Unprincipled ignorance

It’s clear enough that unprincipled ignorance is the single most defining characteristic of those who consistently attack the PM. His equation of ISIS with the Nazis, with a slight twist towards noting the astonishing pride the Islamic State takes in displaying their barbarity, has called to arms the usual brigade of anti-Abbott hysterics. But there is one difference between the Nazis and ISIS that is of singular importance. The Nazis disappeared in 1945. ISIS is a threat today. To distract from any of this is merely to attack the single most focused enemy of ISIS in Australian politics, and there would be few like him anywhere in the world. Objectively, as Stalin liked to say, attacks on Abbott over this issue transform someone into a defender of ISIS.

Daryl McCann has an excellent article at Quadrant Online: Hold the Front Page! Nazism = ISIS. Here is my choice of its central point, but do read it all.

The bloodcurdling irrationality of the Islamic State expresses itself not only in the annihilation of Christians, secularists, modern women, smokers, archaeologists, Yazidis, Kurds, Druse, Shiites, Alawis, historical landmarks, ancient manuscripts, foreign photographers and aid workers, homosexuals, adulterers, suspected Sunni apostates, but also in its exterminationist anti-Semitism. Thus, the call to “liberate” Jerusalem (al-Quds) refers to the drawing near of Islamic “End Times” and has nothing to do with achieving a two-state solution for the Israeli-Arab conflict (or East Jerusalem as the nascent capital of an Islamic Republic of Palestine). Abbott’s depiction of the Islamic State as an “apocalyptic death cult”, then, appears to be right on the money. Conversely, the accusation by leftist journalists and commentators in Australia that Tony Abbott’s analysis is mere hyperbole, intended only to boost lagging popularity at home, can be dismissed as a combination of ignorance and political point-scoring on the part of the commentariat – the very things, ironically, they accuse the Prime Minister of doing.

If I quibble about this, there is something about the wording at the start that does not come to grips with the intensity or the nature of the problems we face. ISIS are mass murderers who will murder many more if they can. I do not know where their drive for power and dominance comes from but it is not “irrational”. And “bloodcurdling” is too weak a word to do the job. With ISIS we are dealing with very rational people who are seeking power, first in the Middle East but also anywhere else they can. It is a global operation spreading with fantastic success. It is also not difficult to set up a franchise operation anywhere, which is why no country in the West is immune, where there is a large scale risk of much greater insurgency over the coming decades. ISIS is unlikely to have reached anything like the dominance it will one day have. If this doesn’t worry you, you lack political imagination and have almost no historical sense worth discussing. You are, whatever else you may think, helping to open the road to further incursions of ISIS barbarities into every part of the world.

Robert Groot, the President of the Executive Council of Australian Jewry, made this statement absolving the PM of missing the point.

groot-note

OK, I get it. But side by side with that, I would like to see the Executive Council’s words on Obama’s agreement freeing Iran to develop nuclear weapons. Here’s my advice, Robert. You should back this Prime Minister to the hilt because whoever may be the next one is unlikely to take ISIS as seriously as Tony Abbott, and it will not matter which side of politics forms the next government for this to be true.

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42 Responses to Unprincipled ignorance

  1. Mantaray

    The great and deliberate error in all this is that Abbott-critics are comparing the “late-term” Nazis…..using hindsight… with early-stage IS.

    The whole point of the Nazis was that no-one, before the fact, expected it to turn out quite as horrifically as it did. In 1936 the civilized world was willing to send it’s sportspeople to the Berlin Olympics to parade before Hitler. Throughout the 1930s many (Chamberlain anyone?) thought Hitler was a bloke to be reasoned with. Leftists even applauded him once he did his deal with Stalin. And on and on and on.

    IS is not like this. It has told us all straight that it is out to murder and mutilate and torture. We know this in advance, and there is no maybe, might be, could be, about it. These guys are much much worse than the Nazids were in say, 1936 or 1937.

    Why do leftists, and leading Jews, refuse to understand this?

  2. ChrisPer

    Why do leftists, and leading Jews, refuse to understand this?

    Judging by what I read of America and Canada from Mark Steyn and Ezra Levant, you repeated yourself redundantly there.

  3. Token

    With ISIS we are dealing with very rational people who are seeking power, first in the Middle East but also anywhere else they can. It is a global operation spreading with fantastic success.

