How many of these are there?

I looked at this and thought that there had to be something wrong. It couldn’t be this easy to defraud the government of $16 million, but it is. And these have been picked up only because they were so greedy. How many are around that only defraud the government of a million or two?

Six people have been charged in Melbourne’s western suburbs for allegedly submitting fraudulent claims for taxpayer-funded family day care payments worth nearly $16 million[!!!!!].

Australian Federal Police have also seized assets worth $1.1m that are believed to be proceeds of the alleged crime, including two Melbourne properties, a “significant amount” of funds in bank accounts and two luxury vehicles.

The AFP arrested the alleged scammers with a range of serious fraud offences after executing a number of search warrants yesterday. . . .

“It will be alleged that members of this group have repeatedly submitted false claims on behalf of family day care centres in Melbourne’s western suburbs, particularly to exploit the Grandparent Child Care Benefit scheme,” AFP Manager Criminal Assets, Fraud and Anti-Corruption Commander Peter Crozier said.

“This scheme helps grandparents with the childcare costs for grandchildren in their care. It covers the full cost of fees associated with up to 50 hours of childcare per child per week.”

So you tell me how this could happen? The supposed moral of the story is exactly the other way round.

“Perpetrators of fraud are on notice: you will be caught and there are severe consequences, including the possibility of jail time,” Senator Birmingham said.

“This tough stance is necessary to ensure our taxpayer dollars are directed to those operators doing the right thing, compliant with Family Assistance Law and delivering high quality, flexible and affordable child care to families.

What it really says to me is that these Commonwealth programs are run by such dills that there is money there just for the taking if you are larcenous enough to try your luck.

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92 Responses to How many of these are there?

  1. memoryvault

    What it really says to me is that these Commonwealth programs are run by such dills that there is money there just for the taking if you are larcenous enough to try your luck.

    I wrote “Dolebludging, a Taxpayer’s Guide” back in 1986.
    30 years on, and nothing much has changed.

  2. Habib

    “This tough stance is necessary to ensure our taxpayer dollars are directed to those operators doing the right thing, compliant with Family Assistance Law and delivering high quality, flexible and affordable child care to families.” Why do they insult our intelligence with such fatuous flannel? Anyone with an IQ above room temperrature knows that this and every other like “program” is a platform for spivs, thieves, chancers and assorted rent-seekers to overcharge, overservice, and overbill for sloppy, low grade service. Andhat’s just the legitimate operators. Nothing clarifies more the fact that the supposed conservative side of politics is nothing of that sort; they are either uttery cynical and treat us with contempt, or honestly believe such a worthless exercise as public funded childcare is worthy, and necessary. I’m not sure which option is worse.

  3. Infidel Tiger

    The rich lists are now full of all these chancers that have cashed in on the child care racket.

    Imagine a business that has nearly all its costs guaranteed by the government? It’s too good to be true.

  4. Struth

    Now let’s take a look at aboriginal funding…………………………….

  5. Now let’s take a look at aboriginal funding…………………………….

    You betcha!
    One small difference. In aboriginal funding everybody knows what is going on. But they are discouraged from doing anything about it, from even talking about it, from even mentioning it in auditor reports.

    Inevitable outcome: The recent Groote Eylandt fiasco, and others like it.

  6. Mick Gold Coast QLD

    From Infidel Tiger at 12:43 am:

    “The rich lists are now full of all these chancers that have cashed in on the child care racket.

    Imagine a business that has nearly all its costs guaranteed by the government? It’s too good to be true.”

    Fifteen years or so ago I heard through a friend married to a Sydney fireman how he and his workmates discovered child care centres and guaranteed income were a perfect fit with their impressive incomes and generous lay about doing nothing time. They went on to buy several of them, which they managed from their comfortable digs.

  7. Ant

    Big government = big fraud.

  8. Megan

    Hang on, there’s a grandparent child care payment? I’ve been doing it for nothing, idiot that I am.

  9. Megan

    And they have recovered only 1/16th of what they have been defrauded of…not something to be shouting about how clever they are to have finally figured out what was going on.

  10. Megan

    That should read what WE have been defrauded of!

  11. Entropy

    Having had a bit to do with government grants, it is amazing what people will try on. Falsified invoices, multiple ABNs so they can invoice themselves, etc. There is the prevailing belief, or at least claim, that they should do it because everyone else is, they just can’t tell you who when they are caught. Also the belief the government employees won’t pick it up.
    Complicating it all is a desire to have claims kept as simple as possible against the need to collect enough information to ensure the claim is credible. The more trust placed in the applicant the greater risk of malfeasance. The more fraud detected the more claim forms end up getting complicated.
    And don’t get me started on the average magistrate of today and their approach to cases of alleged fraud of small grants programs.

  12. Crossie

    Also the belief the government employees won’t pick it up.

    This is a well placed belief. Recently I have had some interactions with Centrelink staff over my mother’s preparation for residential aged care which have left me underwhelmed. Numerous forms to be filled out and paperwork to be enclosed which are then lost so you start again. One person will give you instructions which are later contradicted by other staff or even written correspondence.

    And always the interminable wait. A sane person would do almost anything not to have to deal with them.

    Once when my mother came with me she remarked “Why is everybody who works here overweight?”. I thought it might be so they match the majority of the clientele.

