That has got to hurt

So Professor Jeffrey Sachs was on Q&A this week. Beating his own drum:

No, I’m sorry, with respect, what I have helped to lead has been a massive decline of poverty on the same side as you, helping to get markets to work, helping to get trade to work, helping to get people to work…

…but also helping to stop diseases and helping to get children in school. And if you do any professional work on actual budgeting, then I would tell you what you’re saying is a glib slogan…

…not a reality about what development aid is about. And please, Australia, please do your part. You’re a rich, wonderful, beautiful country that can afford to do more. And poor desperate children need it so that they can grow up to be healthy and be productive in our world. And, Australia, really, we count on you for that.

Okay.

Unfortunately for Professor Sachs he was debating Senator James Paterson:

JAMES PATERSON: Jeffrey, you should know from your own experience about what some of the limitations of foreign aid are. In fact, a UK government review of your recent Millennial Villages Project in Ghana showed that after five years and the expenditure of £11 million of UK taxpayers’ money, that virtually no progress was made on poverty and hunger.

JEFFREY SACHS: You read the Daily Mail!

JAMES PATERSON: No, I read the report. I read the report.

JEFFREY SACHS: Well…

JAMES PATERSON: I read the report. It’s printed out on my desk…

JEFFREY SACHS: Frankly, I read the report also, and it said that multi-dimensional poverty was cut sharply and that incomes went up, so you read a different report.

The report can be found here. Let’s go to the tape:

The MVP did not have an impact on the indicators of  eradicating extreme poverty and hunger, with the exception of reducing poverty measured using household income data and adjusted by purchasing power parity. The project did not reduce poverty whether measured by the national poverty line or the national food poverty line. There is no impact on the percentage of undernourished children.

The MVP increased primary school attendance by 7.7%, however completion rates did not improve.

There was no impact on the percentage of women engaged in wage employment in the non-agricultural sector.

The MVP did not have a positive impact on any of the indicators for this goal [To reduce child mortality], which are child and infant mortality rates and the rate of measles immunization.

But apart from all that, I’m sure the project was a glorious success.

This entry was posted in Economics and economy, Shut it down. Fire them all.. Bookmark the permalink.

73 Responses to That has got to hurt

  1. v_maet

    Where is the ABC Fact Check unit?
    Will ABC offer a retraction of the statements by Sachs given he was 100% incorrect?

  2. duncanm

    wow – first I’ve heard of this project.

    What a colossal cockup of epic proportions.

    Should be used as a clear example to defund the UN.

  3. gbees

    The left have never been good at finance, economics, commerce or maths. To them throwing money at something but not measuring outcomes is somehow success. The more money thrown at it the more successful apparently they are. It’s the exact opposite in the private sector.

  4. I’ve personally stopped giving to all charities.

    In my view they are run by self-serving bastards that give bugger all of the donated money to the causes they profess to help. Until charities are publicly audited and the results published for all to view and analyse, I will never again give to charities.

    The government should do exactly the same with our money (taxes) that goes out as government aid. Why keep lining the pockets of despots and the UN who we have no control over how they spend out money?

  5. stackja

    About Jeffrey Sachs — Jeffrey Sachs
    jeffsachs.org/about/
    Jeffrey D. Sachs is a world-renowned professor of economics, leader in sustainable development, senior UN advisor, bestselling author, and syndicated …

    Sustainable development?

  6. stackja

    bemused
    #2841895, posted on October 17, 2018 at 2:53 pm

    UN has achieved what? Wasted a lot of money.

  7. Genghis

    But didn’t that prick the moderator back Dr. Sacks up. Souldn’t the ABC recognise their bias.

  8. Stackja:
    The Association of African/UN Despots has seen a remarkable increase in wealth distribution to their cohort.
    The results of a trickle down survey will be released when funding for the survey is finalised.

  9. Baldrick

    A Democratic Socialist virtue signalling with other peoples money.

    How quaint.

  10. Mother Lode

    Souldn’t the ABC recognise their bias.

    They do recognise it: With salary increases and promotions.

  11. Tim Neilson

    Thanks for the link, duncanm.

    Actually we may be being too harsh here.

    When compared to the Ekwendeni village of the Soils, Food and Healthy Communities (SFHC), the Millennium Villages obtain only similar achievements at far greater expense.

