A joke, right?

This was picked up from Tim Blair but what gets to me is that since this looks like a joke, and no one even at the ABC would ever put up such a request so it must be a joke, I still think, even then, who knows?

abc - we need your help

But it is a clever parody since the butter-wouldn’t-melt-in-my-mouth tone is so perfectly done, and the disclaimer, that of course it isn’t true and my boss doesn’t think it’s true, but come and talk to us anyway and we can sort this out.

Because if this ad were not a joke and were the real thing, it would mean there’s a cancer at the ABC that needs urgent and immediate treatment before it spreads.

This entry was posted in Media. Bookmark the permalink.

180 Responses to A joke, right?

  1. Paul

    The sheer cheek suggests to me its all true.

  2. “Why be afraid of talking to the ABC? Unless of course, you have something to hide.”

    It’s so like that bit in every lone-fugitive movie when the (innocent-acting, but actually crooked) person in charge asks the fugitive to come in, so that they can tell their side of the story and we can sort this all out.

    Of course, we know the person in charge is going to plug them as soon as they turn up.

    I have no reason to suspect that this is any different.

  3. Because if this ad were not a joke and were the real thing, it would mean there’s a cancer at the ABC that needs urgent and immediate treatment before it spreads.

    Absolute rubbish.
    If it is for real, it looks like the “cancer” is seeking the truth.
    You weren’t there – you wouldn’t know what happened.
    I wasn’t there – I don’t know what happened.
    The Coalition has form for monstering the ADF to massage the narrative.
    I would like to talk to the matelots present.

  4. Mollusc

    Shouldn’t they have asked this before they published accusations from one side?

  5. mmxx

    If this is for real, it signals that the ABC, courtesy of its one-eyed “Jakarta guy”, is adrift in stormy seas whipped up by the Australian public revulsion over its sliming of our Navy.

    Just keep sucking up to Indonesia and the corrupt people smuggling racketeers in southern Java, ABC. It’s apparent that they’re more your choice in standard-bearers now anyway.

    The self-respecting crew members of the ships mentioned in this bizarre notice would already have decided to not touch the ABC with a proverbial 40 foot barge-pole.

  6. A Lurker

    This is an extract from the following ABC news article dated 21st August 2013

    The National Reporting Team was one of a series of new ABC initiatives that received additional funding from the Government. Others included ABC Fact Check, new metropolitan bureaus in Ipswich, Geelong and Parramatta, and additional cameras and live linking in 19 different regions across Australia.

    The full 24-member National Reporting Team includes 15 existing ABC employees and 9 new staff hired externally.

    There are 12 men and 12 women in the team. Two of the new staff are Indigenous.

    .
    .
    .

    Researchers: Alison Branley (from Newcastle Herald) …

    If that request is not legit, then I would assume Alison Branley has grounds for legal action against whoever used her name without permission.

  7. Bear Necessities

    It reads like something the Gestapo would be proud of.

  8. Turtle of WA

    There is a ‘cancer at the ABC that needs urgent and immediate treatment before it spreads’ regardless of the authenticity of the letter.

  9. Well, it’s a bait.

    On the one hand, they can claim, “we’ve tried, but cannot get anyone on the Navy side to speak on record”.

    On the other hand, they can make up Navy quotes with no names, to show how the “compassionate Navy is forced by the government to do evil”.

  10. manalive

    You weren’t there – you wouldn’t know what happened …

    Q. Where’s there?
    A. There is no there if nothing happened.

  11. The self-respecting crew members of the ships mentioned in this bizarre notice would already have decided to not touch the ABC with a proverbial 40 foot barge-pole.

    That’s one possible explanation.
    Another is that telling the truth may not be a good career move.
    You would have no idea which is reality.

    Few have the courage of a Mike Scrafton.

  12. steve

    1735099
    #1169768, posted on January 28, 2014 at 3:47 pm

    ….so explain this to me, if they wanted to investigate (and I have no trouble with them investigating) why did they attack the armed forces for burning asylum seekers hands and publish BEFORE they investigated? It just doesn’t make sense…………unless they are just trying to bury the knife further using some poor naive sailor boy who thinks he is doing a good deed.

  13. Leo G

    No more a joke than this:

    Asylum seekers treated for alleged burns inflicted by Navy – ABC
    http://www.abc.net.au/news/…/asylum-seekers-treated-for-alleged-burns…/52120... (removed 4 days ago)
    6 days ago – Asylum seekers in Indonesia have accused the Navy of inflicting burns on them while their boat was being towed back to Indonesia.

    The ABC asserted that the torture injuries were inflicted by the Navy but that they were only alleged to be burns.

  14. Bear Necessities

    That’s one possible explanation.
    Another is that telling the truth may not be a good career move.
    You would have no idea which is reality.

    Few have the courage of a Mike Scrafton.

    Tut, Tut. Presumed innocent not presumed guilty numbers. Stop digging!

  15. Ros

    This advert is also on The Clowns of The Abbotocalypse and Tony Abbott & The Coalition Government – Exposed. which is “This page is PROUDLY a LABOR support page and has been created as a SHARE PAGE for Info graphs, FACTUAL memes which may contain satire, videos and articles targeting Tony Abbott and the LNP.”

    So refugee rights action and the above 2 facebook pages. Are any of these appropriate vehicles for the ABC to use to advertise for navy personnel, or implicit in the message any one who knows a navy person and wants to tell tales behgind thier back, to talk to the ABC. Yet the lady is apparently a real person. If she hasn’t been posting at these sites she has some lousy mates.

  16. Lysander

    couldn’t the ABC just hitch a ride with Ch7?

  17. rickw

    The ABC IS a cancer: it feeds off it’s host, the Australian Taxpayer, and in return it seems to be quite detrimental.

    Why does a free and democratic country need not one, but two, State run media organisations??

  18. braddles

    What they are fishing for is some disgruntled or career-frustrated ‘Deep Throat’ who will pass on any internal rumour or gossip as fact, to hurt those they resent. There is no lack of disgruntlement or career frustration in the Navy, or so I have been told.

  19. Ros

    the “Tony Abbott & The Coalition Government – Exposed.” admin are

    * Wixy Leaks.
    * Cafe Whispers.
    * The Aimn (Australian Independent Media Network.
    * Independent Political Bloggers.

    and they say
    “This Page does not tolerate trolling by Liberal/conservative supporters if your post/comment is not supported by facts you will be banned and deleted.

    PLEASE SHARE OUR MEMES AND ADD YOUR FRIENDS !

    Encourage others to seek an ‘Abbott Free World’”

    The AIMN is about

    “We all know just how manipulative, dishonest, sensationalist, gutless, unfair and unbalanced is the media in this country. If, like me, you believe they need to be held accountable for the gross display of injustice they push down the throats of the Australian public then this is the thread in which to voice your opinion”

    Hypocrites ther lot of them.

  20. Riverina Matt

    Wouldn’t the RAN have some sort of standing orders regarding comments to the media? That would make this one arm of the Australian government inducing a serving member of the ADF to breach standing orders. Is that in any way ethical?

    It is one thing to report on something that a serving member has told (leaked) to you, but to encourage leaks and undermine ADF discipline? Another example of the ABC actively working to weaken the ADF and Australia.

  21. Baldrick

    … there’s a cancer at the ABC that needs urgent and immediate treatment before it spreads.

    I’m sorry to say but it’s terminal. There’s no hope in just cutting it out. It needs to be euthanised now before more money is wasted. It had a good life but now in its prime it contracted Alzheimer’s and lost the plot big-time. You can sit back and watch the thing deteriorate further or be kind and chop it’s f*#ken head off!

  22. Cold-Hands

    She was recruited as a “researcher” from the Newcastle Herald. Looking at her work there, I find myself less than impressed with her general knowledge and researching ability- it sounds like referencing wikipedia is the summit of her skills:

    The term Novocastrian. Who made this up I don’t know, but when I first heard it I thought people were talking about a whole city of people aged in their 90s. Not even Wikipedia can explain it.

    Still, if this email is kosher, it means that she is branching out beyond wikipedia, which should be encouraged. Just a shame that the ABC didn’t do the leg work before rushing into print with its character assassination.

  23. gnome

    I can’t see the problem.

    What would you do if you were in her position? Whatever comes out is likely to add to the body of knowledge on this matter, one way or the other. Journalists need contacts. Why would anyone have a problem with that?

  24. egg_

    FACT CHECK:
    ABC: Is our aft on fire?
    World: Affirmative.

  25. Louis Hissink

    Numbers, the reaction I get from my contact in the RAN, is that they would be quite interested in seeing how many of the ABC they could keelhaul using HMAS Choules, for example.