  13. Entropy

    It is a mistake to think the typical public servant is one who works in a Centrelink office. They are low paid, and the job sucks. A lot. They are likely to be not much different to their most frequent clientele. Anyone that shows any talent or initiative would not remain in a Centrelink office.
    And those clientele and the endless ways they try to rip the system off is why the forms have become so difficult.

  14. outsider

    Sure, and ant has it in a few words. How about this, heard in a Trump speech last week:

    A recent watchdog review found that at least 6.5 million active Social Security numbers belong to people who are at least 112 years old and likely deceased. Only 35 living individuals worldwide had reached that age as of October 2013, according to the Gerontology Research Group.

    Some of us have worked with setting up systems containing records of large numbers of individuals or other entities, some of it in government. About the first and most important thing you do is the edit system, complete with various levels of cross referencing by demographic chars plus other key data. Age is number one. DSS/CL data is notoriously bad.

    This example of yours would be so easy it would actually be fun to do, for data and metadata specialists. Of course it all requires management that wants to find the transgressions, and is prepared to pay for the right people to do it. Interesting/unsurprising it is in the Gillard/Shorten/Melham jurisdiction.

    But in the end its only taxpayers’ money (and everyone pays tax right?), or maybe they got that money tree growing faster due to the increase in CO2 maybe?

  15. Baldrick

    “Perpetrators of fraud are on notice: you will be caught and there are severe consequences, including the possibility of jail time,” Senator Birmingham said.

    Bullshit. The one’s that get caught are the ‘unlucky’ ones and very much in the minority.

    The take home message from this is you have more chance of winning the lottery than caught defrauding the taxpayer.

  16. sfw

    I don’t watch the news or read papers much these days however I have it on good information that the fraud in this case was mainly organised in the Somali community, they may not work much but they aren’t stupid and know how to make the most of a good thing. My source also said that the people they spoke with would rather live in Somalia but it’s just too good here and the money is easy to come by.

  17. stackja

    Liberty Quotes
    A liberal is someone who feels a great debt to his fellow man, which debt he proposes to pay off with your money.
    — G. Gordon Liddy

    And Liddy was put in prison, for some minor crimes, which today would be laughed out of court.

  18. stackja

    Liberty Quotes
    Give a man a fish, he’ll eat for a day. Teach him to take fish from others, …
    — EconLog commenter Dave Smith

  19. wazsah

    I thought Family Day Care was mostly a stay at home mum caring for a handful of kids usually from working mums in nearby streets. That scheme used to be admin through your local council in the first instance.
    How in th$*&^%* does the fraud get to $16Mill??

  20. Rabz

    “Why is everybody who works here overweight?”

    Is this a trick question?

    Dealing with life’s losers must be an intolerable strain – hence the clockpunchers drown their sorrows in massive quantities of food and booze.

  21. Zyconoclast

    How in th$*&^%* does the fraud get to $16Mill??

    To paraphrase a law of physics and gasses: a fraud on the tax payer will expand until all available money has been exhausted.

  22. HT

    It is a mistake to think the typical public servant is one who works in a Centrelink office. They are low paid, and the job sucks. A lot. They are likely to be not much different to their most frequent clientele. Anyone that shows any talent or initiative would not remain in a Centrelink office.
    And those clientele and the endless ways they try to rip the system off is why the forms have become so difficult.

    I know it’s not the done thing to defend Public Servants here, but I absolutely agree Entropy.

  23. Myrddin Seren

    Note this said without a blink:

    ….our taxpayer dollars are directed to ……….affordable child care to families.

    If – it – is – f**king – ‘affordable’,

    why is the taxpayer picking up huge licks of the cost !?!

    I am pretty sure squandering the national wealth until ruination is now a feature, not a bug, of the ascent of these idiots.

  24. A good way to reduce this welfare fraudis to give no welfare to migrants who have ot paid income tax for thirty years . Watch the ” refugees ” flood out of Australia,the muslim population would be down to 120 in no time ,think of the profits turnbull could send to the Caymans from selling mosques .

  25. Jessie

    Question: How many of these are there?
    Response: Many

    Variables can be read below:

    “We’ve certainly listened to feedback and that’s been part of the lengthy and detailed process we’ve undertaken with these child care reforms to make sure that we get the legislation right,” he said.

    “Importantly here for grandparents and their grandchildren, we’re making sure that support is available for children who are often vulnerable and in need of additional learning and valuable respite for those grandparents who are delivering an amazing service to help care for their grandchildren when their parents are not in a position to do so.”

    (bold added)

    Child Care Fact Sheets

  26. Dr Faustus

    This is the tiniest tip of the iceberg.

    In Brisbane, the feds and Queensland Dept of Education are currently trying to find a legal basis to shut down family day care Child Swapping rings. In some communities, parents register as Family Day Care providers (Blue Card + minimal background/premises check), send their kids off to the neighbours, take the neighbour’s kids in, all meet up for the day – and everyone gets to claim $64/day/child.

  27. MareeS

    Bugger. I’m pretty good at getting the best out of a dollar, but how much free money must be washing around for recent migrants to get this scam going? Memo to self: get on the public purse.

  28. memoryvault

    I am pretty sure squandering the national wealth until ruination is now a feature,
    not a bug, of the ascent of these idiots.

    You are beginning to get the picture, Myrddin. To the people ultimately responsible, the only thing wrong with the above story is that somebody got caught. That just means extra paperwork.