    So MVP manage to achieve the statist’s ubiquitous “greater expense”, but it seems they didn’t manage the usual total failure to achieve anything at all, or the bonus points “pink batts” style catastrophe that wouldn’t otherwise have occurred.

    So, yes, it was a failure because it diverted resources that might otherwise have achieved the same results more efficiently, and thus should be scrapped and never repeated, but by public sector standards it may actually have been above average.

  12. Pyrmonter

    We should do more … more to open ourselves to free trade, free flowing investment and freer migration.

  13. Beachcomber

    It won’t hurt Sachs at all. When it is enclosed in an ABC-TASS media cone of silence, it never happened.

  14. Dr Fred Lenin

    It would not be humane to cut foreign aid middle class socialists like Sachs woukd lose their well paid jobs ,free trips around the world in luxury class ,and guaranteed retirement wealth ,it would also be ounfair and not nice to not reward his creative bullshit .

  15. .

    Sachs is an absolute hack.

    Remember how JC noted all of his advice had failed?

  16. Entropy

    The project did not reduce poverty whether measured by the national poverty line or the national food poverty line

    To be fair, something could be the best program devised since the industrial revolution in reducing poverty, but you would never know it using those measures, which by design would never improve unless you cratered the income of everyone else that wasn’t in poverty.

  17. Entropy

    But yeah, what dot said.

  18. Chris M

    Sustainable development?

    Indeed, it is not sustainable for people to always rely on aid. As Jeffrey would agree they need to embrace sustainability and become self-sufficient.

  19. NB

    You heartless beast, don’t you know it’s all for the ‘poor desperate children’, the little children. What more do you need to …. *click*.

  20. manalive

    Unfortunately for Professor Sachs he was debating Senator James Paterson …

    Indeed, Senator Patterson’s considered responses on foreign aid clearly rattled Professor Sachs, his anger at having his feelings hurt by some savvy young senator from ‘Down Under’ was apparent in his aggressive body language.
    Unfortunately Senator Patterson’s calm response to the arrogant Professor’s ‘Daily Mail’ put-down was lost under gales of laughter from the other panellists and the audience, Sachs was so pleased with the response that he repeated it just before Jones quickly moved on to the next topic.

  21. alan moran

    “Host Tony Jones: Frankly, I read the report also and it said that multi­dimensional poverty was cut sharply, and that incomes went up, so you read a different report.” Total lie and extreme partisanship typical of the ABC defending its own left guests. ABC should be shut down!

  22. NuThink

    stackja
    UN has achieved what? Wasted a lot of money.

    In not effectively achieving anything for which it was supposedly created (reducing or eliminating conflict between nations) it has created lots of perpetual work for the other half of its business, the UNHCR.

    To make the UN effective move the headquarters and agencies away from New York and Geneva and closer to those places in need of help, Harare, Damascus, Mogadishu, Port au Prince to name a few.

  23. Confused Old Misfit

    “Host Tony Jones: Frankly, I read the report…. 0r JEFFREY SACHS: Frankly, I read the report also, and …

    Doesn’t matter who said it I guess. One or both (most likely) are blatant liars.

  24. Nicholas (Unlicensed Joker) Gray

    Outsource all welfare to the Salvation Army. I read a report which showed they were far more efficient in helping poor people than bureaucracies.

  25. Herodotus

    Leftists lie most of the time. That’s it.

  26. Dr Fred Lenin

    Foreign aid is like feeding the native birds and animals they become reliant on it and don’t have the incentive to wot=rd for I ot-rovements and political change . Aid has stuffed Ethiopia the population has increased by 150 per ent since the pop star wankers held concerts to save them years ago ,the u.n. Keeps ordering us to pay more to keep he peasants and u.n. Employees there . Still it will all improve when the trillions from the u,n,climate tax reaches New York ,some of it might reach the starving after soros gore etc extract their lions share . What a complete con this is breathtaking cheek .

  27. Rohan

    It’s tough work trying to direct aid in the third world where you want an outcome such as eradicating extreme poverty. The biggest single issue is that the recipients then expect the handouts. Stop the handouts and they’re left jaded by the whole process. It becomes a vicious cycle.

    It also is an issue in that aid requiring materials is not sourced through local businesses but shipped in from foreign countries. It destroys the local economy, or what’s left of it.

    It’s even harder to try and get programs running that form micro agriculture businesses etc to get them on their feet and self empowered. This way is the only way that things will get better, by creating and boosting the local economy, but that earns resistance as the locals expect the handouts.

