Climate hypocrites

There is an interesting tweet doing the rounds – showing the names and faces of all the Senators who voted to repeal the carbon tax (except, it seems, Bob Day – the photo is of Steve Fielding).

Repeal Senators

The luvvie hysteria has been a sight to behold – but we’ve been here before. Here is an extract from Senator Penny Wong’s speech on 30 November 2009 when the Greens voted down Kevin Rudd’s CPRS.

Senator WONG (Minister for Climate Change and Water) (11:35 AM) … I will briefly mention the Greens and I will just say this. This legislation may well fail on the Greens’ vote and, whatever rhetoric those Greens senators engage in, they will have voted for Australia’s carbon pollution to continue to rise. They will have voted against action on climate change.

Honourable senators interjecting—

The PRESIDENT —Order! Continue, Senator Wong. Interjections are disorderly.

Senator WONG —There are so many retorts that I would like to make, Mr President, but I will not indulge myself. This is a big reform. We knew that when we took it to the Australian people at the last election and we also knew that when we sat down to negotiate with the opposition. This is a long-term, lasting structural reform to the Australian economy. It is about making a change now over the decades to come because that is the only way in which we can respond to climate change. These sorts of reforms, historically in this nation, have only succeeded when there has been leadership across this parliament and it is regrettable and to the great detriment of this nation and to the great shame of the Liberal Party that they have fallen, as a party, so short.

I do have some acknowledgements that I wish to make. I first want to thank Labor members and senators who have campaigned for and supported this great Labor reform for the future of the nation. They have done and will continue to do what is hard, not because it is easy but because it is right. They will continue to look to the future and that is the way this party and this government will continue to go forward. I want to particularly thank and acknowledge the Department of Climate Change and all public servants across government who have served this government and previous governments with professionalism and have demonstrated their enormous capacity for hard work over two years in working up this reform. I thank them and I think the Australian people thank them for the work they have done to contribute so much to this important and big reform.

I also want to thank those members of the Liberal Party who, whatever the differences I have with some of their public policy positions, have shown a willingness to look to the national interest. We saw some of that on display here today and I thank them for that. It is regrettable that too many of their colleagues have chosen instead to go the other way and not look to the national interest. Most of all, I want to acknowledge the many Australians who have continued to support action on climate change and have continued to call for it; the many who have emailed, written or phoned not only my office but also the offices of others in this government to express their support. I particularly want to thank young Australians because this is an issue that so many young Australians care so deeply about. I have often said that the discussion that is had and the questions that are asked when I have spoken to groups of young Australians at times would leave the Senate looking somewhat inadequate.

This is a debate about the future, and Australians know this. In the heat and fury of today’s fight it is often easy to lose perspective, and too many opposite have lost that perspective. The question is: how will this look tomorrow; how will this look in a few years; how will this look 10 or 20 years from now? Long after most of us have left this place, we will continue to be held accountable. We should leave this place being able to look Australians in the eye and say: ‘We acted. We took responsibility.’ Instead, some of those opposite will simply have to look Australians in the eye and say: ‘I voted this way. I voted for the future not now and in fact not ever.’ This government and this party will hold true to the aspirations of the Australian people. We will do all we can and continue to do all we can to safeguard our children’s future and we will not take a backwards step. I commend the bills to the chamber.

We all know what happened next, but let’s just remind ourselves:

Repeal Senators 1

Just look at the people voting “No”.
Brown, B.J., Hanson-Young, S.C., Ludlam, S., Milne, C., and Siewert, R.
If those 5 had voted “Yes” and not “No” our recent political history would be very different. But no. Having snatched defeat from the jaws of victory they now whine about climate criminals.

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106 Responses to Climate hypocrites

  1. calli

    Again 16 minutes before the first comment. The horror of the past few years has been epic.

  2. H B Bear

    K D Wong’s “Greatest Hits” straight into the remainder bin.

    Someone needs to remind these swampies that history is written by the victors.

  3. Andreas

    Brown, B.J., Hanson-Young, S.C., Ludlam, S., Milne, C., and Siewert, R.

    LOL. Climate criminals.

  4. JC

    All the Greens wanted was a little justice…. Climate justice.

  5. jupes

    The question is: how will this look tomorrow; how will this look in a few years; how will this look 10 or 20 years from now?

    One would hope that honesty has returned to public policy by then and the whold debate about ‘climate change’ will look very embarrassing indeed for all concerned.

  6. Grigory M

    If I may be so bold, Sinc – Bill Heffernan is no Barry O’Sullivan. He’s far more colorful ;)

  7. JC

    You’re not bold, just bald and very boring, Grogory.

