Cross Post: Jim Rose – Jihadists and the Nisei soldiers

Japanese Americans interned during World War II jumped at the chance to volunteer to fight.They saw it as their last chance to prove their undivided loyalty to their country.

One Japanese father, when saying goodbye to his son, stressed that showing his loyalty to his country, if necessary through the last full measure of devotion was far more important that his returning safely to his family.

The 442nd Combat Regiment Team was the most decorated unit World War II. Its motto was “Go for Broke”. The 4,000 Nisei soldiers in April 1943 had to be replaced nearly 2.5 times. In total, about 14,000 men served, earning 9,486 Purple Hearts.

Migrants are a cut above regarding initiative and judgement. They pass many of these traits on to their children. These Japanese Americans, both migrants and native born knew that counter-signalling was required. They had to go out of their way to show their loyalty no matter how unfair any suspicions of disloyalty among Japanese Americans might have been at the time.

I am reminded of that counter-signalling by Japanese Americans during the darkest days of World War II when I read today of Julie Anne Genter and Jeremy Corbyn. Both were focusing their pleas on the need to be inclusive and understanding why people join violent, radical groups. They and the rest of the Twitter Left had nothing to contribute regarding strategies to deter the next attack and disrupt those that are in the planning stage, but that is not new.

The notion that bad behaviour towards was minority communities leads to more recruitment to the terrorists is overrated. There will be a few wind-bags who say harsh things after each terrorist attack, but if they cross the line, they will be dealt with by the police and courts in a democracy governed by the rule of law.

Acrimony towards your community following the latest terrorist attacks has little to do with the level of recruitment to these terrorist groups either now or in the past. As Alan Krueger explains:

One of the conclusions from the work of Laurence Iannaccone—whose paper, “The Market for Martyrs,” is supported by my own research—is that it is very difficult to effect change on the supply side. People who are willing to sacrifice themselves for a cause have diverse motivations. Some are motivated by nationalism, some by religious fanaticism, some by historical grievances, and so on. If we address one motivation and thus reduce one source on the supply side, there remain other motivations that will incite other people to terror.

Malcontents join the jihadists today for the same reasons they joined the Red Brigade, the Japanese Red Army Faction and Baader-Meinhof gang in the 1970s and 1980s.

Plenty of young people were attracted to communism in previous generations as a way ofsticking it to the man. Now as then economic conditions were good as were political freedoms. Italy, Japan and Germany were all at the peak of recoveries from war. Japanese incomes are doubled in the previous decade. Germany and Italy were rich countries. As Alan Krueger explains:

Despite these pronouncements, however, the available evidence is nearly unanimous in rejecting either material deprivation or inadequate education as important causes of support for terrorism or participation in terrorist activities. Such explanations have been embraced almost entirely on faith, not scientific evidence.

Each generation has its defining oppositional identity. Radical Islam is the oppositional identity of choice for today’s angry young men and women. Mind you, they have to buy Islam for dummies to understand what they’re signing up for.

In previous generations, it was communism, weird Christian sects, eco-terrorism, animal liberationist terrorism and a variety of domestic terrorists of the left and right with conspiratorial motivations. Look at the level of diversity of the angry young men and women on the domestic terrorists list of the FBI. One jihadists when interviewed said that 30 years ago he would probably have become a Communist as his vehicle for venting his frustrations.

There is always an ample supply of troubled and angry people so trying to redress their grievances is overrated as Alan Krueger explains:

…it makes sense to focus on the demand side, such as by degrading terrorist organizations’ financial and technical capabilities, and by vigorously protecting and promoting peaceful means of protest, so there is less demand for pursuing grievances through violent means. Policies intended to dampen the flow of people willing to join terrorist organizations, by contrast, strike me as less likely to succeed.

The current appeal of radical Islam rests on what psychologists call personal significance. The quest for personal significance by these angry young men and women is the desire to matter, to be respected, to be somebody in one’s own eyes and in the eyes of others.

A person’s sense of significance may be lost for many reasons, including economic conditions. The anger can grow out of a sense of disparagement and discrimination; it can come from a sense that one’s brethren in faith are being humiliated and disgraced around the world.

