Gun Control in the USA

With yet another gun related massacre in the United States, the calls for more gun control have recommenced.

Now if Spartacus was a citizen of the US or lived there, he would probably support gun control.  But the problem is that all those calling for gun control are proposing legislative solutions where the US constitution provides the right to keep and bear arms.  And in the wonderful system that is the US, the constitution beats legislation.

Spartacus does not claim to be a US constitutional scholar, but he can read.  And one of the more recent decisions of the US Supreme Court on this matter, in District of Columbia v. Heller, 554 U.S. 570 (2008) found that:

that the Second Amendment protects an individual’s right to possess a firearm unconnected with service in a militia for traditionally lawful purposes

So give the Supreme Court has confirmed such a constitutional right, why are there no advocates for changing the US constitution?  After all, unlike the 10 Commandments, the US constitution is not etched in stone.  It can be changed, and has been.  Hence the 27 amendments to the US constitution.

Again, if Spartacus was a citizen of the US, he would support a constitutional amendment to limit the right to bear arms, but no way no how should legislation trump (!) the constitution.  If that were allowed, what would be next?  Over-ruling the right to free speech?  How about the separation of Church and State?  Perhaps the protection against unreasonable search and seizure?

As Tommy Jeff wrote rather eloquently:

… whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness.

If you don’t like it, change it.

Follow I Am Spartacus on Twitter at @Ey_am_Spartacus

This entry was posted in Uncategorized. Bookmark the permalink.

317 Responses to Gun Control in the USA

  1. Zatara

    Yeah, right. The gun owners are obsessing about gun control. They bring it up all the time demanding new, more restrictive laws. Right?

    As to “the federal govt going rogue all around them” or “large segments of their society is going rogue”, umm, why would they fret about that? They are the ones with the guns.

    One last piece to digest about armed citizenry in America, they constitute the largest land army in the world with over 15 million hunters and five times that many armed citizens in general. Think about that when you consider taking their weapons away or establishing a totalitarian government over them.

  2. Neil

    In 1870 the New South Wales government raised a regular or permanent military force, consisting of two infantry companies and one artillery battery, their fortunes waxed and waned, but this too was a ‘standing army’.

    And what happened to those units after 1901? But i still think the guy you said was talking bollocks could be correct. he said this

    As for the “magnificent”second amendment, it merely refers to the maintenance of a “well regulated militia” in lieu of a standing army, supported by the right to bear arms.

    The newly formed USA govt did not have the revenue to start a standing army. The same applies to us. At Federation the States had significant tax raising ability that the Commonwealth did not have. We could not afford a standing army hence we had a skeleton army supported by a large militia.

    AUSTRALIA which did not exist pre-1901 did not get a proper standing army until 1947.

  3. 2dogs;

    I am in no way suggesting that you should be limited as to how much ammo you can own.

    No worries, I was just concerned that you were proposing letting the government know my stocks of ammo. A surrogacy gun control program can easily be made by limiting ammunition.

  4. marcus classis

    The Colonial armies were merged (as were the Colonial navies) into a Federal force.

    AUSTRALIA which did not exist pre-1901 did not get a proper standing army until 1947

    You are now reduced to mere sophistry. You do realise that the ‘Australian colonies’ were regarded by each other and by the Imperial government as a single entity, currently maturing and of necessity partially separate but developing towards a continental state from about 1850, don’t you? This was a natural outgrowth after Lord Durham’s Report and the ‘self-government model (see also Darwin’s brilliant work on how the Dominion concept developed). Federation did not just appear one fine day, springing from some brow like Prometheus. It had two generations of history behind it.

    I have already pointed out that each of these colonies had its own standing army and Naval force, formed after the Imperial garrisons were withdrawn. These were merged into Federal forces in 1901.

    You keep going back to a single point someone else pointed out. it’s childish.

    1947 was merely another reform, no more or less important than the Haldane, Childers etc reforms which preceded them.

    NSW had a standing professional army almost a century before that: it was merely in an earlier form. Small and specialised to be sure, but quite real.

  5. Chris

    In respect of John Lott’s research on the effect of CCW on crime:
    The effect sizes he measured were overall positive, and in most places ranged from zero up, ie were small and non-uniform. The BIG effect he failed to emphasise is that a zero to slightly positive effect is NOT what the opponents predicted.
    Gun control proponents are generally wrong on the mechanisms by which people operate. They operate out of contempt and moral superiority over a straw-man view of other people.

