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	<title>Comments on: Who owns the debt?</title>
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	<link>http://catallaxyfiles.com/2013/02/05/who-owns-the-debt/</link>
	<description>Australia&#039;s leading libertarian and centre-right blog</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Thu, 23 May 2013 04:40:18 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: .</title>
		<link>http://catallaxyfiles.com/2013/02/05/who-owns-the-debt/comment-page-1/#comment-720028</link>
		<dc:creator>.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Feb 2013 21:57:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://catallaxyfiles.ozblogistan.com.au/?p=39396#comment-720028</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[If we have a persistent CAD, it is because of persistent inflation. 

Tackle inflation first, then what happens next is going to be desirable.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If we have a persistent CAD, it is because of persistent inflation. </p>
<p>Tackle inflation first, then what happens next is going to be desirable.</p>
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		<title>By: Bruce</title>
		<link>http://catallaxyfiles.com/2013/02/05/who-owns-the-debt/comment-page-1/#comment-719963</link>
		<dc:creator>Bruce</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Feb 2013 20:49:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://catallaxyfiles.ozblogistan.com.au/?p=39396#comment-719963</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[As a result of Basel III a lot more government bonds are being held by banks around the world.

Also there is a degree of soft coercion since banks in the US and EU must buy their own governments&#039; bonds or incur the wrath of those governments.  After the GFC banks have no means to defend against government standover tactics.

As a result most of the bonds of countries like Greece and Spain are owned by their own banks.  If the country goes down so do the banks.  And possibly the EU too due to LTRO-style recycling of dodgy government bonds as collateral into cold hard cash via the ECB.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As a result of Basel III a lot more government bonds are being held by banks around the world.</p>
<p>Also there is a degree of soft coercion since banks in the US and EU must buy their own governments&#8217; bonds or incur the wrath of those governments.  After the GFC banks have no means to defend against government standover tactics.</p>
<p>As a result most of the bonds of countries like Greece and Spain are owned by their own banks.  If the country goes down so do the banks.  And possibly the EU too due to LTRO-style recycling of dodgy government bonds as collateral into cold hard cash via the ECB.</p>
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		<title>By: Forester</title>
		<link>http://catallaxyfiles.com/2013/02/05/who-owns-the-debt/comment-page-1/#comment-719956</link>
		<dc:creator>Forester</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Feb 2013 20:38:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://catallaxyfiles.ozblogistan.com.au/?p=39396#comment-719956</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The truly productive and their kids pay for everything either now or in the future. Socialists think they own everything and let you keep a bit of it. Lucky for the USA the productive own guns and are prepared to use them to stop the Socialists from taking all of it.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The truly productive and their kids pay for everything either now or in the future. Socialists think they own everything and let you keep a bit of it. Lucky for the USA the productive own guns and are prepared to use them to stop the Socialists from taking all of it.</p>
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		<title>By: Winston Smith</title>
		<link>http://catallaxyfiles.com/2013/02/05/who-owns-the-debt/comment-page-1/#comment-719904</link>
		<dc:creator>Winston Smith</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Feb 2013 16:47:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://catallaxyfiles.ozblogistan.com.au/?p=39396#comment-719904</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I&#039;ve always wondered why the government keeps borrowing money off the banks, when they could pay off the debt, self fund, and keep all that interest to itself.
Or even give it back to the taxpayers.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve always wondered why the government keeps borrowing money off the banks, when they could pay off the debt, self fund, and keep all that interest to itself.<br />
Or even give it back to the taxpayers.</p>
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		<title>By: Mother Hubbard's Dog</title>
		<link>http://catallaxyfiles.com/2013/02/05/who-owns-the-debt/comment-page-1/#comment-719670</link>
		<dc:creator>Mother Hubbard's Dog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Feb 2013 10:08:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://catallaxyfiles.ozblogistan.com.au/?p=39396#comment-719670</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[A more relevant question for Australia is our long term CAD. When, I wonder, do our government think we will finally manage to finance our own investments, our own borrowings for housing and our own consumption? Not to mention managing to actually reduce the interest bill on our collective overseas borrowings.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>A more relevant question for Australia is our long term CAD. When, I wonder, do our government think we will finally manage to finance our own investments, our own borrowings for housing and our own consumption? Not to mention managing to actually reduce the interest bill on our collective overseas borrowings.</p>
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		<title>By: Aliice</title>
		<link>http://catallaxyfiles.com/2013/02/05/who-owns-the-debt/comment-page-1/#comment-719615</link>
		<dc:creator>Aliice</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Feb 2013 09:20:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://catallaxyfiles.ozblogistan.com.au/?p=39396#comment-719615</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[LOl Jump its just about right.

