet I still think American gun laws are nutty

     People you’d prefer to coo over as “victims” actually having the right to self-defense, and the right to not become victims at all, scares the shit out of you, doesn’t it.

     

     sdog

     15 Nov 12 at 11:42 am
388. And yet I still think American gun laws are nutty, and the number of gun deaths, both deliberate and accidental in that country are a disgrace. I think Australian gun laws are good and deservedly well supported by our voters.

     Canda is right next door and has more liberal gun laws and less gun violence.

     Australia’s gun laws have at best done nothing and at worst encouraged more crime, including gun crime.

     They would not have stopped any mass or serial killer. They do not stop organised crime.

     Even Dr Don Weatherburn thinks you’re an anti gun, anti freedom fanatic and left wing shill. By his admission Howard’s gun laws were nothing more than an expensive wank.

     There is a left wing obsession with not institutionalising the insane or particularly bad criminals. When they go on a rampage, it is the fault of law abiding gun owners.

     Bizzare.

     

     .

     15 Nov 12 at 11:45 am
389. Is there anything Shitfer isn’t afraid of?

     

     Infidel tiger

     15 Nov 12 at 11:56 am
390. As Gerard Henderson noted yesterday and this writer notes in the Tele today, the anti-Catholic sectarian obsession will mean the investigation misses other crimes that should be addressed:

     So far there are only claims, no evidence that the RC will have an anti-catholic obsession. The terms of reference haven’t even been set yet. And they are actually consulting with the Catholic church when it comes to the terms of reference.

     Whilst it may be one focus of the investigations, its very clear from the initial announcement that it will have a much wider scope. A lot of the protests of bias of the RC look like just setting up some background to continue the denials that there are or have been any systemic problems in the church.

     

     Chris

     15 Nov 12 at 11:58 am
391. Yeah, America’s founding fathers were real idiots for not listening to fascists like Dogshit of the Brisbane Sewer cheering for the emasculation of liberty and the disarmament of the population. Do you understand why the Second Amendment exists, you simpleton? Stupid question. Some people are incapable of learning because they are herd animals born with shrunken brains.

     

     Tom

     15 Nov 12 at 12:00 pm
392. A lot of the protests of bias of the RC look like just setting up some background to continue the denials that there are or have been any systemic problems in the church.

     No, it’s because Gillard hasn’t given a shit about victims of abuse until people called for a royal commission into the unions and she thinks she can ping Abbot with this.

     

     .

     15 Nov 12 at 12:06 pm
393. Fuck Steve, have you got a son?

     

     Tiny Dancer

     15 Nov 12 at 12:07 pm
394. Angry Ant Tom is rambling on again, and wannabe Texas Ranger IT is here with one of his “you’re just a big girlie man” “witticisms.”

     Not much new, then.

     I’m waiting for an explanation from CL (he’s most likely to know, I guess) as to what the Church teaches its priests with respect to when they can refuse to hear a confession.

     That would at least be new…

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 12:07 pm
395. I’ve heard you can buy a pistol with one clip of bullets for a grand. Apparently bullets are a big deal to access illegally for some reason.

     Dunno if it’s true but it’s what I heard.

     

     DaveF

     15 Nov 12 at 12:08 pm
396. ? I have referred to him at my blog, where my fascinating life and opinions are compulsory reading for at least 5 people internationally…

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 12:09 pm
397. Whilst it may be one focus of the investigations, its very clear from the initial announcement that it will have a much wider scope.

     Yes, just like the ridiculous witch-hunt against News Ltd was actually going to be a wide-ranging inquiry into all Australian media.

     Do you seriously not get why people are cynical?

     This is Alinksy 101: “Pick the target, freeze it, personalize it, and polarize it.” Rinse and repeat.

     

     sdog

     15 Nov 12 at 12:10 pm
398. So far there are only claims, no evidence that the RC will have an anti-catholic obsession. The terms of reference haven’t even been set yet. And they are actually consulting with the Catholic church when it comes to the terms of reference.

     The ABC or the media pack didn’t waited for the terms of reference before going launching a jihad at the Catholic Church about the sanctity of the confession.

     A lot of the protests of bias of the RC look like just setting up some background to continue the denials that there are or have been any systemic problems in the church.

     ?????Where did you get that from?????

     The RC has been addressing the issue since the 1990′s and reformed their approach in 1996:

     However, as the Jesuit priest Frank Brennan said on Lateline, the Catholic Church reformed its handling of sex abuse allegations in 1996. Soon after Pell became Archbishop of Melbourne in 1996, he set up the Melbourne Response, which was aimed at confronting abuse of children by clerics and assisting victims

     

     Token

     15 Nov 12 at 12:12 pm
399. Is there anything Shitfer isn’t afraid of?

     Lying

     

     harrys on the boat

     15 Nov 12 at 12:12 pm
400. “I have demonstrated that if you drastically change a community’s ethnic demographics you will inevitably change that community’s institutions and cultural practices.”

     You have not. Neither have you demonstrated that Australia’s ethnic demographics are being drastically changed. Nor have you shown why gradual change to culture or institutions or ethnic demography is automatically a negative.

     In fact, your focus on ethnicity to the exclusion of all the other determinants of culture, and your preference for the White Australia policy, are disturbing.

     

     Jarrah

     15 Nov 12 at 12:14 pm
401. This is Alinksy 101: “Pick the target, freeze it, personalize it, and polarize it.” Rinse and repeat.

     Absolutely. Chris’ objective is transparent.

     The lefty trolls like to use #1 & 4 if you are not aware:

     RULE 1: “Power is not only what you have, but what the enemy thinks you have.”

     RULE 4: “Make the enemy live up to its own book of rules.”

     

     Token

     15 Nov 12 at 12:16 pm
402. “RULE 4: “Make the enemy live up to its own book of rules.””

     Oooh, how terrible.

     

     Jarrah

     15 Nov 12 at 12:21 pm
403. In fact, your focus on ethnicity to the exclusion of all the other determinants of culture, and your preference for the White Australia policy, are disturbing.

     Oh Jarrah, you who love context can not get away with that statement. Here is the whole quote where the WAP is brought up in response to a statement about the constitution:

     Immigration has not heretofore destroyed our way of life because our constitution and our laws have been upheld through our institutions.

     Our immigration policy reflected the principles of the White Australia policy, right up to the 1970s. So, if you see that immigration “has not heretofore destroyed our way of life” then you should equally note the particular *type* of immigration which had been mandated for 70 years at least, and continued in effect till recently.

     I see no endorsement of the WAP which was in place at the founding of Federation, when the other institutions M0nty is referring to were created.

     He even addresses M0nty’s attempt to verbal him that he endorses the WAP:

     If you are advocating a return to the White Australia policy, that is going to get criticised.

     The discussion is with regard immigration changing a nation’s institutions. You asserted the leftist trope of “we are an immigrant nation”. I pointed out it was a particular type of immigration, noting the historical consequences of the White Australia policy on immigration. Once again you descend into name calling.

     I do repeat what has been noted upthread, only dogs can hear a dog whistle.

     

     Token

     15 Nov 12 at 12:21 pm
404. “RULE 4: “Make the enemy live up to its own book of rules.””

     Oooh, how terrible.

     We know you are a big fan of that game, so no surprise you try:

     RULE 5: “Ridicule is man’s most potent weapon.”

     

     Token

     15 Nov 12 at 12:23 pm
405. Dragon’s Breath Zipline, Labadee, Haiti

     Great fun. I did it 2 years ago while on a Royal Caribbean cruise (Freedom of the Seas).

     Hmmm…looks like fun, Septimus. However, I’m not sure Haiti has good safety standards. But it’s definitely worthy of a Bucket List entry.

     I went on Royal Caribbean cruise a couple of years ago, just to Vanuatu and New Caledonia and assorted islands. Great trip, a few rough seas as we were at the tail end of the hurricane but that just made the cruise more interesting. Royal Caribbean cruise ship was fantastic. Highly recommend.

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 12:29 pm
406. Rhapsody of the Seas, iirc.

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 12:30 pm
407. my fascinating life and opinions are compulsory reading for at least 5 people.

     Dogshit explains that Dogshit Today had five readers one year, which is why he devotes his life to being an arsehole, a nuisance and a troll everyone despises at a proper website with up to 20,000 visits per day, the modus operandi being if you clog enough threads with gibberish some people will be forced to read it. Pixel thief doesn’t begin to describe what a contemptible bottom-feeder you are, Dogshit.

     

     Tom

     15 Nov 12 at 12:33 pm
408. “RULE 5: “Ridicule is man’s most potent weapon.””

     I wouldn’t say most potent, but definitely potent. I recommend using it whenever appropriate.

     

     Jarrah

     15 Nov 12 at 12:40 pm
409. Anyone see that shameful idiot Bradbury defend Gillard’s bent behaviour?

     Anyone notice Sky News has the official Chinese communist Party TV station as an “affiliate”?

     

     .

     15 Nov 12 at 12:40 pm
410. For those joining us late, Steve is a lifelong ‘conservative,’ military ‘veteran,’ ‘husband and father’ (to a family for whom he apparently does nothing at any time of the day or night), devout ‘Catholic’ (who has called for American bishops to be “punished” by child murder supporter Barack Obama) and longstanding admirer of John Howard.

     

     C.L.

     15 Nov 12 at 12:43 pm
411. “I see no endorsement of the WAP”

     Not explicitly. But since you’re a newly converted fan of context, maybe you want to look at all Pat’s statements on this topic, and see if you detect a pattern.

     

     Jarrah

     15 Nov 12 at 12:44 pm
412. “Steve is a … military ‘veteran,’”

     Really? I missed that revelation.

     

     Jarrah

     15 Nov 12 at 12:46 pm
413. I never use the term “military veteran”, Jarrah, but I was in one of the forces in my younger years.

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 12:49 pm
414. Girl Guides doesn’t count shitfer

     

     harrys on the boat

     15 Nov 12 at 12:50 pm
415. Shitfer: (*Sure, I was abusing Mk50 thoroughly yesterday, but he deserves special abuse for being a lying, pompous halfwit.)

     Translation: “Mk50 gave me a flogging onmy belief in the AGW Church of Gaia and His Holiness the Goreacle. Again. I cried.”

     Such a pansy.

     

     Mk50 of Brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 12:50 pm
416. And no, Steve – Pell is re-stating normal practice as regards confession. Contrary to your sources (the ABC and David Marr), no priest is ever compelled to absolve the penitent. If the latter is counselled that absolution depends on his willingness to confess to the authorities (in matters of criminal misconduct) and he doesn’t do so, he is not absolved. By the way, even cowardly Pell critic Bishop Geoffrey Robertson admitted yesterday that child molesters don’t, as a rule, go to confession or confess such sins. Their derangement is such that they don’t even consider themselves sinners. The whole confession panic is an invention of left-wing malice junkies who watch too much television.

     Once again, you demonstrate that you’re not a Catholic in any meaningful sense. About a year ago, you referred to Catholics going to confession after Sunday Mass – which was hilarious to actual Catholics.

     

     C.L.

     15 Nov 12 at 12:50 pm
417. I suspect you never used the word ‘devout’ when talking about your religion either.

     

     Jarrah

     15 Nov 12 at 12:51 pm
418. Anyway, CL, apart from your usual summary of wrongness about me (as noted at my blog, I took my son to Supanova last weekend – was that you I saw dressed up as Pope Urban?) please tell us what you know about when a priest or Archbishop can or should refuse a confession.

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 12:52 pm
419. Sky News:

     “The recent debate regarding Aboriginality was sparked a few days ago by Tony Abbot”!!!

     What about this Shane Mortimer clown?

     Aboriginal Commissioner of the HREOC:

     “Aboriginality is not determined by skin colour”

     Of course. Bess Price is no more Aboriginal than some clown who has 1/64th Aboriginal heritage (and lives the same lifestyle as a schmuck from Newcastle upon Tyne).

     

     .

     15 Nov 12 at 12:53 pm
420. I never use the term “military veteran”, Jarrah, but I was in one of the forces in my younger years.

     The Girl Guides 22nd Airborne.

     

     Infidel tiger

     15 Nov 12 at 12:54 pm
421. …please tell us what you know about when a priest or Archbishop can or should refuse a confession…

     If you were a Catholic you would know that a priest is always free to refuse absolution. In your case, you could be refused absolution if you didn’t undertake to stop promoting abortion – which you do as an almost manic preoccupation.

     

     C.L.

     15 Nov 12 at 12:57 pm
422. In school cadets, I was the only one who got 0 out of 35 at the Puckapunyal 300-metre range (mainly because I was aiming at the red flag on top of the hill just for fun). Plus I practised with military pistols, as well as rifles and shotguns (and clay birds), at our private range on the farm. I think that makes me a military veteran.

     

     Tom

     15 Nov 12 at 12:57 pm
423. I never use the term “military veteran”, Jarrah, but I was in one of the forces in my younger years.

     ???

     Exceedingly odd wording there.

     

     sdog

     15 Nov 12 at 12:58 pm
424. “Bess Price is no more Aboriginal than some clown who has 1/64th Aboriginal heritage (and lives the same lifestyle as a schmuck from Newcastle upon Tyne).”

     Where do you draw the line?

     

     Jarrah

     15 Nov 12 at 12:58 pm
425. I was in one of the forces in my younger years.

     Hahahahahahahahahahahaha!!! Dogshit was in the school cadets!

     

     Tom

     15 Nov 12 at 1:01 pm
426. Jarrah:
     

     “I read too many science fiction novels, Dangph.”

     What was the last one you read?

     Jarrah – am reading bank’s ‘The Hydrogen Sonata’ ATT. Very good.

     

     Mk50 of Brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 1:01 pm
427. Exceedingly odd wording there.

     Yes, I thought so too. I’m tipping SFB thinks attendance at Junior Military Cadets school classifies him as “being in one of the forces”.

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 1:02 pm
428. If you were a Catholic you would know that a priest is always free to refuse absolution.

     That’s different from refusing to hear a confession…

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 1:04 pm
429. Exactly, Gab. He will lie about anything if it makes him look good. Dogshit is Frank Burns, the ultimate beta.

     

     Tom

     15 Nov 12 at 1:07 pm
430. By the way, the “confession after Mass” bit was your misunderstanding/misrepresentation of what I said, CL. I remember at the time you got it wrong, as you usually do.

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 1:08 pm
431. There was nothing odd about the wording at all. “Military veteran” to me carries an implication of involvement in some action to most people. Hence I don’t use it, since it was a rather peaceful period when I was in.

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 1:11 pm
432. A lot of the protests of bias of the RC look like just setting up some background to continue the denials that there are or have been any systemic problems in the church.

     ?????Where did you get that from?????

     The RC has been addressing the issue since the 1990′s and reformed their approach in 1996:

     From the Oz a denial of systemic problems (http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/archbishop-george-pell-says-air-should-be-cleared-and-the-truth-revealed/story-fn59niix-1226515437047):

     “While there were significant problems concerning some dioceses and some religious orders, talk of a systemic problem of sexual abuse in the Catholic Church is ill-founded and inconsistent with the facts,” they said on behalf of the Australian Catholic Bishops Conference

     And from lateline last night http://www.abc.net.au/lateline/content/2012/s3633089.htm

     TONY JONES, PRESENTER: The senior lawyer who reviewed the Catholic Church’s Towards Healing protocol says he can point to alleged contemporary cover-ups in the Catholic Church.

     Professor Patrick Parkinson was cited by Cardinal Pell yesterday as the man who had reviewed the Church’s protocols on two occasions and had given them his tick of approval.

     But Professor Parkinson says he’s now withdrawn his support for the protocol because the Church failed to take action over clergy who didn’t comply.

     Pell’s strategy is simply to deny there are (or have been) systemic problems, but the justification for that is looking pretty weak.

     

     Chris

     15 Nov 12 at 1:12 pm
433. Well, Steve – there two ways to make a confession.

     Go to the confessional on a Saturday and simply walk in. This is the normal way – Archbishop Mannix heard confessions into his late 90s. Or – a more recent and rare modus operandi – you can make an appointment to see a priest specifically to make a confession. In the former case, the priest has no idea who he is talking to. In the latter case, he would know the person’s name. If the person was a notorious child molester, any priest would be free to refuse to hear his confession – on grounds that the person was not truly contrite.

     So what Pell said is wholly unremarkable.

     

     C.L.

     15 Nov 12 at 1:12 pm
434. “Jarrah – am reading bank’s ‘The Hydrogen Sonata’ ATT. Very good.”

     Have heard good things about it, haven’t got around to it yet. Last one of his I read was The Player of Games. The Culture novels are impressive.

     

     Jarrah

     15 Nov 12 at 1:13 pm
435. So Professor Parkinson is saying that he personally knows of priests who molested children but he didn’t go to the police.

     Is that right?

     

     C.L.

     15 Nov 12 at 1:15 pm
436. What were you “in”, Dogshit? How old were you? What type of unit was it?

     

     Tom

     15 Nov 12 at 1:17 pm
437. “Bess Price is no more Aboriginal than some clown who has 1/64th Aboriginal heritage (and lives the same lifestyle as a schmuck from Newcastle upon Tyne).”

     Where do you draw the line?

     Wherever the hell they like to. Just don’t force people to agree.

     

     .

     15 Nov 12 at 1:21 pm
438. If the person was a notorious child molester, any priest would be free to refuse to hear his confession – on grounds that the person was not truly contrite.

     That is not the circumstance Pell was alluding to at all:

     “If the priest knows beforehand about such a situation, the priest should refuse to hear the confession,” he said.

     “I would never hear the confession of a priest who’s suspected of such a thing.”

     A “notorious” child molester is not one who is merely “suspected” of it, in my books.

     Good try though to defend a dubious position put by the Cardinal.

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 1:22 pm
439. Tom, I preserve my privacy about this matter.

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 1:23 pm
440. So Professor Parkinson is saying that he personally knows of priests who molested children but he didn’t go to the police.

     Is that right?

     Going by the transcript, yes.

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 1:24 pm
441. I preserve my privacy about this matter.

     Hahahahahahahaha!!! Lying his head off. He was in the school cadets!

     

     Tom

     15 Nov 12 at 1:25 pm
442. There was nothing odd about the wording at all. “Military veteran” to me carries an implication of involvement in some action to most people. Hence I don’t use it, since it was a rather peaceful period when I was in.

     Yes, the Girl Guides détente with the Brownies was a remarkably peaceful period in our history.

     

     Infidel tiger

     15 Nov 12 at 1:25 pm
443. “Wherever the hell they like to. Just don’t force people to agree.”

     I like the cut of your jib, young man.

     

     Jarrah

     15 Nov 12 at 1:25 pm
444. I preserve my privacy about this matter.

     It’s “reserve”, you Dorrie Evans clone.

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 1:26 pm
445. The story is that the Church’s own advisor makes recommendations about matters and individuals and then the Church buries the report and spirits the alleged perpetrators off to the Vatican, from memory, so that’s the story not Parkinson himself.

     

     Scapula

     15 Nov 12 at 1:26 pm
446. William Manchesters final volume in his Churchill biography has been released.

     

     Infidel tiger

     15 Nov 12 at 1:29 pm
447. So Professor Parkinson is saying that he personally knows of priests who molested children but he didn’t go to the police.

     Is that right?

     No. He’s alleging the Church has moved priests overseas while the Church knew they were under investigation by the police for serious child sexual assault.

     SUZANNE SMITH: Patrick Parkinson is very disturbed by the fact that there were three separate allegations of serious child sexual assault made against three different priests in an order known as the Salesians.

     Professor Parkinson is concerned that the Church allowed the accused to travel overseas when they were under investigation by police and he says they were not brought back to Australia to face their accusers.

     

     Chris

     15 Nov 12 at 1:30 pm
448. Yes it is exactly the situation the Cardinal was referring to.

     …so that’s the story not Parkinson himself

     .

     Parkinson claims to know of cases ‘covered up’ by the Church.

     Why didn’t he go to police? Has he committed an offence by not doing so?

     ———————————————–

     Can people stop using the word “Dogshit” to describe a commenter here? I know the request will fall on deaf ears and nobody has more cause to be tired of the relevant person’s serial mendacity and infantile baiting. But can we try and keep exchanges hovering somewhere above one of those YouTube threads, quality-wise?

     

     C.L.

     15 Nov 12 at 1:31 pm
449. I think either “preserve” or “reserve” is OK in the context, Gab.

     I will say I was in cadets as a teenager, then full time service after studies, then in the reserves for some years.

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 1:32 pm
450. I never use the term “military veteran”, Jarrah, but I was in one of the forces in my younger years.

     “I preserve my privacy about this matter.”

     “Ballduster McSoulpatch was unavailable for comment.”

     Seriously, mate. If you were lying about having served in the military, walk it back now before it goes any further. Don’t humiliate yourself.

     

     sdog

     15 Nov 12 at 1:32 pm
451. William Manchesters final volume in his Churchill biography

     A week or two ago I linked to an interesting article about the writing of the book, IT. Did you see that?

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 1:33 pm
452. walk it back now before it goes any further.

     There is no need to, since it is true. It is the reality disconnected here who cannot accept my routine truthfulness.

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 1:35 pm
453. Was it a NYT article?

     

     Infidel tiger

     15 Nov 12 at 1:36 pm
454. …he says they were not brought back to Australia to face their accusers.

     I call bullshit.

     They were all sent to non-extradition countries?

     “Face their accusers”? WTF does that even mean?

     Why weren’t they charged and extradited?

     Could it be because the charges wouldn’t stick?

     In saying that, I am not denying that child sexual abuse took place or that clueless, gutless bishops did the wrong thing.

     

     C.L.

     15 Nov 12 at 1:37 pm
455. IT: Yes, that’s the one.

     You can thank me anytime for the referral to an interesting article in a media outlet you presumably do not routinely touch for fear of catching cooties

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 1:39 pm
456. Professor Parkinson is concerned that the Church allowed the accused to travel overseas when they were under investigation by police and he says they were not brought back to Australia to face their accusers.

     “Is concerned” does that mean he knows for certain or just worried that it could be the case?

     If they were sent overseas while the police were investigating why didn’t the police pursue the matter further? Why didn’t Parkinson raise the matter with the police?

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 1:41 pm
457. Getting over the shock of you having a son is compounded by the revelation that you were an action man defending us all. You and numbers must have been mates. Surely.

     

     Tiny Dancer

     15 Nov 12 at 1:41 pm
458. You can thank me anytime for the referral to an interesting article in a media outlet you presumably do not routinely touch for fear of catching cooties

     John Roskam sent me there actually. Thanks IPA!

     

     Infidel tiger

     15 Nov 12 at 1:44 pm
459. Why didn’t he go to police? Has he committed an offence by not doing so?

     Misprison of felony was abolished a long time ago. Proving concealment would be something different.

     

     .

     15 Nov 12 at 1:49 pm
460. Gab you can read Parkinson’s evidence to the Victorian enquiry here; and I think the Four Corners program has some relevant material.

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 1:49 pm
461. “Is concerned” does that mean he knows for certain or just worried that it could be the case?

     I think its pretty clear that its the former. Remember he’s the person that the Church asked to come in to review the program, he’s not someone who became involved because of an anti-catholic bias.

     If they were sent overseas while the police were investigating why didn’t the police pursue the matter further? Why didn’t Parkinson raise the matter with the police?

     We’ll it would be pretty obvious to the police that they are overseas now. Its not like Parkinson had prior knowledge that they would be sent overseas. Perhaps the police are still investigating further, but having the accused overseas makes their job harder. And I thought part of the new process was that they didn’t move priests interstate/overseas when accused of sexual assault of children?

     But there interactions are something the RC would cover. For example, should the police be more pro-active about making applications that someone not be permitted to leave the country? And ask the church leaders why these priests have not been brought back to Australia to face questioning etc…

     

     Chris

     15 Nov 12 at 1:50 pm
462. Should a Royal Commission into Union and ALP corruption have Gillard testify as to if she ever acted fraudulently or not?

     

     .

     15 Nov 12 at 1:57 pm
463. Its not like Parkinson had prior knowledge that they would be sent overseas.

     How do you know?

     Perhaps the police are still investigating further,

     Or perhaps not. Or perhaps there was no evidence or perhaps or perhaps…

     And I thought part of the new process was that they didn’t move priests interstate/overseas when accused of sexual assault of children?

     Quite. So to what timeframe is Parkinson referring?

     should the police be more pro-active about making applications that someone not be permitted to leave the country

     Thought that ws the case in any situation when someone was being investigated by the police on alleged serious offences.

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 1:57 pm
464. I am an institutionalist.

     That describes the heart of the Left, in four words.

     Since their glorious Long March the Left captured the institutions, which is why the ABC and the universities are so awful, and why why their finest minds are so monocultural.

     They are institutionalists. They are the state.

     

     Jannie

     15 Nov 12 at 1:57 pm
465. Could it be because the charges wouldn’t stick?

     In saying that, I am not denying that child sexual abuse took place or that clueless, gutless bishops did the wrong thing.

     From the same interview:

     SUZANNE SMITH: Professor Parkinson says one of the priests was a convicted sex offender who was sent to Samoa and he appears to have had contact with children. He is angry at the Church’s failure to act.

     So a convicted sex offender has been accused of more abuse and the Church’s response is to move them overseas? I just hope they told local Samoan authorities of his previous convictions.

     

     Chris

     15 Nov 12 at 1:58 pm
466. Will the Royal Commission into either issue investigate if the Sussex St cabal covered up Milton Orkopolous, etc?

     

     .

     15 Nov 12 at 1:58 pm
467. The ABC and the universities were taken over by the corporate right in the eighties. Its the afterglow of liberalism that makes you think they’re still leftist.

     

     Scapula

     15 Nov 12 at 2:03 pm
468. Hopefully the RC will investigate matters related to other denominations and not just the catholic Church.

     I lived in the Church of England North Coast Children’s Home in Lismore from 1949 to 1964. Most of those years were full of hatred, bloody brutal floggings, bashings, starvation and sexual abuse. It was a home of hell and fury.

     In the time I was there more than 200 innocent children were verbally, physically and sexually assaulted. Fear ruled our lives.

     Children were abused, many savagely beaten by the matron, staff and Anglican clergy using belts, electric cords, pony whips and small flexible branches which at times we were ordered to fetch from the backyard.

     Unable to do anything, I stood helplessly and watched in fear.

     I also watched helplessly as my little mates were violently beaten, screamed at and dragged by the hair to their beds.

     …

     Yes, there is a desperate need for a royal commission that investigates abuse in places other than just those connected to the Catholic church.

     The Church of England North Coast Children’s Home has a dark history of neglect, sexual violence, brutal beatings, floggings, hatred and other forms of sadistic cruelty.
     
     Sadly, some victims have taken their lives, some have been in and out of mental institutions, have had counselling or psychiatric treatment; have succumbed to alcohol and drug use or spent time in prison struggling to cope with the consequences of the merciless abuse that is the legacy of their years of torment in the Anglican home.

     Do the Anglicans practise Confession?

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 2:05 pm
469. Gab – why do you think that someone that the Church chose to review their processes would lie about what happened?

     

     Chris

     15 Nov 12 at 2:05 pm
470. Professor Parkinson says one of the priests was a convicted sex offender who was sent to Samoa and he appears to have had contact with children. He is angry at the Church’s failure to act.

     If he was convicted, wouldn’t he be gaoled? And if after time served there would be no way he would still be a priest.

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 2:08 pm
471. The ABC and the universities were taken over by the corporate right in the eighties. Its the afterglow of liberalism that makes you think they’re still leftist.

     Erm yes, that’s why I’ve worked with IR lecturers who think that being against Keynes is a form of fascism and that Work Choices, which brought unemployment under 4% was diabolical.

     

     .

     15 Nov 12 at 2:08 pm
472. why do you think that someone that the Church chose to review their processes would lie about what happened?

     where have I said he is lying? I am asking questions.

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 2:09 pm
473. And why has Parkinson not spoken up about his allegations before now?

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 2:10 pm
474. Do the Anglicans practise Confession?

     The High Anglicans do. Anglo Catholic they call themselves. IIRC some Lutherans also do so as a sacrament, others just do it as a “non sacramental rite”.

     

     .

     15 Nov 12 at 2:11 pm
475. Token, 1123. What Richard Campion wrote is true. I lived in the same Home.

     

     Winston Smith

     15 Nov 12 at 2:16 pm
476. And I thought part of the new process was that they didn’t move priests interstate/overseas when accused of sexual assault of children?

     Who’s “they”?

     The alleged offenders were apparently members of the Salesian order and therefore not under the jurisdiction of any Australian bishop.

     

     C.L.

     15 Nov 12 at 2:20 pm
477. Dragon’s Breath Zipline, Labadee, Haiti

     Hmmm…looks like fun, Septimus. However, I’m not sure Haiti has good safety standards.

     Labadee is a gated private area, on the north coast of Haiti 100kms north of Port au Prince, and all activities are run by Royal Caribbean. Very high safety standards – they fit you with a safety harness and brief you very well, then put you on a smaller zipline first (low level 50m traverse) so you know what to do on the Dragon’s Breath Zipline.

     

     Septimus

     15 Nov 12 at 2:25 pm
478. and all activities are run by Royal Caribbean.

     Then I;m sold on the idea

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 2:27 pm
479. Erm yes, that’s why I’ve worked with IR lecturers who think that being against Keynes is a form of fascism and that Work Choices, which brought unemployment under 4% was diabolical.

