Nanny State bans birthday cake – Hewson overjoyed.

KIDS will be banned from blowing out candles on communal birthday cakes, under strict new hygiene rules for childcare.

But doctors warn the latest National Health and Medical Research Council (NHMRC) guidelines go too far in “bubble-wrapping” children.

The NHMRC is urging childcare centres to stand up to parents who insist on sending a sick child to daycare – even if they have a medical certificate. And daycare staff will now have to wash toys, doorknobs, floors and cushion covers every day.

The new guidelines state children who want to blow out a candle on their birthday should bring their very own cupcake – to avoid blowing germs all over a shared cake.

Busybodies have too much time on the their hands – and too much government money.

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109 Responses to Nanny State bans birthday cake – Hewson overjoyed.

  1. Judith Sloan

    Maybe we should ban birthdays too. Lowers the self esteem of the non-birthday children!

  2. Grey

    Vanity, vanity, all his vanity, sayeth the Preacher, there is nothing new under sun and what-not

    The ban on birthday cakes was issued by the NHMRC in 2006 under the personal diktat of John “Nannycrat” Howard

    When it is a child’s birthday, many children
    like to bring a cake to share with their friends.
    One of the ways of minimising the spread
    of droplet infection, is to encourage parents
    to provide individual cupcakes with a single
    candle on the birthday child’s cake.

    http://www.nhmrc.gov.au/_files_nhmrc/publications/attachments/ch43.pdf – page 24

    Indeed the new guidelines do state what the Daily Telegraph claims, but then so did the guidelines before the new guidelines, and even the guidelines before those guidelines. Not really surprising that it took News Limited 7 years to catch up.

  3. .

    It’s a stupid rule and it ought to be ignored regardless of who came up with it.

  4. C.L.

    A left-wing public servant came up with it.

  5. Gab

    True, Grey. The 5th edition is almost verbatim to the 4th edition and yet it is being touted by Plebeserk and Ellis as “new” when it’s just a rehash. Although I get the impression it is now no longer merely a guideline…

  6. Pickles

    Those tractor factories won’t run themselves you know.

    creche

  7. Dan

    I don’t think the government has a moral right to be involved but I think it a truly disgusting practice especially as I attend a lot of these parties and see two-year-olds spitting snot over a cake.

  8. Reminds me of the posters that appeared in the toilets at my old public service job during the great swine flu hoax – instructions on how to wash your hands! People joke about the nanny state telling you how to wipe your arse but that probably won’t be too far away.

  9. Andrew

    Hewson has become a nanny-statist, so he would be happy in more than one respect.

  10. Craig Mc

    I’ve worked at places where people needed instructions to point their arse towards the toilet bowl when having a crap.

  11. lotocoti

    but I think it a truly disgusting practice …

    Unfortunately for the rest of us, there are people echoing your sentiment who are prepared to take their ‘disgust’ further up the nanny chain and lumber everyone with such absurdities.

  12. Jim Rose

    Get over it Sinclair, this is all as predicted in Gary Becker’s demand for the quantity and quality of children.

    As the size of families fall, parents spend more time doting over the one or two children they have.

    Many aspects of life are treated with more care than in our childhoods because the demand for health and safety are superior goods.

    As incomes rise, the willing of adults to risk drinking and driving falls as has the willingness to let children take risks. Richer is safer. Wealthier is healthier.

  13. They had those “How to Have a Crap” Posters on the wall when I first got to this Clinic.
    Needless to say, they are now little bits of Carbonicles floating in the wind…

  14. Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

    It’s more an aesthetic reaction than a serious medical one and needs to be called as such.

    Do we stop little kids huggin’ and kissin’ each other as they are wont to do? It’s all da same germs, as Da Hairy Ape righly tells me about my aesthetically unshared drink bottle. :)

  15. candy

    Well an infection spread in your kid’s child care centre spreads and they’re sick, and parents naturally take time off work to care for them – all problematic in various ways.

    so perhaps not such a bad idea.

  16. Pedro

    That’s right, anyone who’s looked around a group of kids will see the germs are already pretty well shared. After all, they spread lice pretty quick and that requires hair in contact.