    Yes, it is the same cold calculating rationality using the sane strong horse logic the Nazis used with fantastic success. There are enough souls with darkness within them, there will always be such types.

    Both groups depend on the domrstic left to divide & neuter the people who would stand against their rationalised killing. As the domestic left operate from the same debased moral framework.

  4. rickw

    I do not know where their drive for power and dominance comes from but it is not “irrational”.

    It is entirely rational, and it is entirely based on the Koran.

    ISIS are not new, the world has been subject to 1400 years of ISIS-like organisations courtesy of Islam. The reason most aren’t aware of this is that Colonialism had put a significant crimp in this activity.

  5. Sydney Boy

    Here’s my advice, Robert. You should back this Prime Minister to the hilt because whoever may be the next one is unlikely to take ISIS as seriously as Tony Abbott, and it will not matter which side of politics forms the next government for this to be true.

    Here’s my advice, Robert. If an ALP and Greens coalition are the next Commonwealth government of Australia, expect the nation of Israel to be attacked and pilloried, and the Palestinian “cause” to be pushed and promoted to the detriment of Israel and the Jewish people. Antisemitism will become the norm, and further divestment and hate campaigns against Jewish people, products, and companies will occur. You only need to look at the current shenanigans pushed by the NTEU and Sydney University’s Jake Lynch to see where the left want to go.

    You have been warned.

  6. john constantine

    The baby boomer, upper middle class Jewish Australian will vote left to fit in with the other people in their work lunchroom.

    Imagine being a Jew in their abc staffroom, and being known to vote tory.

    Antisemitism in Australia is the subtle ‘twitternacht’, that is more relentless and neverending than one night of physical breaking glass.

  7. cynical1

    The “Industrial scale” came later, when shooting rows of people and pushing them into trenches
    was too inefficient.

    Both had similar starts at mass murder.

    Only being bone headed morons will stop ISIS.

    You think if they had gas chambers they wouldn’t use them on homos, Christians, Shites, Kurds etc etc?

  8. Tel

    So the Nazis did murder larger numbers of their own citizens than ISIS has (so far), cannot disagree there. The communists (Stalin & Mao) murdered even greater numbers than the Nazis could do, and those murderous regimes stayed in power a lot longer. You don’t hear so much outrage about that though.

  9. Tel

    By the way, don’t you love the way Putin is heading to the Middle East on the basis of “fighting ISIS” which is supposed to be what the Western powers are doing over there. Oh lookie! He is helping us!

    Except of course, the real purpose of US involvement is bringing down Asad, and the not so hidden objective of Putin is to make sure that doesn’t happen. Don’t bother trying to find anyone with clean hands.

  10. ar

    The problem with constantly identifying ISIS as an evil death cult is that it makes any refugee claims irrefutable.

  11. ella

    There is a common thread running through socialism, multiculturalism, communism, Marxism and Islam. Ultimately, all subscribe to the Ideology of Collectivism.

    Obama is a social justice warrior; a collectivist. Pope Francis is a collectivist.

    All those who subscribe to the Ideology of Collectivism recognise each other instantly.

    Communism: from the Latin root communis which means group living.

    Fascism: from the Italian word fascio translated as “bundle” or “group.”

    Multiculturalism: the emphasis changes from the rights of the individual to the rights of the “group.”

    Islam: individuals are not important; all individuals serve the collective; the group, in order to maintain it.

    All aspects of life and society are controlled by the collective ideology. In secular collective ideology we serve the State. The State starts to strangle the individual; it starts to regulates everything, becoming authoritarian, and then totalitarian. It is the same with the collective Theocracy of Islam.

    All collectivists believe in a one-world government of one sort of another, for example the Caliphate. And all collectivists are totalitarians. Ultimately, those of us who survive, are all driven into poverty, the middle class eventually disappears, only the ruling totalitarian elite prosper.

    This is the world of the collectivist.

  12. john constantine

    Famine will be the real force multiplier for isis.

    Few fundemental activists go tothe promised land of childbrothels to grow crops.

    After a growing season or two of isis sweeping through the farms of their enemies, taking the seed grain and slaughtering the breeding stock to feed their supporters, the impact on food supply will show up.