  8. A Lurker

    The Greens are certainly giving a good rendition of a two-year old chucking a wobbly whilst lying on the ground, fists and heels pounding the floor, screaming uncontrollably their eyes screwed up, and their face crimson red. Labor on the other hand, are acting like thirteen year old girls sulking in their room.

  9. The Fifth Bike Rider of the Apocalypse

    Slightly of topic. The ABC’s Catalyst returned to the silver screen tonight preaching the same old gerbil warming sermon.
    It wasn’t a question of whether the seas would rise but how high.
    Well, it will only be modest nine metres and you’ll have to wait ‘several centuries’ for it to happen. Naturally all those mega cities built in low lying areas (what like the f***ing Netherlands) are basically stuffed and ‘will have to deal with sea level rise’.
    The report featured three ‘doctors’ (not the Band Aid applying ones) including one whacko with his Junior Woodchuck’s Sea Rise Detector Antennae clamped on his back.
    Even the wealthiest countries won’t be able afford the cost of combating sea level rises so ‘the most clever strategies are actually what is called a planned retreat’.
    Planned retreat means gradually moving our cities and infrastructure inland.

    Yep. No worries. Tick.

    But don’t be concerned.

    According to Neville the Narrator, sea level rise is at least gradual, so if we start acting we do have the time to make the necessary changes.

    The first necessary change should be to put a broom through the ABC.

  10. Bruce of Newcastle

    The tribalism of the left is a real problem since the actual climate data shows there is no CAGW and can be no CAGW (since ECS is low).

    Unfortunately to break with the tribal meme and embrace reality is something almost all of the left can’t seem to do. So we’re getting hysteria.

    Science does not care what tribe you belong to. It is or it isn’t. CAGW isn’t. That’s quite clear from the empirical data. And the climate models fail to accurately model the temperature record because of the GIGO principle. They don’t include the full effect of the Sun on cloud cover and don’t include the ocean cycles. Therefore they can’t be regarded as correct.

    I’m mystified as to what it will take for these people to embrace reality.

  11. Grigory M

    Ah, Chickie-babe – you’ve been quiet the last couple of nights. All that talk by the other girls about peeing standing up got you a bit nervous again? No problem – you can do that without even trying – and no lanoline needed. But – you ain’t no gun shearer, sweetie.

  12. Tintarella di Luna

    Ah, Chickie-babe – you’ve been quiet the last couple of nights. All that talk by the other girls about peeing standing up got you a bit nervous again? No problem – you can do that without even trying – and no lanoline needed. But – you ain’t no gun shearer, sweetie.

    Huh?

  13. James in Melbourne

    This name-and-shame stuff is ridiculous and contemptible. I agree with whoever said it yesterday, it is borderline incitement for the balaclavas and baseball bats of the rent-a-crowd Socialist Action types, who have been given no sign from the police or the courts that their “feelings” are not actually superior to the law. We are on the slippery slope here, it is only a matter of time until something belonging to a “carbon criminal” is vandalised, or worse, and we know wholly beforehand that the police and the courts will not lift a fingernail to stop it.

    And all over conjecture distilled from dodgy models that are of course programmed to spit out exactly what their data-feeders want them to.

    That evil harridan Milne gives off the unmistakable and deeply unpleasant whiff of zealotry. I don’t like it, people.

  14. Huh?

    Tint – I think he’s been drinking

  15. Mike of Marion

    Tintarella di Luna
    #1385673, posted on July 17, 2014 at 9:13 pm

    Don’t worry about these two – it’s a mutual love-in going on between them!!!!!

  16. Stephan

    Good thing Labor will bring an ETS back, and Abbott has done all the hard yards necessary to make Labor look a relatively good option.

    Thanks Tony, the slow-talking marionette.

  17. Occupy Centrelink

    A victory maybe tempered somewhat by the amendments from PUP. If we don’t see the full reduction on our electricity bill with the compliance costs we’ll know who to blame.

  18. Chrisl

    Went out on the reef today in Cairns and they explained that coral grew in temperatures ranging from 18degrees to 32 degrees,and coral grew to mid tide level (between high and low) So, If global warming occurred ,coral would survive and grow higher! However on the trip back it was all about da warming and da carbon footprint and da donations!

  19. That evil harridan Milne gives off the unmistakable and deeply unpleasant whiff of zealotry. I don’t like it, people.

    Under all the peace and love is a blood-drenched dictatorship just yearning to get out.

    Unfortunately for them, they have already so strongly demonstrated their utter contempt for the Western military tradition that the people they’d need to enforce their reign of blood won’t follow them, and the people who would follow them would be mincemeat for the good guys.

    If these guys tried to spring a coup, the Army would cut straight through their goons and have them against the wall in a week.

  20. I’m mystified as to what it will take for these people to embrace reality.

    Haloperidol and ECT.