     You’re an ideological zealot so you simply don’t like the way academic discourses function. You can’t just rant and swear like people do around here.

     

     Scapula

     15 Nov 12 at 2:28 pm
480. SUZANNE SMITH: Professor Parkinson says one of the priests was a convicted sex offender who was sent to Samoa and he appears to have had contact with children. He is angry at the Church’s failure to act.

     Unmitigated bullshit. Who “sent” him? How does “the Church” force a parolled prisoner to do anything or go anywhere?

     Remember the recent murder of a woman? Remember how we were all WARNED (by the STATE) not to mention the accused’s background? Or to mention that he was allegedly ‘moved on to another location’ by the very same STATE?

     How about we have a Royal Commission into judges and Labor lawyers and honour the memory of all the people who are dead because of them?

     

     C.L.

     15 Nov 12 at 2:30 pm
481. The alleged offenders were apparently members of the Salesian order and therefore not under the jurisdiction of any Australian bishop.

     I have a sneaking suspicion ‘jurisdiction’ is going to be an end game in all this.

     ie Government is already making noises about requiring company boards to have defined diversity – more females, wasn’t there one about Asian business experience too ?

     And wait for the next lot of diversity requirements to be mandated – quotas of GLBT and ethnic minorities on boards;

     more folk with disabilities to be placed in the SAS, commandos and clearance divers

     etc

     Sooner or later someone is going to look at religious hierarchies and say ‘awful lot of middle-aged males you have there ‘ !!

     And of course as these hierarchies operate in the Australian legal and tax jurisdiction – how intolerable is it that their leadership is not selected/approved by the elected representatives of the Australian people.

     Look to a federal government Office of Religious Appointments coming to a future near you soon.

     

     Myrrdin Seren

     15 Nov 12 at 2:30 pm
482. Charles Johnson self-beclowning watch:

     I have no doubt that the climate of deranged xenophobia and anti-Muslim hatred built and fed by people like Newt Gingrich, Pamela Geller, and Robert Spencer played a large part in this brutal crime.

     

     C.L.

     15 Nov 12 at 2:34 pm
483. Meanwhile, I invite sub-titles for a (misnamed) book in the news:

     All Up In My Snatch.

     Via Tim Blair.

     

     C.L.

     15 Nov 12 at 2:39 pm
484. Look to a federal government Office of Religious Appointments coming to a future near you soon.

     What paranoid hooey.

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 2:42 pm
485. Oh dear, poor little Hamas got caught in fighting again, but this time, it can’t go crying off to Russia.

     I’m sure there will be lots of hand waving by the EU and Iran, to be happily ignored completely by Israel.

     Hamas is screwed. If you want allies, you don’t have to be virtuous, but you do have to keep promises.

     

     2dogs

     15 Nov 12 at 2:46 pm
486. Steve, the link to your blog is messed up.

     

     Dangph

     15 Nov 12 at 2:51 pm
487. Re Hamas, this quote from the IDF’s Brigadier General Yoav Mordechai (at Blair’s):

     I encourage all members of Hamas not to walk around above ground.

     

     C.L.

     15 Nov 12 at 2:51 pm
488. “What Richard Campion wrote is true. I lived in the same Home”

     Hey Winston, that sounds a really terrible experience. Can’t imagine how you got through it, and you sound so nice and normal and loveable despite it all.

     

     candy

     15 Nov 12 at 2:52 pm
489. Who’s “they”?

     The alleged offenders were apparently members of the Salesian order and therefore not under the jurisdiction of any Australian bishop.

     Oh so that’s meant to get the Catholic church as a whole off the hook? I understand that the church has a very distributed structure, so someone like Pell has little legal authority outside his immediate area (though he did say he has some moral authority). But ultimately they all report back to Rome right?

     Unmitigated bullshit. Who “sent” him? How does “the Church” force a parolled prisoner to do anything or go anywhere?

     I’d imagine that someone guilty seeking to avoid the prosecution would be quite willing leave the country if his employer was willing to help him. No force required.

     

     Chris

     15 Nov 12 at 2:52 pm
490. I encourage all members of Hamas not to walk around above ground.

     Killing some Hamas members who terrorise Israel is all well and good, but what’s the long-term plan? Is it just going to be exchanging rocket strikes forever?

     

     Jarrah

     15 Nov 12 at 2:54 pm
491. Oh – fixed now I think Dangph, ta.

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 2:55 pm
492. Oh so that’s meant to get the Catholic church as a whole off the hook?

     No, it’s meant to illustrate the absurdity of arguing that George Pell should have restrained free men from buying airline tickets. Or are you saying they should have been held in detention in the crypt of St Mary’s?

     But ultimately they all report back to Rome right?

     Rome can’t stop free men from buying airline tickets either.

     The fact that the men weren’t charged and extradited leads me to believe the allegations were unproven, unproveable or false.

     

     C.L.

     15 Nov 12 at 2:58 pm
493. I think CL is showing little sign of actually reading the detail of the complaints of Parkinson…

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 3:02 pm
494. Is it just going to be exchanging rocket strikes forever?

     I wonder to whom the clown is addressing his latest “thoughtful” question?

     

     JamesK

     15 Nov 12 at 3:03 pm
495. Jarrah:
     

     Killing some Hamas members who terrorise Israel is all well and good, but what’s the long-term plan? Is it just going to be exchanging rocket strikes forever?

     For the medium term, yes. At some point the festering abcess that is Gaza will have to be lanced, but that is years away.

     When Russia and China replace the USA as the middle-east arbiters of power would be my suggestion as to when terrorist barbarian enclaves funded by EU losers can be re-occupied, and non-terrorist governance forced on them.

     

     Mk50 of Brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 3:03 pm
496. Children were abused, many savagely beaten by the matron, staff and Anglican clergy using belts, electric cords, pony whips and small flexible branches which at times we were ordered to fetch from the backyard.

     In defence – only contextual defence – of the Anglicans, this was normal in all schools in those days, including state schools. I suspect it was worse in orphanages where staff were unconcerned by chastisement from an upset father but corporal punishment is not a news flash and is no grounds for special pleading.

     

     C.L.

     15 Nov 12 at 3:03 pm
497. I think CL is showing little sign..

     ‘Thinking’ really isn’t the best description of what liar-steve™ does.

     

     JamesK

     15 Nov 12 at 3:07 pm
498. No, I have read them, Steve. I see a snivelling office pol trying to disassociate himself from the Church now that the abuse bandwagon has taken a more Maoist turn. ‘Don’t shoot [hitherto silent] me. Shoot them.’

     

     C.L.

     15 Nov 12 at 3:07 pm
499. OK, I’ll get the ball rolling…

     All Up In My Snatch: The Search For The Missing Slush Fund Files.

     

     C.L.

     15 Nov 12 at 3:10 pm
500. SfB just popped over to your blog. I think you might want to reconsider this:

     I thought that perhaps someone has pointed the finger at climate change for this fungus spreading, but my Googling around indicates this is not a connection that is really being made – yet.

     The Ash disease was imported from the Continent where it is reasonably common but I imagine not as damaging as their trees have some immunity to it from repeated exposure.

     Apparently over the last few years there have been mass imports of saplings into the UK for some reason and they appear to be the source.

     It’s a Guardian link so I’m sure you’ll treat it as the Gold Standard.

     Ministers have been criticised for being slow to act, after the Horticultural Trade Association asked the then Labour government to ban ash imports in 2009.

     

     DaveF

     15 Nov 12 at 3:13 pm
501. On a different subject, but one that I know is close to the hearts of Catallaxians.
     Catalyst on ABC1 tonight is

     “a landmark, nationwide investigation into Australia’s weather – has it really changed in the last 100 years?
     Made with the close cooperation of the Bureau of Meteorology, this not-to-be-missed special concentrates on the simple facts – actual tidal gauges, real temperature records – going around Australia to look at local records where we all live and play. The result is a unique 100-year weather report “

     Don’t miss it.

     

     SteveC

     15 Nov 12 at 3:17 pm
502. C.L., corporal punishment was normal at schools in the 1960s and 1970s, but it was mostly done with a “strap” of a fairly standard type. Not with the variety of implements listed above.

     

     Julian O'Dea

     15 Nov 12 at 3:20 pm
503. I stopped watching Catalyst a long time ago because it seemed like every episode they would report on important developments in marine biology. That is, they would find some excuse to go to the beach. I see they are going to be checking out the tidal gauges tonight.

     

     Dangph

     15 Nov 12 at 3:24 pm
504. My understanding from old timers, Julian, is that teachers used anything and everything: straps, leather implements custom-made or ad hoc, blackboard rulers, poiting sticks, you name it. Sorry, but this is total bullshit. The conflation of Olden Days corporal punishment war stories with instances of sexual abuse has been done before to outlandishly boost the abuse rate and is completely dishonest.

     

     C.L.

     15 Nov 12 at 3:27 pm
505. SteveC I might check it out, perhaps I’ll learn something.

     Like what kind of pathology this guy suffers from.

     There are significant outcomes presented along with the facts – such as the wine maker that moved the family business to Tasmania as insurance against future climate change.

     

     DaveF

     15 Nov 12 at 3:28 pm
506. “When Russia and China replace the USA as the middle-east arbiters of power”

     You really think that’s going to happen?

     

     Jarrah

     15 Nov 12 at 3:29 pm
507. “Made with the close cooperation of the Bureau of Meteorology, this not-to-be-missed special concentrates on the simple facts”

     You mean, the BOM that has been ‘adjusting’ temperature records allover the country to better fit its climate change narrative? You mean,thew BOM that predicted drought as the new normal? You mean, the BOM whose involvement in dodgy IPCC reports is a national disgrace? That BOM?

     Don’t even get me started on the host station, the ABC, which matches the BBC in its unswerving committment to anything espoused by green lobbyists.

     Here’s a better option. At about the same time, Anthony Watts of the Watts Up With That website (winner of the best science site Bloggies award, 130 million views and counting) is hosting a 24 hour webcast which critically examines the current state of climate science.

     Program, details and link for the webcast here:

     http://wattsupwiththat.com/

     

     johanna

     15 Nov 12 at 3:31 pm
508. the wine maker that moved the family business to Tasmania as insurance against future climate change

     Hmmm, the Catalyst crew should probably go on location to check that out too.

     

     Dangph

     15 Nov 12 at 3:32 pm
509. Oops, typos. Sorry.

     

     johanna

     15 Nov 12 at 3:32 pm
510. DaveF, that is a winemaker who specialiss in cool climate wines. His picking date is now 20 days earlier than 20 years ago, so he has seen the writing on the wall and moved to a cooler climate to safeguard his business.

     

     SteveC

     15 Nov 12 at 3:32 pm
511. So, have we decided if the witch’s teat test will be utilized in gillard’s Royal Commission into the Catholic Church?

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 3:33 pm
512. Who could be bothered watching the ABC much? London to a brick that it’s a standard AGW Cultist melodrama. Again.

     It will probably have the usual suspects saying the usual things and banging on about ‘rising’ sea levels, ‘saving’ the Great Barrier Reef etc etc

     Said reef being something like 600,000 years old and having moved location after the last ice age when the sea level rose.

     Makes me wonder how the poor thing survived at all, without soap-dodging communist greenfilth to wail over it (and demand public money of course).

     

     Mk50 of Brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 3:36 pm
513. SteveC do you have a link?

     I think I may have heard of this bloke then.

     It won’t count if he was located in the Yarra Valley (UHI).

     

     DaveF

     15 Nov 12 at 3:37 pm
514. No DaveF, I heard it in a preview of the show on the radio this morning.

     

     SteveC

     15 Nov 12 at 3:38 pm
515. DaveF: I thought that some scientists thought the fungus may just have blown over from Europe.

     It may have no connection with climate change, seeing no one much seems to be saying so.

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 3:39 pm
516. C.L. I am 57, so not sure if that makes me an old-timer.

     In the 1960s and early 1970s in Canberra, I saw a bus driver beat a boy with his fists. I saw a teacher do similar. I was present when a boy was given what would now be termed a “bitch slap” by a brother in the MSC order which ran the school I attended. (A very good school incidentally, and very liberal by the standards of the day.)

     Other than those cases, I never saw anything used besides a strap or a ruler.

     The description of the Anglican orphanage sounds harsher than anything I ever saw. But residential environments are probably worse in general than the day schools I attended.

     

     Julian O'Dea

     15 Nov 12 at 3:45 pm
517. SfB, yes there is some dispute whether it blew over or came on, literally, millions of saplings they imported.

     The line seems to be the Ag Dept is covering their butt by blaming the wind because they were told of the risk from importation several years ago.

     Absolutely no CAGW link at all from my reading.

     Ok SteveC, ta for the response. I may even check it out now.

     

     DaveF

     15 Nov 12 at 3:46 pm
518. You mean, the BOM that has been ‘adjusting’ temperature records allover the country to better fit its climate change narrative?

     I’m always curious as to how climate denialists think organisations like the BOM work.

     Boss to underling: “Rogers, I see those temperature adjustments you’ve been working on aren’t high enough. I expect to see at least 1/2 degree – you know our policy”

     Later at the pub: “And you know what I did today – a whole 1 degree adjustment to Darwin. What’s the bet that no one will notice?”

     Really, Johanna, how old are you? You show signs of older age paranoia, if you ask me.

     (Yes, very rude and ageist – but people over a certain age do more readily come up with silly theories about what’s going on in the world.)

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 3:47 pm
519. ““When Russia and China replace the USA as the middle-east arbiters of power”

     You really think that’s going to happen?”

     Russia abandoned the Arabs five months ago, Jarrah. It’s a different game now.

     

     2dogs

     15 Nov 12 at 3:51 pm
520. This is interesting

     A couple in the US decided to only spend the equivalent of food stamps for a month and see how they went.

     Short answer: pretty bloody well.

     They ended up coming in way under in fact $160 for the month.

     What is interesting is the pics of the food they made (scroll down for the images of receipts and cooked food). Pretty basic but looks good. One caveat in the Australian context is that chicken is REALLY cheap there, sometimes a dollar a pound.

     

     DaveF

     15 Nov 12 at 3:51 pm
521. SfB,

     (Yes, very rude and ageist – but people over a certain age do more readily come up with silly theories about what’s going on in the world.)

     I think Steve has just inadvertently given the best explanation of AGW theory that I have ever seen…..

     

     Huckleberry Chunkwot

     15 Nov 12 at 3:54 pm
522. As I said, Julian, orphanages were probably worse because there was no fear of parents. Even in the days of corporal punishment (which practice parents actually demanded), teachers would not go too far lest they find themselves copping a well-deserved beating themselves from a father.

     

     C.L.

     15 Nov 12 at 3:57 pm
523. “Russia abandoned the Arabs five months ago, Jarrah.”

     So you disagree with Mk50?

     

     Jarrah

     15 Nov 12 at 3:59 pm
524. NewsRadio is just running a promo for the Catalyst show.

     Yep it’s gonna be CAGW through and through. She’s explaining why they don’t rate averages – not scary enough, they’re going for maximums.

     And she’s jumping around on time frames.

     Gotta break a few eggs to make a cake.

     ABC1 8pm

     

     DaveF

     15 Nov 12 at 4:00 pm
525. C.L.

     Yes. There were parents who demanded corporal punishment for their boys. But there was an understanding that this involved only “cuts” from the strap. The straps used were fairly standard. Lengths of rubber or leather maybe a foot long. Applied to the palm of the hand. The maximum tended to be six.

     What killed the practice at my school was a boy, whose father was a magistrate, having his hand damaged by a brother using a strap. Or so the story went. I doubt that corporal punishment is used these days, although it was still in use at Canberra Grammar in about 1983 at least.

     

     Julian O'Dea

     15 Nov 12 at 4:05 pm
526. As I have observed before, I for one think you weren’t thrashed enough as a child, CL, to get these chronic attempts at blameshifting out of you.

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 4:05 pm
527. Really, Johanna, how old are you? You show signs of older age paranoia, if you ask me.

     Climate zombie goes the personal insult to protect the religion.

     There’s a perfectly logical reason why the adjusted temperature records in Australia and the US make the last warm period in the 1930s relatively colder, isn’t there, Dogshit?

     Everything you do as a troll on this blog shows everyone what a disgusting lowlife you are. And it’s always the women you attack. Have you ever been interviewed by police for sexual misdemeanors?

     

     Tom

     15 Nov 12 at 4:11 pm
528. DaveF it might be the same preview I heard. They also look at minima. Interesting the increase in average minima is twice the increase in average maxima. The interviewer in the preview asked “what is causing it”. the reporter said they deliberately avoided looking at cause, and concentrated on just reporting what has been observed. Leaving discussion of cause for viewers to investigate themselves. Thus, hopefully, making the show watchable by AGW skeptics.

     

     SteveC

     15 Nov 12 at 4:14 pm
529. Tom is an unusual name for a woman.

     

     SteveC

     15 Nov 12 at 4:15 pm
530. SteveC there was no mention of the winemaker but it covered the points you mention.

     The paper Anthony Watts was involved in found that about warmer nights than historically. Explicable but muddied the waters a bit. He didn’t hit a home run with THAT paper LOL

     Thus, hopefully, making the show watchable by AGW skeptics.

     Sure. But that preppy voice of um…what was her name? Newbie? got pretty grating pretty quickly.

     

     DaveF

     15 Nov 12 at 4:22 pm
531. Both resident climate zombies going the insult now. Must be very hurty, Dogshit’s Best Friend.

     

     Tom

     15 Nov 12 at 4:26 pm
532. “Tom is an unusual name for a woman.”

     But not for a transvestite.

     

     Jarrah

     15 Nov 12 at 4:32 pm
533. Julian, once again: corporal punishment was the norm in all schools – including state schools – and all manner of implements were used. Straps, belts, sticks, rulers, pointers – you name it. The attempt to conflate this unremarkable fact with sexual abuse is dishonest and, frankly, pathetic.

     We now know that the worst child sexual abuse (in the context of corporal punishment) occurred on the watch of protestants in the Australian military.

     Oddly, all the perpetrators were ‘free to marry.’

     

     C.L.

     15 Nov 12 at 4:34 pm
534. Swimming Australia and Gymnastics Australia have the most to fear from any Royal Commission.

     

     Infidel tiger

     15 Nov 12 at 4:36 pm
535. Yes Candy. It was pretty brutal, and I’m just a seething mass of repressed rage.
     But I used to say “Stuff ‘em all” I’ll be out of here one day.
     The family motto, (there was five of us, removed because mum was declared “an unfit mother”) was “The best revenge is to live well.”
     And CL, with all due respect, the physical beltings we got were reasonably immaterial, you survive that sort of stuff. It was the constant “You’ll never amount to anything.” and “You’re mad, Winston, you’ll end up in an asylum.” For a 7 – 16yo, that’s pretty damn devastating.

     

     Winston Smith

     15 Nov 12 at 4:41 pm
536. C.L.

     I am just providing information as I have it. There was no use of implements like pony whips and electric cords.

     I don’t know what you mean by “child sexual abuse (in the context of corporal punishment)”.

     I agree it was a different time. But, as I said, no pony whips and electric cords. I am pretty sure that would have been reported at once. We accepted more though, that is certain. The bus driver who smacked the cheeky boy about the head would get a conviction and lose his job these days. In the mid-1960s, nobody would have thought anything of it.

     

     Julian O'Dea

     15 Nov 12 at 4:43 pm
537. Steve from Brisbane Esq.

     Economist.

     Meterologist.

     Horologist.

     Phrenologist.

     ———————————————————————————————

     Bleedings Done.

     =================//====================

     Fortunes Told.

     5¢

     

     C.L.

     15 Nov 12 at 4:54 pm
538. No, it’s meant to illustrate the absurdity of arguing that George Pell should have restrained free men from buying airline tickets. Or are you saying they should have been held in detention in the crypt of St Mary’s?

     Oh you seriously believe they as individuals just decided to buy airline tickets and leave on their own initiative? They ended up working continuing to work for the church in another country. As you say its not within Pell’s legal authority, but moving country and continuing to work for the church doesn’t just happen without the co-operation of the church.

     Have a read of this internal church document on the 4 corners website:

     http://www.abc.net.au/4corners/documents/abuse2012/Letter_JFox.pdf

     It’s pretty clear that the church has been assigning where the priests work – they talk about transferring him. There’s no call for the Church to lock up priests who have had allegations made about them, but they shouldn’t support them to move interstate/overseas.

     The good thing that comes out of this document is that at least in this case the local leadership prevented him from continuing to work in the ministry. But they did allow him to continue working for them in other capacities, and it appears from the letter they still did not inform the Archbishop of Suva that allegations of child abuse had been made against someone they were sending to work for him, nor request (not force) that he return to Australia to face the allegations.

     

     Chris

     15 Nov 12 at 4:59 pm
539. Julian, go back to my original comment.

     I suspect it was worse in orphanages where staff were unconcerned by chastisement from an upset father but corporal punishment is not a news flash and is no grounds for special pleading.

     I know for a fact that teachers used and devised all manner of ad hoc implements to serve as ‘straps.’ My own mother was wacked with a stick during piano lessons. How that differs from “small flexible branches which at times we were ordered to fetch from the backyard” only heaven knows.

     The bus driver who smacked the cheeky boy about the head would get a conviction and lose his job these days. In the mid-1960s, nobody would have thought anything of it.

     Right. And in the mid 60s a doctor who decapitated and disembowelled an unborn baby would have been given the death sentence. Now he’s given a Medicare cheque.

     

     C.L.

     15 Nov 12 at 5:01 pm
540. Oddly, all the perpetrators were ‘free to marry.’

     That’s one bit I agree with you. I think the no-marriage thing as a cause of child abuse is a bit of a furphy.

     Swimming Australia and Gymnastics Australia have the most to fear from any Royal Commission.

     If there are any problems (and there certainly have been allegations) then it will be a good opportunity for victims to come forward. The scouts for example have had problems in the past too as have state run institutions such as boys homes and juvenile prisons. There was an investigation a few years ago in South Australia into the care of children by the state:

     http://www.sa.gov.au/subject/Crime,+justice+and+the+law/Mullighan+Inquiry

     And this resulted in legislative changes to reduce the risk of further abuse.

     

     Chris

     15 Nov 12 at 5:05 pm
541. You’re an ideological zealot so you simply don’t like the way academic discourses function. You can’t just rant and swear like people do around here.

     Says the man who thinks Obama is a “right winger”.

     Academic discourses don’t like you, Bob.

     

     .

     15 Nov 12 at 5:07 pm
542. C.L.

     I have already commented on the hypocrisy of the lack of PC concern about late-term abortion.

     

     Julian O'Dea

     15 Nov 12 at 5:08 pm
543. We seem to be furiously agreeing with one another, Julian.

     

     C.L.

     15 Nov 12 at 5:17 pm
544. Jarrah – am reading bank’s ‘The Hydrogen Sonata’ ATT. Very good.

     For mine, his best Culture novel in ages. Must read.

     

     mct

     15 Nov 12 at 5:22 pm
545. CL,, are you going to bathe and eat today or would that cause you to miss a vital rebuttal on Catallaxy?

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 5:23 pm
546. Julian, you’re wrong about the absence of appliance cords and pony whips (Riding Crops) They were both used frequently in the North Coast Childrens Home.
     I myself have had a liking for being struck across the legs and buttocks with fine leather ever since.
     

     

     Winston Smith

     15 Nov 12 at 5:25 pm
547. 2Dogs:
     

     “When Russia and China replace the USA as the middle-east arbiters of power”

     You really think that’s going to happen?”

     Russia abandoned the Arabs five months ago, Jarrah. It’s a different game now.

     There’s no real divergence here.

     As the US debt level rises, economic damage there from the incompetent governance of the left deepens, military spending drops and their own hydrocarbons output soars, US interest in and ability to do anything about the middle east barbarians will collapse.

     The Russians know this.

     That is why they abandoned their previous model of Arab engagement. Rather than swooping in from the periphery to disable US power in the region, they are moving to take over the arbitrator role the Preshizzle’s (Paco™) incompetence has the US abandoning.

     So of course their previous allies have to be fully re-assessed. The nature of the game and all its rules have changed.

     As the USA abandons Israel, it becomes in need of strong replacement alliances externally. It has been an very good terms indeed with Russia before the Nasserite revolution, why not again?

     That deal is complex but quite do-able, Israel is supported by Russia and an Israeli sphere of influence defined, in return for which Russia gets to dominate the Gulf, and so takes full control over European energy supplies, and so dominates the continent.

     With nowhere else to go, Belarus and Ukraine fall deeper back in to the Russian Empire.

     I expect they will move to dominate Iran thoroughly, too.

     it’s perhaps unfortunate that the hydrocarbon revolution has co-incided with the spectacular incompetence of the Preshizzle (Paco™) and his left-wing idiocy.

     But that’s life.

     There’s a reason why Putin was so delighted with the Preshizzle’s (Paco™) re-election. It gives him a once in a century opportunity to dominate all of Europe.

     Why would he not take it?

     

     Mk50 of Brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 5:31 pm
548. Janet Daley Telegraph: America has become an Old World country
     The Gordon Brown vision of government as omnipotent benefactor is now the model in the US.

     So Europe got the American president it wanted – the one who would present no threat to its own delusions. The United States is now officially one of us: an Old World country complete with class hatred, ethnic Balkanisation, bourgeois guilt and a paternalist ruling elite. And it is locked into the same death spiral of high public spending and self-defeating wealth redistribution as we are. Welcome to the future, and the beginning of what may turn out to be the terminal decline of the West.

     

     JamesK

     15 Nov 12 at 5:38 pm
549. Winston, my point was that the use of electric cords would have been beyond the pale, even back in the dim, dark 1960s. I am pretty sure that if a boy at my school in Canberra had been beaten with such a thing, there would have been trouble. But, as I said, it was a day school.

     C.L. Yes. I can never take the Left seriously as moral exemplars, given their support for abortion.

     

     Julian O'Dea

     15 Nov 12 at 5:41 pm
550. “Hey Winston, that sounds a really terrible experience. Can’t imagine how you got through it, and you sound so nice and normal and loveable despite it all.”

     “Loveable”? Aaaaarghhhh!

     I don’t want to kiss him or nuffin like that but Winston Smith turned out alright in my book.

     It sounds like it was not real flash Winston, but you got back up and boxed on to better days and that alone is exceptional. Onya son, well done.

     

     Mick Gold Coast QLD

     15 Nov 12 at 5:50 pm
551. The United States is now officially one of us: an Old World country complete with class hatred, ethnic Balkanisation, bourgeois guilt and a paternalist ruling elite. And it is locked into the same death spiral of high public spending and self-defeating wealth redistribution as we are.

     Lefties are looking at this wondering why some people think it’s a bad thing.

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 5:52 pm
552. I don’t want to kiss him or nuffin like that but Winston Smith turned out alright in my book.

     Anyone who turns out a decent productive member of society when they have been told in their formative years they are worthless, mental and will amount to nothing deserves every bit of happiness this wretched planet can muster. And more.

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 5:55 pm
553. I think the no-marriage thing as a cause of child abuse is a bit of a furphy.

     I suspect what happens is that some men with a sexual interest in children may move into jobs or roles where they are available to be targetted – scouts, teaching, etc. It is the profession attracting the already deviant.

     I find it hard to believe that many clergy – at least those who are to be priests – enter the priesthood for this reason. (Maybe some brothers do, if they know they will be teaching.) But priests, at the start, would not know exactly what future they could find themselves in. Some may join as a way of hoping to deprive themselves of acting on homosexual attraction, although as Jarrah said, it has been convincingly shown by many studies that sexuality is not a determinant of child abuse.

     It is thus later in their clerical lives that the compulsory celibacy may have a significant role into leading them, in a search for “convenient” sexual outlet, not into some legitimate form of sexual relationship, but into opportunistic sex with the children they find within their reach.

     Thus, it is true that those who are “free to marry” will indeed still be well represented in child abusers, but compulsory celibacy very likely has a role in leading some into it who otherwise would not go there.

     

     steve from brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 5:56 pm
554. Oh no. SfB’s got his excuse to talk about perversion and deviancy.

     We’ll never shut the warped loon up now.

     

     Mk50 of Brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 6:13 pm
555. CL,, are you going to bathe and eat today or would that cause you to miss a vital rebuttal on Catallaxy?

     I can manage all three today, Monty.

     This is unrelated to your recent manic obsessiveness online.

     

     C.L.

     15 Nov 12 at 6:19 pm
556. Go away Fat Boy. Go hang around leftwing sites having discussions with Homer about all that’s bad with da Catallaxy…

     You super-sized 40 year old virgin.

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 6:22 pm
557. Steve from Brisbane Esq.

     Economist.

     Meterologist.

     Horologist.

     Phrenologist.

     ———————————————————————————————

     Bleedings Done.

     =================//====================

     Fortunes Told.

     5¢

     You missed

     Geologist

     Theologist.

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 6:24 pm
558. Hey Fat Boy,

     Before I forget, was there any more from you describing yourself as an “institutionalist” and that you don’t consider yourself neither right nor left.

     It actaully cracked me up.

     Can you also do more of that post-mordernist crap you went on about at the other site as that too gave me a laugh.

     You’re on the right track about being an institutionalist , Fat Boy. But my definition would differ from yours. You ought to be institutionalized, you super-sized idiot.

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 6:37 pm
559. Steve Malenga agrees with me. It was the lack of the white vote that did in Romney. 5 million of the fuckers chose not to turn up.

     http://www.city-journal.org/2012/eon1113sm.html

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 6:42 pm
560. Or are you saying they should have been held in detention in the crypt of St Mary’s?