    Either there will be an expansion of the area over which farms will be raided, or food aid will be demanded, or a wave of displaced persons will be sent to Europe, or the enemies of isis will die like the starved enemies of stalin and mao and pol pot and mugabe and…………

  13. MichaelL

    A few “facts”. Jews in Australia overwhelmingly support the coalition. Apart from being one, I give out Liberal how to vote papers in Wentworth and can recognise the many Jewish voters – nearly all of whom, take just one paper, the Liberal one, with them to vote.

    Robert Goot has been a good leader for the Jewish Community – which is very sensitive about use of the Holocaust in general discussion.

    But Robert and a proportion of the lay leadership are, – in contrast to their “constituents” – (mild) leftists – who may have absorbed the apparent automatic disdain – at best , for Tony Abbott – which allows them to make totally self damaging (and Community damaging) outbursts.

    I believe that Robert has gone too far and should resign his position – but bear in mind that he has been a very effective spokesman for the Jewish Community – including its massive Zionist support for Israel. But the more important you are, the more thought should be applied. Does Robert really want to deal with Tanya rather than Tony?

  14. nfw

    A weasel words apology. What would he rather have: Lie-bor’s open muslim border policy or Abbott’s controlled policy? Now let me see, which group just mentioned hates Jews with a vengeance? They (gays, “progressives”, now at least one Australian Jew, et al) all are lining up with their enemies waiting to be destroyed.

  15. Dr Faustus

    ISIS is actively herding the people it has displaced into Europe – and following with them, camouflaged in the confusion.

    The human and cultural atrocities are a cold rational tool. The new European migrants know exactly that ISIS is amongst them and what they are capable of doing. The next steps will be murder-porn killings of muslims in European countries to drive home the message that: not supporting the Caliphate = apostasy; apostates die just as horribly and remorselessly in Frankfurt as in Raqqa; and European governments are powerless to do anything about the fact. Backed up with promises to visit relatives in Syria and Iraq.

    And suddenly ISIS has a motivated jihad embedded in Europe.

  16. Toiling Mass

    The Nazis have so much been identified as evil (which, of course, they were) that they have become ‘all’ evil. Nothing might not be attributed to them so long as it is evil.

    The result is this fixed polar point in the immoral firmament is the assumption that no other ideology can be more evil.

    I fully take Abbott’s point about not ranking evil – which is kind of my point. The ideology of ISIS is evil. If they lack the logistics and infrastructure that is not some virtue (nor permanent) that just means it is manifested in different ways.

    We could be overtaken by great evil one day, and people would not realise until too late because they weren’t Nazi-looking enough.

  17. Roger

    You should back this Prime Minister to the hilt because whoever may be the next one is unlikely to take ISIS as seriously as Tony Abbott, and it will not matter which side of politics forms the next government for this to be true.

    There is also good probability that the next PM – unless it is Scott Morrison – will allow large numbers of Muslim immigrants into the country. If I were Jew, I would think long and hard about that prospect and what it might mean for my children and grandchildren.

  18. WTF?

    Jews are safer in Australia than they are in Israel.

  19. Roger

    Interestingly, I assume Goot still has not read or watched what Tony Abbott actually said, and has since repeated: namely that he NEVER said IS was worse than the Nazis. This is a lie instigated by the MSM and perpetuated by Goot’s “apology”. When the Left can’t win an argument, they simply lie.
    The Other Roger

  20. JohnA

    ar #1787908, posted on September 7, 2015 at 8:04 am

    The problem with constantly identifying ISIS as an evil death cult is that it makes any refugee claims irrefutable.

    Not so. There is a large slab of territory next-door to the conflict, under the control of various Mulsim-dominated Sheikdoms and republics, with a lot of oil money in their treasuries, and not a refugee in sight.

    A refugee is one who seeks sanctuary in the nearest available safe haven. Turkey is currently safe haven for a lot of refugees from the Syrian civil war/conflict/ISI incursion.

    Any move after that is plain migration – especially if a person seeks “the good life”, better-paying work or a good dentist.

    Be careful how you bend the meaning of words. You may suffer the Big Brother consequences of Newspeak.

  21. closeapproximation

    I think it’s pretty bloody obvious that ISIS would send not only Jews but many other cohorts to a worse death than gas chambers if it only it could. So it hasn’t quite managed 6 million yet, thanks, but so what ?. Talk about missing the point entirely.