    Yesterday I heard of a parent in our school expecting notification of threadworms. Sheesh.

  17. Gab

    Back in the olds days, kids being exposed to germs was thought to strengthen the immune system.

  18. dianeh

    Lets face it, if a sick kid goes to daycare, the other kids catch the illness. Same with school. It is not blowing out candles on a cake that causes it, it is contact between the kids, and contact via surfaces.

    The trouble is it is not always obvious that a child is sick. My daughter looks to be right as rain in the morning but by lunch has a raging temperature and I have to pick her up from school. She has always been the same. It is usually tonsilitis, and it comes on suddenly and severely and is infectious. She gets it from somewhere, and that somewhere is school, and there are usually no birthday cakes in sight.

    I believe that wiping down surfaces ie tables, toilets, door knobs etc daily is a good thing. But the whole building doesnt need doing over unless there is gastro or something going through the kids.

  19. C.L.

    Today’s children need more germs, more dirt, more scratches and more rough-housing. I wonder if even some parents nowadays know what a gravel rash is.

  20. Jim Rose

    Back in the olds days, kids being exposed to germs was thought to strengthen the immune system.

    I read somewhere thatallegies are much less in east germany as compared to west germany because the east was a tougher upbringing.

  21. brc

    Anyone remotely familiar with childcare will note the extraordinary amount of allergies getting around these days. I don’t know if this is better awareness and reporting but it seems like most kids are allergic to something

    I’ve always worked on the bush doctor theory that these kids haven’t been exposed to enough dirt, but I’m sure a study somewhere disproves my theory.

  22. dianeh

    BTW, my daughter suffered congenital health problems as a baby/toddler and often had breathing difficulties. We were advised to never put her into daycare, and to watch her carefully at pre-school. She was high risk due to her illness. We had enough sleepless nights and visits to Emergency as it was, without the bugs running around daycare. She is a lot stronger and less susceptible now but we still have to be vigilant.

    If the idea is to make daycare safer for kids like mine, then the govt is wasting its time. Healthy kids will survive the childhood illnesses from daycare, regardless of spit on birthday cakes or not.

  23. Jim Rose

    When the rule that children must wear hats in the playground was introduced, my sister, who is a teacher, told me of a standoff with the parents of one child. he had to stay inside as a result.

    The parents were recent migrants, money was tight, and they thought the hat was a waste of money for their child. They had migrated from Nigeria.

  24. Jim Rose

    when my nephew visited a school for a talk as the local police constable, he had to sit at the other end of the room because he ate peanut butter with his breakfast

  25. Fleeced

    It’s just bloody embarrassing that the Federal government interferes at this level… I mean, FFS.

  26. Many aspects of life are treated with more care than in our childhoods because the demand for health and safety are superior goods.

    But is there any proof that bubble-wrapping our children and coating them in anti-bacterial gel every 10 minutes is actually improving their collective health?

    We’re seeing “epidemics” of diseases in children that just weren’t huge issues when I was young, for instance. I didn’t know a single child on anti-depressants, anti-psychotics, tranquilizers, or speed; there were exactly three children with asthma in my school; two fatty boom-bahs; none with fatal peanut allergies (one girl had a thing where strawberries made her break out into a rash, but); there was one autistic child in our neighborhood…

    So is there quantitative empirical evidence that today’s cohort of, say, 1 to 10 year olds are healthier (physically & mentally) than Gen-Xers were when we were 1 to 10?

    Or is it just the vibe of the thing?

  27. Craig Mc

    Back in the olds days, kids being exposed to germs was thought to strengthen the immune system.

    Mothers used to have their kids “visit” other kids who had chicken-pox. Would that be child abuse now?

  28. Gab

    none with fatal peanut allergies

    I’m surprised PB hasn’t been banned altogether.

  29. C.L.

    God, I’m glad I wasn’t ‘cared’ for in the Goo-ga Archipelago. We were at home riding bikes, building stuff made out of dirt, squatting by creeks catching tadpoles, capturing lizards, toad hunting with cricket stumps, brawling, swimming in the ocean, shooting at magpies with gings, go-carting, sailing matchbox boats in the rain-flooded gutters, getting bumped and bruised…

    And scoffing Mum’s patty cakes. :)

  30. .

