Real people put living standards above virtue signalling on climate change

Leftist Economist Joseph Stiglitz, coming to Australia to collect the human rights activist “Sydney Peace Prize”, is not the only dreamer urging a carbon tax for Australia and proclaiming that climate change was not a liberal conspiracy.

As Chris Kenny notes the Australian Institute of Company Directors (AICD) are also virtue signalling their support for such economy-crushing measures.  Oblivious to the fact that the carbon suppression agenda is really only confined to the sclerotic EU, 50 per cent of them put it as the major issue confronting the economy.  It’s as though they are cocooned in a world that has never heard of Donald Trump’s rejection of the Paris Agreement or the fact that China and India will at best look to join it a dozen years hence!

While many of the AICD respondents may have expertise in how to make businesses operate profitably, they clearly are bereft of political and general economic skills.

It may well be that the company directors’ stumping up for a carbon tax and other measures designed to subsidise renewables is based on their corporate interests, since so many firms have punted, willingly or unwillingly, for renewable “investments” along with the subsidies without which none of the investments would be profitable.  Any movement to withdraw these subsidies will likely be a precursor for the rescinding of the rorts already granted and this will not look good on balance sheets.

Although the electorate is often also over-obsessed with climate change and its corollary of poverty inducement and high household electricity costs, most people are better grounded on what affects their interests.  The AICD virtue-signalling may well be self-interested but Essential has found that only 7 per cent of respondents among the general pubic put climate change and support for renewable subsidies as the key issue facing them; only 20 per cent placed it in the top three.  In terms of importance climate change may be dominant among the chattering classes but does not come in the top seven for ordinary folk.

Here are the Essential results.

There is a political message in this, though the Morrison Government seems keener on trying to minimise its differences with the ALP and the Greens, perhaps because so much of the Liberal Party is under the patronage of the Photios “moderate” wing.  Based on polling of real people, not only would going the Full Trump be good for the economy but it would, properly sold, be a major electoral positive.

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53 Responses to Real people put living standards above virtue signalling on climate change

  1. Tom

    To qualify for the lefty tribe, it’s essential to reject rational economics and rational thought in favour of the warm inner glow that emanates from being protected from criticism, accountability or morality by memberhip of the zombie herd. So let’s cut to the chase: how many of these champions of 19th century electrical power are corruptly receiving payments for their advocacy or have undeclared personal economic stakes in ruinables?

  2. Ben

    “Over Q2 2018, AEMO was required to intervene in the market to direct synchronous generation units in order to maintain system strength in South Australia and ensure the grid was in a secure operating state. During April and May, directions were in place for 62% and 70% of the time respectively (Figure 3) driven by high wind, lower operational demand and generator outages, including at Pelican Point. Since September last year, there have been directions in South Australia for approximately 26% on the time on average.
    During Q2 2018, curtailments of non-synchronous generation in South Australia increased to around 4.8% of the unconstrained intermittent generation forecast (UIGF, Figure 4). This was driven by high wind conditions and insufficient synchronous generators being available to meet system strength requirements.” – AEMO Quarterly Energy Dynamics – Q2 2018 Page 6

  3. Megan

    Based on polling of real people, not only would going the Full Trump be good for the economy but it would, properly sold, be a major electoral positive.

    Too late. The Photios Parasitic Plague continues to rampage through the party and the handful of fully vaccinated pollies who remain are powerless to stop it. The kind of strong medecine required is beyond them all and, sadly for said real people, we will all have to suffer through the death throes until what’s left is tossed into an anonymous hole far away from further contaminating the rest of us and begin the job of hauling ourselves out of the economic mire we will have been left in.

  4. Warburton

    Whilst this is all true, absent some Trumpian outsider seizing control (impossible, really, in a Westminster system)–I suspect the argument has been lost. No one is going to build a coal plant in Australia. The ones we have are old and decrepit. We never should have ever gone down the path of renewables, but I think it’s irreversible. Am I wrong?!

