Tony’s economic narrative

This is what Tony Abbott thinks: Malcolm Turnbull lost without an economic agenda. This is what John Howard thinks: Tony Abbott would have won coming election. And this is what Tony Abbott now writes: In defence of my economic narrative and tough decisions. He begins:

The first law of governing is that you can’t spend what you can’t raise through taxes and borrowings; and the second law is that today’s borrowings have to be paid for — with interest — by tomorrow’s taxes. Governments, like households and businesses, have to live within their means.

You know, the Micawber Principle of public finance. Which really comes down to this: the reason it is still only just barely worth voting for any of those 54 unworthy bunch of nonentities in the Liberal Party is because Tony and others like him on his side of the speaker remain in the Parliament. The PM is exactly the kind of narcissistic buffoon most of us here took him to be.

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103 Responses to Tony’s economic narrative

  1. Malcolm’s Christmas card list just got a bit shorter!

  2. Ant

    The PM is exactly the kind of narcissistic buffoon most of us here took him to be.

    You can’t slam Maol for displaying these defects while pretending they’re absent in Trump.

  3. slow&easy

    Ant
    The PM is exactly the kind of narcissistic buffoon most of us here took him to be.

    You can’t slam Maol for displaying these defects while pretending they’re absent in Trump.

    There is a slight difference Trump maybe all you say he is, but he is not deposing a duly elected PM.
    Granted, I didn’t and still don’t like TA but the answer was anyone but Turnbull.

  4. Fleeced

    You can’t slam Maol for displaying these defects while pretending they’re absent in Trump

    Heh

  5. memoryvault

    You can’t slam Maol for displaying these defects
    while pretending they’re absent in Trump.

    Please! Trump already has his own current, dedicated thread, and Trump and the Republican campaigns already feature heavily on the current open thread. Do you reckon we could at least try and keep this thread on-topic and Trump-free?

    HINT: It’s about Australian (LNP) government expenditure and leadership.

  6. Tel

    Governments, like households and businesses, have to live within their means.

    Abbott sure can talk the good talk when he isn’t Prime Minster. Bloody awesome!

  7. A Lurker

    Please! Trump already has his own current, dedicated thread, and Trump and the Republican campaigns already feature heavily on the current open thread. Do you reckon we could at least try and keep this thread on-topic and Trump-free?

    Thank-you.Thank-you.Thank-you.Thank-you.Thank-you.Thank-you.Thank-you.Thank-you.
    Perhaps a persistent thread dedicated to the US election might be the best solution.

  8. Harald

    I can’t help it, but I read that article and think: “Great stuff.. In what country did he do all that?”
    .
    Amazing, their clear and crisp understanding of the importance of cutting gov’t spending and gov’t living within its means, when they are not in charge. Funny how that comes from the man whose government actually abolished the debt limit.
    .
    Additionally, if that wasn’t enough, I seem to recall tax hikes, new taxes, growing deficits, growing spending.
    .
    One thing good about Abbott I can say:
    Because of him I have a much better understanding of the two different main types of conservatism in Australia; how that specific band of Abbott’s conservatism allowed him to walk away from repealing 18C so easily and permanently – something many people still do not get, by the way. He was a conservative of the wrong type, made leader of a party with a more or less classic liberal philosophical leaning. That was never going to be a stable situation.

  9. Habib

    Not enough reason to vote for these malfeasant cretins. I hold grudges.

  10. Eyrie

    Howard, the horrible little statist shit should STFU and disappear out of public life.

  11. Pyrmonter

    The economic reality under TA: exclude foreign capital (ADM/Graincorp; increased FIRB scrutiny); refuse to reform IR because spooked by “work choices”; unable to do anything about fiscal policy (except raise taxes); trumpet abolition of the Catbon Tax, but retain the more pernicious RET.

    Turnbull may be little – indeed, even not – better than Abbott; but he’s not worse.

  12. slow&easy

    Harald
    I can’t help it, but I read that article and think: “Great stuff.. In what country did he do all that?”

    Harald, ditto!

    Isn’t it strange they all see the light as soon as they are removed from power?

  13. Combine Dave

    made leader of a party with a more or less classic liberal philosophical leaning. T

    Turnbull’s light bulb ban says ‘lolnope’

  14. Ubique

    It’s high time for conservative politicians to savage the media at every opportunity. Personal attacks seem to work best. Don’t just complain about lefty bias – attack on the basis of the interviewer’s demonstrated repeated lefty bias.

  15. TC

    Mal would still be handing out money to Ford , Holden , Toyota , Qantas and SPC , Abbott did what he could and Mal & Julie leaked and white anted the whole time.

