Tuesday Forum: December 10, 2013

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999 Responses to Tuesday Forum: December 10, 2013

  1. Gab

    From March 22 last year:

    The Federal Government this morning announced a $275 million taxpayer deal to keep General Motors Holden manufacturing in Australia.

    The company itself will contribute $1 billion and is now promising to stay in South Australia until at least 2022.

    The Prime Minister says the Commonwealth will contribute $215 million, and she says it should be seen as a co-investment, not a handout.

    http://www.abc.net.au/worldtoday/content/2012/s3460970.htm

  2. Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

    the Australian Broadcasting Conmmunists

    Oh I like this. It should become more generally used, and thus more known.
    So simple, so elegant, and leaves no doubt at all that the issue is not just ‘bias’, it is intent.

  3. Steve of Glasshouse

    Careful with those collectable Edsells. Some unscrupulous scoundrels have been counterfeiting them by slapping a photo of TLS on the grill a Trabant.

  4. srr

    Expect the ALP and leftist media to turn up the hysteria to 11.

    Expected and happening. Stage 1. Hysterically Ignoring It.
    Fun though, watching the Leftards who pretend they aren’t, who screamed for this news (in a, ‘nah, nah, nah nah, nah’, tone), when they believed it would never happen, now out there madly looking for unicorns to point at. They can’t even bring themselves to post a.simple, ‘YEAY!’.

  5. .

    Dot sez,

    I am relying on the number of people whom lost their job.

    Steve C sez,

    Oh, you know them do you?

    What kind of braindead rhetorical argument is this?

    Do you know the 650,000 or so people at any one month that the ABS counts as unemployed? Do I know the mothers that give birth in the demographic stats? Do I know the factory owners represented in the cap. ex data?

    The fact is you are simply wrong. You cannot reliably give an accurate measure of job losses from the unemployment rate and even working back with the participation rate is not a guarantee your figures will always be close.

    You don’t have an argument. You were wrong. Move on before you flip out like Homer Paxton or Graeme Bird. They are not healthy individuals.

    Under Rudd and Gillard, the amount of people who lost their job was often more than 10,000 per month, averaging to around 9,000 job losses per month over their tenure.

  6. blogstrop

    The Time magazine’s Man of The Year went to Pope Francis, which again prompts me to ask what possessed the cardinals to vote for a socialist, hippie-style, tiptoe through the tulips kind of pope?
    God certainly does work in mysterious ways.

  7. Token

    How can a society review and improve when the majority of its jornalists and intellectuals have retreated to a 2nd (or 3rd or 4th) childhood?

    Greg Sheridan articulates what so many have been expressing for years:

    What was telling about the response of both the ABC and Fairfax to these arguments was the total failure to engage with them at all, and instead resort to straightforward sneering and abuse, even in pieces ostensibly calling for a better standard of debate.

    His statement about the former ABC appointed censor of culture is striking:

    I don’t mind Holmes abusing me – that’s fine. But accusing me of not raising issues I’ve written about at length is either dishonest or lazy.

    I actually think the way he dismissed La Tingle with a whiff of pity reflects the reality:

    It’s sad to see Laura reduced to this level of infantile and dishonest abuse. The quality of her journalism has declined steadily through the years, although she never displayed any serious interest in national security or foreign affairs. But she apparently felt no need to engage with the arguments I actually made about responsible and irresponsible ways to deal with national security stories. Instead it was enough to engage in generalised abuse. The irony of this in a column allegedly lamenting the poor quality of the national debate is striking.

  8. The Time magazine’s Man of The Year went to Pope Francis,

    Runner up, according to the ABC, was “whistleblower” Edward Snowden.

  9. Token

    Anyone who saw the way the left hid the very serious Gillard/AWU matters and blew up the fabricated “punch” crap would have known that the institutions we relied on in previous generations are in terminal decline:

    As her colleague Joye has argued, and as Spigelman’s tenuous defence yesterday conceded, there is a real debate to be had about the ABC’s handling of this acutely sensitive national security story. But that debate certainly won’t be had on the ABC or in most of Fairfax. For that, we are the poorer

  10. Token

    The Time magazine’s Man of The Year went to Pope Francis,

    Has somebody told the Pope that the leftards have been taking his words and not translating them faithfully, or he too much of a mortal man who can be seduced by fame and therefore will allow the distortions to stand so he can have 15 minutes of adulation?

  11. Rabz

    It’s sad to see Laura reduced to this level of infantile and dishonest abuse. The quality of her journalism has declined steadily through the years

    Presumably the quality of her ‘journalism’ went into terminal decline from the moment she hooked up with that syphilitic ol’ fraud, Alan “Byrd” Shamsey?

    What other explanation could there be?

  12. .

    What happened to that crazy birdnest haired woman who was upset that there was a concerted effort depose of Gillard?

  13. Token

    If Toyota needs to dismiss someone, an outrageous procedure of at least three years and three months continuous disciplinary action is required before dismissal can occur. This defies belief.

    That attitude is built into every one of their Australian made cares which consumers consistently reject.

  14. Token

    What happened to that crazy birdnest haired woman who was upset that there was a concerted effort depose of Gillard?

    You’ve got to give more clues here Dot.

    Are you talking about La Tingle, Grattan, Tractor Driver Kelly, Crabbe, Summers, or any other of the wymmynses of the lunar left in the media?

  15. Gab

    Niki Savva on fire today

    Under Labor’s watch, Mitsubishi and Ford failed, Holden foundered, Qantas faltered, debt ballooned and education standards fell. Hypocrisy flourished.

    RTWT

  16. Token

    I see the men of the ALP can’t help themselves and indulged in more of their usual mysogyny, this after showing by their reaction to Speaker Bishop yesterday they can’t handle a women being in charge.

  17. Stevec

    No worries dot. Base your analysis on Roy Morgan. That will get you far. But even if you were right, which you are not, and have provided no evidence, 9,000 is not tens of thousands (plural) which was the assertion you were defending as correct. So not only are you wrong, you have provided your own proof that you are wrong. Haha good job.

    In SAS analysis software a missing value is represented as a dot. How appropriate!

  18. boy on a bike

    On Friday evening, November 29 … someone with the moniker Ghost of PJK tweeted a picture of Christopher Pyne with a text message saying: “As the NSW Education Minister rails against the Gonski betrayal, Pyne is smugly loitering. What a c..t.”

    ACT Education Minister Joy Burch pressed three buttons to retweet the picture and text that same night…

    Why has no one come out with the old rebuttal of:

    “Takes one to know one”.

  19. Token

    Tim Wilson today:

    Since 2008, at least $100 million has been provided by the commonwealth to finance research that could subsequently be used to justify paternalist policies.

    Not all of the research is without merit. But any behaviour that ultimately leads to perceived higher health costs jeopardises public finances, therefore justifying restrictions on individual choice. A left-wing activist might call the buck-passing of health costs from individuals to the government “privatising the gains and socialising the costs”.

    So instead of finding a way to privatise the costs, the solution by government has been to remove choice and incrementally reduce people’s freedoms.

    If this is true it is startling people being funded to justify the pilfering of more money from taxpayers. There are a lot of political warriors who can live high on the hog off that $100m.

  20. Stevec

    Seems like Abbott won’t get his vote on the carbon tax repeal in the senate this sitting. He’s not getting much right is he?

  21. .

    Steve

    I am right. You are wrong. You have no argument. The Roy Morgan stuff is validated by careful analysis of the ABS data. You clearly do not understand the ABS data as you assumed that you could reliably calculate job losses purely by using…unemployment data.

    You do not know what you are talking about.

    Get over yourself you turkey…”ooh look, I use the most expensive data analysis software I can find…”

    No one cares. Most economists don’t use it. It is overpriced shit.

    All you have proven is…that job losses under Gillard and Rudd weren’t 10,000+, but averaged about 9,000 per month…and only at certain times were job losses 10,000+.

    Which is precisely what I’ve asserted.

  22. Token

    Grace Collier’s warning reflects the wave of off-shoring which I am seeing across industries and across businesses big & small.

    No one ever envisaged enterprise bargaining would produce a crisis of this proportion. Half of the Australian workforce has been bumping along for 20 years on the centralised wage-fixing model; yearly dollar amount increases have produced modest wage growth. The other half of the Australian workforce has been receiving percentage increases of about 4 per cent per annum, compounding, for 20 years.

    We are on the cusp of a major crisis, enterprise bargaining wages are now just hitting the violent upswing point in the bell curve, stratospheric wage levels are ahead of us and many of our big companies are going to fall over.

    Putting wages aside, productivity inhibitors in agreements cripple the ability of a company to respond to outside pressure. Unions, jaded by constant employer exaggeration about poor finances, are not facing reality. What we are seeing now with Holden and Toyota is only the beginning.

    Yet, Labor and unions look at this harsh reality with glee and see only the short term political advantage from making these people unemployable and locked into lifestyles beyond their true market value.

  23. Token

    Seems like Abbott won’t get his vote on the carbon tax repeal in the senate this sitting.

    Why is this a surprise to you?

    At the Cat we’ve been talking about that reality since the beginning of the year when we were discussing the fact the only way that regressive and job destroying legislation (which only changed carbon emissions by 0.1%) could only be removed by Labor/Greens losing control of the senate.

    We were previously able to have a conversation based upon the merits of an argument with you SteveC. It is a pity you’ve turned into a M0nty clone.

  24. Stevec

    Dot I assume you know Roy Morgan does their own surveys and has a different methodology. Would you like to point to the “careful analysis” of the abs data that confirms Roy Morgans analysis?

  25. Stevec

    Token. Was there no debate here about double dissolution triggers? I’ve been offline for quite a few months. My point was simply that abbot hasn’t got much right so far. An opinion that has been echoed in these pages frequently.