They are also raising super so you can pay the interest on the debt every tome the share market crashes.

There is now three things you can be sure of  and one you cant be sure of
a) death, b) taxes c) unterest d) super 

 d) which you may never see because of a) b) and c).]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>LOl Jump its just about right.</p>
<p>They are also raising super so you can pay the interest on the debt every tome the share market crashes.</p>
<p>There is now three things you can be sure of  and one you cant be sure of<br />
a) death, b) taxes c) unterest d) super </p>
<p> d) which you may never see because of a) b) and c).</p>
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		<title>By: brc</title>
		<link>http://catallaxyfiles.com/2013/02/05/who-owns-the-debt/comment-page-1/#comment-719614</link>
		<dc:creator>brc</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Feb 2013 09:19:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://catallaxyfiles.ozblogistan.com.au/?p=39396#comment-719614</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[The fundamental problem is that people confuse individuals with a government, and think they are the same thing.

It&#039;s all very well to say &#039;we owe it to ourselves&#039; but if the government stops paying, a lot of pension funds and other income-reliant instruments are going to stop paying people, and they&#039;re going to lose just about everything.

This kinds of woolly thinking is designed to obscure what is going on sufficiently to allow it to continue indefinitely.  Well, it can&#039;t and it won&#039;t.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The fundamental problem is that people confuse individuals with a government, and think they are the same thing.</p>
<p>It&#8217;s all very well to say &#8216;we owe it to ourselves&#8217; but if the government stops paying, a lot of pension funds and other income-reliant instruments are going to stop paying people, and they&#8217;re going to lose just about everything.</p>
<p>This kinds of woolly thinking is designed to obscure what is going on sufficiently to allow it to continue indefinitely.  Well, it can&#8217;t and it won&#8217;t.</p>
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		<title>By: jumpnmcar</title>
		<link>http://catallaxyfiles.com/2013/02/05/who-owns-the-debt/comment-page-1/#comment-719612</link>
		<dc:creator>jumpnmcar</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Feb 2013 09:14:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://catallaxyfiles.ozblogistan.com.au/?p=39396#comment-719612</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[This is too deep for the likes of me.
All I know is I&#039;m paying the interest as an individual borrower.
I&#039;m paying the interest on local council debt as a rate payer. 
I&#039;m paying the interest on state debt.
And I&#039;m paying the interest on Federal debt.
I hope we don&#039;t discover intelligent life on another planet or I&#039;ll be paying the interest on the debt we humans will inevitably owe them.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is too deep for the likes of me.<br />
All I know is I&#8217;m paying the interest as an individual borrower.<br />
I&#8217;m paying the interest on local council debt as a rate payer.<br />
I&#8217;m paying the interest on state debt.<br />
And I&#8217;m paying the interest on Federal debt.<br />
I hope we don&#8217;t discover intelligent life on another planet or I&#8217;ll be paying the interest on the debt we humans will inevitably owe them.</p>
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		<title>By: JamesK</title>
		<link>http://catallaxyfiles.com/2013/02/05/who-owns-the-debt/comment-page-1/#comment-719609</link>
		<dc:creator>JamesK</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Feb 2013 09:12:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://catallaxyfiles.ozblogistan.com.au/?p=39396#comment-719609</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Obummer campaigning on the Letterman Show to answer probing questions as is his wont:

&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2012/09/18/obama_on_debt_we_dont_have_to_worry_about_it_short_term.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;
Obama On Debt: &quot;We Don&#039;t Have To Worry About It Short Term&quot;&lt;/a&gt;
&lt;blockquote&gt;
President Obama addressed the debt and deficit, saying it is not a problem in the &quot;short term,&quot; during an appearance on CBS&#039;s &quot;Late Show&quot; with host David Letterman. Obama also said he did not know what the national debt was when he took office.

When a concerned Letterman asked him about the debt, Obama laid the responsibility for the U.S. national debt and deficit on his predecessor former President George W. Bush.

&quot;Well, here&#039;s what happened. We had a surplus when Bill Clinton was president,&quot; Obama said. &quot;It was projected to continue to be a surplus. We decided to launch two wars on a credit card. We cut taxes twice without finding offsetting costs for it or ways to pay for it, a prescription drug plan and then we had a massive recession.&quot;

&quot;When I walked into office we had a trillion dollar deficit, debt had mounted and then we had to take a bunch of emergency measures, that cost money, saving the auto industry, making sure that the financial system got back on track,&quot; Obama said.

&quot;So now what we&#039;ve got to do is we&#039;ve got to pare down that deficit, get that debt under control and I think the only way we&#039;ve ever been able to do that effectively is when you do it in a balanced way,&quot; Obama explained.