     In my day that’s where the smokers absconded to during break time. Oh, that’s after they closed the 6th Form smoking room!

     

     Nic

     15 Nov 12 at 6:52 pm
561. Bobby Jindal rejects Romney’s “gifts” theory of why Americans voted Obama back in.

     “I don’t think that represents where we are as a party and where we’re going as a party,” he said. “That has got to be one of the most fundamental takeaways from this election: If we’re going to continue to be a competitive party and win elections on the national stage and continue to fight for our conservative principles, we need two messages to get out loudly and clearly: One, we are fighting for 100 percent of the votes, and secondly, our policies benefit every American who wants to pursue the American dream. Period. No exceptions.”

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 7:11 pm
562. Well he’s a GOP governor who is clearly wrong on all counts, Fat boy.

     Romney lost the lower income group, that is the group below 50K by a wide margin. In other words the gimmiethat culture is running rampant.

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 7:14 pm
563. “As the USA abandons Israel,”

     Are you on drugs? The USA’s support of Israel has not diminished.

     “(Paco™)”

     Isn’t Paco a Latino name? That doesn’t make any sense, even for this blog.

     

     Jarrah

     15 Nov 12 at 7:22 pm
564. Bullshit JC

     Romney lost the below 50k because they are paying the most percentage tax whilst pricks at the top use they Cayman islands to pay none.

     BS JC. The below 50K arent being looked after by conservatives in the US and you know it.

     

     Alice

     15 Nov 12 at 7:39 pm
565. JC says

     ”

     Steve Malenga agrees with me. It was the lack of the white vote that did in Romney. 5 million of the fuckers chose not to turn up.”

     and what that means folks is that 5 million white fuckers didnt like Romney.

     

     Alice

     15 Nov 12 at 7:41 pm
566. Stevie. Make dinner.

     

     Tiny Dancer

     15 Nov 12 at 7:44 pm
567. Alice baby.

     Any American holding a Cayman island account or doing transactions in the Cayman Islands is either dodging tax in which case they are committing a crime or they are simply doing what they are allowed to do, which is to hold assets offshore and report any income and pay the US tax as all US taxpayers are liable on their world wide income.

     Australians are able to do the same thing too by the way.

     If you look at the tax stats, people earning 50K are basically not paying any tax except FICA.

     In other words you’re talking out of your rear end again and it’s not a pretty sight.

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 7:45 pm
568. and what that means folks is that 5 million white fuckers didnt like Romney.

     They also didn’t like the Kenyan that much either.

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 7:46 pm
569. Tony Abbott has NO policies eh?
     ( for the Lab/Greens that didn’t get the email )

     We have the plans to double the small business growth rate and in so doing, see an additional 30,000 new businesses across Australia each year. We will:

     1. Scrap the carbon tax to reduce the sky-rocketing power costs small businesses have to pay with no compensation.

     2. Cut red tape by $1 billion each year and implement a comprehensive Deregulation Agenda.

     3. Reduce lawlessness in the workplace by re-establishing the Australian Building and Construction Commission.

     4. Build better infrastructure, with a special emphasis on reducing the bottlenecks on our gridlocked roads and highways.

     5. Simplify the administration of superannuation reporting, allowing small businesses to remit compulsory super payments for workers directly to the ATO, which would then have responsibility to distribute to individual superannuation funds.

     6. Establish a genuine root and branch review of competition laws, to ensure that small business can compete equally with big business.

     7. Support the rights of independent contractors and family businesses, by extending unfair contract protections to small business.

     8. Ease the paperwork burden by moving the administration of the national paid parental leave scheme from small businesses to the government’s Family Assistance Office.

     The Coalition’s priority will be to build a powerhouse economy through lower taxes, more efficient government and more productive businesses that will deliver more jobs, higher wages and better services for Australian families.

     Freeing up Australia’s 2 million small businesses by lowering tax, and cutting unnecessary burdens is part of the Coalition’s plan to deliver a strong and prosperous economy and a safe and secure Australia.

     Well, 7 are needed, and a good start.
     Number 8 is shite based on the ridiculous idea that paying people to NOT work and be productive(in an economic sense) is a positive.

     

     jumpnmcar

     15 Nov 12 at 7:51 pm
570. Yeah you are right on that JC. They didnt even like Obama enough to vote for him. 5 milliom shite fuckers so pissed off they didnt even vote.

     Something is very wrong in the land of “opportunity” splutter, cough.

     It couldnt be 3 deacdes of policies that screwed the middle and lower classes could it?

     Oh no. Lets not go there or Dot will arrive to tell me how beautiful the market is if you leave it alone.

     Bullshit it is.

     

     Alice

     15 Nov 12 at 7:51 pm
571. How were the lower and middle classes screwed?

     Explain it.

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 7:54 pm
572. “2. Cut red tape by $1 billion each year and implement a comprehensive Deregulation Agenda.”

     Great.

     “3. Reduce lawlessness in the workplace by re-establishing the Australian Building and Construction Commission.”

     Not great. Either have the rules apply to all, or none. Don’t revert to a commission that treats the building industry as a special and unique snowflake.

     “4. Build better infrastructure, with a special emphasis on reducing the bottlenecks on our gridlocked roads and highways.”

     The feds shouldn’t be involved in infrastructure at all.

     “6. Establish a genuine root and branch review of competition laws, to ensure that small business can compete equally with big business.”

     Uh oh. Sounds like intra-national protectionism to me.

     

     Jarrah

     15 Nov 12 at 7:56 pm
573. If anything this election proved Americans hated both parties. Shitloads of people stayed home. The welfare pimps got their whores to the polls slightly more successfully than the other statist losers.

     2016 will hopefully be leftard versus full blown Happy Warrior.

     

     Infidel Tiger

     15 Nov 12 at 7:56 pm
574. so sorry – said “shite fuckers” instead of “white fuckers” above and maybe shouldnt have swore but the whole of US politics has been captured by selfish interests in the same way that dirty skunks took over NSW labor party.

     Is this waht we really want as nations of people? Politicians that work for rent seekers? Well its here, now.

     No use playing the left versus the right like Quiggin and Sinc do. That stuff wont get us anywhere towards fixing it. We needto play “dirtbags” out and “honesty in government ” back in. WE cannot do that as a group of people, of any nation, by playing party politic (which is so divisive).

     Same in the US. We need a way to clear out the deadwood.

     

     Alice

     15 Nov 12 at 7:57 pm
575. I asked you a simple question, Alice

     Answer it.

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 7:59 pm
576. What was the simple question JC?

     Ill answer it

     

     Alice

     15 Nov 12 at 8:01 pm
577. At 7.54 Pm, you idiot.

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 8:02 pm
578. How were the lower and middle classes screwed?

     Explain it.

     The Lows can’t get a job under Obama so they literally steal from the Mids to survive.
     The Uppers have great security, and are safe, but Obama is standing in their way from employing the Lows.
     {That’s the way I see it, but I don’t follow it closely.}

     

     jumpnmcar

     15 Nov 12 at 8:03 pm
579. Jesus JC – I just noticed your question. How were the middle classes screwed?

     BECAUSE over the past thirty years it now takes MUM, DAD and the dig on the treadmill to pay the house mortgage and OUR friggin twenty year old are BLUDGING off us because they cant afford their education bill or rents

     I call that the middle classes being SCREWED. And no it didnt happen overnight, but it happened. Good hardworking middle class people SCREWED.

     

     Alice

     15 Nov 12 at 8:04 pm
580. MUM DAD and the DOG on the treadmill to pay the house mortagage.

     Thats how the middle classes goyt screwed, PLUS their kids dont leave home due to EDUCATION DEBTS.

     

     Alice

     15 Nov 12 at 8:06 pm
581. 2016 will hopefully be leftard versus full blown Happy Warrior.

     Ummm

     I hope you;re rigght. Free market policies are selling any more. It’s moocher mania around the west.

     I reckon we could see some really ugly times ahead and at the same time we may not see any resurgence of the free market right. We have perhaps 10 to 20 years of leftwing rule.

     The Kenyan should have been sent packing back to his village. The Lying Slapper ought to be facing criminal changes.

     The Kenyan won and the Slapper is within hitting distance of the Libs when in fact it ought to be a complete trouncing.

     It’s moocher mania all around the west.

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 8:06 pm
582. Looks like the Alan Jones boycott did have some short term effect on 2GB after all:

     The Macquarie Radio Network says it incurred losses of up to $1.5 million after broadcaster Alan Jones said the prime minister’s late father died of shame.

     Chairman Russell Tate said 15 advertisers had declared they would never again advertise with Sydney radio station 2GB, but it was impossible to assess the full impact of the episode on advertising revenue.

     

     Chris

     15 Nov 12 at 8:07 pm
583. oops aren’t selling

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 8:08 pm
584. Jarrah

     “3. Reduce lawlessness in the workplace by re-establishing the Australian Building and Construction Commission.”

     Not great. Either have the rules apply to all, or none. Don’t revert to a commission that treats the building industry as a special and unique snowflake.

     The employees have Fair Work Department, what do the employers have ?

     

     jumpnmcar

     15 Nov 12 at 8:08 pm
585. Chris

     If they have the ears then advertisers will show up. The composition just changes, that’s all.

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 8:10 pm
586. The employees have Fair Work Department, what do the employers have ?

     Nothing except threats.

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 8:12 pm
587. “4. Build better infrastructure, with a special emphasis on reducing the bottlenecks on our gridlocked roads and highways.”

     The feds shouldn’t be involved in infrastructure at all.

     Sorry dude, your gonna hafta splain that to me.
     School halls, NBN, Hi way one, Immigration hotels,………

     

     jumpnmcar

     15 Nov 12 at 8:14 pm
588. Kaboom. Lol

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 8:14 pm
589. JC says

     “its It’s moocher mania all around the west.”

     You got problems when the problems of the west start travelling to the north and east JC.
     Cant cry “westie moocher bludger” then can you?

     Real problems and this isnt moocher mania. Its about the middle classes getting screwed no matter who takes power and thats what is going on.

     Fucking givernments of both colours captured, ringed and capsicum sprayed, bribed and tasered by vested interest rich bludging subsidised rent seekers.

     Call it how it is JC or walk over the precipice with the lot of us and wear it.

     No way to run business. No way to run government and no way to run whole economies but its here and the only people that can change this, is the people who vote.

     

     Alice

     15 Nov 12 at 8:17 pm
590. Just tell me JC

     How the fuck did OBEID get so much power (the fucker) if things werent not already fucked in the land of OZ?

     

     Alice

     15 Nov 12 at 8:20 pm
591. JC
     How did many innocents ( 1 being a kid ) die in that*.?
     *( according to ABC radio )

     

     jumpnmcar

     15 Nov 12 at 8:20 pm
592. “3. Reduce lawlessness in the workplace by re-establishing the Australian Building and Construction Commission.”

     Not great. Either have the rules apply to all, or none. Don’t revert to a commission that treats the building industry as a special and unique snowflake.

     I agree. We need a federal body which covers all political and union corruption. The HSU scandal wasn’t in the building industry.

     

     2dogs

     15 Nov 12 at 8:20 pm
593. You answer my question JC.

     

     Alice

     15 Nov 12 at 8:20 pm
594. 2 dogs

     I agree

     “I agree. We need a federal body which covers all political and union corruption. The HSU scandal wasn’t in the building industry.”

     ALL political and ALL union and ALL public sector corruption and ALL Rserve Bank corruption.

     The foxes have over run the hen house.

     

     Alice

     15 Nov 12 at 8:23 pm
595. JC
     How did many innocents ( 1 being a kid ) die in that*.?
     *( according to ABC radio )

     They were obviously talking about the innocent jewish kids dying as a result of being under constant rocket attack.

     Oh hang on, not they weren’t.

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 8:28 pm
596. You answer my question JC.

     No. Shut up Alice. Go do the dishes or the ironing.

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 8:29 pm
597. “Sorry dude, your gonna hafta splain that to me.
     School halls, NBN, Hi way one, Immigration hotels,……”

     I think you answered your own question.

     

     Jarrah

     15 Nov 12 at 8:30 pm
598. If they have the ears then advertisers will show up. The composition just changes, that’s all.

     I think that’s pretty much true, but they did cop a short term revenue drop which will still hurt. And longer term if Alan Jones keeps putting his foot in it, companies will start factoring in the risk of getting caught up in another public boycott when deciding where to advertise (and how much they’re willing to pay).

     

     Chris

     15 Nov 12 at 8:31 pm
599. Cheryl Kernot carrying on like a senile aunty on the sherry on Sky news. She is atrocious.

     

     Tiny Dancer

     15 Nov 12 at 8:32 pm
600. Jarrah

     Paco.

     He invented the term ‘Preshizzle’ for the The Lightworker, The Healer of The Planet, The Obamessiah; AKA Preshizzle the Kenyan Incompetent. Hence the obvious.

     Like Kae, MareeS, Sgt Mom, Wronwright and many others, he’s from the Blairite community that disintegrated when he went pro some years back.

     

     Mk50 of Brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 8:35 pm
601. I saw that tool Mark Latham on YouTube the other day. He referred to ‘Tories’ and ‘the beltway’, UK and US borrowings favored by microcephalic Australians. Any Aussie who uses these terms is a dead shit. What next, referring unironically to the ALP as Stalinists?

     

     Abu Chowdah

     15 Nov 12 at 8:36 pm
602. How the fuck did OBEID get so much power (the fucker) if things werent not already fucked in the land of OZ?

     For over decade, the NSW ALP kneecapped ICAC. ICAC has a huge backlog to catch up on.

     

     2dogs

     15 Nov 12 at 8:36 pm
603. Obama won and democracy is safe for a few more years. Hooray! Rush Limbaugh and his idiotic rants about how responsible young women who use birth control are WHORES helped defeat Romney. Also all of the Republicans I know (the ones who had the bumper sticker that read — Anybody BUT Romney) need to stop complaining. They got what they asked for — someone who ISN’T Robot Romney. Romney would have trumped up some fake evidence and pre-emptively attacked Iran, putting us into another useless and expensive war.

     Isn’t it funny that no matter how many billions the Koch Brothers, Freis and Adelson spent to defeat Obama, no matter how much voter suppression was blatantly committed and no matter how the GOP didn’t even bother to hide the overt racism, Obama STILL won and not just the Electoral College vote, but the popular vote too.

     

     catnip

     15 Nov 12 at 8:36 pm
604. Good. Sell the thing at auction. Fuck’em. Leftists trying to avoid paying their debts.

     Argentine sailors, whose ship has been detained for more than a month in Ghana by a hedge fund seeking repayment of a debt, drew guns last Wednesday and threatened to shoot port workers attempting to move their Navy boat, according to a lawyer for the port.

     Argentina’s ARA Libertad, detained in Ghana, is at the center of a dispute over a $1.6 billion debt repayment.

     The drama was the latest twist in a bizarre debt-collection tale that began more than a decade ago, when Argentina defaulted on bonds.

     A big bondholder, NML Capital Ltd., has a court order saying it is still owed $1.6 billion. NML is owned by Paul Singer’s hedge-fund firm, Elliott Management Corp.

     In October, after the training ship sailed into Ghana, the crew was surprised by officials armed with a court order to detain the boat, on behalf of NML.

     “This is turning into an international disaster,” said Asare Darko, a lawyer for the Ghana Ports and Harbors Authority, which operates the Port of Tema, where the 113-yard-long tall ship is being held.

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 8:39 pm
605. Isn’t it funny that no matter how many billions the Koch Brothers, Freis and Adelson spent to defeat Obama, no matter how much voter suppression was blatantly committed and no matter how the GOP didn’t even bother to hide the overt racism,

     Lol.. quick call the police. Someone left the gates open at the lunatic asylum and the zombies are out in force.

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 8:42 pm
606. Is mAlice on the turps again?

     

     Mk50 of Brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 8:42 pm
607. Jarrah

     “Sorry dude, your gonna hafta splain that to me.
     School halls, NBN, Hi way one, Immigration hotels,……”

     I think you answered your own question.

     Oh yeh, goodyo.
     But when you say;

     The feds shouldn’t be involved in infrastructure at all.

     That surprised me, ok.

     

     jumpnmcar

     15 Nov 12 at 8:44 pm
608. Whatever you do, don’t let on to Catpiss that this is an Australian blog, m’kay?

     Let’s see how long the idiot takes to realise it.

     Now, to the Lying Slapper. Anyone reckon that Wilson’s $5K actually did come from his or Tony the Greek’s casino winnings?

     

     Mk50 of Brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 8:45 pm
609. Isn’t it funny

     Oy vey, the stupid is strong in this one.

     

     lotocoti

     15 Nov 12 at 8:47 pm
610. She’s a commissioned warship. The effort to seize her is an act of war.

     Who will win the Great Argentine-Ghanaian War of 2012?

     

     Mk50 of Brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 8:47 pm
611. Kaboom. Lol

     That’s a really bad commute.

     

     C.L.

     15 Nov 12 at 8:51 pm
612. Not for any civilised man, CL…

     

     Mk50 of Brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 8:53 pm
613. The more they murder, the deeper hole the Zionists dig for themselves. Kissinger recently mused that Israhell would be gone from the map in 20 years. I wouldn’t give it even half that time. In fact, if the outcome of the onrushing Civil War II in America is what I think it’s going to be – a complete overthrow of the current DemoncratRepublicrap Z.O.G. – it’ll blow away then and there. Only question is how many lives the Samson Option regime will take down with it.

     

     catnip

     15 Nov 12 at 8:55 pm
614. catnip, I think you have been at the catnip.

     

     Julian O'Dea

     15 Nov 12 at 8:59 pm
615. Pathetic. It’s like very primitive all-spectrum jamming, isn’t it?

     All-spectrum trolling. What a retard….

     The Obeid thing really is an insight into the corrupt heart of NSW ALP. Obviously, a RC is needed.

     

     Mk50 of Brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 9:01 pm
616. That’s a really bad commute.

     It’s certainly a one way commute. That fucker isn’t going back to the office in hurry.

     ————–
     catnip,

     You gotta be from the west coast, right?

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 9:03 pm
617. Kissinger

     He still around? I thought he was dead.

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 9:04 pm
618. Petraeus was very good at exercise to keep his body fabulous and Broadwell’s was happy to report his dictum’s quite mirabilus.

     

     catnip

     15 Nov 12 at 9:06 pm
619. Oh. It’s Scrappy’s sock puppet.

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 9:07 pm
620. Yeah 2 dogs

     Kneecapping the ICAC – do you think a change of party will fix this? The libs want a kneecapped government and labour wants a kneecapped government agency (ICAC).

     Either way you look at it I still pay my fucking taxes for thieves to steal it NO MATTER who is at the helm.

     Both parties want ICAC kneecapped. One party wants it because its mentally unsound (and they look after rich pricks who want to avoid their fair share of taxes) and that party is committed to tiny shrunken pathetic governments who dont have the resources to chase crooks.

     The other party (no names just guess) isnt viable because they are a bunch of crooks and criminals inherently (who never go to jail) and dont want ICAC after them, to chase themselves.

     Am I any better off as a taxpayer? Really?

     Under either party?

     NO WAY.

     

     Alice

     15 Nov 12 at 9:08 pm
621. “This is turning into an international disaster,” said Asare Darko, a lawyer for the Ghana Ports and Harbors Authority.
     Now that’s a name to conjure up a welcome to country with. Not much of a welcome for the sail training ship though.

     

     blogstrop

     15 Nov 12 at 9:12 pm
622. Broadwell earned her place in history. An “author” with two arms of rock pandered to a paragon and rode him to advance her stock. In short, in matters sexual, professional, political, Broadwell, a machine-gun model, loved her four-star general.

     

     catnip

     15 Nov 12 at 9:14 pm
623. Just as Gillard owns Slipper, all these dregs belong you, Sinc. I’ll pass on the catnip and take a break for book and a longnap.

     

     blogstrop

     15 Nov 12 at 9:17 pm
624. Go mow the lawn JC or chnage the oil in the car and polish it. Make yourself useful. Dont you tell me to do the dishes.

     Do your own dishes you old dinosaur.

     Dont mind telling an old dinosaur what to do, The idea is keep it simple and give them instructions they can follow (I reckon JC is a 50s 60s vintage just by the way he still likes to think he can give orders to women to go do the dishes).

     Go on KC admit it. You cant and you never have been able to give orders to women that they followed every time, but you keep trying anyway.

     I may just have a soft spot for guys (dinosaurs) like you…

     

     Alice

     15 Nov 12 at 9:17 pm
625. Am I any better off as a taxpayer? Really?

     Under either party?

     NO WAY.

     I think WASTED taxpayers dollar has a bit to do with it Alice.
     Who do you think, ALP or Lib/Nat, waste more?
     I’d be surprised if you answered same/same.

     

     jumpnmcar

     15 Nov 12 at 9:18 pm
626. I may just have a soft spot for guys (dinosaurs) like you…

     Of course you do.

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 9:20 pm
627. Gawd, mAlice, you are a thickie F.U.N. JC’s been saying that to SfB for yonks

     

     Mk50 of Brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 9:20 pm
628. same/same

     Im ;prepared to vote Nats bigtime – Ive had a gutful of lib and labor.

     What the hell? I just dont know anymore. They all rob me and give nothing back and sit around inventing new ways to rob (how clever – lets make the RTA trun a profit, lets lake police checks mandatory on all new staff you hire at $50 a head payable to the government, – not just me but small . medim / latge businesses as well.

     Theiving shitheads.

     The government is in like flynn now for every $50 charge these pathetic buggers in governments and the public service can invent.

     WTF do I pay taxes for??. They add premium fees on top.

     

     Alice

     15 Nov 12 at 9:26 pm
629. MK 50 Ive never known you to string more than five words at once.

     I think I know who the thickie is.

     

     Alice

     15 Nov 12 at 9:28 pm
630. JC

     of coourse I do.

     I understand your type.

     I have one of my own just like you.

     

     Alice

     15 Nov 12 at 9:30 pm
631. This is on email I received from a broker. It’s a large international I-bank.

     He didn’t write it. It’s automatically generated when someone from that bucket shop sends an email.

     I’m fucking banning any brokerage with them until well into next year.

     Just look at the crazy shit large corporations get up to.

     Be carbon conscious. Please consider our environment before printing this email.

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 9:30 pm
632. Just been bouncing through Bris lately Markl. Mid dec have three days. Lets get on the piss.

     

     Pickles

     15 Nov 12 at 9:30 pm
633. Lets get on the piss.

     I’m there!

     

     Tom

     15 Nov 12 at 9:34 pm
634. But we don’t know where we’re going yet.

     

     Pickles

     15 Nov 12 at 9:36 pm
635. Damn moths! I really hate daylight saving.

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 9:38 pm
636. Beware the FBI they think there’s something wrong in every residence and copy every data stream and treat it all as evidence.

     

     catnip

     15 Nov 12 at 9:40 pm
637. KC says large international bank puts on email

     “Be carbon conscious. Please consider our environment before printing this email.”

     Like they considered it beyond getting their ad agency to add a line to their emnail. Utter crap. Id ban them too.

     

     Alice

     15 Nov 12 at 9:40 pm
638. Catnip

     What is the name of the mental asylum you’re residing in?

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 9:43 pm
639. Alice

     Im ;prepared to vote Nats bigtime – Ive had a gutful of lib and labor.

     I’m a Nat man myself, and they partnered with the Libs, a competent manager.
     As for Labor partnering with green, fucken hopeless.
     As a Nat, the greens are cancer.

     

     jumpnmcar

     15 Nov 12 at 9:43 pm
640. Voter fraud in the US? No course not.

     Voter Fraud: Democrats say America doesn’t need voter identification laws because there’s no evidence of election cheating. But when a candidate doesn’t get a single vote in 59 precincts, you’ve got to wonder.

     One candidate did just that last week in Philadelphia, where Mitt Romney was shut out 19,605-0 in 59 voting divisions.

     Read More At IBD: http://news.investors.com/ibd-editorials/111312-633313-voter-fraud-is-a-problem.htm#ixzz2CHq6GSDS

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 9:43 pm
641. There! What days? Dec is looking good.

     

     Mk50 of Brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 9:44 pm
642. Somewhere with cheap beer and lots of it?

     This could get fkn ugly….

     

     Mk50 of Brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 9:46 pm
643. BECAUSE over the past thirty years it now takes MUM, DAD and the dig on the treadmill to pay the house mortgage and OUR friggin twenty year old are BLUDGING off us because they cant afford their education bill or rents

     What crap Alice. 30 year mortgages have been around for over a hundred years. You have done very well if you paid a home off any earlier.

     And as for your bludging twenty year old living at home, you must have a real bludger if they can’t at least pay you board. Is your child the same cretin you were complaining about the other night with the dog? As sinc said keep the dog, evict the son.

     My daughter left home at 19, goes to uni, shares a rent house and works part time. It was her choice to fly the coup and she also has savings all through her own efforts since she was 15.

     If you have a bludging 20 year old it’s self inflicted.

     

     Splatacrobat

     15 Nov 12 at 9:49 pm
644. 15th or so. Somewhere in town.

     

     Pickles

     15 Nov 12 at 9:50 pm
645. Good. Sounds like a plan. Coordinate thru Kae (we can pay her in rum)

     

     Mk50 of Brisbane

     15 Nov 12 at 9:55 pm
646. FBI sezs:

     Patrolling all of cyberspace with fiber-optic lariats,
     we’ve built a pattern for you that includes all random variates. We’ve got in place behavioral space that we get all synoptic on consisting of all patterns in our limitless panopticon. Your ISP is A-OK with giving aid unwarranted.

     Who knows what quo you’ll bestow on them for this abhorrent quid.

     

     catnip

     15 Nov 12 at 9:57 pm
647. JC – a very similar thing happened to McCain in 2008. Those precincts are pretty much black neighbourhoods.
     It does warrant investigation, and there has been some research done into why this might occur.

     http://articles.philly.com/2012-11-13/news/35069785_1_romney-supporters-mitt-romney-voter-id-law

     http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/politics/2012/11/philadelphia_voter_fraud_is_it_possible_that_barack_obama_won_100_percent.html

     That being said, perhaps having an independent electoral organisation like Australia which standardises voting standards and procedures across the nation would be better than electing partisan individuals who try to skew elections to their advantage?

     

     Chris

     15 Nov 12 at 9:58 pm
648. Europe officially in recession again.

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 10:02 pm
649. Chris

     Still, was there not one contrarian voter in those 59 divisions, where unofficial vote tallies have President Obama outscoring Romney by a combined 19,605 to 0?

     That’s pretty much impossible. If there are that many Demorat supporters voting in those precedents, at least 30% would end up voting incorrectly.

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 10:06 pm
650. “It’s possible that 5 million or more eligible whites didn’t vote, perhaps because of a lack of enthusiasm for either candidate.”

     JC, even though others have laughed at the idea, I believe that Romney went too far to the Left, trying to catch votes. But he lost 3 Right votes for every Left vote he got. This cost him too much.
     Therefore, he needs to swing Right to pick up the votes he lost.
     Happy to argue this point out.

     

     Winston Smith

     15 Nov 12 at 10:08 pm
651. Europe officially in recession again.

     Ummm no it isn’t “officially”, you idiot.

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 10:08 pm
652. I dunno Winston. US elections have always been really hard for me to get a firm grip on.

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 10:10 pm
653. Did anyone read today about the Green River Formation, in the US west, that may contain three times the total oil that mankind has ever used in the past?

     But SFB and M0nty believe that Obama is going to out himself as a Climate Change Warrior.

     L

     O

     L

     

     James in Melbourne

     15 Nov 12 at 10:12 pm
654. Can you link that pls James?

     

     Pickles

     15 Nov 12 at 10:16 pm
655. Here ya go Pickles.
     The kicker? Most of it is on Federal Land. I cannot imagine the EPA allowing this to come to fruition.

     

     Winston Smith

     15 Nov 12 at 10:27 pm
656. Ummm no it isn’t “officially”, you idiot.

     You don’t subscribe to the definition as two quarters of negative growth? The rest of the world seems to.

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 10:29 pm
657. Thanks Winston. Just saw one that said at present cost not viable but there was a vast amount there. Saw a core sample from near Alice the other day that looked like it had been pulled out of a vat of chip fat.

     

     Pickles

     15 Nov 12 at 10:33 pm
658. Bullshit JC

     Romney lost the below 50k because they are paying the most percentage tax whilst pricks at the top use they Cayman islands to pay none.

     This is degenerate lunacy.

     

     .

     15 Nov 12 at 10:35 pm
659. Did anyone read today about the Green River Formation, in the US west, that may contain three times the total oil that mankind has ever used in the past?

     But SFB and M0nty believe that Obama is going to out himself as a Climate Change Warrior.

     L

     O

     L

     James in Melbourne
     15 Nov 12 at 10:12 pm

     Here ya go Pickles.

     http://www.thenewamerican.com/tech/energy/item/11387-the-green-river-formation-worlds-largest-oil-shale-deposits

     The kicker? Most of it is on Federal Land. I cannot imagine the EPA allowing this to come to fruition.

     Winston Smith
     15 Nov 12 at 10:27 pm

     Basically this is why Romney should have won. For the sake of prosperity.

     Would anyone like to further defend the ridiculous “Peak Oil” theory?

     

     .

     15 Nov 12 at 10:39 pm
660. “Peak Oil” theory?

     Hopefully America has at least reached Peak Stupid.