  26. .

    JC showed you why you were wrong and how you can show the ABS data approximately correlates with the Roy Morgan data. Go back and read that before you pontificate any further.

    ABS and Roy Morgan aren’t the same entity? Thanks for the tip.

  27. Tom

    Fuck off, SteveC. You’re a z-grade troll.

  28. Stevec,

    Seems like Abbott won’t get his vote on the carbon tax repeal in the senate this sitting. He’s not getting much right is he?

    On the contrary, he (and half the rest of the country) expected exactly this and has not ruled out a double dissolution.

    We look forward to July when the remaining New Communists in the senate are given the boot.

  29. Token

    Was there no debate here about double dissolution triggers? I’ve been offline for quite a few months. My point was simply that abbot hasn’t got much right so far. An opinion that has been echoed in these pages frequently.

    The talk was and is often about DD triggers due to the fact the ALP & Greens stated clearly they would block all attempts to repeal the regressive & job destroying tax which does nothing to change carbon emissions.

    It is your opinion that “abbot hasn’t got much right”, but that does not reflect the view here.

    For some reason you do not see the 80% decline in illegal arrivals as a win, with the result that lives have been saved. That is a reflection of and on you.

    I could discuss the other policy achievements, but it is clear you are hear to wave your team flag and not to have a dialog.

  30. Token

    …you are here to wave your team flag and not to have a dialog.

  31. boy on a bike

    Seems like Abbott won’t get his vote on the carbon tax repeal in the senate this sitting

    The Greens voted against dumping their carbon tax?

    I’m SHOCKED, I tell you – SHOCKED.

    For some queer reason, I was expecting them to vote for it to be killed and then be dancing in the aisles after it was abolished.

    FMD

  32. candy

    Bill Shorten is denying the ALP is the party of “no” today. Funny how things work out.

    It seems the rise in polls for ALP has given them even more impetus to knock back any legislation at all and be obstructive at all costs, as revenge, no matter if the legislation is in the national interest. Yesterday parliament was very unseemly.

  33. Am I being an economic and political dunce if I suggest that, if as has been mooted, the Feds put together a zillion dollar assistance package to help all of those poor Holden workers who will be out of a 100 grand a year job in four years – and walking away with redundancy packages around the 300k mark, that any and all ‘assistance’ be means tested?

  34. blogstrop

    It seems the rise in polls for ALP has given them even more impetus …
    Isn’t it great how the Liars Party and their media boosters are much more poll driven than General Election driven.

  35. blogstrop

    You’re very lippy for a dead man walking, SteveC; sure that wasn’t just a ploy? Worked on JC.

  36. Token

    Can we treat SteveC’s illness & treatment like M0nty’s wife? A topic which it is best to avoid as it does not advance our arguments in any way.

  37. SteveC

    no ploy Blog, I’m afraid. Not a very nice comment actually.

  38. SFB should be along soon.

    Well I am, Gab, but the blog threads are getting kinda of dull when people continually make wildly exaggerated claims and won’t even back down when shown figures that disprove their exaggerations.

    And no, that doesn’t apply to climate change. Ocean heat content is still rising, meaning the earth is accumulating heat but it’s just not atmospheric at this stage. There is no good reason to doubt that when the current cycle that is favouring heat going into the ocean switches again, the historically rapid rise of the atmosphere will resume.

  39. SteveC

    Token, I’ve seen heaps of “disappointment” style comments about Abbott. With which I concur obviuosly!

  40. dover_beach

    dot may err in some areas, but on economics I would back him before Steve C every time.

  41. “rise of the temperature of the atmosphere”.

  42. dover_beach

    It’s freezing here in NY, literally. Mid-west is even worse, about – 18C in Minneapolis. Heat must be trapped in the oceans.

  43. Tom

    the earth is accumulating heat but it’s just not atmospheric at this stage

    Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!

    What would we do without our village idiot?

  44. Bear Necessities

    SFB should be along soon.

    Well I am, Gab, but the blog threads are getting kinda of dull when people continually make wildly exaggerated claims and won’t even back down when shown figures that disprove their exaggerations.

    And no, that doesn’t apply to climate change. Ocean heat content is still rising, meaning the earth is accumulating heat but it’s just not atmospheric at this stage. There is no good reason to doubt that when the current cycle that is favouring heat going into the ocean switches again, the historically rapid rise of the atmosphere will resume.

    Why didn’t the models pick that up? Bad Models.

  45. SteveC

    Actually dot, it’s a bit hard to know what you were arguing:

    You’re a lying shithead, Steve.

    (in response to the original “tens of thousands” comment.

    FACTCHECK
    For 5 years “tens of thousands” became unemployed under Labor.
    Analysis:
    The number of jobs grew by slightly under 1,000,000 when the labour market grew by 1,200,000. Therefore, unemployment grew. Not that hard.
    Result: TRUE

    Oops that’s only 3,000/month

    Actually Steve, it would have been about 8,000-9,000 per month.

    getting there.

    All you have proven is…that job losses under Gillard and Rudd weren’t 10,000+, but averaged about 9,000 per month…and only at certain times were job losses 10,000+.
    Which is precisely what I’ve asserted.

    Well, not really. You asserted sfb was a shithead because he questioned the credibility of the “tens of thousands every month” claim. Which even your own faulty analysis has proved wrong.

    d_b I would back dot on economics over me too, but perhaps not simple arithmetic, and he certainly beats me on cattle-bowl.

  46. lotocoti

    There is no good reason to doubt that when the current cycle that is favouring heat going into the ocean switches again, the historically rapid rise of the atmosphere will resume.

    Have you ever considered something beyond copying and pasting words whose shape you like?

  47. dover_beach

    Majority of Americans Believe Deportation of Illegal Immigrants Not Agressive Enough:

    Only 29% of Likely U.S. Voters think the government should stop deporting illegal immigrants until Congress passes an immigration reform plan. A new Rasmussen Reports national telephone survey finds that 57% oppose a halt to deportations. Fourteen percent (14%) are undecided.

    Sixty percent (60%) believe the U.S. government is not aggressive enough now in deporting illegal immigrants. Fourteen percent (14%) say it is too aggressive, while 16% think the number of deportations is about right.

  48. Bruce

    But Steve,shitfer is a shithead.

  49. Arnost

    There is no good reason to doubt that when the current cycle that is favouring heat going into the ocean switches again, the historically rapid rise of the atmosphere will resume.

    Is there any peer reviewed explanation of what is causing this current cycle that favours all this heat absorption by the oceans? LOL.

    Actually – is there any peer reviewed explanation of how it is actually physical that downwelling radiation heats the deep oceans?

    Otherwise there are very good reasons to doubt…

  50. C.L.

    The arrest, 8 hour detention, fingerprinting and DNA swabbing of a British man who made a Nelson Mandela joke illustrates perfectly why America has a second amendment.

  51. C.L.

    Iranian news agency honours Mandela for his longstanding hatred of Jews.

  52. incoherent rambler

    Cognitive dissonance.

    Abbott is not PM of Australia.
    The world is warming.
    The ALP left the economy in great shape.
    We have no debt.
    Education standards have improved.
    The ABC has no bias.
    JG is has done nuffin wrong.

  53. boy on a bike

    the earth is accumulating heat but it’s just not atmospheric at this stage

    “Here, heaty heaty heaty. Come here, heaty. Come on heaty – your dinner is ready”.

    Note to warmenists – just tap your spoon on the top of the tin and the heat will come running.

  54. C.L.

    Bias? What bias?

    Retired lunatic, Campbell Report plagiariser and architect of the worst economic collapse since the Great Depression – Paul Keating – addresses Caucus.

    ABC24 has live coverage.

  55. Arnost, I think from looking around that it’s fair to say that the exact details of how this works is still a matter under investigation, although a Trenberth paper argues (from the abstract):

    Sensitivity experiments illustrate that surface wind variability is largely responsible for the changing ocean heat vertical distribution.

    Ocean gyre circulation changes are often mentioned as having a role too.

  56. Tom

    boy on a bike
    #1107519, posted on December 12, 2013 at 10:39 am

    Laughed out loud. Ta.

  57. ella

    Nanny from the UN wants inside the Australian home to tell us how to raise our children. There is an attempt to bring in a law to prosecute parents for smacking a child and to give children the power to complain to the UN about violation of their rights.

    Natasha Bita has a piece in The Telegraph this morning on the subject. Natasha quotes National Children’s Commissioner Megan Mitchell:

    “We certainly don’t want children growing up in fear of violence, and replicating violence. But we don’t want to be criminalising parents for trying to save their child from running across a road ….”

    No we don’t. But if memory serves me well an attempt to do just that happened in Christchurch, New Zealand when a father attempted to stop his child from running out into a busy road by reaching forward to get his child’s attention by clipping him across the ear. He was dobbed in.

    I believe Megan Mitchell is aware of this case and that is the reason she used this example. The old “it happened there, but it won’t happen here” excuse.

  58. Infidel Tiger

    No one ever envisaged enterprise bargaining would produce a crisis of this proportion. Half of the Australian workforce has been bumping along for 20 years on the centralised wage-fixing model; yearly dollar amount increases have produced modest wage growth. The other half of the Australian workforce has been receiving percentage increases of about 4 per cent per annum, compounding, for 20 years.

    We are on the cusp of a major crisis, enterprise bargaining wages are now just hitting the violent upswing point in the bell curve, stratospheric wage levels are ahead of us and many of our big companies are going to fall over.

    Putting wages aside, productivity inhibitors in agreements cripple the ability of a company to respond to outside pressure. Unions, jaded by constant employer exaggeration about poor finances, are not facing reality. What we are seeing now with Holden and Toyota is only the beginning.