  21. Haloperidol and ECT.

    Largactil & an enema

  22. James in Melbourne

    Would it be apposite to point out that still, to this day, there is no proof whatsoever that the warming postulated by Milne is at all likely, let alone that it would be catastrophic – the basis for those assertions comes only from models. What the world has actually experienced – that is, the observations – have been thrown out because they don’t match the theory, a complete inversion of the scientific method. Stephan, you do understand this?

  23. JC

    Welcome back Perturbed. We missed your even keel, middle of the road views. :-) You’re a doctor I think you once said, so i want to exchange a medical opinion with you… like you know, from one doctor to another.

    I’m of the (medical) opinion that Tubbsie Milne sounds so extreme and forthright because she doesn’t have and hasn’t had a man in her life for a very long time. No fucker worth half a pound of salt would go near her. Don’t you think the extremes she’s presenting are strongly suggestive of an inability to quench a strong sexual desire? Maybe what she’s not satisfying is a strong sexual passion, which quite frankly all humans desire. This climate obsession she often shows could be that she’s directing her sexuality towards something she feels she can control… the climate in 100 years because she can’t attract a male.

    What’s your take?

  24. Lysander

    http://www.abc.net.au/local/stories/2011/08/16/3294368.htm

    If you haven’t heard this, listen from 7 minutes in when Barnaby owns abc journo. I’ve never heard an abc journo so owned ever before.

    Bloody gold!!!

  25. MemoryVault

    Stephan, you do understand this?

    You’re wasting your time, James.
    Despite apparently having a large collection of scientifical-type looniversity degrees, Stephan believes the atmosphere heats the oceans. You’d have better luck teaching cows how to program a VCR.

  26. Stephan

    I’m of the (medical) opinion that Tubbsie Milne sounds so extreme and forthright because she doesn’t have and hasn’t had a man in her life for a very long time. No fucker worth half a pound of salt would go near her. Don’t you think the extremes she’s presenting are strongly suggestive of an inability to quench a strong sexual desire? Maybe what she’s not satisfying is a strong sexual passion, which quite frankly all humans desire. This climate obsession she often shows could be that she’s directing her sexuality towards something she feels she can control… the climate in 100 years because she can’t attract a male.

    What’s your take?

    Very detailed, obsessive even. This is highly suggestive of projection to me. I’d get that looked at, JC.

  27. I am the Walrus, Koo Koo K'Choo

    Even the wealthiest countries won’t be able afford the cost of combating sea level rises so ‘the most clever strategies are actually what is called a planned retreat’.

    Planned retreat means gradually moving our cities and infrastructure inland.

    First thing we move, we move the ABC studios somewhere west of Dubbo.

    They should be safe out there.

  28. Talleyrand

    When a man stops believing in God he doesn’t then believe in nothing, he believes anything.

    Chesterton was right, the Greens have moved from the Socialist utopia to the Return to Eden environmentalism after the fall of their beloved Communism .

    It really is a substitute religion for our secular times, with superstition in place of science, indulgence instead of real sacrifice and humility. All united into a desire for control of the people ostensibly for their own good.
    It has pissed on the great product of the enlightenment the development of scientific enquiry, and left its acolytes with a brittle form of fascism.

  29. JC

    Very detailed, obsessive even. This is highly suggestive of projection to me. I’d get that looked at, JC.

    I’m fine on that Score, Stephanie. It’s not me you you should be worried about. It’s Tubbsie whom I believe shows all the symptoms of sexual frustration manifesting in climate obsession. You shouldn’t downplay this as it’s sent many a leftie to the JC leftie suicide helpline.

  30. MemoryVault

    First thing we move, we move the ABC studios somewhere west of Dubbo.

    Why?
    What did poor Dubbo ever do to you?
    I was thinking much further west.
    Maybe west of the Nile, for instance.
    I hear things have settled down in Libya.

  31. Rousie

    I think you’ll find Tubbsie has been in a loving relationship with a western red cedar for a few years now.

  32. Mike of Marion

    MemoryVault,
    Nah, they dropped some shells into Tripoli airport the other day!!!

  33. Tintarella di Luna

    I

    think you’ll find Tubbsie has been in a loving relationship with a western red cedar for a few years now.

    Very hardy and durable, much better than plastic, I hear.

  34. Percy

    First thing we move, we move the ABC studios somewhere west of Dubbo.

    They should be safe out there.

    What did the people of Western NSW do to you?
    If you want a direction to move the ABC, try East.

  35. Mike of Marion

    It would be the only wood she’d be getting!!

  36. Stephan

    Stephan believes the atmosphere heats the oceans.

    I believe solar radiation heats the oceans.

  37. JC

    Fuck off Stephanie. This is a medical discussion between doctors trying to help what appears to be a very, very sick patient. Mating difficulties have manifested into climate emergency. It serious stuff.