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 10:43 pm
661. How were the lower and middle classes screwed?

     Explain it.

     Remember that Obama aligned economist produced a bogus report about real wages being stagnant for 30 years. THEN IT TURNED OUT IT WASN’T TRUE – Alice subscribes to the bullshit numbers that Prof. Whackjob cooked up to support The One.

     

     .

     15 Nov 12 at 10:44 pm
662. 1. Scrap the carbon tax to reduce the sky-rocketing power costs small businesses have to pay with no compensation.

     2. Cut red tape by $1 billion each year and implement a comprehensive Deregulation Agenda.

     3. Reduce lawlessness in the workplace by re-establishing the Australian Building and Construction Commission.

     4. Build better infrastructure, with a special emphasis on reducing the bottlenecks on our gridlocked roads and highways.

     5. Simplify the administration of superannuation reporting, allowing small businesses to remit compulsory super payments for workers directly to the ATO, which would then have responsibility to distribute to individual superannuation funds.

     6. Establish a genuine root and branch review of competition laws, to ensure that small business can compete equally with big business.

     7. Support the rights of independent contractors and family businesses, by extending unfair contract protections to small business.

     8. Ease the paperwork burden by moving the administration of the national paid parental leave scheme from small businesses to the government’s Family Assistance Office.

     All but 4. is excellent but 4. can be considered a matter of having a competent administration which lives within its means.

     The Coalition has policies. The truth of the matter is the ALP have no policies, save for Rudd’s motherhood statements from 2007 which have been abandoned or bastardised. Their only policy now is to poison political waterholes.

     

     .

     15 Nov 12 at 10:46 pm
663. Did anyone read today about the Green River Formation, in the US west, that may contain three times the total oil that mankind has ever used in the past?

     Steady on there, cowboy.

     This tantalizing bonanza, however, remains just out of reach, at least for now. The cost of extracting the Green River oil at the moment would be higher than what it could be sold for. And there are significant environmental obstacles.

     The operation might require so much water it would compete with Denver and agriculture for vital supplies, the GAO report warned, could pollute underground streams, affect fish and other wildlife, and kick up so much dirt it would leave national monuments in a cloud of dust.

     Even putting aside the environmental concerns, it requires the price of oil to be much higher than it is now to be worthwhile to start extracting and heating shale. So it’s not really a positive story for the economy. More of a “break glass in case of emergency” kind of deal.

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 10:47 pm
664. Fancy being so obsessed with your opposition that you feature the opposition leader on your Christmas Party invitation!

     And not in a nice way, of course.

     Imagine if the liberals had no class, like Labor, and did something similar with gillard on their card? You could hear the shrieks of “MISOGYNIST” from Hades.

     http://www.michaelsmithnews.com/2012/11/christmas-party-mcternan-style.html

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 10:47 pm
665. Would anyone like to further defend the ridiculous “Peak Oil” theory?

     You realize it’s the very same bozos that accuse anyone of doubting glimate change as being da niilists.

     I’d bet you 50 bucks that

     Stepford the househusband, Fat boy, Bob E, Wadej, steve C (Kimberely the plastic sex doll’s owner)… who am I missing? All these fuckers would have been peak oilers/Energy in their time.

     It’s funny when you think about it. The morons were peddling two theories at odds with one another. If we were going to run out of hydrocarbons then why the fear that one day not in the distant future you’d find sea water swirling around your bed one morning.

     Stepford was thinking of moving home to higher ground at one stage. These morons should be whipped in the public to within an inch of their fucking lives. whipped and then thrown into a dungeon… (no Fat boy, you won’t get any Krispy Kremes in there).

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 10:49 pm
666. Even putting aside the environmental concerns, it requires the price of oil to be much higher than it is now to be worthwhile to start extracting and heating shale. So it’s not really a positive story for the economy. More of a “break glass in case of emergency” kind of deal.

     Fuck, you’re dumb Fat Boy. You really are stupid.

     A price rise is no biggie if coupled with higher efficiency over time.

     Furthermore, if that blurb is accurate which I very much doubt the cost is directly related to potentially new technology that is found.

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 10:53 pm
667. Geoffrey Robertson was bloviating on Lateline just now. The pretext for inviting on what Israel’s cheek in targeting Hamas without getting UN permission.

     He said that Israel’s expected attack on Iranian nuclear facilities next year after Benjamin Netanyahu’s election will be “unlawful”.

     He said that Iran’s nuclear ambitions started “of course” with the former Shah!

     That suggestion marked the point at which I could no longer tolerate this ridiculous buffoon any longer.

     Why is Lateline interviewing a supercilious Australian barrister practising in London on the subject of the Middle East?

     

     JamesK

     15 Nov 12 at 11:06 pm
668. The pretext for inviting him on was Israel’s..

     

     JamesK

     15 Nov 12 at 11:07 pm
669. It’s not very long ago holes had to be drilled pretty straight. Now you can bend the bit a fair bit. Coupled with computing power to hit the target it gets a bit easier and cheaper to get at. Technology can help engineering problems but the whole marketing caper is a different animal. And then there’s the political..

     

     Pickles

     15 Nov 12 at 11:09 pm
670. The pretext for inviting on what Israel’s cheek in targeting Hamas without getting UN permission.

     Hang on, Hams started this latest round over the weekend when they sent rockets into Israel – did they get permission from the UN? Pfft.

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 11:10 pm
671. the GAO report warned, could pollute underground streams, affect fish and other wildlife, and kick up so much dirt it would leave national monuments in a cloud of dust.

     Oh no Consuela hasn’t polished Mt Rushmore with Mr Sheen.

     

     .

     15 Nov 12 at 11:11 pm
672. Even putting aside the environmental concerns, it requires the price of oil to be much higher than it is now to be worthwhile to start extracting and heating shale

     Horizontal drilling and fracking is relatively cheap.

     Oil extraction from shale sand is also viable as Canada demonstrates in high volume.

     

     JamesK

     15 Nov 12 at 11:13 pm
673. LAUDERHILL, Fla. (WSVN) — Nearly a thousand ballots that were not included in Florida’s final count have been found in a warehouse in Broward County.

     Tuesday morning and into the night, there was a buzz of activity at the Voting Equipment Center in Lauderhill, a week after the general election. There was a recount going on for two commission seats that were too close to call, one in Hallandale Beach and another in Dania Beach. Workers had to count those votes manually.

     Also keeping elections officials busy is the fact that 963 filled ballots were found in a warehouse. The supervisor of elections, Dr. Brenda Snipes, said this happens all the time, especially when dealing with paper ballots. Her department is not the only one to have seen more ballots added to the final number after the election, and they have until Nov. 18 to certify all the votes.

     It happens all the time. No worries.

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 11:18 pm
674. On a musical note – a follow-up to last night’s discussions on the ‘$5k In a Brown Bag’ thread (I didn’t have to work tonight so have done some research).

     Carpe –
     Kyary Pamyu Pamyu. Kusume Koharu, Kirarin Revolution, AKB48

     DaveF –
     Nomoto Karia

     These J pop girls are all excellent, but I’d find it diffucult to concentrate on work while listening to them. Nomoto Karia reminds me of a young lady who gave us directions to the Kibuki Theatre in Tokyo.
     Makes me want to get on another JAL flight as soon as possible.

     DaveF –
     Jack Johnson is very good … easy listening … a bit like John Mayer.

     Lloyd –
     Kenny G …. Unnggghh ….. Agreed.

     MK50 –
     Avantasia’s The Scarecrow . prob not for me.
     Sinisterite (Doom Thrash)… I would listen to in the car on my own.
     Oldfield’s Tubular Bells … part 1 is a bit ‘Exorcist Theme’ … part ii I think I prefer David Gilmour.
     Edwardian Woodward! Heh, he was a good actor, but this album needs ….Rule Three Oh Three!
     Seventh Angel’s ‘Lament for the Weary?’ … ok, but not quite enough like Pink Floyd for me.

     Dot –
     Lionel Ritchie, Prince, Billy Ocean and Luther Vandross were all better and more talented than MJ and had better artistic output. ..
     Could be right … I don’t have any of their work though or MJ’s (Michael Jackson?).

     Kae –
     several Janis Ian albums ….
     I only have ‘Between the Lines’ – bought it after seeing her on Live at the Basement about 2 years ago… great story teller, have to look at her other albums
     Everyone’s less crazy than MJ …
     yep. I’ve been, twice, to the graveyard in Coconut Grove (Miami) where he made the Thriller video,

     Thanks all

     

     Septimus

     15 Nov 12 at 11:20 pm
675. Why is Lateline interviewing a supercilious Australian barrister practising in London on the subject of the Middle East?

     Der.. Is the Pope a pedophile?

     But in the spirit of the cultural cringe Robertson brings pomposity to a new level. But perhaps unmatched by his attention seeking, vacuous wife. The Labour Luvvies in the UK adore them, don’t you know..

     

     Lazlo

     15 Nov 12 at 11:22 pm
676. A price rise is no biggie if coupled with higher efficiency over time.

     JC the financial whiz reckons doubling the price of oil would be “no biggie” for the world economy.

     You are a 100% Colombian grade moron.

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 11:22 pm
677. Please let us know about the successful private enterprises you have run mont. Just one will do..

     You wouldn’t know what to do if your arse was on fire, tax-payer funded parasite.

     

     Lazlo

     15 Nov 12 at 11:25 pm
678. Horizontal drilling and fracking is relatively cheap.

     Oil extraction from shale sand is also viable as Canada demonstrates in high volume.

     Obviously you failed to read the link, JamesK. The Green River reserves do not require fracking.

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 11:27 pm
679. Please let us know about the successful private enterprises you have run mont. Just one will do..

     I run a Web site which is top 500 in Australia for traffic during winter months. Thanks Lazlo.

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 11:28 pm
680. Salazar:

     “If you set me up like this again, I’ll punch you out.”

     What is it with the Left and violence?

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 11:29 pm
681. Yes, I am getting more punchy.

     I am sick of these conceited pricks who have no idea how the comfort they enjoy comes into being. Spoiled brats.

     

     Lazlo

     15 Nov 12 at 11:30 pm
682. Pickles, you in Brisbane tomorrow?

     

     Tiny Dancer

     15 Nov 12 at 11:30 pm
683. top 500 in Australia for traffic during winter months.

     Guffaw! That is your sole source of income then?

     

     Lazlo

     15 Nov 12 at 11:31 pm
684. If it was top 400 you would be saying so

     

     Lazlo

     15 Nov 12 at 11:33 pm
685. JC the financial whiz reckons doubling the price of oil would be “no biggie” for the world economy.

     You are a 100% Colombian grade moron.

     Stay off the krispy Kremes and concentrate, Fat Boy. What I said:

     A price rise is no biggie if coupled with higher efficiency over time.

     You shouldn’t be posting here Fat boy as you’re both a grade A moron and liar.

     It’s so pathetic that you have to resort to this level of dishonesty. You ought to be refused food for an hour.

     And WTF is Colombian have to do with anything? LOL

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 11:33 pm
686. In all seasons

     

     Lazlo

     15 Nov 12 at 11:34 pm
687. A price rise is no biggie if coupled with higher efficiency over time.

     JC the financial whiz reckons doubling the price of oil would be “no biggie” for the world economy.

     You are a 100% Colombian grade moron

     He did not say that. He is saying it will happen even without the price rise as efficiencies in production improve – the price rise would just make it more attractive. He was commenting about the costs and rate of return on shale etc, not global industrial output.

     Stop being a tit, monty.

     

     .

     15 Nov 12 at 11:34 pm
688. You are a 100% Colombian grade moron.

     Fat boy may as well have said… Thai, or Solomon Islander….

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 11:35 pm
689. Oh dear. You are not Lambert, are you?

     

     Lazlo

     15 Nov 12 at 11:36 pm
690. I don’t think many will be rejoicing when oil hits a permanent new baseline price of $200 a barrel, and the Green River reserves are finally economic. That would mean some horrible things for a world economy which up until 9/11 (70s crisis notwithstanding) enjoyed oil at $30.

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 11:37 pm
691. Guffaw! That is your sole source of income then?

     Yep, and a good living it is too for only working a quarter of a job.

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 11:38 pm
692. The IDF just took over Lateline.

     

     Scapula

     15 Nov 12 at 11:38 pm
693. Yep, and a good living it is too for only working a quarter of a job.

     You are lying.

     

     Lazlo

     15 Nov 12 at 11:39 pm
694. He did not say that. He is saying it will happen even without the price rise as efficiencies in production improve – the price rise would just make it more attractive. He was commenting about the costs and rate of return on shale etc, not global industrial output.

     Right, Dot, so he was engaging in handwaving, hoping that imaginary science would save his point. Funny how often that happens with you lot.

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 11:40 pm
695. The IDF just took over Lateline.

     Now, a simple question for the simple minded:

     Who started firing rockets at civilians in another country recently: Israel or Hamas?

     

     Lazlo

     15 Nov 12 at 11:42 pm
696. Fat boy may as well have said… Thai, or Solomon Islander….

     You lot need to update your cultural reference libraries.

     Blow is a 2001 film about an American cocaine smuggler. It is based on the real-life story of George Jung, Pablo Escobar, Carlos Lehder and the Medellín Cartel.

     This is grade A, 100% pure Colombian cocaine, ladies and gentlemen. Disco shit. Pure as the driven snow.

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 11:43 pm
697. You are lying.

     Nup!

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 11:43 pm
698. Nup!

     Give me the link then. Share it with the community here, or give it to me privately. I know a lot about web sites that don’t make money.

     

     Lazlo

     15 Nov 12 at 11:46 pm
699. JC – wash your mouth with soap.
     M0nty – say it ain’t true.

     Nobody eats krispy creme

     

     Sinclair Davidson

     15 Nov 12 at 11:46 pm
700. I can’t see that any Palestinian point of view was sort on the violence, so much for balance!

     

     Scapula

     15 Nov 12 at 11:48 pm
701. Sinc

     Monster does by the dozen in one shot. Tell him Monst. Set him straight.

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 11:49 pm
702. sorry ‘sought on the violence’

     

     Scapula

     15 Nov 12 at 11:49 pm
703. I can’t see that any Palestinian point of view was sort on the violence, so much for balance!

     like the dozens of rockets fired into Israel by the day? I wish you were on the pointy end of one of those Bob. You sure change your need to hear a pali point of view then , hey you appalling fool.

     

     JC

     15 Nov 12 at 11:52 pm
704. catnip’s sock puppet returns.

     

     Gab

     15 Nov 12 at 11:52 pm
705. Give me the link then. Share it with the community here, or give it to me privately. I know a lot about web sites that don’t make money.

     Google my name, it will appear soon enough.

     

     m0nty

     15 Nov 12 at 11:54 pm
706. I can’t see that any Palestinian point of view was sort on the violence, so much for balance!

     Because the fascist Hamas do not allow access to western media. They are attempting to turn Gaza into a Taliban state. They have no interest in cultivating communication with decadent western leftists like yourself. You are just a useful idiot.

     

     Lazlo

     15 Nov 12 at 11:57 pm
707. Oh for goodness sake. Here, Lazlo.

     

     Gab

     16 Nov 12 at 12:00 am
708. M0nty – say it ain’t true.

     Nobody eats krispy creme

     I hate donuts, and haven’t ever tried one of those. JC is just being childish and boorish, as usual.

     

     m0nty

     16 Nov 12 at 12:00 am
709. …targeting Hamas without getting UN permission.

     LOL. Riiiight.

     

     C.L.

     16 Nov 12 at 12:01 am
710. Google my name, it will appear soon enough.

     Done that. Nothing. Unless you were part of Monty Python (you weren’t) or Alamein (you weren’t).

     Nothing else in sight. You are off the radar, except in your own mind.

     

     Lazlo

     16 Nov 12 at 12:02 am
711. You were obviously typing the letter O rather than the number 0, Lazlo.

     

     m0nty

     16 Nov 12 at 12:03 am
712. lazlo

     It’s monty with a zero as in M0nty

     This is him.

     This is him playing golf.
     

     

     JC

     16 Nov 12 at 12:04 am
713. Lazlo

     I provided the link for you above.

     

     Gab

     16 Nov 12 at 12:05 am
714. Oh for goodness sake. Here, Lazlo.

     Oh Dear Gab. I am out of touch, mea culpa. Thanks (I think..)

     I guess those of us not from Victoria have a problem with keeping up..

     

     Lazlo

     16 Nov 12 at 12:06 am
715. And here ends today’s lesson in Catallaxy Creepy Online Stalking 101.

     

     m0nty

     16 Nov 12 at 12:08 am
716. Hey mOnty: if you want to see a Tea Party type nearly exploding with rage and hyperbole over the “this is the end of America/socialist disaster” of the Obama re-election, have a look at the first Bill Whittle video made since Obama’s re-election.

     I am reminded of Dr Smith: “Oh the pain! The pain!”

     

     steve from brisbane

     16 Nov 12 at 12:08 am
717. Sorry. m0nty. (I can never remember if it’s a zero or not.)

     

     steve from brisbane

     16 Nov 12 at 12:10 am
718. Lazlo

     lol I knew there was going to be lots of tooing and froing with monty being characteristically snarky and deliberately not providing a link to his Most Famous Site in Australia.

     

     Gab

     16 Nov 12 at 12:10 am
719. We had the IDF on their evil-doings in the ghetto and Robertson leading the war party on Iran (and the Roman Catholic Church) from a human rights point of view.

     Pretty much right wing propaganda all night, although I can see why you might think otherwise given that the interviewer feels some sort of professional duty to ask critical questions as a balance, but there are no alternative viewpoints.

     

     Scapula

     16 Nov 12 at 12:12 am
720. Some nice pictures M0nty.

     

     Splatacrobat

     16 Nov 12 at 12:12 am
721. Voter Cries Over WI Recall: Signaling Death Of Democracy, ‘End Of USA As We Know It’

     

     Gab

     16 Nov 12 at 12:14 am
722. The cause of the Israeli ghetto war seems to be the imminent vote on state observer status for Palestine in the General Assembly.

     

     Scapula

     16 Nov 12 at 12:14 am
723. Basically Monty is a capitalist. He owns the means of production—his intellectual property—and from that he extracts a full time salary while doing no real work. He is clearly exploiting the proletariat.

     Fantasy football should be nationalized. Either that or banned. It is clearly a pointless activity.

     

     Dangph

     16 Nov 12 at 12:19 am
724. I am reminded of Dr Smith: “Oh the pain! The pain!”

     Derangement syndrome in full throaty battle cry, Steve. The Tolkien quote to finish with was fitting, seeing as the rest was pure fantasy.

     

     m0nty

     16 Nov 12 at 12:20 am
725. iPod time!

     She never compromises,
     Loves babies and surprises,
     wears high heels when she exercises -
     Ain’t it beautiful?

     

     sdog

     16 Nov 12 at 12:21 am
726. Basically Monty is a capitalist. He owns the means of production—his intellectual property—and from that he extracts a full time salary while doing no real work. He is clearly exploiting the proletariat.

     But I have no employees. I am exploiting myself! Down with me! Burn me down!

     

     m0nty

     16 Nov 12 at 12:22 am
727. But I have no employees. I am exploiting myself!

     You are exploiting your customers. Based on the labour theory of value, you are overcharging them. If fantasy football were nationalized, evil capitalists like you wouldn’t be able to get away with that sort of thing.

     

     Dangph

     16 Nov 12 at 12:26 am
728. Israel killed its main ally and ceasefire negotiator, Jabari, in launching its attack:

     Ahmed Jabari was a subcontractor, in charge of maintaining Israel’s security in Gaza. This title will no doubt sound absurd to anyone who in the past several hours has heard Jabari described as “an arch-terrorist,” “the terror chief of staff” or “our Bin Laden.”

     Haaretz

     

     Scapula

     16 Nov 12 at 12:26 am
729. There is no way that he is making any serious, life supporting money out of that site.. He is leaching off the public tit somewhere.

     

     Lazlo

     16 Nov 12 at 12:28 am
730. You are exploiting your customers. Based on the labour theory of value, you are overcharging them. If fantasy football were nationalized, evil capitalists like you wouldn’t be able to get away with that sort of thing.

     Not quite. It has taken eight years of work to get to the happy position I am in today. If anything, I think I’m underpaid for all the years I lived like a churchmouse while getting my startup off the ground.

     

     m0nty

     16 Nov 12 at 12:30 am
731. “Kneecapping the ICAC – do you think a change of party will fix this?”

     A change of party has fixed this – Obeid is being investigated now. It was the Libs that set up ICAC originally and the Libs which revitalised after regaining power last year.

     The Lib and ALP party organisations differ in their constitutional arrangements. A big difference is that the Libs have a mechanism for cleaning out corruption through disciplinary measures. Any such power within the ALP to discipline would quickly fall under factional control, and then be subject to the factional power games and useless for its proper function.

     This means that while both the Libs and the ALP can acquire corrupt members, only the Libs can deal with theirs.

     Slipper quit the Libs when the party was starting these procedures against him.

     I constantly hear the argument that “they are both as bad as each other”, but it is simply wrong. One side can actually deal with their problems.

     

     2dogs

     16 Nov 12 at 12:31 am
732. There is no way that he is making any serious, life supporting money out of that site.. He is leaching off the public tit somewhere.

     That is your considered professional opinion after looking at the site, is it? No doubt you’re looking down your nose at the design. Drudge and Craigslist look like crap and they somehow make coin, you know.

     

     m0nty

     16 Nov 12 at 12:33 am
733. MORE company closures, increased offshoring and fewer local jobs will be the inevitable result of the Gillard government’s pro-union approach, according to a savage critique of Labor’s workplace policy record by the traditionally moderate Australian Industry Group.

     ABusiness also has rounded on the Coalition over workplace policy, with resource employers accusing the opposition of “acting like scared little rabbits when debating any substantive IR policy issue” because it feared an anti-Work Choices campaign by unions and Labor.

     “Pro-union”, that’s putting it mildly.

     

     Gab

     16 Nov 12 at 12:35 am
734. Not quite. It has taken eight years of work to get to the happy position I am in today. If anything, I think I’m underpaid for all the years I lived like a churchmouse while getting my startup off the ground.

     OMG. It gets worse. You are one of them evil entrepreneurs. Shudder. Whatever your history, the fact is that you are taking more than your fair share of the pie right now.

     

     Dangph

     16 Nov 12 at 12:39 am
735. OMG. It gets worse. You are one of them evil entrepreneurs. Shudder. Whatever your history, the fact is that you are taking more than your fair share of the pie right now.

     And……….. loving it.

     

     m0nty

     16 Nov 12 at 12:43 am
736. And……….. loving it.

     The funny thing is, you are more capitalist than most of the people at this site. I’m a wage slave myself, a simple computer programmer, working down t’ code mines.

     

     Dangph

     16 Nov 12 at 12:48 am
737. Speaking of classic rants, this reminds me of the derangement syndrome of a few here recently.

     

     m0nty

     16 Nov 12 at 12:51 am
738. The funny thing is, you are more capitalist than most of the people at this site.

     Glad you noticed!

     

     m0nty

     16 Nov 12 at 12:52 am
739. “UNEXPECTEDLY!”

     U.S. weekly jobless claims jump 78,000 to 439,000. wsj.com— WSJ Breaking News (@WSJbreakingnews) November 15, 2012

     

     sdog

     16 Nov 12 at 12:52 am
740. Amazing, Spot. Obama’s back in office one week and look at all the jobs lost. Heckuva job, King Barry the First.

     BTW, has the stock market recovered from the huge plunge it took upon Obama’s re-election?

     

     Gab

     16 Nov 12 at 12:56 am
741. Glad you noticed!

     He’s really a hypocritical fat fuck. That’s what he is.

     

     JC

     16 Nov 12 at 12:57 am
742. Glad you noticed!

     And you play golf. Is it possible to be more bourgeois? You are more right wing than most of the people at Australia’s leading libertarian and centre-right blog.

     

     Dangph

     16 Nov 12 at 1:00 am
743. Sdog:

     This means that while both the Libs and the ALP can acquire corrupt members, only the Libs can deal with theirs.

     Slipper quit the Libs when the party was starting these procedures against him.

     I constantly hear the argument that “they are both as bad as each other”, but it is simply wrong. One side can actually deal with their problems.

     No way. The Libs left Slippery Pete until an electorate petition with 10k? votes hit head office. Everyone knew he was sleazy. He wasn’t punted prior to the last election.

     Weak.

     QLD LNP..don’t start me up. They all have their eye on the main game.

     How did Oneshott and Windsor win their seats from the Nats?

     Blokes who want a payoff, that’s why.

     Yep the lib/Nat lot are clean.

     

     DaveF

     16 Nov 12 at 1:01 am
744. Dangph

     Keepadding is banned here in case you never noticed.

     

     JC

     16 Nov 12 at 1:01 am
745. Yea. Like wind farms..

     

     Lazlo

     16 Nov 12 at 1:02 am
746. VIDEO: Back in the day when America was prospering, proud and unbowed.

     The Rise of New York City: A Fascinating Look at Manhattan in the 1940s

     Film produced in 1946, B&W.

     Encyclopedia Britannica Films chronicles the growth of America’s most iconic city.

     

     Gab

     16 Nov 12 at 1:04 am
747. Interesting that Lezzo made a motza on selling a farm in the Bylong Valley.

     Wonder how long it will take for that to come to light..

     

     Lazlo

     16 Nov 12 at 1:04 am
748. JC, kneepadding? Sorry, I don’t understand.

     

     Dangph

     16 Nov 12 at 1:07 am
749. And you play golf. Is it possible to be more bourgeois? You are more right wing than most of the people at Australia’s leading libertarian and centre-right blog.

     See, now if JC had any wit about him, he’d chime in here with “there’s nothing petit about this bourgeois”. But he has never had an interesting thought in his head.

     Everyone plays golf. Now if I regularly went for dumplings at fashionable oriental tea houses on fashionable retail strips like someone we know, then you could call me some names. Isn’t that right, JC?

     

     m0nty

     16 Nov 12 at 1:09 am
750. Paul Keating (aka Captain Wacky) – the man who presided over the worst economic and unemployment disaster since the 1930s – says Australians were wrong to throw him out:

     PAUL Keating believes Australians were wrong to vote him out of office in 1996 as the electorate was given a clear warning about life under a John Howard-led Coalition government.

     “The country can’t say that it wasn’t told,” Mr Keating said. “The point is that countries make mistakes and they get things wrong.”

     Voters were warned on John Howard, says Paul Keating.

     

     C.L.

     16 Nov 12 at 1:12 am
751. Keating is desperately trying to be useful. He should go and polish is clock or something.

     

     Gab

     16 Nov 12 at 1:14 am
752. Keating is not mentally well. Perhaps some trampolining will cures what ails him..

     

     Infidel tiger

     16 Nov 12 at 1:17 am
753. Gab, I suspect he has more than one clock to polish.

     

     Tiny Dancer

     16 Nov 12 at 1:18 am
754. True, Tiny and mostly they’re cuckoo clocks.

     

     Gab

     16 Nov 12 at 1:19 am
755. Anyway. Bedtime. I don’t understand lefty capitalists. It is a curious thing. There are quite a few of them out there. And big government anarchists too.

     

     Dangph

     16 Nov 12 at 1:23 am
756. Tale of two royal commissions.

     Dennis Shanahan details the inside story and extraordinary backflip performed by Julia Gillard re the Royal Commission. And yes, the childless bottom-feeder had one target in mind:

     While the Prime Minister was careful to describe the royal commission as an inquiry into all institutions who care for children, it was clear the trigger was the allegations against the Catholic Church and that Abbott as a Catholic would be pressed to provide a political position.

     And what of those other calls for a Royal Commission?

     Yet the tale of the second calls for a royal commission – into misappropriation and misuse of union funds and questionable practices that may have put workers’ health and safety at risk – is one of slow prevarication where policy outcomes do not suit Labor’s political agenda.

     Calls for royal commissions – from union leaders mostly – into the alleged misuse of Health Services Union funds and alleged fraudulent misappropriation of more than $600,000 from an Australian Workers Union slush fund have fallen on deaf ears.

     The alleged institutional union protection from officials “averting their eyes”, lack of police investigations, members and officials’ outrage, overlong Fair Work Australia investigations and missing documents have not attracted swift – or any – decision on an inquiry.

     

     C.L.

     16 Nov 12 at 1:30 am
757. Dave: That wasn’t me what said that.

     

     sdog

     16 Nov 12 at 1:30 am
758. “UNEXPECTEDLY!”

     BREAKING: Texas Instruments cutting 1,700 jobs, taking $325 million charge— Bloomberg News (@BloombergNews) November 14, 2012

     

     sdog

     16 Nov 12 at 1:33 am
759. “UNEXPECTEDLY!”

     Dow ends the day down 185, declining more sharply after Obama’s remarks on taxes. nyti.ms/U0b3XE— NYT Business (@nytimesbusiness) November 14, 2012

     

     sdog

     16 Nov 12 at 1:34 am
760. “UNEXPECTEDLY!”

     Obama plans to spend $1.374 trillion on welfare in 2016. powerlineblog.com/archives/2012/… Total federal spending on EVERYTHING in 1992: $1.382 trillion.— David Burge (@iowahawkblog) November 15, 2012

     

     sdog

     16 Nov 12 at 1:36 am
761. Old PJK really is still sore about Little Johnny beating him in 1996. Yes Paul, we all suffered mightily under the Howard government. No jobs, no wealth creation, no prosperity. None of it.