Extremist ideologies, be they communism, fascism or extreme religions are effective in such circumstances because it offers a quick-fix remedy to a perceived loss of significance and an assured way to regain it. It accomplishes this by exploiting primordial instincts for aggression, sex and revenge. MI5’s behavioural science unit found that

“far from being religious zealots, a large number of those involved in terrorism do not practise their faith regularly. Many lack religious literacy and could . . . be regarded as religious novices.” The analysts concluded that “a well-established religious identity actually protects against violent radicalisation”

Most evidence point to moral outrage, disaffection, peer pressure, the search for a new identity, for a sense of belonging and purpose as drivers of radicalisation. Anthropologist Scott Atran pointed out in testimony to the US Senate in March 2010:

“. . . what inspires the most lethal terrorists in the world today is not so much the Quran or religious teachings as a thrilling cause and call to action that promises glory and esteem in the eyes of friends, and through friends, eternal respect and remembrance in the wider world”. He described wannabe jihadists as “bored, underemployed, overqualified and underwhelmed” young men for whom “jihad is an egalitarian, equal-opportunity employer . . . thrilling, glorious and cool”.

Chris Morris, the writer and director of the 2010 black comedy Four Lions – which satirised the ignorance, incompetence and sheer banality of British Muslim jihadists – said:

Terrorism is about ideology, but it’s also about berks.

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94 Responses to Cross Post: Jim Rose – Jihadists and the Nisei soldiers

  1. Infidel Tiger

    The current appeal of radical Islam rests on what psychologists call personal significance.

    Huh? This war has been going on since 610AD and the reasons have never ever wavered.

  2. blogstrop

    Migrants are a cut above regarding initiative and judgement. They pass many of these traits on to their children. These Japanese Americans, both migrants and native born knew that counter-signalling was required. They had to go out of their way to show their loyalty no matter how unfair any suspicions of disloyalty among Japanese Americans might have been at the time.

    Jim using the Japanese in the USA as an example of what current muslim migrants might do is a red herring. There is no, repeat no parallel.

  3. Makka

    Those brave lads in the 442 Regiment knew the answer. Just keep killing them. As many as possible. If we kill enough of them eventually they will be defeated.

  4. Lem

    If we kill enough of them eventually they will be defeated.

    I think it was Curtis LeMay who said something similar.

  5. Gab

    If we kill enough of them eventually they will be defeated.

    Putin called and asked: Who is this ‘we‘, white man?

  6. Makka

    Bomber Harris had a similar approach , Lem.

  7. mark

    No, ideally you may say so…but…the top level of command and control of this outfit is straight off Saddam’s top shelf. They use guerrilla tactics to take over entire cities right under the noses of the authorities. They do not lay siege, they infiltrate! This shows complex elaborate sophisticated adaptable command and control as well as military training beyond the keystone cops propaganda fed to the west. It is straight out of early communism. Build up your presence, identify the key people in the society then strike hard at the neck, take out all the commanders in one hit. The rest will follow like sheep.

  8. Alienation, personal significance, escapism, mal-de-siecle, Qatari funding, Saudi funding, anti-imperialism, the joooos, what-Waleed-Aly-said…These “youths” and their backers/mentors can explain their motives and demands. I’m interested. I’ll hear them.

    So long as they are explaining from a recumbent position.

  9. Ross B

    The 442nd served only in the ETO – and while they went beserk in Italy against the Wehrmacht they were spared action against forces of Imperial Japan. They finished the war without firing any shots in the Pacific theatre. This is not to say they wouldn’t have gone ballistic against troops of their former homeland – an interesting question in itself.
    The reality on the ground in Iraq appears to demonstrate the low morale and effectiveness of troops coralled into fighting against ISIS. The Kurds have proven themselves, but others? They have mainly run when contronted by real or imagined ISIS strength.

  10. David

    So long as they are explaining from a recumbent position

    With a bayonet at their throat preferably.

  11. Old School Conservative

    A very good post – thanks Jim. The significance of the low numbers of Muslims the the ADF has great import.

  12. Fidel

    Paul Murray asked the Australian Muslim Party founder(?) if he was an Australian first or a Muslim first.
    You know the answer.
    Well, looks like Bendigo will soon follow Shepparton down the chute. There’s a few thousand spare bike racks at the new mosque in Bendigo.

  13. Love the long words but it’s twaddle, unfortunately.

    Japanese in America existed in a monoculture anglo-saxon country that demanded assimilation of a clear set of values.

    Islamics of all stripes are more like a social bacillus that hides like lesions inside the human body until it effloresces and expands, destroying until it is subdued or removed.

    Islamics are racially, socially and religiously distinct. They arrive as what they are and do not change. Confusing that with the liminal behaviour of disaffected losers from the anglosphere, ideintifying with the Other to rebel, is gibberish.

    Islam is socio-cultural rabies as Churchill explained. Until the infection source is removed it will reoccur throughout history.

    They call us crusaders for a reason – they’ve never forgotten the previous wars of self defence they have forced us to fight. My family’s arms are covered with the awards of crusaders, and I am proud of that. Islam is incapable of reform, and we should be incapable of tolerating intolerance such as theirs.