  6. Fat Tony

    marcus classis

    With regards to the colonial navies, Toowoomba’s Botanic Gardens has an old cannon from a Qld Navy ship. It’s around 6″ bore – rifled barrel & muzzle loading. I remember climbing over it in the 1950s – still admire it whenever i am in the vicinity.

    What amazes me is these people who think that, if firearms were easily available, we would have wild-west type shootouts in the street.
    Prior to that POS Howard, I have no recollection of this happening. Guns were just another tool to be used responsibly.
    Also don’t remember too many house invasions prior to POSH – the retards were never sure if they might be walking face first into a shotgun.

  7. Eddystone

    Marcus, what few people seem to realise is that the right to keep and bear arms is an English right. For the defence of the realm, keeping the peace and personal protection.

    The USA took the same idea and made it permanent by putting it in the Bill of Rights.

    England (and Australia) relied on the protection of rights by Parliament, and of course we have been sold out by venal politicians and voter apathy.

  8. Eddystone

    The fact that most US States have now legislated “shall issue” CCW, none have repealed it once in, and several have moved to “Constitutional” CCW, where the right is enshrined in the States Constitution, should be a clue that US gun laws are not the result of crazed, penile-deficient, redneck NRA operatives subverting the will of the people

    The fact is, they work, otherwise they wouldn’t be so widespread.

    None of this will make any difference to those infected with the meme that Americans are crazy, violent and stupid, of course.

  9. Neil

    Marcus, what few people seem to realise is that the right to keep and bear arms is an English right. For the defence of the realm, keeping the peace and personal protection.

    And apparently they did away with it at after WW1. With soldiers coming home not with bows and arrows or muskets but with modern rifles the powers that be in Britain thought that was dangerous. Also there was revolution in Ireland/Russia and the British govt was worried about modern weapons in the hands of citizens so they did away with the right to bear arms

  10. Fat Tony

    Neil
    #2514725, posted on October 4, 2017 at 5:11 pm

    With soldiers coming home not with bows and arrows or muskets but with modern rifles the powers that be in Britain thought that was dangerous. Also there was revolution in Ireland/Russia and the British govt was worried about modern weapons in the hands of citizens so they did away with the right to bear arms

    Yeah – after sending millions to their pointless deaths on the killing fields of Europe, I could imagine the politicians / government would not be too keen on any sort of retribution. Doesn’t make it right though.

  11. John Constantine

    If turnbull bans guns in Australia, will Waleed let him play with the gold logie?.

  12. PB

    A man in a Vegas hotel with more guns and ammo than he can use isn’t there to kill, he’s there to sell. Something about this stinks to 911.

  13. PB

    “Also don’t remember too many house invasions prior to POSH – the retards were never sure if they might be walking face first into a shotgun”

    Blackie knows the Polar Bears are unarmed. Ask any Melburnian.

  14. rickw

    Marcus, what few people seem to realise is that the right to keep and bear arms is an English right. For the defence of the realm, keeping the peace and personal protection.

    Correspondence by the founding fathers indicates that English and French thinkers of the time were consulted on the matter. The idea originated not just from English Rights but also European thinking!

  15. rickw

    And apparently they did away with it at after WW1. With soldiers coming home not with bows and arrows or muskets but with modern rifles the powers that be in Britain thought that was dangerous. Also there was revolution in Ireland/Russia and the British govt was worried about modern weapons in the hands of citizens so they did away with the right to bear arms.

    They were worried specifically about a working class revolution, so once again we find our way back to the true purpose of gun control, people control.

  16. Neil
    What about howitzers? I think can think of lots of military weapons that should be banned for citizens. beats me why anyone would want the weaponary that was used from the 32nd floor
    Marcus
    What about them?

    I think Neil is right, howitzers are seriously overrated. They are just jumped up mortars and its too easy to make a mistake and hit something or somebody that you can’t see. For my money the best artillery pieces are those that you can fire over open sights, so you can see what you are firing at and hitting. Much safer.

    just saying

  17. Yeah – after sending millions to their pointless deaths on the killing fields of Europe, I could imagine the politicians / government would not be too keen on any sort of retribution.

