Australia Day Weekend Forum: January 25, 2014

This entry was posted in Open Forum. Bookmark the permalink.

1,048 Responses to Australia Day Weekend Forum: January 25, 2014

1 3 4 5
  1. Tel

    Dot, I agree that the suggestion of an open slather Australian Constitution would essentially write off the states, and just hand all political power to Canberra. With Federalism gone forever it would be centralised everything.

    The ideal would be a Constitution where any use of power could trigger a referendum to settle the issue if enough citizens saw that power as overreach. Avoid having the ability for a central court to make rulings on central powers.

  2. .

    Err Andrew, you seem to misunderstand.

    I found your views and twostix’s comments quite illuminating. Please keep them coming.

  3. JohnA

    C.L. #1168722, posted on January 27, 2014 at 12:48 pm

    Don’t mess with the Pute.

    Really, don’t.

    Maybe he’s seen the t-shirt “DADD – Dads Against Daughters Dating” and adapted the idea…

  4. JC

    Lord, I tell you what, politicians can thank their lucky stars Catallaxy doesn’t have the power the Romans did at the Coliseum. with the thumbing down rule. There would be dead politicians a mile high at the arena we go through them so quick.

  5. Andrew

    Err Andrew, you seem to misunderstand.

    I found your views and twostix’s comments quite illuminating. Please keep them coming.

    I’ll take that back. I apologise.

  6. twostix

    Bishop’s idea is antithetical to what I have learnt about education in the past two years. It is a whack, unworkable idea with no benefit and plays into the hands of the social engineers and economic vandals of the left.

    She floated that idea during Howards failed attempt to nationalise the curriculum. Which Labor then rode on the back of to do so themselves and so shackled every school in Australia into teaching The ALP’s Great And Wonderous Australia. If Bishop had of had her way three year olds would have been forced into it too. The left taking control of the curriculum as obvious to even the biggest political dunderhead.

    Some of the Liberals failed ‘ideas’ are more poisonous than Labors because they pave the way for Labor to act in areas where it never could before.

  7. .

    “Did I fucking want an apology…?!…you pigfucker bully-boy high priest…learn the materials” etc…oh how I long for the halcyon glory days of CatallaxyFiles.

  8. Ed

    Some of the Liberals failed ‘ideas’ are more poisonous than Labors because they pave the way for Labor to act in areas where it never could before.

    That’s why centralisation is almost always a bad idea.
    The next time a grand technocrat comes to power who wants to reshape the nation according to their utopian ideals, they just tweak a few policy settings and ‘hey presto’.

    Decentralisation, which in Australia’s case means federalism, makes it harder for social engineers to get the goodies. It locks it all away in parcels all around the country.

  9. Makka

    “Some of the Liberals failed ‘ideas’ are more poisonous than Labors because they pave the way for Labor to act in areas where it never could before.”

    And this is why the LNP must get on with the decimation of the Left in all its areas of operations- the PS, Juciary, Unions, Media (ALPBC), Welfare Industry…. etc. They will never eradicate them, sure. But like a cull, if you don’t bring down the infestation, natural breeding will overwhelm you. I see none of this with Abbott’s Govt. He’s in fact handing out lollipops to the scum.

  10. twostix

    Dot, I agree that the suggestion of an open slather Australian Constitution would essentially write off the states, and just hand all political power to Canberra. With Federalism gone forever it would be centralised everything.

    The history of “Australia” is one of rapid centralisation as the Federal government and courts literally LOL at the whishy washy weak sauce constitution. Does anybody really think, following the existing arc, that in another 100 years the Federal Government won’t simply be a UK style all powerful body?
    A way to solve this problem would be to have state governments have to vote to confirm Federal Judges.

  11. JohnA

    . #1169184, posted on January 27, 2014 at 10:12 pm

    “If, as Australians seem to want, the national government is to resolve problems that the states can’t handle, the simplest way is for a constitutional amendment to provide that the Commonwealth parliament can make laws generally for the peace, order and good government of the country.”