  26. Bruce of Newcastle

    no one even at the ABC would ever put up such a request so it must be a joke, I still think

    There’s another copy of this request at the “Tony Abbott & The Coalition Government – Exposed” which is a Labor linked Facebook page.

    If it is fake, which seems unlikely to me given the Facebook page, then she would be able to sue for damages. They would have had to have found her phone number, email address AND mobile number, which I’ve cross checked and have found are hers.

    She has also posted such requests for information and contacts on Facebook before. And on Twitter.

    Looks awfully like her.

  27. johanna

    The term Novocastrian. Who made this up I don’t know, but when I first heard it I thought people were talking about a whole city of people aged in their 90s. Not even Wikipedia can explain it.
    —————————————
    What a dope. It’s Latin for denizen of Newcastle (novo castrum), and originated in the UK, where monks used it in relation to people from the original Newcastle.

    Today’s “journalists” are ill-educated buffoons who regard Wikipedia as the fount of all knowledge. Doing actual research is a concept they are utterly unfamiliar with.

  28. Ros

    The National Reporting Team formed middle of last year, “ABC News is shaping a new, dynamic national reporting team. We want to recruit a number of experienced journalists to join a group of outstanding national reporters already in place. Together these reporters and producers will work across radio, TV and digital services, in news and current affairs. Their brief will be original journalism, breaking stories and making a difference. ”

    The editor is Editor: Jo Puccini (from ABC 7.30). Defence & Nat Sec is Michael Brissenden. If this is tue it would seem likely that Brissenden tasked her to do this.

    This has to be a fake and the facebook pages that have left it up just lazy and silly. If true it is bizarre. To place the ad on facebook with groups who wish the navy only harm is unspeakably contemptuous of our armed forces.

    If it is not true the ABC needs to respond immediately. If it is true they need to apologise immediately to the navy. I am going to complain if I can work out how. Then these pious lying facebook groups should be asked to explain also.

    Would the navy follow tim and catallaxy. that is would they know about this advert?

    Crowdsourcing a magic emergent tool of the online world. Well done again you wonderful crowd.

  29. Bruce of Newcastle

    have found are hers

    Sorry, should have said “appear to be hers” since they come up only in those FB and Twitter requests.

  30. Des Deskperson

    ‘Few have the courage of a Mike Scrafton’

    I worked with him in Defence in the nineties, an ambitious apparachik who didn’t in those days seem to have many scruples about power and getting on.

    Courage?? He waited nearly three years, and until he had a safe job in the Victorian public service before he ‘blew the whistle’, possibly because, having been ‘tainted’ by working in Howards office, he wanted to prove his lefty credentials to a ‘progressive’ government as well as get more dinner party invites.

    Later he landed a top job in the NOUS think tank, an organisation which, if not actually affiliated with the ALP, always seemed to get a lot of work when Labor was in power – it ran Rudd’s 20/20 summit in 2008.

    He was also disciplined for porn surfing at work while he was an Assistant Secretary – unbelievable that someone at that level would be so crass – but it didn’t affect his career.

  31. Walter Plinge

    I can’t see the problem.

    What would you do if you were in her position? Whatever comes out is likely to add to the body of knowledge on this matter, one way or the other. Journalists need contacts.

    The problem is that the ABC has few contacts not of the green/left persuasion. When it needs accurate and balanced input it has little idea where to turn. And when it does find a non-left person willing to talk that person is invariably ridiculed and verballed. Result: the ABC is left talking to itself.

    Here we have a junior reporter (I assume she’s junior) who friends are all fellow travellers. Her entire world, socially and professionally, comprises like-minded inner-city green types.

  32. calli

    When it needs accurate and balanced input it has little idea where to turn

    You have nailed the ABC’s blind spot perfectly, Walter.

  33. Louis Hissink

    Walter,

    Which is precisely what Bernie Goldberg wrote in his two books on the US liberal media, Bias, and Arrogance. The lefty media only socialise among themselves and never encounter other views in their social milieu. Which is why there is so deep a cognitive dissonance with them.

  34. Snoopy

    Defence & Nat Sec is Michael Brissenden. If this is tue it would seem likely that Brissenden tasked her to do this.

    Any navy bod considering taking up this offer would do well to remember that Brissenden is happy to break any confidence without feeling any shame.

  35. Kaboom

    Fer Chrissakes, Cats, don’t feed Jellybean Bob.

    Watch the sad prick wither and die – that’s far more enjoyable than giving the thief more oxygen…

  36. Tom

    What this tells us is that, having acted as a megaphone for the country shopper grievance industry since 2007 and the Indonesian government since September 7 last year, the ABC’s new “national reporting team” doesn’t have a single reliable, trustable source inside Operation Sovereign Borders or the RAN; and so clueless is this crack new team that it went to the country shopper grievance industry’s webpage to see if anyone there knew of anyone in the RAN who could corroborate the country shoppers’ story of having been tortured by the RAN — that is, a rat in the ranks prepared to tip a bucket on OSB and the RAN.

    This is not journalism. This is political advocacy that has succeeded only in establishing that the ABC regards itself as an enemy of the Australian armed services. No-one in the RAN will touch them with a barge pole.

    The ABC can’t be reformed.

  37. james

    Speaking of scumbag traitors in the RAN someone really needs to track down former Capt Ingrams.

  38. JC

    Am I missing something as I don’t find anything really wrong with the email other than the fact that the boss ran with the story disbelieving it.

    Brissendan is a real piece of leftwing work. Anything he touches would turn to shit.

  39. I worked with him in Defence in the nineties, an ambitious apparachik who didn’t in those days seem to have many scruples about power and getting on.

    No amount of smearing of Scrafton makes any difference to the fact that a Howard government minister was proved to be lying about this affair to demonize asylum seekers.
    It is entirely feasible that that is happening again.
    We simply don’t know the truth.

  40. A Lurker

    Am I missing something as I don’t find anything really wrong with the email other than the fact that the boss ran with the story disbelieving it.

    This is how I understand it – that allegedly Ms Alison Branley of the AustralianBolshevikCollective has gone to allied far-Left anti-Coalition Facebook groups to try and coax out a Navy rodent who can rat on his or her mates by off the record ‘collaborating’ the fiction that the ABC ran with in the first place.

    If the ABC wanted actual facts, then they should be going straight to the chain of command and getting statements on the record.

  41. Fisky

    No amount of smearing of Scrafton makes any difference to the fact that a Howard government minister was proved to be lying about this affair to demonize asylum seekers.

    No, there was no evidence of lying at all. And besides, we know that illegal immigrants regularly scuttle their boats, taking children down with them, so even if Children Overboard was specifically untrue, it spoke of a wider truth where the boaties really do try to blackmail Australia by putting their children at risk. So it’s holistically true, even if it isn’t a specific fact that children were thrown overboard in that instance.

  42. Fisky

    The real lying was not from Howard, who I genuinely believe was unable to attend to his handphone in those vital last days of the 2001 campaign (and the voters were certainly satisfied enough to re-elect him with a wider majority in 2004), but from the Left. The Left have lied constantly about illegal immigration, and it’s no wonder they have made no inroads into voters’ attitudes. Nobody listens to the Left, everyone listens to Howard/Abbott, and that’s why they have triumphed in bringing illegal boat arrivals to a halt.

  43. Steve of Glasshouse

    Reminds me of a certain dinner menu..

  44. Steve of Glasshouse

    Numbers We simply don’t know the truth.

    It’s on the ABC, thus it is true.

  45. JaneS

    There is nothing wrong with the email, but there’s a Pavlov’s Dog thing going on here.

    The ABC has proven that it is prepared to defame and smear the RAN. Now – NOW – they want to find out more? They are playing cute with wanting to know the twuth (sic)? Alison just wants to get to the bottom of things so she can right the wrongs?

    Pulease. A dog who gets kicked enough knows to stop going near the person hurting him. The RAN members would be advised to do the same.

    As for their ABC, they need to stop giving these reconnaissance jobs to amateurs like Alison. She’s no bueno at this.

  46. Geriatric Mayfly

    Another thing to consider in all of this is, that the ABC is never wrong. Other organisations are frequently deemed to be in error, and are given a good whipping by Media Watch for their sins. But never the ABC. Apologies for blatant misreporting are rare, are uttered in one breath or tucked away where the light does not shine. Offended parties are neither called to redress their grievance, nor given the same time as was allotted to the original piece of bastardry. I guess when they get away with it yet again, there is triumphalism all ’round amongst the ABC collective.