  29. John Constantine

    This is the whole point of go for growth through importing welfare herds.

    The untouchable ruddfilth family hundred million dollar fortune is a shining example for the entire filth mentality.

  30. PeteD

    There is a nice simple solution to all this.

    The Commission of Audit noted that government spending on FTB A is $15 billion per year, spending on FTB B is $5 billion and under the proposed Childcare arrangements, direct Federal Government money is around $10 billion per year.

    Means testing these payments leads to fairly interesting cost hurdles to re-enter the workforce, and probably leads to at least these four suboptimal outcomes:

    * People work less than they otherwise would because the means test increases the marginal tax rates (for FTB A a single income family could see rates at the margin of over 65%)
    * Families structure their work arrangements around tax and benefit incentives, rather than the levels of work they would otherwise choose.
    * People go to work in economically wasteful ways, i.e. between the government and the worker, they pay someone to look after their children more than they gain from going to work (including any benefit from keeping their toes in the workforce.
    * Childcare “providers” rort State and Federal subsidies through caring for related children.

    $30 billion dollars a year is both equivalent to the size of the deficit and also in the same ballpark as the revenue expected from a GST increase from 10-15%.

    Surely the government if they really were reformist could work out a way to absorb all these subsidies into a simpler family taxation system, with real tax cuts (and flat marginal tax rates whether the husband or wife goes back to work), and then let the families work out how best to spend their own money.

  31. memoryvault

    The untouchable ruddfilth family hundred million dollar fortune is a shining example for the entire filth mentality.

    John, if your blood pressure needs a boost, go to the Yellow Pages, type in “Job Service Provider”, and any location you like. For instance, “Greater Canberra ACT” will return you 378 local hits. How many unemployed people are there in Canberra? Just “Australia” will return 17,842 hits.

    ALL these places have an office (rent), overheads (electricity, phone etc), a minimum of three staff (wages), and at least one car. The all-up cost must be staggering, but there is no way of knowing because it is split up over separate departments.

    When someone registers for the dole Centrelink allocates them to one of these “providers” with an auto-generated interview time. At the interview they are basically told to piss off for 12 weeks. If they are still unemployed at the end of 12 weeks they are called in for another interview. After that, they spend the next 12 weeks doing one day courses – resume writing, job hunting etc.

    Note, no real attempt is made to help these people actually get a job until they have been unemployed for at least six months. There is a built-in reason for that. Up to six months the “Service Provider” only gets a minor allowance. At six months it becomes serious money, plus the client is now eligible for bribe money to be paid to a potential employer.

    Nirvana is somebody unemployed for 12 months. At that point the Provider gets a whopping bonus for placing them in a job, and a potential employer gets subsidised wages for six months – or a year if the client has any identifiable disability. Can you guess what happens then? That’s right. The Service Provider “employs” the previously unemployable person on taxpayer-funded wages, puts them to work “helping” the next crop of unemployed, and pockets the bonus.

    And it is all “legal”.

  32. John Constantine

    The oilfilth funded command and control centers exist to enable forts like this.
    The whole point of the ‘religion as an industry’ business model of the filth of saud is to seed business units in other countries, then shovel profit through the door using crony socialism.

    Go for growth.

  33. Crossie

    In Brisbane, the feds and Queensland Dept of Education are currently trying to find a legal basis to shut down family day care Child Swapping rings. In some communities, parents register as Family Day Care providers (Blue Card + minimal background/premises check), send their kids off to the neighbours, take the neighbour’s kids in, all meet up for the day – and everyone gets to claim $64/day/child.

    And no cross checking? A simple computer program that finds names and addresses that are both receivers and providers of care. What does this say about those departmental heads on half a million annual salary? I think those overweight front line staff are the cream of the crop.

  34. Jessie

    With industrial award legislation now of domestic violence leave, and in situ extra cultural leave for special groups, parental leave, training leave and so on, child care ‘swapping’ can be got around.

    The bugs remain. The decision is shaped by the yes/no + meets criteria of the finite yet abstract socio-cultural items developed, collected and entered onto government machines.
    Much like Australian census material which shapes the items of self-professed identification. And informs ‘evidence-based’ policy and funding.

  35. Myrddin Seren

    PeteD

    Surely the government if they really were reformist could work out a way to absorb all these subsidies into a simpler family taxation system, with real tax cuts (and flat marginal tax rates whether the husband or wife goes back to work), and then let the families work out how best to spend their own money.

    if they really were reformist

    They aren’t. The political grouping now morphing in to the Turnbull Party is a vanity project feeding the ego of its namesake and providing political advantage for his minions. Reform takes work and generates bad press. Spending like a drunken sailor is much easier and opens numerous opportunities for patronage, self-promotion and outright graft.

    …..let the families work out how best to spend their own money.

    Report to the Reeducation Camp for cleansing of these improper thoughts about letting the proles make decisions and take responsibility !

  36. Spongebob Steve Pants

    memoryvault- you are Peter Sawyer?

    I LOVE your book. I read through it about once a year for a refresher. My copy is in surprisingly good condition for it age. PS: I am 31 and it was written about the time I was born and still has a point today!

  37. Spongebob Steve Pants

    Memoryvault: I have dolebludging: a taxpayers guide and one man banned.

    I thought dolebludging was funny (was this intentional?) but one man banned very serious.