    That is absolutely true. What’s more I can think of half a dozen British generals who should have been shot at dawn by the .303 Lee Enfield. Starting with Haig.

  18. Neil

    They were worried specifically about a working class revolution, so once again we find our way back to the true purpose of gun control, people control.

    I think there were other reasons. People have a right to walk the streets in safety. The right to bear arms arose in a world that could not afford a standing army. Furthermore the weapons were bows and arrows, muskets etc.

    I just came home from Aldi and could not believe it when i had to walk past a man with not one, two but 5 pitbulls on a leash. I got bitten by a pitbull 2 weeks ago. Some people get sexual thrills owning things where they can have power over other people. It is not just for self-defense but for some other reason. Hence the desire to own a AK47 rather than a rifle.

  19. JC

    I think there were other reasons. People have a right to walk the streets in safety.

    No you don’t actually. You don’t have that right because there’s no possibility the state is able to offer you that right. The only compact we have with the state is that although it can’t offer you ironclad 100% preventative protection, it promises you that they will investigate a crime committed against you and bring the perp to justice. That’s pretty much what we have.

  20. JC

    Neil

    You demonstrate a grave misunderstanding about what a right is and what it constitutes.

  21. Viva

    They are the ones with the guns. …Think about that when you consider taking their weapons away or establishing a totalitarian government over them.

    Sounds like a great future – War Is Peace; Freedom Is Slavery; Ignorance Is Strength” — all at the point of a gun.

    I wonder who would end up as the real tyrants under your Brave New Animal Farm Zatara?

  22. Chris

    Neil, sexual thrills? Projection.

  23. Defender of the faith

    I’m somewhat amazed that people here do not value the right to walk around unmolested. Some here think the US is more free because people can carry guns freely. If people cannot sit in a park and enjoy music without the fear of attack from military grade automatic weapons in the hands of an accountant then are they free? If they cannot send kids to school without the fear that an unhappy teenager will shoot up the kids are they free?
    If you think guns make you free you are already in a prison if your own making

  24. Fat Tony

    Defender of the faith

    Interesting name “Defender of the faith”.

    As a matter of interest, just how would you go about defending that faith?

    I’m somewhat amazed that people here do not value the right to walk around unmolested.

    And just how do you get that right? The government can’t/won’t guarantee that right – all they can do is make it illegal to have any means to defend yourself. They, of course, are surrounded by men with guns.

  25. Eddystone

    Neil

    #2514850, posted on October 4, 2017 at 7:20 pm

    I think there were other reasons. People have a right to walk the streets in safety. The right to bear arms arose in a world that could not afford a standing army. Furthermore the weapons were bows and arrows, muskets etc.

    Neil, don’t take this the wrong way, but there is plenty of information out there on the history of gun control. It pays to educate yourself if you are interested in this topic. That’s what I do, and it’s very frustrating to hear the same old misinformation trotted out by politicians and the media.

    So if you are interested, here is a good essay on English gun control.

    http://davekopel.org/2A/LawRev/SlipperySlope.htm

    What Kopel doesn’t explore is the efforts towards gun control that began in about 1850. They were strongly resisted by Parliamentarians (ha ha, imagine that today), but the efforts never stopped, so we are where we are today.

    And don’t imagine the efforts will stop.

    If you’re interested, Joyce Malcolm’s “Guns and Violence: the English Experience, and “To Keep and Bear Arms” are good value, as is Colin Greenwood’s “Firearms Control: A Study of Armed Crime and Firearms Control in England and Wales”.

  26. marcus classis

    Jannie:

    I think Neil is right, howitzers are seriously overrated. They are just jumped up mortars and its too easy to make a mistake and hit something or somebody that you can’t see.

    Oi!

    me grand-dad was a 4.5″ howitzer man.

    It’s the family traditional weapon.

    if aborigines can have traditional weapons, why can’t I?

    🙂

  27. Eddystone

    Some people get sexual thrills owning things where they can have power over other people. It is not just for self-defense but for some other reason.

    Complete bollocks expect for a tiny number of psychopaths.

    That’s just the same old bullshit that gets peddled in every gun debate by the rude and clueless.

  28. Neil

    So if you are interested, here is a good essay on English gun control.

