Reflexive ignorance across the media

ADDED ON: Old Ozzie mentioned in the comments that the Russian President had spoken about a Western assault on Christianity and traditional values in 2013 – just before anti-Russian troubles began, so I went looking to see what he meant, and there below in the vid is what I found. Not at all what you might have expected.

ORIGINAL POST

Thank you for noting the typical far left media bias at the ABC, Rafe, but what can you expect? The ABC is just reflex ignorant as this article today on Venezuela provides one more example: IMF: Venezuela’s inflation on track to top 1 million percent which comes via the ever-unreliable Associated Press. Heaven forbid they should mention that socialism has had anything to do with it. Instead, their authority on the nature of the problem is no less than the President of Venezuela himself:

Socialist President Nicolas Maduro often blames Venezuela’s poor economy on an economic war that he says is being waged by the United States and Europe.
Maduro won a second six-year term as president despite the deep economic and political problems in a May election that his leading challenger and many nations in the international community don’t recognize as legitimate.

Two of the most uninformed sentences you are ever likely to find, specially designed for those who want to hide themselves from reality. It is even possible that the ABC knows better, but the last people to actually try to explain it are the ones who want the same kinds of economic management in Australia.

But this media ignorance continues everywhere. Trump Derangement Syndrome is a sickness that will do us all in and if we are not very careful put an end to Western Civilisation within a generation. The latest bit of TDS is from Troy Bramston in a column as empty and unhistorical as it is possible to be: Putin could never have suckered Reagan like Trump the chump. I will merely make the obvious point that when Reagan was president, Russia was the Soviet Union and when Reagan met with the Soviet President he was dealing with the core ideological issue of the time. As it happens, I supported Reagan then just as strongly as I support Trump now, and for much the same reasons. Russia is no longer communist, so perhaps it is time to bury the hatchet. Bramston doesn’t like Trump, but so what? He is like virtually every other media type, with nothing to add to the conversation other than empty rhetoric. Here are a few of the comments on the column at The Australian, starting from the top and working my way down. There are plenty more like these, and in fact I never came to a single comment that supported him.

So the writer was in the meeting between Trump and Putin!! I’m sick to death with this type of article. No wonder many of us no longer trust the media.

Oh my Lord … talk about Trump Derangement Syndrome writ large. This column should be compulsory study for journalism students in what NOT to write. There are so many falsehoods and opinions masquerading as fact that no-one could even begin to deconstruct it! Truly shameful, Oz.

What was Trump to do about funding 70% NATO, May’s feckless indecisive dithering over Brexit, the Steele dossier fraud, the FBI, CIA stacked with anti Trump activists, the Muller witch hunt, an irrational left wing media and the list goes on and on. But the best thing he’s done for the US is to get out of that crippling Paris Agreement. If only we had a Trump here.

Sorry Troy…..that days of journalists cherry picking factoids and creating an ideologically charged narratives are over. In this digital world, we are on to you, and what you have tried to run here I know not to be true.

Typical Trump basher. Ignorant of American history and even more ignorant of the American voter. Donald Trump’s supporters don’t care who he’s nice to or how many mistakes he makes as long as he drains the swamp. That’s what they hired him for. He has done exactly what he said he would do when on the campaign trail. That is why people like the writer of this article don’t like him. Donald Trump is not one of them. He is his own man. God Bless Donald Trump.

Mr Bramston, you and many others in the media and political elites will no doubt continue to pile on President Trump but be aware his supporters are as strongly behind him as ever and while his press conference in Helsinki was clumsy, it had no negative effect on his support in America. In fact the more they pile it on, the stronger Trump’s support may get. No doubt you also predicted with absolute certainty that Trump would never beat Hillary, and that Hillary calling Trump’s supporters “deplorables” would have no meaningful impact as well? Hmmm

Engaging in a bit of hyperbole, Troy. The EU is still in place, so too NATO, ANZUS and the rest. Unfortunately for the UK, Australia and the US, so is Theresa May. The fact that some passengers are told to pay up is not a bad thing. The fact some countries taking advantage of trade rules to the detriment of the US are told that must change is not a bad thing. That Trump talks to Putin is not a bad thing. Now, if Kim Jong Un does not deliver on his side of the bargain in Singapore, let’s see how Mr Trump responds. At that point you will be in a better position to see whether Mr Trump was wrong to give talks a chance. But if Rocket Man is sliding from his agreement, I’d be looking to see what role China has been playing in sabotaging any agreement.

“We are witnessing a fracturing of the Western liberal order and a ­decline in US global leadership”. Wrong Mr Bramston, what we are witnessing, thanks to Donald Trump, is a worldwide draining of the swamp and the hopefully the decline of the United Nations and the European Union from taking over our countries.

I’ve not read this article, looks like more Trump bashing. I’m sick of these stories/analysis by people that can’t wait to criticise, when the end of the event in nowhere in sight. Hoping and praying for failure. Can’t you wait to see how it unfolds?

Awesome news filtering in today that the great US President is considering revoking the security clearances of former top Obama era officials. They all conspired against him and need to go now and quickly. Whilst Bramston pummels the keyboard listing all the petty things Trump has done, little does he know that after Iran is fixed, the Federal Reserve will be next on the agenda. There’ll be plenty of time for Troy and his globalists friends to write angry articles about Trump – waaaay into the future as they observe, from the sidelines, the glorious wonders of the swamp getting drained!