  47. Tom

    I don’t find anything really wrong with the email

    It’s not rocket surgery. If the new ABC national reporting team , set up in August, was a professional operation, the first thing it would have done would be to assign two or three reporters to specialise in covering the country shopper issue as one of the biggest rolling stories of the past decade. That would include:
    1. Establishing personal relationships in Operation Sovereign Borders and the Navy in Canberra, Darwin and Christmas Island, as well as establishing contacts in Indonesia as a backup to ABC Indonesia correspondent George Roberts.
    2. Identify the most trustworthy sources in the refugee grievance industry who could be relied upon to provide information, as opposed to spin.
    3. Priority given to establishing lines of communication with the top levels of the Abbott administration.

    None of this has even been attempted as the ABC regards itself as a representative of one of the “sides” in the story and every word of the output of ABC News is designed primarily to reinforce that advocacy role, NOT primarily to inform the public — that is, to act in the public interest.

  48. hzhousewife

    Here we have a junior reporter (I assume she’s junior) who friends are all fellow travellers. Her entire world, socially and professionally, comprises like-minded inner-city green types.

    I am curious to know which eminent School of Journalism graduated her. They must be so proud of themselves.

  49. Louis Hissink

    And the RAN now videotapes all operations of this type of situation just to ensure the facts are recorded, so I hear.

  50. srr

    Tom, could you please work this into an expanded guest post, so we can all easily twitter, and like, and link , and share it around the WWW? Please.

    What this tells us is that, having acted as a megaphone for the country shopper grievance industry since 2007 and the Indonesian government since September 7 last year, the ABC’s new “national reporting team” doesn’t have a single reliable, trustable source inside Operation Sovereign Borders or the RAN; and so clueless is this crack new team that it went to the country shopper grievance industry’s webpage to see if anyone there knew of anyone in the RAN who could corroborate the country shoppers’ story of having been tortured by the RAN — that is, a rat in the ranks prepared to tip a bucket on OSB and the RAN.

    This is not journalism. This is political advocacy that has succeeded only in establishing that the ABC regards itself as an enemy of the Australian armed services. No-one in the RAN will touch them with a barge pole.

    The ABC can’t be reformed.

  51. srr

    Reminds me of a certain dinner menu..

    …and what Brough, Cosgrove and Howard were doing on ANZAC Day ten years ago -

    http://www.defence.gov.au/anzacday2004/images/gallery/260404.cfm

  52. Des Deskperson

    ‘No amount of smearing of Scrafton …’

    Prove they’re smears!

  53. Bruce of Newcastle

    I am curious to know which eminent School of Journalism graduated her.

    She’s one of ours. Newcastle Uni, although I don’t know whether she graduated. Newcastle Uni has a BComm with journalism major.

    Always sad to see a local kid fall in with the dark side.

  54. Encourage others to seek an ‘Abbott Free World’”

    Fine. Abbott is free to rule the world.

  55. And Another Thing

    Reference to “our Jakarta guy” doesn’t ring true. Could be pals of the ABC sniffing around for some info to help the smugglers. Just a thought – wouldn’t a real reporter try to phone one of the ships? Oh yeah, this is the ABC and I guess they haven’t found anything in the press release tray.

  56. srr

    How many of the voters in the last Federal election, were ONLY, 7,8,9 years old when THIS WAS NEWS 10 years ago?


    BRISBANE’S FINEST RETURN FROM MISSION IN EAST TIMOR.

    http://www.defence.gov.au/minister/34tpl.cfm?CurrentId=3872

  57. Ubique

    She’s one of ours. Newcastle Uni, although I don’t know whether she graduated. Newcastle Uni has a BComm with journalism major.

    BComm – to get into the ABC that would need to be a Bachelor of Communism. They certainly wouldn’t want any whiff of commerce about the place.

  58. So it’s holistically true, even if it isn’t a specific fact that children were thrown overboard in that instance.

    Only on the Cat can someone post about degrees and shades of truth, and expect to be taken seriously.
    They lied – they are quite capable of lying again if it suits their political strategy.

  59. ‘No amount of smearing of Scrafton …’

    Prove they’re smears!

    Hilarious.
    The whole point of a smear is that proof is irrelevant.

  60. rafiki

    A journo seeking a backgrounder is hardly unusual. Alison’s most serious error – and for an aspiring journo it is serious – is that she is naive. She has alerted the RAN to what she is up to. She might also be proposing to commit an offence if the sailors are prohibited from backgrounding journos. If the ‘boss’ approved the invitation, then he/she is naive and stupid too.
    It’s not clear to me whether the boss approved of the airing of the allegation by the ABC’s Jakarta person that the sailors burnt the hands of the illegal entrants.
    Of course, a sailor would would be pretty stupid to talk to her. Confidences of this kind are to always respected.

  61. Snoopy

    I’ve never quite understood the nuance of the children overboard ‘scandal’. Ok, the kids weren’t tossed overboard, instead the boat was deliberately scuttled from underneath them. They still ended up in the water.

  62. rafiki

    Christ! “are not always respected”. (As, when I was young, I found out to my cost.)

  63. Fisky

    Only on the Cat can someone post about degrees and shades of truth, and expect to be taken seriously.
    They lied – they are quite capable of lying again if it suits their political strategy.

    It is remarkable that someone who has been wrong about illegal immigration right down to the last tittle is complaining about ‘falsehoods’ now!

    I mean, it’s just too much, it really is.

  64. Louis Hissink

    The children were thrown overboard a couple of minutes after, apparently. Depends on how nuanced you want to be chronologically, but lefties can’t recognise facts so there’s no point in labouring over it.

  65. Snoopy

    Good point rafiki. Is Branley’s invitation an attempt to commit conspiracy?

  66. johanna

    Surely the salient point is that it was posted in a place dedicated to undermining the Abbott government? There are plenty of Service-oriented sites which are read by a lot more navy personnel, but that’s not where she went.

    She was looking for someone to provide unattributed smears to prop up the “story”, or other dirt on the Navy so they could add to the narrative.

  67. MemoryVault

    Rafiki,

    There is nothing naive about this. It is an attempt to get some young RAN types in front of an ABC camera to answer some questions. The answers don’t matter. Neither do the questions, only the footage is important, which is shot three times. Interviewer, interviewee, and noddy shots. The REAL work is done in the editing room after the RAN types have left.

    ANY suitable “answer” can then be grafted onto ANY post-recorded question. Hence a light-hearted exchange about whether the sailors ever end up brawling amongst themselves on shore leave, and whether anybody ever gets hurt, can end up like this by the time it goes to air:

    QUESTION: – “Do you guys ever beat up asylum seekers and the Indonesian crews?”
    RAN: – “Oh yeah – it happens all the time.”
    QUESTION: – “Anybody ever get hurt?”
    RAN: – “It can get a bit vicious – especially if we’ve been at sea a while and need to blow off steam.”

    Anybody who thinks this ssort of thing doesn’t, and can’t happen, here is a little story: In 1986 I did what was billed as a nationwide interview with Terry Willessee, live from the studios of Channel 10 in Sydney. Caused me quite a bit of grief.

    Especially given that, at the time I had never met Terry Willessee, had never been to the Channel 10 studios in Sydney, and was, at the time, camped with my wife and toddler son near Petersborough in the middle of South Australia.

  68. egg_

    Reference to “our Jakarta guy” doesn’t ring true.

    The undercover operative ‘Man from UNCLE AUNTY’?

  69. Large Brass Ears

    When the hot hands thing started up, Numbers was quick off the mark to smear the sailors with a reference to their reported behaviour being similar to some AB who allegedly nicked something off him on the way to Vietnam. FMD.

  70. Fisky

    Did Numbers really rat on the diggers? What a despicable Communist turncoat he is!

  71. Pedro the Ignorant

    I know a former Australian Army officer who was verballed by a Canberra Defence reporter, Peter Young, back in the late 80′s when speaking “off the record” about a new piece of military hardware.

    The said officer’s career came to a grinding halt the day after Young’s article was published.

    Anyone in the military who is not in PR business and speaks to reporters about official matters is not only in breach of military law, but risks having their career rapidly terminated.

  72. Ivan Denisovich

    Vice-Admiral Shackleton also confirmed evidence he gave to a Senate Foreign Affairs and Defence on February 20.

    At that time, he described what happened to another boat containing asylum seekers from Indonesia that had entered Australian waters and was at anchor in the lagoon on Ashmore Reef on October 20, two weeks after the “people overboard” incident took place.