    The good news is that in the next decade every unionised industry in this country will disappear. We are going to end up with mass unemployment of union scum and unions without members.

  59. It’s another reality denying aspect of the blog that you can put NOAA figures in front of them showing the ocean is indeed still heating and the response is “Ha! What do we care? Leftard!”

  60. Tom

    I think from looking around

    Aaaaaahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahaha!!!

  61. C.L.

    Stupidest filter in the blogosphere …

    Four attempts to post this ABC story.

    McTernan shocked to discover Gillard opposed bill to protect unborn girls.

  62. Token

    The arrest, 8 hour detention, fingerprinting and DNA swabbing of a British man who made a Nelson Mandela joke illustrates perfectly why America has a second amendment.

    I wouldn’t gloat, a few months ago a 13yo girl was detained and questioned without supervision by a guardian for 2 or so hours for words words that a powerful & wealthy footballer found “hurtful”.

    I still have not heard boo from Vic Police or the so called civil liberties mob on that egregious action by people on behalf of the AFL.

  63. C.L.

    Also:

    When one journalist said the Prime Minister’s office was handling the AWU “slush fund” allegations poorly, he wrote to staff requesting the exact criticism so he could “c**t the c**t”.

    Note well that the ABC is blaming McTernan for everything. Everything.

  64. Token

    Not saying CL is gloating, that is a collective statement for all Australians.

  65. C.L.

    I still have not heard boo from Vic Police or the so called civil liberties mob on that egregious action by people on behalf of the AFL.

    Exactly.

  66. C.L.

    McTernan leaks …

    Australian industry let off McTernan, could have given gold to Abbott:

    When the Australian Industry Group issued a press release praising some parts of the Coalition’s broadband policy, Mr McTernan replied to the AIG’s administrative assistant and copied his office into the correspondence.

    “I just wanted to warn you that someone has hacked your email account,” he said, on behalf of the prime minister’s office.

    “No serious third party body could issue this release. As you know, proposing to charge virtually everyone in Australia to pay $5,000 to connect to high speed broad band would cost the country up to $43.5bn.

    “I know that the AIG supports major economic reforms, and you could not support the reversal of the structural separation of Telstra.

    “So, clearly someone has hacked your account. Someone who really wants to damage your reputation as a reputable independent commentator on business related issues.

    “Please check your IT security settings. You may be made to say far more embarrassing things in future.”

    AIG, particularly under its former boss Heather Ridout enjoyed a warm relationship with the Labor government.

    The ABC understands its employees were unhappy to receive Mr McTernan’s email but chose to ignore it.

  67. McTernan seemed to have a fairly limited vocabulary when it came to describing how he would hurt an enemy.

    I would like to see some of Credlin’s emails to do a fair comparison, though.

  68. Token

    Note well that the ABC is blaming McTernan for everything. Everything.

    I’m shocked, shocked I tells ya, that the station that ran those misleading, tedious and indulgent speeches from Gillard would be trying to sheet home the blame for the failure of her government to McTiernan.

    Do they realise that by running this series of stories they are tacitly revealing what a collosal failure the Gillard government was?

  69. C.L.

    Is McTernan gay?

    Serious question.

    It’s just that he seems particularly fixated in a bad way on women’s genitals.

  70. Can someone explain to me the possible reasons for the ABC running with these ‘leaked’ McTernan emails?
    The coincidence between the heat the ABC is copping for running hard with the stolen Snowden/Guardian material and the sudden release of this ‘leaked’ email stash is uncanny.
    On the surface it seems to have been carefully orchestrated so the ABC can sit at various inquiries and say ‘us? biased? but we ran the McTurd’n material!’, the wee man is, after all, expendable in ABC eyes.

  71. blogstrop

    Spare me the disappointment, trolls. Your side is beyond the pale.

  72. Tom

    Ms Gillard protested against Tony Abbott’s scare campaign against her carbon tax when she was prime minister, but her spin doctor proposed Labor run one on nuclear energy ahead of the 2013 election.

    “We should do scare campaign in seats where it can help, I’m sure we could generate a scary infographic.” (McTernan said in an email)

    Whatever it takes. Race riots a specialty.

  73. C.L.

    No no, Tom.

    None of the “leaked” emails seem to mention the race riot.

    In fact, I am sure they have been redacted to protect Gillard.

  74. Tom

    The coincidence between the heat the ABC is copping for running hard with the stolen Snowden/Guardian material and the sudden release of this ‘leaked’ email stash is uncanny.

    Correct.

  75. Politics behind the scenes can certainly be played in very ugly fashion these days.

    But again, given that many people are unhappy with Credlin within the Coalition, and even Nikki Savva once commented: “In private, Abbott talks openly about sex to almost anybody who will listen, and usually at great length ” , there is no reason to believe that the behind the scenes of the Abbott office is all sweetness and light. (Abbott may well mean no harm, but guys who talk about sex at length are not a welcome addition by most women in the workplace, or even at a social function.)

  76. dover_beach

    It’s just that he seems particularly fixated in a bad way on women’s genitals.

    Scent of mussels?

  77. McTernan seemed to have a fairly limited vocabulary when it came to describing how he would hurt an enemy.

    Indeed. I know that English is a living language, a moving feast, if you like, but who knew that the c-word could serve as an honorific, a noun, verb, adjective and adverb in a six word sentence.

  78. candy

    It’s just amazing that someone in that elite level of government that McTernan was working in would use the “c” word in emails.

  79. Bruce

    If he’s not he’ll certainly do until the next card carrying poof comes along. Anyone interested getting to “know’ him should hurry,his s.457 visa must run out soon ,that is if he’s not already an over-stayer.

  80. C.L.

    Question:

    The abortion email includes a reply.

    Where are all the other replies?

    Such as “yeah – good idea, John. Let’s c**** the c****s.”

    Where are they?

  81. Yes, candy. I agree. There are so easily leaked to embarrass him and his boss.

  82. C.L.

    But again, given that many people are unhappy with Credlin within the Coalition, and even Nikki Savva once commented: “In private, Abbott talks openly about sex to almost anybody who will listen, and usually at great length ” , there is no reason to believe that the behind the scenes of the Abbott office is all sweetness and light.

    Savva was referring to Abbott’s daggy Dad tendency to answer questions on sex from journalists. Steve the creep attempts to spin the quote to mean that Abbott talks about c—-ts and f—ing in private.

    You really are a foul bacterium at the bottom of a urinal, Steve.

  83. Further to McTurdan: The prevailing meme has it that he liked to think of himself as something of a Malcolm Tucker. I’d contend that the latter day Malignant Dwarf has a poster of Francis Begbie on his bedroom wall.

  84. Steve of Glasshouse

    So an opinion piece about Tony Abbott written by Niki Savva in 2010 is gospel for S of B?
    You really do have a poor concept of evidence..

  85. Token

    It’s just amazing that someone in that elite level of government that McTernan was working in would use the “c” word in emails.

    Do you think that he used the “c” word in the first draft of the mysogyny speech?

  86. Token

    You really do have a poor concept of evidence..

    No he knows what he is doing, SoB regularly tries sleazy tricks to smear.

  87. blogstrop

    I have zero tolerance for the assorted trolls who have been not just apologists for the political forces which have in six years done so much wrecking and so little good, but come here to annoy and to make jibes like “Abbott’s not going too well, hasn’t done anything right, look at the latest poll”.
    They are accessories before, during and after the fact, and they have sought to defend, deflect from and even praise those who inflicted that wreckage. The union movement has been shown to have a widespread corruption problem, and this leaks right into the parliamentary party, who are the union movement’s proxies.
    If they cannot now accept that we have a government who are going to try and repair the damage and reset some of the disastrous machinery set up by those they defended, then they can all fuck off and die as far as I am concerned.
    SfB proves his slimy unworthiness every day here.

  88. You really are a foul bacterium at the bottom of a urinal, Steve.

    Look, I’m sorry [/sarc] if the comment of an Abbott sympathiser and political insider who has worked around him is that he tends to talk about sex a lot in private.

    Of course, this does not mean that he necessarily walks around the office using the language that McT used. (In fact, I expect he doesn’t, although he almost certainly swears more than candy imagines he does.)

    On the other hand, the comment by Nikki suggests that it is indeed possible he could sometimes say embarrassing things that people in his office don’t want to hear.

  89. twostix

    The powerful advisor credited with crafting Julia Gillard’s misogyny speech and so-called “gender wars” did not know whether Labor was opposed to a bill to restrict abortions.

    So the ABC confirms what was said here all along: Entirely scripted by a male – Julia Gillard simply did as she was told.
    Which makes all of this seem more than a little psychotic.

  90. Pickles

    The Indian Supreme Court has held it’s illegal for Dilip’s doodle to go near Aaka’s clacka.
    Airline stopover schedules thrown into further chaos.

  91. Rabz

    It’s just amazing that someone in that elite level of government that McTernan was working in would use the “c” word in emails.

    Given what we’d had foisted on us by those drooling cretins over the last six years, it’s entirely unsurprising that such a foul deformed grub was pulling the strings behind the rotten facade.

    I’m just fed up to the back teeth that we’re still hearing about the brain damaged sewer dweller.

    Send him back, forthwith.

  92. Arnost

    SteveFB…

    Sensitivity experiments illustrate that surface wind variability is largely responsible for the changing ocean heat vertical distribution.

    Handwaving away the physical reality that downwelling IR cannot pentrate the skin layer of the oceans – the top couple of microns. And a very solid argument can be made that where the downwelling IR evaporates the water in the skin, that actually cools the surface.