    I’ve come to the conclusion that current aid policies and practices are misguided and doing more harm than good for these reasons. This includes aid from both Government and NGO’s like World Vision. I’m not surprised that projects like the MVP have failed. But look on the bright side. Those managers all earned nice 6 figure incomes for their trouble. But I guess you could say it has helped with productivity. It’s the little things.

  28. It’s tough work trying to direct aid in the third world where you want an outcome such as eradicating extreme poverty.

    If you can’t eradicate poverty in First World countries, what are the chances of eradicating poverty in Third World countries?

  29. Entropy

    It also is an issue in that aid requiring materials is not sourced through local businesses but shipped in from foreign countries. It destroys the local economy, or what’s left of it.

    Completely unlike drought charities.

  30. hzhousewife

    I’ve personally stopped giving to all charities.

    In my view they are run by self-serving bastards that give bugger all of the donated money to the causes they profess to help. Until charities are publicly audited and the results published for all to view and analyse, I will never again give to charities.

    Exactly.

    And now as I belatedly read down the thread, I am comforted to realise I am not alone.
    Foreign Aid/Welfare/Charity has turned into an industry.
    Public Infrastructure is another(Lend Lease/CFMMEU/Public-private partnerships that milk the State economies/Public Transport agreements)
    As are Renewballs/Energy
    Education ( n0-one teaches responsibility, only rights)
    Maybe even the Health (Care?) Industry (incl Rehab/Physio/Alternative practitioners)

    It’s all a big game, most never learn it.

  31. hzhousewife

    I’ve personally stopped giving to all charities.

    In my view they are run by self-serving bastards that give bugger all of the donated money to the causes they profess to help. Until charities are publicly audited and the results published for all to view and analyse, I will never again give to charities.

    ditto

  32. bollux

    What Sachs and the U.N. should concentrate on is dissuading these poverty stricken people from breeding until their population reaches equilibrium for their particular way of life. Period. Nothing else will, or has ever worked. People be what they want to be despite the best intentions of all these left wing do-gooders.

  33. egg_

    JEFFREY SACHS: Frankly, I read the report also, and it said that multi-dimensional poverty was cut sharply and that incomes went up, so you read a different report.

    What utter codswallop.
    Did he forget to mention “programmatic specificity”?

  34. The BigBlueCat

    bemused
    #2841895, posted on October 17, 2018 at 2:53 pm
    I’ve personally stopped giving to all charities.

    In my view they are run by self-serving bastards that give bugger all of the donated money to the causes they profess to help. Until charities are publicly audited and the results published for all to view and analyse, I will never again give to charities.

    All registered charities have to be audited (financially) and report via the Australian Charities and Not-For-Profits Commission (ACNC), and in many cases also to state Departments of Justice / Consumer Affairs (especially if they aren’t registered via the ACNC). There are some charities that minimise how much charitable funds go to administration, for instance – if you donate for the cause, 100% goes to the cause and not diverted to admin costs. You only have to do your research to work out who to give to and who not to – a blanket refusal to give to charities only fuels the leftist fires to allocate taxpayer-funded general revenues to their cause de jour.

    The government should do exactly the same with our money (taxes) that goes out as government aid. Why keep lining the pockets of despots and the UN who we have no control over how they spend our money?

    Isn’t that what Senate Committees and debate in the lower and upper house all about? I agree about the UN – captured by the left and the Middle East. There’s very little benefit for Australia there other than to keep watch.

  35. hzhousewife

    It also is an issue in that aid requiring materials is not sourced through local businesses but shipped in from foreign countries. It destroys the local economy, or what’s left of it.

    Completely unlike drought charities.

    I hestitate to suggest that the whole current drought charity situation is a mess, because it is all going on around me, and good people are trying their best.

    I live rurally, and I am not uncharitable, but neither am I overly charitable. I happen to think that
    giving of one’s own time to another is a pretty good idea. I’m precious with my own time, not a garrulous person, pretty private, but I try to hang out a bit with the lonely, the down and out, the eccentrics (I quite like the eccentrics!). Works for me.

    Bloke hubby worked with in the past committed suicide last weekend. Big affable cheery bloke, helpful, ouwardly genial to all. Bitch wife who picked and picked and picked at him for 45 years. And kicked his dog. Dog died of old age a week ago. Hung himself in the shed.
    Look, all the blokes knew she was a bitch, and always admired him for putting up with her, saying to themselves that they never would, and why does he take the crap. Well, he got to the end of his tether.