  38. I am the Walrus, Koo Koo K'Choo

    MV, please note that I said ‘west of Dubbo’.

    Ideally, I’d like them all to wake up one morning to the call of the muezzin in Mecca.

    Or the sound of automatic gunfire in Rawalpindi.

    No wuckers about ‘climate change’ n rising sea levels in them there parts.

  39. Tintarella di Luna

    It would be the only wood she’d be getting!!

    Cedar wood not pecker wood?

  40. harrys on the boat

    What a fuckwit Stephanie is. She proves that the left are fucking retards. They cant even parody themselves. Its fucking embarrassing.

  41. James in Melbourne

    Stephan, AGW is not even a theory. IT has never advanced to the testable hypothesis stage – let alone actually be tested, with supporting results, then repeated, with similar results, and thus proclaimed a theory.

    You, and Tubbsie, must understand this, or you make fools of yourselves.

  42. Yohan

    When the revolution comes, at least Bob Day will be able to avoid the communist lynch squads brandishing their Deck of Denier playing cards.

  43. Aaron

    Pretty sloppy work to have two Barry O’Sullivans. Surely Bill Heffernan deserves to be acknowledged for his long-standing commitment against global warming hysteria.

  44. MemoryVault

    Nah, they dropped some shells into Tripoli airport the other day!!!

    So?
    ABC staff wouldn’t want to be anywhere near an airport.
    It’s not as if any of them would ever fly anywhere.
    Think of the carbon footprint that would create.

  45. Rousie

    It would be the only wood she’d be getting!!

    Cedar wood not pecker wood?

    Guys, some respect pls.
    They’d like to keep the relationship private as the western red cedar is a fair bit older than Tubbsie and doesn’t like to comment in public

  46. MemoryVault

    Stephan believes the atmosphere heats the oceans.
    I believe solar radiation heats the oceans.

    Nah, sorry Stephan. You don’t get to slime out of it that easily.
    We had this conversation only a couple of threads ago.

    YOU support the “theory” of CAGW.
    CAGW “theory” requires a warming atmosphere.
    The atmosphere is not warming.
    YOU are on record as claiming the “missing CAGW heat” (from the atmosphere) was “finding its way” into the oceans, probably by some unexplained effect of ocean currents. Your words.

    Kindergarten children know solar radiation heats the oceans.
    What we’re talking about is your “missing CAGW atmospheric heat”.
    Solar radiation has nothing to do with your missing CAGW ATMOSPHERIC heat.

    Your story changes with each post, Stephan.
    Accept it, Stephan.
    You are a religious fanatic making it up on the run to support your crumbling faith-based dogma.

  47. Stephan

    Wrong, MV.

    Ever noticed the air temperature over a cool ocean can be significantly lower than over land, or a warmer body of water?

    Ocean currents are churning up the ocean at the moment, taking the heat out of the atmosphere. More ocean activity + more C02 forcing = static atmospheric temperatures. Not that hard to understand, eh?

  48. Perfidious Albino

    Lysander – ta for the link, Barnaby at his feisty best.

    I never realised ABC radio Canberra was 666 on the dial – figures though…

  49. cohenite

    I believe solar radiation heats the oceans.

    A belief entirely inconsistent with AGW.

  50. Stephan

    Look, being a contrarian is great fun, but you give it a rest when you’re fucking up your own planet.

  51. Matthew

    I have no idea if global warming is real or not. The behaviour of the global warming partisans makes me very suspicious, though. Why all the strong arm tactics?

  52. cohenite

    Look, being a contrarian is great fun, but you give it a rest when you’re fucking up your own planet.

    Bullshit. Humans are improving the planet. If it wasn’t for humans nature would be wrecking the place. Look at the facts: nature = Earthquakes, tsunamis, volcanoes, disease, greens and all the rest of natural disasters.

    Humans = skyscrapers, 6 lane highways, international sporting events, a vast variety of ice-cream and scotch etc.

    No comparison.

  53. James in Melbourne

    Look, being a contrarian is great fun, but you give it a rest when you’re fucking up your own planet.

    She’s a big planet, Stephan, and can look after herself. She has copped for untold millennia, across the geological timescale – and continues to cop – so many different natural influences on her climate, and she still does OK; or did, until conservative voters in the OECD nations began to put a second car in their driveways. My bad.

  54. Aristogeiton

    Hey, Matthew, what do you think of the LDP?

  55. cohenite

    Just watched Abbott’s interview with that cnut on 7.30. Abbott should have said no comparison between the medibank co-payment and the CO2 tax and gone from there.

    He is too apologetic and let’s fuckers like ferguson take the initiative.