    You have a much better chance of explaining the heating of the oceans (if it actually exists and is not an adjustment bodge) by looking at the sun… For visible light and higher frequency radiation will heat the water – and so if the water is heating, there is a perfectly physical forcing.

  93. twostix

    Jacqueline Maley: On the speech, had it been germinating for a while? How much of it was off the cuff?

    Julia Gillard: Well … I knew that on the parliamentary day in question that there would be questions about Peter Slipper and issues about sexism so I did take into the parliament with me Tony Abbott’s key quotes which I thought were objectionable. Apart from that I did hand written notes as he was speaking and just got up and did it. So I hadn’t been thinking about giving a speech like that, I hadn’t prepared for the giving of that speech. I had the quotes with me. I did it off the cuff, made a couple of notes as to how I wanted to structure it as he was speaking.

    Today:

    The powerful advisor credited with crafting Julia Gillard’s misogyny speech

    The woman is a psycotic pathological liar, as we said from day 0.

    The left of course lapped it up and enabled her mad fantasy world for their own gain.

  94. I did it off the cuff, made a couple of notes as to how I wanted to structure it as he was speaking.

    And yet Albo was handing out copies of the speech to ‘key’ journalists before QT. Got to hand it to Albo … the man is telepathetic.

  95. Infidel Tiger

    If you weren’t such a wuss mOnty you could make some serious coin:

    ALP $2.90
    LNP $1.40

  96. egg_

    The coincidence between the heat the ABC is copping for running hard with the stolen Snowden/Guardian material and the sudden release of this ‘leaked’ email stash is uncanny.

    Aunty’s ‘stolen’ generations.

  97. candy

    It’s a fun rollercoaster ride.

    Monty, I reckon it will definitely get worse for the Coalition before it gets better, as the hard measures have to be implemented regarding Holden, Toyota and other things coming up. The cup has run dry and Joe Hockey has a huge task in front of him.

  98. Andrew

    NBN review has found that the cost of Coalition’s NBN program has blown out to over $41.5 billion

  99. Where will the turnaround in Abbott’s fortunes come from, candy? No one here seems to know the answer to this question.

  100. Today the High Court decided unanimously that the Marriage Equality (Same Sex) Act 2013, enacted by the Legislative Assembly for the Australian Capital Territory, cannot operate concurrently with the federal Marriage Act 1961. The Court held that the federal Parliament has power under the Australian Constitution to legislate with respect to same sex marriage, and that under the Constitution and federal law as it now stands, whether same sex marriage should be provided for by law is a matter for the federal Parliament.

    Completely unsurprising.

  101. C.L.

    As I said, the Savva article does not – as Steve claims – state that Abbott talks about c—ts and fucking in the office as per McTernan.

    In fact, she praises him as a rare man loved by women:

    Abbott seems to have an easy relationship with his daughters. They mock him affectionately and he takes it in good humour. Both in government and now in opposition, he has always employed women in senior roles in his office either as press secretaries, policy advisers or chiefs of staff. They have all remained incredibly loyal to him and keep coming back to work for him.

    Not sure we can say such things about – oh, say – Bill Shorten.

  102. Andrew

    Today the High Court decided unanimously that the Marriage Equality (Same Sex) Act 2013, enacted by the Legislative Assembly for the Australian Capital Territory, cannot operate concurrently with the federal Marriage Act 1961.

    A win for the institution of marriage :-)

  103. Bruce

    The Hig Court just hasn’t been the same since the Dancing Queen’s mate got the arse.

  104. C.L.

    LOL.

    But but… homosexual “marriage” is INEVITABLY INEVITABLE.

  105. nic

    The powerful advisor credited with crafting Julia Gillard’s misogyny speech

    Watch the look on luvvies faces when you tell them that a man wrote her speech. Its priceless when the penny drops.

  106. Not only has the Liberal NBN Lite cost blown out to $41 billion – only $3B less than Labor’s full version – it also represents yet another broken promise, as less than half will get 25Mbps by 2016 and more than a third won’t get fibre at all. Of course Turnbull is waving his arms about claiming a black hole in the books. Another complete shemozzle from the worst first three months a federal government has ever had.

  107. Token

    Where will the turnaround in Abbott’s fortunes come from, candy? No one here seems to know the answer to this question.

    No, you choose not to listen as you object to the premise.

    There will be a number of reasons, but we can be certain that the tactics of Labor to stop the repeal of the Carbon Tax will have a political effect when prices rise after 1 July 2014 when the Carbon Tax is applied to fuel in transport.

  108. nic

    The Indian Supreme Court has held it’s illegal for Dilip’s doodle to go near Aaka’s clacka.
    Airline stopover schedules thrown into further chaos.

    Lefty rock/scissors/paper, ‘cultural’ practices (particularly from brown people) trumps gay rights, lest a person be seen as racist or worse, ‘culturally insensitive’.

  109. Token

    Watch the look on luvvies faces when you tell them that a man who regularly wrote the most offensive word to women on repeated emails to female journalists wrote her speech. Its priceless when the penny drops.

    The hypocrisy of the Gillard and her staff is stunning and really must be underlined.

  110. nic

    It’s just amazing that someone in that elite level of government that McTernan was working in would use the “c” word in emails.

    Imagine if he’d looked at his watch!

  111. Rabz

    Today the High Court decided unanimously that the Marriage Equality (Same Sex) Act 2013, enacted by the Legislative Assembly for the Australian Capital Territory, cannot operate concurrently with the federal Marriage Act 1961.

    I trust the cost of the High Court action has been sheeted back to those idiots in the ACT municipal council?

    They should be severely censured for this disgusting, narcissistic sham, the loathsome deadshits.

  112. Andrew

    Not only has the Liberal NBN Lite cost blown out to $41 billion – only $3B less than Labor’s full version – it also represents yet another broken promise, as less than half will get 25Mbps by 2016 and more than a third won’t get fibre at all. Of course Turnbull is waving his arms about claiming a black hole in the books. Another complete shemozzle from the worst first three months a federal government has ever had.

    Wrong, the Labor Party’s project as blown out to $73 billion according to the audit.

  113. Rabz

    nic – in victim poker, race trumps gender/sexuality and has since the OJ verdict.

  114. nic

    I would like to see some of Credlin’s emails to do a fair comparison, though.

    Yep, I’m betting she writes that someone is a C*** after basing a whole strategy around mysogyny /sarc

  115. candy

    Where will the turnaround in Abbott’s fortunes come from, candy? No one here seems to know the answer to this question.

    Now how would I know Monty? but blind freddie can see it won’t happen in 10 weeks of governing.

  116. C.L.

    As I rightly said last week, the ACT’s phony betrothed were idiots.

    Sucked in, idiots.

  117. boy on a bike

    Can someone explain to me the possible reasons for the ABC running with these ‘leaked’ McTernan emails?

    Abbott666 is to blame.

  118. Rabz

    Where will the turnaround in Abbott’s fortunes come from, candy? No one here seems to know the answer to this question.

    When the electorate continues to thank its lucky stars that the current government isn’t the previous one, you preposterous, posturing plonker.

  119. nic

    “We certainly don’t want children growing up in fear of violence, and replicating violence.

    Yep, those policies have worked out well haven’t they?

  120. C.L.

    “We certainly don’t want children growing up in fear of violence, and replicating violence.”

    The Australian left now militantly opposes a smack on the bottom but ferociously supports the ‘right’ to kill unborn girls – something even John McTernan was shocked to discover.

  121. There will be a number of reasons, but we can be certain that the tactics of Labor to stop the repeal of the Carbon Tax will have a political effect when prices rise after 1 July 2014 when the Carbon Tax is applied to fuel in transport.

    LOL, Token predicts at least six more months of pain for you lot.

    Tell me Tokes, how much will inflation rise by in July 2014 due to this measure? And how will the regular punter see it in action, seeing as it won’t affect the price at the pump at all? If that’s what you’re hanging your hat on, it’s going to be a long three years.

  122. nic

    From Faufacts:

    Meanwhile, the Holden debate rolls on. The company’s managing director Mike Devereux says he does not blame the Coalition government for the company’s decision to leave Australia.

    Devereux, who told ABC radio that he had a “constructive” phone call with Prime Minister Tony Abbott this morning, said he had not spoken to Mr Abbott “face to face” since before the election. He would not comment on whether the Abbott government had done enough to keep Holden in Australia.

    “Tony called me and we had a very good chat,” Devereux told ABC radio. “What I did share with him is … I understand completely what the challenges are for his government … to try to determine what path forward Australia needs to take

    http://www.smh.com.au/business/markets-live/markets-live-asx-in-sudden-plunge-20131212-2z76l

  123. Infidel Tiger

    But in a damning assessment of the former NBN Co management and Labor’s policy, the company argued that the current financial estimates are wrong, and that the project would cost $72.9 billion in funding – instead of $44.1 billion — and take three extra years to complete.

    Poor monty. If only he could direct his trolling The Cat energy towards strolling around The Tan.

  124. Token

    LOL, Token predicts at least six more months of pain for you lot

    Your team’s childish indulgence of their supporters at the taxpayers expense create a huge mess which will take years to clean up.

    A realist realises we are going to see an endless string of tricks and political grandstanding when the beneficiaries of this largess lose access to the public feeding trough.

  125. H B Bear

    The ACT town council fails at yet another attempt at relevance.

    Not to worry. Sarah Hyphen-Hypocrite is on the case.

  126. twostix

    The hypocrisy of the Gillard and her staff is stunning and really must be underlined.

    The cynical attempt to manipulate the populace via the most vile and abusive campaign a PM has ever run against anyone, the lies Gillard personally told about it, the Press Gallery and left knowingly furthering the lie, must be brought to the front of the national consciousness..

    The “misogyny” campaign was a cynical ploy constructed and run by a man and was gleefully acted out by amoral ALP “women” under his instruction.