    He said, “During the incident … about 15 people from the vessel jumped into the water, and one woman amongst several women held a young child over the side by its wrists, and the child was dropped into the water. The child was recovered by one of the people in the water who swam to the child and raised it from the water. They were subsequently brought out of the water back onto the boat.”

    He also confirmed that shortly after the Navy had taken over responsibility for policing Australia’s maritime boarders in August 2001, “the Navy discovered quite soon that the use of children for the purpose of moral blackmail by asylum seekers – either by threatening to throw them into the water or by, as in the case of the the event on 24 October, throwing them into the water, or by, as in the case of SEIV10 [another vessel carrying suspected illegal entrants], deliberately sinking the vessel and carrying children into the water from the sunk vessel” was a tactic used by boat people to get into Australia.

    It is clear from the evidence that desperate boat people, no doubt coached by the people smugglers whom they had paid to provide passage to Australia, endangered their own lives and those of their children to force Australia to accept them.

    It also emerged, from video evidence of the “children overboard” incident, that a little girl was dangled from the side of the boat, and a threat was made to drop the child into the water, although there was no evidence that this threat was carried out.

    Vice-Admiral Shackleton also confirmed that in the case of a number of other boats carrying asylum seekers into Australian waters last year, the boats’ engines were deliberately sabotaged, the boats were holed to cause them to sink, water pumps were sabotaged and fires were lit to sink the boats.

    Media coverage of the “people overboard” affair last year supported Labor Party claims that the Defence Minister deliberately misled the Australian people about the incident, illegitimately helping the government win the last Federal Election.

    One Senator said the incident “has become currency for journalists because of statements that were made in relation to children being thrown overboard, yet we have numerous incidents … of children being either thrown overboard or threatened to be thrown overboard. But I have seen no or minimal reporting of any of those incidents in the Australian media in all of that three month period” from September to November last year.

    While the photographs incorrectly were captioned as children who had been thrown overboard, they actually showed children who were in the water due to the deliberate sinking of their boat.

    The evidence indicates that some asylum seekers, including those on the Tampa, which had rescued them from a sinking boat in the Timor Sea in August, but had then been forced to carry the carry them to Christmas Island, engaged in reckless criminal conduct to force their way into Australia.

    http://www.newsweekly.com.au/article.php?id=762

  73. Mk50 of Brisbane, Henchman to the VRWC

    Matt:

    Wouldn’t the RAN have some sort of standing orders regarding comments to the media?

    Yes, and it is against orders.

    That would make this one arm of the Australian government inducing a serving member of the ADF to breach standing orders.

    Correct.

    Is that in any way ethical?

    The ABC? Ethical?? The bastards don’t even know how to spell it.

  74. Fisky

    Simply extraordinary that the Left are still telling fibs about Children Overboard.

  75. Armadillo

    Bolt Update

    A former senior army officer was so astonished by this email from the ABC that he wrote back to ask if it was genuine..
    And, yes, indeed. A week after claiming it had “footage [which] appears to back asylum seekers’ claims of mistreatment by the Australian Navy” the ABC is now checking whether that improbable claim is actually true. What’s more, it now claims that it never really believed the claims it trumpeted so loudly, damaging the Abbott Government and the navy and prompting Indonesia to accuse Australia of a “crime”.

    Amazing stuff:

  76. Leo G

    “… the ABC is left talking to itself.” – Walter Plinge

    An un intended truism- but so true. Almost definitive.

  77. Snoopy

    Surely it’s more than ‘unethical’? I would think it’s illegal.\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\

    Surely it’s more than just ‘unethical’?

  78. Bruce of Newcastle

    Simply extraordinary that the Left are still telling fibs about Children Overboard.

    That is why the ABC ran dead on the lifeboat incident. In the Saga of Children Overboard™ the illegals sank their own boat and ended up in the water. The RAN picked them up and had to take them the Chrissie.

    The recent case the illegals sank their own boat. The Navy then picked them up, gave them another one and sent them back to Indonesia.

    Not the type of story the ABC likes to report so somehow they forgot to mention it.

    Numbers may never learn but the RAN does.

  79. Bruce of Newcastle

    Oh, ok, I’m wrong, they did mention it. Outraged they were. For a very short time…then they deep sixed it.

    We’re heard nothing from the ABC on this story ever since, whereas the Saga of Children Overboard™ went on and on and on.

  80. Fisky

    The ABC is clearly a lying organization that prints and broadcasts lies. It must be shut down and all journalists jailed.

  81. I am the Walrus, koo koo k'choo

    Memory Vault, Tom, Ivan Denisovich – thankyou.

    I don’t think we need to worry about opposition to reforming the ABC. It is trashing its reputation so badly that within six months the broad mass of the population will be indifferent to its fate, with a large group of people wanting something, anything done to restore its quality and integrity.

    ABC – go right ahead, don’t change a thing! We’ll see you in six months!

  82. Aussieute

    Don’t worry the ABC is out there desperately trying.
    A mates son is out there on duty and they are desperately baiting for responses This mob need to be cut to the bone if not deleted totally

  83. Mr Rusty

    The RAN should respond by sending a bunch of their finest down Harris Street for a “friendly talk” with the ABC and their journos.

    Would love to see Tony Jones wearing his face on the back of his head.

  84. Turtle of WA

    Listening to Andrew Bolt on 2GB. According to Bolt, it’s been confirmed by someone he knows.

  85. kelly liddle

    I don’t see what the issue is. Is there a problem if a news organisation asks for confirmation or denial? Should they just make up stories without any corroboration. There are legitimate reasons to question the role of the ABC and even if it should exist in its current form but this is verging on paranoia.

  86. the sting

    The ABC is a cancer on the Australian taxpayer.

  87. Tom

    How will Paul Barry and Media Watch report on the ABC’s attempt to exonerate itself from claims that it is unable to objectively report on the border protection issue? Bolt asks on 2GB.

    Australia is now like the Soviet pre-1989: the locals have to read the official media as propaganda organs of the Kremlin.

    Kelly L, get a dead dog up ya, you clueless clown. Are you still living in ladyboyland?

  88. Fisky

    Should they just make up stories without any corroboration.

    No they shouldn’t. Which is what they did – published a story without corroboration. Getting it now?

  89. kelly liddle

    Tom

    The only thing I have ever had published was about the daily life of someone in the military in the letters to the editor section. It is interesting to note that another organisation was not interested in blatent corruption (even if low level) in the military. Had I done the second thing I would want a news organisation that I could trust.

  90. kelly liddle

    Are you still living in ladyboyland?

    Yes The Valley (Fortitude Valley) is my home.

  91. Brian of Moorabbin

    It is entirely feasible that that is happening again.
    We simply don’t know the truth.

    Remember when SfB and mOnty were parroting this line while Craig Thomson was telling us that Tony Abbott had hired people to hide in his closets and steal his credit cards, drivers licence, mobile phone, etc so as to make him (Honest Craig) look bad?

    Yeah Numbers’ comment reminded me of those times too.

  92. kelly liddle

    No they shouldn’t. Which is what they did – published a story without corroboration.

    On my ABC24 they were called allegations, Fisky did some news organisation report it as fact to you?

  93. Fisky

    On my ABC24 they were called allegations, Fisky did some news organisation report it as fact to you?

    No, but they should not have even raised the allegations unless they had reasonable evidence of their veracity. Which they never actually acquired.

    I mean, just imagine that story – “Allegations have been raised that Kelly Liddle is a baby seal murderer (we haven’t got evidence for this yet, but trust us, allegations have been made).”

    That is not “news”, it’s propaganda.

  94. kelly liddle

    Regarding military reporting the ABC can be quite misleading. They accepted the words of some military propaganda person with regard to training. This happened just before I joined up. It scared me into a lot of exercise which was probably a good thing but despite that I do not think that the military should lie and the ABC support those lies.

  95. kelly liddle

    I would have no problems killing baby seals as long as environmental norms are respected except they are normally found in cold places.

  96. rafiki

    Had to break off for dinner.
    Snoopy: it might be seen as an attempt to get ‘classified’ information from an RAN person. (I am supposing that it is an offence, by both the sailor and the journo, for the former to disclose information about operations to a non-RAN person.) But what she has done might not be enough to be seen as an ‘attempt’. I have not looked at this law for quite some time, but I recall that ultimate success has to be realistic for a prepatory step to be classified as an ‘attempt’ for the criminal law.
    Memory Vault: By ‘naive’ I mean that it was unrealistic for her to think that a sailor would talk off-the-record to her. Also, I don’t think she was proposing something on camera. I too have has similar experiences to you. When I once complained to a journo’s boss that she had verballed me in a newspaper report, she was quite upset!