    Mate it is not necessarily about gun banning but about what type of guns should a citizen be allowed to own.

    Just like dogs. Nobody is arguing about banning dogs. But some people say pitbulls should be banned

  29. Eddystone

    Mate it is not necessarily about gun banning but about what type of guns should a citizen be allowed to own.

    How do you think it starts? If you’re interested, educate yourself, so you have opinions informed by facts.

  30. Viva

    Sorry to rude and clueless but something kinky is going on with guns.Just check out the scantily clad chick clutching a glock or an ak47 or an uzzi featured at the end of every Powerline Week in Pictures

    http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2017/09/the-week-in-pictures-no-kneeling-edition.php

  31. Neil

    How do you think it starts?

    OK i understand that,

    But tonight walking back from ALDI i very scarily walked past a man with 5 pitbulls on a leash. The man is insane. I can see his thoughts. I can control these dogs, i can teach these dogs, these dogs will never hurt anybody. That is before they kill some small child.

    Some people should never come close to certain types of things and the State should ban certain types of things.

  32. Defender of the faith

    Fat Tony: you eloquently make my point. In the us fairly low level politicians have security escorts. In Australia I have walked next to sitting prime ministers on the street and in one case on a train. My cousin in the us lives next to the home of a former president and he says the entire local community is like a green zone. John Howard lives in a suburban home and can be seen walking from his office in the city. Having lived and worked in the US myself I cannot understand why anyone believes the gun idea is a good one.

  33. John Constantine

    Attack dogs are the urban assault weapons of choice for an entire demographic of Australia.

    Guns seem more honest.

  34. marcus classis

    Neil:

    Some people get sexual thrills owning things where they can have power over other people. It is not just for self-defense but for some other reason. Hence the desire to own a AK47 rather than a rifle.

    Wow. Projection much?

    I like to own firearms for two reasons.

    1. Hunting, which puts meat on the table (altho wifey gets tired of venison)
    2. Historical value – these I enjoy firing at the range.

    Please tell me again how you think this is somehow ‘sexual’. I enjoy chuckling at ignorant clods who make crap up regarding things they have no clue about.

  35. JC

    Having lived and worked in the US myself I cannot understand why anyone believes the gun idea is a good one.

    I don’t believe you did live there. In 16 years of my time there – not once did I see anything to do with gun violence. Neither did I feel concerned with wide gun ownership. You’re either drama queening, or you really never lived there , never visited and maintain the typical Australian bumpkin view of the US.

  36. Tel

    Some people get sexual thrills owning things where they can have power over other people.

    I agree.

    Local government and petty bureaucrats are probably the worst to deal with.

    State government are also pretty bad, but they have a lot on their plate to keep them distracted so it kind of works out.

    Federal government goes for bigger thrills like starting wars so I’m mostly off their radar.

  37. Neil

    Please tell me again how you think this is somehow ‘sexual’

    Once again you are shifting the topic. At the moment the topic is what type of guns should a citizen be allowed to own. Do you need a AK47 for hunting?

    It becomes sexual when you want to own a AK47. Same goes for dogs. Get a cattle dog rather than a pitbull

  38. Do you need a AK47 for hunting?

    I want one. Please explain why I should not have one. Words of one syllable would be a good idea.

    It becomes sexual when you want to own a AK47.

    Bloke, we have very different concepts of what to use for a sex toy.

  39. Defender of the faith

    JC; very strange. You clearly haven’t been to Texas or Florida. Or at least not for long. Maybe you spend your time hanging out with weird accountants who fill their spare room with AKs. Maybe if I let you in on the fact that my job is security related you might figure that not everyone has the same experience.

  40. Eddystone

    Your faith in the benevolence of the State is misplaced, IMO Neill.

    Viva

    #2514923, posted on October 4, 2017 at 8:18 pm

    Sorry to rude and clueless

    Haha! No you’re not sorry.

  41. marcus classis

    Neil
    #2514958, posted on October 4, 2017 at 8:42 pm
    Please tell me again how you think this is somehow ‘sexual’

    Once again you are shifting the topic. At the moment the topic is what type of guns should a citizen be allowed to own. Do you need a AK47 for hunting?

    It becomes sexual when you want to own a AK47. Same goes for dogs. Get a cattle dog rather than a pitbull

    Wow, you really are revealing a lot about yourself here. And it’s not pretty.