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101 Responses to Reflexive ignorance across the media

  1. mh

    Troy Bramston does not realise that the Communist Soviet Empire no longer exists.

    What a chump.

  2. mh

    The Oz will be hiring David Hogg next.

    David Hogg

    @davidhogg111
    #WalkAway is Russian propaganda #WalkAway is Russian propaganda #WalkAway is Russian propaganda #WalkAway is Russian propaganda #WalkAway is Russian propaganda #WalkAway is Russian propaganda

  3. This is why I would never subscribe to the Australian. I have no truck with providing opposing views, but that such crap is allowed to be printed without any editorial oversight means that the editor is as culpable as the author.

  4. mh

    This is of more relevance:

    Michael Savage: ‘You’re Asleep’ if You Think Communism Can’t Happen in U.S.

    I want to talk about the coming socialism and ask you … what would you do if the far-left took control of the United States government? Have you made backup plans? I know very intelligent people who are talking about moving out of America should the Bernie Sanders wing of the Democrat Party prevail. You say, “That’s hysterical. It can’t happen here.” You’re wrong. It’s happened in other nations and it can happen here. And we know what they stand for…

    If the communists take over America, and many of them are already in very prominent positions; notably, we have a former communist who was put into the CIA — John Brennan — by Barack Hussein Obama, who was an overt crypto-communist who’s done very well indeed, like all leaders of any communist party have always done. Obama came to do good and he did very, very well indeed. Like all communists, they wind up on top…

    https://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2018/07/19/michael-savage-youre-asleep-think-communism-cant-happen-america/

  5. H B Bear

    Mavis is much better when he sticks to his knitting – blowing old Liar Party cronies and re-writing Liar history.

  6. C.L.

    “We are witnessing a fracturing of the Western liberal order …

    Good. Smash it to smithereens.

  7. RobK

    Ive said all along, undoubtedly Trump will make some mis-steps but he’s the best hope the West has had in a long time. I pray it’s not too late. It’s a massive job that will extend beyond the capacity of one man and his team. Its never too late to watch and learn. I thank him for that too.

  8. Egor

    Trump isn’t a conservative, thank god. Battered US conservatism as sprouted by the likes of Krauthammer and Will would neuter him. Their self censoring no go zones let the bureaucratic left flourish. Now Trump is in the field with a few Deplorables in Congress, almost no Senators and even the international comrades are terrified. Soon the very mention of his name will have them running screaming from the room. Excellent.

  9. OldOzzie

    Is This The Putin Speech That Started The Anti-Russia Hysteria?

    The Russian President spoke about a Western assault on Christianity and traditional values in 2013 – just before anti-Russian troubles began

    Sometimes it is possible to lose clear sight of the reality of politics because of the optics and all the “noise” associated with differing points of view. For the average American partaker of mainstream network news (and lately this applies to cable news outlets as well), the viewing public still tends to absorb the tone and rhetoric of the day. These people, often without any personal critical thought, simply go and echo it to their friends and neighbors, and even back to the news media or polling agencies. This has certainly been the case regarding Russia.

    Case in point: An opinion piece on the Fox News website, by Dan Gainor makes note of the absolute media carnage (not too strong a word in this case) concerning the reaction of the political establishment and almost ALL media outlets (including Fox) to President Trump’s conciliatory tone struck with Russian President Vladimir Putin at the Helsinki Summit, one week ago today.

    But as to why this is happening, the explanation really has to do with the establishment reaction to a speech that President Putin himself gave several years ago about the situation in the West. It is this speech that spurred most of the sanctions and actions taken against Russia. It is NOT the “invasion” of Crimea or the 25 invasions of Ukraine that were reported during the years 2014-2016. It is the alignment that the Russian President noted in the West, and Russia’s refusal to follow that same path.

    Blackpilled offered this video clip and a translation of the speech in English. We offer that clip and the relevant part of the speech’s transcript here.

    It is of tantamount importance to understand that this is the main factor in all the opposition against President Trump, because his presence threw a major monkey wrench into “the plan.”

  10. Art Vandelay

    I will merely make the obvious point that when Reagan was president, Russia was the Soviet Union and when Reagan met with the Soviet President he was dealing with the core ideological issue of the time. As it happens, I supported Reagan then just as strongly as I support Trump now, and for much the same reasons.

    The current anti-Trump hysteria from the commentariat reminds me exactly of the way the media treated Reagan when he was President. We were inundated with stories about Reagan’s unfitness for office, his ‘stupidity’, how he was dragging the world closer and closer to nuclear annihilation by baiting the ‘peaceful’ Soviet Union etc etc.

    As one of the comments at the Australian notes, the internet has changed everything this time around:

    Sorry Troy…..that days of journalists cherry picking factoids and creating an ideologically charged narratives are over. In this digital world, we are on to you, and what you have tried to run here I know not to be true.

    It’s a completely different ballgame now and the ‘old media’ can’t cope with their loss of power.

  11. Frank

    It’s a completely different ballgame now and the ‘old media’ can’t cope with their loss of power.