  97. john constantine

    the abc managed to start the australia day race riot from lies and gotcha interviews.

    abc fantasy come true would be to organise a border incident with indonesia,even if it were based on lies. anybody that consents to a taped interview with todays abc is signing their own careers death warrent.

  98. Rob

    Had to break off for dinner.

    Was that with Mike Scrafton, if so, how many bottles of wine did you drink while he was on the phone?

  99. kelly liddle

    The RAN should respond by sending a bunch of their finest down Harris Street for a “friendly talk” with the ABC and their journos.

    Maybe we should have a coup d’etat, sounds like an excellent idea to me.

  100. rafiki

    Sorry Rob, I don’t get your point. But does this help?: (1) Alison is naive, did something stupid, and possible criminal; and (2) the ABC is a disgrace and should be severely pruned.

  101. duncanm

    Ok… here’s an alernative scenario.

    Brissenden actually thinks the other arm(s) of the ABC went too far with the story. He has asked his underling to fetch some real evidence (which should have been done prior to publishing anything), and she’s blundered about in a very naive fashion.

  102. Habib

    I’ve referred this missive to the crushers, looks like a prima facie offence under Sec 79 Crimes Act, inducement to commission of an offence under this section. Only Senior Officers and PRELs, duly authorised and briefed, can talk to flacks. Any contact outside this, or coercion for contact, is an offence. All involved need to be carted off to the brig. And numero zero, I know a few pussers off Stuart who’d like to fill you in.

  103. Gab

    This is not a joke, right? This is just SOP for the feckless and deranged at their ABC.

  104. Gab

    Shoot first, ask questions later. Their ABC.

  105. Fisky

    I’ve referred this missive to the crushers, looks like a prima facie offence under Sec 79 Crimes Act, inducement to commission of an offence under this section. Only Senior Officers and PRELs, duly authorised and briefed, can talk to flacks. Any contact outside this, or coercion for contact, is an offence. All involved need to be carted off to the brig. And numero zero, I know a few pussers off Stuart who’d like to fill you in.

    I hope the ABC are imprisoned en masse for this. They must be arrested and jailed for sedition and financially ruined.

  106. cohenite

    What a blight is numbers and his shared attitudes amongst the progressives.

    Not one word about the 100s of boaties drowned at sea following the sugar on the table provided by a Gillard/ Rudd government so incompetent that a new word for incompetence needs to be devised to describe them.

    Go on numbers, say one word about the drowned boaties under the watch of the 2-headed Rudd/Gillard monster.

  107. rafiki

    While your hope is entirely laudable Fisky, I don’t see any evidence of an inducement. No-one from the ABC has yet even identified a sailor.

  108. Rob

    rafiki, comment related to enquiry into a certain maritime incident, where questions were asked about how much wine was drunk at mr scrafton’s dinner and whether that may have affected his memory or his reported information about children overboard. Okay, it was pretty obscure, but the man is a hero according to numbers.

  109. Leigh Lowe

    We simply don’t know the truth.

    Which is precisely why the ABC shouldn’t have reported it as fact, Spud-peeler, you fuckwit.

  110. Gab

    We simply don’t know the truth.

    Yes we do. The truth is the complete opposite to what the ABC reported (sic).

  111. Fisky

    “I have been tasked with finding some navy personnel who might be willing to speak with us in a background capacity – not on the record.”

    This must be a violation of several Federal laws, as well as constituting an act of Treason. The ABC must be purged completely.

  112. Zulu Kilo Two Alpha

    They must be arrested and jailed

    Shot at dawn not an option? Left with the feeling there would be a few Cats who would volunteer for the firing party, and go on to eat a hearty breakfast with every evidence of enjoyment.

  113. Andrew

    Another is that telling the truth may not be a good career move.

    Why would that be, Numbers? Are you suggesting:
    1) that the truth is the RAN did torture welfare seekers (in which case you’re a fucking disgraceful grub – selling out servicemen pushing a lie that not even ELLIS believes), or
    2) that the govt would bully RAN servicemen for saying they DIDNT have a boatee BBQ (in which case you’re merely insane)?

    Which are you?

  114. Habib

    Burgoo and bacon, line up for seconds.

  115. rafiki

    Fisky – I like the notion that ABC management (I think we can leave the hapless Alison out of it) committed an act of Treason. To a man and woman, they should be hung, drawn, and quartered – in a procedure that sees their intestines removed and dangled before their still-seeing eyes, private parts removed (where appropriate) and similarly treated. That should fix them.

  116. MemoryVault

    Fisky, Habib, Rafiki and others

    Who actually believe that Abbott and his harem of eunuchs will will actually DO anything about this –
    I have a song for you:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nU615FaODCg

    These days as far as the prosticians are concerned, media roolz – ok?

  117. Habib

    Government doesn’t need to do diddley, that’s what there’s coxswains and the AFP for. If that email has been sent to any member, the sender has a problem. There’s a mood for retribution in the pus.

  118. rafiki

    That video is enough to send me off the Bedfordshire. ‘Night all.

  119. Myrddin Seren

    The email from the crack ABC investigative team reads like complete amateur hour.

    This is the sort of stuff we used to do in school to get material for projects pre-internet.

    “Hi. I am doing a school project on ( insert product/industry/region ) . Could you please send me some brochures to use in the project.? Thank you> A kid”

    The fact that this ham-fisted attempt at sourcing confidential contacts has supposedly come from a degree qualified journo in an elite ( cough ) area of the national broadcaster suggests some worthwhile Senate committee time could be spent on finding out just what sort of degree recipients we tax payers are funding through Australia’s burgeoning journalism school mills.

  120. incoherent rambler

    We’re heard nothing from the ABC on this story ever since …

    The observed ABC technique is smear and slander and then quietly withdraw, after the damage has been done. Guerilla tactics.
    The ABC is damned more for what they do not report (Gillard, Thompson, etc).
    There is currently only one person that can put a stop to this and my view is that Malcom will not stop the ABC serving his interests.

  121. MemoryVault

    Habib,

    that’s what there’s coxswains and the AFP for.

    Sorry to disillusion you Habib, but the AFP are part of the problem, not the solution.
    Currently they are far too busy hiding another little scandal to get involved in anything as paltry as mere National Security and breaches of the Crimes Act.

    Right now their resources are committed full time to hiding the fact that almost all of the 205 “Australians” currently overseas fighting in Jihad wars, are on some kind of Centrelink Income Support payment, like the Disability Support Pension. And where they have spouses and family in OZ, they are on Supporting Parents Benefit.

    And that’s just the tip of the iceberg.

  122. incoherent rambler

    but the AFP are part of the problem

    Gee, could that be why our security organizations will not share any information with them?
    The union RC will probably expose the extent of the “problem”.

  123. Talleyrand

    They must be arrested and jailed

    Shot at dawn not an option? Left with the feeling there would be a few Cats who would volunteer for the firing party, and go on to eat a hearty breakfast with every evidence of enjoyment.

    No Zulu Kilo Two Alpha, I want to take the option of eating my breakfast amongst a forest of impaled ABC employees, just like Vlad The Impaler . Vlad knew how to treat traitors, and slow impalement for a lingering death was the preferred method, and as a warning to others.

    (For that matter Vlad knew the need to show respect to a host culture and its customs. Muslim Ambassadors refused to remove their head covering Turbans when attending his court. Vlad asked politely why the did not uncover their heads as this was his country’s custom; and was told it was the Muslim way of the Turks. So Vlad had their turbans nailed to the ambassadors’ heads, and then sent back to their home country. Jidhadists, and their supporters should take note)

  124. What they are fishing for is some disgruntled or career-frustrated ‘Deep Throat’ who will pass on any internal rumour or gossip as fact, to hurt those they resent.

    That, or some youngster whose answers they can, as has already been suggested, cleverly dub to any chosen question. Bring your mates along with you, sailor, and make sure they have their phonecams running. Then upload to YouTube the moment it’s over and send that little fucker viral.

    My encounters with contemporary journalists (even one journalism student) suggest that they are never, ever, EVER to be trusted.

  125. Habib

    The AFP aren’t exactly a crack law enforcement organisation, but the ABC’s done a few hatchet jobs on them as well. Don’t get mad, get even.

  126. incoherent rambler

    The AFP aren’t exactly a crack law enforcement organisation,

    Come on, they are the best that money can buy!

  127. MemoryVault

    Come on, they are the best that money can buy!

    Yes, it’s just a pity us taxpayers don’t have any money left to buy them.

  128. incoherent rambler

    The ABC can afford them.

  129. MemoryVault

    The ABC can afford them.