    Fleeced

    I think it is a national embarrassment there is a “Minister for Families”

    WTF? The plebs don’t know how to have a family? The ALP thinks we’re a bunch of retards.

  31. Gab

    Peh. Patty cakes are for wussies. Mud cakes (dirt + h20 for) are wot Real kids had.

  32. Jim Rose

    two fatty boom-bahs

    I still remember the names of the two high school mates who had a little baby fat.

    Rising incomes allows people to both eat more food, survive early childhood and be treated for problems that were previously left untreated and led to suicides.

    • How many of your class mates had polio, Hepatitis B, diphtheria, Measles, mumps, rubella, tetanus and other epidemic diseases now forgotten?

    • children born in the 1920s had a 10% chance of dying before they were 15.

    Charles Murray pointed out that in the good old days, the three Rs were successfully taught because a lot of people unsuited for school dropped out much earlier so they were not included in good old days measures of success. Let today’s schools not report the test results for the children that schools in 1950s did not have to teach

    The average years of schooling was 7 or 8 years 50 years ago. See http://www.voxeu.org/article/educational-attainment-world-1950-2010

    An average of ten years school was achieved in 1990.

  33. Tapdog

    I’ve worked at places where people needed instructions to point their arse towards the toilet bowl when having a crap

    You mean like…. this place ?

  34. It’s to minimise the risk of being sued by someone whose kid catches cold from an infected cake, isn’t it?

    I know someone who works as a cook at a nursing homes and though I can’t remember the details it sounded like they have a similar situation there.

  35. dover_beach

    If you’re like me, you look at the multiple scares all over your body, and the like, and are reminded of the innumerable dangers you survived as a child. Of being hit by cars while riding/ skateboarding, of falling from trees or fences, of pack marking on gravel playgrounds, and so on. And you think of all these with a smile on you face, I certainly do.

  36. Leigh Lowe

    I’ve worked at places where people needed instructions to point their arse towards the toilet bowl when having a crap.

    Really?
    I’ve worked at places where I wish people had been instructed to point their arse towards the toilet bowl when having a crap.

  37. Pedro

    “Of being hit by cars while riding/ skateboarding, of falling from trees or fences, of pack marking on gravel playgrounds, and so on. And you think of all these with a smile on you face, I certainly do.”

    Unless you’re dead from that accident with the car, in which case you look like crap. Some of the things we used to do were stupid and the kids who died or were maimed suffered. Let’s not get too glossy about the GODs, I think the helicopter parenting has gone too far, but I don’t let my young girls ride their scooters to school unsupervised.

  38. Infidel Tiger

    Today’s children need more germs, more dirt, more scratches and more rough-housing. I wonder if even some parents nowadays know what a gravel rash is.

    Kids these days suffer from X-Box thumb, not skinned knees and elbows.

    I spent half my life covered in Mercurochrome. Which probably explains why I’m as mad as a hatter.

  39. thefrollickingmole

    You go to a 19th century part of the graveyard and check the “catchall” diagnosis for a lot of early childhood deaths as “sunstroke” or similar vague reasons.

    Id say the allergies have always been there, but more people survive to pass them on now.

    That said the new business premises Im buying is… an ex-childcare center.
    The new regs and staffing requirements (particularly a uni qualified person) was what sent them broke. (so the chap says).

    Great center though, roof is lead and asbestos!

  40. Infidel Tiger

    I stuck a finger full of peanut butter in my kids mouth the other day just to make sure he wasn’t one of these modern day bubble boys.

    All good.

  41. C.L.

    Some of the things we used to do were stupid and the kids who died or were maimed suffered. Let’s not get too glossy about the GODs…

    Thanks for setting us straight, Nicola.

  42. Grey

    I’ve worked at places where people needed instructions to point their arse towards the toilet bowl when having a crap

    Good Lord, I had no idea that working conditions at the IPA were so squalid.
    Something should be done. I would be happy to provide Tim Wilson with a toilet brush and a set of easy instructions.