    This will mean the end of the constitution as we know it and effectively end Federation as a political concept. The States will remain but they shall be effectively demoted to provincial status.

    We will need a rewrite, a republic, along the lines of the US, but with much stronger rules to prevent politicians usurping powers never afforded to them, including restraints on overt (this) and covert (dams case, engineers case) attempts to centralise power.

    I am now turning against Abbott, I hope he can redeem himself.

    I agree Dot and Tel (and Gab) about the death of Federalism which such a clause would occasion.

    But it is up to us, the voters, to tell him so. Not merely to abandon him, but to point out persistently that this is contrary to Liberal policy, and contrary to the Constitution itself – as serious a blow as the 1942 centralising impact of the income tax grab.

  12. Makka

    “Not merely to abandon him,”

    Who is abandoning who?

  13. Makka

    “Who is abandoning who?”

    Ughh…….. *whom*

  14. twostix

    And this is why the LNP must get on with the decimation of the Left in all its areas of operations- the PS, Juciary, Unions, Media (ALPBC), Welfare Industry…. etc. They will never eradicate them, sure.

    I don’t believe that’s possible. The “left” – aka totalitarians, social engineers, etc have always been with us and have always sought to take control of the levers of power. The only solution, as Ed says is decentralisation. Moving powerand decisions as close to the people as possible, separating concerns, creating gridlock, etc.

  15. Infidel tiger

    It’s hilarious that Abbott’s Prime Ministership is flaming out exactly like Gillard’s. The public hate his guts because he is a lying lefty swine.

  16. twostix

    Anybody here in advanced Maths in Highschool?

    Under the National Curriculm too bad for you, you get one choice and that is all:

    Within the New South Wales Board of Studies year 9-10 curriculum, there are three different levels of Mathematics; 5.3 (Advanced), 5.2 (Intermediate) and 5.1 (Standard). The National Curriculum would consolidate the levels into one common level, in which Brown would consider it too hard for some and too easy for others

    Brown has also considered the National Curriculum as a dumb down of the existing New South Wales Higher School Certificate curriculum

    Efficiency, wonderful one-size-fits-all efficiency!

  17. Makka

    “I don’t believe that’s possible. ”

    Decentralization requires significant constitutional change which neither of the main parties support. Therefore, that seems to be closer to an impossibility to me. What is doable is what I mentioned above, with the right PM leading a truly Conservative Govt. Sitting here in the trenches being bombed, from both sides, is not a tenable position.

  18. Makka

    twostix
    #1169225, posted on January 27, 2014 at 10:53 pm

    Link?

  19. JC

    The only solution, as Ed says is decentralisation. Moving powerand decisions as close to the people as possible, separating concerns, creating gridlock, etc.

    There are some qualifiers to that I believe. To all intents and purposes Workchoices was a centralizing initiative with a decentralizing impact. The Corporations law gave Howard the chance to deregulate labor markets from Canberra according to its desires. However the impact would have been felt at the local level.

  20. Demosthenes

    Brown has also considered the National Curriculum as a dumb down of the existing New South Wales Higher School Certificate curriculum

    National curriculum = lowest common denominator. Get rid of centralised education, it serves no good purpose. I once asked a teacher (high school) what were the benefits of a national curriculum. “People who move interstate will be on the same page from day one in their new school”, was the reply. That’s it. That’s the sum total of the justification, at least if the person is intellectually honest. Some might claim it is to ensure an even spread of high-quality education, but there’s nothing stopping it being an even spread of low-quality education, so the possibilities cancel out and the supporting argument disappears.

  21. Fisky

    It’s hilarious that Abbott’s Prime Ministership is flaming out exactly like Gillard’s. The public hate his guts because he is a lying lefty swine.

    He only just beat Rudd, who was a secret Liberal sleeper agent sent to detonate the Labor Party, and took only 3 months to make the Liberals unelectable.