    Do any leftists here feel stupid or duped? I notice m0nty uses the “M” word an awful lot around the time of the now-known-to-be-crafted-for-her-by-an-abusive-male “speech”.

    Now he casually mocks the era.

    It sure was useful for them.

  127. Now how would I know Monty? but blind freddie can see it won’t happen in 10 weeks of governing.

    Right, so no one here can see any signs of Abbott turning it around, or can think of a credible reason why he would be able to in the future.

  128. H B Bear

    How much did this latest exercise in moral vanity by the ACT town council cost ratepayers?

  129. nic

    The hypocrisy of the Gillard and her staff is stunning and really must be underlined.

    This is a flow-chart worth developing:
    The Mysogyny speech
    The defence of Shagger Thomson
    The defence of Slipper
    The language used by Gillard’s chief advisor

  130. Infidel Tiger

    The hypocrisy of the Gillard and her staff is stunning and really must be underlined.

    Her whole office sounds like it was staffed by a pack of useless cnuts.

  131. Driftforge

    Was there a discussion on George Brandis’ inquiry into the restriction of common law freedoms by legislation?

    For the purposes of the inquiry ‘laws that encroach upon traditional rights, freedoms and privileges’ are to be understood as laws that:

    reverse or shift the burden of proof;
    deny procedural fairness to persons affected by the exercise of public power;
    exclude the right to claim the privilege of self-incrimination;
    abrogate legal professional privilege;
    apply strict or absolute liability to all physical elements of a criminal offence;
    interfere with freedom of speech;
    interfere with freedom of religion;
    interfere with vested property rights;
    interfere with freedom of association;
    interfere with freedom of movement;
    disregard common law protection of personal reputation;
    authorise the commission of a tort
    inappropriately delegate legislative power to the Executive;
    give executive immunities a wide application;
    retrospectively change rights and obligations;
    retrospectively extend criminal law;
    alter criminal law practices based on the principle of a fair trial;
    permit an appeal from an acquittal; and
    restrict access to the courts;

  132. Bruce

    We should see a significant turn around in the Coalitions fortunes when the Abbott Royal Commission into Union Malfeasance gets underway next year and if that’s not enough those Labor Luminaries who will be charged with fraud and rape will add to the Coalition’s joy.Think of the Eddie O’Beid matters multiplied by one hundred.Happy days!

  133. Driftforge

    Now how would I know Monty? but blind freddie can see it won’t happen in 10 weeks of governing.

    Right, so no one here can see any signs of Abbott turning it around, or can think of a credible reason why he would be able to in the future.

    Well I suspect the Royal Commission into Union slush funds may have a negative impact on Labor’s votes over next year or two.

  134. Infidel Tiger

    There’s no pain for us Monty.

    It’s quite plain that Abbott’s plan all along has been to gut the union movement. So far so good. One by one all their cash cows are being forced out. The jewel in the crown of the union theft movement, the NBN is now out of their hands. That one really hurts! And… There’s a Royal Commission on the way!

    It’s quite beautiful.

  135. candy

    Sucked in, idiots.

    Those people spent a fair bit of money I would think on clothes and catering and so on. I guess they knew what could happen though.

  136. LOL IT, you’ve been bitching about Abbott for months like he’s a boil on your buttock, and now suddenly he’s a genius. You’re hilarious.

  137. Empire Strikes Back

    I see Krispy has taken to autobamming. I do enjoy the schadenfreude.

    Next up: Monty the Clown flails the flail, on himself.

    Adult themes. Parental guidance recommended.

  138. I expect that the Abbott government will not electorally benefit from appearing so keen to spend money on lawyers for enquiries that clearly have political self interest as a motivation.

    Sure, they will excite the readers of the Australian and Catallaxy (essentially the same subset of the population), as would a repeal of s.18C.

    You’re confusing your own political excitability with the bulk of the Australian public.

  139. H B Bear

    ACT Chief Minister Katy Gallagher said her government had no regrets about pursuing marriage equality.

    “We have no apologies for pursuing what we said we would go before the election,” Ms Gallagher told the ABC before the judgment was handed down.

    It is all about the seeming. They are truly pink Nelson Mandelas.

    Who will think of the beagles?

  140. Infidel Tiger

    LOL IT, you’ve been bitching about Abbott for months like he’s a boil on your buttock, and now suddenly he’s a genius. You’re hilarious.

    Hes a major let down for me, but most things are. However I do appreciate that the union movement in this country is now rooted.

    I’m on tenterhooks waiting for Toyota to close!

  141. Right, so no one here can see any signs of Abbott turning it around, or can think of a credible reason why he would be able to in the future.

    With all due respect, isn’t it a tad early to be crowing ‘game over’?
    Abbott plays a long game. He did so over 5 years of opposition when he went from “unelectable” to PM, with the scalps of Turnbull, Rudd, Gillard and Rudd’s hair transplant hanging from his belt.
    He seems, to me at least, to think in strategic terms and doesn’t lose his nerve if he suffers a few tactical defeats along the way, but then I’m not as politically astute as you, so I’ve probably got that wrong.

  142. egg_

    The hypocrisy of the Gillard and her staff is stunning and really must be underlined.

    McTernan being the master of cunning stunts…

  143. Token

    McTernan being the master of cunning stunts…

    It is no wonder the Musselman felt so welcome in Gillard’s office, he and McTavish seem to have the same topic at the front of mind.

  144. harrys on the boat

    Shitfer and m0nty are becoming just a piss riddled farce.

    They childishly championed the previous governing clusterfuck til its death, with virtually every one of their puerile arguments being demolished. Their juvenile support for Rimmer and TLS befitted the pair of twats that they are.

    Now the Libs are in, they’ve all of a sudden re-branded themselves to be concerned political pundits, worrying themselves over details they chose not to give 2 flying fucks about under Labor.

    What a pair of fucking arse clowns.

  145. Token

    It is all about the seeming. They are truly pink Nelson Mandelas.

    Are you blogging from the UK?

    If so do you realise you’ve callous use of the sainted Mandela in a joke has given the UK police the right to seize your computer, and take your fingerprints & genetic so they can permanently remain on file.

  146. twostix

    Just to remind everyone that the hyperactive M0nty’s previous poll watching and “analysis” has brought us gems such as:

    Rudd can win this with 50% 2PP or even less. He will lose Lyne, New England and Fisher. He will probably lose Corangamite and two other Victorian seats minimum. But there are eight or nine Queensland Coalition held seats he already has on his side. Polls are close enough now that we could see another hung Parliament! Anything is possible now, including a Rudd victory.

    OR

    Rudd will swamp Queensland, they love him there.

    lol

  147. It’s ironic that very conservative attitudes to pre-marital sexual behaviour in India have long been said to lead to more homosexual experiences by single men, yet the country also retains the illegality of that from a colonial law. (As well as being a notoriously unsafe place for women regardless of the fact that it’s a scandal to be seen kissing a lover in public.) This article from an Indian medical journal is interesting on the topic. An extract:

    Data from many different surveys across the country show that same sex activity exists and is prevalent across India in both urban and rural areas. Furthermore, MSM are a part of all socio-economic groups and span all religious as well as other social groups. One study done in several villages reported that nearly 10 per cent of single men and 3 per cent of married men engaged in same sex behaviour24. Another survey showed that 7 per cent of male college students in Chennai had their first sexual experience with another male25. A different sexual behaviour survey in Uttar Pradesh reported that approximately 54 per cent of male respondents indicated some type of same sex behaviour during their lifetime18. Another study conducted at a drop-in center for MSM in Mumbai showed that nearly 23 per cent of MSM were married and that being married to a woman was actually associated with a much higher risk of being HIV positive (23.8% for married men vs. 9.1% for others)8.

  148. feelthebern

    I realize this is from the 10th Dec (apologies if it has already been covered here).
    http://www.crikey.com.au/2013/12/10/flying-high-labor-ministers-racked-up-millions-in-vip-travel/

    Why isn’t this getting coverage by ABC or Fairfax (it doesn’t get a mention on the Fairfax MP expenses special web site)?
    Running hard on a subject when a Lib or Nat is involved, but running dead when Labor is involved is called something. That’s right: BIAS.

  149. will

    We should see a significant turn around in the Coalitions fortunes when the Abbott Royal Commission into Union Malfeasance gets underway next year

    A short trip down memory lane to the Franser Gvoernment and the Costigan Royal Commission should give you pause.

    The tentacles of corruption extended into the Liberal Party with the ‘bottom of the harbour” tax avoidance scheme.

    and the Unions remained untouched (except for some minor extra governance and reporting requirements under the Conciliation & Arbitration Act 1904)

  150. Makka

    Geez stevie, how much time do spend trawling the net digging up juicy tit bits on non-mainstream sexual activities ? It really has your attention, doesn’t it?

  151. johanna

    “The premiers of South Australia and Victoria have travelled to Canberra this morning to “fight” for “substantial” Federal Government funding to help Holden workers find new jobs.

    The iconic carmaker announced yesterday that it would shut down most of its operations in Australia by 2017 – putting nearly 3,000 people out of work.

    Victorian Premier Denis Napthine says his state will need “a substantial amount of money” to help workers gain new skills and to create new jobs.

    “I’ll be meeting the Prime Minister this afternoon, I’ll be looking him eye to eye, and I’ll be fighting for the very best deal for Victorian workers and the Victorian economy and Victorian jobs,” he said.

    South Australia’s Premier Jay Weatherill is similarly adamant that Tony Abbott must put money on the table.”

    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-12-12/premiers-travel-to-canberra-for-talks-on-holden/5152404

    Unbelievable.