  43. dover_beach

    Pedro, lucky for me, the three cars that hit me managed to wash the majority of their force off by the time I meet them but by God each instance hurt, particularly the accident on my skateboard, where I had the presence of mind to jump before the collision.

  44. • How many of your class mates had polio, Hepatitis B, diphtheria, Measles, mumps, rubella, tetanus and other epidemic diseases now forgotten?

    I wasn’t questioning whether vaccines made a quantitative empirical improvement to children’s lives. They do. The science is settled on that one.

    My question was, “But is there any proof that bubble-wrapping our children and coating them in anti-bacterial gel every 10 minutes is actually improving their collective health?”. And then I asked, “So is there quantitative empirical evidence that today’s cohort of, say, 1 to 10 year olds are healthier (physically & mentally) than Gen-Xers were when we were 1 to 10?”

    So. Is there?

  45. Infidel Tiger

    By far and away my worst accident was putting a new front wheel on my bike and only doing the nuts up with my hand. I was going to use a spanner later but forgot. When that wheel comes off you are stuffed. I’ve got the fake teeth to prove it.

  46. Gab

    I have a scar on my ankle from skateboarding. A scar on my arm from falling out of tree. I climbed a 20′ steel ladder that was welded to the outside of a second story building so I could watch planes land at Sydney airport. I should get me an “I survived childhood” badge.

  47. Infidel Tiger

    mumps, rubella,

    Had them and chicken pox. Discovered I had chicken pox sitting in church.

  48. C.L.

    I climbed a 20′ steel ladder that was welded to the outside of a second story building so I could watch planes land at Sydney airport.

    A likely story.

    You were cruelly harrassing possums, admit it.

  49. You go to a 19th century part of the graveyard and check the “catchall” diagnosis for a lot of early childhood deaths as “sunstroke” or similar vague reasons.

    Id say the allergies have always been there, but more people survive to pass them on now.

    But I’m not talking about the 19th century. I’m talking about late 1970s, 1980s. Medical science was certainly advanced enough to determine if a child had died of allergic anaphylaxis. Yet as I said, the only food-allergic kid I knew was a girl who got a rash from strawberries. And thankfully, the entire school district didn’t feel compelled to ban the other several hundred kids from bringing strawberries to school.

  50. Gab

    You may recall, CL, I started out harassing fish in my early yoofhood. But clearly a slippery slope from there as it lead my to my possum harassment tendencies.

  51. Harold

    It’s always been a major contradiction that child care is so expensive and yet child carers are paid so little.

    If 1 carer has 8 kids in their care and they charge $30 a day then they get $240 for that day. $1200 a week for the carer and only $30 a day for the parents! They’ll have some expenses of course, but they shouldn’t have to go so great to turn their $1200 into a pittance.

  52. face ache

    Aaaah CL. What memories. What pain. What fun!

  53. thefrollickingmole

    sdog

    No argument its got beyond a joke, but Im just pointing out dying early meant there was a much smaller pool of genes that might carry on a fatal allergy.

    My best playmate as a kid was an old sow pig… even when it had farrowed it was happy to let me climb all over it and play with the piglets..
    Also managed to fracture my skull along both sides of my head (nearly a flip top head) falling off a truck…

  54. Jim Rose

    A better comparison

    • Born in the 1920s: 10% chance of dying before age 15.
    • Born in the 1960s: 1% chance of dying before age 15.

    Part of this 9% reduction was children cut down in their prime but others would have been children with a frail constitution which now shows up in other illnesses rather than an early childhood death. There are many more premature babies surviving albeit with a frail health ahead of them.

    Too many have forgotten the childhood illnesses they survived or never contracted that would have killed in their parents’ generation.

  55. Leigh Lowe

    Here’s a plan.
    If we want regulate behaviour which endangers childhood health, how about we ban the offspring of hippies who don’t believe in vaccination from childcare and kindergarten. You know the type ….. arts graduates the who become instant immunology professors after 2 hours on the internet looking up some crackpot “anti big Pharma” conspiracy website.
    The benefits would be two-fold.
    Frstly, it would cut down the spread of communicable diseases and secondly, it would prevent normal kids contracting shitty hippie attitudes.