  38. notafan

    In Brisbane, the feds and Queensland Dept of Education are currently trying to find a legal basis to shut down family day care Child Swapping rings. In some communities, parents register as Family Day Care providers (Blue Card + minimal background/premises check), send their kids off to the neighbours, take the neighbour’s kids in, all meet up for the day – and everyone gets to claim $64/day/child.

    That was a big scam in Melbourne that netted the offenders millions, all on welfare as well and not declaring the family day care income to Centrelink.

    Not working, not intending to work ( many are niqabis) and raking in everything they can lay their hands on.

    I wonder what the annual transfer of taxpayers money to the state of Somalia is?

    As well as ‘not the same day rules’ which will just decrease the amount received they should checking to see if the children even leave home (because they don’t)

    Limiting the rebate to people actually working or studying would help and insisting that parents ‘looking for work’ only use non FDC or grandparent arrangements would help.

    As would cancelling sole parent benefits for couples that keep having babies after they allegedly split.

    But think the more muslim migrants we get the more welfare fraud we can enjoy as we work to towards a trillion trillion deficit.

  39. Privatise the whole welfare system with bonuses for the contractors saving money ,if there is a fraud going on the contracter will soon find long jail terms ,withdrawL of all welfare of any kind ,long jail terms and deportation of foreign born .

  40. Combine Dave

    A good way to reduce this welfare fraudis to give no welfare to migrants who have ot paid income tax for thirty years . Watch the ” refugees ” flood out of Australia,the muslim population would be down to 120 in no time ,think of the profits turnbull could send to the Caymans from selling mosques .

    Why target only foreigners when more than 50% of all Aussies consume more tax than they ever pay.

  41. Combine Dave

    and deportation of foreign born .

    Love it.

    But what happens when NZ stops taking them back?

  42. H B Bear

    Just add it to the list – VET training colleges, Islamic colleges, Medicare and pathology over-servicing, FBT free meals for hospital staff, Dilbersek’s low income housing funds skimmed off by student accommodation developers … and on it goes.

    Childcare is the classic example of the dead hand of government displacing co-operative civic society and religious arrangements. Initially by local government and then like everything else swallowed up by the cardigan wearers in Canberra – complete with an ever increasing regulatory bible, an academic research and training arm and the attendant hordes of administrators.

  43. Combine Dave

    Liberty Quotes
    Give a man a fish, he’ll eat for a day. Teach him to take fish from others, …that’s called government
    — EconLog commenter Dave Smith

    FIFY

  44. Myrddin Seren

    notafan

    I wonder what the annual transfer of taxpayers money to the state of Somalia is?

    Other than some lines on a map, I seriously doubt the region described as ‘Somalia’ qualifies as a nation state as we know it. Watch ‘Blackhawk Down’ again.

    In any event, if this one scam lifted $16 mill, and the cops can only find $1 mill here, either all their relos back in Somalia are living like kings – and that is not obvious – OR, more likely, we can see where al Shabaab is getting significant funding from.

  45. Fred

    In my younger days I worked as a clerk for a private rail servicing company. It did contract work for Queensland Rail. My bosses would constantly add additional items to invoices that I prepared, $20 here, $100 there. Governments are stupid and an endless source of money. I quit after six months.

  46. notafan

    Failed state of Somalia sorry.

    Pick on Somalias?

    Last I looked regular Aussie welfare cheats weren’t planning terrorist attacks on Holdsworthy Barracks and going on jihad holidays, or even conduct running battles involving a couple of hundred participants across Melbourne CBD.

    Okay not all of them but what percentage are, or ever have been in paid employment?

    It’s a wonderful thank you for the gift of asylum.

  47. memoryvault

    memoryvault- you are Peter Sawyer?

    Yes. I wrote “Dolebludging”, “The Green Hoax Effect” and “You’re The Boss, OK”, but not “One Man Banned”. That was all the work of Sydney radio announcer Brian Wilshire. I shudder whenever it is mentioned. It is the actual source of much of the criticism leveled at me here by Dot, JC and others, for claims I am alleged to have made, things I’m said to have written. But didn’t.

    Brian approached me around 1993 when I was talking about retiring from spook busting. He wanted to do a “Best of the Inside News”. He would collate and edit it, write an introduction, have it printed, and promote it on his nightly radio program. We would split the profits and both make a mozza. My one condition was that I got to read and approve the draft.

    I never heard from him again until 1997, when he turned up with a box load of copies, and a sheepish grin. That was my share. 24 copies. Seems he had run afoul of the Taxation Department via some offshore tax haven thing, and they had got all the money.

    I didn’t actually look at the book until he had left. What he had done was create chapters based on an article, or series of articles, from The Inside News. Then, sometimes, there might be a sentence or two from the actual article. Then he would launch into several pages of his own tirade on the subject.

    Given that Brian’s politics are somewhere to the extreme right of Genghis Khan, plus the fact that he is Australia’s leading conspiracy theorist, the result was truly cringeworthy. Unfortunately, to the casual reader, there is no way of distinguishing the little that was mine, from the bulk which was his.

    Even more unfortunately, by that stage he had sold over 18,000 copies.

  48. Spongebob Steve Pants

    Thanks memory. Good to know. Cant believe I had been reading your posts on the Cat for years all the time not knowing you were the author of one of my fave books (dolebludging).

