Paul Kelly on Trump

Paul Kelly has an op-ed this morning warning about the consequences of a Trump presidency.

Essential to this disruption is the confusion at the heart of the Trump debate in Australia: while Trump is extolled by some conservatives, Trump himself is not a conservative. He is a radical nationalist, protectionist and reactionary, trading in nostalgia who seeks a dramatic revision in the existing order.

I think Kelly is missing an important point. Trump is an isolationist – this has a long and respectable pedigree in US politics. Historically the US has had to be dragged into intervening in world affairs. They were very late to both world wars, for example.

Kelly points to a number of issues:

  • The TPP: Trump will withdraw from the TPP. Kelly discusses the TPP in geo-political terms – it’s all about isolating China. Yet criticises Trump for suggesting this trade deal doesn’t benefit the US.  It was Obama’s job to convince the US that the TPP was a good deal for them.  In any event, there is nothing stopping the remaining 11 partners from still signing up to the TPP. Or even following unilateral trade liberalisation.
  • Climate Change: Kelly has the funniest line I’m expecting to see all day – “Trump will be depicted as a threat to the planet and the most dangerous man on earth” –  like that hasn’t happened already.
  • National Security: Let’s be very clear here – maintaining Australian national security is first and foremost an Australian government responsibility, not the Americans. That means that our national security spend cannot and should not constitute industry policy and welfare for South Australia. So military platforms and  military systems that secure Australia’s national integrity, not job creation in Liberal marginal seats in Adelaide.

The post-World War II liberal order is about to get a shake-up. Those international institutions, like the UN, the EU, the World Bank, the IMF, the WTO , OECD, etc. are going to have to justify their existence. This is not inherently bad – these massive anti-democratic and frankly increasingly illiberal institutions  are on notice. For all his personal faults and bad taste, Trump knows a bullshit story where he hears one (that is what millions of Americans saw when the watched the Apprentice and what they like in Trump).

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74 Responses to Paul Kelly on Trump

  1. Ant

    Trump knows a bullshit story where he hears one…except when he doesn’t hear it.

    “Trutherism” and “Birtherism” come to mind.

  2. Fergal Belligerence

    How is it that “defence” always gets off? No matter where you go the military budget is wrapped in the flag and dunked in holy water. Which is why it is probably the most concentrated bucket of fiscal squander in every case. The possible irony of the Australian submarine contract is that it’s not a defence spend at all. It’s a blatant piece of fiscal boosterism designed to offset the collapse of the car industry. One wonders whether any vessel will actually ever emerge, though even that does not seem much of a problem as we’ve had very little service from the vastly expensive Collins class subs.

  3. candy

    “Trump will be depicted as a threat to the planet and the most dangerous man on earth” –

    Whenever I read a statement like that by one of our top journalists, you know they are one of the elites who have the time and facility to worry about climate, unlike millions of citizens who have no choice but to fret about work security and meeting financial commitments.

    I think Trump by his isolationist policies and not following the herd, his “own man” as they say, has connected with people in a “human” way. I know that sounds trite but.

  4. Entropy

    So when Hillary also said she would not do the TPP that was OK? Lets go to the tape:

    “I’m continuing to learn about the details of the new Trans-Pacific Partnership, including looking hard at what’s in there to crack down on currency manipulation, which kills American jobs, and to make sure we’re not putting the interests of drug companies ahead of patients and consumers. But based on what I know so far, I can’t support this agreement.”

    So all this carry on by the likes of Kelly about the evil of Trump for opposing the TPP is just the equivalent of him seeing the wrong football team having won, or as a member of the political class, he was comfortable in his expectation that Clinton in power would do the opposite of what she said to get elected.

  5. john constantine

    Trump is Biggles.

  6. Bear Necessities

    Many countries don’t want the US to be isolationist for budgetary reasons. If the US withdraws from being the world’s protector then these nations will have to increase military spending. Something will have to give in their budgets. Health, Education and Wealthfare spending will need to be looked at.

  7. stackja

    Washington’s Farewell Address,1796

    In the fall of 1796, nearing the end of his term, George Washington published a farewell address, intended to serve as a guide to future statecraft for the American public and his successors in office. Washington worked closely with Alexander Hamilton, Secretary of the Treasury, and James Madison, then a Congressional leader, who both provided Washington with drafts of the address. Washington’s address argued for a careful foreign policy of friendly neutrality that would avoid creating implacable enemies or international friendships of dubious value, nor entangle the United States in foreign alliances.