  14. Pedro the Ignorant

    There is a fairly obvious reason that the 442nd wasn’t used in the war in the Pacific, and it had nothing to do with their loyalty to the US.

  15. Rabz

    So, murderous morons are attracted to violent collectivist totalitarian idiotologies.

    Gee, who’da thunk it?

  16. Roger

    I’ll re-post here the results of an Australian Research Council funded academic survey of Australian Muslims (2014) to the question are you a Muslim first or an Australian first?

    Muslim first: 59%
    Australian first: 28%

    To be sure, while most people who identify as religious would place their religious identity over their national identity, but most religions don’t have armed struggle against the unbeliever/oppressor as a doctrine.

    That is why the comparison with the Nisei, while interesting, is not quite apt: the motivating religious factor behind Islamic jihadism is being discounted.

    For the same reason, Islamic jihadism can also not be adequately explained by drawing comparisons with how Leftist terror groups once attracted malcontents. As IT stated, Islamic jihad has been a feature of the religion since its inception. Sure, more than a few dissentients and outright psychopaths will be attracted to that, but it is failing to do justice to Islam to think that alone explains its propensity to violence, which is amply demonstrated in history and can be traced to its authoritative text.

  17. Combine Dave

    Jim using the Japanese in the USA as an example of what current muslim migrants might do is a red herring. There is no, repeat no parallel.

    How about the policies used against the Japanese during the war that we couod dust off and apply to, further our strengths.

  18. johninoxley

    Malcontents join the jihadists today

    Our own useless Malcontent joined the jihadists today, suggesting isis get their own territory. I’ve got news for you mal, they already have and are coming after the rest. Isis is not the problem when we have scum like you strutting the world stage with your new bestie, obummer. The only leaders that have a spine, are old communist bloc countries and and Israel. I trust them far more than I’d ever trust you, they do what they say. their own countries come first.

  19. Notafan

    I think muslim social structures are designed to create these angry young men.
    The sense of superior otherness, the lack of personal responsibility for actions, the cousin marriage, even the one sided sexuality where even if there is a marriage it is nqr if the woman has been mulitated ( amongst other problems with male female relationships). The huge numbers of uneducated men from rural tribes who are subject to the whim of tribal leaders. The brutality, the arbitrary punishments justified by sharia.The natural muslim economy that relied until very recently on slavery in North Africa and the Middle East, the practice of polygamy over many centuries that inevitably creates surplus disenfranchised young men.
    The West has some.
    The Islamic world deliberately breeds them.

  20. Zulu Kilo Two Alpha

    I think muslim social structures are designed to create these angry young men.

    Well said.

  21. Fidel

    Roger, as we have separation of church and state, how can you not be firstly Australian?
    Feel free to then argue which religion you believe is number one.

  22. .

    Because the state cannot own your conscience.

    Friends, family, religion first, then the state.

    Even the British Empire believed this to some extent.

    God, King and Country.

    To say I care for some bozo living on Norfolk Island is just false.

  23. The current appeal of radical Islam rests on what psychologists call personal significance.

    Why does anyone join a cult? Why does someone get a dose of “religion”? Why did so many germans fall in line with Hitler? Why do people get sucked in by all the noble talk of communists?

    The problem with the crusades is that they never finished the job, they didn’t eradicate the cult in the same sense that we eradicated nazism. If we simply thrash islamic state, which is easy to do, the problem will arise again at some point, and again and again till someone decides enough is enough and eradicates this scourge globally.

    Look at turkey, a strong secular constitution and muslims have repeatedly and continuously tried to take over and now they are succeeding. Islam tells them, they must recover lost lands.

    Leaving people free to practice a “religion” that says, non-believers must be enslaved or killed is long term recipe for disaster. No one has the right to practice islam as a “religion”. It must be eradicted, because like HIV there is just isn’t an amount that is acceptable, that won’t breed and eventually kill its host.

    It doesn’t really matter why people join islamic state or islam, what matters is that there is nothing there to join.

  24. Makka

    “Friends, family, religion first, then the state.”

    So, if you found out that one of your friends, family or someone of your religion was about to commit mass slaughter of innocents unknown to you, you would put your loyalty behind the perp. Not surprised in the least.

    Now I see why you are so defensive of these famous ‘moderate’ moslems.

  25. .

    Anyone too silly notice the hierarchy I mention and C.L. has agreed with elsewhere (along with the British Empire’s motto on war memorials which is similar) is one of loyalty – disloyalty ranks nowhere in it.