    True, $1.2 billion a year buys an awful lot.
    But the sad truth is they don’t have to.

    There is a little cabal of of about 50 public servants who are now running the country.
    They took over when we went computer in the mid to late 80′s.
    They saw the opportunity, became the management of the computer departments, and in time, controlled the flow of all bureaucratic information. One way or another, they now control the entire public service.
    Now they are unassailable, and as they reach retirement, they are ensuring they are replaced by like-minded individuals.

    These people are not communists, socialists, greenies, environmentalists, neo-Nazis, or Fascists. They simply hate us, and are committed to tearing down the country by whatever means available, as an expression of their hatred and revenge.

    And they are winning.

  130. entropy

    The reason that Turnbull won’t do anything about this is that ABC is serving his interests, at least for the time being.
    He is obviously too stupid to realise that as soon as it might help him achieve his goals, the ABC will promptly turn on him.

  131. Fisky

    The reason that Turnbull won’t do anything about this is that ABC is serving his interests, at least for the time being.

    If Abbott can ride out the next year and get enough expressions of hatred and treason on the record from the ABC, he should re-shuffle his ministry, kick Turnbull over to Education or whatever and replace him with Pyne. Then Abbott would be completely free to smash the ABC to little pieces.

  132. Tom

    Reposting from the OT:

    The rotting corpse of smirking smartarse Jonathan Holmes is wheeled out to accuse Scott Morrison of ordering the RAN to torture country shoppers:

    Like almost everyone else, I find the notion that members of the Australian navy would deliberately inflict agonising pain on helpless civilians very hard indeed to believe. But so is the notion that would-be asylum seekers would inflict this kind of pain on themselves at the behest of scheming people smugglers.

    No doubt there is an explanation for those burns – probably one that the navy could readily give us, if it were allowed to. But there is no way that I can see that the ABC could have ignored the evidence of injury, and the allegations surrounding them.

    Even I can hear that dogwhistle, you treacherous old tax-eater.

  133. Bruce of Newcastle

    But so is the notion that would-be asylum seekers would inflict this kind of pain on themselves

    Miranda Devine neatly destroys that piece of crap:

    And by the time they boarded the boat the engine was already cold, says Australia Defence Association executive director Neil James. The most likely scenario is the asylum seekers tampered with the engine and burned themselves in the process.

    Very hard to torture someone by burning their hands on a cold engine.

  134. jupes

    But so is the notion that would-be asylum seekers would inflict this kind of pain on themselves at the behest of scheming people smugglers.

    Who is it that sews their lips together Jonathon you gormless twit?

  135. Alfonso

    And Their ABC know Tone will do nothing about it that isn’t merely a token gesture……some impotent ABC ombudsman unseen at production level seems likely.
    They know their man.

  136. boy on a bike

    Very hard to torture someone by burning their hands on a cold engine

    Freezer burns?

  137. boy on a bike

    There is an alternative method.

    Bombard the ABC with crap.

    Get every ex-navy sod you know to ring the ABC, ask for whatshername and waste half an hour or an hour of her time rambling on about what things were like in their day. Melting down the switchboard and tying up their time with rubbish is the equivalent of a SLAPP.

    Of course the callers should act like they are still sailing the seas and have something juicy to tell – until the last minute when they inform her that they retired 10 years ago and haven’t sighted the sea since.

  138. Demosthenes

    There is a little cabal of of about 50 public servants who are now running the country. They took over when we went computer in the mid to late 80′s. They saw the opportunity, became the management of the computer departments, and in time, controlled the flow of all bureaucratic information. One way or another, they now control the entire public service.

    That’s an interesting theory, MemoryVault. Technocratic control is the subject of plenty of sociological commentary, but typically in general terms, whereas you’re rather more specific. Also, you appear to be suggesting that it’s not their technocratic position that leads to control, but instead their desire for control that caused them to move into technocratic positions?

    Now they are unassailable, and as they reach retirement, they are ensuring they are replaced by like-minded individuals.

    Do they wait for the right kind of person to enter the department, and then recruit them? Or do they look for like-minded individuals in high school and encourage them to get into computer science degrees so they can inherit the techno-Illuminati position in the Department of Agriculture?

    These people are not communists, socialists, greenies, environmentalists, neo-Nazis, or Fascists. They simply hate us, and are committed to tearing down the country by whatever means available, as an expression of their hatred and revenge.

    Well, they “saw the opportunity” in the 1980s, so presumably had this hatred and desire for revenge before then. What was it about the ’70s that pissed them off so much? Glam rock?

  139. Honesty

    Here is the complaint I sent the ABC with the first reports, prior to this email coming out. The email proves my case. As usually I expect a we did nothing wrong however these are still further actual evidence of their breach of charter.
    Location: NSW
    Response Required: true
    Program: News
    Program Date: 22 January 2014
    ABC Service\Network: ABC1
    ABC Recipient: Audience & Consumer Affairs
    Subject: Illegal Boat Arrivals
    Your Comments:Your reporting through a political lens of the left has reached a height of disgust that even my ALP friends are ashamed of. You hide behind a non-existent veil of “reporting” to push a left view to attack our brave defenders and our current Government that is in breach of your charter and your support of Australia overseas via the Australian Network.

    Please pass on my disgust to Mark Scott and my request for him to resign.

  140. A Lurker

    The ABC seems to be turning itself inside out trying to defend/explain their actions without looking like Commie activists.

    It’s like an adult catching red-handed a small child with their hand still inside the cookie jar, and the child subsequently spinning every type of lie under the sun in order not to face the consequences.

    The CSIRO Excuse: Honestly mum, it was a science experiment to see if my hand could fit inside.

    Craig Thomson Excuse: That hand doesn’t belong to me. It is someone else’s hand.

    The Asylum Seeker Excuse: The jar (controlled by the Pig-Filth Infidel RAN) came up and bit me on the hand.

    The Clinton Excuse: I didn’t have intimate relations with that cookie jar.

    It would be comical if it weren’t so serious.

  141. Anthony S Adams

    Alison Branley’s boss needs a good seeing too with the rough end of a pineapple. It’s a sad end to a young reporters career. She’ll be branded with this yoke for a long long time!

  142. egg_

    The Simpsons Excuse: The cookie jar fell onto my hand.

    Clearly an organisation bereft of leadership, ethics or principles.

  143. Walter Plinge

    Habib: And numero zero, I know a few pussers off Stuart who’d like to fill you in.

    Seguing from this I have a nearly-finished bottle of Pusser’s Rum which my son (LEUT, FBW) gave me for my birthday. Highly recommended.

  144. Stan

    There is a cancer at the ABC and it has already spread throughout the organisation from top to bottom and from from left to hard-left.

  145. Stan

    There is a little cabal of of about 50 public servants who are now running the country.
    They took over when we went computer in the mid to late 80′s.

    I don’t think so. It is simply that the public service, ABC, CSIRO etc and all our institutions (even the Australian War Memorial council for God’s sake) are now filled with labor and green voters. What do we do?

  146. rafiki

    This episode is one more justification for the government to re-visit and cancel the ABC’s contract to run media into Asia. The award of the contract was corrupted by Conway, and now the ABC’s incompetence to perform the services is apparent. As someone here pointed out recently, a loss of $122 million might be enough to put the whole ABC into a downward spiral. Add to this the probable loss of a significant audience once Foxtel gets sole access to new BBC stuff midyear, and a full review of the ABC would be justifiable. Softly, softly will catch and eviscerate this monkey.

  147. Alfonso

    Stan , the Liberals are half Turnbulls / Hunts. There is no hope there.
    The remainder with a singular exception refuse to make the case in direct plain language. Equivocation on everything except illegal border crossers is standard. These clowns are still official believers in CAGW and its “mitigation” for god’s sake.

  148. .

    Looks like there may be some truth to this

    http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/andrewbolt/index.php/heraldsun/comments/abc_now_admits_its_navy_smear_unlikely_to_be_true/

    A link to Bolt, which Armadillo mentioned at 7.06 om.

    Once more:

    A former senior army officer was so astonished by this email from the ABC that he wrote back to ask if it was genuine..

    And, yes, indeed. A week after claiming it had “footage [which] appears to back asylum seekers’ claims of mistreatment by the Australian Navy” the ABC is now checking whether that improbable claim is actually true. What’s more, it now says it never really believed the claims it trumpeted so loudly, damaging the Abbott Government and the navy and prompting Indonesia to accuse Australia of a “crime”.

    Looks like the ABC is imploding.

  149. They simply hate us, and are committed to tearing down the country by whatever means available, as an expression of their hatred and revenge.