     The Hawke/Keating years were great for economic reform but poor old Paul suffers from a major relevance deficit these days.

     

     tbh

     16 Nov 12 at 1:46 am
762. How many people actually are homosexual?

     Study: hardly any.

     A massive new survey published this morning reveals that only 3.4% of American adults publicly identify themselves as lesbian, gay, bisexual or transgender, with the highest percentage coming among the younger, less-educated non-whites.

     The new Gallup Poll of more than 121,000 adults, the largest of its kind on record, wass conducted during the past four months. It finds the percentage of self-reported LGBT Americans to be much smaller than a general impression derived from their presence in popular culture and their perceived influence in liberal American politics.

     The special report found 3.4% of adult Americans publicly reporting themselves as personally identifying with those categories, 92.2% saying they do not and 4.4% refusing to say or claiming not to know.

     Massive study finds only 3.4% of American adults identify as LGBT.

     How accurate is the stereotype of sophisticated, mostly white bobo homos – as per the media and Hollywood?

     Totally inaccurate:

     Gallup also found the social characteristics of those self-reporting themselves as LGBT is dramatically different from their portrayal in the media as largely white, well-educated and well-to-do.

     The largest percentage (4.6%) came among blacks, followed by Asians (4.3%), Hispanics (4%) and non-Hispanic whites (3.2%).

     Results showed that a larger percentage of women, especially younger women, reported themselves as LGBT (3.6%) compared to men (3.3%).

     And Gallup reports those publicly asserting to be LGBT tend to be younger, less-educated and less wealthy than the rest of the population.

     

     C.L.

     16 Nov 12 at 1:48 am
763. Anyway. Bedtime. I don’t understand lefty capitalists. It is a curious thing. There are quite a few of them out there. And big government anarchists too.

     They are a curious breed. I worked for one in my last job. He fancied himself as a bit of a political student, philosopher and economic pundit too. He was going to remake the world I tells ya.

     Yeah, nah. He ended up just being another pissant would-be Bill Gates with a Napoleon complex. If he really believed in spreading the wealth, he would have paid his people more and not stiff them on bonuses (like myself) and compensation. He was all full of great ideals until he had to stick his hand in his own pocket, like a lot of chardonnay socialists.

     

     tbh

     16 Nov 12 at 1:51 am
764. Obama going well:

     JOBLESS
     INFLATION
     POVERTY
     RECESSION

     SURPRISE: Highest number of new jobless claims — OH, PA…

     DENNY’S to charge 5% ‘Obamacare surcharge’ and cut employee hours…

     TEXAS INSTRUMENTS Cuts 5% of Workforce…

     U.S. Postal Service Loses Record $15.9 Billion…

     DRUDGE.

     

     C.L.

     16 Nov 12 at 3:00 am
765. Thanks, CL, for that interjection re homosexuality. The loudmouthed lobbying gives weight way beyond what’s justified, and in fact there are two things which make me anti-gays in a political sense. One is the outrageous amount of lobbying, and the second is the poor taste – again contrary to the predominant meme of the smart fashionistas and all round smug superiority.
     I have known some very well educated and cultured gays, very nice people. They live their lives in an understated way, far from all the politics and the mardi gras sleaze ball crassness. I probably don’t need to add that there may be good reason why some refer to our national broadcaster as the gay b c. Their boosting of the gay marriage issue is out of all proportion.

     

     Blogstrop

     16 Nov 12 at 6:46 am
766. In Sydney this weekend Tiny.

     

     Pickles

     16 Nov 12 at 7:43 am
767. McCain punches back at Obama: On Benghazi, you’re incompetent or corrupt

     Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., responded to President Obama’s challenge that he “go after me” over the Benghazi attack by declaring him either incompetent or corrupt and suggesting he is not taking the attack seriously.

     “This president — this administration — has either been guilty of colossal incompetence or been engaged in a coverup, neither of which is acceptable to the American people,” McCain said on the Senate floor today. “I speak as a friend of Christopher Stevens, I speak as a person who knows something about warfare, I speak as something of an authority — that this attack could have been prevented if the information on the ground had been taken into consideration.”

     

     JamesK

     16 Nov 12 at 8:06 am
768. Keating is not mentally well. Perhaps some trampolining will cures what ails him.

     From Keating to Gillard, (excepting maybe Beazley & Crean) Labor seems to have a special place in its heart for special needs kids who become adults.

     

     Token

     16 Nov 12 at 8:32 am
769. Obama going well

     Mark Twain once wrote “History doesn’t repeat itself, but it does rhyme.”

     People were crowing about the unassailable position of GWB and a permanent Republican majority after the 2004 election.

     

     Token

     16 Nov 12 at 8:35 am
770. Now the election is out of the way, the reporting of real response to the super storm that saved Obama is coming out:

     President Obama, touring parts of New York City slammed by Hurricane Sandy, was chided by a girl for ignoring the disaster.

     As the president waded through a supply center, a girl who was waiting for goods told a reporter, “We need help–he should of been here a long time ago,” according to the White House pool report.

     Obama has received little criticism for the federal government’s handling of the disaster which is still crippling areas of New York where many families remain homeless or without power.

     When will the silly people learn? If you want assistance after a disaster, scream about institutionalised racism.

     

     Token

     16 Nov 12 at 8:39 am
771. I question the timing of how rooted America is.

     

     Infidel tiger

     16 Nov 12 at 8:39 am
772. Wow, what an amazing coincidence.

     What happened again at the beginning of Nov?

     The Department of Labor has announced that new jobless claims rose by a staggering 78,000 in the first week after the election, reaching a seasonally-adjusted total of 439,000. Over the past year, and in the weeks leading up to the election, jobless claims were said to be declining, dipping as low as 339,000, with the media proclaiming that they had reached the “lowest level in more than four years.” Now, suddenly, the news seems far less rosy.

     …Some of the new claims, especially in New Jersey, were due to Hurricane Sandy–but these were offset by a decline in claims filed in New York. The highest numbers of new filings came from Pennsylvania and Ohio, where there were thousands of layoffs in the construction, manufacturing, and automobile industries.

     Both states had been targeted by the presidential campaigns. President Obama highlighted his record of job creation in Ohio in particular, focusing on the automobile industry. The state reported 6,450 new jobless claims in the week after the election–second-highest after Pennsylvania, which recorded 7,766 new claims.

     No matter who wins, watch for this after the next Australian election as I trust the unions will be cutting deals on redundancies that are based upon similar tactical targeting.

     

     Token

     16 Nov 12 at 8:42 am
773. What is it with the left and their insufferable arrogance?

     PAUL Keating believes Australians were wrong to vote him out of office in 1996 as the electorate was given a clear warning about life under a John Howard-led Coalition government.

     “The country can’t say that it wasn’t told,” Mr Keating said. “The point is that countries make mistakes and they get things wrong.”

     

     Tom

     16 Nov 12 at 9:37 am
774. Pallywood.

     Footage from the BBC captured by watchdog group Honest Reporting shows a heavy man lying on the ground and being carried away by residents, apparently after being injured by an Israeli attack.

     Moments later, that same man again fills the frame, except he is walking about and obviously unhurt.

     The widespread staging of such victim situations is a favored tactic of Arabs fighting Israel and has come to be known as “Pallywood.”

     

     Gab

     16 Nov 12 at 9:44 am
775. Restaurant chains: increase prices and reduce employee working hours to pay for Obamacare.

     http://pjmedia.com/tatler/2012/11/15/some-dennys-restaurants-to-add-obamacare-surcharge-cut-worker-hours/

     

     Gab

     16 Nov 12 at 9:51 am
776. How many people actually are homosexual?

     Study: hardly any.

     What’s your point, CL? Credible estimates have always been two to four points. This study only confirms that range.

     

     m0nty

     16 Nov 12 at 9:52 am
777. The recent death of a woman in Ireland who did not have an abortion in circumstances where (it appears) a non viable fetus was in the process of a miscarriage anyway certainly shows that there are “hard cases” where legally enforcing Catholic views on the matter can (rarely, probably, but that is no comfort to her husband) lead to outcomes of dubious morality.

     New Scientist follows up with an interview with an obstetrician who argues that pro-Lifers should accept that pro-choice doctors can act out of good conscience too. She gives another example, which sounds similar, or possibly clearer, than the Irish case:

     Not long ago I cared for a patient who was having a septic abortion [one in which the womb is infected]. An ambulance initially took her to a local religiously affiliated hospital that could not provide the emergency labour induction or dilation and evacuation procedure she needed because the fetus, as in Savita Halappanavar’s case, was still alive. She was transferred to my institution and ultimately did well. I wondered, but don’t know, if the doctors who initially saw her and transported her to my institution felt morally compromised by the policy of their hospital.

     A third type of “hard case” is, I expect, the mentally unwell mother who is threatening, or has attempted, suicide unless she is provided an abortion. There is more than one way of looking at this, and I simply make the point that doctors in that situation are in a very difficult position.

     

     steve from brisbane

     16 Nov 12 at 9:55 am
778. Slate: “THE WHITER THE PLACE, THE WORSE OBAMA DID” — and the more the economy has recovered.

     

     Gab

     16 Nov 12 at 10:01 am
779. You might have added the following line from the post, Gab:

     It seems to me that for basically coincidental reasons, some of the biggest falls in unemployment have happened in very white places

     

     steve from brisbane

     16 Nov 12 at 10:06 am
780. DUMPED attorney-general Robert McClelland has vouched for the integrity of Fair Work commissioner Ian Cambridge, who kept a detailed diary of his investigations into alleged union fraud in the 1990s involving the former boyfriend of Julia Gillard, ex-Australian Workers Union official Bruce Wilson.

     http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/investigations/mcclelland-stands-by-fwa-commissioners-integrity/story-fng5kxvh-1226517701548

     

     Gab

     16 Nov 12 at 10:10 am
781. Tim Blair reports. The reckoning begins:

     Lord McAlpine, the former Tory party treasurer wrongly accused of being a child abuser following a botched Newsnight report, yesterday agreed a £185,000 compensation settlement with the BBC – funded by licence-payers.

     Lawyers for the Tory peer warned Twitter users ‘we know who you are’ and urged them to come forward voluntarily or face being pursued through the courts.

     His action is intended to stop so-called ‘trial by Twitter’ and, if successful, could radically change the way the internet is policed and make those using social networks more directly accountable for defamatory comments.

     Twitter folk might be a little anxious:

     Lord McAlpine’s lawyer Andrew Reid said those suspected of defaming the peer would receive a letter before action was taken telling them they had 48 hours to respond …

     Mr Reid said: ‘Let it be a lesson to everybody that trial by Twitter or trial by the internet is a very nasty way of hurting people unnecessarily and it will cost people a lot of money …’

     Guardian columnist George Monbiot has offered ‘an abject apology’ for identifying the former Thatcher aide online.

     Writes Monbiot:

     I have done a few stupid things in my life, but nothing as stupid as this. The tweets I sent which hinted – as I assumed to be the case – that Lord McAlpine was the person the child abuse victim Steve Messham was talking about were so idiotic that, looking back on them today, I cannot believe that I wrote them.

     But I did, and they are unforgiveable. I helped to stoke an atmosphere of febrile innuendo around an innocent man, and I am desperately sorry for the harm I have done him.

     

     Gab

     16 Nov 12 at 10:28 am
782. PAUL Keating believes Australians were wrong to vote him out of office in 1996 as the electorate was given a clear warning about life under a John Howard-led Coalition government.

     Earth to Paul: we voted YOU out, massively and emphatically, and we enjoyed doing it. I was actually picking up ice for the election night party when I heard that the early swing was on. Only the rusted-on true believers, inculcated in the Labor myth at their kitchen tables as kids, voted for you. It was beautiful. To see your ashen-faced concession speech and rejoice in the knowledge that my country had repudiated YOU and all of the sneering faux-intellectual chip-on-shoulder pretentious Fabianism that you stood for remains one of my most precious memories. The fact that the country ignored YOUR “warning” for 11 years – while the public finances were restored to a state more befitting a sovereign nation – and was only tricked into changing by the ALP candidate posing as Howard-Lite tells YOU all you should need to know about your “warning,” you abject poseur.

     And by the way, Britain did not “rat on” Australia in Malaya, you insufferable boor, it was defeated in a military campaign by a far more motivated, efficient and well-trained opponent. There is a big, big difference. I think that half-grasped history masquerading as some sort of polymath statesman was what I most despised.

     

     James in Melbourne

     16 Nov 12 at 10:31 am
783. I think that half-grasped history masquerading as some sort of polymath statesman was what I most despised

     Well said, that man.

     

     Huckleberry Chunkwot

     16 Nov 12 at 10:39 am
784. Julian Burnside got off real easy then, after he called Tony Abbott a paedo on Twitter.

     

     candy

     16 Nov 12 at 10:44 am
785. The recent death of a woman in Ireland who did not have an abortion

     As I read the articles this I noticed this point, in Ireland an abortion is legal if it threatens the life of the mother.

     This is a case of medical negligence as the staff broke the law and ignored the mother’s needs.

     They should face the law for the death due to their actions.

     It is crass that the abortion lobby is trying to take political advantage out of the tragedy.

     I am not surprised SoB is trying to exploit the death of that poor women. Compare to his attitude to AJ’s “died of shame” comments and contrast.

     

     Token

     16 Nov 12 at 10:46 am
786. Writes Monbiot:

     I have done a few stupid things in my life, but nothing as stupid as this.

     Wrong, georgie – why be so modest?

     Your entire pointless existence has been one long cavalcade of stupid.

     

     Rabz

     16 Nov 12 at 10:47 am
787. It seems to me that for basically coincidental reasons, some of the biggest falls in unemployment have happened in very white places

     This is code for, there are less Labor Market distortions for equal opportunity, thereby allowing the market the flexibility to adjust.

     The economic illiterate does not get this of course.

     

     Token

     16 Nov 12 at 10:48 am
788. I believe in legal abortions but this is beyond the pale in terms of grubby lobbying and dishonesty, and Catholic bashing. It needs to be reiterated.

     As I read the articles this I noticed this point, in Ireland an abortion is legal if it threatens the life of the mother.

     This is a case of medical negligence as the staff broke the law and ignored the mother’s needs.

     They should face the law for the death due to their actions.

     It is crass that the abortion lobby is trying to take political advantage out of the tragedy.

     I am not surprised SoB is trying to exploit the death of that poor women. Compare to his attitude to AJ’s “died of shame” comments and contrast.

     Explanation on that ludicrous 6 PM Project – Ireland is a Catholic country. Lies.

     

     .

     16 Nov 12 at 10:49 am
789. Julian Burnside got off real easy then, after he called Tony Abbott a paedo on Twitter.

     Abbott knows what he would get if he took Burnside to court.

     Look at the disgraceful smears the Labor hack of a judge allowed Ron Merkel to be make in the Bolt case (which continues to be quoted by the wingnuts in the fruitbat Left).

     

     Token

     16 Nov 12 at 10:53 am
790. He did not say that. He is saying it will happen even without the price rise as efficiencies in production improve – the price rise would just make it more attractive. He was commenting about the costs and rate of return on shale etc, not global industrial output.

     Right, Dot, so he was engaging in handwaving, hoping that imaginary science would save his point. Funny how often that happens with you lot.

     WTF are you on about monty – are you seriously predicting an end to Moore Law, and other productivity improvements in other industries?

     Why don’t we just assume capital accumulation is going to end right now because any prediction of growth is just “imaginary hand-waving science”.

     Everything you are saying flies in the face of what has happened in the oil industry since its inception.

     

     .

     16 Nov 12 at 10:54 am
791. Earth to Paul: we voted YOU out, massively and emphatically, and we enjoyed doing it.

     Who thinks that Australia would be in the position it is in today if Howard government had not reduced the unit cost of importing/exporting by confronting the thugs on the wharfs, implemented the GST, fixed up the banking system with the reforms in the early 2000′s, and paid of Keatings debt by runnning surpluses and selling Telstra?

     All of these were positions contrary to what Keating was running with before 1995.

     

     Token

     16 Nov 12 at 10:59 am
792. The leftist media…

     Another BBC presenter has been arrested on child molestation charges.

     He joins a BBC producer, who has also been arrested.

     Odd. After all, they were free to marry.

     

     C.L.

     16 Nov 12 at 11:11 am
793. What’s your point, CL? Credible estimates have always been two to four points. This study only confirms that range.

     The study says 6.4% of people between the ages of 18-29 identify as LGBT. That is way higher than the previous best estimates of around 2% of the population.

     

     AJ

     16 Nov 12 at 11:13 am
794. Barack Obama: ‘Tony Abbott is right.’

     President Barack Obama said he plans to work with Congress in his second term to curb human-aggravated climate change, but not at the expense of the US economy…

     Without specifying what actions he would take, Obama said he would speak in the coming months and years to get bipartisan support for tackling the problem of rising global temperatures…

     “I think the American people right now have been so focused, and will continue to be focused, on our economy and jobs and growth that … if the message is somehow, we’re going to ignore jobs and growth simply to address climate change, I don’t think anybody’s gonna go for that,” he said. “I won’t go for that.”…

     

     C.L.

     16 Nov 12 at 11:18 am
795. Abbott knows what he would get if he took Burnside to court.

     Rubbish. There is no proof that Burnside was referring to Abbott. I think it highly unlikely that he was.

     

     steve from brisbane

     16 Nov 12 at 11:21 am
796. LOL. The gay lobby has always preferred to say that at least 10 percent of people were homosexual.

     This, of course, was always a fantasy.

     The fact is hardly anybody is gay and hardly anybody gives a crap about their causes.

     

     C.L.

     16 Nov 12 at 11:21 am
797. There is no proof that Burnside was referring to Abbott.

     If there was no “proof” other than the tweet, of course, then Burnside apologised for nothing. lol

     Talk about a denier.

     

     Gab

     16 Nov 12 at 11:24 am
798. “tony abbott” then “paedo in speedos” – sounds pretty easy to figure out the meaning.

     

     candy

     16 Nov 12 at 11:28 am
799. Stepford and SteveC ( owner of Kimberly, the plastic sex doll which he takes on holidays) are like two old spinsters.

     “You can’t say that, that’s not true, the guardian says this, daily kos had this to say, nytmes believes this reall happened”.

     The cat really upsets them.

     Sinc, boot the bobsey twins. We beg you.

     

     JC

     16 Nov 12 at 11:32 am
800. Australia: land of the Roxonian Methodist.

     Experts debate reducing alcohol in wine.

     “Over the last 25 years, for a number of compounding reasons, we’ve just found our alcohol content has crept up,” he said.

     “This can have implications for tax and possibly not all positive impacts on the flavour.

     “Also there’s the question of not wanting people to unwittingly take in more alcohol than they think they’re taking in.”

     

     C.L.

     16 Nov 12 at 11:35 am
801. If there was no “proof” other than the tweet, of course, then Burnside apologised for nothing. lol

     He explained, as soon as he saw what had happened, that it was a mix up between two different threads.

     He apologised for an accident.

     People do that, you know.

     

     steve from brisbane

     16 Nov 12 at 11:39 am
802. LOL

     

     Gab

     16 Nov 12 at 11:40 am
803. Reducing alcohol in wine. FMD.

     

     dragnet

     16 Nov 12 at 11:42 am
804. “Over the last 25 years, for a number of compounding reasons, we’ve just found our alcohol content has crept up,” he said.

     “This can have implications for tax and possibly not all positive impacts on the flavour.

     “Also there’s the question of not wanting people to unwittingly take in more alcohol than they think they’re taking in.”

     Lies. What do they think desert wine is?

     Yeah I’m sure people “unwittingly” get drunk the same away “honours students” never choose to take drugs, they are always “pushed” onto them by aggressive bullies who never seem to be apprehended or punished…

     Please. This level of stupidity belongs in a terribly produced 1980s low budget cop drama no one remembers.

     

     .

     16 Nov 12 at 11:43 am
805. By the way, there are Catholic sites saying that Catholic morality (not just Irish law) would allow the abortion in the Irish case, citing a “ruling” by Pius XII.

     It seems to me that this is not clear at all.

     The case of removing a fallopian tube because of an ectopic pregnancy seems clear, because it can be called an operation which indirectly leads to the loss of the fetus.

     Cases such as the Irish one, and the other one cited in my first post, seem much more ambiguous in terms of what Catholic doctors think they can do.

     

     steve from brisbane

     16 Nov 12 at 11:46 am
806. Reducing alcohol in wine. FMD.

     The next step will be “plain packaging” of all alcoholic beverages. You know, “plain packaging” like on cigarette packets that are 98% covered in pictures. Expect to see wine bottles with enlarged pictures of cirrhosised liver and such.

     

     Gab

     16 Nov 12 at 11:48 am
807. Abbott welcomes research on Gardasil being on the PBS, takes credit for it…

     Pleased to see research on the positive impacts of Gardasil being on the PBS; a decision I made as health minister http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/victoria/life-saving-vaccine-is-blitzing-cervical-cancer-virus/story-e6frf7kx-1226517718064

     Internet points out that he had to be dragged kicking and screaming into that decision by Howard.

     Prime Minister John Howard has overruled his health minister in trying to push forward the start of a mass immunisation program against cervical cancer.

     Abbott claimed that putting Gardasil on the PBS might increase cancer. The projection:

     Professor Frazer, CSL and Merck say Gardasil provides 100 per cent protection from the cause of 70 per cent of cervical cancers.

     And the result:

     New Victorian research reveals the controversial Gardasil vaccination program has resulted in a 77 per cent reduction in some human papillomavirus (HPV) types.

     These types of HPV are responsible for almost three-quarters of cervical cancers.

     One wonders if Abbott’s daughters have been immunised.

     

     m0nty

     16 Nov 12 at 11:57 am
808. WTF are you on about monty – are you seriously predicting an end to Moore Law, and other productivity improvements in other industries?

     Actually Dot, Moore’s Law is reaching the end of its run, which is why these days the chip industry is not focusing on increasing transistor density but on increasing the number of chips and relying on parallelism to produce improvements. Ye canna change the laws o’ physics, as a great Scottish man once said.

     Plenty of areas of engineering haven’t changed a lot in decades. There’s no guarantee that costs will come down in this particular area.

     

     m0nty

     16 Nov 12 at 12:06 pm
809. Reducing alcohol in wine. FMD.

     It is not uncommon for major wineries to add pure alcohol to wine to boost alcohol content.

     

     Steve of Ferny Hills

     16 Nov 12 at 12:25 pm
810. The long range step will be damn breathalyser units attached to the bar so that as so you exceed 0.08 or whatever you will be cut-off. At present rates I fear this long range may only be about 8 years away.

     

     dragnet

     16 Nov 12 at 12:30 pm
811. Burnside shat himself not because he did the wrong thing but because he got caught.

     

     Tiny Dancer

     16 Nov 12 at 12:34 pm
812. Some reds can do with less alcohol. Particularly in a warm climate, if you don’t chill a red, the fumey alcohol feel from some reds is too much.

     

     steve from brisbane

     16 Nov 12 at 12:36 pm
813. Actually Dot, Moore’s Law is reaching the end of its run, which is why these days the chip industry is not focusing on increasing transistor density but on increasing the number of chips and relying on parallelism to produce improvements. Ye canna change the laws o’ physics, as a great Scottish man once said.

     Plenty of areas of engineering haven’t changed a lot in decades. There’s no guarantee that costs will come down in this particular area.

     It’s the best educated guess, which you are saying won’t happen because you support a theory which assumes no technological improvements.

     You are talking your own book.

     

     .

     16 Nov 12 at 12:45 pm
814. Moore’s Law is reaching the end of its run, which is why these days the chip industry is not focusing on increasing transistor density but on increasing the number of chips and relying on parallelism to produce improvements

     So basically you are agreeing with dot’s point. Moore’s law itself may be ending, but like you say parallelism is increasing. Computing power is still going up and prices are still going down.

     

     Dangph

     16 Nov 12 at 12:48 pm
815. It seems to me that this is not clear at all.

     It’s pertinent to point out to any newbies that liar-steve™ is a fuckwit in addition to being a liar.

     

     JamesK

     16 Nov 12 at 12:53 pm
816. The World Today also ran a story in which Senator Doug Cameron called upon Australia to use its Security Council seat to solve the “Power Imbalance” between Israel and Gaza! Unbelievable.

     You could cut through his accent to make sense of what he was saying? All I heard was outrage and the Israeli’s are terrorists. Which he was given a pass for.

     

     DaveF

     16 Nov 12 at 1:03 pm
817. It’s the best educated guess, which you are saying won’t happen because you support a theory which assumes no technological improvements.

     You are talking your own book.

     Sure, we’re both arguing our sides. But you’re asserting that a gamble is 100% going to pay off. I’m saying you can’t rely on scientific discoveries that haven’t happened yet. Ask the carbon sequestration people how that is working out.

     

     m0nty

     16 Nov 12 at 1:05 pm
818. mont..

     finfets and other vertically integrated CMOS technologies will give a boost back to the Moore’s law type line.

     Don’t discount it so quick.

     

     duncan

     16 Nov 12 at 1:06 pm
819. The World Today also ran a story in which Senator Doug Cameron called upon Australia to use its Security Council seat to solve the “Power Imbalance” between Israel and Gaza! Unbelievable.

     You are aware that we got the UN Seat by having Rudd travel the world to promise dictators and despots that if we were elected we’d throw Israel under the bus?

     

     Token

     16 Nov 12 at 1:07 pm
820. Another academic asked for a discussion on the official definition of Australia’s One-Drop-Of-Blood Law:

     It is strange that if someone has seven Caucasian great-grandparents and one Aboriginal great-grandparent, they are able to identify as Aboriginal. That is their right, but could this be considered racist, or even a form of ancestral genocide against non-Aboriginal people because it is denying a person’s non-Aboriginal ancestry?

     [H/t Bolta]

     

     Token

     16 Nov 12 at 1:10 pm
821. So basically you are agreeing with dot’s point. Moore’s law itself may be ending, but like you say parallelism is increasing. Computing power is still going up and prices are still going down.

     Mining machinery is not equivalent to computer chip technology. Moore’s Law does not apply across all fields of engineering.

     

     m0nty

     16 Nov 12 at 1:10 pm
822. No, ‘Catholic’ Steve, it is not permissible to perform an abortion to save a woman’s life. Nor did Pius XII say it was.

     Do bear in mind, folks, that Steve once criticised a woman here for protecting her baby by shooting an armed intruder.

     I’m not sure why people are pretending to care about the Indian woman who died in Ireland. According to the CDC, more than 450 women have died as a result of abortion complications since Roe vs. Wade.

     

     C.L.

     16 Nov 12 at 1:14 pm
823. See, now if JC had any wit about him, he’d chime in here with “there’s nothing petit about this bourgeois”. But he has never had an interesting thought in his head

     .

     I went to bed. Thanks for making my point about how amusing the work petite is when referencing you, fat boy.

     Everyone plays golf.

     Those that do and have some respect for the game wouldn’t go on the course wearing black work socks, shorts, sneakers, shirt hanging out to disguise the fat belly, which doesn’t really disguise it at all and a stupid looking hat.

     Now if I regularly went for dumplings at fashionable oriental tea houses on fashionable retail strips like someone we know, then you could call me
     

     some names. Isn’t that right, JC?

     No

     

     JC

     16 Nov 12 at 1:22 pm
824. No

     LOL, so sitting in an oriental tea house sipping chai with your little finger in the air is the pursuit of a man’s man, is it JC? Hahahaha.

     

     m0nty

     16 Nov 12 at 1:31 pm
825. ‘Juliar’, as one likes to say around here, has just ‘thrown the Palestinians under the bus’:

     ”Australia supports Israel’s right to defend itself against these indiscriminate attacks. Such attacks on Israel’s civilian population are utterly unacceptable.”

     And would you believe that Abbott has just fell in love with ‘Juliar’:

     ”Israel has a right to self-defence and Israel has been under pretty serious attack from elements in Gaza for quite some time now,” Mr Abbott said.”Israel has a right to self-defence and Israel has been under pretty serious attack from elements in Gaza for quite some time now,” Mr Abbott said.

     

     Scapula

     16 Nov 12 at 1:31 pm
826. It is not uncommon for major wineries to add pure alcohol to wine to boost alcohol content.

     In that case it’s called ‘fortified wine’ and says so on the bottle. These things used to be called ‘Sherry’, ‘Port’ ‘Tokay’ etc, until Europe cracked down on the use of these geographical indicators.

     otherwise you’re talking rubbish, or winemakers are breaking the law. Wine that’s not labelled ‘fortified’ is the result of pure fermentation. the highest alcohol content I’ve seen this way is 17% in a white wine from the Mornington peninsula. Much higher than that and the alcohol kiss off the yeast and stops fermentation.

     

     papachango

     16 Nov 12 at 1:35 pm
827. What’s the view of Lee Rhiannon and that Marrickville boycotting woman?

     

     papachango

     16 Nov 12 at 1:36 pm
828. LOL, so sitting in an oriental tea house sipping chai with your little finger in the air is the pursuit of a man’s man, is it JC? Hahahaha.

     I did all that last time I was on the Bund in a great place above one of the old European banks.

     Next time I plan on getting a linen suit and correct hat so I can fit in with the other ex-pats.

     

     Token

     16 Nov 12 at 1:37 pm
829. Mining machinery is not equivalent to computer chip technology. Moore’s Law does not apply across all fields of engineering.

     I am talking about general technological process, Moore’s Law is just an example in a particular industry.

