Monday Forum: December 11, 2017

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1,308 Responses to Monday Forum: December 11, 2017

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  1. zyconoclast

    Does anyone else get the “you are posting to fast go back message”?

  2. ArthurB

    Top ten!! my day is made

  3. Dr Fred Lenin

    Hey in de team . Eksellento.as they say somewhere.

  4. zyconoclast

    Braxton Winston used to stare down Charlotte riot police, now he oversees them

    Despite having no political experience he decided to run for city council — and won.

    Now he is part of the body that oversees the police force.

    Mr Winston has a big task ahead of him.

    “I have to learn how to run a city. I am a corporate board member of a multi-million dollar corporation,” he says.

    “I have 8,000 employees that I have to be a steward of and be an employer of choice, but also hold them accountable.”

  5. Ez

    Our federal treasurer, again:

    “I think every multinational should pay the tax that they should be paying on the income they earn here, and that is what our laws are designed to achieve,” Mr Morrison told reporters in Sydney on Monday.

    Taxation is levied against profit, not income, you dim-bulb.

  6. Joe

    “I have to learn how to run a city. I am a corporate board member of a multi-million dollar corporation,” he says.

    “I have 8,000 employees that I have to be a steward of and be an employer of choice, but also hold them accountable.”

    NO, you are a representative of the people of your city, and your only responsibility is to protect and serve THEM. The employees come second.

  7. pete m

    If you look after your employees they will take care of your customers.

    Branson

    Agree mostly. soemtimes you need to show your employees why they need customers – or no jobee!

  8. The Moribund Barking Toad

    in the top twenty

  9. Motelier

    Missed the top ten by “that” much!

  10. Motelier

    Has ScMo given up trying to increase the tax take yet?

    Everyone should negioate cash only prices. Just starve anyone who promotes higher taxes.

  11. Motelier

    ScMo = ScoMo.

    big fingers on an Ipad

  12. Baldrick

    21st Battalion A.I.F

    Duggan, Bernard Oscar Charles (1887–1963)
    On 31 January 1917, he was transferred to the 23rd Battalion as commanding officer but relinquished this appointment on 27 February when he was evacuated with trench fever. Promoted temporary lieutenant-colonel in June, he rejoined the 21st Battalion as commanding officer and served in the 3rd battle of Ypres late that year and at Warneton and Ploegsteert early in 1918. He was awarded the Distinguished Service Order in the 1918 New Year honours. From then until the Armistice he commanded the 21st in all its operations, except at Hamel when he was again evacuated with trench fever, serving in the capture of Ville-sur-Ancre, Frise, Mont St Quentin and Montbrehain. He won a Bar to his D.S.O. for exemplary zeal and energy at Montbrehain on 5 October; he and his shrunken battalion were then withdrawn from the line. In addition to his D.S.O. and Bar he was mentioned in dispatches three times during the war.

  13. Bruce of Newcastle

    The artist was probably on LSD.

    Hillary Clinton portrait alerts security dogs, causes road closures in Miami

    Miami police were forced to briefly shut down the area surrounding an art show and clear the site after security dogs reacted to a suspicious crate in Miami, Fla., during the Art Basel festival on Saturday morning.

    But when authorities opened the crate outside the Art Miami tent, it contained none other than a “punk” style picture of Hillary Clinton — complete with pink hair and a studded jacket.

    The painting, done by Orlando-based artist Scott Scheidly, had also been shipped a similar pop art-style portrait of President Trump – dubbed “Trump Pimp” – but the president’s painting had already been removed from the crate prior to the security check.

    So Trump wins again…

  14. Baldrick

    Missed it by that much.

  15. Roger

    Face palm:

    Tim Nicholls overturned the LNP’s decision to putt Jackie Trad last on the how to vote card because he considered the Greens candidate to be a greater threat to Qld’s economy.

    Left factional leader Trad was subsequently elected on LNP preferences and is now Treasurer.

    Memo to the next QLD LNP leader: The Greens are Labor’s problem, not yours. Exploit it.

  16. a happy little debunker

    Trump vs the Talking Heads.

  17. Rabz

    there’s talk he could be bumped from the Senate for Kristina Keneally if she’s unsuccessful in Bennelong next weekend

    Yep, they really are determined to foist that grating z-grade mediocrity on the electorate.

    Talk about a tin ear.

    Earth to da layba pardeee – she’s about as popular as syphilis.

  18. Zulu Kilo Two Alpha

    THE NATION
    Men accused of assaulting police and Christine Forster face court

    The Australian
    12:18PM December 11, 2017
    Ean Higgins
    Reporter
    Sydney
    @EanHiggins

    Four men who allegedly assaulted Liberal Party supporters and police at a violent protest against detention of asylum-seekers on Manus Island have pleaded not guilty at their first court appearances.

    In Sydney’s Downing Centre local court Nicholas Dobrijevich, 20, and Christian Quinonez Munoz, 31, pleaded not guilty to assaulting Tony Abbott’s sister, Sydney city councillor Christine Forster at the Liberal fundraising function last month.

    Matthew David Campbell, 21, pleaded not guilty to assaulting Ms Forster’s partner, Virginia Edwards, and two men.

    Samuel Charles Williams, 24, pleaded not guilty to assaulting Senior Constable Arthur Vlachos.

    The charges followed the protest organised by pro-refugee activists in the inner-Sydney suburb of Eveleigh on November 10 at the Liberal function attended by prominent party figures including Immigration Minister Peter Dutton and Mr Abbott

    From the Oz.

  19. Roger

    I would think Sam – if Labor are pressuring him – is being told he has to resign completely from Parliament.

    Oh, they’re pressuring him…but he evidently has a strong hand to play or he’d be gone by now.

    Those not privy to Labor Party intrigues can only imagine what cards he may hold.

  20. notafan

    Where where where is Monty?

    The police ripped Forster’s jacket etc

  21. John Constantine

    Will the protesters that attacked Abbott’s sister get a bill for police wages, like Milo got?.

    Or is it really that different when they do it?.

  22. Joe

    Those not privy to Labor Party intrigues can only imagine what cards he may hold.

    Yup, all those millions in donations from …

  23. Tom
    #2581556, posted on December 11, 2017 at 12:22 pm
    Star-Spangled Banner in the snow. Glorious. H/T IT.

    Glorious indeed.
    A capacity crowd stands for a memorable national anthem.
    No athletes kneel in disrespect.
    Highly respected serving members of the armed forces sing beautifully.
    The snow gives a massive “up yours” to global warming misfits.

    I’m going back to replay it!

  24. Bruce in WA

    Stimp; they’re just too f….ing stupid to survive.

  25. thefrolickingmole

    Stimpson J. Cat

    Youd think with things like antibiotic resistance people might take them aside and suggest trying for the next mutation to create a new “super AIDs” is a bad idea.

  26. Woolfe

    Looks like Sino Sam will be Labor’s next Thommo.

  27. Rabz

    a “punk” style picture of Hillary Clinton — complete with pink hair and a studded jacket

    LOL. Shrillary of course, being the absolute antithesis of anything remotely cool or hip to da yoof.

  28. Rabz

    Looks like Sino Sam will be Labor’s next Thommo.

    Grate. I can’t wait for the teary speech in parlyfax house where he claims he’s been set up by shadowy forces (intergalactic lizard peoples, hopefully) determined to discredit him.

  29. Zulu Kilo Two Alpha

    Looks like Sino Sam will be Labor’s next Thommo.

    Defended to the last ditch, because he has the dirt file.

  30. Woolfe

    Rabz, it wasn’t him that did the deal with Chincoms but Mr Bean. Simply case of mistaken identity

  31. nilk

    This is not the answer to Life, The Universe and Everything. It’s #43 or #44.

  32. H B Bear

    Looks like Sino Sam will be Labor’s next Thommo.

    And so the circle of Liar degeneracy and immorality completes itself. I wonder if the Liars ever asked for their $150k in legal fees back after Thommo ceased to be any use to then?

  33. Zyconoclast

    Tyrell Cobb’s mother Heidi Strbak inflicted fatal blow on toddler, judge finds

    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-12-11/tyrell-cobbs-mother-inflicted-fatal-blow-on-her-toddler/9246112

    Sentencing lotto?

    Ex partner got 4 years suspended for manslaughter

    Did anyone else notice that the three people mentioned all have different surnames?

  34. John Constantine

    ABC news read a statement from China, denying that chicoms buy political and cultural influence with bribes.

    Also said Australia wasn’t properly multicultural.

  35. Rabz

    I wonder if the Liars ever asked for their $150k in legal fees back after Thommo ceased to be any use to them?

    Bear – didn’t poor ol’ Thommo end up bankrupt? He also had some family kangaroo court “troubles” as well, if I remember correctly.

    What an appalling grub he was.

  36. C.L.

    Tyrell Cobb’s mother beat her son to death and she got done for … manslaughter.
    It’s nice being a woman.

  37. kc

    For all the Orwellian/civil liberties/free market capitalist downsides, having just read some more about the ice scourge, is there a single mechansim that would have more effect than our society going cashless? I know it would be confronting, intrusive and very big brother but clearly the old methods of law enforcement have failed. Add all the elements of the cash economy….under the counter smokes, international money tranfers for terrorists, washing cash through casinos. And basic tax avoidance the demographic moste effected would be the black market. We would be and our individual rights and liberties would be collatoral damage but is it a price worth paying?

  38. Rabz

    We would be and our individual rights and liberties would be collateral damage but is it a price worth paying?

    My answer would be “No”.

  39. kc

    Any suggestions for stopping the drug trade and tax avoidance that would be as effective?

  40. Bruce of Newcastle

    KC – Futile.
    If we went cashless the dealers would immediately start accepting bitcoin. They may already.

  41. Joe

    …ice scourge…

    Self inflicted weak willed ex-citizens.

  42. Joe

    …drug trade…

    If it’s TRADE, legalise it.

  43. H B Bear

    Bear – didn’t poor ol’ Thommo end up bankrupt?

    Dunno. If he had any decency he would have necked himself so no doubt he didn’t do that either. I expect he will bob up as an RSL cook in a couple of decades time.

  44. Stimpson J. Cat

    OK, because of that unholy video I am going to have revoke acronym position privileges.
    That sh$t is simply not acceptable and must be condemned.
    BGTL now becomes BLTG.
    No excuses.

  45. Bruce of Newcastle

    Any suggestions for stopping the drug trade and tax avoidance that would be as effective?

    Teach the Gospel. Practicing Christians tend not to do drugs or avoid tax.
    Chemical assistance may be required eg naltrexone, since addiction is a bad news alteration of brain biochemistry.

  46. Up The Workers!

    “Dunno. If he had any decency he would have necked himself so no doubt he didn’t do that either. I expect he will bob up as an RSL cook in a couple of decades time.”

    Nah…he is overqualified for that job.

    As I understand it, he has one too-many eyeballs.