    Depends on what I am hunting. If I am hunting salties in a swamp my oath I’d want an AK!

    If I am doing feral pest control (pigs) again, I’d want an AK or something like it – which is why professional pest animal controllers have semi-automatics.

    If I am a firearms collector or a theatrical armourer, again, the answer is yes.

    And now we get to the core of it.

    Why do you insist that because something frightens YOU, you should have the right to hold a gun to my head and tell me what I can and cannot do?

    No, the type of person getting the sexual jollies here is not me, it’s people like you who want the power to force others to accord to their desires.

  42. Neil

    Have you been reading the news? Obviously not

  43. JC

    I’ve been to florida countless times, defender. I never witnessed anything remotely what you claim.
    So you were involved in security? Not another claim working for ASIO. Marcus Classic has alluded to that preposterous nonsense some time ago.

  44. marcus classis

    Defender of the faith
    #2514966, posted on October 4, 2017 at 8:47 pm
    very strange. You clearly haven’t been to Texas or Florida. Or at least not for long. Maybe you spend your time hanging out with weird accountants who fill their spare room with AKs. Maybe if I let you in on the fact that my job is security related you might figure that not everyone has the same experience

    ‘Security related’ – so what?

    That’s merely an empty appeal to authority.

    There’s a lot of military people at the Cat. I’ve spent a fair bit of time in Texas and it is nothing like you insinuate. I also have US acquaintances who are part of the US gun culture. The sort who spend large to enormous sums on everything from pistols to muskets to heavy machine guns to medium artillery to tanks. And who use and fire all of these.

    You have not lived until your hairy friends have dragged you to Knob Creek Kentucky where all the MG aficionadoes hang out twice a year. That’s why I’d love to own a Cauchat. Fired one there. Really unusual and heaps of fun to fire on the range.

  45. Neil

    No, the type of person getting the sexual jollies here is not me, it’s people like you who want the power to force others to accord to their desires.

    No there are some sick people out there who want to do damage to other people. Your desires can go to hell. I want to walk the streets without having to be worried about what some evil person might do.

    Want to own a gun get a musket. Want to own a dog get a cattle dog. But i have big problems with people who want to own pitbulls or AK47s

  46. marcus classis

    Neil:

    No there are some sick people out there who want to do damage to other people.

    Correct. You are one of them. You want to hold a gun to my head to force me to accord to your wishes.

    Your desires can go to hell.

    Exactly what I expect a totalitarian to say. To you, only your wishes matter. And everyone else can ‘go to hell’.

    I want to walk the streets without having to be worried about what some evil person might do.

    Then irrespective of any of this you have to stay indoors from now on. I am perfectly law abiding. If I had a collection of a million guns the threat to you is non-existent.

    But one crim with an illegal Glock, and you are in mortal danger. And you choose not to anything to minimise the risk to you (per your example with your neighbour’s dog).

    That’s evolution in action. You define yourself as too stupid to survive.

  47. Eddystone

    I want to walk the streets without having to be worried about what some evil person might do

    Nearly every normal person does. I suppose evil people don’t worry about it so much.

    I wonder what an evil person who wanted to harm you might worry about?

  48. marcus classis

    Hmm. Thanks, Neil!

    Your comment of ‘go get a musket’ is a good one.

    The Vortek StrikerFire Backcountry is a modern, high technology .50 cal rifled muzzle loader with a 26″ barrel. 2lb TAC2 competition trigger, autodecocking, weighs just 5.8lb and comes with a 3-9×40 Duplex scope. Sub-MOA and 200 yards out of the box and I can cast my own Minie rounds for it no worries.

    Been into black powder with my Martini Henry Mk II and Mk IV in 577/450, but these are very old rifles from the 1870s. The Vortek’s brand new.

    And in Queensland I do not even have to register it, as it’s a muzzle loading black powder firearm over 22cm long.

    Thanks for the suggestion.

  49. Tel

    Your desires can go to hell. I want to walk the streets without having to be worried about what some evil person might do.

    You don’t do irony, do you Neil?

  50. Eddystone

    Marcus, have you been firing the Martini Henry’s?

    Didn’t you get one from IMA?

  51. Tel

    You don’t do irony, do you Neil?