     Mining technology looks like it has come in leaps and bounds but is just the compounding of industry growth.

     Both the CMOS technologies and general trends in oil since the 1870s say you are are wrong.

     There is no such thing as peak oil. None of the predictions have come true.

     What was previously shallow oil has become more expensive than what is considered standard depth or deep oil.

     Even look at baking bread. Bread was made for centuries then in the last 150 years, we have seen coincidental advances based on other available technologies.

     Hubbert’s theory was based on assumptions that aren’t valid. Did he assume that ground penetrating radar or magnetic anomaly detection was going to be used at all or on a wide scaling for petroleum and mining in general?

     To a large extent these technologies didn’t exist or only had limited military applications.

     M. King Hubbert created and first used the models behind peak oil in 1956 to accurately predict that United States oil production would peak between 1965 and 1971

     So far. Not going to happen given the Bakken, North Slope, Green River and Gulf of Mexico formations.

     What it is dependent on is the Federal administration allowing drilling. Romney was going to allow this. Obama opposed the Keystone project.

     He is simply a bad President who is limiting technological progress and economic growth by edict.

     

     .

     16 Nov 12 at 1:39 pm
830. Meanwhile, coming soon…

     Slowly but surely the associates of abortionist Kermit Gosnell, who goes on trial in March 4, 2013, have been convicted of various crimes or are coming close to being put on trial.

     A little over two years after a police raid in February 2010 and a subsequent scathing Grand Jury report, Gosnell goes on trial on eight counts of murder–first-degree murder in the deaths of seven babies aborted alive and then killed when their spines were severed; and with third-degree murder in the case of the 41-year-old Karnamaya Mongar, who died from a drug overdose reportedly prescribed by Gosnell…

     A 281-page Grand Jury report stated that hundreds of viable babies had been aborted alive and killed when Gosnell snipped their spinal cords. At least two women had died (although there were only records for one) and when law enforcement officials accidentally discovered Gosnell’s “House of Horrors,” they found blood-stained furniture and the remains of babies strewn throughout the abortion clinic. According to the Grand Jury report, Gosnell made millions.

     

     C.L.

     16 Nov 12 at 1:42 pm
831. No news of that and the Irish story gets misreported and is because of “Catholicism….re a Catholic Country“.

     

     .

     16 Nov 12 at 1:45 pm
832. C.L.

     I wonder if Gosnell will get a supportive telephone call from Obama.

     

     Julian O'Dea

     16 Nov 12 at 1:47 pm
833. How the US has made itself a net energy importer

     http://wattsupwiththat.com/2012/08/30/north-american-energy-independence-by-2020/

     http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424127887323894704578114591174453074.html

     

     .

     16 Nov 12 at 1:48 pm
834. Masculinity, Emily’s Lister style:

     THE Gillard government spin has reached a new level, and it is insulting stuff. First, the government called in a magazine to interview the female ministers only, where they were asked questions about their sex drive amongst other things. Terrific. Now, the first bloke Tim Mathieson has been trotted out for an interview and he sounds like the old-fashioned wife. If there was a male prime minister with his wife like this, there would be screams of outrage. Tim gets up in the morning, does the Prime Minister’s hair and then sits on the couch watching TV. He regularly pours her bath when she gets home and brings her a cup of tea in the morning. Imagine if Tony Abbott’s wife said that was how their relationship worked.

     They really are terrified of men.

     

     C.L.

     16 Nov 12 at 1:56 pm
835. or winemakers are breaking the law

     Sactly.

     

     Steve of Ferny Hills

     16 Nov 12 at 1:57 pm
836. RNC report suggests other reasons why Romney lost

     Voters by a 15 point margin blamed President Bush over President Obama for the state of the economy.

     Voters preferred a candidate whose policies favored the “middle class”, and 10% more voters felt Obama’s policies favored the middle class.

     Obama’s hurricane response provided a bump. 42% said it was the “most important” or “an important” factor in their vote, and Obama won them by more than a 2:1 margin

     The RNC also looks at how demographics affected Romney’s outcome in four key states:

     Florida – 238,000 more Hispanic voters participated than in 2008 and Obama got 60% of Hispanics.Obama’s margin of victory was 78,000.

     Ohio – Romney won independents by 10, but there were more Democrats. African American turnout increased by 178,000 and Obama got 96% of them.Obama’s margin of victory was 103,000.

     Virginia – Romney improved with independents (+11), and white voters (+24), but it was not enough.Obama’s margin of victory was 113,000.

     Colorado – 147,000 more young voters participated than in 2008, and Obama increased his share of the Hispanic vote from 61% in 2008 to 75% in 2012.Obama’s margin of victory was 113,000.

     

     JamesK

     16 Nov 12 at 1:59 pm
837. So the non-whites voted for Obama.

     News at 11.

     

     C.L.

     16 Nov 12 at 2:01 pm
838. I am talking about general technological process, Moore’s Law is just an example in a particular industry.

     “… it’s the vibe.”

     I’ll believe that Green River is going to save civilisation from Peak Oil when I see it. At the moment, it’s only economic after the oil price rises high enough to significantly damage the world economy.

     

     m0nty

     16 Nov 12 at 2:04 pm
839. or winemakers are breaking the law

     Sactly

     .

     If you have proof then you ought to take the evidence to the relative authorities.

     

     Gab

     16 Nov 12 at 2:04 pm
840. Ol’ Leathery does a bit of straw clutching while getting ready for the Tony Abbott Hour on Sunday.

     

     H B Bear

     16 Nov 12 at 2:07 pm
841. So the non-whites voted for Obama.

     News at 11.

     So who da next demolition party presidential candidate… Jesse Jackson Jnr?

     

     Arnost

     16 Nov 12 at 2:07 pm
842. We already know Labor plans to borrow the Obama campaigns tactic of appealing to minority groups which smearing the opposition’s leader as a woman-hating tool of the rich.
     
     The Labor Party plans to borrow strategy and campaigning techniques from Barack Obama’s election campaign to convince key groups, including women, to reject Liberal leader Tony Abbott.
     
     Already other parts of the Obama campaign are being borrowed, including bits of speeches. .
     
     Here’s Bill Clinton nominating Obama at the Democratic convention:

     I want to nominate a man cool on the outside but burning for America on the inside.

     Here’s Julia Gillard last night nominating herself to the Business Council of Australia:

     But because we face unprecedented opportunity – because I burn with ambition for our nation’s future.

     Crap campaigners have to steal from other campaigns. And lie, of course.

     http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/andrewbolt/index.php/heraldsun/comments/gillard_pinches_even_the_words_from_the_obama_campaign/

     New strategy just like the old strategy: “hey! I know, let’s play the man not the ball!”

     

     Gab

     16 Nov 12 at 2:08 pm
843. Obama’s hurricane response provided a bump. 42% said it was the “most important” or “an important” factor in their vote, and Obama won them by more than a 2:1 margin

     This reflects the statements in the exits polls (for those who chose to look).

     Keep this in mind when the wing-nuts quote their man-god Nate Silver.

     

     Token

     16 Nov 12 at 2:09 pm
844. Keep this in mind when the wing-nuts quote their man-god Nate Silver.

     …who didn’t even bother to vote.

     

     Gab

     16 Nov 12 at 2:10 pm
845. So who da next demolition party presidential candidate… Jesse Jackson Jnr?

     You are right, it is most likely someone like Julian Castro as they need to keep working the minority communities:

     In September of the next year, Castro delivered the keynote address at the 2012 Democratic National Convention in Charlotte, North Carolina.[20][21] He is the first Hispanic ever to deliver a keynote address at a Democratic National Convention.[22]

     

     Token

     16 Nov 12 at 2:12 pm
846. Hey didn’t gillard or Swan criticise the Liberals for employing US political tactics?

     

     Gab

     16 Nov 12 at 2:12 pm
847. So who da next demolition party presidential candidate… Jesse Jackson Jnr?

     Nope Arnost, JJJr is currently negotiating a plea deal on campaign fund fraud.

     Rep. Jesse Jackson Jr. was re-elected on Nov. 6 despite being both under ethics investigation and in rehab at the Mayo Clinic. He has not actually been on the job in Congress for the better part of a year. Now that the ethics investigation seems to be heating up again, he’s negotiating for a way out that would put him on the dole, forever.

     Sources tell FOX 32 News that Congressman Jesse Jackson Jr. is willing to give up his 2nd Congressional District seat if he’s given disability when he steps down.

     And shaking down the people as he goes down. These people (oops racist) never know when to stop.

     Questions are also raised about the expensive watch he bought his mistress.

     

     DaveF

     16 Nov 12 at 2:16 pm
848. Speaking of clcohol in wine… the call to reduce content is absurd, of course, but I do notice Australian wines seem to have a higher alcohol-content (on average) than French wines.

     

     Fleeced

     16 Nov 12 at 2:28 pm
849. So who da next demolition party presidential candidate… Jesse Jackson Jnr?

     I fear sooner or later it will be Michelle Obama. If you don’t like that, you’re racist AND misogynist!

     

     Fleeced

     16 Nov 12 at 2:33 pm
850. Geez, you need higher alcohol content to ease the horror of Juliar!!

     Mike

     

     Mike of Marion

     16 Nov 12 at 2:37 pm
851. Well, Libertarians have got the attention of the Republican Party, what are they going to do now?

     Libertarians provided the margin for Democrats in at least nine elections

     Instapundit notes how stupid their actions can be, better a Leftwing Democrat than a Tea Party Republican apparently:

     It’s particularly sad that libertarians didn’t back Mia Love. Really, you’re not going to vote for a candidate whose favorite economist is Bastiat? Apparently not.

     

     Token

     16 Nov 12 at 2:42 pm
852. Better a rightwing Republican than a rightwing Democrat causes people not to vote for Obama, as well, so these ‘facts’ don’t tell you much in isolation.

     The big fact is that the Reptilian Partty hasn’t won the big states in a long time.

     

     Scapula

     16 Nov 12 at 2:50 pm
853. Well, Libertarians have got the attention of the Republican Party, what are they going to do now?

     Wedge it into long-term electoral insignificance, from the looks of it. Growing amounts of minorities vote for the Democrats, Libertarians chipping away white voters, what does that leave the GOP?

     

     m0nty

     16 Nov 12 at 2:57 pm
854. Speaking of clcohol in wine… the call to reduce content is absurd, of course, but I do notice Australian wines seem to have a higher alcohol-content (on average) than French wines.

     true. generally it’s because the relatively warmer climate means the grapes have more sugar in them, so during fermentation it converts to more alchohol. Wine from the hotter regions of France, such as the southern Rhône, has similar levels – e.g. Gigondas wines are regularly 14%.

     It might also be the Aussie taste for more fully fermented, drier wines.

     

     papachango

     16 Nov 12 at 3:07 pm
855. Wedge it into long-term electoral insignificance, from the looks of it. Growing amounts of minorities vote for the Democrats, Libertarians chipping away white voters, what does that leave the GOP?

     I do hope the Democrats rest on their laurels and assume that to be true.

     

     Token

     16 Nov 12 at 3:13 pm
856. thrown the Palestinians under the bus’

     Wish someone would throw Ellis under a bus…

     

     max49

     16 Nov 12 at 3:16 pm
857. The GOP needs to win over more Asians and Latinos, and become more competitive in the larger cities. The former should help with the latter. GOPers need to take a deep breath, we were bemoaning the candidates available in the primaries and seemed to forget that during the campaign (I did). The candidates that will be available for 2016 are going to be much better and the Dems are going to have to field a new candidate that is going to have to fight in their own primaries to win the nomination. So, less moaning and more calm reflection.

     

     dover_beach

     16 Nov 12 at 3:18 pm
858. I do hope the Democrats rest on their laurels and assume that to be true.

     The only hope left for the unelectable hard right: that the left get complacent.

     

     m0nty

     16 Nov 12 at 3:25 pm
859. This weeks Media Watchdog is up and running:
     

     ● Stop Press: Phillip Adams AO & Geoffrey Robertson QC Plug Their Books Per Courtesy of the Taxpayer

     ● Hyperbole of the Week: Michael Koziol Wins for the Aussie Speccie

     ● Nancy’s Pick-of-the-Week: Leigh Sales’ 7.30 Hatchet Job on George Pell

     ● Can You Bear It? Double Standards On Jokes About Traditional Owners and on the Late Peter Roebuck; Plus When a Cardinal Became a Mr

     ● Waiting for Mark Latham : Some Abbottcentric Proposals

     ● MWD Reflux Re Stephen K and Allan RMJ

     ● Correspondence: Peter Manning’s False Claims on Tony Abbott and Julia Gillard Documented

     The pick is a day by day dissection of Leigh Sales’ coverage of the forthcoming Royal Commission.

     

     Cold-Hands

     16 Nov 12 at 3:26 pm
860. The only hope left for the unelectable hard right: that the left get complacent.

     Not the only hope, but a valid one… kinda like they were here after the 2007 election – when Libs were going to be gone for a generation.

     

     Fleeced

     16 Nov 12 at 3:33 pm
861. Interesting theory Token at 2.09. Nate Silver was horribly wrong right up until a few days before the election, when a hurricane fluked him getting the numbers spot on. What an amazing coincidence. maybe Nate is a weather god, not just a man-god.

     

     SteveC

     16 Nov 12 at 3:39 pm
862. The pick is a day by day dissection of Leigh Sales’ coverage of the forthcoming Royal Commission.

     Honest question here, Cold-Hands: who out there is willing to go on record at the moment in support of the Catholic Church’s handling of child sexual abuse cases involving its priests? Who does Sales or Uhlmann call? Where are these contrary voices?

     

     m0nty

     16 Nov 12 at 3:42 pm
863. According to the SMH article, the legal situation in Ireland is very unclear:
     In 1983 Ireland’s constitution was amended to ban abortion completely.

     In 1992, the country’s Supreme Court ruled that it was permitted in cases where the mother’s life was at risk, including at risk of suicide.

     This related to a case in which the government used the courts to try to prevent a 14-year-old rape victim, ‘X’, from leaving the country to have an abortion overseas.

     The 1983 ban is effectively still in place because seven successive governments have refused to back the Supreme Court decision by enacting legislation.

     Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/world/death-of-woman-denied-abortion-puts-global-pressure-on-ireland-for-law-reform-20121115-29d3d.html#ixzz2CMFjLFZD

     

     SteveC

     16 Nov 12 at 3:48 pm
864. CL, in the case above, assuming this reporting is correct:
     Mrs Halappanavar died after doctors refused to terminate her 17-week pregnancy, even though they knew her miscarriage was inevitable and there was no chance the foetus would survive.

     do you believe an abortion justified or not? Yes or No.

     

     SteveC

     16 Nov 12 at 3:52 pm
865. do you believe an abortion justified or not? Yes or No.

     The Pope told CL that it was God’s will that Mrs Halappanavar should die in agony. CL believes the Pope.

     

     m0nty

     16 Nov 12 at 3:56 pm
866. No, ‘Catholic’ Steve, it is not permissible to perform an abortion to save a woman’s life. Nor did Pius XII say it was.

     CL, you know I do not generally engage in debate on abortion with you, but I do note that the Catholic Herald blog comment by William Oddie (“a leading Catholic writer and broadcaster”) indicates clearly that he believes that the abortion of the baby in the Irish case would be within Catholic doctrine.

     This, at the very least, shows that there can be genuine confusion and uncertainty about the practical implementation of Catholic policy.

     

     steve from brisbane

     16 Nov 12 at 4:07 pm
867. The GOP needs to win over more Asians and Latinos, and become more competitive in the larger cities. The former should help with the latter. GOPers need to take a deep breath, we were bemoaning the candidates available in the primaries and seemed to forget that during the campaign (I did). The candidates that will be available for 2016 are going to be much better and the Dems are going to have to field a new candidate that is going to have to fight in their own primaries to win the nomination. So, less moaning and more calm reflection.

     Most intelligent comment on this forum about this issue.

     

     Dead Soul

     16 Nov 12 at 4:31 pm
868. Who does Sales or Uhlmann call? Where are these contrary voices?

     The evidence suggests that they made no calls to anybody. If they had done so, they would have made note of their request and told the viewers that the invitee had refused to appear. You can be sure that they would have slanted the refusal to make it appear that they were too ashamed to appear. They could have spoken to the independent commissioner who heads the Melbourne Response; at worst they could have spoken to an official Catholic Church spokesman such as Father Shane Mackinlay. Your imputation is groundless; more smear and innuendo to add to Sales’ hatchet job.

     

     Cold-Hands

     16 Nov 12 at 4:40 pm
869. The GOP needs to win over more Asians and Latinos

     And – who knows? – having credible policies on economics, immigration, defence, health, climate change and foreign affairs might just get them some extra votes from those groups. Crazy idea, I know…

     

     steve from brisbane

     16 Nov 12 at 4:41 pm
870. Mont, but you don’t believe consititutions can be changed, because they are upheld by institutions.

     As an “institutionalist” surely you support the Irish to maintain their institutions, and defend their constitution?

     In 1983 Ireland’s constitution was amended to ban abortion completely.

     In 1992, the country’s Supreme Court ruled that it was permitted in cases where the mother’s life was at risk, including at risk of suicide.

     Mont said The SCOTUS doesn’t change the constitution, Pat.

     And neither does the Irish Supreme Court, apparently.

     Don’t worry though, mate. As your hamster wheel starts spinning to try to get you out of your latest contradiction, you can always just call me a racist. After all, you’re such an intellect.

     

     Pat Hannagan

     16 Nov 12 at 4:45 pm
871. Correspondence: Peter Manning’s False Claims on Tony Abbott and Julia Gillard Documented

     Manning is as dependent on unsubstantiated claims of extremism as M0nty.

     

     Token

     16 Nov 12 at 4:55 pm
872. The GOP needs to win over more Asians and Latinos

     Yes, what the GOP needs to do is turn into Democrats and elect a new people.

     Sheesh.

     

     Pat Hannagan

     16 Nov 12 at 4:55 pm
873. The Pope told CL that it was God’s will that Mrs Halappanavar should die in agony. CL believes the Pope.

     David Marr told Monty that it was the left’s will that unborn babies have their spines cut with scissors and die in agony. Monty believes Mr Marr.

     

     C.L.

     16 Nov 12 at 5:02 pm
874. Honest question here, Cold-Hands: who out there is willing to go on record at the moment in support of the Catholic Church’s handling of child sexual abuse cases involving its priests?

     What are you basing that statement on?

     Any prudent person would be suspcious of Leigh Sales & the ABC’s presentation of the facts when it comes to the Catholic Church:

     Leigh Sales’ claim that not one of the 600 cases of child criminal abuses upheld in Victoria in the past 16 years was referred to police, is misleading. She neglected to mention that in these cases either the complainants did not want the matters referred by the Catholic Church to the Police or the matters had already been dealt with by Police.

     More details from GH on why everyone should question the ABC’s handling of the facts:

     Leigh Sales as interviewer of George Pell: How about the case of Father F who testified in court under oath that he had abused boys, and that he had told three priests about that in the early 90s, yet he remained a priest until 2005?

     In fact, Fr. F was sacked as a priest in 1992. Ms Sales and Ms Neighbour should know this, since it is on the public record. Moreover, both should be aware that the Church’s handling of the Father F case is the subject of an independent inquiry by former judge Antony Whitlam, who is not a Catholic. 7.30 should not be in the business of anticipating the outcome of a properly constituted legal enquiry.

     

     Token

     16 Nov 12 at 5:05 pm
875. Here’s a decent column arguing what I sort of suggested above. Some extracts:

     Numerous Republicans pointed last week to the party’s restrictionist immigration agenda as the source of its dismal performance with the growing (and increasingly Democratic) Latino bloc. But the party’s Latino problem does not rest with immigration law. Polls show that Hispanics are just plain liberal on the main role-of-government questions dividing the parties. More than three fifths want to leave Obamacare in place rather than repeal it; a mere 12 percent agree with the Republican position of closing the deficit entirely through spending cuts. The harsh truth that fend-for-yourself economic libertarianism is a worldview mainly confined to the shrinking, aging white electorate is a reality Republicans prefer not to acknowledge.

     And:

     As Chait and Ponnuru both point out, the economic agenda of the Republican Party is a loser. It can’t hope to capture the minority vote, the support of women, or a number of moderate independents. But it’s a winner for Fox News. Hardline economics and a new, even-more-conservative Tea Party candidate to challenge any Republican that doesn’t uphold the gospel of True Conservativism? Well, let’s just say that this makes for constant controversy and great television.

     I’ve written previously that the Republican Party needs to ditch Fox News if they want to win. They’ll need to ditch Tea Party economics as well. The challenge for conservatives will be realizing that this economic agenda is simply fueling conservative media, not helping Republicans win back the voting public.

     

     steve from brisbane

     16 Nov 12 at 5:06 pm
876. They could have spoken to the independent commissioner who heads the Melbourne Response; at worst they could have spoken to an official Catholic Church spokesman such as Father Shane Mackinlay.

     Yes, the media of all descriptions seem to be going to Pell and Pell only, which is a mistake. Good point, Cold-Hands. Hopefully more will be made in coming months of how Pell is not liked inside all quarters of the Church, and how there are other, more moderate voices that should be heard.

     

     m0nty

     16 Nov 12 at 5:23 pm
877. assuming this reporting is correct:
     Mrs Halappanavar died after doctors refused to terminate her 17-week pregnancy, even though they knew her miscarriage was inevitable and there was no chance the foetus would survive.

     Not enough detail is contained in this report to draw any meaningful (medical) conclusions. The report claims that Mrs Halappanavar died of septicaemia sometime after her three day labour. There is insufficient detail to determine whether early delivery of the foetus would have improved her chance of survival.

     

     Cold-Hands

     16 Nov 12 at 5:24 pm
878. The pick is a day by day dissection of Leigh Sales’ coverage of the forthcoming Royal Commission.

     Gee, I wonder does her partner have “close ties” to the ALP.

     

     blogstrop

     16 Nov 12 at 5:24 pm
879. Yes, what the GOP needs to do is turn into Democrats and elect a new people.

     Sheesh.

     As the values of Asian American are actually in alignment with the ROC, if it treats this very dispersed and different set of people as a serious constituency they are likely to have success.

     In the conservative press this is the conversations they are having.

     

     Token

     16 Nov 12 at 5:24 pm
880. The Cardinal is certainly heading towards a pretty big downer of an end to his career (so to speak.)

     Didn’t CL once or twice express a vague hope that he may be in the running to be the next Pope?

     

     steve from brisbane

     16 Nov 12 at 5:26 pm
881. I am talking about general technological process, Moore’s Law is just an example in a particular industry.

     “… it’s the vibe.”

     I’ll believe that Green River is going to save civilisation from Peak Oil when I see it. At the moment, it’s only economic after the oil price rises high enough to significantly damage the world economy.

     What price is that, monty?

     The amount of oil found in America over the last seven years is simply staggering.

     You presume that unconventional oil will not become cheaper as it requires more technological advancement, and you have assumed no will come. Which is a totally bizzare assumption given the history of oil.

     Scale economies can make it cheap enough, even without advances in technology.

     That’s true for every kind of unconventional oil. Look up the research.

     

     .

     16 Nov 12 at 5:29 pm
882. n 1983 Ireland’s constitution was amended to ban abortion completely.

     In 1992, the country’s Supreme Court ruled that it was permitted in cases where the mother’s life was at risk, including at risk of suicide.

     Mont said The SCOTUS doesn’t change the constitution, Pat.

     And neither does the Irish Supreme Court, apparently.

     The exact text of the Eighth Amendment of the Constitution of Ireland:

     The State acknowledges the right to life of the unborn and, with due regard to the equal right to life of the mother, guarantees in its laws to respect, and, as far as practicable, by its laws to defend and vindicate that right.

     The Irish Supreme Court merely interpreted the new test of “with due regard to the equal right to life of the mother” as meaning that abortion was permissible where the mother’s life was at risk (or more precisely, travelling abroad to get an abortion was permissible). This seems, to me, to be a fairly straightforward interpretation.

     

     m0nty

     16 Nov 12 at 5:32 pm
883. I don’t know what so called conservative press you are reading, Token, but, >70% of asians voted for Obama.

     I would suggest the GOP focus on its core constituency and try to get their vote up. I would also suggest the GOP do not take advice from their opposition as to how they can increase their vote.

     That’s what I’ve read on the conservative sites I read.

     

     Pat Hannagan

     16 Nov 12 at 5:32 pm
884. I would suggest the GOP focus on its core constituency

     White men who use “Just for Men”?

     

     steve from brisbane

     16 Nov 12 at 5:35 pm
885. This seems, to me, to be a fairly straightforward interpretation.

     So straight forward that the Irish legislature have refused to legislate it.

     In 2010, the European Court of Human Rights demanded that Ireland pass legislation to give effect to the court decision.

     The Irish parliament is an institution, m0nt. Defend them!

     And remember, as you said, The SCOTUS doesn’t change the constitution, Pat.

     There’s an easy way out of this, m0nt, admit you were wrong.You should be used to it by now.

     The wrong bit, not the admittance, that is.

     

     Pat Hannagan

     16 Nov 12 at 5:38 pm
886. What price is that, monty?

     I read somewhere $200/barrel was what they were looking at. I don’t know if that’s true.

     Dot, you may be right and we may all stride forth into a glorious future of cheap energy together arm in arm, but all the previous technological advancements in oil you’re talking about were concerning crude. Shale oil is a different kettle of fish. I’m reserving judgement.

     

     m0nty

     16 Nov 12 at 5:40 pm
887. Gee, I wonder does her partner have “close ties” to the ALP.

     Sales is married to an animator/academic Phil Willis who worked on Happy Feet 2. He doesn’t appear to be a political animal, although odds are that he is a typical inner urban latte sipping progressive academic.

     

     Cold-Hands

     16 Nov 12 at 5:40 pm
888. In 2010, the European Court of Human Rights demanded that Ireland pass legislation to give effect to the court decision.

     The Irish parliament is an institution, m0nt. Defend them!

     I will defend them. They are perfectly within their rights to tell the ECHR to go jump in Lake Geneva, and I would support them in doing so. Supra-national world government dictating national laws, pfah to that I say.

     In any case, legislation is not needed to give effect to the court decision, because the court decision carries its own power.

     

     m0nty

     16 Nov 12 at 5:48 pm
889. the Republican Party needs to ditch Fox News if they want to win.

     How do you propose a nominally conservative political party should “ditch” a nominally conservative cable network?

     

     lotocoti

     16 Nov 12 at 5:48 pm
890. Mont said In any case, legislation is not needed to give effect to the court decision, because the court decision carries its own power.

     Ok. You admit that the SCOTUS can change the constitution.

     Just say that and we can move back to our our earlier discussion.

     

     Pat Hannagan

     16 Nov 12 at 5:52 pm
891. Ok. You admit that the SCOTUS can change the constitution.

     No, Pat. Common law is not the same as the constitution.

     

     m0nty

     16 Nov 12 at 5:54 pm
892. I don’t know what so called conservative press you are reading, Token, but, >70% of asians voted for Obama.

     Pat, Token linked to Pajamas Media, and that in turn linked to the source. The source seems kosher, but it is puzzling.

     The Left are forced to treat (East?) Asian males as dishonourable white men because Asians refuse to become victims. If they still support the Left, thats just weird.

     I suspect this has something to do with the definition of Asian in the data collection. Including Singaporeans in the same category as say, Bangladeshis, is about as useful as including Germans with Greeks, as average Europeans.

     

     Jannie

     16 Nov 12 at 6:06 pm
893. With respect to technology development in the resources industry, there is plenty going on that the public and even the analysts aren’t aware of. I am quite confident that the trajectory of R&D will continue on its present path for a good while. We are nowhere near hitting the ceiling.

     

     tbh

     16 Nov 12 at 6:07 pm
894. Dot, you may be right and we may all stride forth into a glorious future of cheap energy together arm in arm, but all the previous technological advancements in oil you’re talking about were concerning crude. Shale oil is a different kettle of fish. I’m reserving judgement.

     wow dot. Fat boy is reserving judgement. We have to wait until he unreserves then.

     It’s not the only thing he’s keeping in reserves though… if you know what I mean.

     

     JC

     16 Nov 12 at 6:07 pm
895. I agree with that TBH, but we are in in the middle of a huge capital strike in the US at the moment as firms won’t invest with any confidence as there’s a hostile adminsitation

     

     JC

     16 Nov 12 at 6:10 pm
896. How do you propose a nominally conservative political party should “ditch” a nominally conservative cable network?

     I agree. They should ditch Fox and embrace MSNBC.

     

     JC

     16 Nov 12 at 6:11 pm
897. And – who knows? – having credible policies on economics, immigration, defence, health, climate change and foreign affairs might just get them some extra votes from those groups. Crazy idea, I know…

     Lol.

     

     JC

     16 Nov 12 at 6:12 pm
898. I agree with that TBH, but we are in in the middle of a huge capital strike in the US at the moment as firms won’t invest with any confidence as there’s a hostile adminsitation

     JC, you would know more about that than I. Internationally we’re still seeing companies willing to invest though. I would hope that the Obama II administration would just these folks get on with the task of producing cheap energy. It will help their industrial base no end.

     

     tbh

     16 Nov 12 at 6:18 pm
899. in 1983 Ireland’s constitution was amended to ban abortion completely.

     1) Constitutions can be changesd.

     In 1992, the country’s Supreme Court ruled that it was permitted in cases where the mother’s life was at risk, including at risk of suicide.