    I recently sat in on a seminar for people about to embark on higher degrees, an induction sort of thing. There was a well known journo there that was hoping to do some research on how people get their information. In particular the lower socio-economic bracket and why they believe what they do. This involved interviewing them in situ, for which they had concerns about their security.Left unsaid but alluded to was the fact that they were of the incorrect opinions, how to cure invincible ignorance sort of thing. It reminded me of the Glen Reynolds line about the media interviewing Trump voters and how it usually comes across as a nature documentary, they are as antelopes on the plains to these people and there is no recognition the underlying philosophy.

    Far more interesting to give the social sciences treatment to why the chattering classes cling to the beliefs and sources of information that they do. A topic that would probably be enlightening but unhelpful to future career advancement.

  12. Tom

    There is no newspaper in Australia that hates its own readers as much as The Australian — mainly because they’re so well-informed and are sick to death of the establishment drivel it serves up daily from Labor hacks like Bramston.

    The Australian — and most of the legacy news media — are still behaving as though they have a monopoly on sources of information and the internet never happened. Very little of the MSM will survive its trashing of public trust in news media and The Australian is way short of guaranteeing its longevity.

    Letting special interests prevail over the public interest is a death warrant.

  13. AU has more swap creatures per head of population than the US.

    We have the big swamp in Canberra. Sizable swamps in each state and smaller swamps in local government.

    Let’s not call these swamps “wetlands”. Start the draining now. (unless there is an easier way to rid ourselves of the leaches)

  14. Dave of Reedy Creek, Qld

    Very interesting article; quotes from the readers shows that a few of us are awake and know how to read and do some research. The more they beat-up President Trump, the more I admire him. He must have the hide of armoured tank, nerves of steel and determination of something akin to titanium to shake off the attacks, the slander, the lies, the fake news and the downright tawdry rubbish hurled at him on a daily or hourly basis. I think I would be surprised if I could count on one hand anything positive in any Australia media outlet. What is really exposed day in and day out is what a lying bunch of people work in news and how many leftist hold those positions. This has been a major eye opener for many people with a brain.

  15. If nothing else, Putin pointed out exactly where the Left wants to take the world. Given full power, the Left would burn Christians at the stake.

  16. JohnL

    Troy Bramston does not realise that the Communist Soviet Empire no longer exists.

    Troy Bramston does not realise that he still has snoot under his nose left from the time he spent in the kindergarten.
    https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/trumps-approval-rating-reaches-record-high-in-poll-powered-by-republican-support

  17. Tel

    He is like virtually every other media type, with nothing to add to the conversation other than empty rhetoric. Here are a few of the comments on the column at The Australian, starting from the top and working my way down. There are plenty more like these, and in fact I never came to a single comment that supported him.

    Mockingbird gotta sing, don’t it?

    Not fooling people so easily as it used to.

  18. Bones

    As to President Ronald Reagan, Henry Kissinger made the comment that sometimes he would be sitting listening and watching Reagan and wonder how did this man become president.

    However he then added, “But it is my belief that he never made a mistake”.

    PS I paraphrase.

  19. H B Bear

    There is no newspaper in Australia that hates its own readers as much as The Australian — mainly because they’re so well-informed and are sick to death of the establishment drivel it serves up daily from Labor hacks like Bramston.

    It is hard to go past the view that Teh Australian runs columns by the Bittered Sav, van Wrongselen, Mavis, Statler and Waldorf as the print equivalent of click bait. If they are, they are very much mistaken. I ditched my subscription a couple of years ago and am now even less inclined to take it back up.

  20. Oh come on

    Putin isn’t wrong, but isn’t the Russian birthrate also catastrophically low? It certainly was during the 2000s. IIRC, Russians also aborted far more infants than they carried to term, and Russia was the only country outside of sub-Saharan Africa where male life expectancy was dropping like a stone due to rampant alcoholism.

  21. .

    Reflexivity?

    Sounds like someone has been reading too much George Soros.

  22. Dr Fred Lenin

    These continuing desparate attacks onTrump by the left shows their inadequicies up perfectly ,they never let up . I used the think Peter Ustinov was amusing untill I saw him on stage mocking the hesitant speech of Ronald Reagan ,I immediately thought. The man was in the early stages of Alzheimer’s and this bastard is mocking him ,that was the end of him to me . The left have no morals or sympathy as Ustinov illustrated ,.Hollywood must be full of wankers of all the genders , the left condemns it’s self with its own mouth daily .

  23. Boambee John

    Go to Spiked on line and read THE FLIGHT OF THE ELITES FROM THE NATION STATE,
    FRANK FUREDI

  24. I may only be a lurker here, but I do enjoy a regular bracing dose of SKates and the unhinged soundness of the commenters at the Cat.

    Keep up the good work.

  25. bruce

    Every day the Oz doesn’t miss an opportunity to rubbish Trump. Read the Oz daily for 50 years but sadly stopped 2 years ago. Why, because of crap like this.

  26. Bad Samaritan

    The important thing to bear in mind is that Trump doesn’t worry about what the Elitists think, say, or write. He actually laughs at, and taunts, them.

    They throw tantrums about Putin giving Trump lists of KGB operatives currently embedded in the Deep State, in Helsinki. They are terrified of what is coming next. They beg Trump not to delve any further into their corrupt venality.

    And then, as they shriek and moan and gnash their teeth, the Donald says “Oh, and by the way, Vlad will be in Washington shortly…with loads more documents concerning all you Swamp Creatures, and your decades-long treachery”

    Wow. The Donald is God!

  27. Roger

    Putin isn’t wrong, but isn’t the Russian birthrate also catastrophically low? It certainly was during the 2000s. IIRC, Russians also aborted far more infants than they carried to term, and Russia was the only country outside of sub-Saharan Africa where male life expectancy was dropping like a stone due to rampant alcoholism.

    As of 2016 he also used laws on terrorism to restrict the the religious freedoms of non-Russian Orthodox Christians in Russia, from Catholics to Baptists.

    So let’s not anoint him the protector of Christianity just yet.

  28. As of 2016 he also used laws on terrorism to restrict the the religious freedoms of non-Russian Orthodox Christians in Russia, from Catholics to Baptists.

    Is that fact, or something from the MSM?

  29. Gary

    mh
    #2771046, posted on July 24, 2018 at 11:48 am
    The Oz will be hiring David Hogg next.
    David Hogg

    @davidhogg111
    #WalkAway is Russian propaganda #WalkAway is Russian propaganda #WalkAway is Russian propaganda #WalkAway is Russian propaganda #WalkAway is Russian propaganda #WalkAway is Russian propaganda

    Hogg often uses repetitive tweets.

  30. Confused Old Misfit

    Hogg often uses repetitive tweets.

    Saves having to think.

  31. Nerblnob

    Tom:

    The Australian — and most of the legacy news media — are still behaving as though they have a monopoly on sources of information and the internet never happened.

    x100. It’s suicidal.

    FWIW I don’t need to believe that Trump or Putin are great guys.
    Putin is a ruthless kleptocrat at the head of a murderous security apparatus. He’s not gonna “drain the swamp” – he’s King Croc of the Russian/CIS swamp. But he’s at least shrewd enough to recognise where Russia’s external interests lie and the value of internal security.
    Trump is a fat prick from the corrupt NYC business milieu but he’s not stupid, he just doesn’t give a fuck what the MSM say.

    When will the likes of Turnbull, Abbott, UK’s Teresa May realise that you do not have to follow an agenda set by the MSM/legacy media? They didn’t vote you in. The people who voted you in ignored the MSM’s campaign against you. (OK, not against Turnbull).

    You, the politician, can ignore them too. You have other outlets.

  32. mh

    Comparison of David Hogg with Reichsminister for Public Enlightenment and Propaganda Jos*ph Goeb$#*s

    https://knowyourmeme.com/photos/1355281-marjory-stoneman-douglas-high-school-shooting

  33. Egor

    Trump gets it.
    Trump escalates.
    Until he wins.
    It’s heartwarming.

  34. Crossie

    The Oz will be hiring David Hogg next.

    David Hogg

    @davidhogg111
    #WalkAway is Russian propaganda #WalkAway is Russian propaganda #WalkAway is Russian propaganda #WalkAway is Russian propaganda #WalkAway is Russian propaganda #WalkAway is Russian propaganda

    I saw that elsewhere yesterday and thought the hysterics are getting hysterical.

  35. Crossie

    The current anti-Trump hysteria from the commentariat reminds me exactly of the way the media treated Reagan when he was President. We were inundated with stories about Reagan’s unfitness for office, his ‘stupidity’, how he was dragging the world closer and closer to nuclear annihilation by baiting the ‘peaceful’ Soviet Union etc etc.

    I remember well the hysteria over Reagan in the 80s particularly the protest at Greenham Common organised by Linda McCartney. There were reputedly 200,000 protesters at that event so the anti-Trump protest in London did not impress me and their little balloon even less so.

  36. Crossie

    The Russian President spoke about a Western assault on Christianity and traditional values in 2013 – just before anti-Russian troubles began

    When I saw this some time ago I thought wouldn’t it be ironic if Christianity and western civilization were saved from leftist vandals by a former KGB boss.

    These days I say wouldn’t it be ironic if Christianity and western civilization were saved by an adulterous, egotistical billionaire.

  37. Nerblnob

    I remember well the hysteria over Reagan in the 80s

    #metoo

    Now the same crowd is saying “Trump is no Reagan”

    But we can at least say this: “May is no Thatcher”

    And Turnbull isn’t even a Hawke.

  38. BorisG

    Troy Bramston does not realise that the Communist Soviet Empire no longer exists.

    Putin takes inspiration from Stalin (and Ivan the Terrible). Christianity is just a cover. But you can bury your head in the sand.

  39. BorisG

    male life expectancy was dropping like a stone due to rampant alcoholism.

    Actually serious demographers don’t quite know the cause of this rapid decline. Alcoholism in Russia isn’t new, and alcohol consumption is less than in other countries such as Spain.

    Then the life expectancy bounced back and again no one quite knows why.

  40. BorisG

    These days I say wouldn’t it be ironic if Christianity and western civilization were saved by an adulterous, egotistical billionaire.

    Putin regards the Western civilisation as its main enemy, and most his policies are aimed to undermine it. This includes the support for Russian Orthodox and almost total suppression of activities of western churches in Russia.

  41. Crossie

    Putin takes inspiration from Stalin (and Ivan the Terrible). Christianity is just a cover. But you can bury your head in the sand.

    I’m well aware that he does not believe in any god that is not called Putin but he has learned from the Soviets’ failure that oppressing the people does not lead to greatness, allowing religious freedom works in his favour.

  42. BorisG

    It is NOT the “invasion” of Crimea or the 25 invasions of Ukraine that were reported during the years 2014-2016.

    So Crimea and Ukraine weren’t invaded? And these should not have resulted in the sanctions?

  43. Crossie

    BorisG, Russian Orthodox Church may be “eastern” but it is still part of Christianity and thus western civilization.

  44. BorisG

    I’m well aware that he does not believe in any god that is not called Putin

    I am not sure about that.

    but he has learned from the Soviets’ failure that oppressing the people does not lead to greatness, allowing religious freedom works in his favour.

    I won’t call the situation in Russia religious freedom. It is freedom for the Russian orthodox, Islam (strictly approved versions) and Judaism, and very tough restrictions on the rest.

  45. BorisG

    BorisG, Russian Orthodox Church may be “eastern” but it is still part of Christianity and thus western civilization.

    Its ideology and teachings are overtly anti-western.

  46. Crossie

    I won’t call the situation in Russia religious freedom. It is freedom for the Russian orthodox, Islam (strictly approved versions) and Judaism, and very tough restrictions on the rest.

    It’s still an improvement on Soviet atheism.

    As for the Russian Orthodox Church being overtly anti-western, does it interpret the bible differently to other Christian churches? I know very little about it so I can’t tell one way or the other though from what I understand of the great schism the argument was over church governance and not theology.

  47. BorisG

    It’s still an improvement on Soviet atheism

    Sure it is. But religious freedom predates Putin. It was already flourishing in the 1990s. There are more restrictions on other churches under Putin.

  48. BorisG

    As for the Russian Orthodox Church being overtly anti-western, does it interpret the bible differently to other Christian churches? I know very little about it so I can’t tell one way or the other though from what I understand of the great schism the argument was over church governance and not theology.

    It may have started that way, but today Russian Orthodox Church (not Greek etc) is distinctly anti-western in its rhetoric.

  49. max

    Putin: A Nationalist With Nuclear Weapons

    The Left is doing its best to destroy Trump. It will be four years of this kind of journalism — eight if he is re-elected.

    Lefties have always respected power — and nothing else.
    The Left was always polite when discussing the USSR. It was Communist. It was aggressive.
    Today, Russia is a much-shrunken empire. It is on the defensive.
    The Left is always ready to push weak nations around. So, we hear about Russia as having hacked the American election somehow.
    Vladimir Putin is hated by the Western Leftist Establishment.
    He is hated by these people for good reason. He is the most powerful nationalist on earth. He leads a country with nuclear weapons. He’s a nationalist who cannot safely be pushed around by neoconservatives and Progressives.
    From 1917 until 1991, the Soviet Union was internationalist. It was tyrannical. It was bureaucratic. It was in favor of world revolution. It was an empire. And because of this, the Western liberal media gave the Soviet Union, if not a free ride, then at least a discounted ride. The Soviet Union was Marxist, and Marxism for people on the Left was always considered a legitimate political philosophy.
    Putin represents this older Russian nationalist tradition. He also commands the second most powerful military forces on earth. The Russians are still armed to the teeth with nuclear weapons. They are the other superpower.
    We have heard at a lot about America as the sole superpower, but this is not true. Any nation that has over 5,000 nuclear missiles is a superpower. That is Russia. When that nation has missiles that can deliver these weapons to their targets, it is a superpower. You don’t push it around.
    Putin is a nationalist. Nationalism is hated by the Progressives. They have been pushing the New World Order ever since Woodrow Wilson decided that the United States of America was going to join the League of Nations.

    Neoconservatives have always been united with Progressive internationalism. They want America to police the world, especially the Middle East. They want America to undermine nationalist regimes that are a threat to the State of Israel. That is the bottom line with respect to Putin’s interventionism in Syria.

    Putin verbally and institutionally represents nationalism, and this is an intolerable affront to the Democratic Progressives. It is an intolerable affront to the New World Order. So, the media have created an image of Putin as a kind of dark genius of media control. He has invaded the turf of Leftism, which controlled the flow of information until the World Wide Web appeared in 1995. Somehow, it was Putin, not grassroots voters, who cut short the political hopes of David Cameron in Great Britain and Hillary Clinton in the United States. It just could not be that the voters have had enough of Progressive internationalism.

    Putin is the institutional heir of the Communists who killed Soviet Communism. He is a nationalist. He is the incarnation of nationalism. That’s why the mainstream media hate Putin. That’s why he gains my grudging respect. Let us hope the Trump is wise enough not to try to push him around. Putin does not hold the hammer and sickle, but he holds the hammer. He can cut off the flow of natural gas into Western Europe at any time. The internationalists and NWO bureaucrats in Western Europe have nothing to counter this.

    https://www.garynorth.com/public/16140.cfm

  50. mh

    Boris, what about the video? Did you listen to what Putin was saying?

  51. Geriatric Mayfly

    I remember well the hysteria over Reagan in the 80s particularly the protest at Greenham Common organised by Linda McCartney. There were reputedly 200,000 protesters at that event

    That Greenham Common malarkey went on for years. Private Eye had a long running cartoon strip, entitled ‘Wimmin” which showed daily life of the old Lezzos going about their pointless routines in their squalid encampment. Quite diverting.

  52. Gary

    BorisG

    It look like Putin has the same transactional relationship with Russian Orthodox Church as Trump has with evangelicals.

  53. duncanm

    Boambee John
    #2771232, posted on July 24, 2018 at 4:04 pm

    Go to Spiked on line and read THE FLIGHT OF THE ELITES FROM THE NATION STATE,
    FRANK FUREDI

    Thanks BJ,

    Frank gets it. That article spoke a whole lot of obvious to everyone except our usual conga-line of commentators.

  54. BorisG

    From 1917 until 1991, the Soviet Union was internationalist

    Wrong. It was only internationalist from 1917 until WWII. During the war Russian nationalism was encouraged, and the trend continued after the war.

    The current regime is even more nationalist, and it is nationalist of aggressive, imperialist variety.

  55. BorisG

    It look like Putin has the same transactional relationship with Russian Orthodox Church as Trump has with evangelicals.

    Partly. But Putin has all the power and control, including over the church. Trump can only dream of this level of power.

  56. Jo Smyth

    Obama and the media moguls at Twitter, Facebook, You Tube, Google etc had a plan in place to gradually change the social media scene once Hillary was in power. They are still attempting to carry out that plan and block any conservative commentary so it is easy to imagine how freedom of the press and media would have completely disappeared over time. I suppose it still might.

  57. BorisG

    Boris, what about the video? Did you listen to what Putin was saying?

    Yes but he is a hypocrite. Also I wonder what you make of his call for collective decision making in the world? He is clearly advocating the UN, etc.

    He claims to support Christian values but most of his policies are anything but.

  58. BorisG

    Let us hope the Trump is wise enough not to try to push him around. Putin does not hold the hammer and sickle, but he holds the hammer.

    Appeasement and defeatist. Russia has lots of nukes and gas, but its economy is small and vulnerable and needs to be contained if not confronted just like USSR was.

    Putin only invaded Ukraine because he perceived Obama as a weakling, and rightly so. Trump appears to be even more appeasing than Obama.

  59. mh

    Boris, that one point about collective decision making was directly referring to “important global decisions”. The main thrust of his argument is that there is a huge downside to the push for global government, or a uni-polar world to use Vladimir’s terminology. He is making the case for the sovereign state.

  60. BorisG

    In Russian context, uni-polar world is the one led by one country, the USA, or Nato. They are advocating for multi polar world, involving Russia, China, India, Brazil…

    They are very jealous of having lost the superpower status and keen to regain it.

  61. BorisG

    At the end day, what is the logic here? Putin is a nationalist, so all his attacks on Ukraine, On American election, poisoning people in the UK, all this is excused because he is a nationalist? Are these policies defending western values ? Actions, not words?

  62. Nerblnob

    Trump appears to be even more appeasing than Obama.

    “appears” – but in oil & gas, and travel, sanctions are getting tighter.

    Otherwise, I agree with what you say about Putin and Russia under him.

    its economy is small and vulnerable

    Yes.

    A Russian client said to me last year, “If sanctions really hit, we would shut down. Everything is imported. We don’t make anything that anyone else wants”.
    (mind you, Australia’s heading towards that point too)

  63. Nerblnob

    Russian retaliatory sanctions to the 2014 sanctions were kind of amusing.

    They banned Australian beef & wine, which they didn’t take much of, but didn’t ban Australian mutton/lamb, which they take a lot more of and their citizens seemed to enjoy. Steak places in Sakhalin that used to advertise USA, Australian and NZ beef now don’t advertise any origins, but I was told still get NZ beef.

    There is virtually no Italian or French cheese in shops or restaurants any more, but maybe some Russian equivalents or cheese from countries like Greece and Turkey. Not that the average Russian punter is bothered.

  64. Beachcomber

    so all his attacks on Ukraine, On American election, poisoning people in the UK, all this is excused because he is a nationalist?

    OK. Let’s see:
    – attacks on Ukraine – supported the eastern Ukrainian resistance to an EU-backed coup de tat
    – attacks on American election – maybe some trolling on Facebook etc, and maybe somehow got access to Democrat emails but doesn’t seem to have done much with them
    – poisoning people in the UK – looks suspiciously like internal UK dirty business and security failures

    There’s not much that needs to be excused.

  65. Gary

    BorisG

    Can you be more specific when you say anti western do you mean not following the progressive path like western religions?

  66. John Constantine

    If only Putin wasn’t so stupid as to fail to grasp western progressive economics.

    All he has to do is borrow trillions of dollars to import millions of single military age Wahhabis into Moscow, pay them welfare and have them operate as consumption machines for Moscow property services.

    Russia then becomes a superpower again.

    [ Conquered into part of the caliphate, but a still a superpower]

  67. Iampeter

    BorisG, Russian Orthodox Church may be “eastern” but it is still part of Christianity and thus western civilization.

    But Christianity isn’t part of Western Civilization other than being perhaps its single oldest enemy.

    Dear Conservatives, please stop trying to save Western Civilization as you don’t understand it at all and through your total ignorance are helping to end it faster than anyone other movement in modern times.

    Although it is kinda entertaining to watch you tie yourselves into knots when one of the worlds worst dictators spouts the same nonsense you might hear during a Sunday sermon and you don’t have the wits to join the dots and draw the correct conclusions.

  68. Gary

    On ya bike little Imp, adults talking.

  69. max

    BorisG = Fake News Democrat
    1)attacks on Ukraine fake news
    2)On American election fake news
    3)poisoning people in the UK fake news

  70. max

    How the Catholic Church Built Western Civilization by Thomas E. Woods

    In How the Catholic Church Built Western Civilization, you’ll learn:

    Why modern science was born in the Catholic Church
    How Catholic priests developed the idea of free-market economics five hundred years before Adam Smith
    How the Catholic Church invented the university
    Why what you know about the Galileo affair is wrong
    How Western law grew out of Church canon law
    How the Church humanized the West by insisting on the sacredness of all human life

    No institution has done more to shape Western civilization than the two-thousand-year-old Catholic Church

    “Christianity has played a central role in Western civilization and contributed an important influence on the development of classical-liberal thought.”

    Murray N. Rothbard

  71. BorisG

    All he has to do is borrow trillions of dollars to import millions of single military age Wahhabis into Moscow,

    Russia has plenty of those already. Many Muslims reside in the Russian federation and are free to travel to Moscow any time they wish. In addition Russia and especially Moscow has a sizable number of workers from Tadzhikistan and Uzbekistan. Probably more than any European capital.

  72. BorisG

    – attacks on Ukraine – supported the eastern Ukrainian resistance to an EU-backed coup de tat

    Yeh just like Stalin supported a people’s uprising in the Baltic states in 1940.

    – attacks on American election – maybe some trolling on Facebook etc, and maybe somehow got access to Democrat emails but doesn’t seem to have done much with them

    Ok but over 20 poeple indicted for serious crimes.

    – poisoning people in the UK – looks suspiciously like internal UK dirty business and security failures

    Litvinenko was also a victim of an UK internal dirty business?

  73. BorisG

    But Christianity isn’t part of Western Civilization

    I think it is, especially the Protestant ethics.

  74. .

    – attacks on Ukraine – supported the eastern Ukrainian resistance to an EU-backed coup de tat

    It is insane, isn’t it? Putin funded Merkel, who tried to take over the Ukraine to screw over Putin?

    You’d have to be several kinds of disturbed to believe this nonsense.

  75. mh

    How the Catholic Church Built Western Civilization by Thomas E. Woods

    Max, I don’t think Iampeter will be reading that! Peter will be diving straight back into some Rand.

  76. .

    Rand is good, Peter reckoned he was pro-abortion because he was pro-life!

    For a long time, I defended Peter but I reckon only a troll account would say such a bizarre quip.

    Don’t let him colour your views on Rand.

    Hey, you all should read some Rand too. Capitalism: The Unknown Ideal is actually quite brilliant.

  77. mh

    Peter reckoned he was pro-abortion because he was pro-life!

    Hahahaha! Let’s all be Iampeter. How about this:

    I am pro-heroin because I am pro-health.

    I am pro-Hollywood because I am pro-child protection.

    I am pro-MS13 because I am pro-law and order.

  78. Roger

    Is that fact, or something from the MSM?

    Look up Yarovaya law.

  79. .

    That’s right roger, the Catholic Church, whom some here are saying Putin defends, or a smaller church (say a Methodist or Congregationalist from Texas) could not go to Russia now as preachers or missionaries.

    They could not come in with significant donations, look after the poor, educate the illiterate and care for the sick for free or set up new parishes because that is “extremism”.

  80. BorisG

    Dot, to be fair, Peter just looks like a very extreme version of yourself. His views on economics, education, health care, trade, immigration etc. are identical to yours.

    You differ on Trump but this is glass half full half empty difference.

  81. .

    An extreme version of x that is identical to x?

    No.

  82. BorisG

    There is virtually no Italian or French cheese in shops or restaurants any more, but maybe some Russian equivalents or cheese from countries like Greece and Turkey. Not that the average Russian punter is bothered.

    Swiss is available as are lots of vegetables from Israel. That’s right, they import vegetables (the best are from Azerbaijan, but pricey too).

  83. BorisG

    Dot, read my comment again please. He is not identical, but some of his views are.

  84. .

    I read it and it was nonsense, Boris.

    If me being fairer to Trump makes me more tolerable than Peter, then what can you infer from that?

  85. Roger

    Russian Orthodox Church may be “eastern” but it is still part of Christianity and thus western civilization.

    It’s complicated. Slavic Christianity derives from the Byzantines via Cyril and Methodius. However, differences over the filioque and, later, papal primacy gave Greek Orthodoxy an anti-western stance which is further accentuated in Russian Orthodoxy by the notion that Moscow is the “Third Rome”, the successor to Rome and Constantinople as capital of Christendom. Thus there are sharp tensions even within Orthodoxy between Russians and Greeks, especially since the present day Patriarch of Constantinople, based in Istanbul (whose only real flock is the Greek diaspora) is supported by the Americans.

  86. Gary

    I think the little Imp makes sense in todays contexts. If you don’t like the description change it and demand others follow, no nuance allowed.

    BorisG

    I’m genially in interested in your reply to my question.

  87. BorisG

    Can you be more specific when you say anti western do you mean not following the progressive path like western religions?

    That is an impression I get from reading about them and listening to them. I will try to dig out some specifics.

  88. Iampeter

    Hey Max you forgot some other great titles:

    How Christians colonized Mars by Freddie Fullacrap.
    And who could forget, How Christians Prevented Earths Destruction by Planet X by Using A Giant Space Laser Powered by Prayer to Deflect It – written by Idiotswillbelieveanything.

    Since we’re engaging in holocaust denial levels of historic revisionism, lets go all the way!

  89. Iampeter

    It’s actually amazing that you wouldn’t burst out laughing at the mere suggesting of something like “modern science was born in the Catholic Church” given how little knowledge you need to know this is nonsense.
    All you need is a few basic facts and the ability to think a little. Just join the damned dots.

    Do you honestly believe an ideology that teaches self-sacrifice, obedience to random commands from on high because they are from on high, that suffering and sacrifice and death for the sins of others is moral and all for the purpose of what really matters, which is your eternal after life, could’ve come up with the ideas required to make scientific discoveries, establish rights-based politics for the purpose of individual wealth and prosperity and happiness in our one life on this earth?
    Do you really not see the total contradiction?

  90. Iampeter

    Rand is good, Peter reckoned he was pro-abortion because he was pro-life!

    That’s correct. The pro-life position is the pro-abortion position.
    Those who want to ban abortion and reduce half the human population to the level of cattle are not on the side of life. Or Western Civilization. They are its mortal enemies.

    And yes Rand is good and should be read, but no one can discolor her more than those that don’t even remotely understand her. Like Libertarians.

    Just like no one can do more damage to capitalism and Western Civ than those who don’t even remotely understand it. Like a lot of posters here and the conservative movement in general.

    Sorry but bad arguments are worse than no arguments and all you end up doing is acting as useful idiots and advancing every evil ideology today even as you think you’re opposing them.

  91. .

    It’s actually amazing that you wouldn’t burst out laughing at the mere suggesting of something like “modern science was born in the Catholic Church” given how little knowledge you need to know this is nonsense.
    All you need is a few basic facts and the ability to think a little. Just join the damned dots.

    Lemaitre and Mendel came up with cosmic inflation/big bang and theories on genetics/heritability.

  92. Iampeter

    Dot, suggesting that anything pro-life/good that people did who happened to be Christian or were living in the time that it dominated every aspect of peoples lives was because of Christianity, is the same nonsensical leap as suggesting that because Oskar Schindler was saving Jewish lives means that Nazi’s were responsible for saving the Jewish people.
    No. Whatever good these people managed to do was despite the evil ideology dominant at the time.

    Join. The. Dots, Dot.

  93. Iampeter

    Dot, suggesting anything pro-life/good people who were Christian did was because they were Christian is the same nonsensical leap as if you were to suggest that because Oskar Schindler saved Jews so the Nazi’s were the saviors of the Jewish people.

    No, any good these people did was despite the evil ideologies they belonged to or were dominant in their time.

    You need to join the dots, dot.

  94. Iampeter

    Dot, suggesting anything pro-life/good people who were Christian did was because they were Christian is the same nonsensical leap as if you were to suggest that because Oskar Schindler saved Jews so the Nazi’s were the saviors of the Jewish people.

    No, any good these people did was despite the evil ideologies they belonged to or were dominant in their time.

  95. Iampeter

    Lemaitre and Mendel came up with cosmic inflation/big bang and theories on genetics/heritability.

    Yea it must’ve been all that prayer and self sacrifice and ritualized flesh eating and blood drinking, right?

  96. Roger

    Yea it must’ve been all that prayer and self sacrifice and ritualized flesh eating and blood drinking, right?

    Sacramental eating and drinking, not “ritualized”.

    And there’s nothing “random” about the Ten Commandments; you’ll find them expressed in one form or another in most cultures, not just the Judeo-Christian culture of the West.

    Why, it’s almost as though the morality they express is written on the human heart, so to speak.

  97. Iampeter

    But the West isn’t Judeo-Christian and isn’t based on the same ideas “expressed in one form or another” in other collectivist and mystic cultures. That’s what makes the West special.

    And morality isn’t “written on the human heart”, that’s the kind of emotional, man-child stuff that always makes me chuckle when conservatives try to claim millennials are the immature ones.

    Morality is a concept that has to be figured out using reason just like everything else and is based on the facts of reality. Facts like, humans are living beings that have to take certain actions. Facts like, certain actions lead to life and prosperity while other actions will lead to suffering and death. Having a code to help you make this choice is what morality is for.

    In other words, morality is a code of value, accepted by choice in order to help you choose the right actions for the purpose of living your life on this earth.

    Random, collectivist and unintelligible commands from a supernatural dictator are no more “morality” than if someone held a gun to your head and told you “do what I say or else”.

  98. Roger

    Random, collectivist and unintelligible commands from a supernatural dictator are no more “morality” than if someone held a gun to your head and told you “do what I say or else”.

    What, precisely, do you object to in the second table of the Ten Commandments, Imp?

    Or do you support dishonouring one’s parents, murder, being unfaithful to one’s spouse, lying, stealing and having illicit desires for the property of others?

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