    If some people want to prove their loyalty to the Commonwealth by treating the lives of those they love equal to those of strangers, I am glad they are not my friends.

  26. Roger

    Roger, as we have separation of church and state, how can you not be firstly Australian?
    Feel free to then argue which religion you believe is number one.

    In reference to moral and legal obligations that is absolutely correct, Fidel. Most Christians, if not all, would be happy to acknowledge that. However, the separation of church and state also means that the state has no coercive powers over a citizen’s conscience when it comes to religious beliefs.

    For Christianity and most religions this is not a problem. If, for example, a Christian disagreed with a law imposed by the state, his religion would counsel him to conscientiously object but also to submit to the legal consequences. What it would not do, or only in the most extreme of circumstances (this is debated by theologians, e.g. Bonhoeffer and the Nazis), is take up arms against the properly constituted state.

    Islam, it seems to me, knows of no real separation of religion and state. Taken at face value, it does not cede any lasting authority to the state, and certainly not to the secular state. It regards the Ummah – the Muslim nation – as the only really legitimate political entity. States are only stepping stones to be tolerated on the way to establishing the Ummah under a caliphate. This is why Muslim declarations of allegiance to their religion rather than their nationality bears much more import than, say, a Catholic saying he listens to the Pope over and above the Prime Minister.

  27. Mick Gold Coast QLD

    I read Jim Rose’ piece and find myself confused by the comparison to expat Japanese in World War II. I see so many differences between society then and now and in the circumstances of a war declared in what were familiar terms then for the general population (unlike the politicians now thundering that there is no war, no threat, no surreptitious invasion and no discernible potential enemy).

    Then I get to this bit.

    “The current appeal of radical Islam rests on what psychologists call personal significance.”

    Someone is profiting, even if it is merely the fake profession of gobbledigook peddlers who claim they know about people and charge handsomely for it. They’ve invented a whole new condition demanding treatment – “personal significance”.

    After reading so much in the linked material offered here by fellow contributors during these past few days I have concluded we are deluged by over analysis from people who haven’t really got a clue, dopey journalists providing space fillers, self styled experts peddling a bias, once-were-important players campaigning still for the advice they offered some president long ago which he ignored, conspiracy theorists and comedians.

    “Terrorism is about ideology, but it’s also about berks.”

    That would be Muhammed Daewooooo of Elizabeth SA. I don’t need a sixty page treatise by a BA whose thesis focused on the reading of tea leaves to tell me he was a lazy lump of lard with the ability to breathe in and out and nothing more, whose father let him hang around army disposal stores way too often, and who convinced himself that paint ball skirmish was damn near the real thing.

    He was a plaything for a time for any number of prominent people who should know better and a convenient distraction allowing the main players to get on with their evil work undisturbed.

    I don’t much care about root causes and understanding why the ignored and margarinised and disinfected are committed to killing me – the knowledge itself is all I need. I do know though that it is not the simpletons like that useless hick that I should be looking out for.

  28. Roger

    “bear much more import”

  29. Makka

    It’s a straight forward choice dot. The traitor will stand by and do nothing and allow it to happen, smug in the knowledge he has remained loyal. Just not to the defenceless innocent victims. This is also exactly how moderate moslems justify their treachery. Great company you keep.

  30. Bert A

    There are only so many psychopaths in this world even if all of them joined ISIS it still would only be a fraction.

    I think a point is missed here, as has been pointed out repeatedly and conveniently overlooked by the apologists, is that it’s the basic tenet of Islam to eventually conquer the world, by any means, peaceful if possible by arms if not.
    The fact that there is a large proportion of so called “moderate” muslims, proves nothing. The communists in Russia had only a few thousand of adherents to begin with if that many?
    Organisation and patience is the key.

    Not every muslim is prepared to risk his life but every one of them will take advantage of the outcome.

  31. .

    That’s utterly ridiculous Makka.

    The state failed at multiple levels in the judiciary and executive regarding Monis for example – and you want me to put my family equal to, or after institutions which have failed to protect us and innocent strangers?

  32. John

    Why explain? Why not just exterminate the vermin.
    If a shark kills a surfer we send the boat to kill the shark. Many times a wrong shark.
    If a crocodile kills a person (stupid enough to be swimming in crocodile infested river), we send a hunting party to kill the crocodile. Many times a wrong crocodile.
    If a jihadist trys to kill us we try to “de-radicalise” them.
    If a terrorist take roomful of hostages, we “negotiate” with the vermin, and try to talk him to surrender, because the profiles can no determine if he is a terrorist, or a criminal, or religious fanatic, or a jihadist. And we kill two hostages in the process.
    God, we really are a stupid breed!