  5. manalive

    ‘Carbon’ taxes and the like are simply passed on to consumers, government regulations reduce competition.
    The CC™ craze has moved the economy along the road to corporatism a trend James Burnham predicted in The Managerial Revolution in 1941.
    These large corporations run large bureaucracies similar to government:
    … whether ownership was corporate and private or statist and governmental, the essential demarcation between the ruling elite (executives and managers on the one hand, bureaucrats and functionaries on the other) and the mass of society was not ownership so much as it was control of the means of production …

  6. Dr Faustus

    The big end of the AICD membership relies on climate change (more accurately subsidies) for future growth and prosperity.

    The bulk of the AICD membership falls into the guaranteed cost-recovery category – where all boats float/sink equally on the tide of renewables. These guys just want the impact of climate change driven sanctions to fall equally so that it is easier to manage the cost recovery process without excess competition.

  7. stevem

    50 per cent of them put it as the major issue confronting the economy.

    I’d have to agree with them. Of all their concerns rapidly rising power price and flow on costs of doing business are crucial. Having a reliable power supply is also vital. Clearly the carbon suppression agenda is a major issue.

    Supporting Australia’s renewable trajectory would be stupid, but saying it’s a major issue is dead on.

  8. H B Bear

    LOL Is the Sydney Peace Price the most useless “award” ever given? I guess the mob the gave Wayne Goosesteen the Treasurer of the Year must come close.

  9. RobK

    Ben,
    It shows the signs of things to come. The desire for more expensive storage, justified by the present cost of FCAS paid to SA gas gensets. Curtailment is the last case option as it cuts into RE profits and FCAS is avialable at the expense of the consumer. The other moves they do is to keep smaller links across the boarder loaded up to stabilise the larger links. This has implications, both good and bad but it indicates how increasing RE makes for a complicated grid and stability becomes harder to achieve. More costs.
    Seperately, I seemed to detect a change of heart regarding ACGW and RE in some of the large corporates, around the turn of the century, particularly in oil and gas. Some suggest it was in their interest to wage a war on coal, I’m not totally convinced of that. From around that time the multinationals seemed to fall in line behind the scam.

  10. .

    ACID?

    Wow. You should check out “The Investor Group on Climate Change”.

    https://igcc.org.au/who-are-we/

    Fuckwits and panhandlers, the lot of them.

    Awkward fictional weirdo and anti-hero Alan Partridge was right.

    Scum. Sub-human scum…

  11. Bob in Castlemaine

    ACID – my ain’t that an appropriate acronym!
    So many of these so called directors throwing ACID in the face of Australian economic prosperity.
    Maybe it’s time shareholders started putting the ACID on these vacuous, virtue signaling dimwits who are supposed to be representing their interests.
    Trouble is I guess many institutional shareholders also have directors who’ve been cloned from the same ACID DNA.

  12. Muddy

    ‘Real’ people who appear beyond The Bubble are merely holographic opportunities for those within The Bubble to gain status and prove their worth. Or serve as recreational tools.

    Existence occurs only within The Bubble. This simple law explains everything, answers all questions.

    Beyond The Bubble, the projections within The Void have no status, no rights, no voice, nothing. How could they? They do NOT exist.

    So close your mind, move away from the surface, and continue conforming.
    Don’t make me Void You.

  13. Adelagado

    I don’t even see ‘Climate Change’ on the list. You can’t choose it as ‘important’ if it isn’t even offered as a choice. ‘Promoting Renewable Energy’ IS on the list but that’s quite a different issue.

  14. Fang

    If he carn’t go full Trump! Maybe Full Dougy Ford, might be an alternative? 🙂

  15. manalive

    I don’t even see ‘Climate Change’ on the list. You can’t choose it as ‘important’ if it isn’t even offered as a choice. ‘Promoting Renewable Energy’ IS on the list but that’s quite a different issue …

    ‘Renewables’, meaning wind and solar, are useful ’boutique’ applications for remote areas etc., they have never been and would never be considered capable for utility-scale generation without the Climate Change hobgoblin.

  16. Fat Tony

    Warburton
    #2849561, posted on October 26, 2018 at 9:21 am
    Whilst this is all true, absent some Trumpian outsider seizing control (impossible, really, in a Westminster system)–I suspect the argument has been lost. No one is going to build a coal plant in Australia. The ones we have are old and decrepit. We never should have ever gone down the path of renewables, but I think it’s irreversible. Am I wrong?!