  56. Tintarella di Luna

    Humans = skyscrapers, 6 lane highways, international sporting events, a vast variety of ice-cream and scotch etc.

    No comparison.

    And there’s this of course

  57. Stephan

    She’s a big planet, Stephan, and can look after herself. She has copped for untold millennia, across the geological timescale – and continues to cop – so many different natural influences on her climate, and she still does OK; or did, until conservative voters in the OECD nations began to put a second car in their driveways. My bad.

    Yes – I should say, fucking up the planet for humans. The planet will go on of course, it will just have much less capacity to sustain human society.

  58. MemoryVault

    Wrong, MV.

    Stephan, NET transfer of energy can only be one way.
    Either the oceans LOSE net energy to the atmosphere, or
    the oceans GAIN net energy from the atmosphere.

    If the oceans GAIN net energy from the atmosphere, then you can explain your missing CAGW heat.
    However, that would mean no evaporation, no clouds, and no precipitation. That is contrary to observed fact.

    On the other hand, if the oceans LOSE net energy to the atmosphere, we have evaporation, clouds, and precipitation. This is in accordance with observed fact.

    So, you have a simple choice: the observed facts of evaporation, clouds and precipitation, or a religious belief in something that isn’t happening, in a fanatical attempt to explain the missing CAGW atmospheric heat that you so desperately need to keep your religious dogma on life support.

  59. cohenite

    Yes – I should say, fucking up the planet for humans.

    Bullshit again dickhead. More humans today live better than they ever have. And reliable energy to keep nature at bay is the reason why and the best defence against what nature will throw at us.

  60. .

    There is nothing “luddite” about rejecting “science” built with severely compromised, falsified data.

  61. .

    Let’s make up for your cutting and running elsewhere, Stephan.

    The temps were adjusted up by 2.3 degrees (for Darwin). What is the justification for this?

  62. Stephan

    If the oceans GAIN net energy from the atmosphere, then you can explain your missing CAGW heat.
    However, that would mean no evaporation, no clouds, and no precipitation. That is contrary to observed fact.

    On the other hand, if the oceans LOSE net energy to the atmosphere, we have evaporation, clouds, and precipitation. This is in accordance with observed fact.

    Do you mean to say we have a complete understanding of the energy interface between ocean and atmosphere? I’m pretty sure that’s far from being the case.

    Of course the oceans lose energy to the atmosphere through evaporation etc. They also absorb heat energy from the atmosphere. Ocean currents have cycles we don’t completely understand. That is to say, it’s possible (and indeed thought) that we are currently in a cycle whereby oceans are gaining net energy from the atmosphere, taking into account the processes you mentioned.

  63. Infidel Tiger

    Yes – I should say, fucking up the planet for humans. The planet will go on of course, it will just have much less capacity to sustain human society.

    You sounded quite good humoured until today. Now you are starting to sound like a deadset bedwetter.

    Even if global a warming is true and it isn’t, there is no need to fret. Cheap energy, human ingenuity and economic growth have solved every problem that slut Mother Nature has ever chucked at us.

  64. .

    Do you mean to say we have a complete understanding of the energy interface between ocean and atmosphere? I’m pretty sure that’s far from being the case.

    Right. So how can climate worriers claim “the missing heat is in the ocean”?

  65. Stephan

    The temps were adjusted up by 2.3 degrees (for Darwin). What is the justification for this?

    I don’t know, ask Darwin – or whomever of his descendents feels like going through the drudgery of listening to your inanities.

  66. Stephan

    Right. So how can climate worriers claim “the missing heat is in the ocean”?

    The heat is right there, measured by the NOAA. That’s not in question. What’s not completely understood is the mechanism by which is got there. It’s a complex system after all.

  67. Stephan

    Bullshit again dickhead. More humans today live better than they ever have. And reliable energy to keep nature at bay is the reason why and the best defence against what nature will throw at us.

    It’s almost like there’s more than one variable at play here. That’s not to say the effect of one particular variable isn’t becoming a significant and deleterious effector.

  68. .

    You are cutting and running again, Stephan.

    You actually think you can brush off such fraudulent “science” with a light hearted remark.

    Any other academic would be fired.

    Imagine if Kwiggen or Sinclair D produced an economics paper where they adjusted unemployment data down by 10% of the average over a time period that made their theory have “perfect” statistical results?

    They’d be correctly fired without question. This is analogous to what happened with the Darwin, NT temperature data.

  69. Stephan

    They’d be correctly fired without question. This is analogous to what happened with the Darwin, NT temperature data.

    And? That wouldn’t call into question their entire fields of study, I wouldn’t think?

    (Though I must say there is a distinct dearth of quantitative evidence behind supply-side schools of economic thought. Always lots of lovely philosophical quotes to shove in the gaps, though!)