  47. Mother Lode

    Self inflicted weak willed ex-citizens.

    People go through their lives without having to wear the consequences of their decisions.

    I truly believe that the faculties of judgement have been allowed to atrophy.

    Not so long ago people were brought up with the idea that they have to be responsible for their lives. Victimhood was not sacred, and failure was a spur. Now we always hear about the victims – the people who make bad choices because, we are told, society has abrogated its responsibility to make their lives easy.

    Not so long ago kids modelled themselves after people such as their parents, sought them out for guidance, and strove to be grown up.

    Welfare used to carry a stigma if you were not deserving of it. It was not a lifestyle choice.

    Let school kids find out how much this crap fucks you up. Let the kids see the addicts for the wasted people they are. Let them see how deleterious it affects other people.

    There is no no drug addiction chic.

    There are a whole lot of stupid things I never did in my life because I did not want to end up in a wheelchair, or bleeding in a gutter, or with brain damage.

    I think this kind of growing up again would make much of the war on drugs redundant, to be honest. Let people make their mistakes and own them. Or see other people’s mistakes and not have to own them.

  48. stackja

    ALP disreputable? I am shocked!

  49. Up The Workers!

    To nilk, at 1.30pm:

    ABSOLUTE RUBBISH!

    You must be a Labor voter – you’ve just comprehensively failed in philosophy AND maths.

    The correct answer is 42!

    Don’t you know ANYTHING?

    (Now what was the question again?)

  50. kc

    I consider myself a conservative, free enterprise kind of typical self employed old white guy. The kind who are now regularly maligned as the enemy. It bugs me that what we called “illegal drugs” are now “recreational”. It pisses me off that i pay all my due taxes, north of $1m a year if you add bas, corp, payroll and the like yet i see a cash economy thriving on my own doorstep. Lots of small businesses paying staff with cash, lots of little operators being cash only, paying no tax, money being washed through casinos and used for overseas holidays. I know india had half a shot by banning the big notes and it did not bide well but if we have a look at cashless welfare cards in some disfunctional remote communities it seems to be working. I am forming a view that the risk and inconvenience to individual freedom would be offset by the positive benefits, but, will stand corrected if somone has a more practical and eefectiv3 sollution, and teaching the bible is not one of them.

  51. kc

    & if you think the average drug f#cked bogan yobbo is going to pay in bitcoinn you are kidding yourself

  52. JC

    Like this.

    gold is the money of kings, silver is the money of gentlemen, barter is the money of peasants, debt is the money of slaves and bitcoin is the money of fools.

  53. stackja

    Ice is just the latest fad.

  54. Zulu Kilo Two Alpha

    Report suggests GST carve-up should be replaced with a new system
    Shane Wright, PerthNow
    December 11, 2017 9:27AM

    THE annual GST carve-up should be abandoned and replaced with a system that would deliver WA billions of dollars and stop mendicant States from bludging off the rest of the nation, a report out today argues.

    Compiled by the right-leaning Institute of Public Affairs, the report found WA had lost $16 billion to other parts of the Commonwealth since the current GST allocation system was introduced.

    Over the same period South Australia had reaped $19 billion from other States including WA, NSW and Victoria.

    The Productivity Commission is investigating the GST allocation system, with its draft report backing changes that it says would deliver more money to cash-strapped WA while taking money from poorer States such as SA and Tasmania. It has come under fire from smaller States as well as from Victoria.
    After years of complaints of our GST share, there might be some light at the end of the tunnel.

    IPA research fellow and report author Morgan Begg said some proposals being examined by the commission would deliver more cash to WA but were “second-best” options.

    He said the current system was deeply flawed and reduced incentives for States to build their economies and compete against other parts of the country in areas such as tax or bureaucratic oversight.

    But in a radical shift, Mr Begg said the country would be better off giving each State the right to strike its own rate of GST and keep that cash to do as they wished.

    “More reform is required, decentralising the GST by allowing the States to set the rate that applied in their respective jurisdictions and keeping the revenue raised would unlock the benefits of competitive federalism,” he said.

    Well, well, South Australia bludging off the Commonwealth? Who’d have thought it?

  55. kc

    And cash is a fad that has never gone out of fashion. Is it’s time due? Can we sacrifice our own rights for the greater good? We dont actually “need” it for much anymore. We just like the thought of it but almost every criminal enterprise does need cash to survive.

  56. Can we sacrifice our own rights for the greater good?

    The bolded phrase is used almost exclusively by tyrants.

  57. stackja

    What makes criminal enterprises so special? Problem is legalising immortality.

  58. but if we have a look at cashless welfare cards in some disfunctional remote communities it seems to be working.

    Currently those cards are costing $18,000 each to set up, and $12,000 a year to administer, per recipient. That’s to administer the $13,000 a year the dole recipient actually receives. Brilliant scheme! Most definitely the pathway to prosperity for all.

    Or we could try decriminalizing recreational drug use, initiating a “three strikes you’re out” jail policy for all serious crimes, including the supply of dangerous drugs, getting rid of half our public servants and all middle class welfare, and halving personal and company taxes with the savings.

  59. Bruce of Newcastle

    & if you think the average drug f#cked bogan yobbo is going to pay in bitcoinn you are kidding yourself

    KC – Every druggie has a phone. All they will need is a phone app and bingo, it’ll all be handled for them.

    I know of no other way apart from Christianity to arrange for a person to actually want to obey the law of the land, such as taxpaying, which is what you’re effectively after. Buddhism may partially work, but you might lose the work ethic aspect that way. Buddhist nations haven’t tended to be as dynamic as Judeo-Christian ones. Judaism is pretty good too, but the Haredim are quite a problem in Israel.

  60. kc

    Dont think i have tyranical tendancies, just think our society is going down the sh!thouse and maybe those of us who can and want to should try to help out our fellow man. Particulary if they can’t seem to be able to help themselves. I look towards singapore as an example of a benevolent dictatorship that worked.

  61. Driftforge

    The bolded phrase is used almost exclusively by tyrants.

    Or anybody with the mental capacity and ethical inclination to consider things greater than themselves. Well, and pretty much everyone who thinks that civilisation is a Good Thing.

  62. stackja

    Recreational drugs are the problem. Ice is just the latest

  63. thefrolickingmole

    kc

    Heres an “easy” way to launder some of the dough.

    Want drugs, buy a pizza from me (or whatever low cost disposable item you like) money is laundered completely legal.

    Just run ads telling people not to do it, any day now they are sure to work…

  64. benevolent dictatorship

    I’m in favour of it.
    Only if I am the dictator.

  65. kc

    Accept the fact that cashless welfare cards are an expensive fraud, but, it has largely shut down the drug and sly grog trade in those communities.

  66. Bruce of Newcastle

    Can we sacrifice our own rights for the greater good? We dont actually “need” it for much anymore.

    The philosophical question would be fun if there wasn’t so much riding on it. SF writer James P. Hogan had a go at imagining a secular cashless society which works in Voyage from Yesteryear. It’s a good read.

    So far any attempt at a socialism-which-works has failed utterly. Same goes for prohibition. Top down doesn’t work, only bottom up. (Oops, bad pun. 😀 )

  67. kc

    Bruce I’m not just after taxpaying. I can see that for all intents, prohabition has not worked. Law enforcement has not worked. We are losing a generation, and maybe that is what many people are happy with, a kind of evolution, except the buggers are breeding and taxpayers are footing the bill. While it all reeks of orwellian big government control i can’t think of a better way to stop it than remove their currency, literally. Bible classes dont really cut it either im afraid

  68. Chris

    gold is the money of kings, silver is the money of gentlemen, barter is the money of peasants, debt is the money of slaves and bitcoin is the money of fools.

    So I went looking and found something I had only seen quoted in bits.

    Cold Iron’, by Rudyard Kipling
    21 November 2012 by Tom Simon 9 Comments
    ‘Gold is for the mistress — silver for the maid —
    Copper for the craftsman cunning at his trade.’
    ‘Good!’ said the Baron, sitting in his hall,
    ‘But Iron — Cold Iron — is master of them all.’

    So he made rebellion ’gainst the King his liege,
    Camped before his citadel and summoned it to siege.
    ‘Nay!’ said the cannoneer on the castle wall,
    ‘But Iron — Cold Iron — shall be master of you all!’

    Woe for the Baron and his knights so strong,
    When the cruel cannon-balls laid ’em all along;
    He was taken prisoner, he was cast in thrall,
    And Iron — Cold Iron — was master of it all!

    Yet his King spake kindly (ah, how kind a Lord!)
    ‘What if I release thee now and give thee back thy sword?’
    ‘Nay!’ said the Baron, ‘mock not at my fall,
    For Iron — Cold Iron — is master of men all.’

    ‘Tears are for the craven, prayers are for the clown —
    Halters for the silly neck that cannot keep a crown.’
    ‘As my loss is grievous, so my hope is small,
    For Iron — Cold Iron — must be master of men all!’

    Yet his King made answer (few such Kings there be!)
    ‘Here is Bread and here is Wine — sit and sup with me.
    Eat and drink in Mary’s Name, the whiles I do recall
    How Iron — Cold Iron — can be master of men all!’

    He took the Wine and blessed it. He blessed and brake the Bread.
    With His own Hands He served Them, and presently He said:
    ‘See! These Hands they pierced with nails, outside My city wall,
    Show Iron — Cold Iron — to be master of men all.’

    ‘Wounds are for the desperate, blows are for the strong.
    Balm and oil for weary hearts all cut and bruised with wrong.
    I forgive thy treason — I redeem thy fall —
    For Iron — Cold Iron — must be master of men all!’

    ‘Crowns are for the valiant — sceptres for the bold!
    Thrones and powers for mighty men who dare to take and hold!’
    ‘Nay!’ said the Baron, kneeling in his hall,
    ‘But Iron — Cold Iron — is master of men all!
    Iron out of Calvary is master of men all!’

  69. but, it has largely shut down the drug and sly grog trade in those communities.

    No, kc. The people who want the grog and drugs simply moved to other communities. The same thing happened when they introduced “drinking licenses” in Arnhem Land ten years ago. All the drunks moved to Mt Isa, creating a massive public housing shortage.

  70. 132andBush

    Re the story linked by Johanna earlier today about the autistic man sipping paraquat.
    It was left in an unmarked soft drink bottle ffs!! That’s almost attempted murder.

    As for the farmer who died after accidentally having some spray in his mouth while using it in a BACKPACK sprayer? I’m sorry to say thats an example of natural selection.

  71. kc

    And if i wanted an app to buy a pizza, your pizza shop would need an abn, just for a start, plus hit industry benchmarks, have a commercial kitchen, bank the money generated by the app etc

  72. kc

    Talking metaphor memory vault. If there was no “commu ity” with “cash” to move to, could you still buy drugs and or avoid tax? Could uou still have criminal enterprises if you remove their currency? Would it be “worth” the inconvenience to the law abiding?