  22. twostix

    To all intents and purposes Workchoices was a centralizing initiative with a decentralizing impact.

    And now we have the FWA abomination.
    The commonwealth having industrial relations powers is the disease if the states retained their power over it we could have QLD with nice loose labor regulation going gangbusters while Victoria implemented their communist FWA rules for the ten remaining Victorians.

  23. twostix

    “People who move interstate will be on the same page from day one in their new school”

    That’s quite bizarre Demo because I’ve heard exactly the same line from people as well. It simply must be one of the most piss weak justifications for a day 0 revolution in education anybody has ever come up with.

  24. Andrew

    And now we have the FWA abomination.
    The commonwealth having industrial relations powers is the disease if the states retained their power over it we could have QLD with nice loose labor regulation going gangbusters while Victoria implemented their communist FWA rules for the ten remaining Victorians.

    The interesting thing about IR laws and federalism is that it was one of the best Liberal state Premiers, Jeff Kennett who actually centralised the IR laws to Canberra which has given future Liberal government lots of grief in trying to deal with EBA’s for teachers, nurses, etc.

  25. twostix

    If you want to see the absolute root of the publics dislike of the Abbott Government it’s this:

    TONY Abbott and Bill Shorten have reaffirmed their commitment to advancing indigenous Australians’ constitutional recognition.

    Who is advising this guy that Australia wants two Prime Ministers?

  26. Ed

    Who is advising this guy that Australia wants two Prime Ministers?

    Abbott has fallen into the same trap that Rudd fell into: surrounded by bad advisors and living in a bubble.
    His unceasing, constant attempts to ‘reach across the aisle’ are embarrassing and ridiculous.

  27. Ed

    And why the hell didn’t he just abolish FWA? It didn’t exist 5 years ago.
    Would it be really that radical to repeal legislation that’s less than five years old?

  28. srr

    Who is advising this guy that Australia wants two Prime Ministers?

    “Who’s The Boss? – Peta Credlin!”

  29. twostix

    The interesting thing about IR laws and federalism is that it was one of the best Liberal state Premiers, Jeff Kennett who actually centralised the IR laws to Canberra which has given future Liberal government lots of grief in trying to deal with EBA’s for teachers, nurses, etc.

    It’s the party of stupid on steroids. Kennett tried to do an end run around the communists who infest Victoria by giving IR powers to the federal government. Except then what happens when the federal government gets taken over by Victorian socialists?

    We get the FWA act and thanks to Kennett paving the way for the federal IR takeover nobody can escape.

    File that under another one of the policies that the Liberals come up with for very short term gain then Labor make hay out of forever. He didn’t want to fight the fight in the state so he just handed the power over. Just like the fat dickhead O’Farrell on the NSW Curriculum – which after Carr needed attending to. Rather than have a fight he just handed the power to the federal government. Barry O’Farrell a “Liberal” state premier gave the power to set the NSW curriculm to Labor.

  30. Mick Gold Coast QLD

    From Infidel Tiger at 10:50 pm:

    “It’s hilarious that Abbott’s Prime Ministership is flaming out exactly like Gillard’s. The public hate his guts because he is a lying lefty swine.”

    Now that’s from the wild end of a sudden shrill call here for Abbott666³ to be run out of town and instantly replaced by Morrison / Bishop’s a Fool / Peter Reith Who-No-Longer-Works-for-the-Company / Comrade Stumbull, ALP sleeper.

    There would be about three of us who know 30% of Morrison’s breeding and race record – I don’t – yet he’s been hoisted as the Great White Hope; where he sits in the NSW vs Victoria ownership wars (just a few will remember widespread astonishment that the Liberals appointed John Howard as Leader, and derision from the QLD branch); who he runs with internally; policy positions; religion; seat; margin and so on.

    They’ve been in for four months and, I read, have hurtled into oblivion because of Abbott666³ – Aaaarrrgghhh!

    No. It’s funny – I’m laughi … Aaaarrrgghhh!