    No Good.

  36. All registered charities have to be audited (financially) and report via the Australian Charities and Not-For-Profits Commission (ACNC), and in many cases also to state Departments of Justice / Consumer Affairs (especially if they aren’t registered via the ACNC).

    Where are these audited results published so that the general public can scrutinise the documents? However, it’s been stated numerous times by charities that opening their books would have a detrimental effect on donations and have long lobbied to keep these private. And why is the ACNC so against this: https://www.millsoakley.com.au/third-dimension-what-next-for-the-australian-charities-and-not-for-profits-commission/? Why do charities get involved in lobbying on political issues?

    Yeah, pull the other one, it plays Jingle Bells.

  37. Empire 5:5

    I’ve personally stopped giving to all charities.

    In my view they are run by self-serving bastards that give bugger all of the donated money to the causes they profess to help. Until charities are publicly audited and the results published for all to view and analyse, I will never again give to charities.

    They are audited to a similar standard as corporations (fallible and occasionally fraudulent) and required to publish a financial report. If you can’t find the report, report them to https://www.acnc.gov.au

    The financials will give you enough to measure cost ratio and distributions, though rarely enough to detect the impact for the stated beneficiaries, because the $ are locked up in opaque programs which invariably employ a battalion of social destruction wowsers.

    Don’t throw the baby out with the bathwater. Private charity maintained the fabric of civilisation long before the invasion of the welfare state. Many marginalised people still depend on private charity to maintain some semblance of dignity.

    Look for the government and trust grants under income. This is usually the most instructive metric.

  38. I live rurally, and I am not uncharitable, but neither am I overly charitable. I happen to think that giving of one’s own time to another is a pretty good idea.

    Same here and my wife in particular is a volunteer with Ambulance Victoria. But talking to a number of people (the farming type) in our township about the donations being collected, they too are concerned that the donations might help individual families to some extent, but it won’t help the local businesses who are also an integral part of the community.

    The other issue is with things like the hay drives. Those offering to deliver the hay are faced with bureaucratic hurdles and not being compensated for actual costs (big ones at that). And others receiving the hay have to pay exorbitant costs to cover what they desperately need.

    There’s a lot of well-meaning going work on, but it’s not always effective.

  39. Don’t throw the baby out with the bathwater. Private charity maintained the fabric of civilisation long before the invasion of the welfare state. Many marginalised people still depend on private charity to maintain some semblance of dignity.

    Churches maintained the fabric of civilisation and caring for the less well off, but that’s all be privatised and has become a thriving business. Why else would there be 50,000+ registered charities, employing 1.2+ million people and worth $134.5 billion in 2015?

  40. JohnL

    Einstein said:
    “There are only two things that are infinite – the universe and human stupidity but I am not sure about the universe.”
    Last night’s Q&A got close to infinite stupidity. One can only wonder how long it will take for them to reach “infinite”.
    As for the Australian Foreign Aid, it should not be cut but restructured.
    Example one:
    At present, the parts of Queensland and NSW are experiencing severe drought. Stock – cattle, sheep are dying of starvation. Same as dying children in XYZ. So, the Foreign Aid takes money (cash – remember that term?) from its budget (say one million). Uses this money to purchase cattle from the parts of the country that is doing well at the set fair price (cents/kg for example) so it would not disturb the market. The cattle are processed and sent as chilled meat to feed the starving children.
    The foreign aid buys the cattle (mainly the breeding stock) from the properties affected by the draught (at the fair price) and supplies it to the properties that sold fat cattle for restocking (at the fair price or free of charge). When the drought breaks, as it always does, the breeding stock (maybe with calf at foot) is returned to the original properties. The farmer is paid a fair “rent” for looking after the breeding stock.
    The carpetbaggers are eliminated at both ends.
    The process is repeated at every drought or any adverse conditions.
    The process is repeated with other commodities – sheep, milk, eggs etc.

  41. Tel

    There’s a lot of well-meaning going work on, but it’s not always effective.

    Hmmm, sounds like you might benefit from a system that coordinates scarce resources to ensure they go where most needed, while maintaining individual incentives to contribute.

    Interesting concept, never given it much though really. Perhaps someone should?

  42. hzhousewife

    There’s a lot of well-meaning going work on, but it’s not always effective.