  56. dacet street

    Who’s Hewson ???

  57. A better comparison

    • Born in the 1920s: 10% chance of dying before age 15.
    • Born in the 1960s: 1% chance of dying before age 15.

    No, that’s not “a better comparison”.

    As I’ve stated twice now, I’m interested in GenX vs the current crop of kids. Say, born in 1970 or 1975 vs born in 2000 or 2005. I’ve stated my questions twice, shall I try for third time lucky?

    My question was, “But is there any proof that bubble-wrapping our children and coating them in anti-bacterial gel every 10 minutes is actually improving their collective health?”. And then I asked, “So is there quantitative empirical evidence that today’s cohort of, say, 1 to 10 year olds are healthier (physically & mentally) than Gen-Xers were when we were 1 to 10?”

    So. Is there?

  58. Leigh Lowe

    I think it is a national embarrassment there is a “Minister for Families”

    The correct portfolio title should be “Minister for Clueless and Prolific Procreators”

  59. dover_beach

    IT, I have a similar story but without the missing teeth. Must have been about 9 y/o when some friends and I learned you could do endoes with the use of one’s foot. Still only a novice I proceeded to attempt one but was going a little too fast and so went arse over t..My friends almost died laughing.

  60. Clancy of The Underpass

    You can’t have your cake and blow out the candles too.

  61. Rob

    The parents were recent migrants, money was tight, and they thought the hat was a waste of money for their child. They had migrated from Nigeria.

    Ironically black Africans are experiencing Vit D deficiency due to this, they have more difficulty absorbing it. The parents are probably right.

  62. Infidel Tiger

    My best playmate as a kid was an old sow pig… even when it had farrowed it was happy to let me climb all over it and play with the piglets.

    Sounds like Charlotte’s Web.

  63. Pedro

    Here you go sdog, trending up
    http://www.aihw.gov.au/australian-trends-in-life-expectancy/
    but that doesn’t fully answer your question as it won’t necessarily capture the incidence of diseases, espec those that do not kill.

  64. I remember the German Measles Playgroups. Those were the days…

    There’s a reason they’re called childhood diseases. You get them as a kid and generally become immune without any great dramas. Get them as an adult, and it’s bad Karma. Like Mumps.

  65. papachango

    Council run kinders are like some kind of proving ground for ludicrous political correctness, but there is the occasional pocket of resistance.

    Here in the City of Yarra, aka The Most Left Wing Council In The Entire Country (as measured by the number of elected Socialist Party and Greens councillors), one kinder teacher let slip that the Council bureacrats aren’t happy with her because she sits the kids down for lunch at a set time.

    Apparently the PC thing to do is something called a ‘progressive lunch’ where you put the kids’ food on a special table and they can go eat it whenever they like. Something to do with accommodating cultural sensitivities…

    FMD

  66. Rob

    Winston- it may be better to have them early in life if you have to have them but you are better off not having them at all, see the natural experiment in measles taking place in east africa now

  67. Here you go sdog, trending up

    Yeah, no. “Life expectancy” is a whole different thing. More preemies being kept alive and more geriatrics surviving longer is a great thing, as are better cancer treatments etc. That doesn’t tell me whether fat bubble-wrapped kids today, for all the birthday-cake-bans and triclosan-soakings and peanut-shunning and psychotropic drugging and all, are physically and mentally healthier than GenX kids were. I.e., is all this shit actually helping kids?

    Never mind.

  68. candy

    Polio, TB, measles, mumps, thank God all much better left far behind us.

  69. C.L.

    Kids Exposed to Bacteria Have Stronger Immune Systems.

    Fifty percent of Americans aged six to fifty-nine were sensitive to at least one allergen, according to results from a nationally conducted survey by the National Institute of Health (NIH) from 1988 to 1994, up two to five times from rates found in a similar survey completed in 1980. When the study was released, the researchers were surprised by the number, but that number has continued to climb steadily since this survey was completed.