    I suppose sooner or later somebody had to state the obvious, just to be kind the poor kid.

    Sigh.

  52. Eddystone

    For Neill. It’s so great when the State bans weapons so we can all feel safe.

    May 15, 2003

    FROM THE FRONTLINES
    [Dave Kopel]
    A reader of my article about British government hostility toward the right of self-defense offers some details about how bad things have gotten:

    “I’m an alumna of Pepperdine University, a school which proudly owns a house/campus on Exhibition Road, literally across the street from the Imperial University, in the middle of South Kensington, right near Harrods, Hyde Park, the Albert Hall. Within two days of arriving for our first semester in London, our relatively small [American] class (37 students, 10 men, 27 women) was visited by a local police officer to instruct us on living in London. Her first question was to the women, ‘How many of you brought mace?’ Three girls raised their hands. She told us we couldn’t use it, shouldn’t even carry it, it was illegal.

    “Had any of us brought any other type of weapon, such as a knife? Several of the men in our group indicated that they carried pocket knives. She told us to leave them at home too.

    “Then she instructed us on how to properly be a victim. If we were attacked, we were to assume a defensive posture, such as raising our hands to block an attack. The reason was (and she spelled it out in no uncertain terms) that if a witness saw the incident and we were to attempt to defend ourselves by fighting back, the witness would be unable to tell who the aggressor was. However, if we rolled up in a ball, it would be quite clear who the victim was.

    “The feeling I got was, in London, it is not permissible to defend oneself. I also understood that this police officer thought Americans were more likely to be aggressive and/or cause more damage to a potential attacker. She was warning us for our own good. I have to admit, she did not make me feel particularly safe.”

    Posted at 10:25 PM

  53. if aborigines can have traditional weapons, why can’t I?

    Fair enough Marcus, each to his own. Mine would be the LE no5, the old bush carbine. The FN was pretty fancy, but like rooting a Celebrity Model with no romance.

  54. Eddystone

    I’ve got a couple of SMLE NoIII*’s, a No4Mk2, a No5 Jungle Carbine and a P14, plus an MLE 1906, sporterised, and a couple of sporterised No4’s.

    All were the “assault rifles” of their day, all (bar the P14) guaranteed to stop ten charging pit bulls without reloading!

  55. marcus classis

    Eddystone
    #2515032, posted on October 4, 2017 at 9:47 pm
    Marcus, have you been firing the Martini Henry’s?

    Didn’t you get one from IMA?

    Got a MkIV from IMA. Fantastic thing to shoot, great fun. Got a Mk II converted to ME303, getting a MkIII in 577/450 and a Cadet.

    🙂

    Also got a Gahendra from IMA, to do some research. Never, ever, ever fire one of these. Decent steel in the action, the barrel is a nightmarish mix of soft crap steel and softer wrought iron, spiral hammer welded on to a mandrel by Nepalese blacksmiths. It’s NOT a 577/450, either. it was designed for the soft-foil ammo and soft lead bullet (no tin or antimony) and it slugs at .415 to .435. Use ‘modern’ 577/450 brass cartridge ammo in a Gahendra and it WILL suffer catastrophic failure.

    Now I know why the Nepalese Army withdrew them in 1891!

  56. marcus classis

    Also getting the OVS 7mm Mauser – but it has been sporterised, dammit. Some time in the 60s.

    Next year’s job is to restore it to Boer War config.

  57. Eddystone

    Did you have to do much to the MkIV before shooting it? And where do you get ammo?

    I must get one of those.

  58. I’ve got a couple of SMLE NoIII*’s, a No4Mk2, a No5 Jungle Carbine and a P14, plus an MLE 1906, sporterised, and a couple of sporterised No4’s.

    Eddystone, Maaaate, That’s just bragging. Not the slightest bit jealous. Not even envious. Just don’t care.

    Only one No5, you say?

  59. Eddystone

    Yeah, only one. I must lift my game. Not sure if the local Gestapo SAPOL will approve any more, as my wife said, “Why do you need so many guns?”

  60. Eddystone

    Irreversible

    #2514575, posted on October 4, 2017 at 1:51 pm

    Fat Tony: so there is no evidence that an armed citizenry is in any way beneficial.