    And they are winning.

    No. They’re not waving; they’re drowning. Another six months and their allies in Parliament are fucked, and so are they. And they know it.

  150. Myrddin Seren

    Demosthenes

    What was it about the ’70s that pissed them off so much? Glam rock?

    Whitlam Dismissal – 1975.

    Pretty sure that it has been mentioned at The Cat on several occasions that Get Up’s single biggest support group is 50-something APS employees resident in the ACT and environs, who have never, ever recovered from 11Nov75.

    Okay – MemoryVault’s assertion is a big one. Maybe Des Deskperson might scroll on by and give us an insider’s few of the IT Mandarins if we are lucky.

  151. Gab

    Their ABC is acting very childishly.

  152. MemoryVault

    Demosthenes

    Technocratic control means control of the input and output of information, not the number crunching that happens along the way. In any large modern organisation there is an IT department employing IT-type people. These people care not one whit about the information flowing through, and stored in, their servers. Their sole interest is in keeping all the pretty LEDs flashing at the right time, and in the right order.

    Decisions are made on the data that comes out one end, and how it is interpreted and extrapolated by the person doing the outputting. Precisely what can be interpreted is, in turn, largely influenced by what is input, and how.

    Hence, if the Bureau of Statistics require that the CPI remain static at a time when it is rising alarmingly, the person inputting the data simply substitutes the price of a kilo of mince, where previously the figure was for a kilo of steak, or lamb. The person outputting the data for ministerial consumption knows of, but fails to note the substitution, and the politicians blithely accept the artificially reduced figure as “the gospel truth”. Goes on all the time in a multitude of ways, in all the main departments.

    This does not require any form of “Grand Conspiracy”, only that the players give their allegiance to the department and those controlling it, rather than to some higher ideal of “public service”. I have no idea how they recruit these days, but back in the eighties it was simplicity itself. Every state and federal government department was crawling with male career public servants who had been passed over for promotion in favour 0f some 20-something girl, usually fresh out of uni, and with less than three months experience in the department. It was called “Affirmative Action” Offers were made to these disgruntled people.

    In the department I worked in, the mainframes – somewhere in Canberra – were Fujitsu, and integrated desktop units from Wang were just being rolled out. The offer was a two-level pay rise, plus a year in Japan learning how to make the Wang units input and output data from the mainframes. Then an unchallengeable permanent position in Canberra – with accommodation – safe from the ravages of “Affirmative Action”.

    For a 30-something male public servant with a young family to feed, faced with the very real prospect of never being able to secure a promotion, it was an attractive offer.

    It some ways I regret not having taken it up.

  153. Jannie

    Maybe, just maybe, Abbott is giving the ABC all the rope they need. When they do go for them, they will have plenty of material. Is it time for a Royal Commission into the ABC?

  154. MemoryVault

    Jannie,

    Maybe, just maybe, Abbott is giving the ABC all the rope they need.

    Abbott will not do anything about the ABC. Nor the BoM, nor the CSIRO, nor Turney and the Ship of Fools, nor “climate change”, nor the treasonous transformation of our education system into a propaganda unit for the Greens. Alfonso has it right at 9.50am above.

    In Australia today, “politics” consists of the following 4 steps:
    1) – Get selected.
    2) – Get elected.
    3) – Get re-elected.
    4) – Line up a nice little earner for when you get unelected.

    For those few with some ambition another step can be added:
    3a) – Get promoted.

    But this is entirely optional.

    Politicians no longer care one whit about actually “running the country”.
    That is the job of the bureaucracies and their bureaucrats.
    The two groups stay out of each others way as much as possible.

  155. Seguing from this I have a nearly-finished bottle of Pusser’s Rum which my son (LEUT, FBW) gave me for my birthday. Highly recommended.

    Continuing your segue, I’m pretty sure I’ve a bottle of Royal Navy issue stuff, that was still in Royal Navy stocks on Black Tot Day and thus was never issued. Picked it up in a pub somewhere in England.

  156. Jannie

    C’mon MemoryVault, even though you are probably right, such a bleak assessment makes me feel, well bleak. There must be more to life than the ABC triumphant, picking my pockets and debauching my grandchildren. I can’t quite explain it, but lately I have started to feel that the ABC have crossed a line and they are walking into trouble, but are too arrogant to understand it. Life is not always just, but there ARE consequences for actions, cause and effect. The ABC have stored up one huge gunnysack of consequences for themselves, sooner or later nature is gonna let rip. Hopefully before I die.

  157. Des Deskperson

    ‘ Maybe Des Deskperson might scroll on by and give us an insider’s few of the IT Mandarins if we are lucky.’

    My comments, for what they are worth:

    I worked for a number of years at a senior level in the Australian (Commonwealth) Public Service, including running branches responsible for quantitative and qualitative analysis and reporting. I have never heard of anyone who remotely resembles Memory Vault’s IT controlling mandarins, let alone met one.

    Apart from a few specialist organisations, few APS agencies have any real in-depth IT capability anymore. IT across the service was outsourced in the nineties and while some basic functions – staffing data – are now being clawed back, most agencies that want to undertake detailed IT based analysis, including, for example, client surveys – employ consultants. Agencies frame the basic questions, but the inputting and the outputting is managed by consultants. To control and manipulate data in the way that Memory Vault suggests, the Manadrins these days would have get at the consultants.

    Not much else that Memory Vault has to say rings true in my experience. There is no such thing as ‘public service’ when the term is used qualitatively. APS employees serve the government of the day. Increased internal and external mobility means that few employees have any strong or lasting allegiance to their department or the people who run it. There have never been any affirmative action policies in the APS, although a lot of boys clubs have been broken up by fairer selection processes. And it’s worth noting, once again, that it’s still perfectly possible for someone with no connections and no assets other than brains, ability and diligence to get to the top in the APS.

  158. Zulu Kilo Two Alpha

    I’ve a bottle of Royal Navy issue stuff

    Off topic, I know, but one ex – RN bloke who I had the privilege of working with described the sensation of the rum ration after a freezing night as “having a large tomcat dragged down your throat by the tail….”

  159. nilk

    Johanna all she had to do was google “novocastrian etymology”, but I suspect she may not know the word “etymology.”

    Or else google is not her friend.

  160. MemoryVault

    Okay Jannie, just for you, here is a list of alternatives:

    1) – The Member for Goldman Sachs, Malcolm Turnball will announce the defunding of the ABC as an irrelevant dinosaur in this digital computer age. He will also announce that certain ABC personnel will be charged under Section 79 of the Crimes Act in relation to the Indonesia spying revelations.

    2) – The Environment Minister, Greg Hunt will simultaneously announce:
    - – - – An end to all CAGW nonsense including RETs and “Green Armies”, and
    - – - – A top level inquiry into the CSIRO to find out when it stopped practicing science, and
    - – - – A top level inquiry into the BoM to find out when they dropped meteorology from their charter.

    3) – The Education Minister, Christopher Pyne will announce:
    - – - – That his appointment of a communist and a religious fanatic to oversee a review of our National Curriculum was, in fact an advance April Fools day joke, and
    - – - – That the review will actually be carried out by a group of 70 year old retired teachers who date back to when the education system actually taught stuff.

    4) – The Treasurer, Joe Hockey will announce he has no intention of appropriating your superannuation to fund infrastructure programs.

    5) – The PM, Tony Abbott will announce:
    - – - – There will be no Gonski money for for education until education starts educating, and
    - – - – There will be no money for NDIS until Human Services explains how so many “new” Australians automatically qualify for a DSP, while longer-term Australians are being refused even though they are literally dying, and
    - – - – There will be no middle-class welfare PPL because we simply can’t afford it, and
    - – - – Chris Turney will be held personally financially responsible for the Ship of Fools debacle.

    Feeling better now, or would you like some more?
    I’m a writer – fairy tales come naturally to me.

  161. MemoryVault

    Aah – Des Deskperson, what fond memories you invoke.

    I well remember “experts” like you being trotted out in the newspapers and on TV in 1985, when I first spoke out about the mess our welfare system was in. “Impossible”, they sputtered. “Utter nonsense”, they cried. “Doesn’t happen”, they assured.

    That was until my wife and I traveled across Australia, defrauding the system of a variety of benefits, in a number of states, then gave all the money back and went on national television to show how easy it all was. After that all that was heard from the “experts” was the sound of crickets chirping.

    By the way, if you worked in the APS in the 80′s and managed to remain unaware of the effects of “Affirmative Action”, then all I can say is you never stepped foot out of a National or State HQ, into a regional office, and therefore have no idea how the APS works (or at least worked) at the coal-face level. It was not pretty. There were suicides.