    Here we have an industry closing down not least because of featherbedded and overpaid “workers”, and government subsidies that paid for it – and the first thing these morons do is demand even more of our money for the overpaid workers! The ones will four years’ notice to get another job, and redundancy benefits most workers can only dream of!

    I can understand it from Jay Weatherill, who is a union-appeasing Laborite. But, was Napthine dropped on his head when he was a baby, or something? He actually says the Feds should give the State Government money so that the State Government can use it to create jobs. Seems he has just worked out how to bring unemployment in Victoria down to zero – take other people’s money and use it to “create jobs.”

    It really is depressing.

  152. Google works very quickly, Makka. So that article took approximately 3 seconds to locate.

    As Catallaxy threads have an abiding interest in homosexuality (as Yobbo notes, it gets used an insult on virtually every single thread, several times a day) I thought it would be of general interest…

  153. Empire Strikes Back

    Napthine faces an election within 12 months and commands a shaky one seat majority.

    As the premier of a Soviet monarchy, he is behaving to type.

  154. Tracey

    My position became redundant earlier this year after many years of loyal service. What a pity I hadn’t been with Holden. Half the country would be demanding the Government throw some money at me.

  155. Empire Strikes Back

    A short trip down memory lane to the Franser Gvoernment and the Costigan Royal Commission should give you pause.

    The tentacles of corruption extended into the Liberal Party with the ‘bottom of the harbour” tax avoidance scheme.

    Union thuggery can exist only in symbiosis with crony capital. Ironically, the reforms of the Hawke/Keating economic reforms have weakened that nexus. No doubt a RC would uncover some link to persons or organisations associated with the LNP, but I suspect this time around that poses less risk to the LP machinery than it would have 30 years ago.

  156. feelthebern

    Today’s unemployment data:

    Employment Change 10.0K
    Unemployment Rate 5.8%
    Full Time Employment Change 15.5k
    Part Time Employment Change 5.5k
    Participation Rate 64.8%

    This was for the MONTH of November.
    & we have all this hubbub over 3000 Holden staff who will go over the next 4-5 years.
    & if they get made redundant during that time, they get 300k-500k exit packages.
    Seems a little unhinged.

  157. With all due respect, isn’t it a tad early to be crowing ‘game over’?
    Abbott plays a long game. He did so over 5 years of opposition when he went from “unelectable” to PM, with the scalps of Turnbull, Rudd, Gillard and Rudd’s hair transplant hanging from his belt.
    He seems, to me at least, to think in strategic terms and doesn’t lose his nerve if he suffers a few tactical defeats along the way, but then I’m not as politically astute as you, so I’ve probably got that wrong.

    So you can’t think of a single mechanism Abbott would use to turn things around either, Shoss. You just assume he’s using strategery, without ever being able to articulate what chess move might be of assistance.

  158. pete m

    steve from brisbane

    #1107552, posted on December 12, 2013 at 10:55 am

    McTernan seemed to have a fairly limited vocabulary when it came to describing how he would hurt an enemy.

    I would like to see some of Credlin’s emails to do a fair comparison, though

    How about comparing his language and tone with common decency and good sense.

    Oops, sorry, forgot who I was speaking to.

  159. harrys on the boat

    Shitfer in defence of McTernan……. I don’t criticise him as I bet, in my own guesswork and total fantasy, that Credlin is just as bad.

    If that’s the standard Shitfer, you’re a vile p3dophile who just hasn’t been caught yet.

  160. johanna

    In over a decade of daily dealings with Prime Ministers’ and Ministers’ offices in Canberra, and a few before that dealing daily with a State Premier’s office, I have never seen language like that – even remotely like that – in writing. From what I know of the Ministers, Premiers and Chiefs of Staff I worked with, it would have been an instant firing offence.

    Indeed, even speaking like that would have been unacceptable in most of those offices, except perhaps over a few drinks after work, or in private generally – certainly not in the middle of the office or in public.

    Of course, I only worked with Coalition governments.

  161. Leo G

    Another study conducted at a drop-in center for MSM in Mumbai showed that nearly 23 per cent of MSM were married and that being married to a woman was actually associated with a much higher risk of being HIV positive (23.8% for married men vs. 9.1% for others)

    Selection bias. How representative of all married MSM is a group of married MSM who regularly use the services of a drop-in centre for MSM?

  162. .

    All you have proven is…that job losses under Gillard and Rudd weren’t 10,000+, but averaged about 9,000 per month…and only at certain times were job losses 10,000+.
    Which is precisely what I’ve asserted.

    Yes.

    Well, not really. You asserted sfb was a shithead because he questioned the credibility of the “tens of thousands every month” claim. Which even your own faulty analysis has proved wrong.

    There was nothing faulty in my analysis and you have never proven anything substantive to say otherwise. What I said was true, and my criticism of Steve from Brisbane is correct. He is a lying shithead.

    The original claim was that for FIVE years, the figure of 10,000 happened. Steve disputed this.

    For 9,000 we looked at the entire 2007-2013 term of the ALP, which is correct as well..

    Please learn how to count before you pontificate about economics, stats software and why you’d send me broke if we both put up a shingle as forecasters etc.

  163. So you can’t think of a single mechanism Abbott would use to turn things around either, Shoss. You just assume he’s using strategery, without ever being able to articulate what chess move might be of assistance.

    But why should I articulate what Abbott may or may not do? He held his nerve over all of the years of opposition, when every single Government press conference, on whatever subject, devolved into an Abbott666-fest. He clearly has the capacity to devise a long-term strategy and the balls to stick by it, whatever the vicissitudes of life may toss up in short term.
    The Krud office high-fived each other when Abbott rolled Turnbull because Abbott was ‘unelectable’. You are, in effect, doing the same thing right now.

  164. JC

    WTF!

    EXCLUSIVE – Sex, guns, cocaine-induced heart attacks and a pet Bengal tiger biting a party girl’s breast: The $100m poker playboy ‘Instagram King’ opens his heart and home to reveal what drives his ‘lunatic lifestyle’

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2521591/Dan-Bilzeran-poker-playboy-crowned-Instagram-King-reveals-lunatic-lifestyle.html

  165. .

    steve from brisbane
    #1107537, posted on December 12, 2013 at 10:47 am

    It’s another reality denying aspect of the blog that you can put NOAA figures in front of them showing the ocean is indeed still heating and the response is “Ha! What do we care? Leftard!”

    Fuckwit,

    In 2010, Antarctica recorded the lowest ever temperature on planet earth, and in 2013 the old record was beat once more with the second lowest recorded satellite temp (which the NOAA use as well).

    We’ve cooled since 2010 as well.

    What an absolute fuckwit.

  166. I have seen no long term planning from Abbott at all. He is great at short term negative tactics, but the business of government seems beyond his abilities.

  167. JC

    Monster

    Removing the carbon tax has ,long term implications and so does the removal of the mining tax. These two actions offer excellent examples of long term signaling.

    You just don’t get this because you don’t understand economics.

  168. will

    In over a decade of daily dealings with Prime Ministers’ and Ministers’ offices in Canberra, and a few before that dealing daily with a State Premier’s office, I have never seen language like that – even remotely like that – in writing. From what I know of the Ministers, Premiers and Chiefs of Staff I worked with, it would have been an instant firing offence.

    Indeed, even speaking like that would have been unacceptable in most of those offices, except perhaps over a few drinks after work, or in private generally – certainly not in the middle of the office or in public.

    Of course, I only worked with Coalition governments.

    In the blokey ALP/Union world, talking like that gives you cred.

  169. Bear Necessities

    Just to remind everyone that the hyperactive M0nty’s previous poll watching and “analysis” has brought us gems such as:

    Rudd can win this with 50% 2PP or even less. He will lose Lyne, New England and Fisher. He will probably lose Corangamite and two other Victorian seats minimum. But there are eight or nine Queensland Coalition held seats he already has on his side. Polls are close enough now that we could see another hung Parliament! Anything is possible now, including a Rudd victory.

    OR

    Rudd will swamp Queensland, they love him there.

    lol

    If the ALP had General Custer as its leader then they would of won also.

  170. harrys on the boat

    m0nty’s becoming a concern “Hi Alan” troll now……… fuck off you fat waste of fucking space.

  171. Empire Strikes Back

    JC
    #1107815, posted on December 12, 2013 at 1:52 pm

    I’m struggling to hold back the envy.

    Not sure about the goat though.

  172. twostix

    I expect that the Abbott government will not electorally benefit from appearing so keen to spend money on lawyers for enquiries that clearly have political self interest as a motivation.

    Union corruption again receives the patented Steve from Brisbane “non story” stamp of approval.

    You still haven’t apologised to the blog for your wrongness, get to it.

  173. I have seen no long term planning from Abbott at all.

    Like I said, you are much more politically astute than I am.

  174. C.L.

    Has Steve acknowledged that I caught him lying about the Savva article?

  175. Andrew

    Barnaby Joyce frowned when Abbott complemented Obama…lol

  176. JC

    Has Steve acknowledged that I caught him lying about the Savva article?

    Yes, by not commenting here for a while, hoping people will forget.

  177. twostix

    So you can’t think of a single mechanism Abbott would use to turn things around either, Shoss. You just assume he’s using strategery, without ever being able to articulate what chess move might be of assistance.

    Perhaps a long and viciously personal campaign against the ALP rape culture?

  178. dover_beach

    theos 1:55 PM on 12/12/2013
    It is concerning that in the year 2013, Bronze age writings by desert dwellings nomads continue to influence politicians to the point where they will actively discriminate against fellow human beings. The same Bronze age writings were used for many years to justify apartheid in South Africa.

    In the not too distant future, Australian society will look back in embarrassment at the discrimination against one section of society.