  70. Grigory M

    It’s twoo – it’s twoo – the missing heat is in the oceans. Here it is, the middle of winter – I stand at the water’s edge on my favourite beach, shivering like a dog shitting razor blades while I wait for the fish to bite. But, if I stand in the water – my feet thaw out and I stop shivering. Surely, that is conclusive evidence – yes?

  71. Stephan

    Anyway it’s off to the gym, I think. Nice and quiet now.

    A well-oiled mind requires a nice set of guns to balance it out – wouldn’t you say?

  72. .

    Stephan
    #1385823, posted on July 17, 2014 at 11:18 pm
    Right. So how can climate worriers claim “the missing heat is in the ocean”?

    The heat is right there, measured by the NOAA. That’s not in question. What’s not completely understood is the mechanism by which is got there. It’s a complex system after all.

    Yes, a lot more complex than a simple get out of gaol free card for climate worriers:

    http://hockeyschtick.blogspot.com.au/2013/10/new-paper-finds-pacific-ocean-has-been.html

    We show that water masses linked to North Pacific and Antarctic intermediate waters were warmer by 2.1 ± 0.4°C and 1.5 ± 0.4°C, respectively, during the middle Holocene Thermal Maximum than over the past century. Both water masses were ~0.9°C warmer during the Medieval Warm period than during the Little Ice Age and ~0.65° warmer than in recent decades.

    Note:

    Also, the paper uses data for the modern period from Levitus et al, which finds the world oceans have warmed only 0.09°C over the 55 year period from 1955-2010. An ocean that is 0.09C warmer can only warm the atmosphere by an additional 0.09C.

    From:

    Pacific Ocean Heat Content During the Past 10,000 Years
    Yair Rosenthal,* Braddock K. Linsley, Delia W. Oppo
    *Corresponding author. E-mail: [email protected]

    Published 1 November 2013, Science 342, 617 (2013)
    DOI: 10.1126/science.1240837

  73. Gab

    Interesting what Penny Wong thought of the carbon dioxide tax between 2009 and 2010.

    Video here.

    Wong certainly had a different opinion to this week:

    I was in this chamber when the CPRS, the Carbon Pollution Reduction Scheme—something which would have introduced a market mechanism, a floating price for carbon—was voted down by this Senate. The reason it was voted down on that day, the fundamental reason, is the same reason this legislation is likely to be voted down today—that is, a man called Mr Tony Abbott. He decided that it was in his political interest not to look to what was responsible, not to look to what was right, not to look to an effective, credible response to climate change, but to stake his political career, his political ambitions, on fearmongering and scaremongering. That is what this debate has been about for years. It has been about Mr Tony Abbott wanting the leadership of the Liberal Party, wanting to be Prime Minister, and staking his political campaign on fearmongering. The man who told us that Whyalla would be wiped off the map now cannot even guarantee to Australians that they will get the sorts of price reductions that he campaigned on for years.

    If these bills pass today, it will be a day in history where this parliament failed the test of leadership, failed the test of rising above opportunistic politics and short-term sectional interest to act in the national interest. If these bills pass, this nation will have walked away from a credible and effective response to climate change, it will walk away from reducing our greenhouse gas emissions and it will walk away from the task of transforming the Australian economy into the clean energy economy that we have to be in the 21st century. If these bills pass, this nation will be the only nation in the world going backwards when it comes to tackling climate change.

    She’s a weathervane.

    Wong did the same thing regarding gay “marriage”.

    Wong did the same thing backing Rudd over Gillard.

    She’s cheaper than a two-bit penny.

  74. .

    Stephan
    #1385832, posted on July 17, 2014 at 11:26 pm
    Anyway it’s off to the gym, I think. Nice and quiet now.

    A well-oiled mind requires a nice set of guns to balance it out – wouldn’t you say?

    You are cutting and running again, Stephan.

  75. .

    Grigory M
    #1385830, posted on July 17, 2014 at 11:23 pm
    It’s twoo – it’s twoo – the missing heat is in the oceans. Here it is, the middle of winter – I stand at the water’s edge on my favourite beach, shivering like a dog shitting razor blades while I wait for the fish to bite. But, if I stand in the water – my feet thaw out and I stop shivering. Surely, that is conclusive evidence – yes?

    What are you targeting? I’m heading down to the sth coast soon – hope the bluefin haven’t ran out to the pacific basin yet.

    Note the paper above Grigory relies on the 1st and 2nd laws of thermodynamics to say that however much the oceans have warmed, they can only warm the air by as much – from 1955 to 2010, the oceans warmed by 0.09 of one degree. CO2 emissions however rose very rapidly.

  76. Stephan

    You are cutting and running again, Stephan.

    Well, I’m actually riding to the gym, not running, and I don’t worry about cutting and bulking phases. Just simple incremental improvement is the name of my game.