    Washington expressed his views on foreign relations with a warning against “permanent inveterate antipathies against particular Nations,” as well as “a passionate attachment of one Nation for another.” The first, he argued, would lead to unnecessary war, while the second would result in unwise treaty concessions, which could arouse the ill-will of other countries expecting fair treatment. Washington counseled the public to be wary of foreign influence. He argued for impartial commercial treaties, but against treaties of permanent alliance, although the United States should fulfill any existing agreements “with perfect good faith.” Temporary alliances would be acceptable in “extraordinary emergencies.”

  8. jupes

    Well done Sinc for wading through Kelly’s sludge. I couldn’t do it.

    The man is a professional wrongologist of the Flannery class.

  9. jupes

    The post-World War II liberal order is about to get a shake-up.

    And about time too.

    Those international institutions, like the UN, the EU, the World Bank, the IMF, the WTO , OECD, etc. are going to have to justify their existence.

    We can only hope.

  10. Tom

    Almost daily, Paul Kelly reminds the Oz’s editor-in-chief Paul “Boris” Whittaker how much deadwood the paper has accumulated over the decades and how urgent a thorough cleanout now is. In fact, Kelly loathes The Australian’s readership (probably because of their astuteness and intelligence) and they’re sick to death of him, as you will find in comments under this piece.

  11. egg_

    The man is a professional wrongologist of the Flannery class.

    Methinks it’s the meme with these Messianic pundits, the facts don’t matter.

  12. The Deplorable Barking Toad

    Kelly slimes any of us who supported Trump as the “lunatic right”:

    here:
    The protectionists in Australia will be cheering — the union movement, the Greens, Nick Xenophon, Pauline Hanson and the pro-Trump lunatic Right that thinks the revolution is nigh and seems mad enough to cheer Trump all the way to serial damage to Australia’s national interests. Meanwhile the free-trade purists will hardly be dismayed since they regard the TPP as a flawed project and are sceptical of its geo-strategic import.

    and here:
    Just imagine the progressive rhetoric — Trump will be depicted as a threat to the planet and the most dangerous man on earth. In Australia the polarisation will be intense. The progressive Left, politicians and media, will demonise Trump while the lunatic Right will demand the Turnbull government follow Trump, withdraw from the Paris compact and be mad enough to become a climate policy outcast. Since neither Turnbull nor his cabinet has the slightest interest in such mimicking of Trump the next demand of the lunatic Right, already foreshadowed, is that Turnbull be deposed if he refuses to follow Trump.

    Elitist prick

  13. egg_

    mad enough to become a climate policy outcast

    An ever growing club, ignoring the Paris scam?

  14. Rabz

    As pointed out previously, any post here on “the editor at large” need simply be entitled:

    Paul Kelly is wrong (again)

  15. What? National security can’t be about industry policy and welfare for South Australia? Even at the risk of Whyalla Wipeout? No matter what Turnbull and Thales/DCNS think?

    Give that man all the Logies and Walkleys you can think of! Kelly is the most dangerous man to Pyne and Xenophon on the planet.

  16. Jannie

    As a member of the card carrying cultural elites it’s great to see Kelly fretting about real and perceived threats to his club. Kelly seems unable to see himself, he’s unconscious of the fact that he is transparent in a glass tower. He lectures to people who see right through his contradictions. There may be some who take him seriously, but most Oz readers worked him out a while ago. He can’t help their circulation and subscriber figures much.

  17. MAGB

    Paul Kelly wouldn’t have a clue. Trump is not the emperor – he has to get most things through Congress and there’s no indication they’re going to do anything extreme. However the thing they will probably do, and that we can really look forward to, is completely annihilate the climate cult.

  18. H B Bear

    Statler is a wrongologist of van Wrongselen proportions. Yet another reason to quit Teh Australian, as if you needed one.

  19. Diogenes

    FMD did everybody miss Trump saying in his 100 day speech yesterday, he would looking at bilateral trade deals so if the idiots we have running the government get their act together, pull their collective heads out of their ar..es and start making nice, we could be at the head of the queue and be no worse off.

  20. They were very late to both world wars, for example.

    Best evah line in a movie;
    “Pushy Americans, always showing up late for every war.”
    “Chicken Run” for the Phillistines who were wondering which movie.

  21. Eyrie

    Be fun if Trump tore up ANZUS on the grounds that we and NZ (doesn’t even have a tactical Air Force of any kind unless you count the warbirds at Wanaka) weren’t doing enough for ourselves and said the US would come to our aid if it suited the US at the time.
    The pollies in Cantberra would be running around like headless chooks.

  22. Anne

    Trump is a Giant.

    Kelly is a tiny, squeaking Gnat.

    .

    #DrainTheSwamp – of career Politicians, sinecured Bureaucrats and Old Media Tarts.

  23. Up The Workers!

    Ned Kelly and Paul Kelly, though separated by 136 years, share much in common.

    The former was a thief of horses and cash; the latter, a thief of oxygen.

  24. wreckage

    Trump is a conservative. Those are all conservative positions. Kelly is a fucking lunatic, as well as a fool.

  25. Vicki

    Kelly discusses the TPP in geo-political terms – it’s all about isolating China. Yet criticises Trump for suggesting this trade deal doesn’t benefit the US.

    Kelly out in the stratosphere here. The TPP is clearly not in the interests of America – which Clinton acknowledged by opposing it.

    It was amusing to listen to Craig Emerson get quite cross with Fran Kelly when she wouldn’t accept that the TPP did not favour either the USA or Australia.

  26. Ubique

    Trump is more than an EU-style protectionist (funny how Kelly and the rest of elite never complained about Common Market then EU protectionism). He is a deal maker. He’s out to get a better deal for the US in its trade relations. And he’ll get it. The EU wouldn’t know a good deal if it fell over one.

  27. Anonandon

    The Apprentice was how I was introduced to Trump. He was as good at that as I think anybody could be. Certainly made Mark Bouris look like an amateur in comparison.

  28. J.H.

    Trump is going to Recarbonize the global economy….. It’s over for the Ecofascists.

    …. and they know it too. 🙂

  29. gabrianga

    May I suggest that you also “miss the point” that Kelly has been tilted towards Labor/Democrat politics for more than four decades ,this slightly clouding his written and spoken word?

  30. the sting

    Kelly still does not get why the people voted for Trump. Kelly still believes in human induced global warming without any empirical evidence for the same. Trump has made the ”mainstream media” and the press gallery redundant. I am still smiling .

  31. Roger

    FMD did everybody miss Trump saying in his 100 day speech yesterday, he would looking at bilateral trade deals so if the idiots we have running the government get their act together, pull their collective heads out of their ar..es and start making nice, we could be at the head of the queue and be no worse off.

    You’re very optimistic, Diogenes.

    Japan is already at the head of the queue thanks to PM Abe’s swift action (note he’s already said Japan will pull out of the TPP if the US doesn’t participate).

    Our PM was too busy taking selfies in Peru with the outgoing, worst POTUS ever.

    Our politicians and PS boffins are still processing the Trump victory.

  32. Oh come on

    “Trutherism” and “Birtherism” come to mind.

    Trump is a truther? Where and when did Trump doubt the official explanation for 9/11, Ant?

  33. Mark M

    Trust MSM Kelly to completely miss the point.
    Unless you are on the receiving end of the asylum or climate change billions, the “losers of globalization” are, well, almost everyone.

  34. miltonf

    Like reading Honi Soit or Tharunka

  35. Maybe Australia could follow this move: http://www.breitbart.com/california/2016/11/22/npr-donald-trump-may-defund-500-million-public-broadcasting/.

    With President-elect Trump promising to pay for his infrastructure and defense spending by defunding non-essential federal spending, one of the first programs on the block could be the almost $500 million spent on public broadcasting.

  36. JohnA

    areff #2217053, posted on November 23, 2016, at 10:39 am

    Trump is Biggles.

    and Worrals would have had Turnbull for brekkie, being more of a man than is our PM. She certainly had the right idea about multiculturalism.

    And if it had been Gimlet King of the Commandos, Turnbull would never know how he had been done in!

  37. John Comnenus

    Trump is neither an isolationsit nor a protectionist.

    He is going to put America First. I thought that was the job of the US PResident. I bet Malcolm Turnbull would say he puts Australia first – or maybe not.

    Either way it is clear that countries like China have been stealing IP from the USA for years and using that IP royalty free for years. Nothing in the TPP was going to fix that – IP was going to be worked towards. So why should the US President support giving away his country’s IP to enrich its biggest strategic and economic competitor?