    No, you’re not wrong.
    If it was purely economic, we could dig our way out eventually.

    But, our governments are bringing in millions of 3rd-worlders (savages & parasites) who will change the culture to what they came from.

    This is intentional, to hand a great quarry and farm to the chicoms, who will be responsible for “law & order”

  17. Fat Tony

    Adelagado
    #2849617, posted on October 26, 2018 at 10:55 am
    I don’t even see ‘Climate Change’ on the list. You can’t choose it as ‘important’ if it isn’t even offered as a choice. ‘Promoting Renewable Energy’ IS on the list but that’s quite a different issue.

    Just as a matter of interest, how do you define “climate change”?
    It used to be CAGW (Catastrophic Anthropogenic Global Warming), but since that didn’t happen, it became “climate change”.

  18. Myrddin Seren

    While many of the ACID respondents may have expertise in how to make businesses operate profitably, they clearly are bereft of political and general economic skills.

    Key word emphasised.

    If you are one of the long suffering shareholders of numerous Australian listeds – like AMP or CBA – you may have pause to wonder about the calibre of Australian senior management/directors taken as a group ?

    Likely answer – without looking for comparable metrics – absent cozy protected business sectors – frequently pretty shit.

  19. Boambee John

    , 50 per cent of them put it as the major issue confronting the economy.

    It actually is “the major issue confronting the economy”, just not in the sense of this survey.

    The insane actions being taken in the name of “fighting” CAGW have done more damage to the Australian economy than a major war, and they are just getting started!

  20. Adelagado

    Fat Tony
    #2849625, posted on October 26, 2018 at 11:25 am

    Adelagado. Just as a matter of interest, how do you define “climate change”?

    I define it as the climate being different now than it was 100 years ago. With half the country in drought anyone who isn’t ‘interested’ in that is a fool.

    But its a stand alone topic as far as I’m concerned. I don’t see it on the list and I don’t automatically assume that anyone interested in Climate Change is naturally a renewables fanatic. I’m certainly not.

  21. Adelagado

    Perhaps some of you guys haven’t read Alans post properly. This is what he said…

    7 per cent of respondents among the general pubic put CLIMATE CHANGE and support for renewable subsidies as the key issue facing them

    My point above is simply that ‘climate change’ isn’t even on the list. Has Alan just made that bit up?

  22. Fat Tony

    Adelagado
    #2849638, posted on October 26, 2018 at 11:56 am
    Fat Tony
    #2849625, posted on October 26, 2018 at 11:25 am

    Adelagado. Just as a matter of interest, how do you define “climate change”?

    I define it as the climate being different now than it was 100 years ago. With half the country in drought anyone who isn’t ‘interested’ in that is a fool.

    But its a stand alone topic as far as I’m concerned. I don’t see it on the list and I don’t automatically assume that anyone interested in Climate Change is naturally a renewables fanatic. I’m certainly not.

    I hate to be the one who breaks this to you, but the climate has always been changing – that’s why we have the word “climate”. We have had warm periods eg Roman, Minoan which were warmer than now.
    We have had cold periods – Little Ice Age and the big Ice Ages.

    Also, we have had droughts before – a lot worse than the current drought.
    It’s also been hotter, colder, wetter & dryer.

    The only fools are the ones who think “de-industrialising” the West will somehow magically revert us to some ideal climate.

    As an aside, could you tell us what this “ideal climate” would be please?

  23. Hydra

    What a shame the average person does not recognise the link between “cost of living” and tax cuts.

    The largest cost to most individuals annual budget is tax.

  24. Rohan

    Warburton
    #2849561, posted on October 26, 2018 at 9:21 am
    I suspect the argument has been lost. No one is going to build a coal plant in Australia. The ones we have are old and decrepit. We never should have ever gone down the path of renewables, but I think it’s irreversible. Am I wrong?!

    I think it will come to a head this summer if we have significant power outages as predicted on the eastern seaboard. 20 million hot and bothered Aussies waking up to the reality of the magnificent incompetence of our ruling class in a heat wave, may finally tip the balance.

    Or I could be wrong. And then we’re f$%ked.