  49. Zyconoclast

    Memory vault
    I picked you for Peter Sawer when you mentioned your book. I did not want to call you out.
    I also loved your semi regular sessions on the Brian Wilshire show on 2GB.

  50. Spongebob Steve Pants

    Zycon- i had similar concerns but if you google the book, his name is right there.

  51. Botswana O'Hooligan

    There are giant scams running all over the place if one cares to look, and we all know about paying “tradies” cash money upfront for a supposed discount, and we see the trolley persons of swarthy persuasion at supermarkets who are probably on the dole and just getting a bit of exercise your honour, by collecting trolleys. One good one is practiced in the North where a couple may not be able to have children so their immediate family give them one of their spares. The kid is a gold mine because it was registered as belonging to its normal parents who were paid, and still are paid child support, it is registered under the new family name and generates child support, and when it goes to school it gets registered under an Anglicised name and generates more support. Rumours abound about immigrants using the system but one would bet that they are probably no match for our brethren “up North” when it comes to screwing the system for they have been doing it ever since the government decided that the aboriginal and islander problems could be resolved by throwing large amounts of money at them.

  52. memoryvault

    I picked you for Peter Sawer when you mentioned your book.

    Never been shy about it, Zycon, it’s come up here many times. The “Memoryvault” is something of a family joke. Prior to the stroke I had a bonafide photographic memory. But now it doesn’t work on anything post-stroke. But most of the stuff pre-stroke is still there, but with holes in it, where some bits are “locked” away – hence the “vault”.

  53. Cynic of Ayr

    You people have got it all wrong!
    The Government knows all about this fraud! Rudd and Gillard knew. Abbott knew!
    Abbott thought, “I’ll put Morrison in charge. He sorted the boats out, he’ll easily sort out a million or so rorters.”
    A month or two later.
    “How’s things going with the child care racket, Scotts old fellah? Any progress?”
    “Ah, well, Tones, it’s like this. Most of them are “refugee” immigrants. Most can’t speak English. Most belong to a religion that sanctions lying to us. Most will never get any sort of job.”
    “That’s not much of an excuse for stealing so much!” Tony replies.
    “Well, it is, Tones. Ya see, if we crack down on it, the ABC is all over us for being racist bigots. Fairfax says were suffering from islamophobia – whatever the fk that is? The twits on twitter, are raging about meanness, cruelty, and they’re organising protest love-ins all over the place, especially love-ins at some residences that seem a bit flash for starving immigrants to be living in. Sarah Two-Dads is bawling her eyes out, flooding the bloody Senate with Alligator Tears, saying we’re taking food from baby’s mouths! Get the picture?”
    “Must admit, getting clearer. Crocodile!” Tony said, a bit faraway.
    “What?”
    “Nothing. Go on.” Jeez, I suppose we all can’t go to Oxford! Tony thought.
    “Ok, I’ve got one more word.”
    “What’s that?”
    “Islam!” Scott said, with eyes rolling in despair.
    “We’re fkd, aren’t we?”
    “Yep!”
    Following that exercise in futility, a Waffler from the burg of Wentworth comes along, and brings his six year old plot to the boil, rendering blade wounds to Tony’s back.
    The Waffler, “So, Scott, I see you’ve done a first class, card carrying job with the Centrelink rorters!”
    “Errr, well, Excellency, I didn’t do all that well at all.”
    “Don’t be so modest! Of course you did. All those rorters, sorry, depressed minorities, love me, and it’s important not to do anything to change that.”
    “There’s a lot of money involved, Excellency, perhaps we should do a little?”
    “NO! And that’s an order! Money is no object. After all, it’s not my money! The prime result to strive for here is the people’s love for me, which, admittedly, won’t approach my own love for myself, but that’s irrelevant.”
    “Please, Excellency, Exalted One, in good conscious, I should attempt something.”
    “Are you deaf? What part of “no” Don’t you get? OK, I can see where this is going. You’re sacked from that Portfolio, and in penance for your insubordination, and reward for cleaning my pocket knife, you’re now Treasurer!”
    “Treasurer!” Scott gasps, eyes shining, rather than rolling.
    “Yes, Treasurer! Your job is now to give me all the money I want to stop this insidious .005 Degrees increase in World Temperature, from ruining my rose garden. And to do that, I need all the people to love me, and vote for me.”
    “No problem, Excellency, I can do that. After all, it’s not my money!”
    “You’re a quick learner, Scotty, I’ll grant you that. Now run along, Jules and I have to discuss how we are going to get a slice of the 100 million we are going to give to a Pacific Island – doesn’t matter which one – to erect a few thousand windmills on the beach, to power their huts.”
    (Editor’s note. In the interest of space frugality, the Waffler’s words have herein been reduced to what he meant, rather then the thousands of words he actually uttered. )
    And so, Scott trundles off, muttering, “Old Age Pensioners! There’s somewhere I could garner a few bucks!”

  54. sabrina

    Ordinary people get encouragement to launder following more sophisticated attempts (sometimes succesful) ones by the politicians. Some of them are caught, and yet make comeback. Those who are caught, do not always pay their money back.

  55. DavidA

    Sinclair still pro open borders?

  56. It is the actual source of much of the criticism leveled at me here by Dot, JC and others,

    Dot & JC basing rants & personal attacks on piss-poor research & wrongology.

    Lol! Who’d a thunk it?

  57. Dr Faustus

    But most of the stuff pre-stroke is still there, but with holes in it, where some bits are “locked” away – hence the “vault”.

    Genuine interest, MV, are you aware of the boundaries where the holes form?

  58. Capitalist Piggy

    @Cynic

    That’s pretty much what I heard too.

    The Australian Government has admitted that the rorting is around $300 million.

    This is old news but doesn’t seem to have gained much traction in the media, probably because many of the rorters are indeed from the Middle-East.

    My question is this: where has that $300 million gone? Would it be too fanciful to wonder if at least some of it ended up in ISIS bank accounts?

  59. .

    Salvatore at the Pub
    #1891191, posted on December 18, 2015 at 12:37 pm
    It is the actual source of much of the criticism leveled at me here by Dot, JC and others,

    Dot & JC basing rants & personal attacks on piss-poor research & wrongology.

    Lol! Who’d a thunk it?

    So your claim there is a 22 km long open coal mine is correct? As is MV’s approval of the troofer theory on 9/11?

    Please, you’re walking into agony now Sal.

  60. memoryvault

    Genuine interest, MV, are you aware of the boundaries where the holes form?

    Not until I go looking for something and it’s not there, or some of it is not there. I know it should be there, I know I know it, I just can’t recall it. Speech is an interesting sub-set. I had to learn to speak again. But it’s not like before, it’s like speaking in another language where I have to think the thought in English, then translate it into Speaklish, then speak the translation. Often there are holes.

    The other day I was trying to explain “pecuniary interest” to my daughter-in-law. I can think pecuniary. I can write pecuniary. I can translate pecuniary into Speaklish in my head. But when I open my mouth to say it, gibberish comes out. I can practice until the cows come home. Makes no difference. Wherever pecuniary resides in my head, the pathway to my mouth is gone.

  61. memoryvault

    As is MV’s approval of the troofer theory on 9/11?

    I’m not going to bother biting, Dot.
    I’ve said before, I have no idea what happened on 9/11.
    So I don’t have, or support, any particular “theory”.
    All I know for sure is what didn’t happen.

  62. .

    The steel didn’t need to melt. It only had to be weakened and expand greater than the engineering tolerances.

  63. .

    What it really says to me is that these Commonwealth programs are run by such dills that there is money there just for the taking if you are larcenous enough to try your luck.

    There is no difference between defrauding this and getting a legitimate arts or other grant.

    We ought to live by morals, not laws. Laws are invented by arseholes.

  64. Bert A

    Memoryvault

    is your book available in ebook? googled but not found.
    As we are relocating to far away land only ebook purchases from now on.

  65. EB

    It’s getting like online advertising, next they’ll be building an allowance for fraud into their budget.

  66. memoryvault

    is your book available in ebook? googled but not found.

    Working on it.

  67. Tip of the iceberg stuff as usual. This is just one case of one of the fifty plus welfare payments that can be defrauded and there are many easier ones to rip off. They’ll be made an example of just to try and prove the Government is doing something but ultimately the scams will go on, more “transfers” (my new pet hate word) will be established and the welfare service class expanded further and filled with activists who gladly hand over OPM as they see it as a way of getting back at da rich.
    If you went by my defintion of welfare scam 80-90% of people would be guilty.

  68. Dr Faustus

    MV: Thanks for that.

  69. I’d like to read the Dolebludging ebook too MV, especially if you pop a short update on it regarding all the “reforms” that have happened since you wrote it.

  70. amortiser

    Dot,
    You are exactly right.

    There are billions of taxpayers dollars spent on “transfer” payments. That is, billions taken from some people and given to others. All this money is taken coercively.

    The bureaucrats are complaining that there is $300 million being rorted. The truth is they haven’t got a clue about the extent of the fraud taking place. Fraud, in their eyes, being funds transferred to people they haven’t really approved of. All transfer payments are ill gotten gains.

    When I have arguments with people about this it becomes very enlightening how they think. Take the arts grant recipient.

    I say to them why don’t you go to your neighbour and beg that he pays you the money you want to pursue your interest. The immediate reaction is that he would be embarrassed to so. So I then ask why you don’t go you your neighbour and threaten him with violence unless he gave you the money you wanted. Oh no!! He couldn’t do that, that would be illegal and criminal.

    So then I put it to him that that is exactly what he is doing when he goes to his political representative and requests that he works to extract funds from the taxpayer for that very purpose. The reaction to this is a blank stare. Blank Out!!

    Politicians can rob the citizenry blind and commit all sorts of criminal acts that are not allowed to the ordinary citizen. When a sufficient number of people become aware of this racket the concept of personal responsibility for ones actions is severely weakened and civilised society is progressively destroyed.

  71. Spongebob Steve Pants

    An ex father in law gave me my copy of the dole book. He loved the term ‘nirvana of dole bludging’, and the front cover. I must say I agree, but the whole thing is gold. Ive seen it on ebay here and there.

  72. Spongebob Steve Pants

    Biggest change in the world of welfare is the cross checking between the ATO and the DSS.

  73. memoryvault

    The bureaucrats are complaining that there is $300 million being rorted. The truth is they haven’t got a clue about the extent of the fraud taking place.

    Back in 1985 I spoke out about the mess our welfare system was in. I got canned from the public service. I was approached by “A Current Affair” (then called “Willesee”) and asked if I would rip the system off across the country while they filmed it. I was appalled by the idea. Instead I wrote “Dole Bludging – A Taxpayer’s Guide”.

    About the same time I was contacted by someone from the Special Minister of State department. He said back in Canberra they knew all about the problems. The PM (Hawke) knew about it, the Treasurer (Keating) knew about it. They had a plan to identify and fix the problems. Would I help? Would I work in with the Federal Police and help identify the problems in welfare? (Others were working in other areas). Eventually a Report would be made public, I would be exonerated, and re-admitted to the PS. I readily agreed.

    For the next several months I worked by phone with a group of AFP officers in Canberra. Then, early in 1986 Special Minister of State Mick Young announced in Parliament that he had a Report from the AFP, detailing $8 billion in fraud, much of it in various social services areas. Mr Young then went on to say that the Report would not be made public for operational reasons. However, it “proved” the need for a National ID Card.

    I phoned my contact in the Special Minister of State Department. He laughed and said I was a gullible patsy. The whole idea right from the beginning was to justify the “need” for an ID card. So then I phoned “A Current Affair”, and the rest is history.

    .
    Trust me, they have a pretty good idea of how much is getting creamed off, by whom, and where it is going. And yes, just like back when I wrote Dolebludging 30 years ago, most of it could be stopped tomorrow. It won’t be, because the whole idea is to send the country bankrupt, as I told Ray Martin – and a half a million viewers – on the Midday Show back in 1987.

  74. Combine Dave

    Failed state of Somalia sorry.

    Pick on Somalias?

    Last I looked regular Aussie welfare cheats weren’t planning terrorist attacks on Holdsworthy Barracks and going on jihad holidays,

    Actually a large number of these welfare dependent Jihadis are Australian born, so yes they are.

    or even conduct running battles involving a couple of hundred participants across Melbourne CBD.

    I know it’s not Melb CBD but Qld (Logan) has had numerous racial based riots were all participants were welfare recipients and all 100% Australian born and raised.

    The idea that generational welfare dependency is AOK as long as those sweet sweet Centrelink dollars are flowing to nonmuzzos is absolute bullshit.

    As aside if you were born in the 80s (and onwards) and you plan to arrange your finances as such so you can retire in a multi million dollar home and access the full pension.

    You should be shot.

    Out of a cannon.

    Into the sun.

  75. notafan

    Never suggested that life time dependency on welfare was admirable in anyone.

    What I said was that multi million dollar systemic fraud was a great thankyou for the gift of asylum.
    Btw ,Holdsworthy was a plot hatched in the Somalia refugee community and there have been a number of Somalis go join the reavers including a ‘fashion model’

    I was comparing Anglos with Somalis not other second generation muslim children of refugees.

    One thing is for sure, their commitment to Australia runs last.

    And who is ‘you’?

    I very much doubt anyone born in the 80s is planning any such thing. They won’t even be eligible for the age pension until they are 70.

  76. Combine Dave

    Never suggested that life time dependency on welfare was admirable in anyone.

    Good.

    What I said was that multi million dollar systemic fraud was a great thankyou for the gift of asylum.
    Btw ,Holdsworthy was a plot hatched in the Somalia refugee community and there have been a number of Somalis go join the reavers including a ‘fashion model’

    Agreed. I am not a huge fan of economic ‘refugees’. If anything the Trump doctrine is sorely needed in Australia.

    I was comparing Anglos with Somalis not other second generation muslim children of refugees.

    And how does either compare to the home grown aboriginal welfare industry and its frequently rioting clientele?

    And who is ‘you’?

    Anyone planning to suckle on my hard won income and depriving my poor family of much needed $ that I earned but was stolen from me via government theft (aka taxation).

    I very much doubt anyone born in the 80s is planning any such thing. They won’t even be eligible for the age pension until they are 70.

    Unfortunately the bulk of my colleagues (whether born 80s or earlier) plan to do so.

  77. notafan

    I don’t know.
    Again, other than Junaid Thorne and his brother, yet to hear much about jihadi type Aboriginals.

  78. old bloke

    Then, early in 1986 Special Minister of State Mick Young announced in Parliament that he had a Report from the AFP, detailing $8 billion in fraud, much of it in various social services areas.

    MV – I find that staggering. If you estimated fraud of $8 billion in 1986, how much is going out the window these days? Could you do a guest post here one day giving a breakdown of where this money is going?

  79. Combine Dave

    I don’t know.
    Again, other than Junaid Thorne and his brother, yet to hear much about jihadi type Aboriginals.

    Well you mentioned giant race riots earlier…

    Centerlink funded violence and not a Jihadi in sight – http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/queensland/logan-tensions-on-the-rise-after-cars-damaged-in-alleged-racial-attack/story-e6freoof-1226553302614

    I dont disagree that more needs to be done to crack down on specifically Islamic welfare cheats, purposefully migrating illegally here (successfully due to our compliant govs) to grow rich on our Jizya , but FFS our local ‘hard up’ crowd are far more numerous and far more fiscally damaging to our nation.

    Politically it would be a lot easier to ban all unwelcome invaders arriving from the Middle East than it would be to unwind the corrosive and corrupting effect that Australia’s never ending welfare for all has on the voting public.