  77. Grigory M

    What are you targeting?

    Tailor and bream, Dot.

  78. Aristogeiton

    Holy shit Stephanie, you’re such a faggot.

  79. .

    My attempts to catch Tailor are usually thwarted by Australian Salmon. At least they fight hard.

  80. cohenite

    The ocean is a net transmitter of heat to the atmosphere by several factors and several magnitudes. Solar heats the ocean and heat moves to the atmosphere via IR which is also back-radiated from the atmosphere to the ocean. But the back-radiation does not penetrate the ocean merely assisting in heat transfer of latent heat to the atmosphere by evaporation.

    The other method of ocean -> atmosphere heat transfer is by conduction.

  81. MemoryVault

    Do you mean to say we have a complete understanding of the energy interface between ocean and atmosphere? I’m pretty sure that’s far from being the case.

    Not necessary – typical Stephan strawman.
    All we need to know – for the purpose of this conversation – is the NET effect of the energy interface – which observation demonstrates is net energy transfer FROM the oceans TO the atmosphere. In other words,your “missing” atmospheric heat cannot be “finding its way” into the oceans.

    Of course the oceans lose energy to the atmosphere through evaporation etc. They also absorb heat energy from the atmosphere.

    NET transfer of energy can only be one way, Stephan. The choice is simple: “missing heat” finding its way into the oceans OR evaporation, clouds and precipitation. You can’t have both.

    it’s possible (and indeed thought) that we are currently in a cycle whereby oceans are gaining net energy from the atmosphere,

    Not in the world I live in, Stephan, which is governed by certain engineering principles, chief amongst them, in this case, being the Laws of Thermodynamics.

    Truth is, Stephan, despite your professed degrees, your lack of knowledge of basic physics is so woeful, you wouldn’t have even been able to get a Junior Certificate at the end of year 10 in my day. Put another way, back in the Sixties you wouldn’t even have qualified as an apprentice sewer cleaner.

    That might go some way in explaining your lack of success in obtaining meaningful employment now.

  82. Grigory M

    Yes, the Australian Salmon are fun to catch but no good to eat. I always put them back in the water.

  83. cohenite

    The heat is right there, measured by the NOAA.

    That is just a lie. NOAA has measured nothing below 1800 meters. And the OHC from 700 meters to the surface is not increasing.

  84. Grigory M

    hope the bluefin haven’t ran out to the pacific basin yet

    My friend caught a 15 kilogram bluefin tuna off the beach while we were spinning for tailor. Peeled off almost all of his line (300 metres) before he could turn it, then took him backwards and forwards along the beach for three-quarters of an hour until we could swim it ashore for him.

  85. Leo G

    “Ocean currents are churning up the ocean at the moment, taking the heat out of the atmosphere. ” – Stephan

    Didn’t you claim to have an undergraduate degree in Science?

  86. entropy

    Even the really warm pool of rising sub surface water (+6 degrees anomaly a few months ago) in the eastern pacific has dissipated, with cold water rising underneath. The much ballyhooed super el nino won’t be. It will just be a tiddler at most.

    not that that means the drought is over, mind.

  87. JC

    Sobering analysis, if she runs

    POLITICS 06.09.14

    GOP’s Biggest 2016 Problem: Clinton’s Numbers Among White Voters

    Hillary Clinton’s strength among white voters is the key to 2016—and it spells nearly certain defeat and disaster for Republicans.

    Culture will likely shape the 2016 presidential elections, and this is bad news for the Republican Party. Recent polls show Hillary Clinton running well among white voters overall, showing real strength among white non-evangelical Protestants, and running competitively among white Catholics. Trailing only among evangelicals, Clinton is poised to move beyond the upstairs-downstairs coalition that brought Barack Obama to the White House, and that continues to characterize his policies and presidency to this day.

    On multiple levels Clinton is not Obama, and GOP swipes at Clinton over her age and health appear to have gained less traction among voters than digs leveled at the President over his birth certificate and religion. Instead of faltering, Clinton is building upon her bid for the 2008 Democratic nomination, when she stitched together wins in industrial and large states by winning a majority of white voters.

    Take Pennsylvania, which Clinton loyalist and talking head James Carville once described as “Philadelphia and Pittsburgh with Alabama in between.” Its Democrats definitively preferred Clinton over Obama in the state’s 2008 presidential primaries. Six years ago, Clinton beat Obama by nine points, and now she leads prospective 2016 Republican contenders Rand Paul, Paul Ryan, Jeb Bush, and Mike Huckabee among Pennsylvania’s white voters in general, and surprisingly among white voters without college degrees. If the GOP cannot capture working-class votes outside of the South, it will again face defeat.