    I know it wont influence your Irreversible opinion, but if anyone is interested, here is an article about the J e w ish resistance in the Warsaw ghetto, and how even a small number of inadequate weapons made a difference.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2015/10/10/the-warsaw-ghetto-uprising-armed-j e w s-vs-n a z is/?utm_term=.1c4a84307874

    In Warsaw, as elsewhere, the key impediment to resistance was shortage of arms. According to Holocaust historian Abram L. Sachar: “The indispensable need, of course, was arms. As soon as some J e ws, even in the camps themselves, obtained possession of a weapon, however pathetically inadequate—a rifle, an ax, a sewer cover, a homemade bomb—they used it and often took N a zis with them to death.” Thus, “the difference between resistance and submission depended very largely upon who was in possession of the arms that back up the will to do or die.” [Sacher, pp. 47-48, 60.]

  61. harry buttle

    “John Howard lives in a suburban home and can be seen walking from his office in the city. Having lived and worked in the US myself I cannot understand why anyone believes the gun idea is a good one.”

    Tony Abbott was brutally, but fortunately ineptly attacked in the street, perhaps a security detail or the knowledge that he might have had a gun might have changed that.

    Jill Meagher was raped, strangled and buried in a shallow grave, I’m going to assume that her final thoughts were not ” I cannot understand why anyone believes the gun idea is a good one”.

  62. Irreversible

    Wow. Eddystone, just wow. You really take the bikkies. And i was thinking JC or Marcus were the most illogical people on the planet.

  63. overburdened

    If people are skilled in any of the martial arts then they understand the responsibility they have to promote an orderly and peaceful society. This guy was not trained so he didn’t get the message and I sense that many here don’t understand it.

  64. Zatara

    They are the ones with the guns. …Think about that when you consider taking their weapons away or establishing a totalitarian government over them.

    Sounds like a great future – War Is Peace; Freedom Is Slavery; Ignorance Is Strength” — all at the point of a gun.

    I wonder who would end up as the real tyrants under your Brave New Animal Farm Zatara?

    As a public service to fellow Cats I’m not going to ask WTF you are talking about Viva, because I doubt you would recognize a rhetorical question and you might actually try to explain that bizarre trip you just went on.

    But what pasture did you get those mushrooms from?

  65. marcus classis

    Eddystone
    #2515076, posted on October 4, 2017 at 10:29 pm

    Did you have to do much to the MkIV before shooting it? And where do you get ammo?
    I must get one of those.

    Full resto as I got a ‘dirty’ one from IMA. Took months but a lot of fun. Ammo is hard to get, Bertram makes brass but some of it is slightly oversized and has to be machined. I now have a reloading dies and the MkIII comes with purpose made dies to convert commercial brass. The MkIII also comes with bullet moulds and a bunch of brass too. That’s one reason I am getting it as the MkIII itself has been butchered, the forward furniture has been cut away so again it needs resto.

    Yeah, only one. I must lift my game. Not sure if the local Gestapo SAPOL will approve any more, as my wife said, “Why do you need so many guns?”

    The perfect number is one more than you have right now!

    Irreversible
    #2515131, posted on October 4, 2017 at 11:35 pm
    Wow. Eddystone, just wow. You really take the bikkies. And i was thinking JC or Marcus were the most illogical people on the planet.

    Good Lord. So dear old Irreversibly Stupid sings the old ‘an armed citizenry is of no possible benefit of any kind evah!’ song, in the face of mountains of evidence of just how dumb that statement is, and Eddystone raises a despairingly poignant historical example, so Irreversibly Stupid goes the full leftard. He’s a genuine reality denier. Hope you are not a Holocaust Denier, son.

    I’ve had the privilige of meeting people who survived the camps. They had a standard comment, ‘when they came for us, we should have fought, but we had let them take our guns away’.

  66. rickw

    No there are some sick people out there who want to do damage to other people. Your desires can go to hell. I want to walk the streets without having to be worried about what some evil person might do.

    The evil people ALREADY have the guns FFS, 200 illegal glocks imported, border security “lost track” of 20 known illegal arms shipments, who knows how many they didn’t detect. This was one years worth, 2015-2016. All this and you get all prissy about what some bloke who’s been vetted to death can own. You live in fucking fairy land.

  67. Barry 1963

    My prediction on a spike in sales in bump stocks came true!

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *