Medicare Fraud

From the Herald Sun’s front page:

ROYAL Children’s Hospital doctors are defying the Federal Government following showdowns with the Immigration Department over the return of children to detention centres.

Distressed about the welfare of dozens of patients brought to the hospital while housed in Australian immigration detention centres, RCH staff are demanding the Federal Government ceases locking children in detention.

The Sunday Herald Sun understands matters escalated this year when a child with a range of health issues was transferred from a detention centre, prompting a standoff of more than a month while doctors said they could not clinically discharge the patient.

While I have a lot of sympathy to the notion that mandatory detention is morally dubious, I also think that misuse of public resources for political purposes is fraud. Medical doctors prescribing medical treatment for political purposes and that are not medically required excludes actually ill people from access to those medical resources.

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81 Responses to Medicare Fraud

  1. Ros

    They should stop watching MASH.

  2. Bruce of Newcastle

    I agree that relocating the children to a detention camp is not a good idea. I am sure they would do much better at home in their country of origin, so should be sent there instead.

  3. Leigh Lowe

    It also begs the question as to whether the child of a tax-paying citizen of this country will have treatment compromised because a bed is occupied by the child of an asylum-shopper with no medical condition.

  4. Amused

    Any doctor found to be rorting Medicare like this should be immediately suspended from their duties pending a criminal trial.

  5. Neil

    I thought most/all children had been released from detention by now.

    And how come these doctors were not protesting when Labor had 2,000 kids locked up? Or do children only get sick when the Coalition is in power.?

  6. 1234

    Bullshit Sinclair. You have simply jumped to a conclusion because you don’t have the facts. You are just trying to inflame the situation and cater to the prejudices of those who will now crawl out from under their rocks. Par for the course here – dog whistle central.

  7. Lily

    I take it these compassionate people would also be holding on to abused and injured Aboriginal children too, if they are holding onto children who are traumatized by parameter fencing and tropical palms. Oh that’s right, horror abuses of Aboriginal children are just a figment of the imagination of the right wing nutters.

  8. Gab

    I thought most/all children had been released from detention by now.

    Correct. Down from 2,000 to about 100 since 2013 when Abbott was elected.

    And how come these doctors were not protesting when Labor had 2,000 kids locked up? Or do children only get sick when the Coalition is in power.?

    No, doctors only protest when Libs are in power.

  9. Hydra

    All children currently in detention are only there because the child has chosen to stay AND/OR the parents of the child will not let the child leave.

    Their own fault.

    Not our problem.

  10. Andrew

    Open borders with no consequences for illegal entry in a deliberate attempt to violate the Migration Act and bringing your children along is morally dubious. Just as it’s morally dubious to bring your kids if you’re planning on stealing a car, or robbing a bank or blowing up a Shi’ite mosque in a suicide bombing.

  11. .

    Medicare fraud is much, much bigger than this.

    It should be abolished.

  12. Alfonso

    Bugger, if the Nauru economically /religiously motivated illegals had cheque books with substantial funds the Liberts would encourage unlimited numbers.
    At a pinch you’d think the Muslim Brotherhood or Hamas could do a sausage sizzle for the readies.

  13. .

    It’s alright Alfonso, you think if they have a Cert II in ditch digging they’re suitable, and you’re too clever for most people, who are too stupid to own a gun etc.

    Yep Alfonso, you’re really a champion of liberty.

  14. What do we mean by ‘children’ here? 17 year olds? 12? 4? 25 year olds with no papers but a smooth face and a Koran that tells them it is ok to lie to and deceive infidels? What do we mean by ‘detention centre’? Christmas Island for example is like a holiday camp with everything provided. Manus may not be as comfortable but even there the conditions exceed those of many ordinary islanders. And why ‘advocate’ just for ‘cheeeeldren”? Are all people not equal before the Law? The law which the disregarded when coming here illegally. Hey, here’s an idea…. why not send them all to the outback, to a ‘station’ somewhere remote, where ‘ordinary’ taxpaying Australians live, with no swimming pool, no supermarket, no hospital, no free food , no dentist, no caqfe, no bus service, no anything not provided by the sweat and hard work of those who are there. etc.

  15. Bugme

    Its funny that doctors don’t show the same compassion when a foreign trained doctor wants to practice medicine in Australia. No the AMA shuts up shop and and wont let them work. Total hypocrites the lot of them.

  16. Alfonso

    It’s all too exciting, I can’t wait until Dave leads with his chin next election. Unlimited immigration numbers from anywhere if they can pay or someone pays for them. Go the sausage sizzlers.

  17. Mick Gold Coast QLD

    mandatory detention

    deciding, unilaterally, on my behalf that giving money, near unlimited social and health support, citizenship for every claimed relative from the country of origin and eventually much of my country to ignorant, uneducated, dishonest, fanaticist chancers who demand I shut up when they invade and swiftly take over

    “is morally dubious” at the very least.

  18. Difficult. Kids should not be in hellhole detention centres, but kids should not be separated from their parents either – as they must be in this case. Conclusion: just get the rest of the refugee claims processed so these awful places can be closed down for good.

  19. .

    Alfonso
    #1823768, posted on October 11, 2015 at 3:14 pm
    It’s all too exciting, I can’t wait until Dave leads with his chin next election. Unlimited immigration numbers from anywhere if they can pay or someone pays for them. Go the sausage sizzlers.

    That’s not what the policy is you pathetic, dishonest turd.

    People should make up their own mind than listen to your nonsense.

    http://ldp.org.au/index.php/policies/1156-immigration

  20. john constantine

    Which exposes a mindset that can use moral relativism to place entire settlement communities in the hands of their welfare industry.

    There is no truth, there are no facts [as squaleed waleed lectures us] there is only the political outcome.

    If putting an entire voteherd on medicare/welfare progresses the correct political outcome, it cannot be wrong.

  21. Des Deskperson

    Under the Victorian Medical Specialist Enterprise Agreement 2013, the lowest level medical specialist – Specialist Year 1 – at the RCH currently earns a base salary of around $190,000 p.a if they are employed full time. This doesn’t include the employer superannuation contribution or a variety of other perks, including 27,000 pa to advance their medical education. More senior doctors are paid considerable more – a specialist year 9 pulls in a base salary of around $300,000 pa.

    While I have no problems with these rates, you would think that people on his level of remuneration and fired by compassion could pass around a hat among themselves and their rich friends and clients to fund some sort of private respite care or other support facilities for these, err, kiddies. I’m sure it could be made tax-deductible, would meet their goal of embarrassing the government, engender a good deal of moral pride and let the RCH get on with its real work.

  22. Alfonso

    Stop lying Dotty, for the LDP if you have the money and no criminal record as disclosed by the first rate institutions in the Middle East and Interpol you’re in. In unlimited numbers.
    Tears before bedtime, Dave’s finished when he gets somewhere else on the ballot
    I’m curious, do the sponsored 3rd world muslims so imported have to wait longer for their LDP concealed carry handgun permits available to all who aren’t diagnosed psyche/criminals? If they do it’s clearly unacceptable discrimination and Dave must address at a press conference it immediately.

  23. Zatara

    RCH staff are demanding the Federal Government ceases locking children in detention.

    The truth emerges.

  24. Boambee John

    Amfortas
    #1823765, posted on October 11, 2015 at 3:03 pm
    What do we mean by ‘children’ here? 17 year olds? 12? 4? 25 year olds with no papers but a smooth face and a Koran that tells them it is ok to lie to and deceive infidels? …
    Hey, here’s an idea…. why not send them all to the outback, to a ‘station’ somewhere remote, where ‘ordinary’ taxpaying Australians live, with no swimming pool, no supermarket, no hospital, no free food , no dentist, no caqfe, no bus service, no anything not provided by the sweat and hard work of those who are there. etc.

    Each of these doctors should be asked to sponsor such a ‘child’ in their own home (with a modest government stipend to assist with costs).

    They would be responsible for the care of the child, maintaining communications with the parent, and (subject to forfeutire of a suitable bond, and criiminal prosecution if they fail) for the routine availability of thr child to Immigration officers.

  25. ella

    “Men must love and be loyal to their families and their people in order to preserve them. Only if they think their own things are good can they rest content with them. A father must prefer his child to other children, a citizen his country to others. That is why there are myths – to justify these attachments. And a man needs a place and opinions by which to orient himself. This is strongly asserted by those who talk about roots. The problem of getting along with outsiders is secondary to, and sometimes in conflict with, having an inside, a people, a culture, a way of life. A very great narrowness is not incompatible with the health of an individual or a people, whereas with great openness it is hard to avoid decomposition.”

    Allan Bloom: ” The Closing of the American Mind”

    The opening of the borders in Europe?

  26. Eyrie

    What’s morally dubious is people who, by any international definition aren’t “refugees”, breaking in to our country. Not our problem.

  27. Kool Aid Kid

    Doctors are entitled to decide when a patient may be discharged. It is a pity that these folk conflated the issue with detention policy. I wholly agree that kids should not be in those places and for that definition I’d be liberal as to the age of the kids. God knows what they may have experienced.

  28. Alfonso

    Send the LDP some copies of that ella. They don’t get a single thing therein.

  29. Snoopy

    Why is it that lefties never miss a dog whistle?

  30. Harry Buttle

    Because, Snoopy, if you can hear the dog whistle, you’re the dog.

  31. S'

    Difficult. Kids should not be in hellhole detention centres, but kids should not be separated from their parents either – as they must be in this case. Conclusion: just get the rest of the refugee claims processed so these awful places can be closed down for good.

    Processing “refugees” is nigh impossible when so many threw away any documentation they had once they got to Indonesia (correction – flown). Consider the case of Captain Emad (?) who got revealed as a smuggler after being here a few years. I doubt their tales are held to serious scrutiny, or that the Immi. dept has the resources.

    The people detained probably didn’t register with the UNHCR in Indonesia, they know their chances are good in gaming Oz.

  32. Hydra

    While I have no problems with these rates, you would think that people on his level of remuneration and fired by compassion could pass around a hat among themselves and their rich friends and clients to fund some sort of private respite care or other support facilities for these, err, kiddies. I’m sure it could be made tax-deductible, would meet their goal of embarrassing the government, engender a good deal of moral pride and let the RCH get on with its real work.

    Too much seeming not enough doing Des

    Unforch government tax take so high that nobody wants to donate to anything

  33. Sparkx

    Found the article on the ALPBC web. RCH consultant paediatrician Dr Kate Thomson-Bowe (reminds me of Hanson-young) reckons “The environment of a detention centre is so far from what develops normal opportunity, the families don’t have the opportunity to play together, the children are subject to rules and regulations that no typical child is subjected to.”
    I would have thought the parents had all day to play with, and educate, their children – if they wanted to.

  34. .

    Alfonso just lying his arse off again.

    You’re below contempt you lying shithead.

  35. B Shaw

    It isn’t our problem; it’s unfortunate, but the parents have put the child in danger in the first place and should return home with their offspring.

  36. Sparkx

    And yes, isn’t it amazing that these protests only occur under a liberal government when the centres are gradually being emptied but not when the labor lot are busy filling them up.

  37. Ever since they stopped bone density testing there’s a lot more minors in detention. They’re probably being treated for osteoarthritis and cataracts. No worries, clock it on their medicare card and private insurer.

  38. Alfonso

    Be a good Champion and answer the question Dotty:
    Do the sponsored 3rd world muslims so imported under LDP policy have to wait longer for their LDP concealed carry handgun permits available to all who aren’t diagnosed psyche/criminals? If they do it’s clearly unacceptable discrimination and Dave must address that at a press conference immediately.

  39. Anthony

    Fairfax media believes that there are no asylum-seeking children doing an Assange in the hospital. How many asylum-seeking children have been treated in the RCH?
    Unless this situation is resolved immediately, I will withdraw $1000 per child from my annual Good Friday Appeal donation. After all, it wasn’t the son of allah who died that day!

  40. Bugme

    Would love to know the opinion of RCH doctors on mothers who drop there kids off a child care centre, from months of age, surrounded by barb wire fences 10 – 12 hrs a day etc. What is the psychological effect, what are you thoughts on their detention????

  41. nilk

    Very good point, Bugme. Long daycare is an abomination and should be outlawed.

  42. Sinclair Davidson

    Alfonso – your comments are OT.

  43. Alfonso

    Noted, started with Nauru, open borders and got hard to answer for a Libert. As usual.

  44. blogstrop

    OT? How about junior math 1234?

    Bullshit Sinclair. You have simply jumped to a conclusion because you don’t have the facts. You are just trying to inflame the situation and cater to the prejudices of those who will now crawl out from under their rocks. Par for the course here – dog whistle central.

  45. Baldrick

    No surprises here, since the AMA is presided over by well renowned leftard Professor Brian Owler, who said recently, “Well, the AMA made its position quite clear back in December 2011 when my predecessor outlined the fact that we needed to get children out of detention. ”

    In 2011 there were closed to 2,000 children in detention. Now there are about 100. That’s a 95% reduction.

  46. Richard H

    A problem with a simple answer: the Government announces that it will refuse to transfer any child from detention to a hospital while the ban remains in place (all medical treatment to take place in the detention centre). Of course, the Government would need to grow a spine first, and medical science hasn’t yet figured out how to do that.

  47. mr skeletor

    Dot use to be worth reading. Now he seems to have gone troppo.
    Forget the LDP, Canning should have shown you they were done.

  48. Neil

    Not only did the ALP lock up 2,000 kids they provided no education facilities on Christmas Island. It was not until Morrison did something about it did the kids have proper schooling

    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-07-24/christmas-island-children-asylum-seekerswetting-bed-flashbacks/5620202

    There is one hope, according to Professor Triggs – the children will soon be able to go to school.
    Professor Triggs says the Government has responded to her request for education for the children.

    It appears these Doctors must have not noticed these things until the Coalition got elected. With 2,000 kids locked up there must have been lots of kids requiring medial attention under Rudd/Gillard

  49. Geriatric Mayfly

    I was looking for mention of that Owler chappie Baldrick and you gave him a guernsey. He will cling to any rung on the ladder that elevate his chances of a safe Labor seat.

  50. Rabz

    Medicare Fraud

    LOL. Like Medibank/Care hasn’t been perpetually defrauded from the second it was introduced.

    The rebadged Doctors Reform Society and various parasitic ciphers have merely exploited a new angle.

  51. Walter Plinge

    I reckon the doctors’ wives are behind this.

    Might adversely affect the Good Friday Appeal too, if it’s still on then.

  52. rickw

    Did it ever occur to these idiots that the children are mere expendable leverage to the illegal immigrants?

  53. "Up The Workers!"

    Isn’t it touching to see such heart-warming care and compassion for vulnerable young children from a bunch of left-wing multi-millionaires from the abortionists’ profession.

  54. .

    mr skeletor
    #1823837, posted on October 11, 2015 at 5:17 pm
    Dot use to be worth reading. Now he seems to have gone troppo.
    Forget the LDP, Canning should have shown you they were done.

    Hilariously, days later, most “conservative” commentators here advised putting the ALP last, not even ahead of the Greens.

    I’m somewhat confused as to who has gone troppo and why.

    (It’s not even buildup yet).

  55. H B Bear

    Just another glorious day in the CFMEU puppet regime of Victoriastan.

  56. Angry God

    A comment from the doctor, no obvious political motive to be seen anywhere.

    No Bias Here

  57. Alfonso

    “I’m somewhat confused as to who has gone troppo and why”
    OT, but ok. Good, I’ll take it as a standard setter.
    Dotty comes across as road rage unstable, I seem to remember he claims to be a licenced firearm owner.
    Here’s a tip Dotty. These pages get collected and surveilled. LFAOs have been harassed for less. Do yourself a favour….. find a girlfriend.

  58. .

    Advice from functionally illiterate trolls on the net. What a wonderful time to be alive.

  59. Mick Gold Coast QLD

    From Kool Aid Kid at 3:50 pm:

    “Doctors are entitled to decide when a patient may be discharged. It is a pity that these folk conflated the issue with detention policy. I wholly agree that kids should not be in those places and for that definition I’d be liberal as to the age of the kids. God knows what they may have experienced.”

    After the evening meal in Smellystan:
    Abdul: “It seems the fighting continues 700 miles to the north, across the border in TheOtherStan.”
    Fatima: “Must be awful for them, really.”
    Abdul: “It would be nice to find somewhere with some sugar on the table.”
    Fatima: “Australia looks nice at this time of the year dear.”
    Abdul: “I’ll burn my parole papers in the morning, then, along with that silly home detention monitoring bracelet.”</em

    Quite horrid Kool Aid Kid I'm sure.

  60. Alfonso

    Chin up Dotty, Champion.
    You’re Dave’s valued advisor, what could possibly go wrong for the LDP?

  61. Mick Gold Coast QLD

    From Angry God at 7:09 pm:

    “A comment from the doctor, no obvious political motive to be seen anywhere.

    No Bias Here”

    There has never been a more exciting time to be a doctor than today, yesterday, last year and every year before. You don’t even have to send the gummint an invoice for all the patients you say that you see, they put the easy money straight into your account ‘n all.

  62. Austin Mangosteen

    Children’s doctors who have a political bent ought to take a leave out of Ben Carson’s biography.
    Ben Carson pulls no punches and knows how to kick people in the teeth. (And, would you believe, he is not a dental surgeon looking for work.) This guys a pediatric neurosurgeon who wants to perform some surgery on the spinal cord of American politics; evidently the country is suffering from issues to do with backbone. Neurosurgeon Brian Owler might learn something, too, if he is humble enough.

  63. Austin Mangosteen

    Children’s doctors who have a political bent ought to take a leaf out of Ben Carson’s biography.
    Ben Carson pulls no punches and knows how to kick people in the teeth. (And, would you believe, he is not a dental surgeon looking for work.) This guys a pediatric neurosurgeon who wants to perform some surgery on the spinal cord of American politics; evidently the country is suffering from issues to do with backbone. Neurosurgeon Brian Owler might learn something, too, if he is humble enough.

  64. Roger

    a standoff of more than a month while doctors said they could not clinically discharge the patient.

    That aspect of the report is disingenuous.

    Quite evidently they could discharge the children on purely clinical grounds, but refuse to do so in order to make a political point because we have a LNP government that may be embarrassed by it.

    Doctors are entitled to political opinions, but not at the expense of the Medicare levy payer. And, as Leigh Lowe remarked, what of those children of citizens who may need a hospital bed in the meantime?

    This is political grandstanding masquerading as compassion.

  65. candy

    Doctors release damaged and injured children back to homes when they are suspicious of abuse occurring or parents not coping / on drugs etc.

    Perhaps they should keep those kids too, and not just concentrate on keeping the children from detention centres.

    It’s a terrible situation but I’m not sure it’s ethical to lock up a children in hospital and giving no say to the mother in the detention centre who must be desperate to have her child back and think the child might be dying in hospital, being there that long. Who can say what the mother knows or is told?

  66. Quibbler

    Candy, it is very likely that at least one parent would accompany the child to hospital and remain with them.

  67. Crossie

    Doctors release damaged and injured children back to homes when they are suspicious of abuse occurring or parents not coping / on drugs etc.

    Perhaps they should keep those kids too, and not just concentrate on keeping the children from detention centres.

    That particular action could get them into trouble with the lefty commentariat who would scream racism and bigotry. Besides, there would be no work for armies of social workers.

  68. Perfidious Albino

    But apparently video-conferenced appointments are just fine for the rest of us (according to Dr Kate).

    http://blogs.rch.org.au/news/2014/05/07/world-class-medical-care-for-kids-only-a-a-video-link-away/

  69. gabrianga

    Dear 1234 please let us know how you are coping with the children you have given a home to and perhaps a clue as to whether you get additional welfare for such an act of sympathy.?

  70. JohnA

    Roger #1823950, posted on October 11, 2015 at 8:01 pm

    a standoff of more than a month while doctors said they could not clinically discharge the patient.

    That aspect of the report is disingenuous.

    This is political grandstanding masquerading as compassion.

    It is always masquerading as compassion.

  71. Barry

    Child abuse and neglect in Indigenous Australian communities

    Accurate statistics about the incidence of child abuse and other family violence in Aboriginal communities are scarce (Bolger 1991). Although the statistics that are available are imperfect, they are sufficient to demonstrate that the occurrence of violence in Indigenous communities and among Indigenous people ‘is disproportionately high in comparison to the rates of the same types of violence in the Australian population as a whole’ (Memmott, Stacy, Chambers and Keys 2001: 6). O’Donoghue (2001: 15) illustrates the extent of the problem of family violence, noting that many Indigenous children are growing up in communities where violence has become ‘a normal and ordinary part of life’.

    I’m trying to remember when I last heard of doctors refusing to release an indigenous child back into an abusive environment.

    Let me see now: it was probably on the last occasion we heard a Greens politician addressing this issue, rather than obsessing over illegals. Never!

  72. Des Deskperson

    As the RCH’s own site boasts, the hospital is affiliated with and shares facilities with the Murdoch Childrens’ Research Institute.

    Presumably the good RCH doctors are comfortable with this, despite the fact that, as every ‘progressive’ knows. it’s Murdoch money and influence that put this government into power and therefore shares a good deal of responsibility for its mistreatment of refugees.

  73. Jessie

    Barry at 8.03

    I’m trying to remember when I last heard of doctors refusing to release an indigenous child back into an abusive environment.

    The content of the paper you have posted states the extraordinary rates of violence and abuse are a direct consequence of colonialism, lack of regard for differing cultural practices, racism, excessive alcohol consumption and lack of funding. The report’s bibliography most recent reference is 2003. With the exception of pouring billions of $aid into dysfunctional models premised on falsehoods much has moved on in a circular fashion since these times. The AMA, Medicare items and the journalists of The Australian have not moved on either 🙂

  74. .

    Alfonso
    #1823932, posted on October 11, 2015 at 7:43 pm
    Chin up Dotty, Champion.
    You’re Dave’s valued advisor, what could possibly go wrong for the LDP?

    Good times eh little buddy. We have a mayor and a Senator. You will never get elected.

    The system works.

  75. Jessie

    Pardon,
    Itemisation of medicare benefits schedule for race-based consults/procedures has certainly moved on. Quite a booming industry.

  76. Jessie

    Des Deskperson
    The RCH Melbourne is a PPP scheme.
    Here is the lengthy summary of this amazing 1billion investment. Which 2013 media reports as not being able to deal with emergency and medium waiting list (surgery) children.

    Perhaps the doctors wives and research noddles are wanting the old buildings left so as to set up a new commune? Saves on travel. And NHMRC supports and invests millions in groovy grants based on race and culture. You will be entertained reading that children having visitation rights to zoo and scienceworks and cinema. Possibly the mosque? For spiritual health?

  77. 1234

    You see Sinclair. They have all crawled out from under their rocks, citing idiotic comparisons, non sequiturs and other spurious racist arguments. What a following you have!

  78. 1234

    Sinclair, any advance on your assertion of, “prescribing medical treatment for political purposes”? Thought not. You do know that it is not unusual to keep a patient in hospital for a few extra days after an operation if they have no one to support them at home? Similar here I think. They are not satisfied that the patient would not relapse. But what would you know? FA that’s what.

  79. .

    1234 has just defiled a stawman. I hope you get all the fibres out. It sounds painful champ.

  80. Empire

    You see Sinclair. They have all crawled out from under their rocks, citing idiotic comparisons, non sequiturs and other spurious racist arguments.

    I’ve searched high and low for the racism, but I can’t find it. Is it hiding at the bottom of the ocean with your discarded ethics?

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