    But it’s worse than just missing the point. It is wilful unprincipled ignorance, like Steve says. Talk about fiddling while Rome burns.

  22. ar

    JohnA,

    Any move after that is plain migration

    Sure, as long as you or I are doing the assessing.

    By all means call them a death cult to make the case to carpet bomb the shit out of them, “they’re a death cult, they love it”. But otherwise, in the end, it just gives activists ammunition in their calls to accept any and all refugees.

  23. Boambee John

    john constantine
    #1787899, posted on September 7, 2015 at 7:43 am
    The baby boomer, upper middle class Jewish Australian will vote left to fit in with the other people in their work lunchroom.

    Imagine being a Jew in their abc staffroom, and being known to vote tory.

    Antisemitism in Australia is the subtle ‘twitternacht’, that is more relentless and neverending than one night of physical breaking glass.

    We have the secret ballot in Australia, they can say what they like in the lunchrooms, if they are that desperate for the approval of people who would happily consign them to the gas chambers, but vote sensibly in the polling booth.

  24. Ralph

    But why does he even need to make the comparison? Why is it important to be comparing one type of evil with another? It’s almost universally accepted that ISIS is evil. What good does it do comparing it to the Nazis? The Coalition already owns national security and had no need to over-egg it to try and draw a response from Labor. This was unnecessary overreach.

  25. Roger

    But why does he even need to make the comparison?

    The point of the comparison was to highlight the shamelessness of IS.
    There is evil which seeks to conceal its true nature and there is evil which is shameless.
    The former at least pays a twisted tribute to the existence of civilised values, while the latter is beyond the pale. Abbott was attempting to convey just what the civilised world faces in IS.

  26. a reader

    A comparison between the two. When the Nazis threatened the liberty of Europe and the broader world, young men laid down their lives to protect the freedom of their people. When ISIS threatens the liberty of the Arabian Peninsula, the young men run away.

  27. Simon

    The real question is whether Tony is as serious about ISIS as he was about balancing the budget and cutting back spending 3 years ago?

    I agree that ISIS must be destroyed. I am not at all certain that anything this government does or says is ever going to help much.

  28. rickw

    The problem with constantly identifying ISIS as an evil death cult is that it makes any refugee claims irrefutable.

    They are not escaping ISIS, they are effectively an advanced guard, whilst most are probably not directly affiliated with ISIS, if ISIS starts to score on the continent, I know who’s side they will be on.

    Most of them are male and do not originate from within 1000km of ISIS held territory, why are the doing this now? They sense that the pendulum is swinging, and that they have a one-off opportunity to flood their way into Europe, and maybe even become its masters.

  29. .

    If you’re 40, never shot a gun, don’t own a gun and can see your army fleeing or they used to torture you and have nothing but rusted old Nornico/Paki knock off AK47s, what motive or means have you got to enlist or create a posse comitatus?

    Consider also that the ISIS High Command consists of some former Ba’athist officers from Iraq and Syria.

    The situation warrants intervention (and I think those who backed the Arab Spring are morally bound to this, but also must appear so to minimise blowback), although it might be best for Turkey and Jordan to help their hopeless Iraqi “allies”.

    The USA and her allies (including us) could intervene and destroy ISIS, but what is the exist strategy other than a pure search and destroy mission and quick exit?

  30. Ralph

    The real question is whether Tony is as serious about ISIS as he was about balancing the budget and cutting back spending 3 years ago?

    I’ll tell you what he’s not serious about – balancing the budget.
    He’s deadly serious about stopping the boats and opposing SSM, wind farms and serious action on climate change. They are his passions. As for the rest, he doesn’t give two hoots and he’ll bend according to the political breeze of the day. I’d say he’s half-hearted on the war on ISIS. If public opinion turned against it, he’d drop it like a hot potato.

  31. Ralph

    The USA and her allies (including us) could intervene and destroy ISIS, but what is the exist strategy other than a pure search and destroy mission and quick exit?

    Exactly. An exit strategy is needed to ensure we’re not just creating bigger problems down the track. The most I look at it, the more I think that the only real viable long term solution would be outright US colonisation of Iraq, Syria and Afghanistan. Just take the whole thing over and run it like a state. Anything less just leaves a vaccum for more baddies to arise in the place of ISIS. Very difficult situation indeed.