    Yes, I see this happening too, bemused.
    I also concur with your second comment.

    When I retire I want to learn about how to track companies/charities/organisations and their “business”. Every morning on RN I hear commentary from erudite people with great monikers representing organisations I have never ever heard of. I always wonder, who pays their salaries? What does this University Department actually do, why has ths person been chosen to give an opinion on this topic. Now I’m older, they all sound 25 so I am not easily impressed. I think my retirement will be pretty busy!

  43. Tel

    The carpetbaggers are eliminated at both ends.

    You don’t know the power of the dark side.

  44. JohnL

    You don’t know the power of the dark side.

    Yeas, I do.
    I was born and raised in the communist oppressive country. For the last 50 years, I watched Australia descend into the same gutter. I am unable to do anything about it. My children tell me that I am too critical of Australia.

  45. Whalehunt fun

    As for the Australian Foreign Aid, it should not be cut but restructured.

    No. Not one cent of government money should be given as aid to non-citizens, even if they are resident in Australia and especually if they are not. They all have land they can sell us. If they do not want to sell their assets they can run off and die.

  46. Tel

    Whalehunt fun #2842320,

    If they had a bit more empathy for us, they would understand why they need to sell off their assets.

  47. Billie

    There’s 53,000 charities employing almost 1M people in Australia

    I stopped giving to charities when I learned that

    Now I give to local needy folk directly, my barber, the butcher and the bread shop guy

    My taxes already get dispersed to the charity mobs .. for what benefit?

    SonI can be scolded constantly?

    No thanks

  48. Empire 5:5

    Now I give to local needy folk directly, my barber, the butcher and the bread shop guy

    My taxes already get dispersed to the charity mobs .. for what benefit?

    There was a time when you paid less tax and after purchasing your basket of essentials, if you had some to spare, donated cash and time to a church, club or association, for the general betterment of one’s amenity.

    Not all charities are cranks or third party tax hooverers.

    Some day the welfare state (as we know it) is going to end.

  49. Hugh

    I don’t mind donating money to drought-stricken farmers qua poor people, but why are we giving them money qua farmers?

    They’re businessmen, and they’ve taken a risk. They lose. We shouldn’t be encouraging them to go on taking losing risks. We can donate them relief money, but say at the same time, we should be saying, “Get the hell outta there.”

    If the response is “Well over the decades, good and bad, we make a profit” we should say, “Fine! Get your act together so that your good years offset your bad years, just as any business does!”

  50. Hugh

    I don’t mind donating money to drought-stricken farmers qua poor people, but why are we giving them money qua farmers?

    They’re businessmen, and they’ve taken a risk. They lose. We shouldn’t be encouraging them to go on taking losing risks. We can donate them relief money, but at the same time, we should be saying, “Get the hell outta there.”

    If the response is “Well over the decades, good and bad, we make a profit” we should say, “Fine! Get your act together so that your good years offset your bad years, just as any business does!”

  51. duncanm

    We’re being too harsh – I bet the program employed lots of people, they felt good about what they were doing, and a new cargo cult was born.

  52. Crossie

    I’ve personally stopped giving to all charities.

    In my view they are run by self-serving bastards that give bugger all of the donated money to the causes they profess to help. Until charities are publicly audited and the results published for all to view and analyse, I will never again give to charities.

    When I found out that Tim Costello was being paid $200,000+ by World Vision I decided that they obviously don’t need my money since they already have so much of it. It was also galling that this silver tail then had the nerve to lecture less well off people on their lack of generosity. At least his brother Peter is unashamedly in the business of making money.

  53. World Vision

    I think I may have mentioned this in the past, but when I used to work in Melbourne just off Sturt St, there was an old building that I passed every morning and wondered about all the exotic cars parked in front. These exotic cars changed fairly regularly for newer models and I was intrigued.

    So I started to ask around and one day someone said that it’s the headquarters of World Vision and so the penny dropped. But one day all the cars disappeared and a ‘For Lease’ sign appeared on the building. That’s when World Vision relocated to a massive new building in Burwood (which I also passed a few times) and is located on 1 Vision Drive.

    The donation are certainly being put to good use.

  54. hzhousewife

    Charities are in the Public Relations Industry these days. They expect Government to pay for, and perform, the Good Works, while they flutter about making us feel guilty about far flung kidlets sitting in gutters.