  33. .

    John
    #1860530, posted on November 18, 2015 at 10:27 pm
    Why explain? Why not just exterminate the vermin.

    How many people do you want to kill, John?

  34. Fidel

    Thank you Roger.
    The non separation of church and state is the reason Islam is incompatible with Australian society.

  35. Makka

    dot, I get you. You would willingly see scores of innocents slaughtered rather than dob in one of your relatives. No need to keep explaining it, it’s crystal. You’re moslem, right?

  36. duncanm

    How many people do you want to kill, John?

    more than they of us.

  37. .

    Makka
    #1860538, posted on November 18, 2015 at 10:34 pm
    dot, I get you. You would willingly see scores of innocents slaughtered rather than dob in one of your relatives. No need to keep explaining it, it’s crystal. You’re moslem, right?

    Ridiculous the lot of it.

    I pity you that you find the command of the government greater than the love for your family, friends or your neighbour.

  38. notafan

    God first.
    But the Christian understanding of what that entails is not the muslims.
    Roger is right. Muslims don’t recognize the nation state .
    There are only two states; el sham and the one they haven’t conquered yet.
    There is no golden rule in islam and there is no flexibility in the rules , interpretation just depends on who the big man is this week..
    There is no reasoning.
    Just winning or submitting.

  39. notafan

    Btw wasn’t that state versus God played out by Saint Thomas More.

  40. Makka

    “Ridiculous the lot of it.”

    You haven’t denied a word of it.

    If I found any member of my family plotting to commit mass slaughter , they would certainly forfeit my love and loyalty. In an instant. Like I said and you haven’t denied- You would be quite comfortable in allowing the slaughter to go ahead because family. Wow, I’m really seeing the shit you are made of.

  41. .

    Makka
    #1860554, posted on November 18, 2015 at 10:48 pm
    “Ridiculous the lot of it.”

    You haven’t denied a word of it.

    If I found any member of my family plotting to commit mass slaughter , they would certainly forfeit my love and loyalty. In an instant. Like I said and you haven’t denied- You would be quite comfortable in allowing the slaughter to go ahead because family. Wow, I’m really seeing the shit you are made of.

    My god you’re an idiot. FTR your accusations are all false. Are you too simple to understand calling something ridiculous is a repudiation of it as false?

    We’re not going to let you get away with your bullshit statism by calling people terrorists who value the lives of their loved ones over strangers and the government.

  42. cohenite

    Muslim terrorists don’t join anything; as has been shown many times; the only difference between violent muslims and non-violent muslims is the violence.

  43. John

    John
    #1860530, posted on November 18, 2015, at 10:27 pm
    Why explain? Why not just exterminate the vermin.

    How many people do you want to kill, John?

    All the vermin!

  44. .

    Could you put a number on that, John?

  45. cohenite

    Well the issue is not the number, it’s whether the West should be proactive instead of miserably and ineffectually reactive. Given that the number is not important, the criteria is the point.

  46. Art Vandelay

    A very good post – thanks Jim. The significance of the low numbers of Muslims the the ADF has great import.

    Indeed:

    Latest figures suggest that around 35 Australians have been killed fighting with IS and a further 150 to 350 have gone to the Middle East to join radical militant groups but only about 100 of the nation’s 30,000 soldiers identify as Muslim.

  47. Makka

    “We’re not going to let you get away with your bullshit statism by calling people terrorists who value the lives of their loved ones over strangers and the government.”

    Quaking in my boots I am, especially as you are again making shit up and promoting lies. Anyone reading can see through you.

    I’ll go further though- you are describing yourself as a fking low traitor. I agree with you.

  48. .

    Promoting lies – you are calling me a traitor, a Muslim and a terrorist aider and abettor because I rate the safety and security of my family over strangers.

    You’re just a ridiculous little man Makka.

  49. Makka

    because I rate the safety and security of my family over strangers.”

    No.

    Because you stated you would willingly allow innocents to be slaughtered if your family was plotting to do so. That’s treachery , you juvenile book gnome.

  50. .

    Makka
    #1860601, posted on November 18, 2015 at 11:29 pm
    “ because I rate the safety and security of my family over strangers.”

    No.

    Because you stated you would willingly allow innocents to be slaughtered if your family was plotting to do so. That’s treachery , you juvenile book gnome.

    Well done keyboard warrior.

    You’re a pathological liar, a fantasist, a dog and not fit to be a father or a head of a household.

    Enough.

  51. Stimpson J. Cat

    There are only so many psychopaths in this world even if all of them joined ISIS it still would only be a fraction.