  31. Cold-Hands

    Not sure if this has been mentioned earlier, but Piers Akerman is calling for an ALP apology for Union war crimes.

    AS a backdrop to today’s Australia Day celebrations, the Labor/Green Left is working itself into a lather over plans to review the flawed national education curriculum.

    The review is most timely and it behoves Australians to pause to remember that the awful campaign being waged by powerful trade unions during World War II had prevailed, it is unlikely we would have had anything to celebrate today.

    Naturally, the current national curriculum crafted by Left-leaning academics says nothing about the appalling actions taken by individual ­unions, their leaders, the ACTU and members of Labor’s leadership to sabotage Australia’s war effort.

    In a hard-hitting Australia Day eve address to members of the Young Liberals, Employment Minister Eric Abetz, the leader of the government in the Senate, reminded his audience of this extraordinary chapter in Australian history – a chapter which Labor cannot bring itself to address.

    [...]

    West Australian scholar, poet and author Hal Colebatch has published a painstakingly researched, fully documented account of the treachery in a book Australia’s Secret War. Quoting from the book, Senator Abetz said: “(a) systematic campaign of sabotage criss-crossed the nation, from Townsville to Fremantle, and cost the lives of countless Australian Diggers and allied soldiers.”

    [...]

    It would seem that while the Labor movement is losing its attempt to keep its foul wartime record a dark secret, it is unable to keep the lid on the activities of its current backers.

    As a former national union leader, Bill Shorten has to clearly distance Labor from the shameful actions of the past and the discreditable activities of more recent members.

    He should also deliver the long overdue national apology, well in time for next year’s Australia Day celebration.

    Given that its the done thing for progressives to handwring over things done generations ago, Dolly Shorten should have no problems with an apology…

  32. Ed

    Barry O’Farrell a “Liberal” state premier gave the power to set the NSW curriculm to Labor.

    O’Farrell is worse than Labor because under Labor at least we had hope that things could be different. Now we know better.
    The one small solace in regard to O’Farrell is that because he failed to reform NSW all the things that destroyed Labor will get him in the end too.

  33. DrBeauGan

    I asked a few weeks ago if Abbott had ever done anyhing indicative of courage or principle. There were no suggestions, but Candy loved him.
    Unless he launches a royal commission into union corruption soon and eventually destroys labor, his support base will comprise only Candy. He seems entirely happy to madden his natural supporters. Half his front bench are sad sogs, a spiritless gang of timeservers.
    Where is Guy Fawkes when you need him?

  34. srr

    O.K. Just Google – Cory Bernardi Abbott – read only the first two pages of results, and see why those who voted for the ‘catholic family man’ Abbott, are very, very, angry with the Feminist Lap Dog, Abbott.

  35. Mick Gold Coast QLD

    I forgot – it is also widely, fiercely, unequivocably, Catallaxically determined Peta Credlin is a witch.

    Double Aaaarrrgghhh!

  36. Ed

    He seems entirely happy to madden his natural supporters.

    ah but he never says anything the left can use against him.
    That’s why he speaks so slow.
    It’s so that he can make sure he never says anything controversial.
    (yes, that’s the actual reason..)

  37. twostix

    Speaking of Barry O’Farrel – the most useless premier outside of Victoria remember this?

    BARRY O’Farrell will use his thumping mandate in NSW to take the fight up to the Gillard government on a range of contentious federal-state issues including health reform, infrastructure funding, a carbon tax and the national curriculum, which he fears is “dumbing down” education in his state.

    Yeah, some “fight” that was O’Farrell you wanker.

  38. H B Bear

    ALPBC is showing Stephen Fry’s World of Poofs or something.

    Shame he isn’t black. Then they could just put it on endless loop and go to the pub.

  39. C.L.

    Wait, what?

    Abbott has been overtaken in the 2PP poll by a man who … by a Senior Labor Figure?

    Has that ever happened before – like anywhere in the world?