  16. handjive

    PM Talkbull obviously believes Shorten’s threat to property prices is greater than Global Warming:

    “Turnbull is deadly serious about the case against the Shorten plan that he eventually settled on.
    He genuinely believes the Labor policy would drive down property values, and he is certain that if he can persuade voters of that the electoral consequences for Labor will be devastating.
    But he has struggled to get his message across clearly.”

    http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/opinion/laurie-oakes-voters-cant-stand-this-indecision/news-story/d837c5edcc5adefe009a0aae8bb68000

    Malcolm Turnbull spending $95,000 for a private jetty at his Point Piper mansion

    http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/nsw/malcolm-turnbull-spending-95000-for-a-private-jetty-at-his-point-piper-mansion/news-story/dcb7f3c058cfe0221ec0b5858cc4ded0

  17. Ant

    Oh, ok then. Inconsistency shall have borders from here on. Gotcha.

  18. Struth

    Abbott was A WOL on the economy.
    That’s what started this whole problem off.
    It allowed Malcom in.
    Yes Malcom is far worse than Abbott, but Abbott was no good either.
    He is a social conservative, not an economic one.
    He talks the talk, but it’s not a priority to him.
    And even socially he backed down on 18c.
    Steve, your man fetish for Abbott should have calmed down by now.

  19. Token

    The first law of governing is that you can’t spend what you can’t raise through taxes and borrowings; and the second law is that today’s borrowings have to be paid for — with interest — by tomorrow’s taxes. Governments, like households and businesses, have to live within their means.

    Great point by Tony. Why did he hold onto that stupid maternity scheme and agree to the Labor ballasts on the economy like the NDIS?

    There are a few more mea culpa’s he owes us.

  20. egg_

    Abbott blew it by hiding beneath Credlin’s apron strings.

  21. BOB

    I reckon the only ex PMs worth listening to are those who left of their own accord ie, the ones not fired by their own party or the electorate. Why would anyone listen to the opinions of an employee dismissed for incompetence?

    Abbott is the latest to demonstrate the point – now he’s he’s telling us what needed doing doing but, which he did not do.

  22. Andrew

    indeed, even not – better than Abbott; but he’s not worse.

    Are you kidding? He’s revoked / withdrawn many of the minor cuts A666ott made, handed $1bn to the UNSSR for climate corruption, initiated public funding for Big Wind, hinting at Gonski, retained all the tax increases to date and is adding higher CGT and taxes on pensioners, imposing double taxation on property investors and has created a small ETS (“purchases of O/S credits”). He’s sacked conservatives like Nikolic, tried (and failed) to fellate the cross benchers, announced huge defence wastage in the DPRSA, handed out Fed money on state public transport projects, reversed border protection by the first slippery step.

    And tried to increase the GST to 15% on the advice of some idiot. Oh that’s right – that arseclown Parkinson who A666ott FIRED!

    No worse that A666ott???

  23. Aussiepundit

    Tony’s economic narrative

    Abbott and Hockey tried to sell their disastrous first budget with the narrative of “fairness.” Remember? That was Abbott’s economic narrative.

    Fairness.

    Oh yeah, and getting “on track” to a “believable” surplus, but not in the lifetime of anyone sitting on a parliament seat with the possible exception of Wyatt Roy. In other words, deficits as far as the eye could see.

    Fairness and deficits. That was the Abbott narrative.

  24. Aussiepundit

    “Fairness and deficits, but Labor would be worse.”

  25. slow&easy

    Aussiepundit
    “Fairness and deficits, but Labor would be worse.”

    Is that comment coming with a /sarc tag or do you mean it?

    Labor could indeed be worse but a couple of terms of labor govs. would help to clean out the Lib’s deadwood wets or make them redundant altogether as a political party.
    Either way at least we’d know what to expect.

  26. Baldrick

    egg_
    #1959056, posted on February 27, 2016 at 4:22 pm
    Abbott blew it by hiding beneath Credlin’s apron strings.

    Abbott/Credlin – bad, because Turnbull/Clarke – better … oh, hang on …

  27. egg_

    Baldrick
    #1959071, posted on February 27, 2016 at 4:39 pm

    Recall the bunker?
    I hope, if he had his time again, he’d have done things differently, but he blew it.

  28. Robber Baron

    Turnbull only has to keep the 54 on-side and to hell with everyone else. They are his power, not the electorate. He has no rival. No one will vote for Morrison in a spill. No one will vote for Bishop (have you noticed how the leaks have all stopped?) There will be no spill. Election dates have already been agreed upon. Turnbull will lead the Liberals to a historic election defeat. It’s all coming apart for Malcolm.

  29. Token

    Abbott and Hockey tried to sell their disastrous first budget with the narrative of “fairness.” Remember? That was Abbott’s economic narrative.

    Fairness.

    That was Staple’s idea, and omg was it stillborn.