    Once the Trump economic revolution takes off Kelly will start to see the light and proclaim the brilliance of ……….. Barrack Obama in creating the log stagnation before his policies finally bit to create jobs and wealth.

  38. Entropy

    Our PM was too busy taking selfies in Peru with the outgoing, worst POTUS ever

    That is a bit too far: Obama is lame, and his only legacies will be doubling debt and being the first black POTUS. But how do you compare him with a Carter?

  39. Entropy

    Our politicians and PS boffins are still processing the Trump victory.

    Actually I suspect they are still in the denial phase. Just you wait when they get to anger. They will be firing communiques everywhere.

  40. DrBeauGan

    I just sent this to [email protected] Since they won’t publish it, here it is:

    Reading an article by Paul Kelly is like being lowered slowly into the Slough of Despond by the hair until the nostrils meet the bubbles. His complete incomprehension of the post-brexit post-Obama world makes him a good candidate for early retirement. His only talent has been to equivocate somewhere between left and right, and now we have only left and further left, that talent has lost any value it had.
    I don’t suppose you will be able to publish this, for fear of giving offence to old farts, but please bung it along to Boris as useful feedback. I’ve been buying the weekday paper edition for a long time now, and my main reason is to ensure that Bill Leak and the people who do Cut and Paste remain in work. Oh, and Hedley Thomas. James Jeffrey can write, he’s almost your only regular who can. It’s a pity he doesn’t have anything interesting to write about. The rest of the gang have all the intellectual vitality of a primary school common room after Christmas.

  41. Ant

    Where and when did Trump doubt the official explanation for 9/11

    The “official explanation” exonerated GW Bush and his administration insofar as they bore responsibility for it (leaving aside the usual accusations of incompetence or negligence by various individuals and/or agencies within Bush’s ultimate control).

    Trump made it abundantly clear that he thinks Bush was responsible in significant part for covering up the truth behind who the real perpetrators were, along the lines of Michael Moore’s theories (Fahrenheit 11).

    I’ll let go his idiocies stated some time ago about “bombs” inside the building. He was left to think things out for himself at the time without any minders around, which often strays well into territory for the insane – like Birtherism.

  42. National Security: Let’s be very clear here – maintaining Australian national security is first and foremost an Australian government responsibility, not the Americans. That means that our national security spend cannot and should not constitute industry policy and welfare for South Australia. So military platforms and military systems that secure Australia’s national integrity, not job creation in Liberal marginal seats in Adelaide.

    Excellent. Well said, Doomlord.

    (You are still not quite forgiven for your Turnbullism, but this will go some way towards mending fences, and mitigating the mockery that will justly fall upon your head from on high when you finally recant in the face of an utter dearth of Potential Greatness™ by 15 September 2017.)

  43. BorisG

    Trump is neither an isolationsit nor a protectionist.

    Trump is a mass media entertainer impersonating a politician. He is doing a pretty good job of impersonation.

    As far as he is a politician, he is neither a conservative nor reactionary nor a nationalist, an isolationsit nor a protectionist.

    He is a populist, who will tell his base what they want to hear.

    it will be entertaining to watch where it is all going.

  44. Tim Neilson

    “Trutherism” and “Birtherism” come to mind.
    The first person to say that Barack Obama was born in Kenya was Barack Obama. It appeared on the cover of early editions of “Dreams from my Father”. Nothing goes on the cover of a published work without the author seeing it and approving.
    OK, there’s two other possible explanations. We’ll assume that Barry isn’t actually illiterate, since he seems to be able to read a teleprompter, but maybe he just outsourced the cover etc. to Bill Ayres, as well as the actual writing of the book, so never actually looked at the cover text. Or maybe the day it came through he’d just got a stash of really good choom.

  45. Robbo

    “That is a bit too far: Obama is lame, and his only legacies will be doubling debt and being the first black POTUS. But how do you compare him with a Carter?”

    Carter was a peanut farmer who somehow or another staggered through the maze and ended up as POTUS. Sure he was incompetent but at least he didn’t inflict the same chaotic level of damage on the US as that babbling nincompoop Obama.
    Since WW2 the US has had a good number of incompetent idiots living in the White House but Obama takes the title as the worst because he has done more damage to the country during his eight years than all the rest combined.

  46. BorisG

    For all his personal faults and bad taste, Trump knows a bullshit story where he hears one

    Late conversion into trumpism? Trump is god!

  47. John L

    Last week I stayed at luxury 5 star Mia Resort in Mui Ne, Vietnam. I have met the managers, young Lithuanian lady. Highly educated, with a degree in economics. Well travelled and experienced – travelled out of Lithuania for last six years and managed tourist resorts in Europe and Asia. Our discussions turned to world politics and economy, and naturally to Trump. Sum total of her opinion was that Trump will not get the chance to be the worst POTUS because he will be impeached. When I asked why she said she did not know, but she said they would find something. She did not elaborate on “they” or “something”.
    Two weeks before that, I met young German, also at a luxury resort (5*) in Luang Prabang. Also highly educated (economics degree) and well travelled. This young man, his wife (who is French born in Lebanon) and their child live in Singapore. He owns and operates an on-line business with warehouses in Indonesia and Malasia. His views on world’s politics, economy and off cause Trump were similar to those of the young lady from Lithuania. They both thought that Obama may be the greatest ever POTUS (similar about Merkel).
    Needless to say, they both were the disciples of Keynesian economic theory!
    So, as you can see, the higher education is failing us, not only in Australi, it is the worldwide desees.

  48. Tel

    So when Hillary also said she would not do the TPP that was OK? Lets go to the tape:

    Oh Entropy, we all know Hillary was just lying about that to fool the rubes. You know “private position” vs “public position”. All of the Very Serious People understand what’s going on.

  49. Ant

    The first person to say that Barack Obama was born in Kenya was Barack Obama.

    Even if he was born in Kenya, as far as his eligibility for POTUS goes, so what? His mother was American, which is why the Birtherism stuff was always nutty.

  50. Stackja

    BO half USA?
    Constitution says?

  51. Nelson Kidd-Players

    I never looked in detail, but didn’t the Big O gain some sort assistance at university on account of his birth status? Maybe that was the source of the stories. If so, he had his cake as well as eating it.

  52. Tim Neilson

    Even if he was born in Kenya, as far as his eligibility for POTUS goes, so what? His mother was American, which is why the Birtherism stuff was always nutty.
    As I understand it, the law about “natural born citizen” is a bit more complicated than that, or at least was when he was born. From what I read, he couldn’t automatically inherit US citizenship from his mother, because his father wasn’t a US citizen and she wasn’t yet legally an adult (21 in those days) when he was born. That’s why the Obama administration itself so steadfastly insisted that he was born in Hawaii, rather than just ignoring the issue.
    N K-P, I believe that no-one really knows because the big O has refused to release his high school, college and graduate school transcripts. I don’t find it at all improbable that he has told a few porkies in the past about being born in Kenya to get financial advantage and to make the book cover a bit more exotic, and then had the problem that his prior inaccuracy made things difficult for him when he decided to aim for the White House.

  53. rickw

    “Trump will be depicted as a threat to the planet and the most dangerous man on earth”

    If a Year 10 submitted this as an essay it would probably get a comment like:

    vacuous and unbelievable arguments, try doing some research. C-

  54. rickw

    National Security: Let’s be very clear here – maintaining Australian national security is first and foremost an Australian government responsibility, not the Americans. That means that our national security spend cannot and should not constitute industry policy and welfare for South Australia. So military platforms and military systems that secure Australia’s national integrity, not job creation in Liberal marginal seats in Adelaide.

    It could be so simple:

    Swiss System – do compulsory national service, keep your rifle at home, range practice a couple of times a year.

    USA 2nd tier – buy proven US 2nd tier hardware, we’d be looking quite smart right about now, up to our eyeballs in F-16’s, Warthogs, Hercs, Frigates and Subs.

  55. rickw

    As an aside: The Steyr is a case in point, I’ve shot both the Steyr and M-16. How the hell we ended up with a dangerous piece of crap like the Steyr is beyond me – no proper trigger guard! The M-16 is a great weapon, great natural point and shoot, proven design subject to ongoing improvement. Yet we select the Steyr, screw around with all the tolerances and then get into an exercise of re-inventing the wheel at taxpayers expense.

  56. As an aside: The Steyr is a case in point, I’ve shot both the Steyr and M-16. How the hell we ended up with a dangerous piece of crap like the Steyr is beyond me – no proper trigger guard! The M-16 is a great weapon, great natural point and shoot, proven design subject to ongoing improvement. Yet we select the Steyr, screw around with all the tolerances and then get into an exercise of re-inventing the wheel at taxpayers expense.