  73. Stimpson J. Cat

    benevolent dictatorship

    That moment when you realize not only was Judge Dredd right, he has always been right, and always will be right.

  74. stackja

    1950s Sydney suburb didn’t have major criminal problem Aspirin and penicillin were the only ‘drugs’ that were needed.

  75. kc

    Anyhow, I’ll retreat to my corner and slap myself. I hate the thought of da govmint knowing about everything i do and how i spend my money, nor do i trust them to not try to wring a bit more out of me. I just wish there was an better way to deal with criminals and the black economy. Maybe i will just retire in singapore and be done with it.

  76. Boambee John

    John Constantine at 1334

    Also said Australia wasn’t properly multicultural.

    Bit rich coming from a country where Han Chinese predominate!

  77. one old bruce

    – “It’s done in two ways. One way is a small purchase, say, a bag of potato chips, treated as though it were a very large purchase, and then they will give the customer some cash in addition to the potato chips, or they will just give them their card–let’s say there’s $300 on the card. They will give them $100, and then they have $200 left on the card, and they will keep ringing up as though they’re sales during the day, and they will end up with that $200.”

    https://www.naturalnews.com/042125_food_stamps_criminal_fraud_taxpayer_money.html
    https://www.naturalnews.com/041428_black_market_welfare_food_smuggling.html
    https://www.naturalnews.com/051808_food_stamp_fraud_Chicago_welfare_system.html#

  78. Mother Lode

    1950s Sydney suburb didn’t have major criminal problem Aspirin and penicillin were the only ‘drugs’ that were needed.

    My Grandfather was utterly convinced of the near panacea medicinal virtue of Ford Pills.

  79. except the buggers are breeding and taxpayers are footing the bill. While it all reeks of orwellian big government control i can’t think of a better way to stop it than remove their currency,

    In a way you keep answering your own questions, kc. The solution to the above dilemma is NOT to ban cash/control people’s spending (which doesn’t work anyway), but to stop footing the bloody bill in the first place. This is far simpler and easier to do than implement the massive societal upheaval that you’re suggesting.

    Would it be “worth” the inconvenience to the law abiding?

    No, it wouldn’t. It would be far more than a mere “inconvenience” to the law-abiding, and those intent on thwarting the law would soon find a way around it.

  80. Boambee John

    Stimpson at 1403

    BLTG

    You are still using their terminology. Do not despoil the fine word “gay” (happy, joyous) by linking it to homosexuality. Use the honest technical term “homosexual”.

    BLTH

  81. Roger

    Bit rich coming from a country where Han Chinese predominate!

    Not simply predominate, but actively dominate from a perspective of racial superiority.

  82. stackja

    Why don’t homosexuals like plain English? Why euphemisms?

  83. DrBeauGan

    Iron out of Calvary is master of men all!’

    Probably Kipling’s most nauseating poem.

  84. kc

    Memory vault, how? If all and every transaction had to traverse the banking system, how could it be thwarted? Ctiminals deal in cash. They buy with cash, sell for cash and operate outside the system. They pay no tax and only ever seem to caught when they try to wash it through banks or buy traceable assets. I hate the very thought of a no cash economy and the infrigements on my own life. I hate criminality and tax avoidance even more.

  85. Tel

    Want drugs, buy a pizza from me (or whatever low cost disposable item you like) money is laundered completely legal.

    I have often thought that the entire fashion industry might be running on that basis.

    When I walk though shopping malls, and look at all the “outlet” shops where as far as I can see no one buys anything and fairly ordinary dresses have high price tags. Then again, I’ve not had good experiences going shopping with women so I could be totally wrong on this.

  86. Bruce of Newcastle

    KC – I know where you are coming from and I agree entirely. I’m a chemist. If you thought it was bad now just wait. Fentanyl is only the start of the massive wave that is coming.

    The problem is how do you get people to behave? That has been the question since prehistoric times. Nations which have worked out a system have been the successful ones. Rome for example worked on “virtue” for their republican phase. But the empire got too big and republicanism no longer worked. They went to an imperial dictatorship, which solved the command and control problem but lost the virtue. After a while the empire suffered terrible corruption and societal decay because of the same problem we have with adherence to law – top down control isn’t very efficient.

    You can see why Constantine liked the idea of Christianity. Roman virtue was no longer working but Christianity reincarnated it again in a new form. Christianity then helped the Eastern Roman Empire to survive another thousand years.

    The Protestant work ethic is a thing. How you duplicate the industriousness and law abiding aspects of it without the underlying belief system I don’t know. But that’s what is needed.

  87. Empire

    In a way you keep answering your own questions, kc. The solution to the above dilemma is NOT to ban cash/control people’s spending (which doesn’t work anyway), but to stop footing the bloody bill in the first place. This is far simpler and easier to do than implement the massive societal upheaval that you’re suggesting.

    Thank you, MV.

    Our current problems are the predictable consequence of a rapacious state, state actors buying votes from special interests and grifters specialising in skimming other people’s money from…the state.

    It should not have to be said at this blog that state inflicted dysfunction is never solved by adding further state intervention. Only a statanist would support such a thing.

  88. Roger

    The Protestant work ethic is a thing. How you duplicate the industriousness and law abiding aspects of it without the underlying belief system I don’t know.

    Culture is downstream from religion.

  89. Roger

    Only a statanist would support such a thing.

    I take it that’s not a typo…one for the Catallaxy lexicon.

  90. kc

    Bruce i accept you cant get people to “behave”. If druggies however had to barter because there was no cash. If drug sellers could not operate because they could not benefit from a cash transaction, would they bother? For all the civil benefits of a cash economy, there are some seriuos downsides and i have no idea how, with the existing system, society is going to cope as we baby boomers put the cue in the rack. God knows gen x and y dont want to be in a small business.

  91. Stimpson J. Cat

    Do not despoil the fine word “gay” (happy, joyous) by linking it to homosexuality.

    Sorry, but we are way past despoiling my friend.
    It is far far far too late to either save or rehabilitate the word “gay”.
    It only has two meanings now:
    a male homosexual/female homosexual
    a word signifying disgust/disdain/dissaproval etc
    Thinking otherwise is delusion, plain and simple.

  92. P

    stackja #2581704, posted on December 11, 2017 at 3:15 pm

    1950s Sydney suburb didn’t have major criminal problem Aspirin and penicillin were the only ‘drugs’ that were needed.

    Alcohol for adults. Sniffing Clag or my fav Perkins Paste for school age.

  93. Chris

    Probably Kipling’s most nauseating poem.

    I am sure that’s why we only ever see the first worse (sic).

  94. If all and every transaction had to traverse the banking system, how could it be thwarted? Ctiminals deal in cash.

    I own a still, and I know where there is a tank on an ex dairy farm with 8,000 gallons of molasses. Even if I didn’t own the still I could make one from stuff bought at Bunnings. What are going to do – insist all bottles have a serial number and are registered? There’s not a great deal that I need in life that I couldn’t acquire by trading cheap, but drinkable alcohol.

    Criminals deal in cash, but only because it is simplest and most convenient means of transactions. It is not the only means. Anything with an intrinsic value will suffice. During the Great Depression unopened packets of .22 bullets, and sealed tins of tobacco both served as “cash”.

  95. herodotus

    Also said Australia wasn’t properly multicultural.

    Yeah, right. If only it could be done properly, as they say about communism.

  96. DrBeauGan

    The Protestant work ethic is a thing. How you duplicate the industriousness and law abiding aspects of it without the underlying belief system I don’t know. But that’s what is needed.

    Nobody is going to be law abiding when laws do not deserve to be followed. Nobody is going to be industrious when half his earnings are confiscated by the state to buy votes from the indolent. This is the situation in which we find ourselves.

    It will either be resolved in blood and fire or, much more likely, by cultural collapse. Either the competent people leave or they start a revolution. Leaving is cheaper and less hassle for most of us.

  97. testpattern

    PFAS scandal spreading

    ‘High levels of toxic chemicals linked to firefighting foams have been found near Port Hedland Airport, not far from homes in South Hedland. The highly contaminated area is on a growing list of WA sites impacted by per- and polyfluoroalkyl substances (PFAS), which are a global concern. PFAS has also entered the Swan and Canning rivers, and is present at locations across Perth.’

    CURRENT LIST OF WA SITES KNOWN TO BE IMPACTED BY PFAS

    https://thewest.com.au/news/north-west-telegraph/high-levels-of-toxic-chemicals-found-near-port-hedland-airport-ng-b88686637z

  98. Rae

    Re the story linked by Johanna earlier today about the autistic man sipping paraquat.
    It was left in an unmarked soft drink bottle ffs!! That’s almost attempted murder.

    The article mentioned no comment from the local Council. It seemed to insinuate negligence by a Council worker or contractor.

  99. Baldrick

    Black Lives Matter to protest in Melbourne against peaceful paying customers of a free speech advocate:

    We, residents, tenants, businesses, community organisations, representatives and community leaders stand united against hate and fear being brought into our suburbs.
    Together, we resoundingly condemn the hosting of an event on Monday 4th December that brought hate, vitriol and vilification to our proudly, diverse multicultural suburbs.
    We condemn the actions and behaviour of white-nationalist hate groups who abused and vilified local residents through megaphones and intimidated and assaulted local residents in the streets of Kensington & Flemington.
    This is not about ‘free speech’. People like Milo have ample free speech.
    This is about countering hate-speech, violence and its very real impacts upon people in our communities. We are stating that it is unacceptable.
    We stand by and support all local residents who were abused, intimidated or affected by the presence of this event.
    We are committed to stand up against racism and hate in our communities.

    But those of the Socialist Alternative who engaged in violence, intimidation and hate of people waiting outside to see the event get a free pass.

  100. Baldrick

    Rae
    #2581732, posted on December 11, 2017 at 3:49 pm

    Oh and fuck off Septimus Mac

  101. testpattern

    ‘Kipling’s most nauseating poem’

    The Browneye of the Little White Quadrant

    He was known as mad Windschuttle to historians round town,
    He was madder than they felt inclined to tell,
    His ahistoric pranks were worshipped by the cranks,
    And dogs lined up to shag his leg as well.

    Into Quadrant came one day a man called Black Carew,
    He was blacker than a menacing Zulu horde,
    ‘You’re welcome to my country, you may chew my Ngammeri,
    As a gesture of goodwill and fair concord.’

    With a semiotic shudder and a fart to end all farts,
    Windschuttle’s head spun just like Linda Blair,
    ‘Terranullius forever!’ were the last words that he said,
    As body parts exploded everywhere.

    Now there’s a vacant office where the little white Quadrant stood,
    A browneye dog awaits a leg to woo,
    There’s a sign that says ‘It was my country, you’re welcome to it mate,
    – Gone to flog carpets in Kathmandu.’

  102. Stimpson J. Cat

    Bad enough having a Gaydar, now we have to have a f$cking Raedar.
    I like that you are being polite though Grig.