    The apparent reason for these steadily increasing rates is the more sterile lifestyle we live today. The body’s immune system is formed in reaction to foreign, generally harmless substances such as dirt, animal dander, pollen, mold, and particular foods. The more our lifestyle protects us from encounters with such substances, the greater the chance for a reaction when they are finally encountered.

    Exposure to farm animals or pets at an early age could help children avoid developing allergies, according to a study published in the Journal of the American Medical Association (JAMA). This study found that children without pets are more likely to develop allergy related diseases than children with frequent exposure to animals during the first years of their lives.

    This study also found that in the past, when families tended to be larger, children had fewer allergies. Today’s children, raised in smaller families, have fewer siblings and are therefore exposed to fewer germs.

    Being too clean can impair the skin’s ability to heal, according to scientists at the University of California’s School of Medicine. Normal bacteria that live on the skin of active children, children with pets, and kids who live on farms trigger a pathway that prevents inflammation when they get hurt. This pathway leads to a modulated immune response that reduces redness and swelling, and quickens healing.

    Very interesting points about smaller families, fewer siblings.

    Further:

    The increase in the number of children with food allergies is startling. Thirty years ago, food allergies were extremely rare. Today, 4.3 million U.S. children suffer from life-threatening food allergies. The number of children with peanut allergy alone has doubled in five years, and the number continues to grow. Peanut allergies were virtually unknown a few years ago, when peanuts were a popular snack at circuses and carnivals, and the peanut butter and jelly sandwich was the staple of the childhood diet.

    For the past several years, theories have been purposed regarding the effects of our sanitized world on our immune systems. However, the development of more and more products for use in the cleaning of our environments has continued. We have been taught by advertisers that the goal of every housekeeper should be a house that is completely germ free and sterile. And we have been taught that parents whose children are dirty from play are negligent. We have bought into the idea that no matter how many toxic ingredients are contained in household and personal care products, they should be used with ever greater frequency in our homes and on our bodies.

    Also in the news today: one of the country’s most popular contraceptive pills has been withrawn because it causes blot clots – and death.

  70. .

    Always look for the good news though C.L.

    You and JC seem to find the best and worst. You two could write daytime soaps.

    The hero has re-entered the family estate after his plane crash and 3 year stint as a Saudi Prince:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peanut_allergy#Oral_desensitization

    Until a few years ago, desensitisation for peanuts was at the time impossible.

  71. Chris M

    Too many skanky illegal immigrant kids?

  72. “Busybodies have too much time on the their hands – and too much government money.”

    I cannot see how such people could possibly be productive in society. Productive people are too busy producing to worry about such wastes of time.

  73. candy

    I reckon food allergies/poor immune systems/asthma are related to diet of fatty food, sugary food and drinks and processed rubbish that kids are given too regularly, and lack of exercise.

  74. Infidel Tiger

    Polio, TB, measles, mumps, thank God all much better left far behind us.

    Polio is almost gone, but you can be killed by the Taliban for trying to eradicate it

    TB is making a comeback.

    Measles and mumps never went away.

  75. “Do we stop little kids huggin’ and kissin’ each other as they are wont to do? It’s all da same germs, as Da Hairy Ape righly tells me about my aesthetically unshared drink bottle. ”

    Apparently yes. MMM FM had people ringing up this morning with their horror stories about touching bans at schools. The worst i heard was a teenager getting detention for shaking hands with another boy after a game of rugby, FFS!!

    If I was emperor of the world, i would have an official golden glove, for the explicit purpose of slapping the faces of those who enforce such ridiculous rules in the most menial of circumstances.

  76. Rabz

    Peanut allergies were virtually unknown a few years ago, when peanuts were a popular snack at circuses and carnivals, and the peanut butter and jelly sandwich was the staple of the childhood diet.

    Am I the only person who thinks that ‘peanut allergies’ are a psychosomatic load of bullshit?

    Harden up, peanut heads!

  77. Dangph

    No, an anaphylactic reaction is a purely physiological thing. A macho attitude won’t protect you from it.

  78. Rabz

    A macho attitude won’t protect you from it.

    What a pity.

  79. Leigh Lowe

    Peanuts are Charles Darwin’s weapon of choice.