    Every time they would get momentum Staples would reintroduce the politics of envy as he seemed to live under the delusion that if he did the medja would love him.

  30. Baldrick

    egg_
    #1959072, posted on February 27, 2016 at 4:42 pm
    I hope, if he had his time again, he’d have done things differently, but he blew it.

    It’s a bit unfair to blame the problem solely on the AbbottBeast. He was being undermined, leaked against and back-stabbed, all for the sake of change.

  31. memoryvault

    Turnbull will lead the Liberals to a historic election defeat.

    Agreed. But I don’t think Turdbull actually gives a toss. “Become PM” was on his bucket list. Now it’s been ticked off. He’s probably already planning his next accomplishment, whatever that is.

  32. Token

    It’s a bit unfair to blame the problem solely on the AbbottBeast. He was being undermined, leaked against and back-stabbed, all for the sake of change.

    An election should sort out a lot of the left & hard left marginals that will never will be like Laundy and van whatever south of Brisbane so the party can focus on the people who represent the real voters of the party.

  33. Dan

    The PM is exactly the kind of narcissistic buffoon most of us here took him to be

    And the former PM is exactly the kind of narcissistic buffoon most of us here took him to be.

    Was he a non-practising small government activist in secret while he was PM or did someone clamp his eyelids open and forcefeed him Milton Friedman Youtube videos after he was chucked out?

  34. Dubbxe

    Agreed. Turnbull is another peacock. Which was what Andrew Peacock was: a peacock.

  35. Dan

    He was being undermined, leaked against and back-stabbed, all for the sake of change.

    Waterboarded and forced to increase my marginal tax rate by 2% too no doubt. I have several thousand reasons not to be sympathetic about that.

  36. memoryvault

    He was being undermined, leaked against and back-stabbed,
    all for the sake of change.

    Yeah. By a cabinet of his own choosing.
    Turdbull, Pyne and Hunt should have been relegated to the backbench from day one.
    Instead they were each given major portfolios.
    I mean, putting Turdbull in charge of the ABC?
    That would be like the Yanks arming ISIS.
    Oh . . . wait . . .

  37. memoryvault

    the party can focus on the people who represent the real voters of the party.

    You mean the ones who “don’t matter”?
    First they have to get them back. No mean feat.

  38. slow&easy

    Dubbxe
    Agreed. Turnbull is another peacock. Which was what Andrew Peacock was: a peacock.

    True but a good judge of horseflesh, and a good punter, spent many enjoyable hours with him at the Caulfield TAB.
    Some people should never go into politics.
    PS
    Not a friend just a fellow punter and on that level he was great.

  39. Nanuestalker

    Agreed. But I don’t think Turdbull actually gives a toss. “Become PM” was on his bucket list. Now it’s been ticked off. He’s probably already planning his next accomplishment, whatever that is.

    +1

    One should also remember that Little Johnny put his ego before the country & party and let in Rudd/Gillard…

  40. slow&easy

    memoryvault
    That would be like the Yanks arming ISIS.
    Oh . . . wait . . .

    You can be funny MV LOL

  41. Baldrick

    Dan
    #1959085, posted on February 27, 2016 at 5:03 pm
    Waterboarded and forced to increase my marginal tax rate by 2% too no doubt. I have several thousand reasons not to be sympathetic about that.

    No, he wasn’t perfect but has Lord Kardashian reversed that decision?

  42. cynical1

    Politicians are like dog shite.

    Some smell more, none smells nice.

    Funny how they all become the wise man.

    After leaving office…

  43. Dan

    He was a conservative of the wrong type, made leader of a party with a more or less classic liberal philosophical leaning.

    Perhaps I suffer from some rigidity of thinking but a party that taxes me at 50%, spends more than a coalition funded by unionists and Greens who literally are ‘former’ communists…spends hundreds of millions of dollars putting priests and imams in schools across the country despite being specifically told not to, twice by the High Court…if that qualifies as the ‘classical liberal’ side of politics we really are screwed.

    Actually we are screwed.

  44. cynical1

    One should also remember that Little Johnny put his ego before the country & party and let in Rudd/Gillard…

    Or maybe he knew Costello was wise man.

    Hands up those who saw a future leader in Morrison…

  45. Dan

    No, he wasn’t perfect but has Lord Kardashian reversed that decision?

    Neither has my barber, what’s your point? i’m not suggesting a single person in the LNP has a clue.

  46. cynical1

    Or maybe he knew Costello was another wise man.

  47. The first law of governing is that you can’t spend what you can’t raise through taxes and borrowings

    Ahhhh, if only that were an actual law. Then again, drop the borrowings bit and it’s even better. It would stop the Labor rodeo of spendspendspend then whinewhinewhine as the Libs cutcutcut (although they seem to have given up on that).
    Make it law that if you blow the Budget by more than 5% your party cannot run for election in the next term. That would focus a few minds.

  48. memoryvault

    Make it law that if you blow the Budget by more than 5% your party cannot run for election in the next term. politicians get ten years for misappropriation of Commonwealth funds. That would focus a few minds.

    FIFY

  49. Megan

    The PM is exactly the kind of narcissistic buffoon most of us here took him to be.

    That is completely insulting to narcissistic buffoons.

  50. The first law of governing is that you can’t spend what you can’t raise through taxes and borrowings

    Perhaps a law that forces Governments to budget no more than the previous years revenue. Do the budget late August early September.

  51. mem

    Seems to me that JH and TA have now done Mal’s pre-budget “times are tough and we need to rein in spending” warm-up routine so he can now look like the good guy when he only pulls the belt in half a notch. Maybe the Turnbull’s coup was a planned strategy ? Just joking about the planned bit, but they have certainly done his ground work for him. If he can’t work off this base he really is a lame duck.

  52. sabrina

    Is any commercial organization looking for TA to join them? Career academics, career politicians, lawyers and accountants are the source of problems in this country.

  53. Stackja

    TA is right.
    MT is wrong.

  54. Sean

    Good to see Abbott preparing for a career in comedy after politics.

  55. gabrianga

    No need for a jetty at Point Piper. No need, even for a boat, if you can walk on water.

    Hope Abbott and Howard continue to give Lord of Wentworth,his fair lady, Bishop, and the other craven deserters many more sleepless nights.

  56. J.H.

    Harald wrote… “One thing good about Abbott I can say:
    Because of him I have a much better understanding of the two different main types of conservatism in Australia; how that specific band of Abbott’s conservatism allowed him to walk away from repealing 18C so easily and permanently “

    Abbott had a hostile Senate that would not have passed any changes on 18c…. Sure he could have used it as a DD trigger…. But with Turnbull’s constant white anting Abbott would have probably been deposed even earlier than he currently was if he’d gone commando on the Senate over 18c.

    Politics is a numbers game…. If you don’t have the numbers, you can’t achieve your objective. It’s pretty simple. Abbott won Government without a Senate. Remember Gillard. She led a minority Government in the Lower house, but owned the Senate. Passed 500 pieces of legislation, the Rudd/Gillard/Rudd regime did.

  57. Habib

    All of it bad. What’s it say about this socialist shithole that a mark of success for a legislature is how much intrusive and unnecessary rules it can plonk onto statute? Any sentient and sober government would be judged on what busybody bullshit they repealed. And apologised for its imposition.

  58. Leigh Lowe

    Agreed. Turnbull is another peacock. Which was what Andrew Peacock was: a peacock.

    Peacock was, in fact, a peacock, it is true.
    Turnbull, however, is just a cock.

  59. Pusnip

    Another delusional post from the craziest sore loser on The Cat, eulogising the weakest Liberal PM since at least McMahon. Best description of Abbott today? ‘A non-practising small government activist’ – LOL.
    Those of us who value fiscally responsible government need an electable champion in parliament. Abbott is neither electable nor a champion. Stop giving the deadbeat oxygen.

  60. Aussiepundit

    “Fairness and deficits, but Labor would be worse.”

    Is that comment coming with a /sarc tag or do you mean it?

    Comes with a sardonic tag, but not sarcasm.
    Abbott/Hockey really did market their first budget with the “fairness” concept.
    They really did justify their abysmal projections by saying that Labor would have done an even worse job.
    And they really did construct the budget so that there would be deficits for many, many years to come.
    So all these things were actually key parts of Abbott’s economic narrative.

  61. Aussiepundit

    Abbott had a hostile Senate that would not have passed any changes on 18c

    Oh really. And how do you know? How does anyone know?
    Politicians are, at a very basic level, elected to do one thing: vote. Vote on legislation.
    Politicians are not elected to huddle in back rooms, talk to each other about how they would have voted, and then hold a press conference about what some fictitious vote might or might not have been.

    If you believe in a law, and you were elected to bring in that law, bring in the legislation and let’s have a public vote.

    That way, we can see where everyone stands on the issue. Right now, honestly, we don’t know where everyone stands. We don’t even know for sure where Abbott stands on it.

  62. Harald

    J.H.,
    You have that wrong, I think.
    .
    Have you seen, by any chance, the Bolt Report interview with Abbott? It was very telling. I couldn’t find the clip quickly enough, but here is a transcript of the part that gave some insight into the thinking of Abbott: link
    .
    Those who read Abbott’s book Battlelines were probably not as surprised by the quote, like I wasn’t.
    .
    The Tennyson quote is a reference to Common Law (instead of Statutory Law). And Abbott brings this up in an answer to a question whether Australians should be freer, this was in context of the 18C discussion.
    .
    Look closely at Abbott’s words here in his reply to “Should Australians be freer?”
    .
    Abbott: “Well, that’s the classic Liberal position, isn’t it? Lower taxes, smaller government, greater freedom – that’s the classic Liberal position.”
    .
    This could easily be mistaken for agreeing with Bolt that Australians should be freer. But it is just an acknowledgement that this is indeed the liberal position. And then Abbott continues to articualte the conservative position – his position:
    .
    “And then of course there’s the classic conservative position – respect for the family, respect for institutions and values that have stood the test of time, and the Coalition that I have the honour to lead is the Australian custodian of both the liberal and the conservative traditions.”
    .
    So yes? No? Should Australians be freer in the context of the 18C discussion? Where is he going here?
    .
    Then the next section of the answer:
    .
    Abbott: “I think it was Tennyson who summed it up, Andrew, when he talked of ‘a land of just and old renown, a land of settled government, where freedom broadened slowly down from precedent to precedent.’ I think that nicely captures the paradox of freedom and order.”
    .
    So it is a clear balance here for Abbott. Abbott agrees that 18C is bad law, because it is statutory type law – one size fits all for every situation. But he thinks at the same time that there should be order based on precedent. My conclusion here is that Abbott wanted to get rid of 18C, and instead wants to put in its place a Common Law based solution, where there is more flexibility.
    .
    So Abbott fundamentally disagrees on the liberty principle: There must be law. Just different kind of law. A particular jackboot on your throat that fits that particular circumstance.
    .
    This view is also fully consistent with the fact that Brandis’ remark “we all have the right to be bigots” was so damaging. Abbott fully disagrees with that statement. According to him we don’t. Speech must be regulated. Just by a different method.
    .
    For me there is a principle at stake in the 18C discussion. For Abbott it is more about what type of law do we need to micromanage peoples conversations. That makes it much easier to walk away from the reform, too. Which is what he did.
    .
    That walking away happened by the way, in the context of the islamic radicalisation. That was also telling. Abbott had been advised that removing the 18C control on speech would cause grave difficulties with the islamic community, resulting in increased radicalisation. (I disagree with that causal relationship, but that is besides the point.)
    .
    That meant Abbott, had he gone ahead and repealed 18C, he would have had to replace it with this other type of law quickly. But that cannot be done, because of the nature of common law: it needs precedents to establish the outcomes. Which in this case means: Abbott would have needed the confidence that society could handle that freedom: let the chips fly where they may, go through the tribulation of the cases, produce the precedent in common law. In that process lies the freedom if you can call it that: in that process of exploration to find out the precedent.
    .
    But Abbott did not have that confidence that society would handle having this freedom and regulate itself. He talked the talk, but faced with the reality, he did not walk the walk. He did not believe that we could handle it.

  63. Clam Chowdah

    No! Sinc says Mal is awesome!

  64. FRR

    For me the basic test is why are they politician in parliament self interest or self importance or really to try and make a difference to the country – compare abbot, howard and turnbull on this parameters

  65. Aussiepundit

    No! Sinc says Mal is awesome!

    Just better than Tony.

  66. gowest

    The first law of governing is that you can’t spend what you can’t raise through taxes and borrowings.
    Good way to wedge the opposition, but it wont work Tony. When a hostile senate uses it belt you, follow the penultimate law!
    Govern so that you can win the next election by making sure you spend the money on electorates that vote for your side!

  67. memoryvault

    If you believe in a law, and you were elected to bring in that law,
    bring in the legislation and let’s have a public vote.

    Therein lies the nub of the matter. A lot of the things people claim were blocked by a “hostile senate”, were, in fact, never put up for a vote in the senate. Particularly the “old” senate that Abbott inherited, and which remained in force until July 1, 2014.

  68. Habib

    Just better than Tony. How, exactly?

  69. mr skeletor

    The Turnbull tossers only have Abbott666 shit left.
    When Malcom gets his ass creamed in the next election no doubt it will all have been Tony’s fault, will cry the Cats who support Sanders.

  70. memoryvault

    it will all have been Tony’s fault, will cry the Cats who support Sanders.

    What on earth does the result of an Australian election for the Federal Parliament, have to do with a communist running for Democrat pre-selection for the U.S. Presidential campaign?

  71. Adam R

    Oh yes. Tony Abbott has all the answers for fixing the economy now that he’s been booted out of office. The problem is that while he was actually in office, all he did was ADD to the deficit. This career politician fraud makes me sick and I wish people would stop calling him a conservative. Besides his crackpot religious beliefs and his personal stance on abortion, in what sense is he conservative?

    Stop kidding yourselves- there are NO conservative options in Australian politics period. You get a choice between socialist party A, and socialist party B. Both parties stand for big government, big taxes, big spending, big deficits, big regulation, constant attacks on personal freedoms and the expansion of the police/ nanny state.

    The only bloke with a clue in that cess-pit they call Canberra is David Leyonhjelm.

  72. mareeS

    I’m just finishing a book on the life of Cicero (reading, not writing) and it is interesting that Julius Caesar, possibly the greatest egotist in history apart from Napoleon, features as an incompetent wrecker of the Roman republic’s social fabric, much like Obama has been for the US, and Lord Wentworth is shaping up in our tiny slice of the globe.

    These people only come along every once in a while, narcissistic buggers that they are, but boyoboy, they do some damage that takes years to fix.

    Meanwhile, we’re pulling the plug on civilization and heying off to west papua for a month or so. Should be interesting.

  73. CR

    Tel, Abbott has been reciting the ‘government must live within their means’ slogan for years. Since he was opposition leader. Look ot up.

  74. Aaron

    The only bloke with a clue in that cess-pit they call Canberra is David Leyonhjelm.

    Isn’t that the bloke who supported the Labor/Union smear campaign against Dyson Heydon?

  75. Aussiepundit

    The practice of figuring out which legislation will pass, and which will not, via lots of backroom meetings, then withholding the legislation that “would have been voted down” is a corruption of the process.

  76. BorisG

    Caesar, possibly the greatest egotist in history apart from Napoleon, features as an incompetent wrecker of the Roman republic’s social fabric, much like Obama has been for the US, and Lord Wentworth is shaping up in our tiny slice of the globe.

    I am sure both Obama and Turnbull would be elated by the comparison, but it is not accurate. Do you think people will remember either of them 2000 years form now. Turnbull is not wrecking anything. He is doing nothing, good or bad. he has not usurped any powers any more than Howard, Rudd, Guillard, or Abbott (or Hawke or Keating for that matter). He is the opposite of Caesar in that respect.

    There is a cultural shift in the western societies, which is indeed dangerous, and Obama and Turnbull are symptoms of this, not the drivers. Especially Turnbull.

  77. John L

    Abbot and Barnaby Joice should form a new truly liberal party. Take all liberal members that have brains, and there are a few, and take all National members that have brains, and there are a few, with them. Do not take, and I repeat, do not take in any members of the gang of 54! They will be voted out at the next election and theirs seats will go to the new party. This will prevent the leakage of seats to Labour as angry voters will have somewhere to go.
    After taking over, the new party should immediately call the double dissolution to get rid of the silly clowns in the Senate and then start governing and kicking goals and heads.

  78. BorisG

    John, Conservative party would be more accurate.

  79. Combine Dave

    Just better than Tony. How, exactly?

    MT wont fail to repeal s18.

    MT will cut spending.

    Tax rises will never be considered under a MT gov….

    Oh wait on all those issues Turnbull, that rich socialistic prick-classic liberal my arse, did worse than Abbott.

    Abbott was shit, but thank Christ he stopped the boats, stopped the waste going to Holden/Ford/Toyota Australia/SPC and attempted to stop those busted arse canoe builders the ASC (before being overruled by Lord Waffler).

  80. Bob

    Is there a problem Turnbull cannot solve merely by grinning at it?

  81. John L

    BorisG
    #1959465, posted on February 28, 2016 at 5:15 am
    John, Conservative party would be more accurate.

    I don’t care what name or label the new party have. As long they would have the guts and fortitude to turn this country around and steer it on the right path, and make this country great again!

  82. Tel

    Tel, Abbott has been reciting the ‘government must live within their means’ slogan for years. Since he was opposition leader. Look ot up.

    Yeah, he talked big in opposition, no doubt.

    I never disputed that… just sad that he forgot about it for the brief period while he was PM.

  83. Aussiepundit

    MT wont fail to repeal s18.
    MT will cut spending.
    Tax rises will never be considered under a MT gov….

    Oh wait on all those issues Turnbull, that rich socialistic prick-classic liberal my arse, did worse than Abbott.

    No, on all those issues Turnbull did exactly the same as Abbott.

  84. Rabz

    Just better than Tony.

    How, exactly?

    LOL. A question that the Waffler’s fluffers here are incapable of answering.

  85. BarBar

    Australia very lucky Tony has such a strong economic narrative to pitch when he takes over as Leader of the Opposition later this year.

  86. BorisG

    Abbot and Barnaby Joice should form a new truly liberal party.

    This would be interesting. Then we will find out how much support conservatives have. a small problem is that Barnaby is happy where he is.

  87. Linden

    yes he most certainly was! and I for one is most bitterly disappointed by Abbott’s inability to communicate the message, albeit he copped the most horrendous under mining campaign from the ABC et`all all the way.

  88. Aussiepundit

    Just better than Tony.
    How, exactly?

    Malcolm has left all major Coalition policies in place: therefore, on that front, about the same as Tony.

    The rate of new spending proposals has slowed. Therefore, on this one, better than Tony.

    Malcolm has not made any really dumb, ridiculous comments on TV. (cf “shirtfronting”, for example). Therefore, better than Tony.

    Malcolm has a better run office. Therefore better than Tony.

    That’s not the end of the list, but it will do for a start.

  89. Ros

    Thought even the Insiders were a little worried this morning about Malcolm’s economic message. Managed to blame others though, like Morrison. Except Farr. Pointed out Turnbull dropping Morrison in it on a regular basis and then telling all in private that Morrison keeps stuffing up.

    And I am not sure, but I think Farr covertly said Turnbull was leaking on Morrison. While hardly surprising in one sense, Turnbull just can’t help himself, will always be the nasty school bully, it is a bizarre thing for a PM to do to his Treaurer. Maybe he is just thinking along the lines of his destruction of Abbott, nothing personal, just business. Can not see how the Liberal Party can survive his bizarre form of leadership.

    Then there is Jennifer Oriel building Turnbull up, she thought by claiming he was a centrist, though centrist was moving rightish? And centrists struggle with economic narratives I think was her point. So a party that formed in 1944 as a right of centre and has been so ever since even if the balance between conservative and liberal moved around a bit, has now got a centrist party embedded in it. No wonder it is falling apart. What sort of economic narrative can emerge from that strange party form.

  90. Harald

    Aussiepundit,
    🙂
    How many of those are a credit to Mal’s own independent choices, you think? And which are a result of the negotiations with the right wing in exchange for their conditional support required to become and remain PM?
    .
    I would give him 2: the dumb remarks bit, and the better run office. Nothing of substance of policy, that is. On policy matters – the substance of it- he’d be worse on nearly every point.
    .
    That said, having Abbott argue for lower government spending and government living within its means… This the guy whose government removed the debt ceiling, permanently. Try to get that genie back in its bottle. Forget it. That will be one of the longest lasting Abbott legacies.

  91. Habib

    Malcolm has left all major Coalition policies in place: therefore, on that front, about the same as Tony.

    The rate of new spending proposals has slowed. Therefore, on this one, better than Tony.

    Malcolm has not made any really dumb, ridiculous comments on TV. (cf “shirtfronting”, for example). Therefore, better than Tony.

    Malcolm has a better run office. Therefore better than Tony.

    So he’s done nothing. Why the change then? What about the cash thrown at the UN, assorted warmy boondoggles, and shortly to those incompetent cretins at the ASC? Once you penetrate the tortured prose and bland rhetoric, he basically doesn’t make any comments at all, except to pump some more psi into his already dangerously over-inflated ego. We have no idea how his office is run, as it’s not bering subject to a constant campaign of destabilisation and media backgrounding. At best a D-, please try again.

    Although I think him basically honest and committed to what he believes to be right, I’m no Abbott shill, and was a constant critic; far too DLP for me. His userper on the other hand was a shit failure last time around, and allowed a sociopathic egotist who publicly consumed his own secretions to make him his bitch. History again repeats.

  92. John L

    Long, long time ago the Insiders became irrelevant. Long, long time ago ABC became irrelevant. Sell it! Or better give it as a gift to worst enemy.
    First and fatal mistake Abbott made when he failed to call double dissolution the moment the Senate provided the trigger.
    After that everything is academic.

  93. egg_

    Abbott was shit, but thank Christ he stopped the boats, stopped the waste going to Holden/Ford/Toyota Australia/SPC and attempted to stop those busted arse canoe builders the ASC (before being overruled by Lord Waffler).

    Yet both Abbott and Turnbull kowtow to their agrarian socialist partners.
    Manufacturing vs Ag, huh?
    What’s the comparative export income for the Taxpayers’ well earned?

  94. Crossie

    Not enough reason to vote for these malfeasant cretins. I hold grudges.

    And the MPs have to be made to feel the effects of the grudges, it’s the only way they learn.

  95. Crossie

    Abbott was A WOL on the economy.
    That’s what started this whole problem off.
    It allowed Malcom in.

    I read somewhere that Mal started undermining the government from the moment the election victory was declared. What’s more, opposition to repealing 18C came from Mal’s faction.

  96. Crossie

    I reckon the only ex PMs worth listening to are those who left of their own accord ie, the ones not fired by their own party or the electorate. Why would anyone listen to the opinions of an employee dismissed for incompetence?

    BOB, if your dictum had been followed in the past there would have been no second terms for Churchill or Menzies.

  97. Pusnip

    Malcolm is not Tony and is therefore better than Tony – the worst Liberal leader since at least McMahon.