  103. stackja

    Alcohol and glue not known to me.

  104. Geriatric Mayfly

    We are stating that it is unacceptable.

    Where’s that word ‘inappropriate’ when you need it?

  105. Baldrick

    Stupid.Fucking.Liberals trying to stymie Jim Molan’s Senate seat:

    The High Court has stopped short of endorsing Liberal Jim Molan to replace former Nationals senator Fiona Nash over a new legal issue.
    The court heard there were no questions about Mr Molan’s eligibility, but there was an issue about the declaration of the poll.
    The High Court heard today that due to Mr Molan’s low placement on the ticket there was some argument over whether he should inherit Ms Nash’s six-year term ahead of senators Concetta Fierravanti-Wells and John Williams, who are both serving three-year terms.

    Jim Molan received 9,000 more votes than Fierravanti-Wells and 8,000 more than Williams.

  106. Stimpson J. Cat

    Re the story linked by Johanna earlier today about the autistic man sipping paraquat.

    Autistic people can be incredibly stupid at times.
    I still remember the time I put my finger in a lamp socket without a bulb to see if it was on.

  107. Where’s that word ‘inappropriate’ when you need it?

    Probably being used inappropriately elsewhere.
    Which, it must be stated, is unacceptable.

  108. If you look after your employees they will take care of your customers.
    Branson

    Yeah, coz that’s all it takes to implement excellent customer service.

    Go soft on the staff & give them lots of free goodies.
    Yeah.

  109. Farmer Gez

    The Protestant work ethic is somewhat of a conceit.
    Without the Magna Carta would such ethic would even exist? The Barons didn’t give a cus about the law for a common man but they did care about property rights and its protection from regal or forceful theft, and there lies the basis of a work ethic. You get to keep what you earn by and large and the common law of the land will uphold your right to do so.
    We don’t lack religion but we do lack the clear distinction of personal right to property as distinct from the governments power to confiscate such property for the commonwealth (non wealth creators).

  110. testpattern

    ‘The same thing happened when they introduced “drinking licenses” in Arnhem Land ten years ago. All the drunks moved to Mt Isa’

    Bullshit. Charter plane benders fly non stop to Darwin where they like to stay at my uncle’s hotel.

    Nor have sly groggers have ever stopped. Most communities have a big house that stands out like an aboriginal-friendly comment on catallaxy. I saw new palace in Looma when I was there recently.

  111. Sparkx

    james macpherson‏
    @jamesmacpherson
    8m8 minutes ago
    More
    THE West will tolerate itself to death
    0 replies 4 retweets 4 likes
    Reply Retweeted 4 Liked 4 Direct message

  112. Empire GTHO Phase III

    I take it that’s not a typo…one for the Catallaxy lexicon.

    Roger

    “Statanist” was originally a JC typo. I use it liberally with leftists.

    Quit worshipping the Great Statan and take the goddam red pill…

  113. Bruce of Newcastle

    If druggies however had to barter because there was no cash.

    KC – Sorry mate that horse has already bolted as I said.

    Bitcoin is just one of a bunch of internationalist currencies made feasible by the internet and blockchain. The invention is here, it can’t be uninvented.

    It is easy to produce apps that do stuff like exchange bitcoin or etherium or another virtual currency. You now can swipe your phone at the supermarket to pay your grocery bill. Druggies will be able to swipe their phone with their dealer’s phone to pay in virtual international currency.

    Because it is highly encrypted, uses the internet, is international AND operates by a phone the chances of a national government preventing its use is nil. Too useful. You’d have to ban phones. Try that and you’ll be hung from the nearest lamppost. People are totally addicted to their phones.

    Even homeless people, even Zimbabweans and Venezuelans, have phones. About the only people who don’t are Norks, and that approach is worse than the disease.

  114. calli

    Where’s that word ‘inappropriate’ when you need it?

    Probably being used inappropriately elsewhere.
    Which, it must be stated, is unacceptable.

    And problematic.

  115. JC

    “Statanist” was originally a JC typo. I use it liberally with leftists.

    Not a bad typo. It sorta conveys double meaning using one word. Satanist and statist. Might use it myself.

  116. DrBeauGan

    It’s interesting how ‘unacceptable’ has transitioned from requiring a noun declaring to whom it was unacceptable, to a standalone word which implies ‘unacceptable to all decent people’. Likewise ‘inappropriate’ which no longer needs to specify what exactly something is inappropriate for. Using a hammer to insert a screw is inappropriate. Now declaring an ugly woman unfuckable is ‘inappropriate’. This simply abuses the word.

    The word ‘discrimination’ is also abused.

    The world needs more discrimination, not less.

  117. Mater

    Any suggestions for stopping the drug trade and tax avoidance that would be as effective?

    Re-introduce personal consequences.
    Stop paying their Hospital bill when they OD!
    Stop giving them a wage when their brains are too f$cked up to work!
    Same applies to getting obese, etc.

    People will only stop doing stupid things when they (and their families) have to endure the true consequences of their actions.

  118. Geriatric Mayfly

    We condemn the actions and behaviour of white-nationalist hate groups who abused and vilified local residents through megaphones and intimidated and assaulted local residents in the streets of Kensington & Flemington.

    Looking at the petitioners and occupations, we have a classic invasion of a locality by the precious, soy soaked and woke inner urban Left. For years, I drove to and from work down the main drag of Flemington and on the turn into Smithfield Rd. applied the nosegay to carry me, in small comfort, past the stockyards and abattoirs. Never saw one of these nouveau creatures there in five years, nor smelled the aroma of a single coffee bean en passant. Adam Bandt (a signatory) was still in nappies.

  119. testpattern

    ‘Looks like Sino Sam will be Labor’s next Thommo.’

    Dastyari reminds me of the CLP politicians and their public servants who for many years actively tried to prevent East Timor activists and critics of Indonesia from being heard. They lost and so will the China appeasers.

  120. pete m

    I’m having a debate with folks over whether kids should be criminally responsible by age 10 in Qld.

    I say they know by then right wrong so need to be amenable to a justice system designed for kids.

    The others say keep kids out of justice system until they know the consequences of their actions.

    Here’s the argument against me:

    There is a big difference between ensuring they accept consequences and getting them caught up in the criminal justice system. Also, while children know they are doing something wrong, they lack the insight to understand the far-reaching consequences of their offending. You can’t expect a 10-year-old to be able to look that far ahead. Also, one way they will end up running a drug network is being exposed to harder and more experienced criminals within the system. Another is labelling them a criminal at 10-if you take away a chance at earning a living legally, what choices are left to them? If we won’t have a shot at rehabilitation a 10-year-old, it is time to switch off the lights and walk away.

  121. Stimpson J. Cat

    Which, it must be stated, is unacceptable.

    Unacceptable!!!

  122. Zatara

    The Protestant work ethic is a thing. How you duplicate the industriousness and law abiding aspects of it without the underlying belief system I don’t know. But that’s what is needed.

    You eliminate giving free stuff to the able-bodied. No exceptions.

    Once upon a time, people would work to put food on the table. Then the govt started paying and feeding them to do nothing. Was it so hard to foresee what would happen?

    In the same way that the Depression strengthened our character and work ethic the welfare society has massively weakened both.

  123. Mike of Marion

    Holland and Holland
    Gunmaking Craftmanship.

  124. Rossini

    Currently, those cards are costing $18,000 each to set up, and $12,000 a year to administer, per recipient. That’s to administer the $13,000 a year the dole recipient actually receives.

    How did you arrive at these costs………seems far too high

  125. P

    Looks like Jim Molan’s Senate wait may be put off until New Year.

    One wonders if it is because Mr Molan is a close ally of Tony Abbott.

  126. Chris

    Most communities have a big house that stands out like an aboriginal-friendly comment on catallaxy. I

    Speaking of the Big House, I chatted with a chap working as a prison guard the other day. He had just had added to his population a kid of 18 years and four months age, for an indefinite sentence. The kid will grow old and die in prison for murdering three people.
    He is not aboriginal, for the the record.

  127. old bloke

    1950s Sydney suburb didn’t have major criminal problem Aspirin and penicillin were the only ‘drugs’ that were needed.

    For the heavy drug users, there was always the “Bex and a good lie-down”.

  128. I’m having a debate with folks over whether kids should be criminally responsible by age 10 in Qld.

    It’s really a non-argument, Pete. It is what happens when society tries to put a chronological age on developing behaviour. I’ve met thirteen year girls street-wise enough to be running a high class brothel, and 30 year old women who really should have had a full time chaperone.

    In the old days it was much simpler. Boys were boys until they got hair on their balls, and could get an erection. Then they were men. Girls were girls until they had fairly regular periods, and then they women. There was very little confusion.

  129. Chris

    How did you arrive at these costs………seems far too high

    Sounds like the real reason Aboriginal welfare spending is so high – battalions of wodjilas in Silver City administering service delivery. Divide $165K per annum per wodjila (white c**t) by the number of aboriginals living on the allocated public spending – bam! A truckload of money per aboriginal person.

  130. JC

    I’m having a debate with folks over whether kids should be criminally responsible by age 10 in Qld.

    Get a load of this.

    A 19 year old Chicago woman who live-streamed the racially charged kidnapping, torture and mutilation of a mentaly disabled teen was given 200 hours of community service and four years of probation on Friday.

    http://ibankcoin.com/zeropointnow/2017/12/10/chicago-woman-who-filmed-kidnapping-and-torture-of-disabled-teen-avoids-prison/#sthash.yg6Hn53s.dpbs

  131. Zatara

    I’m having a debate with folks over whether kids should be criminally responsible by age 10 in Qld.

    If they are too young to be responsible for their actions then you go after the people who ARE responsible for their actions. Their parents.

    Make it painful enough for mum and dad and watch how their attitudes towards those responsibilities change. It might take a generation or two to sort itself out but it will sort itself out.

  132. Bruce of Newcastle

    I’m having a debate with folks over whether kids should be criminally responsible by age 10 in Qld.

    He had just had added to his population a kid of 18 years and four months age, for an indefinite sentence.

    This is straight out off the “history and moral philosophy” bits of Heinlein’s Starship Troopers.
    Remember Dillinger, and the kids who (in that book) were allowed to run riot until 18 then would be subject to a death sentence for their next crime.

    No wonder lefties hate Starship Troopers.

  133. P

    For the heavy drug users, there was always the “Bex and a good lie-down”.

    A Bex power a day was very common right throughout the 50s.
    Adults took them around morning tea time.
    Never knew of kids under 15yrs taking a Bex other than when sick.
    Very addictive those powders were.

  134. Chris

    Mike of Marion, thanks for the H&H video. I visited their shop some 15 years ago, when a Royal Grade double in say .500 Nitro was a steal at GBP 99,000.
    The work is beautiful.

  135. How did you arrive at these costs………seems far too high

    Extrapolated from two sources. The first was a news report a few months ago, about the card system, and the costs of implementing and running it. The answer supplied to the committee was that the cards had cost $30,000 each in the first twelve months. However, it was pointed out that this included one-off implementation costs, so the annual cost would be less.

    The second was a news report only a few days ago, where a politician was singing the praises of the card system, and their effectiveness in tackling societal issues, despite each card costing $12,000 a year to administer. He was speaking as part of the debate on whether to expand issuing the cards to the Bundaberg area, and somewhere else (forget where).

    Both news items were on the ABC online.

    If the annual admin cost per card is $12,000, and the cost of implementation plus one year’s admin cost is $30,000, then the implementation cost was $18,000.

  136. Gilas

    kc
    #2581636, posted on December 11, 2017 at 1:48 pm

    For all the Orwellian/civil liberties/free market capitalist downsides, having just read some more about the ice scourge, is there a single mechansim that would have more effect than our society going cashless?

    So that the government/ATO could control/see/trace all financial transfers? Are you joking?

    Decriminalise drugs, reduce the costs of policing them, reduce the profit motive for the criminal cartels and let the invisible hand of Darwinism do its work.

  137. Sorry, first para refers to a Senate committee hearing.

  138. notafan

    A Federal Government trial restricting how Centrelink recipients can spend their money is costing taxpayers up to about $10,000 per participant.

    The Cashless Debit Card quarantines 80 per cent of welfare and cannot pay for liquor, gambling or be used to withdraw cash.

    The Coalition is looking to expand income management to more communities, with one MP pushing for 10 new trial sites to be announced in next week’s budget.

    Centrelink cashless welfare card trial costing taxpayers $10,000 per participant

  139. Tel

    If they are too young to be responsible for their actions then you go after the people who ARE responsible for their actions. Their parents.

    Make it painful enough for mum and dad and watch how their attitudes towards those responsibilities change. It might take a generation or two to sort itself out but it will sort itself out.

    Mums and dads were locked out of any ability to discipline their kids with the help of the school system, social workers, and the teacher’s unions (all the same people who complain about the results). They cannot be held responsible, unless they are actually given some authority with which to be responsible.

    These days, the school can start giving your child sex change drugs without even telling you a thing about it… tell me again about responsibility here????

  140. Rabz

    LOL. Wonderful new portrait of good ol’ Phil the Greek by Aussie artist Ralph Heimans.

    His portrait of Betty Windsor does the lady justice, as well. I saw it a couple years ago at the NPG, with a good mate who was an ex Royal Marine.

  141. Bruce in WA

    Mike of Marion

    Thanks, Mike. I never get sick of seeing that video … the craftsmanship is superb.

  142. Knuckle Dragger

    Testes,

    For once you’re partially correct. Charter planes full of ‘benders’ (if you mean lifelong benders) do arrive in Darwin all the time from all over the NT. They’re there because of reduced ability to buy grog in heir home communities due to the existence of drinking permits, which most of them are banned from having anyway because they’re domestic violence offenders or flog everyone in sight when they’re pissed.

    Their favourite trick to get the Dept of Health to pay for it is to say they’re going to Darwin ‘for hospital, for that dialysis miss’. If they can’t get that sentence out, just tapping their kidneys usually gets the message across and free flights ensue.

    Then it’s straight from the airport to the front of the nearest bottle shop to humbug anyone not on the Banned Drinkers’ Register (BDR) to buy grog for them. They themselves are on the BDR for the same reasons they can’t get a permit at home. That’s why half of Port Keats live in the creek bed between the airport and the convenient Airport Hotel, and play frogger back and forth on McMillans Road every day – first to buy grog, and then back across the road to hide and drink it.

    It also sounds very much like ‘your uncle’s hotel’ is the Capricornia in Fannie Bay. Very cheap, very close to the Frontier Hotel and a non-suspicious death rate for occupants that was up there with the Gatwick in St. Kilda before it became a Block project. If you say it’s the Mantra Pandanus, then I’ll KNOW you’re having a lend.

    Sly grogging is most often done out of the backs of cars, not houses. They’re easy to spot and nullify, not least because currently a 700ml bottle of Beam goes for $700. You will know it by the three ‘voluptuous’ indigenous ladies sprawled across the bonnet of a beaten to shit Toyota or Mazda ute that’s just back from Alice, with a scrawny white fella (otherwise known as the breadwinner) supplying a small but cashed up crowd at the other end.

  143. calli

    An interesting story of courage, despite the attempted spin.

    It also has a nice sting in the tail.

    As well as support from the Yes camp, Mr Littleproud says he’s received a significant number of emails from No supporters in western Sydney, praising him for representing the wishes of his electorate.

  144. testpattern

    Origins of the Australian collection in the Vatican Museums

    ‘The main source of Australian collection items in the Vatican Museums are from the Tiwi Islands north of Darwin, Kalumburu in the north east Kimberley and around New Norcia near Perth’

    http://aiatsis.gov.au/explore/articles/australian-collection-vatican-museums

    The catalogue will be released in January 2018, hopefully not on the 26th.

  145. Ez

    The Fair Work Commission held Anglo American unfairly dismissed Vincent ‘Jimmy’ Wilson after finding the evidence was not enough to support such serious allegations and after considering that the female trainee had herself made sexually explicit conversation.

    The 19-year-old woman, known as Person A, alleged Mr Wilson had engaged in “unwelcome and uninvited physical contact” with her, including “slapping or patting” her on the backside while they were in a crane basket together.

    Why is Vincent ‘Jimmy’ Wilson named (potentially harming future employment opportunities) while the party making unsubstantiated allegations is only allowed to be identified as “Person A”?

    However, she [Commissioner Paula Spencer] warned that “in the current environment of sexual harassment allegations, it is necessary to comment that nothing in this decision should be construed as condoning sexual harassment at a workplace in any way”.

    WTF is this?!
    A commissioner’s Weinstein-ing this guy? Really?

  146. Zatara

    tell me again about responsibility here????

    First of all lets accept that SOMEONE is responsible when a child commits a crime. If it isn’t them it’s the people legally responsible for them and their welfare until they reach majority. That’s not their school, their social worker or the teacher’s union. It’s the parents.

    The fact that for some reason we have allowed external agencies to insert themselves into that relationship is certainly lamentable but it doesn’t change the basic fact. The parents are responsible.

    I didn’t say some mindsets and some laws didn’t need to be changed. I just pointed out the obvious, and dare I say natural, solution.

  147. Joe

    You eliminate giving free stuff to the able-bodied. No exceptions.

    Except when the only abled bodies working are robots.

  148. Joe

    First of all lets accept that SOMEONE is responsible when a child commits a crime. If it isn’t them it’s the people legally responsible for them and their welfare until they reach majority. That’s not their school, their social worker or the teacher’s union. It’s the parents.

    Except parents ability to sanction their children has been neutered by the left – by design.

  149. Centrelink cashless welfare card trial costing taxpayers $10,000 per participant

    And here’s a press release from Jenny Macklin stating the cost at $12,000 a year.
    I’m not going to get into a bunfight over $2,000 when not even the politicians can agree on the cost.
    Let’s just agree to agree that it costs far too much to be considered an answer to anything.
    Let alone universal implementation for the entire population to tackle drug addiction.

  150. Zatara

    Except parents ability to sanction their children has been neutered by the left – by design.

    So un-nueter it. Or accept that every time you allow the state to make another decision on how you raise your kids is one more step towards being nothing but their biological source and their financier.

  151. notafan

    I’m not MV

    I’m getting into a bunfight over $30.000 a year.

    I don’t believe for one second that the US version costs a fraction of that,btw.

  152. Stimpson J. Cat

    First of all lets accept that SOMEONE is responsible when a child commits a crime. If it isn’t them it’s the people legally responsible for them and their welfare until they reach majority. That’s not their school, their social worker or the teacher’s union. It’s the parents.

    Some kids are just natural born criminals who need to be trained in civilized behaviour.
    This is where intelligence comes in to play.

  153. Empire GTHO Phase III

    Not a bad typo. It sorta conveys double meaning using one word. Satanist and statist. Might use it myself.

    Whenever I tell a leftard the term was coined by JC, they ask for a biblical reference…

  154. Knuckle Dragger

    Zatara at 4.46;

    Parental responsibility has been tried and failed, in the NT anyway. About 10 years back the govt (not sure whether it was CLP or Labor) made a huge song and dance about new legislation which would hold parents responsible for the behaviour of their children. There would be financial penalties, and the go-to line at pressers was that if parents didn’t have the money the govt would confiscate their TVs.

    Needless to say, a large proportion of juvenile crooks were already in care (Voller style) and therefore ineligible, and for those that lived with at least one parent – well, they were on disability, weren’t they, and couldn’t leave the house to enforce said discipline.

    The legislation was quietly repealed.

    A more effective version existed in Victoria in the early 70s. It was called the Dad Act 1942 and involved liberal clouts to the back of the head until you thought your tongue would fall out. Now THAT system worked.

  155. Leigh Lowe

    P

    #2581762, posted on December 11, 2017 at 4:31 pm

    Looks like Jim Molan’s Senate wait may be put off until New Year.

    One wonders if it is because Mr Molan is a close ally of Tony Abbott.

    I thought his appointment was off the back of a HC ruling which put a hard and fast stipulation that the next candidate on the ticket would occupy the spot.
    The Greens get to nominate, I think, because they resigned prior to being referred so it becomes a normal casual vacancy which the party can nominate a replacement of choice.
    Trumble rolled the dice on the HC decision and lost.
    To defy that process now is sailing very close to contempt of court.

  156. Boambee John

    P at 1642

    Very addictive those powders were.

    And also very destructive of kidneys.

  157. Empire GTHO Phase III

    So un-nueter it. Or accept that every time you allow the state to make another decision on how you raise your kids is one more step towards being nothing but their biological source and their financier.

    Also by design.

    None of this will be changed at the ballot box.

    There will be blood and there will be destitute ex public sector employees.

  158. Leigh Lowe

    And here’s a press release from Jenny Macklin stating the cost at $12,000 a year.
    I’m not going to get into a bunfight over $2,000 when not even the politicians can agree on the cost.

    That is bullshit.
    What happens when any high profile policy pops up which a government is committed to (or bound to) is that the PS has a fucking stacks-on loading up the cost.
    For example, do you really think that running the SSM plebiscite cost $120 meg?
    The arsewipes in the ABS basically shovelled everything they could into that bucket and no doubt had a bit of a party along the way.
    Same with the cashless welfare card.
    The PS knows the Coalition is hot to trot on it and I’ll bet Centrelink is making every post a winner in loading cost into it.

  159. Zulu Kilo Two Alpha

    It was called the Dad Act 1942 and involved liberal clouts to the back of the head until you thought your tongue would fall out. Now THAT system worked.

    You were pampered. The “Dad Act” in Western Australia involved an old fashioned razor strop. One of the clauses stated that the attention span of your sons was twice the length of whatever they’d last been belted with.

  160. Boambee John

    Tel at 1700

    Mums and dads were locked out of any ability to discipline their kids with the help of the school system, social workers, and the teacher’s unions (all the same people who complain about the results). They cannot be held responsible, unless they are actually given some authority with which to be responsible.

    These days, the school can start giving your child sex change drugs without even telling you a thing about it… tell me again about responsibility here????

    Then go for the school system, starting with the Commonwealth and state ministers, and working down to school principals and classroon teachers. If they will not permit parents to have responsibility, then lay it on them.

  161. I’m getting into a bunfight over $30.000 a year.

    Sorry, Nota, but you’ve lost me.
    Who said anything about “$30,000 a year”?
    And what has the “US version” got to do with it?

  162. Chris

    You were pampered. The “Dad Act” in Western Australia involved an old fashioned razor strop.

    And yer tell that to the young people these days and they just doooon’t believe you!

  163. Top Ender

    A Millennial job interview

  164. Zatara

    Knuckle Dragger

    A more effective version existed in Victoria in the early 70s. It was called the Dad Act 1942 and involved liberal clouts to the back of the head until you thought your tongue would fall out. Now THAT system worked.

    Exactly. When the parents have skin in the game they focus more on how it’s played.

    Passing it off on the schools, the state, whatever, is popular for some elements of society because it’s the lazy, easy way out. This is what the left counts on when they slip in just one more law or regulation to make state control of the children more pervasive.

  165. testpattern

    ‘Parental responsibility has been tried and failed, in the NT anyway’

    more bullshit.

    Howard’s intervention wrecked what was left of parental control in some Arnhemland communties. Parents were told they couldn’t smack their kids, kids said you can’t touch us, gangs organised the kids. That’s why av fuel sniffing on Elcho.

  166. Snoopy

    That is bullshit.
    What happens when any high profile policy pops up which a government is committed to (or bound to) is that the PS has a fucking stacks-on loading up the cost.

    Exactly. Who is running with the bad news? Surprise! It’s Their ABC. I wonder what the figures for emergency income grants in those communities are? That’s the money you ask for on Monday when you gambled away Thursday’s payment on Friday.

  167. Knuckle Dragger

    ZK2A,

    Did I mention I was barefoot and in the snow at the time? And carrying the family horse?

  168. testpattern

    ‘One wonders if it is because Mr Molan is a close ally of Tony Abbott.’

    the guy has more baggage than the ovation of the seas. people who write puffpiece books about themselves are likely to have their claims investigated.

  169. Snoopy

    Parents were told they couldn’t smack their kids, kids said you can’t touch us, gangs organised the kids. That’s why av fuel sniffing on Elcho.

    What a load of bullocks. Aboriginal boys have never been disciplined by their parents.

  170. Zulu Kilo Two Alpha

    Did I mention I was barefoot and in the snow at the time? And carrying the family horse?

    Used to live in hole in middle of the road, we did..

  171. Makka

    A commissioner’s Weinstein-ing this guy? Really?

    Of course. The process IS the the punishment.

  172. H B Bear

    Granny Macklin the geriatric of the house. Time to be movin’ the ol’ gal on.

  173. C.L.

    Probably the biggest trending story of the day …
    What do all y’all think of famous folks coming to the aid of bullied boy Keaton Jones?
    Kind of nice, I think.
    Snoopdogg weighed in:

    Say lil Man U gotta friend in me for life hit me on dm so we can chop it up love is the only way to beat hate 👊🏾☝🏾

    Meanwhile British boxer Tony Bellew takes a more practical approach:

    Tony Bellew ✔ @TonyBellew
    This is truly heartbreaking! I’d love to teach this kid to fight and believe me the bullies would never bully anyone again after a good crack on the chin! Bully = Coward

  174. Rossini

    If the annual admin cost per card is $12,000, and the cost of implementation plus one year’s admin cost is $30,000, then the implementation cost was $18,000.
    A Federal Government trial restricting how Centrelink recipients can spend their money is costing taxpayers up to about $10,000 per participant.

    Whatever the cost verses the supposed advantages…………it seems a massive waste of resources……………although it probably provides work for someone

  175. Mother Lode

    What’s with Testes’ fixation on all things Aboriginal?

  176. Knuckle Dragger

    Testes,

    You of all people should apparently know better.

    Parents in the NT have NEVER been told they can’t smack their kids. It’s actually legislated under Section 11 of the NT Criminal Code Act that you can.

    And the indigenous folk have NEVER EVER EVER been told you can’t smack your kids.

    You know why? Because………. CULTURE. Massive own goal there son.

    Are you seriously telling me that generations of NT governments have given the OK for parents and ‘elders’ to slice their teenage boys’ penises open with a knife or a sharp rock, but won’t let them hand out a smack on the arse when deserved? Even for you, that’s stretching it.

    I can look out my front door and see it. The view from Perth might be a bit more blurry.

    To quote your good self, ‘More bullshit.’ Only this time your staggering ignorance masquerading as all-seeing wisdom amuses me. Greatly.

  177. thefrolickingmole

    That moment when you realize not only was Judge Dredd right, he has always been right, and always will be right.

    Obligitory, you know it makes sense.

    Also this was done in parody, anyone want to bet he wouldnt win now?

    http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-q5zP6N2OlTY/TkxWaT4OJcI/AAAAAAAAAM0/l7QUPgiGHPg/s1600/368politician.jpg

    Better than Maolcolm and the termites of the uniparties.

  178. P

    Leigh Lowe #2581797, posted on December 11, 2017 at 5:29 pm

    Two articles this arvo on Jim Molan and his present position as it appears to stand at this moment:

    “Jim Molan’s senate wait may be put off till New Year”
    The Australian – Paywall.
    To get past the wall just go to google news and right click on the article then click Open in new tab

    “Citizenship saga: Fiona Nash’s NSW Senate seat still vacant after new legal issue”
    ABC News

  179. thefrolickingmole

    AHAH!!! Western Australia is fighting back against the inequity of the GST carveup by… inflicting economic damage on ourselves…

    Federation is now going to spiral into an act of self harm, a circular ball kicking contest with the first to squeal “stop”! picking up the tab for the rest.

    (from the mines department)
    Statewide moratorium on fracking while enquiry is being held

    Date:
    Friday, 08 December 2017

    The State Government gazetted today a Legislative fracking ban achieved in South-West, Peel and Perth.

    A moratorium on fracking anywhere in the State will be imposed while a scientific inquiry is conducted, with the outcome deciding the future of fracking in Western Australia.

    Department of Mines, Industry Regulation and Safety Executive Director Petroleum Jeff Haworth said the inquiry will seek input from the Western Australian community.

    “Community members and interest groups with concerns will be able to put their views to the inquiry, and the State Government will consider these views to form a final decision on the future of fracking in Western Australia,” he said.

    The inquiry is expected to be completed within 12 months.

    The fracking ban in the South West, Peel and Perth regions is already in place by Ministerial direction to each petroleum title holder to prohibit fracking under the Petroleum and Geothermal Energy Resources Act 1967.

    “These regulations reinforce those directions,” Mr Haworth said.

  180. Bruce in WA

    Bex contained:

    Aspirin – Chemically known as acetylsalicylic acid, this drug acts on the body as an anti-inflammatory, helping to alleviate pain, fever, headache and other symptoms. The maximum recommended daily dose of aspirin is 1 g (1000 mg), as it can lead to stomach bleeding. A single bex powder (approximately 1 gram) contained 420 mg of aspirin.

    Phenacetin – This chemical was widely used with aspirin and caffeine as a fever and pain reliever. It acts primarily on the nervous system, targeting the sensory tracts of the spinal cord, the brain and the heart. It was withdrawn from use in 1983 due to its damaging action on the kidneys and carcinogenic properties. Each Bex powder contained 420 mg of phenacetin.

    Caffeine – Found in coffee, tea and soft drinks, caffeine is a powerful nervous system stimulant. In combination with aspirin, it can give greater pain relief than aspirin alone. More than 250mg of caffeine a day can lead to unpleasant side effects like sleeplessness, irritability and heart palpitations. A single bex powder contained approximately 160mg.

    In the 1960s, housewives routinely used Bex to get through the day. However, once it was recognised that these substances were addictive and large doses of phenacetin taken by habitual uses were resulting in widespread kidney disease, analgesics came under government regulation in the 1970s

    Yep, misused, just like “Mother’s little helper” — valium.

    Quack prescribed valium for my mother in the 60s, when she was still barely 40, because she had “bad nerves”. Eventually, in her 50s, a more enlightened tried to wean her off it as she could see no medical reason for her taking it. The results were so horrific the doctor put her back on diazepam.

  181. Zulu Kilo Two Alpha

    What a load of bullocks. Aboriginal boys have never been disciplined by their parents.

    Gospel according to a family member, who was a social worker dealing with Aboriginals, was that boys were never disciplined, because they were going to find life difficult enough later on, and not disciplining them meant a happy childhood.

  182. P

    N.B. Once you read an article behind a paywall, the you must clear your history before reopening another article from that same news service that is restricted.

  183. Makka

    What do all y’all think of famous folks coming to the aid of bullied boy Keaton Jones?

    Hi Ma ought to get him enrolled at a reputable Martial Arts dojo, stat. A couple of years and this kid won’t even be worrying about bullying. He’ll gain a lot of confidence too.

  184. Zulu Kilo Two Alpha

    What’s with Testes’ fixation on all things Aboriginal?

    He’s working on a career, exploiting the Aboriginal industry, and the white taxpayer, for all it’s worth.

  185. thefrolickingmole

    I think the word Statanists can be used for these swine.
    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2017/dec/11/meat-tax-inevitable-to-beat-climate-and-health-crises-says-report

    Cant wait for Maocolm to be first in line for this innovative and exciting new tax…

    Maria Lettini, director of Fairr, said: “As implementation of the Paris climate agreement progresses we’re highly likely to see government action to reduce the environmental impact of the global livestock sector. On the current pathway we may well see some form of meat tax emerge within 5-10 years.”

    Nations begin to implement sin taxes as consensus forms over the harm caused by the product, the analysis notes, and today more than 180 jurisdictions tax tobacco, more than 60 tax carbon emissions and at least 25 tax sugar.

    The first global analysis of meat taxes done in 2016 found levies of 40% on beef, 20% on dairy products and 8.5% on chicken would save half a million lives a year and slash climate warming emissions. Proposals in Denmark suggested a tax of $2.70 per kilogram of meat.

    Meat taxes are often seen as politically impossible but research by Chatham House in 2015 found they are far less unpalatable to consumers than governments think. It showed people expect governments to lead action on issues that are for the global good, but that awareness of the damage caused by the livestock industry is low. Using meat tax revenues to subsidise healthy foods is one idea touted to reduce opposition.

    “It’s only a matter of time before agriculture becomes the focus of serious climate policy,” said Rob Bailey at Chatham House. “The public health case will likely strengthen government resolve, as we have seen with coal and diesel. It’s hard to imagine concerted action to tax meat today, but over the course of the next 10 to 20 years, I would expect to see meat taxes accumulate.”

  186. Chris

    Gottliebsen in the Paywallian over coming 3 days:

    Australia’s Big Freeze, part 1: Why aren’t companies investing?

    I ran into a senior big-four banker (not a CEO) a week or two back and over a drink I half-joked that in about 10 years “you will have about halved your staff”. His eyes narrowed:

    “Robert, you have got it wrong. The redundancies will be truly huge but perhaps not half … but your timing is way out — call it three to five years. Certainly within five years. Cost ratios will fall sharply.”
    snip
    The reason that is repeated time and time again is that large and small Australian business people have lost faith in the government. They don’t know where it is headed and not sure how long the current administration will last. When it comes to a replacement they fear what an ALP government will do. They have watched gross overspending from both parties to boost our deficit; innovation policies trashed; the Australian Taxation Office blocking the so-called “gig” economy vital to our future; and, among the states, NSW, Victoria and South Australia have adopted energy policies they must have known would inflate prices and risk blackouts. Frankly, I don’t think the political situation is as bad as it looks from media headlines because both parties are capable of governing. To some extent, I believe the political excuse is a smokescreen for the second and more fundamental set of forces that are causing Australian companies to freeze.

    The boards and top executives of Australian companies know that if they invest heavily in new strategies and technologies they will not be thanked by institutional shareholders who have become risk-averse. Meanwhile, small shareholders are thirsting for dividends. If executives and directors get it wrong they will lose their jobs, so they look at their present situation and say: “We have time. I will leave it for my successor”.

    In addition, the remuneration practices of so many Australian companies are geared to short-term profit and share market performance. Any company that embarks on a high technology revolution could well suffer a profit downturn and with that will come lower share prices and much less remuneration for executives.

    The short-termism of our institutions is delivering a dangerous blow to the wellbeing of the Australian corporate community. And there is a third reason why companies will not invest. Most executives realise this looming industrial revolution is going to totally transform the employment outlook of a big part of their customer base. Already consumers are holding back their spending but if there is a rise in job insecurity then they will further contract, which means that any extra investment now becomes higher risk than it would normally be.

    And finally, a lot of companies, including banks, have allowed their dividends to rise too high and they don’t have the abundance of cash that they should have, given their level of profit generation.

    Tomorrow we look at the government and corporate strategies required for Australian enterprises to join the “swinging 20s”.

    link if you can

  187. You were pampered. The “Dad Act” in Western Australia involved an old fashioned razor strop.

    Fond memories. At sixteen I was strong and fit, a state swimming champion and record holder, shotput and discus champion. I swam five to eight miles a day, worked out in a gym three nights a week, and did judo and karate. One day I decided I’d had enough of being clipped over the ear.

    My dad was ex-navy – fourteen years, and ex-copper – fifteen years. He was a brawler. The initial exchange of blows demolished the couch and the TV. Then dad came at me in a sort of combo running rugby tackle/bear hug and we went out through the front door, taking the flywire screen with us, including the fancy wrought iron trimming, into the carport.

    With a combined weight in excess of 200 kilos, a lot of momentum, and the wrought iron frame underneath us, we landed very heavily on the bonnet on mum’s brand new Mazda Rotary, only the thirteenth one in Australia. It was about three days old and she had waited six months for it.

    Dad spent the next month staying with his brother, and I slept on a friend’s couch, until we had the car panel-beated and resprayed. Even then mum spent another week deciding whether we could move back in. After that a quiet peace reigned in the family home.

  188. Mother Lode

    He’s working on a career, exploiting the Aboriginal industry, and the white taxpayer, for all it’s worth.

    Oh, how ordinary.

    I might have known.

  189. Chris

    What’s with Testes’ fixation on all things Aboriginal?

    He’s working on a career, exploiting the Aboriginal industry, and the white taxpayer, for all it’s worth.

    Maybe, but I think its mostly that we fed the troll red meat – probably after midnight, too.

  190. johanna

    1950s Sydney suburb didn’t have major criminal problem Aspirin and penicillin were the only ‘drugs’ that were needed.

    Oh, stop with the rose coloured glasses.

    Try aspirin, phenacetin and caffeine (APCs) aka Bex and Vincents powders. Remember the phrase, ‘have a Bex and a good lie down?’

    Well, APCs destroyed people’s kidneys, and people took shedloads of them. It was the combination that did it. I worked for a guy who took about 15 a day. In another casual job in a factory, many of the women who worked on the assembly line with me took them every day, in large quantities. Eventually, they were banned.

    That was also the era when barbiturates were the default sleeping pills. Lots of people took them, and they were dangerous, especially when mixed with alcohol. They depress the breathing mechanism.

    No doubt there are other examples.

    As for penicillin being the only prescription drug that was ‘needed,’ what an ignorant comment.

  191. johanna

    Checking up, I see that others have picked up on some of my points.

    Not a lot of leeway for stupidity here. 🙂

  192. Roger

    The reason that is repeated time and time again is that large and small Australian business people have lost faith in the government.

    Mmm…it seems to me that quite a number of large and not a few small business people have been quite happy to hitch their wagon to profligate and policy deficient governments for their own short term gain.

  193. Geriatric Mayfly

    Very addictive those powders were.

    No one has mentioned “Vincent’s” a powder in pretty pink. Vied at the time with Bex, but I know nothing of its properties. If any, the allure was always enhanced by the carefree bikini clad lass who appeared in the advertising.

  194. C.L.

    Heh.

    The police-lady with the tatts played a big role there, huh.
    Seriously – she dresses like that for police work?

  195. Chris

    Mmm…it seems to me that quite a number of large and not a few small business people have been quite happy to hitch their wagon to profligate and policy deficient governments for their own short term gain.

    Government throws our money on the table for any carpetbagger. The ones who are not carpetbaggers do it tougher,l

  196. Rae

    Fierravanti-Wells should move up to the 6 year term. Molan should get a 3 year term.

  197. Pedro the Ignorant

    I have no idea what the cashless welfare card costs, and don’t really care.

    The sly groggers and drug runners that have infested the remote “communities” for decades have been severely hit by the lack of cash available for grog, methamphetamines and ganja.

    In the past, the ready availability of government cash from welfare benefits saw grog in particular being sold by scruffy looking whitefellas out of the back of utes for astonishing prices, like $400 for a block of Emu Export or $600 for a bottle of bourbon.

    The lack of ready cash has driven off the parasites, now looking for greener pastures. An intangible benefit in many ways, but can only be a Good Thing, IMO.

  198. johanna

    Stimpson J. Cat
    #2581740, posted on December 11, 2017 at 4:02 pm

    Re the story linked by Johanna earlier today about the autistic man sipping paraquat.

    Autistic people can be incredibly stupid at times.
    I still remember the time I put my finger in a lamp socket without a bulb to see if it was on.

    Stimpy, as a (relatively) non-autistic person, I have engaged in similarly stupid acts.

    But what intrigues me, and thanks to contributors for pointing it out, is that apparently paraquat smells vile and tastes awful. It could not possibly be mistaken for water or soft drink.

    Not only that, what was an unmarked bottle containing it doing in a public dunny?

    It’s a strange story.

  199. Baldrick

    The first global analysis of meat taxes done in 2016 found levies of 40% on beef, 20% on dairy products and 8.5% on chicken would save half a million lives a year and slash climate warming emissions.

    Right, so we know it’s bullshit right from the get go.

  200. Baldrick

    Rae
    #2581855, posted on December 11, 2017 at 6:30 pm

    Fuck off Grigory Weinstein.

  201. Zulu Kilo Two Alpha

    Indigenous body to help develop north Aust

    Lucy Hughes Jones
    Australian Associated Press
    5:55PM December 11, 2017
    Save

    The federal government has established a body of indigenous leaders to advise on its northern development agenda.

    Northern Australia Minister Matt Canavan says eight senior community figures would ensure the policy benefits Aboriginal businesses and supports innovation.

    Aboriginal Affairs Minister Nigel Scullion said a major proportion of Northern Australia was indigenous land, where more investment and jobs are needed.

    “Indigenous Australians must have a seat at the table and have the opportunity to pursue development that they want on their land if we are to realise the potential of our north,” Senator Scullion said.

    Northern Territory appointee Dr Donna Odegaard said the group wanted to expand the capability of First Nations communities, with many having their own successes which others could learn from.

    Western Australian appointee Peter Yu said he would embrace the challenge to investigate policies to drive critical growth in remote regions.

    The group will attend the next ministerial forum on northern development to be held early next year.

    From the Oz I’ll bet good money that this is the sort of gravy train that tetste sees himself as being part of.

  202. Zulu Kilo Two Alpha

    Shirley Finn inquest: Former detective Laurie Tyler gives evidence
    Tim Clarke, PerthNow
    December 11, 2017 2:00PM

    A FORMER police officer has told the inquest into the gangland-style killing of Shirley Finn how he witnessed Sydney crime lord Abe Saffron and corrupt cop turned killer Roger Rogerson drinking with WA detectives at the Raffles Hotel around the time the brothel madam was murdered.

    Laurie Tyler, a former detective at the former Criminal Investigation Branch himself, gave evidence before coroner Barry King, who continues to hold the inquiry into Ms Finn’s murder in 1975.

    And in that evidence, he said he had a clear memory of spotting the two high-profile eastern states identities in the company of Detective Bernie Johnson – the head of WA vice squad at the time, and Mick Reed – who was in charge of the Finn investigation.

    This one’s for Memory Vault.

  203. calli

    There was a policewoman in that, C.L.? I was, ahem, distracted by the muscley blokes. 😀

  204. Knuckle Dragger

    Zulu,

    I’ve suffered through a Welcome to Country by Dr Odegaard. Blonde hair, pale skin, piercing blue eyes. Could have passed for a Swedish Olympic water polo team member, albeit a considerable number of Olympics ago.

  205. Slayer of Memes

    Timeline of mUnty’s “WUSSIA COLLUSION!” narrative:

    “Look at this evidence reported on by (CNN/ABC/MSNBC/CBS)!! Drumpf will be gone within (insert timeframe here)!!”

    *Evidence turns out to be fake*

    “Ok, ok…. but just wait til you see the REAL evidence!”

    *Rinse and Repeat*

    The.
    Fat.
    Fucking.
    DICKHEAD.

  206. stackja

    johanna
    #2581842, posted on December 11, 2017 at 6:19 pm

    Rose Garden

  207. johanna

    Zatara
    #2581786, posted on December 11, 2017 at 5:15 pm

    tell me again about responsibility here????

    First of all lets accept that SOMEONE is responsible when a child commits a crime. If it isn’t them it’s the people legally responsible for them and their welfare until they reach majority. That’s not their school, their social worker or the teacher’s union. It’s the parents.

    The fact that for some reason we have allowed external agencies to insert themselves into that relationship is certainly lamentable but it doesn’t change the basic fact. The parents are responsible.

    I didn’t say some mindsets and some laws didn’t need to be changed. I just pointed out the obvious, and dare I say natural, solution.

    You have missedthe point, Zatara. It’s like when there is a public inquiry into some malfeasance of government. In the end, nobody is responsible because everyone is responsible.

    With the breakdown of parental authority by government agencies, how can the parents be held responsible? In known dysfunctional families, they have had numerous interventions and monitoring.

    Raising the age of responsibility is just letting both parents and governments off the hook for even longer periods, and does nothing to address causes.

  208. JC

    Probably the biggest trending story of the day …
    What do all y’all think of famous folks coming to the aid of bullied boy Keaton Jones?
    Kind of nice, I think.

    It’s heart breaking listening to it and seeing how much pain he feels.

  209. Baldrick

    Western Australian appointee Peter Yu said he would embrace the challenge to investigate policies to drive critical growth in remote regions.

    Peter Yu was born to Aboriginal and Chinese parents. Which side of his lineage will he be representing?

  210. stackja

    C.L.
    #2581852, posted on December 11, 2017 at 6:27 pm
    Heh.

    The police-lady with the tatts played a big role there, huh.
    Seriously – she dresses like that for police work?

    Undercover?

  211. stackja

    Baldrick
    #2581875, posted on December 11, 2017 at 6:52 pm

    Yu will decide!

  212. Zatara

    You have missedthe point, Zatara.

    No Johanna, that’s exactly my point.

  213. testpattern

    Some time ago Doug Wells was promoting his favourite books by Bill Harney.

    Here’s a quote from the introduction to the first edition of Harney’s first book published in 1943, ‘Taboo.’ I knew I’d kept it for a reason.

    ‘It is true that many Aboriginals in most parts of the continent have been deliberately shot or poisoned by white settlers sometimes with the assistance of the police. The invaders, that is the white settlers, objected to the presence of the original owners of the land…’

    Brave words for 1943? No, not at all. Had Henry Reynolds been writing before 1950 he would’ve been mainstream. It was only post WW2 Holocaust that an embarrassed Australia started to deny and excise from history what had been openly written about a decade earlier.

  214. Baldrick

    Love is Love :

    Amorous couples are flocking to a beach to have sex ‘all day’ – and locals are sick of it.
    Residents near Mudjimba Beach on the Sunshine Coast, Queensland, say gay couples are meeting to have anonymous sex metres from where families with young children frolic on the sand.
    Locals say the ‘creepy’ couples have transformed the beach from a family hot spot into an ‘uncomfortable’ area.
    The no-go area extends across a stretch of beach from a new boardwalk all the way to the Twin Waters lifeguard tower. Locals said the men would walk along the beach wearing obscure items of clothing after setting up the encounter on a social media group, then signal each other.
    The source said in recent weeks the issue got worse to the point where men were mastur bating in full view of families and made lewd posts of social media.

  215. johanna

    If you want to see what happens when you put a Muslim in charge of immigration and citizenship, watch this.

    It is an extract (about 9 mins) from a Canadian Parliamentary hearing where MP Michelle Rempel tries to get the Canadian Minister, a Muslim, to say whether or not prohibition of female genital mutilation will be in the new citizenship guidelines. They were in the old guidelines, but have disappeared from the draft for the new ones.

    He refuses to answer, slips and slides in every direction, and won’t even admit that he finds the practice abhorrent. It’s a revolting display.

    BTW, props to Rempel, who is very sharp and smart, and showed this scumbag up for what he is.

    Meanwhile, PM Trudeau, who has his mother’s morals and his father’s principles, is fine with it all.

  216. H B Bear

    Peter Yu was born to Aboriginal and Chinese parents. Which side of his lineage will he be representing?

    Let’s ask the Persian Dwarf. He’ll know.

  217. hzhousewife

    Bex – my fathers’s friend was a patient of Professor Pricilla Kincaid-Smith while his kidney’s failed due to overuse of the powders. I was very proud to work with people who knew her at Queen Victoria Hospital later.
    I Never Promised You a Rose Garden was quite a good novel I read in my early twenties when times were a lot simpler, a precursor to other drug culture stories like Monkey Grip and Trainspotting.

  218. cohenite

    It’s mildly amusing that Australia’s next PM will have an untested rape allegation against him and his deputy has a husband with a conviction for drug dealing and without any other qualification is NSW’s most senior bureaucrat.

    A comparison with Peter Blackmore is interesting. Blackmore was subject to a number of rape allegations in 2003. All were thrown out from court and questions were asked by his defence and acknowledged by the court about how the complaints were made to police and the mental condition of the complainants.

    Compare that with how the complaint against our next PM was handled.

  219. Makka

    The federal government has established a body of indigenous leaders to advise on its northern development agenda.

    So much to offer after 150,000 years of living in caves.

  220. Baldrick
    #2581883, posted on December 11, 2017 at 7:01 pm

    Love is Love :

    Thgat is so wrong on so many levels.

    Sick deviants

  221. testpattern

    ‘Peter Yu said he would embrace the challenge to investigate policies to drive critical growth in remote regions.’

    He and everyone else. I’ve already referred you to the Native Title reform paper and the move toward PBCs in the context of northern development in Qld and WA. If you still haven’t read it I suggest you do. The KLC is miles ahead of the Noels and already has a spinoff PBC which negotiates native title in the other States, hence –

    ‘..is proud to announce the Kimberley Land Council as the co-convenor of the 2018 national native title conference…will be hosted by the Yawuru people on their traditional lands in Broome Wa from Tuesday 5 to Thursday 7 June 2018.’

    https://scontent-syd2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/24131433_1901935320059181_9141090229079258421_n.jpg?oh=b6b59bfbfbfe21e1dcd5a5625f1c0cb0&oe=5A8A6693

  222. This one’s for Memory Vault.

    Who remains totally underwhelmed by the latest Shirley Finn “inquest”. As it so happens I had the opportunity to meet and interview Abe Saffron in the Eighties. Three observations I’ll make.

    I can’t see Abe mixed up in a murder. He was very much a bribery man. He believed most men could be bought. If they couldn’t, go and find somebody else for the job. He didn’t even see himself as particularly dishonest, only doing what had to be done in order to do business with corrupt politicians and law enforcement officials. Personally he actually believed drugs should be decriminalised, and prostitution made legal, despite the fact that they were his two biggest earners.

    He was very, very smart. If he had been involved in any way in a murder in Perth, the last place he would have been when it was going down, was Perth. If he was in Perth at the time, that to me is a good indication that he didn’t know anything about the pending Finn hit.

    He ruled some, but not all, aspects of crime in Sydney, centred on Kings Cross. He knew where his strengths lay, and his weaknesses. He confided there were places in and around Sydney where he would not go, or attempt to “throw his weight around”, as he wasn’t in control of those places and was just as likely to end up dead. I can’t see him getting involved in crime in way over in WA.

  223. stackja

    ALP legislated personal responsibility away. Lawyers rejoiced.

  224. Makka

    Chris
    #2581834, posted on December 11, 2017 at 6:12 pm
    Gottliebsen in the Paywallian over coming 3 days:

    Thanks Chris. Not everyone has the subscription and this is interesting stuff.

  225. Makka

    Locals say the ‘creepy’ couples have transformed the beach from a family hot spot into an ‘uncomfortable’ area.

    They just have to ruin it for straight families, just like their sham sex “marriage”.

  226. testpattern

    ‘because of reduced ability to buy grog in their home communities due to the existence of drinking permits, which most of them are banned from having anyway because they’re domestic violence offenders or flog everyone in sight when they’re pissed…their favourite trick to get the Dept of Health to pay for it is to say they’re going to Darwin ‘for hospital..’

    More bullshit from fucknuckle the LOR cuckoo. Charter flights to Darwin have never had anything to do with permits and domestic violence. They’ve been operating since the 70s and have never needed reason. It’s just what you do if you have the money.

    Nearly every community has a big house, owned by the man who controls everything there and he’s not a whitefella. silver pillows and cartoons $100 op bundy $200-250.

  227. old bloke

    memoryvault
    #2581896, posted on December 11, 2017 at 7:12 pm

    I can’t see him getting involved in crime in way over in WA.

    I remember, sometime in the 80’s, that he arrived at Perth Airport to be met by the Police who sent him back to Sydney on the next available flight. He had some business interests in Perth, he owned the Raffles Hotel in Applecross, but the Police wouldn’t let him into Perth.

  228. Zulu Kilo Two Alpha

    Who remains totally underwhelmed by the latest Shirley Finn “inquest”.

    Oh, I can’t see it going anywhere, either, but it’s just a reminder of a time, when Perth, then widely perceived as an overgrown country town, turned out to contain such a choice collection of scoundrels, and, as you say, this started the chain of events that led to W.A. Incorporated.

  229. calli

    The creepy couples are easily removed – a few of the fed up dads set up a game of beach cricket nearby. Then aim very very carefully. Plus a widely spaced and energetic outfield with lots of running, shouting and sand spraying.

    I imagine sand caked Vaseline can be rather unpleasant.

  230. testpattern

    testpattern
    #2572337, posted on December 1, 2017 at 5:57 pm

    https://www.ag.gov.au/Consultations/Documents/options-paper-proposed-reforms-to-the-native-title-act-1993.PDF

    As always, keeping you informed before the msm.

  231. Dr Faustus

    Screws tighten on Sam Dastyari as Labor elders weigh in

    Kim Beasley frowns.
    But Albanese and Tony Burke circle the wagons around Dastyari (and Shorten).

    The questions about Sam Dastyari have been answered and he’s paid a price for it, for that lack of judgement,” Mr Albanese said on Monday afternoon

    No lack of judgement there, boys. Special Agent Dastyari solicited money from the Chinese and delivered his little heart out. All judgement, 100%.

    Subtext: ‘Parliamentary Labor is a Broad Church – with room for fucking idiots and active foreign agents. They just don’t get paid the delicious, greasy perks the rest of us do.’

  232. Zulu Kilo Two Alpha

    I remember, sometime in the 80’s, that he arrived at Perth Airport to be met by the Police who sent him back to Sydney on the next available flight

    I heard differently – he would be met at the airport by the Perth cops, driven out to the Raffles, he was allowed in for just as long as he needed to do his business, then he would be driven back to the airport and put on the plane.

  233. I remember, sometime in the 80’s, that he arrived at Perth Airport to be met by the Police who sent him back to Sydney on the next available flight. He had some business interests in Perth, he owned the Raffles Hotel in Applecross, but the Police wouldn’t let him into Perth.

    That sounds about right, Old Bloke. Owning the Raffles (I never knew that) would have pissed off the BLF? or whichever union was recruiting from the bikie gangs at the time. I’d give odds that it was officers from the Plain Clothes Division that saw him off. Crime hates competition.

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