  40. C.L.

    ALPBC is showing Stephen Fry’s World of Poofs or something.

    The Western world has a fever.
    And the only prescription is.
    More cow’s hoof.

  41. JC

    Ha!

    “Iran, like other Middle Eastern countries, has an extremely high infertility rate. More than 20 percent of Iranian couples cannot conceive, according to a study conducted by one of the country’s leading fertility clinics, compared with the global rate of between 8 and 12 percent. Experts believe this is due to the prevalence of consanguineous marriages, or those between cousins. Male infertility is ‘the hidden story of the Middle East,’ says Marcia Inhorn, a Yale University medical anthropologist and a specialist on assisted reproduction in the region.”

  42. Ed

    Ghostwhovotes:

    #ReachTEL Poll 2 Party Preferred: L/NP 47 (-1) ALP 53 (+1) #auspol

    All that pandering to progressives.
    Caving on the war memorial;
    Appointing Natasha Stott-Despoja;
    all the bipartisan photo ops with Shorten…
    all the slow, excrutiating interviews where you tried not to say anything that progressives would hate.

    Where has it gotten you, Tony?

  43. C.L.

    Man who brought you ‘Schindler’s List’ comments on Obama administration’s policy of indicting and arresting disloyal artists and film-makers:

    ‘I Never Feared My Govt Until Now’.

  44. Gab

    New open forum thread, peoples. Get yer act together.

  45. srr

    Mick, my preference for PM is one who Abbott threw to the bitches before the election.

    It seems his name must never be spoken or the Wycheproofian melts …or something…whatever, it makes Abbott all mean, angry, spitty face, and scares his sickly sweet fairy flossy groupies.

  46. C.L.

    Judges, lawyers, experts: country and regional victims of drunken violence not important.

    Guess why:

    JAILS across NSW are likely to be overflowing with Aboriginal prisoners as an unintended consequence of minimum mandatory sentencing laws proposed by Premier Barry O’Farrell to curb alcohol-fuelled violence in Sydney’s CBD.

    Every year more than 3000 Aboriginal men, most affected by alcohol at the time of their offence, are found guilty of assault in NSW courts. But only 740 receive jail sentences while the rest are given bonds, fines or other non-custodial penalties.

    Under Mr O’Farrell’s new regime of mandatory sentences for violence involving alcohol or drugs, many more would suddenly face at least a minimum of two years in jail. About half of all assault charges will be subject to mandatory minimum sentences.

    In an effort to crack down on “one-punch” assaults in Sydney’s entertainment precinct that have left victims dead or brain damaged, Mr O’Farrell said last week his government was willing to do “whatever it takes”, including the construction of additional prisons.

    But judges, lawyers and case workers experienced with violence in indigenous communities say the impact of Mr O’Farrell’s proposed legislation will reach beyond the problem of inner-city street violence…

    John McKenzie, chief legal officer of the NSW Aboriginal Legal Aid Service, said Aboriginal people were already over-represented in NSW jails, accounting for 2 per cent of the state’s population but 23 per cent of all prison inmates in the state.

    “My biggest concern about Mr O’Farrell’s measures is at the lower end of the scale of assaults if they are cases involving alcohol that attract mandatory minimum sentences and extended maximums,” Mr McKenzie said.

    The impact on the Aboriginal community would be vast – we are talking hundreds or even 1000 to 2000 additional people convicted of assaults getting locked up for two years.”

  47. Senile Old Guy

    I supported Abbott even when others here were saying the Liberals should change to Turncoat. I have lost faith in the Tony Abbott who wanted to govern for all Australians. That seems not to have been good enough for him. He now wants to racially taint the Constitution…

    Exactly. Changes to Our Constitution cannot be “administrative”. If the changes are trivial, there is no need to make them. If not…

    So far, the only Minister who has followed through after the election on policy announced before the election is Morrison. TA initially supported changing the Constitution to recognise local government and is now arguing for other changes.

1 3 4 5

Comments are closed.