    Psycopaths are relatively rare.
    ISIS are not psychopaths.
    They are true believers, something much more terrifying.

  52. Stimpson J. Cat

    Makka what Dots trying to explain is this:
    Two people shot and bleeding to death in front of you.
    One is your son, the other a stranger.
    You can only save one.
    Who do you choose?

  53. JC

    Quaking in my boots I am, especially as you are again making shit up and promoting lies. Anyone reading can see through you.

    Oh Lord, here he goes again accusing people of lying. Fuck off Makka, you dickhead. Seriously, get back to zero hedge with those other losers. It’s where you belong.

    You spray venom on every topic.

  54. A Lurker

    How many people do you want to kill, John?

    Dot sounds like Mr. Jordan from Bolts blog.
    Constantly answering a statement with a question.
    Diversions and distractions every which way you look.

    Dot, the real world is not your university debating team. In the real world decisions have to be made and some of those decisions will neither be pleasant or politically correct. Your constant excusing and distracting is not a good look. Even though war isn’t officially declared, we are still in a war situation – you cannot play tiddly-winks with an enemy who wants to kill you, your family, your society, and your culture.

    God save us from lawyers and lawyer-wannabes.

  55. Bert A

    No need to kill anyone just stop them coming in the first place.

    None of this UN humanitarian obligation crap.
    How come Japan China the and lots of others can get away with not accepting any “refugees” or only a token numbers but Australia is constantly castigated despite the great effort we’re making?

  56. A Lurker

    How come Japan China the and lots of others can get away with not accepting any “refugees” or only a token numbers but Australia is constantly castigated despite the great effort we’re making?

    It’s very simple to understand. The White, Christian, Captialistic, Democratic West is evil and thus it must be destroyed by whatever means necessary.

  57. duncanm

    HT Bolt – a lefty in the US starts to twig.

    4M Syrian refugees.
    4 recruited by US willing to fight IS.

    If they won’t fight for their country – the real question is, why should the west?

  58. Gab

    If they won’t fight for their country – the real question is, why should the west?

    No, the real question is why should the West allow these cowards into their countries?

  59. Gab

    Michael Totten, World Affairs Journal, Tuesday:

    The US spent years fighting ISIS under its previous name in Iraq and suffered no casualties at home from the organisation while doing so. ISIS — which was called (al-Qa’ida) in Iraq back then — was far too busy ­trying to stay alive on its home turf. And it eventually lost in Iraq and existed basically nowhere until the Syrian civil war provided a “safe space” for it to regroup and rebuild. You want to fight ISIS? Don’t permit it to have a safe space anywhere on this planet.

  60. Stackja

    How many British fled oversea during blitz?

  61. jupes

    Migrants are a cut above regarding initiative and judgement.

    Well Japanese migrants are. Muslims not so much.

    Bolt has a link to a telling stat: 4 million Syrian refugees, 4 – FOUR – willing to be trained to fight IS.

  62. jupes

    You’re a pathological liar, a fantasist, a dog and not fit to be a father or a head of a household.

    LOL.

    Stop picking on Dot you guys. His mum’s sick of picking up the dummies.

  63. Tel

    http://www.conflictsforum.org/2015/obama-and-the-legacy-of-the-dark-side/

    Explains the history of US sponsorship of so called “moderates” who went on to be jihadis.

  64. Rabz

    No, the real question is why should the West allow these cowards into their countries?

    We shouldn’t. But because we’re lead by a pack of evil destructive treasonous imbeciles, this suicidal idiocy will continue until we end up in a bloody civil war and a fight to the death for our survival.

    Which we’ll probably lose.

  65. Dr Faustus

    The current appeal of radical Islam rests on what psychologists call personal significance.

    “. . . what inspires the most lethal terrorists in the world today is not so much the Quran or religious teachings as a thrilling cause and call to action

    This may indeed be the case for Western Sydney ISIS fanboys masturbating over jihad, sex slaves and being the one behind the AK47. Not so much for ISIS itself, or its hardcore facilitators – for them, it’s all about the Islam.

    Lets’s go to the experts: “in March 2014 more than 250 Islamic scholars and thinkers from around the world attended the Forum for Promoting Peace in Muslim Societies in Abu Dhabi. One of the goals of the Forum was for these leaders to establish a unified position in response to the gravest threats facing the Muslim world today during this critical phase of its history.”

    The output from that Forum unequivocally concluded that the main problem is that the leadership of ISIS has erred in its legal interpretation and implementation of the Koran and sharia. Not so much that they are inhuman monsters in search of personal significance, or wrong in their objectives. More a technical difference of opinion, based on the fact that Islam is not open to interpretation except by scholars who fully understand the Koran, ‘religious science’ and the Arabic language.