     2) Constitutions can be reinterpreted to be anything other than their original intent.

     Mont said Common law is not the same as the constitution.

     We *are* discussing the constitution, m0nt, not Common Law.

     Admit you were wrong m0nt, and then let’s move back to my “dog whistling”.

     

     Pat Hannagan

     16 Nov 12 at 6:19 pm
900. No, ‘Catholic’ Steve, it is not permissible to perform an abortion to save a woman’s life. Nor did Pius XII say it was.

     And in a great victory for Akin-Mourdockism, a woman has just needlessly died, taking her unborn child with her. The church’s position is presumably that it is more ethical to sacrifice two lives rather than one. What a fantastic triumph for “pro-lifers”.

     Of course, there is a real risk that this case could cause Ireland to swing to the other (pro-abortion) extreme of total abortion on demand, and if that happens it will be in no small way due to “pro-lifers”.

     

     Fisky

     16 Nov 12 at 6:23 pm
901. “I would suggest the GOP focus on its core constituency and try to get their vote up.”

     By some measures, relying on their core constituency is insufficient. Of course, that depends on what ‘core’ means.

     As a senator from Texas, the largest and most important state in the Republican firmament, Cruz has a special role in the post-Romney debate. At the Presidential level, Texas has thirty-eight electoral votes, second only to California, which has fifty-five. It anchors the modern Republican Party, in the same way that California and New York anchor the Democratic Party. But, Cruz told me, the once unthinkable idea of Texas becoming a Democratic state is now a real possibility.

     “If Republicans do not do better in the Hispanic community,” he said, “in a few short years Republicans will no longer be the majority party in our state.” He ticked off some statistics: in 2004, George W. Bush won forty-four per cent of the Hispanic vote nationally; in 2008, John McCain won just thirty-one per cent. On Tuesday, Romney fared even worse.

     “In not too many years, Texas could switch from being all Republican to all Democrat,” he said. “If that happens, no Republican will ever again win the White House. New York and California are for the foreseeable future unalterably Democrat. If Texas turns bright blue, the Electoral College math is simple. We won’t be talking about Ohio, we won’t be talking about Florida or Virginia, because it won’t matter. If Texas is bright blue, you can’t get to two-seventy electoral votes. The Republican Party would cease to exist.
     …
     Immigration from Mexico only partly accounts for the change. More than a million Americans have moved to Texas in the past decade, many from traditionally Democratic states. More than three hundred and fifty thousand Californians have arrived in the past five years; since 2005, over a hundred thousand Louisianans permanently relocated to Texas, mostly in Houston, after Hurricane Katrina. The population is also skewing younger, which means more Democratic. But Munisteri is more preoccupied by the racial and ethnic changes. He turned to a chart showing Texas’s population by ethnic group over the next few decades. A red line, representing the white population, plunged from almost fifty-five per cent, in 2000, to almost twenty-five per cent, in 2040; a blue line, the Hispanic population, climbed from thirty-two per cent to almost sixty per cent during the same period. He pointed to the spot where the two lines crossed, as if it augured a potential apocalypse. “This shows when Hispanics will become the largest group in the state,” he said. “That’s somewhere in 2014. We’re almost at 2013!” He added, “You cannot have a situation with the Hispanic community that we’ve had for forty years with the African-American community, where it’s a bloc of votes that you almost write off. You can’t do that with a group of citizens that are going to compose a majority of this state by 2020, and which will be a plurality of this state in about a year and a half.”

     He told me that he had a slide that he wouldn’t show me, because he didn’t want Democrats to know about his calculations. He said that it depicted the percentage of the white vote that Republicans would have to attract if they continued to do as poorly as they have among Hispanics.

     “By 2040, you’d have to get over a hundred per cent of the Anglo vote,” he said.

     “Over a hundred per cent is not possible,” I offered.

     “That’s my point!”

     http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2012/11/19/121119fa_fact_lizza?currentPage=all

     

     Jarrah

     16 Nov 12 at 6:25 pm
902. TBH

     America firms have around $1.7 trillion held in cash or cash equivalents.

     When I say there’s a capital strike I’m not suggesting absolutely no money invested. It’s just that no one is prepared to take any marginal risk. That’s because the Kenyan of course.

     

     JC

     16 Nov 12 at 6:27 pm
903. In that case, I understand and agree. That stockpile of cash has been growing for a couple of years now.

     

     tbh

     16 Nov 12 at 6:29 pm
904. Jannie, yes, the data does not discriminate ethnicity amongst the broad category “Asian”. Still, given the proportion of east asians amongst Pakistani and Indians in the US census, east asians must have been very much pro-Obama.

     Pajamas Media, btw, is a neocon website.

     

     Pat Hannagan

     16 Nov 12 at 6:29 pm
905. The journalists who are so keen for the seal of the confessional to be broken will no doubt be happy in future to “name their sources”.

     

     Julian O'Dea

     16 Nov 12 at 6:32 pm
906. Hehe, that pick of m0nty driving a golf ball a massive 165 yards (not metres ) with a huge cupping slice always makes me laugh.
     That and his attire, good grief.
     I can almost hear him scream ” GO DA PIES!! ” as the ball flops meekly into the rough on his way to a double bogey . lol

     

     jumpnmcar

     16 Nov 12 at 6:33 pm
907. Jarrah, the GOP, especially under the Bush dynasty, has followed the Democrat playbook and promoted Hispanic immigration into the USA, and now Texas is marginally a Democrat state as a result. It will go the way of California.

     If the GOP followed the Sailer Strategy then it would simultaneously a) appeal to its own ethnic base , and b) reduce the Democrats remaking of the electorate.

     This is an obvious electorally winning strategy.

     

     Pat Hannagan

     16 Nov 12 at 6:36 pm
908. Oh, and i said ” bogey ” not bougie

     bougie |ˈboōjē; – zh ē|
     noun ( pl. -gies) Medicine
     a thin, flexible surgical instrument for exploring or dilating a passage of the body.

     But he probably gets a double bougie too.

     

     jumpnmcar

     16 Nov 12 at 6:36 pm
909. “yards (not metres )”

     1 yard = 0.9144 metres

     

     Jarrah

     16 Nov 12 at 6:39 pm
910. the GOP, especially under the Bush dynasty, has followed the Democrat playbook and promoted Hispanic immigration into the USA, and now Texas is marginally a Democrat state as a result. It will go the way of California.

     If the GOP followed the Sailer Strategy then it would simultaneously a) appeal to its own ethnic base , and b) reduce the Democrats remaking of the electorate.

     This is an obvious electorally winning strategy.

     I haven’t followed Sailer on this. I’m sure though that he’s saying what i am. It’s the white white that counts for the GOP.

     They shouldn’t be tailoring policies to attract ethnic racial/ groups. In fact the GOP seems quite at ease with the issue of race. No one gives a shit about it as long as you support a decent portion of rightwing policies.

     The GOP should continue to paint the demorats as the party representing the minorities and the gimmiethats.

     Romney lost the vote because 5 million whites stayed out on this one.

     

     JC

     16 Nov 12 at 6:45 pm
911. “And – who knows? – having credible policies on economics, immigration, defence, health, climate change and foreign affairs might just get them some extra votes from those groups. Crazy idea, I know…”

     As in getting policies which may get their core constituency out of bed on election day?
     Like moving back to the Right instead of pretending to be Left Lite?
     Those policies?
     Good idea.

     

     Winston Smith

     16 Nov 12 at 6:46 pm
912. Here’s the problem for the GOP. Allowing the illegals a track to citizenship gives the other side potentially a swag of new votes.

     Furthermore it compensates for bad behavior.

     Give them status but not full citizenship rights.

     

     JC

     16 Nov 12 at 6:50 pm
913. 1 yard = 0.9144 metres

     Thanks Jarrah, I have a conversion app too.
     But rule of thumb, on the course is ad GST to get to yards.
     Just ask Rorry m0ntilroy.

     

     jumpnmcar

     16 Nov 12 at 6:50 pm
914. The GOP should continue to paint the demorats as the party representing the minorities and the gimmiethats.

     Romney lost the vote because 5 million whites stayed out on this one.

     These are conflicting statements, and do not conform with the Sailer Strategy.

     Dems won because they promote ethnic division, and those groups *do* want the “gimmiethats”.

     “5 million whites stayed out” because Romney didn’t care for their ethnic vote, and chose instead to run a more-war foreign policy, whilst at the same time ignoring that very people who would fight that war, heaping salt into the wound, saying they were part of the 47% who would never vote for him.

     The exit poll stats definitively state that the % who won’t vote for him are non-Whites, no matter what policy the GOP throws up.

     

     Pat Hannagan

     16 Nov 12 at 6:54 pm
915. How are they conflicting statements?

     

     JC

     16 Nov 12 at 6:56 pm
916. I just took a look at sailer’s blog.

     He references and links to a story saying that the Latino poverty rate has increased to 28%.

     Is anyone seriously suggesting this group will flock to the GOP? Please.

     

     JC

     16 Nov 12 at 6:58 pm
917. “Dems won because they promote ethnic division”

     And yet you advocate the Sailer strategy, which is solely about ethnic division.

     

     Jarrah

     16 Nov 12 at 6:59 pm
918. And yet you advocate the Sailer strategy, which is solely about ethnic division.

     No, it’s based on mobilising the

     …5 million whites (who) stayed out on this one.

     Which is important because it means you aren’t trying to take votes from the Dems.

     Of course the strategy Pat is advocating (ie getting people to vote in their best interests) should be easy to execute but the reality is it isn’t. People much prefer to be bribed.

     

     Greg P.

     16 Nov 12 at 7:04 pm
919. Like moving back to the Right instead of pretending to be Left Lite?

     Winston: would you care to explain how reducing tax rate for the rich, a permanent increase in Defence spending, abolishing Obamacare, turning Medicare into a voucher system, saying climate change is nothing to worry about, and having a VP who says “the policy of a Romney administration is to oppose abortion with exceptions for rape, incest and life of the mother,’’ are Left Lite policies?
     

     I’m all ears…

     

     steve from brisbane

     16 Nov 12 at 7:06 pm
920. Recounting her final days in UHG, he said: “Savita was really in agony. She was very upset, but she accepted she was losing the baby. When the consultant came on the ward rounds on Monday morning Savita asked if they could not save the baby could they induce to end the pregnancy. The consultant said: ‘As long as there is a foetal heartbeat we can’t do anything.’

     “Again on Tuesday morning, the ward rounds and the same discussion. The consultant said it was the law, that this is a Catholic country. Savita [an Indian Hindu] said: ‘I am neither Irish nor Catholic,’ but they said there was nothing they could do.

     “That evening she developed shakes and shivering and she was vomiting. She went to use the toilet and she collapsed. There were big alarms and a doctor took blood and started her on antibiotics.

     “The next morning I said she was so sick and asked again that they just end it, but they said they couldn’t.”

     He recollected the moment he heard that medical staff were moving his wife into intensive care.

     “They said they were shifting her to intensive care. Her heart and pulse were low, her temperature was high. She was sedated and critical but stable. She stayed stable on Friday but by 7pm on Saturday they said her heart, kidneys and liver weren’t functioning. She was critically ill. That night, we lost her.“

     But according to 80-year-old virgins, needlessly causing Savita to die in excruciating agony was the just and moral thing to do. That’s what their doctrine says.

     Thank God that religious cranks who support the death of innocent women have no power whatsoever to force their lunatic views on Australians, and are a tiny and irrelevant minority who pose no threat to anyone.

     

     Fisky

     16 Nov 12 at 7:08 pm
921. Sorry, JC. I misunderstood you.

     Yes, the GOP should be the party of the non-minority ethnic group. That is the Sailer Strategy.

     

     Pat Hannagan

     16 Nov 12 at 7:09 pm
922. And yet you advocate the Sailer strategy, which is solely about ethnic division.

     If it works, why not?

     

     lotocoti

     16 Nov 12 at 7:11 pm
923. Jarrah said And yet you advocate the Sailer strategy, which is solely about ethnic division.

     Yes, because the Dems have won the “minority” vote, regardless of the Dems policies. They will alawys be the party of the non-White vote, regardless of whatever economic policy etc the GOP throws up. This is the lesson from the last election.

     The Dems have played ethnic politics to their success, Keating himself said that politics is all about “interest groups”.

     Until the GOP, and our own Libs, wake up to the fact that they will never carry the non-White vote, unless they themselves become non-White, then they will go the same way as the GOP.

     So, either mandate yourself out of existence, or start playing by the opposition’s rules.

     

     Pat Hannagan

     16 Nov 12 at 7:14 pm
924. If it works, why not?

     Didn’t the extract from Jarrah’s 6.25 comment show that it is a hopeless long term exercise?

     

     steve from brisbane

     16 Nov 12 at 7:17 pm
925. I don’t know what so called conservative press you are reading, Token, but, >70% of asians voted for Obama.

     Did you read the article I linked to?

     It is about picking off groups who have the values that naturally respect the GOP message, rather than trying to follow the example of Dennis Hastert and Tom deLay to get into a bidding war for constituencies.

     Its premise is pretty simple:

     Asians “also stand out for their strong emphasis on family,” the Pew study reported. “More than half (54%) say that having a successful marriage is one of the most important things in life; just 34% of all American adults agree. Two-thirds of Asian-American adults (67%) say that being a good parent is one of the most important things in life; just 50% of all adults agree.”

     If the Republican Party can’t win the support of the immigrant group with the strongest family values and the most success in achieving the American dream, what can it say to the Hispanics, the immigrant group with the least success in achieving the American dream?

     Is it unrealistic? The party currently Nikki Haley & Bobby Jindal are governors of traditionally conservative states and have not needed to pander like Democrats.

     

     Token

     16 Nov 12 at 7:21 pm
926. Didn’t the extract from XXXXXX comment show that it is a hopeless long term exercise?

     Really? So you think The GOP should simply mesh with the Demorats and become one political party?

     The GOP cannot and should not compete with the gimmiethat party. It will be on a hiding to nothing because the left will always outbid you.

     Pat Hannagan, I was suggesting this strategy on Election Day as the results came in and was called wacist by the leftarded loons here.

     

     JC

     16 Nov 12 at 7:25 pm
927. Asians “also stand out for their strong emphasis on family,” the Pew study reported.

     May as well ask one for his opinion then then:

     In multiracial societies, you don’t vote in accordance with your economic interests and social interests, you vote in accordance with race and religion.
     -Lee Quan Yew.

     

     Greg P.

     16 Nov 12 at 7:26 pm
928. Is it unrealistic? The party currently Nikki Haley & Bobby Jindal are governors of traditionally conservative states and have not needed to pander like Democrats.

     But what is there to be unrealistic about though Toke. Jindal and Haley joined the GOP and were obviously welcomed with open arms. I don’t understand why people think the GOP is hostile to minority people. They aren’t.

     The difference is appealing to individuals and not groups.

     

     JC

     16 Nov 12 at 7:29 pm
929. Ire Ran is cruising for a nuke being lobbed on it one day soon.

     http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-11-14/israel-hits-gaza-targets-as-air-strike-kills-hamas-leader.html

     

     JC

     16 Nov 12 at 7:34 pm
930. Really? So you think The GOP should simply mesh with the Demorats and become one political party?

     The GOP cannot and should not compete with the gimmiethat party. It will be on a hiding to nothing because the left will always outbid you

     Republicans hold 29 governorships, the house because they hold the greater number of both Purple States.

     If its message is failing, the voters did not get the memo. In a 2 party franchise parties evolve.

     

     Token

     16 Nov 12 at 7:39 pm
931. “No, it’s based on mobilising the 5 million whites (who) stayed out on this one.”

     Not according to Sailer.

     “Which is important because it means you aren’t trying to take votes from the Dems.”

     Overall, 39% of white people voted for the Democrats. The Sailer strategy – go the whole hog and make the Republicans the White Party – is doomed to fail.

     

     Jarrah

     16 Nov 12 at 7:40 pm
932. Really? So you think The GOP should simply mesh with the Demorats and become one political party?

     The GOP cannot and should not compete with the gimmiethat party. It will be on a hiding to nothing because the left will always outbid you.

     This whole “the greedy moochers won” analysis is shallow and stupid.

     As was pointed out when the Romeny 47% comment came out – Republicans used to think it was a good thing to reduce tax burden on the low income. Now, they think they can call them lazy bums for not paying tax.

     The Democrats recognize the need to reduce the deficit; it is just a question of how to get there and balancing how the pain is spread.

     Two centrist parties can each come up with their approaches to this problem without turning it into an ideological war.

     As Brooks (I think it was, in NYT) said: the lesson of the election was that Americans like centrist policies.

     The GOP has gone off into Right wing ideology land where evidence doesn’t matter and the think it’s clever to insult the poor, calling them moochers, effectively. To have any hope it will have to abandon this pathetic Randian/Tea Party influence and come back to the centre and reality.

     

     steve from brisbane

     16 Nov 12 at 7:41 pm
933. I don’t want an argument with you Token, the simple fact is that the last Yank election demonstrated that the GOP is being played against non-White ethnic groups, and losing badly.

     The GOP cannot win by appealing to these groups, the Dems have them sown up.

     The GOP can only win by halting the demographic slide and start promoting policies that appeal to their own natural constituency.

     

     Pat Hannagan

     16 Nov 12 at 7:41 pm
934. Outside of the South, Obama won 46% of the white vote.

     

     Jarrah

     16 Nov 12 at 7:42 pm
935. …start promoting policies that appeal to their own natural constituency.

     coz da proles are so fucking rational.

     

     Greg P.

     16 Nov 12 at 7:43 pm
936. Now this is an artist who is self absorbed.

     

     Winston Smith

     16 Nov 12 at 7:44 pm
937. Aaah, socialists and the wonders they create!

     Add another 36,000,000 corpses to socialism’s corpse-mountain…

     THIRTY-SIX million people in China, including my uncle, who raised me like a father, starved to death between 1958 and 1962, during the man-made calamity known as the Great Famine. In thousands of cases, desperately hungry people resorted to cannibalism.

     The toll was more than twice the number of fallen in World War I, and about six times the number of Ukrainians starved by Stalin in 1932-33 or the number of Jews murdered by Hitler during World War II.

     After 50 years, the famine still cannot be freely discussed in the place where it happened. My book “Tombstone” could be published only in Hong Kong, Japan and the West. It remains banned in mainland China, …..

     Those who deny that the famine happened, as an executive at the state-run newspaper People’s Daily recently did, enjoy freedom of speech, despite their fatuous claims about “three years of natural disasters.” ….

     One might wonder why the Chinese government won’t allow the true tale to be told, since Mao’s economic policies were abandoned in the late 1970s in favor of liberalization, and food has been plentiful ever since.

     The reason is political: a full exposure of the Great Famine could undermine the legitimacy of a ruling party that clings to the political legacy of Mao, even though that legacy, a totalitarian Communist system, was the root cause of the famine. As the economist Amartya Sen has observed, no major famine has ever occurred in a democracy.

     

     Mk50 of Brisbane

     16 Nov 12 at 7:46 pm
938. Leigh Sales’ claim that not one of the 600 cases of child criminal abuses upheld in Victoria in the past 16 years was referred to police, is misleading. She neglected to mention that in these cases either the complainants did not want the matters referred by the Catholic Church to the Police or the matters had already been dealt with by Police.

     Although this may be true (I don’t know if it is), other churches have a different policy for referring matters to police. For example, the Anglicans automatically refer complaints about their clergy to the police (not identifying complainants if they don’t want it). This is important for identifying patterns of complaints/abuse which otherwise might not emerge.

     They also have a nationwide register of complaints, again for similar reasons, so clergy can not move around and remain undetected because no one knows of previous suspicions.

     

     Chris

     16 Nov 12 at 7:47 pm
939. The party currently Nikki Haley & Bobby Jindal are governors of traditionally conservative states and have not needed to pander like Democrats.

     Token I suspect the Repubs are fairly colour blind as far as candidates go.

     In any event George Takei won’t be voting for them anytime soon.

     

     DaveF

     16 Nov 12 at 7:54 pm
940. The GOP can only win by halting the demographic slide and start promoting policies that appeal to their own natural constituency.

     A GOP breeding program?

     

     Chris

     16 Nov 12 at 7:54 pm
941. Now I’ve opened the Star Trek Pandora’s Box….

     This recording of Bill Shatner flogging his recording director is worth a listen.

     

     DaveF

     16 Nov 12 at 7:58 pm
942. That stuff you linked about Texas is downright perverse Jarrah.

     People are moving from Louisiana and California to Texas because the republican policies in Texas are basically working and keeping the state relatively employed. This is having the effect of shifting the vote in Texas AWAY from the republicans?

     Sigh.

     

     JAG

     16 Nov 12 at 8:00 pm
943. I don’t want an argument with you Token, the simple fact is that the last Yank election demonstrated that the GOP is being played against non-White ethnic groups, and losing badly.

     We are not so far apart. I don’t know much about Sailer though.

     Straight after the election I linked to this article which underlined how the efforts by Bush in 2005/6 were stupid enough to go pander-tard and got screwed by it.

     All the talk about “appealing” to Hispanics by rewarding the lawlessness of illegal immigration is another example of some Republicans failing to understand the enemy on the left. Racial interest groups beholden to the Democrat Party will not stand down simply because the Republican Party endorses a form of amnesty. To hope that Hispanics will politically drift to the GOP after immigration concessions overlooks the racial stranglehold groups like the NAACP and La Raza (yes, “The Race”) have over political dialogue and organizing.

     I saw the same Bush-era racial naivete play out in 2006 when Section 5 of the Voting Rights Act was up for renewal. Many in the GOP viewed the renewal as a “chance to reach out to minorities.” Sound familiar?

     …The Republicans were proud of their minority outreach in the summer of 2006. President Bush signed the law in a White House ceremony with the race hustler Al Sharpton and other familiar faces in attendance. Surely this “outreach” would buy peace for the Republicans, right?

     Wrong. No sooner had the ink dried on the paper than all of the race groups turned on President Bush. The next two years heard a constant drumbeat in the media and from some of the same people invited to the signing ceremony that Bush was an “enemy of minority rights.” The racial groups were particularly venomous toward the administration.

     Those laws Bush signed to appease the hucksters are the shield the Democrats use when they resist voter ID and other anti-voter fraud laws.

     

     Token

     16 Nov 12 at 8:00 pm
944. More than three hundred and fifty thousand Californians have arrived in the past five years;

     Fuck California. And stay the hell out of Texas.

     My first order of business as President would be to build a wall around that leftist stinkhole. Name anything bad and I’ll bet it began in California.

     At least Mexicans work and are not all patchouli soaked sodomites.

     

     Infidel Tiger

     16 Nov 12 at 8:00 pm
945. Good. Sounds like a plan. Coordinate thru Kae (we can pay her in rum)

     Gin, fellers, it’s GIN, tonic and lime. Taa.

     I still may not be able to go.

     

     kae

     16 Nov 12 at 8:02 pm
946. Shitfer do you think the Simpson Bowles debt reduction plan is sound?

     

     Infidel Tiger

     16 Nov 12 at 8:02 pm
947. I think the old guard is going to have to die out first MK50. China is going to remain a slow burn in moving to a freer (is that even a word?)society.

     

     sdfc

     16 Nov 12 at 8:03 pm
948. Overall, 39% of white people voted for the Democrats.

     But, that’s just the point Jarrah (it was actually 41%). The GOP promoted themselves as aracial without ethnic sympathy, purely economic, whilst the Dems played to their non-White constituency.

     If the GOP were to focus on its natural ethnic constituency it would have picked up enough % to have won the election, and halt the demographic slide.

     The solutions being offered, that is to have an open borders immigration policy to which the GOP panders, is electoral suicide.

     The GOP didn’t choose to play ethnic politics, the Dems did. And that’s the key. Until they wake up to this fact then they are doomed to never being re-elected again.

     Here is the voting breakdown: http://isteve.blogspot.com.au/2012/11/heres-other-exit-poll-data-that-nobody.html

     

     Pat Hannagan

     16 Nov 12 at 8:03 pm
949. Token I suspect the Repubs are fairly colour blind as far as candidates go.

     That is the heart of it. That is what JC is saying as well.

     

     Token

     16 Nov 12 at 8:05 pm
950. Simpson an Bowles were on CNBC this morning. They seem like pretty sensible guys. They reminded me of the two old blokes in the muppets though.

     

     sdfc

     16 Nov 12 at 8:06 pm
951. I read somewhere $200/barrel was what they were looking at. I don’t know if that’s true.

     Dot, you may be right and we may all stride forth into a glorious future of cheap energy together arm in arm, but all the previous technological advancements in oil you’re talking about were concerning crude. Shale oil is a different kettle of fish. I’m reserving judgement.

     monty you have been deceived.

     Shale oil can be produced at 40 USD bbl, given scale economies. $200 a barrel – it was economic with limited scale production a few years ago over 90 USD bbl.

     

     .

     16 Nov 12 at 8:07 pm
952. People are moving from Louisiana and California to Texas because the republican policies in Texas are basically working and keeping the state relatively employed. This is having the effect of shifting the vote in Texas AWAY from the republicans?

     That is why Virginia is slowly shifting to the Democrats.

     The lefties move from the urban toilets they created around Maryland into Virginia for the low taxes and low regulation and are now ruining that state.

     

     Token

     16 Nov 12 at 8:07 pm
953. What does it matter who won?

     really – is anyone offering the American people a way back to the American dreamn?

     Fucking no-one.

     The country is being screwed over by its elites.

     Up to the American people to give these pricks a kick up the arse and if they cant figure out how (and figure out their own government)

     Tough luck. They are stpuid. They can wear it.

     

     Alice

     16 Nov 12 at 8:09 pm
954. A GOP breeding program?

     It’s called ‘The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints’. Non-drinkers though, unfortunately.

     

     Greg P.

     16 Nov 12 at 8:09 pm
955. M0nty’s point about higher production costs is valid. However the recent dicoveries of huge oil reserves seems a massive poke in the eye to the peak oil crowd.

     

     sdfc

     16 Nov 12 at 8:12 pm
956. Let me see…

     Egypt is facing famine…
     They are just about out of foreign reserves…
     They cannot feed their population…
     They are running out of propane for domestic cooking…

     What is a barbarian islamist scumbag to do?

     So as sure as night follows day – yep! You guessed it!

     JOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOS!!

     Mursi has recalled Egypt’s ambassador to Israel for consultations. The Arab League is scheduled to meet tomorrow to discuss the violence.
     Mursi is in touch with “all the effective players in the world” in an effort “to calm the situation, stop the bloodshed in Gaza and end this unacceptable aggression against our families and people in Palestine,” Yasser Ali, spokesman for the Egyptian president, told Al Jazeera television in an interview.

     

     Mk50 of Brisbane

     16 Nov 12 at 8:12 pm
957. The same people that like Simpson and Bowles also seem to be big fans of Krugman, which is a little strange.

     

     Infidel Tiger

     16 Nov 12 at 8:15 pm
958. No Propane?

     They will get violence anyaway bo matter sho sees who.

     

     Alice

     16 Nov 12 at 8:18 pm
959. Infidel get on track nand off politics

     

     Alice

     16 Nov 12 at 8:20 pm
960. Where are my musical companions from two nights ago?

     It’s Friday night and all work is done for the week. A Stella Artois has been relaxed with, followed by a glass of delicious Sangiovese Rosé with the barbequed pork cutlets and steamed vegetables, and now a glass of Pinot Noir is being enjoyed while the earphones are on and I listen to the opening stanzas from:

     100 Must Have Movie Classics

     What say you to that my friends?

     

     Septimus

     16 Nov 12 at 8:20 pm
961. “JOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOS!!”

     You’re a bit of a weirdo, Mk50.

     

     Jarrah

     16 Nov 12 at 8:23 pm
962. Krugman’s alright though his economics is vastly different to mine.

     

     sdfc

     16 Nov 12 at 8:23 pm
963. Hmmmmm what can I say but style Septimus!!!
     I cant compete tonight. i got home late and Im afraid it was a cold meat salad (not one of my best recipes)
     hastily prepared and thrown on table,

     No style here tonight!

     

     Alice

     16 Nov 12 at 8:25 pm
964. I’ve read Steyn’s “After America”. It wasn’t a book saying “do this and you’ll avoid disaster”. It’s a book explaining why demographics is destiny, but also indicates that adding the catalyst of leftist ideology to the mix acts as an accelerant.
     This election ran true to Steyn’s “prognosis negative”, disappointing as that has been to anyone with hope that the slide might be lessened.

     

     blogstrop

     16 Nov 12 at 8:26 pm
965. Dont much like Krugman but I like him more than Ben Bernanke Bailout King.

     

     Alice

     16 Nov 12 at 8:27 pm
966. sho sees who

     Is that one of the new chinese ruling clique?

     

     blogstrop

     16 Nov 12 at 8:28 pm
967. And it’s Bombay Sapphire, please.

     

     kae

     16 Nov 12 at 8:29 pm
968. Dont be rude Blog

     

     Alice

     16 Nov 12 at 8:30 pm
969. Alice – something like 85% of the urban population is reliant on bottled propane for cooking. You try cooking without heat. Current black market rates are over ten times normal for bottled propane. Food has trebled in price in some places.

     Jarrah, that’s a well-known mockery of conspiracy-theory idiots who blame all their self-generated troubles on the Jews: to wit, the entire muslim arab world, among others. Just who do you think the Egyptian islamist media is currently blaming the food, power, cooking oil and propane shortage on?