    PS – Before anybody asks, yes our welfare system was a mess back then, and yes, it is orders of magnitude worse now.

    But then, that is precisely what was supposed to happen.

  162. Jannie

    Hey MemoryVault, you do remember a lot of stuff I just forget about because its too depressing for me to to keep it all in my gunnysack. I agree its important to be realistic, believe me I am no Pollyanna. Sometimes I despair of the ABC, but a bit of optimism can be a good thing, if only to keep up the morale of the boys at the front. But I am also being realistic. There ARE consequences for actions, and nothing lasts forever. Those are truths and not merely platitudes. The future of the ABC is not assured, it has too many implacable enemies, even if they are keeping a low profile.

  163. Rabz

    MV – ease up, Desky is one of the good guys.

  164. MemoryVault

    Jannie,

    because its too depressing for me to to keep it all in my gunnysack.

    You’re obviously not drinking enough.
    Shiraz Cabernet works a treat for me.

  165. blogstrop

    Tim Blair’s latest statement on the matter confirms that Branley wrote it:

    I confirmed this with Branley yesterday prior to publication of the item on my site – the words are definitely hers.

  166. MemoryVault

    Rabz

    Desky is one of the good guys.

    Well he may be. That doesn’t excuse him for commenting – rubbishing – things he obviously knows nothing about. Affirmative Action for Women was formally incorporated into the APS structure via the Public Service Reform Act, 1984, and had been practiced for some time before then.

    This was prior to the passage of the Affirmative Action (Equal Employment Opportunity for Women) Bill 1986, which imposed further requirements on the APS to incorporate “affirmative action” in the promotion of women within the service.

    To state, as Desky does that:

    There have never been any affirmative action policies in the APS

    when, in fact, such affirmative action policies were mandated by legislation, is misleading, to say the least.

  167. Mique

    Des Deskperson on Memory Vault’s “IT controlling mandarins”. I have a son who works at a senior level in part of the Defence IT conglomerate. Years ago, I was a senior RAAF officer in a policy division during the transition from typing pools to desktopery, a painful process for all concerned, made doubly difficult by the requirement to sacrifice tried and proven single-Service filing systems in favour of a FOI Act driven move to a unified, homogenised and utterly useless department-wide system based purely on an annual chronological system. Needless to say, treasured archives were thrown into absolute chaos or disappeared completely, eg thermal faxes, and it doesn’t surprise me in the least if Defence’s corporate memory has effectively been totally destroyed. My son confirms that the resultant system is pure chaos, and the whole concept of “IT controlling mandarins” is a laughable description of the status quo. By definition, nobody controls chaos.

  168. rafiki

    From 1984 to 2005 I worked at the ANU, a quasi-branch of the APS. I taught a lot of public servants, and mixed socially with many. While the Public Service Board might never have proclaimed that ‘from now on, we are going to appoint women, nesbians, and aboriginals in preference to men’ that is my clear impression of how the system of appointments operated. At the ANU, there was no such proclamation, but I recall a meeting with a Deputy Vice-Chancellor who told us that that what was expected. (I made myself unpopular by arguing that given we had appointed a large number of women on the old ‘merit’ system, why did we need a policy of preference.) On one appointments committee, the then Dean confided to me that while he thought the best candidate was a man, with an Australian LLB and a Canadian PhD in law and economics (and we badly need such expertise), a women with no overseas experience and little academic merit would be appointed. I imagine that pst who worked in the APS and the ANU in this period could tell similar stories. Across Australian universities, there have been disastrous female appointments at professorial level. These policies are a major contributor to the marked decline in standards at the universities.

  169. Des Deskperson

    ‘when, in fact, such affirmative action policies were mandated by legislation, is misleading, to say the least’

    Where?? Please cite the sections in either the Public Service Act 1922 or its successor the Public Service Act 1999 that mandates affirmative action, that is, quotas for women that override the merit principle for selection for engagement or promotion, that legally empower managers to put gender above ability in choosing staff.

    You are confusing Affirmative Action with EEO. EEO, ( now incorporated into the broader term ‘diversity’ ) was included in the 1984 reforms that implemented the recommendations of the Coombs Royal Commission. Coombs wanted initiatives that would ensure that women were not disadvantaged in competing on merit for jobs (EEO) , but he was dead against quotas. That’s how it’s worked ever since, admittedly not perfectly.

    IIRC – I can’t find it on Comlaw – the old Affirmative Action (Equal Employment Opportunity for Women) Act 1986 didn’t apply to the APS.

  170. Ros

    “What brought it back to life was the acquisition by the ABC’s Jakarta correspondent George Roberts – from whom, he has never said – of footage of asylum seekers being examined at a police clinic in Kupang, and dramatic still photographs of their severely burnt hands.”

    From Jonathon Holmes.

    A news item last night showed the hands of the remarkable pair of young lads who rowed across the Atlantic. What struck me was the similairty in a video of the blisters htey had and the supposed asylum seekers. Apart from Roberts claim that the video and photos demonstrate blisters from heat burns, and the touching site of a woman making seemingly considerable notes about the blisters, which required her to hold the victims hand throughout, has anyone with medical knowledge and skills expressed any opinion as to the nature of these blisters, eg how old they were when photoed, likely causes etc.

    But what is really striking when watching Roberts video is how staged it is. It is most certainly not the product of some kind of amateur good fortune shoot of the surprise turn up of these men at the clinic, at which there is a permanent photgrapher on duty for such moments, the police health clinic in Kupang. The hold handing note taking scene is planned and directed. And Kupang has very limited health facilities, in particular clinics. So a police clinic, does any one know if this is true.

    Now considering that Roberts won’t even tell his employer it seems how he got this video, who made it, why they passed it to him and the fact that it is obviously a directed photo shoot I would suggest that the ABC is in bigger trouble than they are letting on. Restaging of a scene being identified as such I would think is an absolute requirement of ethical reporting. To rerun the episode, to stage it means it is not evidence of anything. Yet the ABC put it out there as evidence.

    Surely allowing the Australian public to believe that by good fortune the ABC got hold of a video of these poor folk turning up at a health clinic, rather than what it seems a staging of the event, constitutes faking evidence. The reality is it could have been made by and provided by the people smugglers PR team. Roberts has to put out on the public sphere who and how and when, and why up until now he has refused to say. That the ABC runs with a video that they are unable to demonstrate is a true record of an event as it occured makes their failure out right fraud.

  171. MemoryVault

    Desky,

    I think this has been done to death, so I won’t comment on it further after this. Googling “affirmative action in the australian public service”, will net you about 4.5 million hits.

    For Gawd’s sake, Desky, there were scholarly reference books on the history and success – or otherwise – of affirmative action in the APS, being written in the early 1990′s – twenty years ago.

    I’m sorry if you were too busy “running branches responsible for quantitative and qualitative analysis and reporting” to notice, but there you are.

  172. MemoryVault

    Ros,

    Very interesting point.
    There is now a new thread specifically on the ABC beat-up.
    I suggest you repost your comment there – if that’s allowed on Catallaxy.

  173. Des Deskperson

    ‘I’m sorry if you were too busy “running branches responsible for quantitative and qualitative analysis and reporting” to notice, but there you are.’

    No need to be rude. You haven’t answered my question about the legislation – or referred to or produced any official APS policies or programmes that mandate or even recommend affirmative action. You don’t know the official and technical differences between affirmative action and EEO/diversity. You have produced no evidence at all for any of your claims and all your anecdotes – and indeed all your public sector experiences – appear to be decades old.

  174. .

    I think rafiki’s comments are illuminating. Nothing overt, but the loopy changes leading to stunning managerial incompetence can be done under the auspices of fairness.

  175. Armadillo

    Bloggy @2.13

    I confirmed this with Branley yesterday prior to publication of the item on my site – the words are definitely hers.

    Blair shows young Branley how to be a journalist. Pick up phone and confirm it’s veracity. How refreshing. Blair knows if Branley lies and gets caught out later, he then has a ‘huge’ story. Why didn’t Branley think of that with the Navy?

  176. .

    To follow up rafiki – some of the female appointments to the NSW bench at all levels have been uncompromising idiots (often with a loopy agenda belonging to the crackpot fringe of the left) and basically, shit lawyers.

    How they compare say to DC Judge Jennifer English or Crown Prosecutor Margaret Cuneen, who both got where they are on merit, is beyond me.

  177. .

    Even Mary Gaudron was an entirely suspect appointment. Her career was centred around her being a woman and in the dinosaur era, being snubbed by male barristers.

Comments are closed.