&lt;strong&gt;When asked if he remember what the national debt was when he entered office, President Obama said &quot;I don&#039;t know what the number was precisely.&quot; Obama told Letterman &quot;we don&#039;t have to worry about it short term.&quot;

&quot;A lot of it we owe to ourselves. Because if you invest in a treasury bill or something like that then essentially you&#039;re loaning the government money. &lt;em&gt;In fact, the majority of it is held by folks who live here, but we don&#039;t have to worry about it short term&lt;/em&gt;,&quot; Obama said.&lt;/strong&gt;

&quot;Right now interest rates are low because people still consider the United States the safest and greatest country on earth, rightfully so, but it is a problem long term and even medium-term. And so we&#039;re going to have to take care of this debt and deficit, but we&#039;ve got to do it in a balanced way,&quot; he added.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

So according to Obummer as the debt he has increased from 60% of GDP to 110% of GDP in 4 years is owed to Americans it&#039;s not such a pressing problem, apparently]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Obummer campaigning on the Letterman Show to answer probing questions as is his wont:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2012/09/18/obama_on_debt_we_dont_have_to_worry_about_it_short_term.html" rel="nofollow"><br />
Obama On Debt: &#8220;We Don&#8217;t Have To Worry About It Short Term&#8221;</a></p>
<blockquote><p>
President Obama addressed the debt and deficit, saying it is not a problem in the &#8220;short term,&#8221; during an appearance on CBS&#8217;s &#8220;Late Show&#8221; with host David Letterman. Obama also said he did not know what the national debt was when he took office.</p>
<p>When a concerned Letterman asked him about the debt, Obama laid the responsibility for the U.S. national debt and deficit on his predecessor former President George W. Bush.</p>
<p>&#8220;Well, here&#8217;s what happened. We had a surplus when Bill Clinton was president,&#8221; Obama said. &#8220;It was projected to continue to be a surplus. We decided to launch two wars on a credit card. We cut taxes twice without finding offsetting costs for it or ways to pay for it, a prescription drug plan and then we had a massive recession.&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8220;When I walked into office we had a trillion dollar deficit, debt had mounted and then we had to take a bunch of emergency measures, that cost money, saving the auto industry, making sure that the financial system got back on track,&#8221; Obama said.</p>
<p>&#8220;So now what we&#8217;ve got to do is we&#8217;ve got to pare down that deficit, get that debt under control and I think the only way we&#8217;ve ever been able to do that effectively is when you do it in a balanced way,&#8221; Obama explained.</p>
<p><strong>When asked if he remember what the national debt was when he entered office, President Obama said &#8220;I don&#8217;t know what the number was precisely.&#8221; Obama told Letterman &#8220;we don&#8217;t have to worry about it short term.&#8221;</p>
<p>&#8220;A lot of it we owe to ourselves. Because if you invest in a treasury bill or something like that then essentially you&#8217;re loaning the government money. <em>In fact, the majority of it is held by folks who live here, but we don&#8217;t have to worry about it short term</em>,&#8221; Obama said.</strong></p>
<p>&#8220;Right now interest rates are low because people still consider the United States the safest and greatest country on earth, rightfully so, but it is a problem long term and even medium-term. And so we&#8217;re going to have to take care of this debt and deficit, but we&#8217;ve got to do it in a balanced way,&#8221; he added.</p></blockquote>
<p>So according to Obummer as the debt he has increased from 60% of GDP to 110% of GDP in 4 years is owed to Americans it&#8217;s not such a pressing problem, apparently</p>
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		<title>By: The Beer Whisperer</title>
		<link>http://catallaxyfiles.com/2013/02/05/who-owns-the-debt/comment-page-1/#comment-719601</link>
		<dc:creator>The Beer Whisperer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 Feb 2013 09:07:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://catallaxyfiles.ozblogistan.com.au/?p=39396#comment-719601</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[&quot;I wonder if our leftist/keynesian friends have ever considered even the possiblity that their ideas are directly causing the worst possible kind of inequality? I’d bet my house on ‘no’.&quot;

I&#039;d bet my house &quot;yes&quot;.  Since when was robbing from the rich(er than them) against their &quot;principles&quot;?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;I wonder if our leftist/keynesian friends have ever considered even the possiblity that their ideas are directly causing the worst possible kind of inequality? I’d bet my house on ‘no’.&#8221;</p>
<p>I&#8217;d bet my house &#8220;yes&#8221;.  Since when was robbing from the rich(er than them) against their &#8220;principles&#8221;?</p>
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