    Morrison-Abbott had a great plan to cut or put time limits on welfare in specific desirable tourist locations, ie: long term welfare recipients on the gold coast, collecting the $ and enjoying the beach and night life.

    I believe Turnbull has since shitcanned this great idea (and almost all of their proposed savings measures).

  80. memoryvault

    Could you do a guest post here one day giving a breakdown of where this money is going?

    Only about half of that was via social security, Old Bloke. A significant proportion of that was via SPB, but the biggest area was the dole. All sorts of rorts. It was assessed on a weekly basis, but on a fortnightly form. Entire industries – for example the wharfies – would issue payslips showing all the hours actually worked across the fortnight, as being worked, and paid for, in the one week. That way the wharfie got a healthy pay packet for one week, and full dole for the other week for him, his wife and kids. Plus perks like a health care card etc.

    There were areas I wasn’t involved in, but heard about during the investigation. Medicare was one of the biggies. Amazing how many people chose to visit their GP ten or twelve times in the fortnight just prior to carking it. Or the GP visited them. Daily. Nobody left to dispute the fact.

    It is all ancient history now, Old Bloke. There are now so many ways to legally rort the system that only a fool would do it by illegal means. I don’t know any details of the case featured in this post, but I’d bet a testicle whatever they did, could have been done legally – and I’m quite sure IS being done legally, on a grand scale, by people prepared to cross the T’s and dot the I’s.

  81. memoryvault

    Morrison-Abbott had a great plan to cut or put time limits on welfare in specific desirable tourist locations, ie: long term welfare recipients on the gold coast, collecting the $ and enjoying the beach and night life.

    Tried in the 80’s with disastrous effects, Dave.

  82. old bloke

    Thanks MV. I knew one old dear who was visited at least twice a week by her (retired) doctor for a chat and a cup of tea. She wondered why he always asked her to sign a Medicare form whenever he dropped by for a cuppa. Both have now gone to meet their maker.

  83. Combine Dave

    Morrison-Abbott had a great plan to cut or put time limits on welfare in specific desirable tourist locations, ie: long term welfare recipients on the gold coast, collecting the $ and enjoying the beach and night life.

    Tried in the 80?s with disastrous effects, Dave.

    How so?

    Genuinely curious. The unintended consequence of gov policy is almost as funny as the tards that continue supporting such policies long after any positive benefit has long been overwhelmed by the negative.

  84. John Constantine

    Saw a bloke that used to work part time for me years ago, he was in the supermarket bottleshop yesterday.

    He and his missus are on disability, plus he gets carers pension for her and she gets carers pension for him.

    He just smokes and doesn’t eat food, she just drinks and doesn’t eat.
    Just slow euthanasia on the tax dollar, he is under a hundred pounds and don’t care.

  85. MV, I bought your first two books, and still my copy of “Green Hoax Effect” I just pulled it out when you mentioned it, and after a couple of pages realised that most was still relevent.
    Good work, thank you.

  86. Dr Faustus, if I remember correctly, this may be a function of the ‘holographic effect’ theory of mind that was touted about about twenty years ago.

  87. memoryvault

    Imcome reporting has changed so it looks like that week on week off has closed.

    Yes. Probably the only tangible thing I can claim to have helped accomplish in 25 years of activism.

    people moving to an ‘Area of Lower Employment Prospects ‘ can be . . .

    Yes. To answer Curious George’s query, whenever a law or regulation requires a bureaucrat to make a subjective decision, chaos will follow. Example: Nice young couple we met when we were living in Mt Beauty. Had more or less permanent seasonal employment at the Falls Creek ski resort during the snow season. Him as a waiter, her as a cook. Spent the rest of the year partially on the dole, with a bit of casual fill-in work around the place.

    We moved up to the Sunshine Coast, QLD, which was just taking off then (1988). We told them about all the hospitality jobs on offer. So they came up, found cheap digs in Landsborough, and started looking for jobs anywhere from Caloundra to Noosa. When they next handed in their dole forms they were advised they were suspended for 12 weeks.

    According to the nice lady at Centrelink, in her estimation, using the provided guidelines, Landsborough was an “area of lower employment prospects” than Mt Beauty. The fact that it was ski off-season and employment in prospects in Mt Beauty were zero, was irrelevant. The fact that employment prospects in Landsborough were zero was irrelevant. The fact that they were actually seeking work on the coastal strip where employment prospects were good, was irrelevant. If they wanted the dole, they would have to go back to Victoria. That was the official Last Word.

    It all became academic a few days later when they both scored jobs in Montville, and they had us to fall back on in the meantime, until the first pay-checks arrived. But all around Australia people were caught in the same vicious trap.

    To the system, generally the capital city is the place of highest employment, and officially prospects dwindle the further away you move. Since moving from one area to another invariably means moving through areas of lower employment than where you are coming from, or going to, effectively the rules actually prevent people moving around to find work, no matter how motivated they might be.

    Effectively they are kept penned up in the capitals and major regional centres, where overall employment prospects might be higher, but prospects for young people with no qualifications and little or no experience, for instance, might be zilch, and competition fierce. So they give up and go to the local beach instead, thereby accomplishing the exact opposite of what was intended.

  88. memoryvault

    PS – Sorry for the late reply – been getting in some retail therapy at Bunnings.

  89. Yon Toad

    Take a tour through Centrelink Auburn if you want to see how easy it is.

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