Sin taxes and health care costs

Here is a great graph from Julie Novak’s Nanny state taxes: Soaking the poor in 2012 report from last year.

sin tax - health cost

Update: More on this from Eric Crampton.

By C&L’s figures, tobacco costs the Australian health system $318.4 million. … So tobacco leaves the Australian federal government up $2.7 billion and state governments up $833 million.

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46 Responses to Sin taxes and health care costs

  1. stackja

    Cut taxes.
    Then nanny will need to go on a healthy diet.
    I do not smoke nor drink alcohol.

  2. Infidel Tiger

    The poor must be punished. Every shitty policy is always because of them.

    Every little pleasure we can deprive them of, I approve.

  3. SteveC

    Sinclair, why would you single out health costs alone? [Pull your head in pal. Sinc] Here’s a through study. By an incredible coincidence it’s the same paper quoted by Novak! How about you publish the table on page xii to go with your pretty graph.

  4. m0nty

    Imputed savings from premature deaths, hmm. But what about the lost benefit to society of those dead smokers and drinkers? What if some local John Galt likes the odd tipple and a fag, and dies twenty years early thus depriving the world of the full effect of his genius?

  5. Sinclair Davidson

    monty – death is a private cost.

  6. m0nty

    Private cost LOL, even in death the right wants to socialise losses and privatise profits.

  7. Greg James

    That’s weird. That Wong chap, in his opening response on Insiders this morning, justified the increase in the tobacco tax by saying that tobacco smokers had an impact on the budget, and also justified it on the basis of the taxes going to hospitals etc.

    I suppose he was right, in a way, because it seems that it does have a fairly significant impact on the budget bottom line, but I don’t think this graph quite shows what the funny little fellow was implying.

    Of course, good old Bazza let it go through to the umpire.

  8. SteveC

    [You were warned. Sinc]

  9. Gab

    Aww, does it hurt your feelings, SteveC? Don’t care.

  10. JC

    You were calling me a cook roach on another thread, stevesC, you plastic sex doll owner. Double standards much, fuckhead?

    If you don’t like the rules, piss off.

  11. Armadillo

    I think it was Hawke who said to his fellow cabinet members: “Three things. Don’t touch their booze, smokes or sport – it’s the only thing most of the poor bastards have got to look forward to”.

    I don’t usually agree with Labor, but I’m willing to make an exception in this case.

  12. Tony N

    Tobacco and alcohol are drugs of choice and very damaging at that. If you object to the tax then don’t drink or smoke.

  13. Sinclair Davidson

    Greg – the sum of both public and private costs of smoking may well be quite high – but private costs are just that. The actual impact on the health care budget is not likely to be very high – especially given that non-smokers die too. So it is the differential cost that is associated with smoking that is the issue.

  14. Infidel Tiger

    Tobacco and alcohol are drugs of choice and very damaging at that. If you object to the tax then don’t drink or smoke.

    Exactly. Life’s pleasures should be the reserve of the well heeled. The lower classes must be punished hard and often.

  15. sunshine

    Arent the costs of alcohol understated here ? The total costs are massive . Recently the Vic police said alcohol is involved in 80% of violent crime . Its not just the $ cost that should be considered either ,there are massive total costs . I am open to the idea that smokers may be a net saving to health as they die earlier .

  16. JC

    I

    f you object to the tax then don’t drink or smoke.

    Fuck off Knackers. We will do what we like with our bodies.

    People, please purchase your cigs from duty free sellers over the web from overseas. The sellers will offer services such as writing on the package that it contains other junk than tobacco. You could also use a re-shipper who will state anything you want on the face of the package so it gets through customs. There are so many packages coming through they simply don’t have time to check them. Don’t pay the tax, if smoke and it helps starve the beast.

  17. Armadillo

    Recently the Vic police said alcohol is involved in 80% of violent crime

    And cars were involved in 100% of car crashes. Its not just the $ cost that should be considered either ,there are massive total costs (like pollution, resources used to build cars, workplace accidents when building cars, use of fossil fuels and so on and on and on). I am open to the idea that car drivers may be a net saving to health as they die earlier .

  18. Borisgodunov

    Hopefully peoplewillstop smoking and drinking en masse,thus depriving the bludging pollies of lots of money,forcing them to raise taxes to cover the losses,then the
    People will get Really Pissed Off and change the whole political system.I cannot for the life of me see Any merit in electing some self seeking little Tosser with a Tiny “degree” to run the country! People who are totallyinexperienced in life and business and have never had a Real Job in alltheir miserable little lives,this is a total travesty of Democracy,Long Live the Peoples Revolution,destroy politics!

  19. SteveC

    Actually Gab, it was Sinclair’s feelings which were hurt and resulted in the “pull your head in” edit by Sinclair. I was merely pointing out the double standard. I suspect this comment will be deleted as well. Robust….. hahahahaha.

  20. JC

    It’s really quite funny. Right on this thread we have Fatboy (who appears to have a serious food disorder), StevesC the owner of a plastic sex doll and of course the recently arrived Lt Knackers all advocating for higher sin taxes. All leftists to the bone.

    The modern Australian left… a cross between Fred Nile and Peronist economics.

  21. JC

    Does the Australian left speak Spanish? They ought to.

  22. candy

    Poorer/disadvantaged may smoke in environment lack of education, boredom, frustration with low income, idleness and so on.
    It’s catch 22 I guess, but it’s hard I think and saying just quit is too glib and doesn’t take into account human nature.

  23. Gab

    It’s pathetic, JC. Legend has it, back in the good old days, leftists raged against “The Man” and “The Establishment” and “The Rules”. Nowadays they make the old Temperance Society look like Roman bacchanalia-ists..