  66. Tintarella di Luna

    Islam is the cover for bloodlust.

  67. Tintarella di Luna

    We shouldn’t. But because we’re lead by a pack of evil destructive treasonous imbeciles, this suicidal idiocy will continue until we end up in a bloody civil war and a fight to the death for our survival.

    I don’t believe for one minute that the igeneration will fight for anything because they can’t see anything worth fighting for other than “Hug Me” placards and idevices. They’ll gladly pay the jizya as long as they can watch cat videos and take selfies, oh and sing protest songs sockin’ it to The Man.

  68. A Lurker

    How many British fled oversea during blitz?

    Children were sent away from the cities to the country, and some were sent overseas to Australia and elsewhere. The adults I believe remained behind.

  69. Tel

    Muslims don’t recognize the nation state .
    There are only two states; el sham and the one they haven’t conquered yet.

    Seems pretty weird when they are constantly fighting amongst themselves over minor religious schisms or tribal grudges.

    I suggest your understanding is about equivalent to saying there’s no difference between French and German, or saying all Chinese are Han.

  70. A Lurker

    I don’t believe for one minute that the igeneration will fight for anything because they can’t see anything worth fighting for other than “Hug Me” placards and idevices. They’ll gladly pay the jizya as long as they can watch cat videos and take selfies, oh and sing protest songs sockin’ it to The Man.

    Frankly at this point in time I think the Earth would be vastly improved by the appearance of the Vogon Constructor Fleet – or more optimistically, the Golgafrincham’s and their B-Ark to take away the useless third of our planet.

    p.s. We’ll keep the telephone sanitisers.

  71. How many people do you want to kill, John?

    1% is perfectly acceptable. I would even tolerate 10% to emancipate the other 90%.

    I have come to the conclusion, dot is either a muslim, is married to one, or has muslim relatives.

  72. rich

    How come Japan China the and lots of others can get away with not accepting any “refugees” or only a token numbers but Australia is constantly castigated despite the great effort we’re making?

    Critical theory

    “the criticism never demands an alternative”

  73. notafan

    I didn’t say muslims only had one mind.
    Clearly there are two major camps and have been since mohammed died but each believe that their version of el sham is correct.

  74. jupes

    I have come to the conclusion, dot is either a muslim, is married to one, or has muslim relatives.

    Either that or just another lefty fuckwit.

  75. .

    A Lurker
    #1860676, posted on November 19, 2015 at 6:59 am
    How many people do you want to kill, John?

    Dot sounds like Mr. Jordan from Bolts blog.
    Constantly answering a statement with a question.
    Diversions and distractions every which way you look.

    Dot, the real world is not your university debating team. In the real world decisions have to be made and some of those decisions will neither be pleasant or politically correct. Your constant excusing and distracting is not a good look. Even though war isn’t officially declared, we are still in a war situation – you cannot play tiddly-winks with an enemy who wants to kill you, your family, your society, and your culture.

    God save us from lawyers and lawyer-wannabes.

    Don’t talk down to me you idiot. I have said I want strong action against Daesh etc.

    Calling me Mr Jordon? Fuckwit.

    If you cannot understand that decent people value the life of their family over strangers, and reject this ‘Pray for Paris” nonsense, I can’t help you.

  76. Jim using the Japanese in the USA as an example of what current muslim migrants might do is a red herring. There is no, repeat no parallel.

    Blogstrop, you are correct. The issue here is that the Nissei saw themselves as Americans first. The Muslems see themselves as muslims first.
    The wedge of this was enabled when, using identity politics, the Left started using the term Muslim Americans/African Americans. The fact that America/Australia comes second in this description of self, is an indicator of where the loyalties lie.

  77. .

    Zippy The Younger
    #1860759, posted on November 19, 2015 at 8:53 am
    How many people do you want to kill, John?

    1% is perfectly acceptable. I would even tolerate 10% to emancipate the other 90%.

    I have come to the conclusion, dot is either a muslim, is married to one, or has muslim relatives.

    I have come to the conclusion you are a child and idiot and think killing 160 million Muslims will automatically end Islam as a religion and free the remaining 1.54 billion Muslims.

  78. jupes

    I have come to the conclusion you are a child and idiot and think killing 160 million Muslims will automatically end Islam as a religion and free the remaining 1.54 billion Muslims.

    Well it may or may not end it automatically. But it will come down to them or us at some point.