    Loved this comment from one of the reality-based community on the ABC website following the High Court decision.

  179. Infidel Tiger

    Perhaps a long and viciously personal campaign against the ALP rape culture?

    Shocking isn’t it?

    In the spirit of reconciliation the Leader of the Opposition should renounce it.

  180. C.L.

    Abbott takes the high – non-attacking – road on Holden.

    He’s like a boxer who once killed a man in the ring.

    He won’t fight.

  181. .

    How did the bible ever justify apartheid?

    Galatians 3:26-29

    New American Standard Bible (NASB)

    26 For you are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus. 27 For all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free man, there is [a]neither male nor female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 And if you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s descendants, heirs according to promise.

  182. feelthebern

    What about the indignation of Pliber & the gang over the Mark Textor tweets?
    Haven’t heard anything from them about the Scotman’s emails.
    The staff member who got a bollocking via email “c*nt, you’ll be c*nted” (whatever the fuck that means) should have gone to HR.
    It is pretty bullying behavior.

  183. Infidel Tiger

    Abbott takes the high – non-attacking – road on Holden.

    All that wank about Holden workers being “good workers”. No they fucking weren’t. They were leeches and good Australians are glad they’ve gone. We celebrate it.

  184. Armadillo

    Abbott says Government will be announcing plans to support South Australian industry in the next few days. Interestingly, Pyne brings up the Olympic Dam mine in the next question.

  185. boy on a bike

    “c*nt, you’ll be c*nted”

    Thinking that over, that is actually the sort of thing that good mates might say to one another (depending on the company that you keep). So I doubt we’ll see any claims for bullying or harassment.

  186. feelthebern

    Thinking that over, that is actually the sort of thing that good mates might say to one another (depending on the company that you keep). So I doubt we’ll see any claims for bullying or harassment.

    Dude, you must be hanging out with Harry from Lock, Stock & 2 Smoking Barrels.
    My mates don’t speak like that at all.

  187. .

    Surprised any of the minions didn’t take this as carte blanche to rip into Mc Ternan and Gillard with all manner of profanities, at every opportunity.

    Dropping the c-bomb at least twice in every sentence.

  188. twostix

    Abbott says Government will be announcing plans to support South Australian industry in the next few days. Interestingly, Pyne brings up the Olympic Dam mine in the next question.

    Tony can thank me later for that idea.

  189. C.L.

    Perhaps a long and viciously personal campaign against the ALP rape culture?

    For the record: the Australian Labor Party is the only political party on earth that has chosen no fewer than three child rapists as leaders. Leader Keith Wright; deputy leader Bill D’Arcy; Northern Territory Chief Minister Bob Collins.

  190. twostix

    Surprised any of the minions didn’t take this as carte blanche to rip into Mc Ternan and Gillard with all manner of profanities, at every opportunity.

    I’m still processing the enormity of it. Not the C bomb emails – but the fact that the ABC just casually admitted the entire “misogyny” campaign of Hate was literally thought up and run by a vile, abusive little thug of a man. Gillard, Plibersek and Roxon were just little ladies doing as they were told, trotting out each day with their pre-scripted abuse given to them by a male.

    How much the ALP despises the electorate though, such a rank attempt at manipulation can only come from the deepest contempt toward the target’s intelligence.

    The Press Gallery aided and abbetted them. Most of them knew it was a farce yet instead of exposing it they pushed it forward.

    And Gillard just a month ago was still lying about it not to her enemies, but to her supposed “supporters”.

  191. Leo G

    I have seen no long term planning from Abbott at all.

    When do you expect to see results from long-term planning?

  192. Has Steve acknowledged that I caught him lying about the Savva article?

    CL doing the usual trick of making stuff up, calling it a lie, and claiming a win.

  193. egg_

    Gillard, Plibersek and Roxon were just little ladies doing as they were told, trotting out each day with their pre-scripted abuse given to them by a male.

    They’re not harridans, after all?
    McTernan used mind control?

  194. Makka

    “I have seen no long term planning from Abbott at all. He is great at short term negative tactics, but the business of government seems beyond his abilities.”

    It will take all of his first term efforts to undo the vicious damage caused to this country by the degenerates of the Left , mOnty. Proud of your team, I take it?

  195. dover_beach

    How did the bible ever justify apartheid?

    It never did. But the idiocy of that comment doesn’t end there. Leaving aside the fact that the Jews and Christians were never desert-dwelling nomads, or that the Bible did not appear during the Bronze Age, imagine the reaction by these same people if Bolt referred to the inordinate influence of a certain group of ‘desert-dwelling nomads’ that presently are acknowledged during opening ceremonies, etc. on the politics and culture of this nation. Do you imagine that the comment would receive a number of +1 from fellow ABC readers, and so on? I very much doubt it.

  196. Phil Coorey details the bizarre shambles that was the Libs’ mismanagement of the Holden decision to withdraw. Yet more division, Industry Minister being undermined openly by the PM and Treasurer in cahoots with the leader of the Nats. No wonder McFarlane is whinging about Cruddlin.

    If this is long term planning, I’d hate to see what the plan is. Leadership spill before the new Senate kicks in?

  197. Makka

    Assistance for Olympic Dam for the repeal of the CT, anyone?

  198. boy on a bike

    And Gillard just a month ago was still lying about it not to her enemies, but to her supposed “supporters”.

    Hahahahaha – someone should ask Ann Summers for comment.

  199. Token

    …I have never seen language like that – even remotely like that – in writing. From what I know of the Ministers, Premiers and Chiefs of Staff I worked with, it would have been an instant firing offence.

    Agreed.

    I noted this is Gillard’s responsibility because as you suggest she could have sanctioned him at any time to force him to stop the deranged and abhorent behaviour, but she chose not to. She therefore endorsed the use of the C word.

    What a disgraceful women. Remember that next time a left bangs on about Abbott & mysogyny.

  200. Tom

    Has Steve acknowledged that I caught him lying about the Savva article?

    No. Shitfer lies about everything. It’s compulsive. It’s just what leftards have to do — if they tell the truth about their agenda, normal people loathe them and, in parliamentary terms, they are unelectable.

  201. Andrew

    Andrew Robb seems to at least be well across the fact that the big government spending does not work.

  202. Infidel Tiger

    Phil Coorey details… that he uses Turtle Wax on his bald melon.

    What a non-entity Coorey is. He might as well fill his columns with Xmas recipes.

  203. dover_beach

    CL doing the usual trick of making stuff up, calling it a lie, and claiming a win.

    Why would anyone ‘make stuff up’ and then ‘call it a lie’? No, I think you’ve confused what CL did (in this instance, show that you had made stuff up, concluded that you had in fact lied, and left it to the rest of us to acknowledge he had won) with what you usually do which is make stuff up, call it the truth, and then claim the win yourself.

  204. Infidel Tiger

    Crazy Bob makes an appearance!

  205. twostix

    McTernan used mind control?

    Hey don’t look at me, it’s the ABC that is saying that Gillard is a ditzy air head that just did as she was told by the ALP men.

  206. Bear Necessities

    Quoter from Phil Coorey’s article.

    Whether you believe in subsidising the industry or not, Holden is leaving for one incontrovertible reason: the federal government was no longer prepared to pay the subsidies required.

    Good!

  207. Makka

    “Andrew Robb seems to at least be well across the fact that the big government spending does not work.”

    No, but incentives to invest do, for the businesses that wish to of course. During the campaign the LNP made several references to strategic incentives to spur investments. Special economic zones etc. Olympic Dam (OD) did not get up mainly due to the ROI timeframe. That formula will be under close scrutiny. Abbott sees OD as a game changer.

  208. Under Labor’s watch, Mitsubishi and Ford failed, Holden foundered, Qantas faltered, debt ballooned and education standards fell. Hypocrisy flourished.

    Mitsubishi failed under Howard and told him so, they waited until after the 2007 election to announce their withdrawal. Ford, Holden and Qantas were all victims of the high dollar, to be truthful. Debt ballooned because of the GFC and the money paid for the rescue of hundreds of thousands of jobs that would have been lost in the recession we didn’t have because of the stimulus. Education standards fell because Gillard didn’t get around to fixing Howard’s SES mess until late in her time.

    Tired old talking points from tired old MSM hacks like Savva are so easy to disprove with facts.

  209. Oh come on

    The Member for K-K-K-Kraaaazeeee Kennedy, Bob K-K-K-K-Katter just asked perhaps the most boneheaded, pig-ignorant question ever asked in QT.

    It was something like “Does the Prime Minister accept that the floating dollar of the Keating-Howard floating dollar of 49-52c would have been better for agriculture and industry, and does he support returning to this policy?”

    This really was the kind of language he was using – check Hansard if you don’t believe. Though you could be forgiven for not believing, as it is pretty unbelievably stupid, even for Katter.

  210. egg_

    twostix
    #1107901, posted on December 12, 2013 at 2:48 pm

    /sarc tag implied, sorry.

  211. Oh come on

    Yes, m0nty is right. Howard was not only the Prime Minister from 1996 to 2007; he was also the head of design and engineering for Mitsubishi Australia and personally designed the unloved Mitsubishi 380 that sunk that company’s Australian operations.

  212. Andrew

    Electricity Bill trying to censure the PM.

  213. Token

    What a non-entity Coorey is. He might as well fill his columns with Xmas recipes.

    Do you think he may have realised this would the consequence of being chief cheerleader for the Liars Party in government? He now is a non-entity who only has connections to the party which will be in opposition for 6 to 9 years at least.

  214. Oh come on

    Debt ballooned because of the GFC and the money paid for the rescue of hundreds of thousands of jobs that would have been lost in the recession we didn’t have because of the stimulus.