    One of the best weapons I’ve ever used is the Finnish (Valmet) equivalent of the AK-47, 7.62 Assault Rifle. The simplest weapon on the planet, absolutely nothing to wrong with it, and as accurate and deadly as you can get. The Steyr is an absolute piece of crap.

  57. Tel

    If a Year 10 submitted this as an essay it would probably get a comment like:

    vacuous and unbelievable arguments, try doing some research. C-

    You’ve been out of the school system for some time, haven’t you?

  58. rickw

    One of the best weapons I’ve ever used is the Finnish (Valmet) equivalent of the AK-47, 7.62 Assault Rifle. The simplest weapon on the planet, absolutely nothing to wrong with it, and as accurate and deadly as you can get. The Steyr is an absolute piece of crap.

    There are definitely better weapons around than the M-16, the primary extraction is crap, both in terms of the cam action and the extractor claw force and function. The whole concept of direct impingement is not fantastic, why dump a whole lot of hot crud into the bolt / carrier group when doing it remotely works just as well. Bolt head rotation by using a single cross drilled hole is awesomely simply, but there isn’t a lot of metal left. The magazines are very marginal, and the whole curved then straight design was little more than an accident. But still a shitload better than the Steyr!

    In anycase, Stoner and Kalashnikov (and friends) came up with a lot of good ideas that stood the test of time. The boffins at Steyr Aug, not so much!

  59. Oh come on

    The “official explanation” exonerated GW Bush and his administration insofar as they bore responsibility for it (leaving aside the usual accusations of incompetence or negligence by various individuals and/or agencies within Bush’s ultimate control).

    Trump made it abundantly clear that he thinks Bush was responsible in significant part for covering up the truth behind who the real perpetrators were, along the lines of Michael Moore’s theories

    Yes but that alone doesn’t make him a truther – as you well know. Does he say who he thinks the perpetrators were? That’s what would make him a truther or not. Michael Moore is not a truther, for instance. You know what a truther is, Ant. A truther believes that 9/11 was a false flag operation staged by the US government. That’s the core belief of a truther. Where has Trump suggested such a thing?

    It seems to me you’re being deliberately non-prescriptive here, Ant. Giving yourself some semantic wiggle-room. Why haven’t you provided a link to where Trump made his position so “abundantly clear”? Surely the internet would be stuffed to the gills with this kind of thing, if it exists in a form that could potentially render Trump a truther. I mean, you were willing to really scrape the bottom of the barrel to dig up ‘evidence’ of Trump’s 9/11 “idiocies”; one would think you’d provide a link that backs up your key claim? Anyway, speaking of your scraping the bottom of the barrel, I have something to say about that, too:

    I’ll let go his idiocies stated some time ago about “bombs” inside the building.

    You should let them go and it’s embarrassing you bring them up in such a way. Honestly. Linking to some barely viewed YouTube video? Pretty clear you just searched for that. Amirite? You’re so desperate for evidence that’ll cast Trump in a bad light that you’ll furnish some grainy, unknown clip featured on a conspiracy theorist channel on YouTube. Pretty sad, Ant. And did you even bother to watch it? Considering that Trump made those comments “some time ago” – on September 11, 2001 to be exact, a time when nobody knew what the hell was going on – it’s pretty clear he’s pissing in the wind. Dismissed as speculation from a semi-informed source possessing only superficial understanding of the day’s occurrences (the position we all found ourselves in at that time. Lucky nobody sought you or I out for our opinion of what had happened that morning). There was no 9/11 conspiracy theory on 9/11, so you really can’t say he was toeing any line there. In the interview, he stated that he thought the plane strikes occurred simultaneously with the detonation of bombs planted in the buildings. He didn’t suggest that these bombs were planted by the US government – which would be the definitive calling card of a truther – this was an idea that developed long after 9/11 itself. In hindsight, the concept of a plane/bomb combo strike does sound idiotic. But on the very day the planes hit WTC 1 & 2, would you have mocked the idea? I wouldn’t have.

    Ant, you either need to provide much stronger sources to back up your claim that Trump is or ever was a truther or espoused truther opinions. The alternative is that you retract your claim.

  60. Far Right Heretic

    If Australia is serious about national security wr need to change a lot of our practices:

    1. Limit immigration. Any immigrant or descedant of an immigrant who identifies as a hypenated Australian can never be trusted not to side with their mother country. Therefore we need to limit all immigration, especially muslim and Chinese immigration as these are two biggest threats.