  25. duncanm

    Adelagado
    #2849638, posted on October 26, 2018 at 11:56 am

    I define it as the climate being different now than it was 100 years ago. With half the country in drought anyone who isn’t ‘interested’ in that is a fool.

    funny – it was very much the same 100 years ago. Federation Drought

  26. duncanm

    Another data point — the Darling was dry at Bourke for over a year from early 1902.

    It currently has nearly 4m in it on the BOM river gauge.

  27. Adelagado

    Fat Tony
    #2849645, posted on October 26, 2018 at 12:10 pm

    I hate to be the one who breaks this to you, but the climate has always been changing

    Yes I know its always been changing. And thats not necessarily a bad thing. Would you please read my posts correctly instead of assuming I’m a climate doomist. I’m just saying that ‘Climate Change’ is not even on Alans List even though he says it is.

  28. duncanm

    Adelagado,

    try here for a visual, easy to digest summary : BOM yearly rainfall history from 1900

    the 2000’s look particularly average to me. Check out the 1900’s, late 1920’s, mid-late ’30’s.

    If anything, Australia looks like its been getting wetter over the last 100 years.

  29. John Constantine

    The incoming shorten looting cartel will legislate for quotas of diversity communists on company boards, with compulsory union representation at board level.

    Comrades.

  30. John Constantine

    Political officers will be required on all company boards, to submit reports on all unsound thoughtcrimes of management.

    Comrades.

  31. Adelagado

    How can I make this clearer. I’m not taking a stand on Climate Change either way.

    I’m just saying that Alans article is BULLSHIT because ‘Real People’ weren’t even asked about ‘climate change’ even though his HEADLINE and the purpose of his article suggests they were.

    Read the article then look at the list!!!

  32. It’s also been hotter, colder, wetter & dryer.

    What if the Terror Australis weather operates on a 371* year cycle?

    The 100 years of bom data (if you trust the adjustments) is not going to be helpful for a while.

    * pick a number

  33. DaveR

    DuncanM,
    that is the effect of the terrible Federation Drought (1896-1903), possibly the hottest period in Australia in the last 300 years (meaning – forget claims about todays temperatures such as “hottest ever….”). Not only did rivers run dry but there were a lot of deaths.

    The Bureau of Meteorology is absolutely determined to bury the truth of the Federation Drought as it makes a mockery of its biased Global Warming narrative.

  34. Roger

    Real people put living standards above virtue signalling on climate change

    The key, then, to getting people to question the AGW scam is to explain to them how the scam will negatively effect their living standards while enriching the minority who benefit from it.

  35. DaveR

    Unfortunately Morrison and Frydenberg (NEG -who Me?) are of the Turnbull left Liberal set, although Morrison seems to throw the odd comment to the right of his party..

    In a purely political sense, the Turnbull policies are not a winner for the Coalition, but the Abbott centre-right policies can deliver a 20+ seat majority at the next election.

    Climate Change and Energy are front and central of this policy difference.

    But I dont think the Liberals will wake up in time, and many of the left Liberal Luvvies will have to leave and join Labor, so its probably a save the furniture effort.

  36. Tom

    I’m just saying that Alans article is BULLSHIT

    Only took you five posts to identify yourself as a zombie troll. For the troll, it’s crucial not to blow your cover too early — behaviour obviously learned through being booted off other websites for being a nuisance.

  37. Adelagado

    incoherent rambler
    #2849688, posted on October 26, 2018 at 1:20 pm

    Adelagado, go clean your solar panels .

    I’ll try anther tack Incoherent Ramble. Would you please read the list and tell me which ‘issue’ supports Alan’s headline and assertion that ‘real people’ have little interest in ‘climate change’.

  38. Roger

    But I dont think the Liberals will wake up in time, and many of the left Liberal Luvvies will have to leave and join Labor, so its probably a save the furniture effort.

    How many of the Liberal Luvvies and/or their family members (Hi Malcolm, Alex) are heavily invested in renewables?

  39. Adelagado

    Tom
    #2849697, posted on October 26, 2018 at 1:42 pm

    I’m just saying that Alans article is BULLSHIT

    Only took you five posts to identify yourself as a zombie troll.