  80. Abu Chowdah

    I’ve worked at places where people needed instructions to point their arse towards the toilet bowl when having a crap.

    You’ve worked in the Middle East and Asia Minor?

  81. brc

    .My friends almost died laughing.

    Death from excessive laughter at a friends mishap is an omnipresent threat of a childhood well lived.

    I still remember when the fat kid in our class slipped over on the muddy slope that ran down to the cricket oval, rolled to the bottom and split his shorts clean in two in the process. There he was, bawling in the mud with a white muddy arse sticking up. Because he was fat, one of the teachers had to lend him a pair of shorts, so he spent the rest of the day with a gigantic pair of shorts held in by a belt.

    Even now it still brings mirth.

  82. Merilyn

    Makes you wonder how us older people ever survived without the help of all these people who know better.

  83. brc

    It would seem that peanuts & dairy, coupled with the new trend of hippies refusing immunisation will finish off the ignorant in society.

    It’s amazing that some people will wax lyrical about the threat of climate change causing some inconvenience for their great-grandchildren but won’t immunise their kids against preventable diseases. Whooping cough, measles, rubella, all seem to be doing the rounds more and more, when these are supposed to be all vaccinated away.

    Not much good worrying about your grandkids facing a 10 cm rise in the harbour level if you’re intent on letting your immediate offspring go to hospital based on internet advice that government vaccination is an evil pharma conspiracy, and that childhood diseases is best prevented by a diet of organic vegetarian fare.

  84. My advice to mums with babies?
    Let ‘em out into the backyard to play with the cow shit, eat a bit of dirt, and generally get dirty. Hose ‘em off before you bring ‘em in for a shower.
    And get a cat or dog. And only give them antibiotics in that first year if they need the stuff – not if you want to give it.
    Like any other system in the body, the Immune System needs something to work on. Just waving your arms and legs in the air is not going to increase muscle tone.

  85. Grey

    My advice to mums with babies?

    Have you been blessed with issue, Winston?

  86. dover_beach

    brc, I wasn’t even there and your story has brought tears to my eyes.

  87. Winstone,

    That was my dear old Mum’s way of bringing up boys! We used to spend a lot of time playing in the half constructed building sites too. My favourite was walking across the open flooring bearers, good for foot eye coordination.

  88. tbh

    As a GenX’er, I find the amount of cotton wool we wrap our kids in to be very troubling. Even fellow GenX’er parents do it, but I occasionally remind them what we did as kids and we lived to tell the tale. I mean, I don’t let my two eight year olds ride their bikes on a main road, but neither do I prevent them from doing most of what a healthy kid should be up to. They get into scrapes (particularly the boy), but that’s a learning experience for them.

    My biggest battle is with Mrs TBH, who has this mortal fear of them being kidnapped or something. You just can’t debate this stuff rationally with a paranoid mother.

    The creeping nanny state is a blight on our society and ordinary folks must resist and ridicule it as much as possible.

  89. tbh

    Generation X, people born from the mid 60′s to the late 70′s.

  90. Chris

    Mothers used to have their kids “visit” other kids who had chicken-pox. Would that be child abuse now?

    Perhaps not child abuse but pretty stupid given that chicken pox in very rare cases can lead to death of otherwise healthy children. And there’s a great alternative – just give them the chicken pox vaccination!

    Apparently the PC thing to do is something called a ‘progressive lunch’ where you put the kids’ food on a special table and they can go eat it whenever they like. Something to do with accommodating cultural sensitivities…

    It’s pretty standard at kindys and childcare to make the children sit down at lunch and even help to setup, serve it and cleanup afterwards (where its provided).At the childcare my daughter went to being allowed to help was a reward! Just part of the socialisation education that they do.

    TB is making a comeback.

    TB is making a comeback because people in undeveloped countries are not getting immunised and when they catch the disease have partial medical treatment because of cost. So they’re essentially breeding antibiotic immune strains of TB which not surprisisingly eventually spread to Australia. A good example of why funding immunisation and medical programs for people outside of Australia, especially those on or sea borders is to our direct benefit. Diseases don’t respect borders!

  91. hammygar

    Makes you wonder how us older people ever survived without the help of all these people who know better.