  55. rickw

    You’re a rich, wonderful, beautiful country that can afford to do more.

    The uniparty is working feverishly to fix this error in our ways.

  56. Tel

    If the response is “Well over the decades, good and bad, we make a profit” we should say, “Fine! Get your act together so that your good years offset your bad years, just as any business does!”

    If they had been allowed permits to build dams during the good years (when both water and money were available) they would be in a much better position to ride out the drought years. First the government regulations cripple the farmers, and then they pull out the small violins and sad trombones and start grandstanding over stupid 10c milk donations.

    With regulations like live exports I understand there’s an aspect of animal cruelty involved, but even in that case we should at a minimum have a national plebiscite and long transition period for any new regulations introduced.

    With things like putting some water into a hole in the ground for storage, it’s helping to prevent animal cruelty. More water available means the animals benefit and the farmer also benefits.

  57. billie

    Ah yes, government, her to help

    it’s a definition of help I am clearly not familiar with

  58. JohnL

    The add on the TV depicting the starving child is disgusting and obscene. The well-fed and obviously well to do Paki is using, exploiting this unfortunate child to shame us into giving a donation!
    There should be an obscenity warning with these adds and each charity donation adds should be required to give a number of the starving children that that particular charity saved.

  59. …each charity donation adds should be required to give a number of the starving children that that particular charity saved.

    That’s easy, they’ll just adjust as necessary.

    Tim Blair had an interesting observation in 2014 about something that wasn’t initially Obvious.

    Of course Tim Costello immediately came to the rescue to earn his meagre salary.

  60. Chris M

    Outsource all welfare to the Salvation Army. I read a report which showed they were far more efficient in helping poor people than bureaucracies.

    Yes, historically welfare is the work of Church deacons, not government. They know the needs of people at an individual level.

  61. waynerw

    Once I was a very generous donor to charity.
    Then I found out that Tim Costello earned more than his brother .
    You’ve got to be joking. The well dried up on the spot.

  62. Dr Fred Lenin

    Poverty will always be with us as long as we have leftist virtue signallers the poor are there to be used to gain the power,look how the Bolsheviks used the poor workers and peasants ,that set the pattern for subsequent left revolutions . The working people who keep the country afloat destroy the elite and substitute the lowest of the bourgeoisie to become the new elite . You can see the left at work creating poverty in the west with the climate scam and unbridled migration ,reduce the workers to the lowest common denominator and they could rule for maybe 70 years like the soviets . On that figure China mustn’t be far from getting rid ot[f the present corrupt mob, who cleverly created a wealthy class with brains to counteract the aparatchiki who lack brains .bit like the socialist Hitler with I G Farben and Krupp .the present fascists have soros.koch gang etc all trying to destroy Trump and become the eminence Gris of the communist fascists a job that would give them endless pleasure and money trillions nit billions.

  63. Buccaneer

    Standard leftist tactic, when you’re caught out lie in the knowledge the MSM will studiously avoid reporting your lie or anything to do with the issue at hand. The bigger the lie the better.

  64. jupes

    Is this Sachs the bloke Bill Thomson beclowned after the show?

    The idiot reckoned planes should run on “alternate fuels”. Bill asked him what alternate fuels? Dickhead was gobsmacked.

  65. Don

    This guy has some great comments about Africa.

  66. Billie;

    There’s 53,000 charities employing almost 1M people in Australia

    Really?
    Do you have a link for that?
    (Meanwhile, I’ll do some checking myself.)

  67. Do you have a link for that?

    I provided that in my earlier post.

  68. Nob

    Don
    #2842874, posted on October 18, 2018 at 3:00 pm
    This guy has some great comments about Africa.

    Every African with any sense has great comments about Africa.

    I work with enough Africans, Nigerians, Congolese, Ghanaian mostly and I go to their countries and do oil and gas business with them

    Most westerners only know local Africans who are connected with the aid industry in some way, who stick to the victim narrative.

    You’ll never hear them on our media unless they sneak through as a comedian.

  69. Nob

    Got my last two paragraphs in reverse order.
    Suffice to say that opinions from or about Africa that you hear on western media do not reflect real-life African diversity.

  70. JohnA

    bemused #2842924, posted on October 18, 2018, at 4:08 pm

    Do you have a link for that?

    I provided that in my earlier post.

    Couldn’t see any link in your post at 10:08pm. Did you forget, or did it not work?

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