  79. notafan

    Time and time again I have read on muslim websites their rejection of the laws and sovereignity of the countries in which they live.
    On muslim village one man asked if it was okay to join the Australian army. The chorus was no as because there might be a muslim at the other end.
    On American websites more of the same.
    This appears to come from the concept of dar al islam and dar al kufr.
    Of course from the link all a muslim has to do is declare that the muslim ruled country isn’t really dar al islam and it’s on for young and old.
    We are fortunate that over the centuries dar al islam has often done this or we might not have any place to call dar al kufr.


    And from a muslim website

  80. Boambee John

    Malcolm’s latest brain fart is to negotiate a power sharing arrangement between ISIS and others over part of the territories of Syria and Iraq (implicitly the Sunni part).

    His example is Lebanon, apparently he is not aware that Lebanon has been in a permanent state of civil war for over 30 years, with tens of thousands killed.

    That should work well!

  81. God, we really are a stupid breed!

    Just our leaders, John. The vast majority of the peasants are getting well and truly fed up with them and their enablers.
    They refuse to look at history, because they believe it doesn’t apply to them.
    They do wake up when the tumbrels start rolling.

  82. John
    #1860530, posted on November 18, 2015, at 10:27 pm
    Why explain? Why not just exterminate the vermin.

    How many people do you want to kill, John?

    All the vermin!

    Correct reply, John.
    Dot et al, continue to throw this reply up, because then they can achieve their Moral High Ground TM, and accuse others of being mass murderers in waiting.
    Dot, you do you and your cause no favours by using cheap debating tricks like this one.

  83. We shouldn’t. But because we’re lead by a pack of evil destructive treasonous imbeciles, this suicidal idiocy will continue until we end up in a bloody civil war and a fight to the death for our survival.

    Which we’ll probably lose.

    Very much doubt we’ll lose, Rabz, but, by God, the butchers bill will be enormous.

  84. H B Bear

    Can’t add anything more to the debunking of this nonsense.

    Anyone looking for an example of how the Caliphate might work down the road just needs to have a look at the illegal immigration situation during the R-G-R Dark Ages. Straight from Kabul, Tehran, Islamabad through Malaysia and Indonesia – no visas or immigration control because you are my Mohammedan brother and then onwards to the reviled West aka Australia.

  85. .

    Winston Smith
    #1860878, posted on November 19, 2015 at 11:03 am
    John
    #1860530, posted on November 18, 2015, at 10:27 pm
    Why explain? Why not just exterminate the vermin.

    How many people do you want to kill, John?

    All the vermin!

    Correct reply, John.
    Dot et al, continue to throw this reply up, because then they can achieve their Moral High Ground TM, and accuse others of being mass murderers in waiting.
    Dot, you do you and your cause no favours by using cheap debating tricks like this one.

    Wrong Winston.

    Killing people indiscriminately is stupid.

    ISIS should be destroyed, and Iran’s nuclear programme ended by force.

    I’ve actually seen someone argue against limiting collateral damage here lately (it was MV).

    That is really stupid and immoral.

    What I want from you is a specific war plan. I trust you don’t want to kill innocent people.

    The idea that we should abandon limiting collateral damage or simply nuke population centres in the Middle East is blithering mania.

  86. cohenite

    Isis and all the other violent jihadist groups and iran are merely the pointy end of islam; you cut that pointy end off and another grows. The problem is with islam itself. How do you solve it: look to a country which has effectively solved it, Japan; and what does it do: effectively bans it and treats it as the disease it is.

    Once you view islam as a pathology then you can proceed as with any other epidemic.

  87. Bert A

    cohenite
    You are perfectly right.
    Islam is what it is and it will never change, Mohammed done a Kevin Rudd on them.
    If you change it, it will no longer be Islam and besides you can’t change it because it’s the final word of Allah, so there!
    I’m not a fan of A Bolt, he has his moments, but him calling for the reform of Islam is just ridiculous.
    Who the hell he think he is, Martin Luther?

  88. Makka

    ” But it will come down to them or us at some point.”

    Then the question becomes, do you want dot in the trenches there with you at your back?

  89. Diogenes

    but him calling for the reform of Islam is just ridiculous

    Actually what we are seeing is the backlash to reform in the middle east as the before(50s) /after(today) photos of Afghanistan & Iran that are doing the rounds show.

  90. .

    Makka
    #1861317, posted on November 19, 2015 at 6:07 pm
    ” But it will come down to them or us at some point.”

    Then the question becomes, do you want dot in the trenches there with you at your back?

    You’re a fucking dog pal. You won’t back down from libellous comments such as calling me a Muslim and a terrorist.

    You’d kill your own children to save the life of the Prime Minister.

    Keyboard warrior. Cockhead.

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