    Tom. I’ve been a ‘Catallyst’ for a few years. I’ve commented hundreds of times. I’ve even had a Guest post or two. I resorted to the swear words in capitals because my comment about Alans article is being continually misinterpreted by Cats who are automatically assuming I’m a greenie or a troll. In fact I usually like Alan’s posts and agree with much of what he says. But in this case his headline and assertion is simply not supported by the accompanying survey chart. Look at it. It doesn’t mention ‘Climate Change’ anywhere.

  40. Diogenes

    Adelagado

    You are being disingenuous. Renewabulls is the proxy for action on climate change as it the only (expletive deleted) action that will ‘stop’ it if you listen to our ‘betters’ in parliament, the media and ‘climate’ scientists

  41. Alan Moran

    BULLSHIT who knows? then there is this analysis of the AICD report by Jo Nova. Not all that many voted and many who did were not real company directors.

  42. Adelagado

    Diogenes
    #2849711, posted on October 26, 2018 at 2:14 pm
    Adelagado, You are being disingenuous. Renewabulls is the proxy for action on climate change.

    What rot. Farmers are vitally interested in Climate Change but that doesn’t mean they are pro-renewables. Conversely one can be thoroughly keen on renewables as ‘potentially’ a source of clean cheap electricity without believing we must have them NOW to save the planet.

    Anyway, what does ‘Promoting Renewable Energy’ even mean? Does it mean advertising campaigns, big subsidies for wind farms, funds for research and development? Its a very vague question, but it certainly is not a proxy for Climate Change in a legitimate survey.

  43. duncanm

    Adelegao,

    FWIW, I agree with your point, but your “I define it as the climate being different now than it was 100 years ago. With half the country in drought anyone who isn’t ‘interested’ in that is a fool.” is bullshit.

  44. .

    The Federation drought was worse than the current one or the millennium drought.

    Much of the holocene was actually much warmer too.

  45. RobK

    I think Adelagado has a point. It’s a stinker of a survey and any critique should probably start with highlighting its weaknesses before waddling through contrived analysis.

  46. Fat Tony

    Adelegao,

    Before people are asked their views on “climate change”, we should have a common definition.

    Instead, we have accusations of “climate denier”, which would have to be one of the biggest BULLSHIT terms around. No-one denies the climate changes, though the last 150 years have been unusually steady.
    But it suits the scammers, because instead of having to use facts, data, logic, science etc, they can just scream “Denier” and make people shut up.

    So, if you want to improve Alan’s article, provide a definition of “climate change” that everyone can agree on and then be used in proper surveys – for whatever use that will be.

  47. RobK

    Tony,
    To complicate things the UNFCCC has a different definition to the IPCC. Link;https://www.ipcc.ch/publications_and_data/ar4/syr/en/mains1.html

    Definitions of climate change

    Climate change in IPCC usage refers to a change in the state of the climate that can be identified (e.g. using statistical tests) by changes in the mean and/or the variability of its properties, and that persists for an extended period, typically decades or longer. It refers to any change in climate over time, whether due to natural variability or as a result of human activity. This usage differs from that in the United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change (UNFCCC), where climate change refers to a change of climate that is attributed directly or indirectly to human activity that alters the composition of the global atmosphere and that is in addition to natural climate variability observed over comparable time periods.

    We use one, lefties use the other as agitprop. It is a real barrier to civil discussion.

  48. Art Vandelay

    then there is this analysis of the AICD report by Jo Nova. Not all that many voted and many who did were not real company directors.

    I just came here to post the same thing. Unsurprisingly, it looks like the ABC have misrepresented the results of the survey and others in the media were too lazy to verify the information in the ABC report before they repeated its assertions:

    ABC-Watch: Beyond fake headlines — 61% of company directors do not care about Climate Change

  49. Percy Popinjay

    Tax avoidance by big companies

    This is not an “issue”. Companies are entitled to engage in legal tax minimisation practices. If they aren’t then their boards and senior management are incompetent and should be removed.

    What an age of irredeemable idiocy we live in.

  50. duncanm

    What an age of irredeemable idiocy we live in.

    sad, but true.

  51. Mitch

    3 years between elections isn’t long enough to go “the Full Trump”.

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