    Very many just didn’t survive. It’s very fashionable to scream “political correctness” about life-preserving safety measures, but the child survival rate is a great deal higher than it was 30 or 40 years ago, let alone 100 years ago.

  92. Infidel Tiger

    It’s very fashionable to scream “political correctness” about life-preserving safety measures, but the child survival rate is a great deal higher than it was 30 or 40 years ago, let alone 100 years ago.

    More’s the pity in your case.

  93. Token

    Super, the panties hitched up their waste brigade is laying waste to this thread.

  94. blogstrop

    Exposure to germs is an important part of developing an efective immune system. That’s the closest I can come to finding a positive aspect to Hammy’s presence.

  95. John A

    CL: “I wonder if even some parents nowadays know what a gravel rash is.”
    Ouch! I can feel that horrid tingling in my nerves already.

  96. I notice that no well-salaried nanny made the fairly simple recommendation of placing clear plastic wrap over the cake before affixing candles thereon and, once the child has extinguished the festive flames, removing candles and plastic in one simple move before cutting the said cake and distributing the slices thereof.

  97. John Mc

    but the child survival rate is a great deal higher than it was 30 or 40 years ago, let alone 100 years ago.

    Thank you capitalism and the technological progress it begets.

  98. Yobbo

    If the federal government really wanted to do something for kid’s health, they would allow schools to ban kids who had not been immunised.

  99. Yes Grey – two girls.
    Also been a Registered Nurse for thirty years, and a Remote Area Nurse for the last fifteen.

  100. Infidel Tiger

    If the federal government really wanted to do something for kid’s health, they would allow schools to ban kids who had not been immunised

    Yep. And remove them from their parents.

  101. Go to any outback cemetery and look at the headstones. Aramac, White Cliffs, those sorts of places. You’ll find the resting places of entire families of mum, dad, and about five kids.
    Thank Christ for ‘capitalism and the technological progress it begets.’

    I’m also indebted to a poster from the 40′s found in a clean up in some old bush hospital, “You can fret over a needle, or learn to pray over a cot.”

  102. Grey

    Also been a Registered Nurse for thirty years, and a Remote Area Nurse for the last fifteen.

    Fair enough, although my advice would be to leave the medical advice to the doctors – at least in RL, you are free to spout any nonsense you like online.

  103. .

    Fair enough, although my advice would be to leave the medical advice to the doctors – at least in RL, you are free to spout any nonsense you like online.

    Right. Doctors hate normal development of the immune system because a libertarian leaning nurse states what 99% of health professionals recommend.

    Fuck you just don’t have an off button, do you?

  104. Chris

    If the federal government really wanted to do something for kid’s health, they would allow schools to ban kids who had not been immunised.

    Probably a state issue, but children who have not been immunised can be excluded when there are outbreaks in attempt to limit how big the outbreak gets.

    I feel sorry for those who can’t take vaccinations due to medical conditions. Because they are put at extra risk from those who can but refuse to vaccinate. The good news is it looks a bit like the AVN is falling apart under the weight of lots of people complaining about them to various regulatory bodies. And they can’t keep up :-)

  105. Grey

    Dot the hygiene hypothesis is just a hypothesis and one lacking in evidence
    http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23103806

    SUMMARY:

    There is a considerable body of evidence which warrants scepticism about the hygiene hypothesis. However, these anomalies contradict the ‘narrow’ version of it in which microbial pressure early in life protects against atopic asthma by suppressing T-helper 2 immune responses. It is possible that a more general version of the hygiene hypothesis is still valid, but the aetiologic mechanisms involved are currently unclear.

    I don’t think that 99% of health professionals recommend babies playing with cowpats

  106. Let’s protect the children:

    by completely eliminating their fun, cauterizing their imagination and turning them into paranoid poltroons, like the education bureaucrats who want to micro-manage their lives. […]
    Next, a second-grader in Denver was suspended for throwing an imaginary grenade at an empty box on the playground at the Mary Blair Elementary School.

  107. kae

    CL 1:52

    The contraceptive pill has always had contraindications for women who suffer from any kind of thrombosis.

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