     The Dalai freaking Lama?

     

     Mk50 of Brisbane

     16 Nov 12 at 8:30 pm
970. What do you think would happen if we had large bank failures Alice?

     

     sdfc

     16 Nov 12 at 8:34 pm
971. From Tim Blair, Hamas Bumper Stickers.

     If you can read this you are within the blast radius

     My Other Car Is a Crater

     Honk if your horn is not currently connected to a detonator

     Baby with a bomb in his diaper on board

     If this van’s tick-tockin’, don’t come a knockin’

     THE BEST WEIGHT LOSS PROGRAM EVER

     My child was briefly an honor student at Kill Yourself Elementary

     Incoming Objects Are Closer Than They Appear

     

     blogstrop

     16 Nov 12 at 8:35 pm
972. MK50 I dont know what your point is if we are in agreement??

     “something like 85% of the urban population is reliant on bottled propane for cooking. You try cooking without heat. Current black market rates are over ten times normal for bottled propane. Food has trebled in price in some places.”

     Sounds like a recipe for a civoil uprising to me me while various dignitories are flittig around the world to ‘discuss the problem”

     They should be worried the place doesnt erupt before the politicians get back from their visiting dignatory holiday somewhere or worse find themselves (the politicians who went on holidays) chucked in the slammer on return??

     People can only out up with so much.

     

     Alice

     16 Nov 12 at 8:36 pm
973. Septimus
     Janis Ian, I bought the albums when I was a teenager at school.
     And The Basement is still around! I was there in the 70s.
     And also Harpoon Harrys, what a joint!

     

     kae

     16 Nov 12 at 8:37 pm
974. something like 85% of the urban population is reliant on bottled propane for cooking.

     because of the joooos that is.

     

     Greg P.

     16 Nov 12 at 8:38 pm
975. It may have been mentioned before but Fairfax have a Carbon economy editor.

     A wonderful effort today on the Feds slightly reducing solar subsidies.

     The renewable industry’s peak lobby group, the Clean Energy Council, said today’s decision should “erode all arguments” for further changes to the RET.
     ‘‘We would have expected the government to have more regard for the sense of investor uncertainty today’s announcement creates, right at the time when both major parties are seeking to demonstrate that Australia is a reliable place in which to invest, with stable and consistent market rules,’’ Russell Marsh, the council’s policy director, said.

     Tell that to the mining industry and the smokes makers, bro.

     Incidentally this Carbon economy editor bloke came from the business section of the paper. Truth.

     Worth a look to see how to write an article based on press releases. Including this orphan sentence which comes out of nowhere:

     But Rheem, Australia’s largest producer of solar hot water systems, welcomed the announcement, saying it would ”create a level-playing field for all solar hot water producers”.

     

     DaveF

     16 Nov 12 at 8:41 pm
976. sdfac says

     ”

     What do you think would happen if we had large bank failures Alice?

     Gee are you nasking me about Lehman? or Goldman Sachs? or wmaybe AIG????

     This is what would have happened sdfc.
     Lehman already busted because no one bailed those fuckers out.
     No-one as far as I ca see died because lehman busted.
     So Goldman should have busted only the fuckers got handed a scakful of gold.
     Same asd AIG

     bailed out the fuckers.

     and you have the nerve to ask me sdfc what would have gone wrong it we hadnt bailed hem out.

     Let me tell ypu in answer.

     A whole lot of rich pricks who nbank with them would have lost thrir dough which needs to happen to reducxe inequality.

     Other than that, nothing would have happened SO I OBJECT TO BAILING OUT THESE CROOKED BANKS WITH MY TAXES. STUFF THAT.

     Now, is there any part of my response you dont get sdfec???

     

     Alice

     16 Nov 12 at 8:42 pm
977. and i agree my speling is bad because sdfc has got me riled up suggesting we needed to bail out the banks ORSOMETHING DIRE WOULD HAVE HAPPENED…

     Bullshit we did and bullshit something dire would have happened if we didnt bail the banks out. The dicks would just be a gambling derivative or few out of business.

     GOOD.

     

     Alice

     16 Nov 12 at 8:45 pm
978. Before we move forward, do you realise that a large part of the money supply is bank liabilities.

     

     sdfc

     16 Nov 12 at 8:47 pm
979. From Tim Blair, Hamas Bumper Stickers.

     Does my bomb look big in this?

     

     Carpe Jugulum

     16 Nov 12 at 8:47 pm
980. oh dont give me that crap sdfac when you and I know the MS is created by banks and has nothing to d with what the central bank does or doesnt do

     Do you get that central banks dont control the money supplu sdfc or are you still sliving back in the days when they did (and when major banks were natioal/state banks??)

     Not the fucking case now more is the pity or perhaps you, sdfc , are still caught up in some econ textbook which is telling you that the central banks control the money supply

     whilst every other banker in town is laughing at you??

     sdfc – kill your economist would be self now.

     

     Alice

     16 Nov 12 at 8:52 pm
981. …to wit, the entire muslim arab world…

     I must add I disagree with you characterisation of Arab Muslims. I’ve known many, mainly from my time stationed in London, some quite intimately for that matter .

     Some were living in London, others were middle-east investors. A more honest and hospitable people I cannot think of. But trying to label all of them as Joo² obsessed morons is reflects more on yourself than them. I gather your geo-politics is of the neoconservative mindset.

     *NOTE: for leftist-morons I DO NOT consider importing massive amounts of Muslims into a liberal democracy a good idea. This probably makes me a hypocrite to you but I don’t really give a shit.

     

     Greg P.

     16 Nov 12 at 8:53 pm
982. You seem very confused. I made it very clear that a large part of the money supply is the liabilities of commercial banks. What is it you think I said?

     

     sdfc

     16 Nov 12 at 8:56 pm
983. It’s Friday night and all work is done for the week.

     What % of workers and indeed bosses does that statement hold true?
     Not as many as septmus thinks.

     

     jumpnmcar

     16 Nov 12 at 9:00 pm
984. On a musical note – a follow-up to last night’s discussions on the ‘$5k In a Brown Bag’ thread (I didn’t have to work tonight so have done some research

     Septimus – i can take no credit, my youngest is a JPop devotee, who coached me and the youngest Jugulette would spend every day in Akibo if i ever let him go to Tokyo.

     But it was fun

     

     Carpe Jugulum

     16 Nov 12 at 9:02 pm
985. What a surprise, Muslims are actually nice people. More of them might actually stay in their own lands if they werren’t otherwise being occupied.

     

     Scapula

     16 Nov 12 at 9:18 pm
986. “I Fish & I Shoot & I Voted Hamas … Oh, Crap!”

     

     blogstrop

     16 Nov 12 at 9:24 pm
987. they werren’t otherwise being occupied.

     Which ones are being occupied bob…

     

     max49

     16 Nov 12 at 9:24 pm
988. Scrofula that “occupied” meme is so worn out.

     

     blogstrop

     16 Nov 12 at 9:25 pm
989. It’s Friday night and all work is done for the week.

     What % of workers and indeed bosses does that statement hold true?
     Not as many as septmus thinks.

     Hi jumpnmcar. It applies 100% for me tonight. I reckon I’ve earned it this week, having worked all day Sunday then through until midnight Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday, and all day Thursday and today. That’s a pretty normal working week for me and luckily there were no all-nighters, which occasionally are necessary.

     So, judge me not my friend. I’m my own boss now and can mostly regulate my hours but in the past I was responsible for the workplace performance and welfare of others and never asked more of them than I did of myself.

     Cheers.

     

     Septimus

     16 Nov 12 at 9:30 pm
990. A more honest and hospitable people I cannot think of.

     As individuals, I do not doubt the validity of your views, having experienced similar.

     As societies, their record speaks for itself, as it does for all so-called theocratic ‘honour’ societies.

     

     Mk50 of Brisbane

     16 Nov 12 at 9:38 pm
991. More of them might actually stay in their own lands if they werren’t otherwise being occupied.

     Yes scrappy, it’s the fault of the juice, da evil juice.

     Time for a new meme hot chocolate protester.

     

     Carpe Jugulum

     16 Nov 12 at 9:43 pm
992. I think the old guard is going to have to die out first MK50. China is going to remain a slow burn in moving to a freer (is that even a word?)society.

     What people forget is that the Chinese Communists set up the country as a military dictatorship.

     The People’s Liberation Army were more important than the Red Army was to the Russian Communists.

     The Central Military Committee ultimately calls the shots.

     

     .

     16 Nov 12 at 9:45 pm
993. M0nty’s point about higher production costs is valid. However the recent dicoveries of huge oil reserves seems a massive poke in the eye to the peak oil crowd.

     His point is actually about scale economies.

     With scale economies, costs would be competitive even at low crude prices.

     

     .

     16 Nov 12 at 9:49 pm
994. The Cardinal is certainly heading towards a pretty big downer of an end to his career (so to speak.)

     Didn’t CL once or twice express a vague hope that he may be in the running to be the next Pope?

     For those joining us late, Steve is a devout ‘Catholic’ who hates Cardinal Pell, the pope, the American hierarchy, St Augustine, claims to know more about theology than Thomas Aquinas and admires child murder advocate Barack Obama.

     Pell was papabile in the press – quite rightly. There is no ‘downer’ at any part of his career – excepting the time he was accused of molestation by a mentally deranged wacko (a not infrequent occurrence for clergy).

     [Steve now Googles papabile].

     

     C.L.

     16 Nov 12 at 9:56 pm
995. Dot I don’t think there is any question that the costs are higher for shale oil than for conventional sources.

     

     sdfc

     16 Nov 12 at 9:57 pm
996. Invasion of Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Lebanon and Gaza.

     Construction of an apartheid system of rule complete with wall.

     Invasion of Afghanistan, Iraq and the planned attack on Iran.

     The pollonium poisoning of Arafat and the failure to honour the Oslo Accords.

     And now, once more, a hammering of the Muslim Ghetto of Gaza.

     

     Scapula

     16 Nov 12 at 9:58 pm
997. But, that’s just the point Jarrah (it was actually 41%). The GOP promoted themselves as aracial without ethnic sympathy, purely economic, whilst the Dems played to their non-White constituency.

     If the GOP were to focus on its natural ethnic constituency it would have picked up enough % to have won the election, and halt the demographic slide.

     No, the Dems can pander to minority instincts – it’s socially acceptable. The GOP cannot “focus on its natural ethnic constituency” – whites – they will be labelled racists. Some may see this as a double standard, but it exists nonetheless.

     The GOP didn’t choose to play ethnic politics, the Dems did. And that’s the key. Until they wake up to this fact then they are doomed to never being re-elected again.

     Nonsense. If the GOP plays “ethnic politics” and specifically pander to the white vote, they will be labelled – with some justification – as neo-KKKlansmen. The strategy you are spruiking would be electoral suicide, and would radically shrink their share of the white vote, let alone the total vote. It would probably destroy the party, too.

     No, the GOP do not have the option today of pandering to the white vote like the Dems used to several decades ago.

     See, this is why the GOP is the Stupid Party and the Democrats are the Evil Party. The Democrats have employed the same very nasty, socially divisive policy of divide and conquer that they’ve used for over a hundred years – they’ve merely shifted constituencies.

     

     Oh come on

     16 Nov 12 at 9:59 pm
998. That’s great because I wasn’t disputing it or supporting it.

     The point is scale economies alone can make it economic, not sustained technological progress, which monty thinks will stop – because we can’t tell the future – thus predicting a steady state is valid?

     

     .

     16 Nov 12 at 10:00 pm
999. For example, the Anglicans automatically refer complaints about their clergy to the police (not identifying complainants if they don’t want it). This is important for identifying patterns of complaints/abuse which otherwise might not emerge.

     They also have a nationwide register of complaints, again for similar reasons, so clergy can not move around and remain undetected because no one knows of previous suspicions.

     Clergy cannot “move” because of “complaints” and “suspicions”?

     I call bullshit.

     I have to point out again the laughable, disgraceful hypocrisy of the Victorian police ‘force.’ These are the very same people who wet their beds and ordered everyone not to talk about the past of a certain convicted serial rapist a few months ago. They and the Victorian justice system just moved him on to a new location. Then they threatened critics with jail for publicising the fact. But now they have the sheer brass neck and gall to criticise the Catholic Church for not putting various priests’ faces on milk cartons. The Victorian police – hard at work.

     

     C.L.

     16 Nov 12 at 10:08 pm
1000. Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Lebanon
      .. not one occupied by anyone I recognise

      Afghanistan, Iraq..not occupied by anyone

      a hammering of the Muslim Ghetto of Gaza. Yeah and if you were a Jew you would probably sit whimpering on your fat arse as the missiles came in…

      

      max49

      16 Nov 12 at 10:09 pm
1001. Pell is hardly papabile. Australia is not important enough in the Catholic world.

      

      Julian O'Dea

      16 Nov 12 at 10:13 pm
1002. I don’t think we have really a difference of opinion Dot. A higher price should induce more efficient fuel consumption over time. A much better outcome than the shock of a declining supply.

      

      sdfc

      16 Nov 12 at 10:16 pm
1003. The pollonium poisoning of Arafa

      Not true Bob ..I don’t think they have even dug him up yet…and even if he was who cares the murderous swine..

      

      max49

      16 Nov 12 at 10:24 pm
1004. “Mr Blewitt, who has admitted he was involved in fraud, said from Malaysia last night Mr Wilson told him to exit quickly with a redundancy payout. “He told me, ‘We are all out, we are gone, the game’s up – the best deal you can do is a redundancy package because they are going to try to get you if you stay’,” he said.

      But the sudden allocation of redundancy to the men being ousted because of their suspected fraud meant the AWU could not afford to look after the families of deceased members who were supposed to receive “7 to 8 Bereavement Grants” cheques.

      The diary reveals Mr Cambridge’s anger that the redundancies meant “the Bereavement Grants would simply have to wait for six months or so”.”

      —–

      From The Australian article today called “Rushed cheques and a quiet exit:” etc (google those words if you want to read it).

      These people are lower than a snake’s belly. What a pity the article did not name the members of the AWU executive who thought that paying off criminals was more important than looking after the bereaved families of deceased members.

      

      johanna

      16 Nov 12 at 10:28 pm
1005. Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Lebanon
      .. not one occupied by anyone I recognise

      The West Bank is more than being occupied, parts of it are being appropriated.

      

      sdfc

      16 Nov 12 at 10:28 pm
1006. Sinai of Egypt was occupied, the Golan Heights of Syria is occupied, the Sheba Farms of Lebanon occupied.

      Gaza is blockaded and the West Bank is mostly effectively occupied.

      Iraq was occupied and Afghanistan currently is under de facto occupation.

      

      Scapula

      16 Nov 12 at 10:29 pm
1007. Sinai of Egypt was occupied,..not now ..so wrong

      Golan Heights of Syria is occupied..not greater Syria..just a small portion..wrong

      Sheba Farms of Lebanon occupied…as above

      Iraq was occupied and Afghanistan currently is under de facto occupation….Iraq not occupied…wrong

      Afghanistan…sort of maybe..but wrong…when do Marxists give up lying..obfuscating,misrepresenting and the crime of omission…

      

      max49

      16 Nov 12 at 10:37 pm
1008. Invasion of Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Lebanon and Gaza.

      Yep, ok. Delusion – youre doing it right.

      Construction of an apartheid system

      Where i come from that is called bullshit.

      The pollonium poisoning of Arafat

      That is what a howler monkey with a tinfoil hat throwing poo at its own reflection would say.

      Seek professional help before you self harm.

      

      Carpe Jugulum

      16 Nov 12 at 10:45 pm
1009. parts of it are being cultivated appropriated

      FTFY

      

      Carpe Jugulum

      16 Nov 12 at 10:48 pm
1010. Sorry folks, not a good link before. This is a better one for tonight’s listening:

      100 Must Have Movie Classics

      Currently enjoying track 32. Anyone else have this?

      

      Septimus

      16 Nov 12 at 10:48 pm
1011. The former East Prussia was more than occupied.
      The West Bank, not so much.

      

      lotocoti

      16 Nov 12 at 10:48 pm
1012. The West Bank is indeed being appropriated, but first it had to be occupied, olive trees uprooted, houses burnt to the ground and the like.

      

      Scapula

      16 Nov 12 at 10:52 pm
1013. and he sits in Palm Beach one of the most salubrious area’s of Sydney pontificating…If you think it is so good Bob why don’t you move down to South West Sydney and put up with what less well heeled poor bastards do…my bet is you would not last a day …

      

      max49

      16 Nov 12 at 10:52 pm
1014. These people are lower than a snake’s belly. What a pity the article did not name the members of the AWU executive who thought that paying off criminals was more important than looking after the bereaved families of deceased members.

      The leftist trolls who infest here are lower than a snake’s belly. They are equivalent to what they perceive to be the Catholic hierarchy and their cover-ups.

      They are selective, moral vacuums.

      

      Lazlo

      16 Nov 12 at 10:53 pm
1015. Half of Europe was occupied, trees uprooted, houses burned to the ground and the like.

      Can anyone play this game?

      

      Gab

      16 Nov 12 at 10:54 pm
1016. Terra Nullius then carpe?

      

      sdfc

      16 Nov 12 at 10:55 pm
1017. Terra Nullius then carpe?

      

      sdfc

      16 Nov 12 at 10:55 pm
1018. SBS now broadcasting Al Jahzeera spin referring to ‘retaliatory rocket strikes’.

      Arf! Is McTernan moonlighting?

      

      Lazlo

      16 Nov 12 at 10:55 pm
1019. but first it had to be occupied,

      70′s and late 60′s Uni’s didnt really work did they Bob…

      

      max49

      16 Nov 12 at 10:56 pm
1020. Wall Street was occupied…

      

      Gab

      16 Nov 12 at 10:57 pm
1021. Scrappy – Gaza is not occupied. It was vacated in 2005.

      Do Try to keep up. It is from Gaza that Hamas (the terrorist organisation) is lobbing missles onto civilains.

      But of course you BDS supporting terrorist apologists don’t worry about that. It doesn’t fit your meme.

      

      Carpe Jugulum

      16 Nov 12 at 10:57 pm
1022. Gough has a lot to answer for…

      

      max49

      16 Nov 12 at 11:02 pm
1023. Terra Nullius then carpe?

      I have no idea what you are on about sdfc.

      Perhaps you should put away the crack pipe.

      

      Carpe Jugulum

      16 Nov 12 at 11:02 pm
1024. The urising in Gaza is freedom in action.

      

      Scapula

      16 Nov 12 at 11:05 pm
1025. Half of Europe was occupied, trees uprooted, houses burned to the ground and the like.

      Can anyone play this game?

      Of course Gab ..its called the lefty emotive card ..distant relative of the gender card..

      

      max49

      16 Nov 12 at 11:07 pm
1026. These people are lower than a snake’s belly. What a pity the article did not name the members of the AWU executive who thought that paying off criminals was more important than looking after the bereaved families of deceased members.

      It is utterly unbelievable that these criminals and their bag lady in Federal parliament are getting away with this travesty of corruption. I can think of no time in political history where a serving prime minister could be shown to have received $5000 in a secret payment from a notorious criminal and not be dragooned into answering questions by a stunned press gallery.

      

      C.L.

      16 Nov 12 at 11:07 pm
1027. An uprising against Hamas and their fascist regime would certainly be freedom in action.

      

      Lazlo

      16 Nov 12 at 11:08 pm
1028. The urising in Gaza is freedom in action.

      Surprised you haven’t wanked yourself to death bny now Bob…

      

      max49

      16 Nov 12 at 11:10 pm
1029. What a pity the article did not name the members of the AWU executive who thought that paying off criminals was more important than looking after the bereaved families of deceased members.

      But Michael Smith has named them. Bill Shorten is on the record as saying that Cambridge has to be stopped, or else ‘we are all going down the gurgler’.

      Smith has the evidence, and the clock is ticking…

      

      Lazlo

      16 Nov 12 at 11:13 pm
1030. but first it had to be occupied, olive trees uprooted, houses burnt to the ground and the like.

      For a moment I thought you meant Kfar Etzion. Then I remembered it was Jewish owned land in the West Bank, which doesn’t count with your sort.

      

      lotocoti

      16 Nov 12 at 11:15 pm
1031. A question for CL
      In the case above, assuming this reporting is correct:
      Mrs Halappanavar died after doctors refused to terminate her 17-week pregnancy, even though they knew her miscarriage was inevitable and there was no chance the foetus would survive.

      So, CL in the case above do you believe an abortion justified or not? Yes or No.

      

      SteveC

      16 Nov 12 at 11:15 pm
1032. What I’m having a fit about sfdc is monty’s assumption that since we cannot tell the future, predicting zero technological growth for any particular industry is the most likely outcome.

      

      .

      16 Nov 12 at 11:17 pm
1033. Currently enjoying track 32. Anyone else have this?

      It looks a good choice for a Christmas present actually, a great range of tracks there

      

      candy

      16 Nov 12 at 11:19 pm
1034. I didn’t get that from Monty’s comment Dot and I’ve had a few drinks and can’t be bothered looking.

      

      sdfc

      16 Nov 12 at 11:21 pm
1035. Good Lord Steve c its been done to death(not intended..the subject)I’m over it..

      

      max49

      16 Nov 12 at 11:22 pm
1036. “Gough has a lot to answer for…”

      except he’s pushing up daisies …

      

      candy

      16 Nov 12 at 11:22 pm
1037. History still passes judgment Candy…

      

      max49

      16 Nov 12 at 11:25 pm
1038. So, CL in the case above do you believe an abortion justified or not? Yes or No.

      No.

      With respect to the 540 women who have died at the hands of abortionists since Roe vs. Wade (CDC figures), does this cause you sadness and shame?

      Yes or no?

      

      C.L.

      16 Nov 12 at 11:35 pm
1039. Fair enough Mk50.

      My current boss is Jewish. He provides me with beers at 3pm on a Friday.

      What I’m trying to say is I’ve struggled to get a ‘dog in the fight’ over the whole mid-east thing.

      

      Greg P.

      16 Nov 12 at 11:38 pm
1040. Hey, not too often we get a genuinely rabid terrorist-loving jew-baiting anti semite racist here at the Cat!

      Scapula, congratulations, you are a rare beast indeed. being genuinely rabid puts you one cut above the normal leftard terrorist-loving jew-baiting anti semite racist.

      Tell me, while you openly boast here about being a jew-baiting anti-semitic racist, do you equally hate black people, Asians and ‘little brown people’ too?

      Anyhoo, gotta run.
      How is it your type signs off? Heil? Is that it?

      TTFN!

      

      Mk50 of Brisbane

      16 Nov 12 at 11:42 pm
1041. “Hey, not too often we get a genuinely rabid terrorist-loving jew-baiting anti semite racist here at the Cat!”

      We still don’t have one.

      

      Jarrah

      16 Nov 12 at 11:46 pm
1042. Gough’s dead? I thought it was Margaret who died?

      

      Splatacrobat

      16 Nov 12 at 11:46 pm
1043. Do you care to disclaim why you give a fuck about the West Bank MK50?

      You got up me and JL the other day for talking about the US election because it ‘didn’t matter’ according to you.

      You seem illogical to me.

      

      Greg P.

      16 Nov 12 at 11:47 pm
1044. Greg P

      That’s hard to do with so much demonisation of Israel in the MSM.

      I worked out which was ‘my’ dog in that fight when I met my first Arab Muslim Israeli many moons ago. A rellie of his had a seat in the Knesset, he was a medical student with an Israeli government scholarship – really nice bloke.

      He was also a homosexual, ‘out’ to his non-Muslim Israeli Jewish and Christian friends only. (He was dating the brother of my then-girlfriend). He said he never went to Arab countries any more, he went to Egypt and they beat him up for being gay, and would have killed him is they had found his Israeli passport.

      After that it was easy – there’s only one liberal western democracy in the entire region and the rest are barbarian hellholes: tyrannies, theocracies or absolute monarchies.

      Another good way to tell is ‘Israeli soldiers put arab kids behind them in a gun battle, arab terrorists hide behind the kids’.

      

      Mk50 of Brisbane

      16 Nov 12 at 11:52 pm
1045. It takes a long time to grow olive vines. And even longer to get a decent fruit. Dont ever try to do it commercially.

      

      Jannie

      16 Nov 12 at 11:53 pm
1046. “After that it was easy – there’s only one liberal western democracy in the entire region and the rest are barbarian hellholes: tyrannies, theocracies or absolute monarchies.”

      Only two sides, one saints the other devils, right? Why am I not surprised.

      

      Jarrah

      16 Nov 12 at 11:55 pm
1047. Only two sides, one saints the other devils, right? Why am I not surprised.

      I agree. Not really buying that story.

      

      Greg P.

      16 Nov 12 at 11:57 pm
1048. Do you care to disclaim why you give a fuck about the West Bank MK50?

      Because I prefer civilised people to barbarians. And many arabs are not barbarians, merely having them in control.

      As an Imperialist, I prefer civilised people and nations to rule barbarians to at least bring enough order to give those who want to be civilised among them the chance to become so. The Romans had the right philosophy in that regard.

      You got up me and JL the other day for talking about the US election because it ‘didn’t matter’ according to you.

      And it still does not, it’s a short term issue and whoever won has few options. Also, I am sick to death of it after a whole flipping year of it.

      Jarrah – seriously? You agree with Crapulon at 9:58 that the Jooooooooooooooooooooooooooos are to blame for everything that’s wrong in the ME?

      Really?

      If he recast it to read “Black people are responsible for [all the garbage he wrote], you would not consider that racist?

      Crapulon is a racist because he demonises Jews. See his 9:58 and tell me he’s not demonising Jews, jarrah.

      

      Mk50 of Brisbane

      17 Nov 12 at 12:05 am
1049. One side is defending its citizens. If there were no rocket attacks on Israel then nothing would be happening.

      Hamas is trying to spin the Israeli response to attacks on its citizens as the issue, ably assisted by the brainless and brainwashed msm and the moral relativists right here.

      

      Lazlo

      17 Nov 12 at 12:07 am
1050. My homosexual arab banking client was severely victimised by the Qatrai Royal Family so he left his 4 wives and 87 children behind to pursue a life of sexual freedom in London, only to be met with racial discrimination of the vilest kind.

      Restauranteurs would continually give him and his ‘partner’ the window seat. Nightclub owners would offer to cordon off 1/2 their club due to his credit card limit etc…

      …so I joined the Palestinian Freedom Fighters Cause.

      Kidding. Just wanted a go at it myself.

      

      Greg P.

      17 Nov 12 at 12:09 am
1051. Only two sides, one saints the other devils, right? Why am I not surprised.

      Please do not attempt to put words into my mouth, Jarrah. A simple chap like you might think of the world in such simple terms, but not I. I’ve lived this shit for way too long.

      Multiple sides in ever-shifting mosaics of alliance de jour, locked into a situation where they cannot live with each other and cannot live without each other, with specific factors (islamism, trans-national criminal entities, terrorist entities, sectarian and communal hatreds, international interference, oil politics, family politics and several dozen more variables) endlessly making it worse.

      Our best frigging analytical matrix for analysing this crapfight was four dimensional and the theoretical mathematician who came up with it was half mad.

      And a redneck-greenie, oddly. Never did figure that out.

      

      Mk50 of Brisbane

      17 Nov 12 at 12:13 am
1052. very funny, GP.

      look up this name: Abdulwahab Darawshe

      

      Mk50 of Brisbane

      17 Nov 12 at 12:17 am
1053. You’ve gotta dog in the fight son.

      Just admit it.

      

      Greg P.

      17 Nov 12 at 12:17 am
1054. So, CL in the case above do you believe an abortion justified or not? Yes or No.

      No.

      CL, you realise that is in effect to endorse the avoidable death of an innocent woman? In fact, we are talking about the death of TWO people in this case, whereas if the abortion had been allowed, there would have been one.

      

      Fisky

      17 Nov 12 at 12:20 am
1055. I’ll level with you.

      All the young analysts in my department were running around today with a case of geo-politikitis. Personally I’d rather they focused on their fucking jobs and stfu.

      Nut still they’d try and tie it into insurance and what not. I told the fuck that “occasionally Israel’s deliver a slapdown on the Pals or whoever they are and nothing develops” yet still i was told this was “the start of WW3″.

      The Mid-East fucking shits me to tears. Female analysts seem to especially love it. Perhaps because they can watch CNN for 30mins then give me the latest update.

      I soon tell them to calm down. They ask me how I am so knowledgeable. I say I’m not it’s just that I read newspapers.

      Fuck the middle-east and it’s fucking boosters.

      

      Greg P.

      17 Nov 12 at 12:27 am
1056. “Jarrah – seriously? You agree with Crapulon at 9:58 that the Jooooooooooooooooooooooooooos are to blame for everything that’s wrong in the ME? ”

      When have I EVER given you reason to believe such a stupidity? In fact, when has Scapula ever done that?

      Drop the strawman arguments, and engage with the issues, or be ignored as a troll on the subject.

      “Please do not attempt to put words into my mouth, Jarrah. ”

      Oh cripes, the irony, IT BURNS.

      

      Jarrah

      17 Nov 12 at 1:51 am
1057. As an Imperialist, I prefer civilised people and nations to rule barbarians to at least bring enough order to give those who want to be civilised among them the chance to become so. The Romans had the right philosophy in that regard.

      Oh cripes, the irony, IT BURNS.

      Quite.

      

      m0nty

      17 Nov 12 at 8:56 am