    This has been debunked so many times here, I can’t believe you have the gall to wheel this palpable falsehood out again. You’re just being obtuse now.

    Education standards fell because Gillard didn’t get around to fixing Howard’s SES mess until late in her time.

    Well, she was an epically incompetent Prime Minister. Thanks for admitting that, m0nty. So what you’re saying is that Gillard allowed education – supposedly Gillard’s great passion – go to the dogs and only decided to do something about it when she was looking down the barrel of a massive electoral rout and needed to pull a rabbit out of a hat.

  215. Infidel Tiger

    I feel like I’m being molested in a toilet listening to Shorten make his censure moment. What chutzpah.

  216. Oh come on

    I’ll bet Bill Shorten has never lifted the bonnet of a car, little pansy man.

  217. Oh come on

    Holden has been a good company to Australia? Well it’s been good at eating our taxes.

  218. Oh come on

    Fuck off, Bill. If you think the decision to shutter Holden’s Australian operations happened within the last week, you’re even stupider than m0nty.

  219. Tom

    Coorey’s article this morning was very useful in informing the thousands of road warriors in airport business lounges everywhere that not only is the national “business” daily a leftwing toilet, but its idea of hiring a national political commentator is not to get someone who is expert in translating politics for a business audience, but to drag in a leftwing activist hack from ShakeMyHead.com who believes that capitalism is essentially bad and Marxism is greatly underestimated. They have also figured out that AFR editor Michael Stutchbury thinks they’re stupid.

  220. Token

    Hey don’t look at me, it’s the ABC that is saying that Gillard is a ditzy air head that just did as she was told by the ALP men*.

    Wow, so she was young and naive again.

    There we thought she was a powerful women totally in control when in fact she was reliving her relationship with Bruce Wilson.

    * Did you include Uncle Bill Ludwig in that group?

  221. Oh come on

    Bill Shorten needs to go on a fact finding tour of Malaysia and see how to run an automotive national champion like Proton.

    I mean, that’s basically what he wants, isn’t it?

  222. It was something like “Does the Prime Minister accept that the floating dollar of the Keating-Howard floating dollar of 49-52c would have been better for agriculture and industry, and does he support returning to this policy?”

    While I agree that this is a monumentally stupid question to ask, there is an argument to say that if China and Korea are allowed to manipulate their currencies to the benefit of their manufacturing industries – which is a large part of why our manufacturing industry is dying a slow death – what are we supposed to do about it, just sit back and take it? Free trade where only one side is free is not free trade.

  223. Token

    They have also figured out that AFR editor Michael Stutchbury thinks they’re stupid.

    I do hope Stutch is keeping a secret diary so he can write a tell all book about how he managed to stay sane when working with the likes of La Tingle, the bald idiot Paunxatawney Phil, etc.

  224. twostix

    Mitsubishi failed under Howard and told him so, they waited until after the 2007 election to announce their withdrawal. Ford, Holden and Qantas were all victims of the high dollar, to be truthful. Debt ballooned because of the GFC and the money paid for the rescue of hundreds of thousands of jobs that would have been lost in the recession we didn’t have because of the stimulus. Education standards fell because Gillard didn’t get around to fixing Howard’s SES mess until late in her time.

    You lose a little bit of yourself each time you lie m0nty. Even if you are only being “clever”. I thought you would have learned that in the Gillard years.

  225. nic

    Holden has been a good company to Australia?

    Wrings hands, but don’t Holden also produce the nasty gas that will make our children’s children’s lives a misery? The ‘greatest moral challenge of our time’ and all?

  226. Aaron

    I’ll bet Bill Shorten has never lifted the bonnet of a car, little pansy man.

    He’s lifted plenty of skirts in his time, with and without permission.

  227. So what you’re saying is that Gillard allowed education – supposedly Gillard’s great passion – go to the dogs and only decided to do something about it when she was looking down the barrel of a massive electoral rout and needed to pull a rabbit out of a hat.

    She waited for Rudd’s review to finish, and at the end of it had a solid slab of policy which had buy-in from all stakeholders and would transform the system into one more focused on need, without a lot of waste and inefficiency. This is called long term planning. That it took so long is only an indication of how difficult it was.

    Meanwhile, Abbot and Pyne go through four different silly policies in a few months, then throw all their plans away and revert back to Gonski. Heckuva job.

  228. bons

    IF the RC is managed correctly, we are going to witness one of the most significant turning points in our history. It will bloom just like the Fitsgerald RC.
    The Union Dons faced with personal and organisational disaster will have to overreact exposing themselves even further to scrutiny. You can imagine that relationships with the ABC will come to light as well.
    In the space of just over a year we could witness the World’s most powerful unions, and their elected Tammeny team being completely devestated. Hopefully some complicit management teams as well. How many current Senators will be exposed.
    This is every little conservatives dream – thank you Santa.

  229. C.L.

    Phil Coorey

    Known here for years as “Labor spokesman Phil Coorey…”

    LOL.

  230. C.L.

    No, Steve.

    You were caught lying about the Savva article.

    When you don’t post the link that’s always the dead giveaway.

    Unfortunately for you, I Googled the article.

  231. It’s official: early days of Abbott government easily the worst start since at least WWII.

    Looking at the full history of governments (elected from opposition or re-elected) that have lost the polling lead in the first six months or so of their terms, it’s noteable that most of the recent examples (including the final governments of Whitlam, Fraser and Gillard) have lost, while the final Hawke government survived its term only at the cost of its initial Prime Minister. (Note: for the Newspoll era I am not counting falling behind in a single poll as losing the lead.) To find examples of governments losing the lead early and then winning under the same PM we have to go way back to the Menzies governments of 1951-4 and 1961-3.

    So it has been 50 years since a government started anywhere near this badly, and recovered to win the next election with the same leader. Glorious.

  232. Infidel Tiger

    To find examples of governments losing the lead early and then winning under the same PM we have to go way back to the Menzies governments of 1951-4 and 1961-3.

    Menzies you say? How did that work out?

  233. Oh come on

    So what you’re saying is that, after five years in government, the Rudd/Gillard governments bear no responsibility for sliding education results – it was all Howard’s fault. Take this down, folks. I’m sure m0nty will acknowledge that sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander. The coalition has 5 years of blaming Labor for any of its missteps that m0nty will no doubt turn a blind eye to.

  234. SteveC

    Are you still digging that hole dot? Can you explain this strange conundrum? ABS says the labour force increased by 1,200,000 over the 6 years. Employment grew by 1,000,000 over the same period, and unemployment by 200,000. Over the same period, the population (15 years and over) grew by 2,000,000, and the participation rate stayed relatively steady at 65%

    Roy Morgan says that over the same period the employed grew by 1,100,000 , unemployment by 700,000 and thus the labour force increased by 1,800,000.

    So of the increased population, ABS says about 60% were added to the workforce, which is consistent with their participation rate. Roy Morgan says of an increased population, about 90% were added to the workforce. His figures show an increase in the participation rate from 62% to 65% – which would be a good thing – but highly doubtful.

    The entire 500,000 discrepancy in the two unemployment counts is contained in Morgan’s strangely low workforce figure in 2007. You can try the same analysis with 5 years data if you like, but it doesn’t make any difference. Conclusion, only a nong would believe Morgan’s workforce figures.

    Did you find that “analysis” yet that shows Morgan is consistent with ABS?

    Perhaps you invest in that expensive shit after all, or at least a decent calculator.

  235. twostix

    It’s official: early days of Abbott government easily the worst start since at least WWII.

    M0nty you’re becoming maniacle.

  236. Combine Dave

    Meanwhile, Abbot and Pyne go through four different silly policies in a few months, then throw all their plans away and revert back to Gonski. Heckuva job.

    Does this mean you now support the coalitions education policy?

  237. Combine Dave

    While I agree that this is a monumentally stupid question to ask, there is an argument to say that if China and Korea are allowed to manipulate their currencies to the benefit of their manufacturing industries – which is a large part of why our manufacturing industry is dying a slow death – what are we supposed to do about it, just sit back and take it? Free trade where only one side is free is not free trade.

    We are too small to do anything else. Unless we bankrupt ourselves trying to force the dollar down.

  238. twostix

    So what you’re saying is that, after five years in government, the Rudd/Gillard governments bear no responsibility for sliding education results – it was all Howard’s fault. Take this down, folks. I’m sure m0nty will acknowledge that sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander. The coalition has 5 years of blaming Labor for any of its missteps that m0nty will no doubt turn a blind eye to.

    OCO m0nty isn’t here to argue. He seems to think that through sheer force of will and blog comments he can change reality and bring Tony Abbott down.

    Kind of like a Cargo Cult.

  239. .

    Can you explain this strange conundrum?

    There is no conundrum. The ABS figures are not comprehensive.

    You don’t understand what you are talking about.

    So of the increased population, ABS says about 60% were added to the workforce, which is consistent with their participation rate.

    That’s not even correct, not even in a rough sense.

    Conclusion, only a nong would believe Morgan’s workforce figures.

    You have no reason to say this other than it is convenient.

    The entire 500,000 discrepancy in the two unemployment counts is contained in Morgan’s strangely low workforce figure in 2007.

    There is nothing strange about it and you have no reason to say so.

    For five years of Rudd-Gillard, 10,000 people per month lost their jobs. Over their whole tenure, it was roughly 9,000 per month. Often the job losses exceeded 10,000 per month.

    You are still prattling on with crap and you believe you can calculate job losses from the unemployment rate. The LFPR gets close but this merely confirms what JC and I said.

    Your conclusion that other people need a calculator to add up as you do is premised on the idea that they don’t udnerstand the ABS data like you and also like you, make convenient assumptions about data they simply don’t want to know about.

    Go away, you are being a fool and have been found wanting several times.

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