  98. Ros

    Better run office. Depends how you measure such things. The ministers are supposed to be getting their New Policy Proposals in and some a bit slow. So this well run office does some “sources said” on this exciting topic, accompanied by

    “Mr Clarke’s call for ministerial chiefs of staff to submit their proposals was “much smoother and friendlier, there were fewer threats, unlike the previous leadership”, one source familiar with the meeting said.”

    Well thank goodness Peta isn’t there anymore or she might have added some nasty remarks about Malcolm say. That would be so unprofessional.

    Further the office staff sources added,

    “Work has been underway for months because everyone knows the election is going to be sometime this year,” that second source said.:

    I was sure that they would have it in the second fortnight of January 2017. Good thing they are on top of when the election is due in that office.

    And then there is Arthur. Star Wars gave me an evil thought, a nick name for Arthur, “Darth Sidious” He is very efficient in his way.

    As for really dumb comments, lets revisit Darwin. He declares in an interview, on local Darwin radio, that Darwin port was not used by the military only commercial. He followed it up with a release saying all he meant was that it was a commercial port not a military one. It advertises itself as a military port, for both Australian and other nations navies, though probably not the Chinese.. Then there is his putdown of Obama and the Americans, admittedly not one of his better ones,

    “it was put to me that the first thing they had read about it was in The Wall Street Journal. He advised Obama he should take up reading a more authoritative source, that he should invest in a subscription to the Northern Territory News, because it was not a secret.””
    And, so funny
    “I did say to him even the US president would struggle to get onto the front page of the NT News without a crocodile angle,” Turnbull said.

    The Americans weren’t happy about this port lease, and Malcolm admitted he had been advised of their concerns before his public meeting with Obama where he had a laugh at him. Dumb Malcolm, really dumb. And it is worth saying if it had been Abbott rather than cute charming grinning Turnbull the press would have been apoplectic.

    Not so cute anymore though. Not grinning as much either.

    Of course as it turned out it was the mistake of public officials not Malcolm.

  99. egg_

    Well thank goodness Peta isn’t there anymore or she might have added some nasty remarks about Malcolm say. That would be so unprofessional.

    He may have used her – spectacularly unsuccessfully as LOTO – but, notably, not in Government.

  100. BarBar

    Ros
    #1959620, posted on February 28, 2016 at 12:24 pm
    Thought even the Insiders were a little worried this morning about Malcolm’s economic message. Managed to blame others though, like Morrison. Except Farr. Pointed out Turnbull dropping Morrison in it on a regular basis and then telling all in private that Morrison keeps stuffing up.
    And I am not sure, but I think Farr covertly said Turnbull was leaking on Morrison

    Indeed he did. And he also wondered how long Morrison will put up with it.
    Turnbull’s form in this respect is not just the previous PM but also shafting Brendan Nelson when Opposition Leader.

    Re Peta Credlin: It didn’t get much publicity but in the Parliament Turnbull accused and mocked Tony Burke for having two negatively geared investment properties.
    Turned out Burke had sold both properties years ago. Turnbull had to retract in the parliament and also wrote a letter of apology to Burke.
    Such an incident can only be the result of piss poor staff work. Won’t be the last example either.

    Odds shorten (pun intended) on treasurer resigning and sitting alongside Abbott on the backbench
    before too long.

  101. Leo G

    Abbott was A WOL on the economy.
    That’s what started this whole problem off.
    It allowed Malcom in.

    The “whole problem” started much earlier and was “going strong” when Malcolm Turnbull was elected Liberal leader in September 2008. Malcolm even warned us. He said that having a liberal leader who admitted having smoked marijuana was a bad idea because the drug caused brain damage.
    The “problem” is further elaborated by the dialectic of this thread. Do we really need to know which of two pin heads better supports 54 skittish seraphs?
    Nearly time to move on.
    Anyone for all-in skittles?

  102. Rabz

    So he’s done nothing. Why the change then? What about the cash thrown at the UN, assorted warmy boondoggles, and shortly to those incompetent cretins at the ASC? Once you penetrate the tortured prose and bland rhetoric, he basically doesn’t make any comments at all, except to pump some more psi into his already dangerously over-inflated ego. We have no idea how his office is run, as it’s not bering subject to a constant campaign of destabilisation and media backgrounding. At best a D-, please try again

    Thank you, Squire. An excellent response to the Waffler fluffers that are blighting this site.

  103. Rabz

    He said that having a liberal leader who admitted having smoked marijuana was a bad idea because the drug caused brain damage.

    LOL “drugs are bad, m’kay?

    Does anyone here seriously think that neither Abbott nor the Waffler evah smoked the weed when they were costing taxpayers an unrecoverable fortune during their university days?

    FFS.

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