    2. End all foreign ownership of our land and prevent foreigners or immigrants from working in any industry related to national security or involving critical infrastructure.

    3. Build all military equipment in Australia. That is the only way we can be sure of planned defects.

    4. Introduce national service for all Australian men and move to the Finnish model of requiring all Australian men to maintain a service weapon and ammo. Australia is a large country with a massive shoreline and small population. We need to be able to mount a defence withih days, not months.

    5. We need nuclear weapons as a deterrent against China.

  61. Oh come on

    Far Right Heretic, it sounds like you’d be more comfortable in North Korea rather than Australia.

  62. Far Right Heretic

    @Oh Come On: Without America to protect us we have to face the fact that we are a large country, rich in resources, with bugger all ability to protect ourselves. I am sorry that triggers you.

  63. gabrianga

    . We need nuclear weapons as a deterrent against China “?

    This from Governments of both persuasions which delayed, hindered and finally halted the development of new uranium mines?

    With some of the world’s recognised resources of high grade uranium we let Canada,Kazakhstan and Africa capture the $multi billion markets which were available.

    The Labor Party’s “3 uranium mine policy” was the subject of much ridicule and laughter when dining out in Toronto,Regina , Quebec but when the Coalition moved in….nothing changed and Australia lost the exports.

  64. Oh come on

    I am sorry that triggers you.

    Hang on. You’ve just thrown the switch to full bore, pants-shitting, Enver Hoxha-style isolationist mode – and you have the chutzpah to call *me* “triggered”?

    Jeeeeeezus. Some people have absolutely no self-awareness whatsoever.

    Pillboxes. You forgot the pillboxes, Enver. We’re gunna need millions of ’em!

  65. Far Right Heretic

    @gabrianga: Our government is busy selling us out to China so why would they care about whether we can defend ourselves against our soon to be overlords?

    @Oh Come On: Isolationalist is just a scaremonger word for nationalism and it has been pushed by the globalist lackeys to discredit anyone who questions the wisdom of letting the barbarian hordes inside the gates while selling our land to a potential enemy and outsourcing our defence.

  66. Oh come on

    That was a bunch of kneejerk know-nothing jargon, Right Wing Heretic. Research Enver Hoxha if curious.

  67. Crossie

    Trump knows a bullshit story where he hears one

    Journalists and commentators used to have this talent in the past, now it’s only the voters and an occasional politician.

  68. Crossie

    withdraw from the Paris compact and be mad enough to become a climate policy outcast.

    It’s all about being in the cool kids club, the national economic interest be damned.

  69. Crossie

    Japan is already at the head of the queue thanks to PM Abe’s swift action (note he’s already said Japan will pull out of the TPP if the US doesn’t participate).

    Our PM was too busy taking selfies in Peru with the outgoing, worst POTUS ever.

    Our politicians and PS boffins are still processing the Trump victory.

    Where is Lady Macbeth? What is she doing to earn her title and salary? Hillary’s loss seems to have thrown Julie Bishop into a slough of despond.

  70. Bemused;

    One of the best weapons I’ve ever used is the Finnish (Valmet) equivalent of the AK-47, 7.62 Assault Rifle. The simplest weapon on the planet, absolutely nothing to wrong with it, and as accurate and deadly as you can get. The Steyr is an absolute piece of crap.

    It was about 40 years ago, a mate who had an extensive rifle collection, had procured a Valmet that had been made for the Saudi Royal Guard – not the National Guard, which is a clusterfuck of a much different nature. Gold plated it was. Gaudy Saudi as he described it. Never got to shoot it, but he loved it.

  71. Ellen of Tasmania

    “There were times when a reasonable man thought that the Democrats wanted to drive off the cliff at 80 mph and the Republicans countered with a proposal that we go 50. …

    But surrounding the whole thing, there has always been a mysterious bipartisan consensus, one dictated by an imperious zeitgeist, promulgated by the entertainment complex and media, and studiously obeyed by all the politicians.

    This zeitgeist was enthusiastically pushed by the left and sullenly obeyed by the right, and the whole culture steadily followed after it. When it has made enough of an appearance to be given a name, it has been called political-correctness. …

    What is really going on is a gigantic collision between the insiders and the outsiders. Nothing is more obvious than that the decree went forth from the zeitgeist that Trump was to be thrown into the volcano, as so many before him had been, and the villagers refused.”

  72. gbees

    I gave up reading Paul Kelly’s waffle a while ago.

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