  24. Infidel Tiger

    Once we’ve cured the poor of the notion that they should have the same freedoms as the upper classes, we must develop a national scheme to teach them how to dress and how to name their children properly.

  25. Gab

    That’s scary IT. I fear you have gone full-on leftard.

  26. Holden

    This is a fantastic own goal. Years ago working in a sawmill, I was the only bloke who read the paper. And before each a election the boys would ask me only one question concerning politics “Who is putting up the price of smokes and beer?”

  27. Nanuestalker

    the right left wants to socialise losses profits and privatise profits losses.

    FTFY

  28. JC

    That saw mill has gone, Holden.

  29. JC

    Lt. Tony Knackers
    I’m posting your latest post in Spanish. If you clowns are peddling Peronism, you ought to do the right thing and post it in Spanish.

    El tabaco y el alcohol son las drogas de elección y muy perjudicial en eso. Si usted se opone al impuesto entonces no beber y no fumar.

  30. cynical1

    So we next need a fat tax.

    Diabetes, heart disease, colon cancer all caused
    by eating shit food.

    Like doughnuts.

    By the way, what does AIDS cost in medical care…..

  31. JC

    It’s pathetic, JC. Legend has it, back in the good old days, leftists raged against “The Man” and “The Establishment” and “The Rules”. Nowadays they make the old Temperance Society look like Roman bacchanalia-ists..

    It’s Peronism morphed in with Fred Nile, Gab. You’re got donut breath (fatboy) talking about da costs to shociety. This is the same person who hasn’t see his dick since he was 10.

  32. JC

    By the way, what does AIDS cost in medical care…..

    I think the entire cocktail of medications to keep them alive is around:

    The drug mix that an HIV patient must take can cost between $15,000 to $30,000 a year. The average price is about $20,000.

    Makes lung cancer child’s play in comparison.

    But hey, getting the AIDS cocktail is a minority right which to our Fred Nile like Peronist economics loving “friends” mean you homophobic if you bring it up.

  33. Holden

    Yeah JC, don’t worry I don’t miss it. The mills might be gone but that mentality still exists. It’s just that I don’t have to point out that Labor is going to tax their arse’s off.

  34. Holden

    Eva Peron had really nice hair JC.

  35. JC

    Ummm did she? That excuses all her incompetence then I guess.

  36. cynical1

    I must be getting old.

    Everybody smoked when I was growing up, now, nobody smokes and every shopping centre
    toilet has a bin for used syringes.

    So called “Progressives” have a lot to answer for…

  37. jumpnmcar

    The cost to Australias’ budget of electing ALP/ green is massive.
    Way more than drinking, smoking and gambling combined.
    Let’s tax that in accordance with cost.
    What figure should be put on that?

  38. JohnA

    bacchanalia-ists..

    Gab, could you have been looking for bacchanalians, maybe?

  39. Tel

    Recently the Vic police said alcohol is involved in 80% of violent crime.

    That would explain why Somalia has so much less violent crime than Australia.

  40. JC

    Lol… Every single leftwinger who thought they could this around dropped out as soon as they were compared to Fred Nile and Juan Peron.

    You gutless cowardly betas.

    Or let me say that in Spanish to you in case you understand it better.

    Lol … Cada izquierdista que pensaban que podían esto alrededor abandonado tan pronto como se compararon con Fred Nilo y Juan Perón.

    Usted cobarde betas cobardes.

    O permítanme decir que en español para que en caso de que lo entienda mejor.

    Usted imbéciles

  41. Gab

    Usted cobarde betas cobardes.

    See? even in Spanish they’re known as betas.

  42. Mick Gold Coast QLD

    “Arent the costs of alcohol understated here ? The total costs are massive . Recently the Vic police said alcohol is involved in 80% of violent crime …”

    No moonshine, you got that quite wrong.

    The Labor Party’s Victorian Police Commissioner not so long ago announced she’d personally squashed just about all the crime in the State, by employing statistical policing.

    I can visualise that and it would have to be true.

  43. JC

    The Australian left are in some ways as bad as the Taliban.

    Just ban everything

    In 1996, the parliament of Iran approved a ban on smoking in any public place. In Iran, however, the ban was soon overturned as being, of all things, unconstitutional.

    How fucking embarrassing that Iran’s court found for liberty and the Australian Left doesn’t. You turnips ought to hang your fucking heads in shame.

  44. wreckage

    You have to factor in dying just after you reach pension age as being a massive cost to society, rather than a slight saving. The “costs of smoking” thing basically works by assigning an essentially arbitrary number to the cost of an individual dying before they otherwise might have.

    Of course, this means taxing cars and bathrooms more than cigarettes.

  45. kelly liddle

    Tobacco and alcohol are drugs of choice and very damaging at that. If you object to the tax then don’t drink or smoke.

    In many cases working is damaging to ones health and it is taxed so following the logic people should just go on welfare to avoid excessive taxation. I know someone who is currently struggling with this dilema because he bought a house he couldn’t afford so worked hard for 6 or 7 years and has nothing to show for it so he is considering housing commission. He has quit smoking though for the last 8 months or so.

    One thing that is often said about smokers is that that reduce productivity, I can’t see how this is true because many working class smokers will actually work more so they can afford their smokes. Hard to pay $140 a week for smokes if you are on the pension.

  46. Jessie

    Tel,

    That would account for the non-official databases devised by individuals in Vic Police, databases which capture alcohol only. Better data for those alcohol-free precincts planned for by the town planners. Evidence-based policy :)
    When did anyone see the full range and number of databases (official or not), the variables collected and reported by police service?

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