  88. MemoryVault

    Didn’t you claim to have an undergraduate degree in Science?

    Sad, isn’t it?
    I have a youngish (45) relative with a recent Masters in Science.
    He majored in Eco-Feminism.
    Go figure.

  89. Aristogeiton

    MV, 45 is very much old enough for regret…

  90. Squirrel

    So are we going to get a mugshot lineup of all those passionately concerned environmentalist Senators who voted against the re-indexation of the fuel excise? Of course not, that’s entirely different, isn’t it……

  91. cohenite

    He majored in Eco-Feminism.

    The thing about the filth and attendant studies is that nature regards the female as a womb and not much else. It is only in the rarefied streets of inner Newtown where nature is a picture of a Polar bear snuggling up to a seal that the notion that nature liberates and supports sexual equality thrives.

    Eco-Feminism; I can just see the lady walruses organising their local support chapter to protest against the big fat bastard which keeps rooting them.

  92. evcricket

    Well done you colossal dickheads, you managed to drag Australia back a decade. It must feel so good.

    Do you boneheads honestly believe that Tony Abbott has got this right and that the rest of the world is actually wrong? Your faith in the democratic process is heartwarming at least.

    Anyway, I expect this will cost Abbott government and we will have a price on carbon again within 5-years. enjoy this mild victory for idiocy and mediocrity while it lasts.

  93. Gab

    Oooh, someone’s got a bug up their ass this morning. Wail, carbon creepy,wail.

  94. motherhubbard'sdog

    Bob Brown’s initials are BJ? You’re kidding, right?

  95. motherhubbard'sdog

    PS, I notice that Barry O’Sullivan managed to get two mentions. One of those photos can’t be right.

    That touch of professionalism!

  96. .

    evcricket
    #1386184, posted on July 18, 2014 at 9:56 am
    Well done you colossal dickheads, you managed to drag Australia back a decade. It must feel so good.

    We managed to stop a policy built on scientific fraud – data fraud, internal censorship of journals, bogus results and graphs.

    Do you boneheads honestly believe that Tony Abbott has got this right and that the rest of the world is actually wrong? Your faith in the democratic process is heartwarming at least.

    The rest of the world has rejected “carbon pricing”. The US won’t have it. China increases emissions more than our output every year. India Won’t Brazil Won’t Russia won’t. The EU ETS has failed twice.

    Anyway, I expect this will cost Abbott government and we will have a price on carbon again within 5-years. enjoy this mild victory for idiocy and mediocrity while it lasts.

    You can’t run a business without subsidies, how can you make any accurate predictions at all?

  97. Sinclair Davidson

    It must feel so good.

    Maaaaate – you’ve got no idea. AWESOME!!!!!!!

    We have just inflicted the greatest political defeat on you lefties in a generation. If not ever.

  98. .

    Don’t forget da ebil mining has also gotten a leg up evcricket – no more MRRT.

    Tell us how Shorten is going to campaign to reintroduce two taxes again and win an election – given that thanks to Senator David Leyonhjelm (LDP) the TFT remains at $18,200 with the carbon tax gone.

  99. Gab

    What is best in life?

    To hear the gnashing of teeth and sobbing of lefties in the morning.

  100. Sinclair Davidson

    Gab – you got to see some of the hate mail I’m getting. Fantastic.

  101. Gab

    you got to see some of the hate mail I’m getting. Fantastic.

    Hehehe. You rule supreme, Doomlord. Revel in your victory!

  102. The Hunted Mind

    It would be the only wood she’d be getting!!

    The thought of her getting splinters makes me laugh.

  103. The Hunted Mind

    … then spew.

  104. Mr Rusty

    Well done you colossal dickheads, you managed to drag Australia back a decade.

    You’re assuming that “back” is something bad, but when you are standing at the edge of a cliff of totally deranged, anti-scientific, fictional lunacy then taking steps back into the land of rational normalcy is actually a positive thing.

    It must feel so good.

    Nah, cos we evil, redneck, right-wing, deniers, yada yada yada don’t “feel” anything…
    Bwahahahahaha!!!! Just kidding, we’re fucking LOVING IT!
    Mmmmm, please cry more of your bitter salty tears for us to wallow in, oh, yum…tastes so good!

  105. Bruce of Newcastle

    Do you boneheads honestly believe that Tony Abbott has got this right and that the rest of the world is actually wrong?

    Yes. Its what the data says.

    The real world data overturned the stress hypothesis of stomach ulcers, the Earth centric hypothesis of planetary orbits, the immobility of the continents and the manifest destiny of the Proletarian Revolution.

    All of which were the consensus at the time. Ok the latter was only consensus in your half of the world, Ev, but it fell just as hard as all the other ones. The climateers’ hypothesis is presently undergoing the same fate.

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