  32. Viva

    I do not know where their drive for power and dominance comes from

    The dark side of the Force.

  33. Paridell

    Mr Abbott’s concession to the Nazis that “they had a sufficient sense of shame to try to hide it” is one more reason, in an endless list, why politicians and others should not make statements on the Nazis unless they really know what they are talking about. The Nazis carried out their racial schemes in secret because it was easier that way, not because they were ashamed of them. Here is Himmler addressing SS leaders in Posen, 1943:

    Most of you know what it means to see a hundred corpses lying together, five hundred, or a thousand. To have gone through this and yet – apart from a few exceptions, examples of human weakness – to have remained decent fellows, this is what has made us hard. This is a glorious page in our history that has never been written and shall never be written.

    To Himmler, the page was not ‘shameful’, it was glorious. What was shameful — indeed “a crime against our own blood” — was allowing Jews and other subhumans to live and potentially marry Germans. To the Nazi mind, that was the very definition of shame – Rassenschande, “racial shame.”

    Concepts such as these are so alien and offensive to us that they are difficult even to mention in public. That is why the anodyne song “Tomorrow Belongs To Me” was written for the movie Cabaret. A genuine Nazi song, with lyrics like “when Jewish blood spurts under the knife,” could never have seen the light of day in a Liza Minnelli vehicle or any other Hollywood movie.

    Mr Abbott meant well, but he was wrong and Mr Goot was right. The next Aussie MP who wants to mention the Nazis should make good and sure that he knows what he’s talking about, or keep quiet.

  34. @SeditionaryI

    ISIS/ISIL wouldn’t last 5 minutes if we could only do to them what we actually did the the Nazis…

  35. Yohan

    I agree this was another media beatup that unfairly misrepresented Abbott. But lets deal with reality, don’t fucking break Godwin’s law. As soon as you make any Nazi analogy, people just roll their eyes, no matter how smart or accurate it is.

    It doesn’t matter that Abbot was misrepresented, it’s yet another example of his incompetent media strategizing. This is not the first time he has broken Godwin’s law.

    The words ‘Nazi’ and ‘Holocaust’ need to be removed from any political leaders vocabulary (except when kissing the ring of the local Jewish organizations), but Abbott is too stubborn to take common sense advice.

  36. Godwin’s law

    As the number of comments on a thread draws closer to 100, so too does the chance of one commenter calling another commenter a “nazi” approach 100%.

  37. Paul

    Except of course, the real purpose of US involvement is bringing down Asad, and the not so hidden objective of Putin is to make sure that doesn’t happen. Don’t bother trying to find anyone with clean hands.”

    Only smart comment so far.

    ISIS is the straw-man by which Assad is to be brought down. Its all in the Yinon Plan, brought to you by those-who-must-not-be-named, and which is still proceeding as intended. Did anyone really think a fully formed army, complete with equipment and logistics could just appear out of the desert like that with no one knowing?

  38. @SeditionaryI

    Paul, Putin’s (Embrace The Putin, Become The Putin) aims are simple, keep ISIS out of Turkey, and to do that he needs Assad to remain in power for as long as possible. Russia can ill afford to have ISIS spread along its Southern Frontiers, it has enough trouble with the insurgencies it is already fighting there, and it doesn’t want them all to unite under an ISIS/ISIL flag.

    Obama’s aims are simple, play as much golf as possible between now and when Hillary takes over.

  39. Paridell

    For those wondering about the post from Paul…

    Q. What is the Yinon Plan?
    A. The 21st century version of the Protocols of the Elders of Zion.

    In other words, it is the latest fabricated Jewish-conspiracy document.

  40. Yohan

    Pat Buchanan was saying as soon as the Iran deal was finalised the establishment would then move to take down Assad. He said to look for the war drums to start beating in the media, and they did right on cue, but did not gain much traction.

    There is no doubt this new bombing coalition has been formed with the main intent to attack Assad and ISIs, kill two birds with one stone. And there is no doubt that’s why Putin has rushed advanced weaponry such as planes and probably missile defence into Syria, to provide an air screen for the regime.

    Its a bizarre geopolitical game. Why would we support a secular police state dictatorship such as Egypt, but at the same time want to take down a similar regime in Syria? Oh wait, we know why….

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