Iran – unfolding

An Iranian oil tanker,

IRAN FORCES SAY THEY SEIZED BRITISH-FLAGGED OIL TANKER IN GULF
  • Saudi king approves hosting U.S. troops to enhance regional security
  • U.S. Army: We are monitoring the situation in the Strait of Hormuz
  • A London black cab taxi drives past Big Ben and the Houses of Parliament in late afternoon sunlight
    Britain says seizure of two vessels by Iran is unacceptable

From The Jerusalem Post. You may be sure PDT has no wish to enter a conflict with Iran, but you may also be almost as sure that he will not hesitate to take Iran on if the US is pushed too hard. The Democrats will only seek to criticise any decision when it comes. Guliani was just on Fox saying the US could obliterate Iran and set their economy back a decade, which is possible. But what can be done is not the same as what should be done.

The one red line I can remember was whether any American service personnel are harmed. It is also a British ship that has been captured. The British navy hardly rules the seas but leaving the response to the US would be a humiliation. Not to mention that the Iranian government is deeply hated by its own citizens, so this may be the only way to save itself. Beyond that, both Guiliani and Hannity stated that there is more to know, but which they cannot state in public.

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124 Responses to Iran – unfolding

  1. stackja

    Iran pushing for what?

  2. Fair shake of the Sauce bottle

    So how does this play out?

    Does Kim Jong-un go peace ambassador?
    Does Ali Khamenei let the ships go in return for the Democrat Nomination?
    Does the mod-squad Twitter their way to victory?

    Stay close to your social media accounts for the next exciting narrative!

  3. PB

    The real narrative behind all this will never be permitted an airing here.

  4. Muddy

    The most likely initial kinetic strike, if there is one (and if we hear about it), will be against command and control capabilities. Damage can be done to communications networks and other infrastructure with a comparative minimum of human casualties.

    I’d put money on the U.S.’s regional ally already having a list of potential targets, and plans for inflicting economic damage also (the sources of the regime’s income are …?), should the opportunity arise. Damaging the electricity grid could cause civil unrest and provide a small internal distraction. On the other hand, if the regime falls … what then?

    In terms of P.R. for President Trump – it’s a no-win.

    As for the Brits … Oh dear. This isn’t the first humiliation in the region though, so perhaps they’ll ignore it again. No doubt there are elements of the SBS not too far away, but will they be used, and how?

  5. Fair shake of the Sauce bottle

    elements of the SBS not too far away

    Haha I hope that is not a typo cos it sounds so good.

  6. Muddy

    Special Boat Service, Saucy.

  7. Tom

    For the first time since World War Two, we’re seeing America in action under a decisive commander-in-chief not in the thrall of a US miltary-industrial complex.

    The fracking revolution puts Trump and America in an unprecedented position of strength as a net exporter of hydrocarbon energy, no longer dependant on the oil and gas fields of the Middle East.

    Against the mightiest military force in the world, the mad mullahs of Iran, as well as Russia and China, no longer have the geo-political power they once enjoyed beyond their strategic nuisance value.

    The imminent unshackling of Great Britain from the socialist warmongers of the EU also puts the UK in a strong position as the key Northern Hemisphere US military ally. I hope (but am far from confident) the incoming UK PM doesn’t sabotage Trump’s strategy in the Gulf.

    The US military-industrial complex’s role in driving US foreign policy has been derailed and, with 100% support of US military families, it no longer has an endless source of human cannon fodder for its global ambitions.

    To call this a geo-political revolution is an understatement.

  8. Another Peter

    SBS as in Special Boat Service, not the TV channel

  9. bespoke

    PB
    #3112001, posted on July 20, 2019 at 5:04 pm
    The real narrative behind all this will never be permitted an airing here.

    Give it a go.

  10. I wonder if the Four Nags of the Apocalypse will make their way to the Middle East to give their support to Iran?

  11. A Lurker

    Quick question, in case this all blows up what are Australia’s reserves of petrol and diesel?

  12. Zulu Kilo Two Alpha

    Quick question, in case this all blows up what are Australia’s reserves of petrol and diesel?

    IIRC, some three weeks to a month.

  13. Tel

    … what are Australia’s reserves of petrol and diesel?

    How should any of us know?

    Ask Singapore.

  14. Fair shake of the Sauce bottle

    SBS as in Special Boat Service, not the TV channel

    There’s me learning stuff again.

    I was really hoping Lee Lin Chin would conduct a preemptive condescending news read to accept Irans culture to keep what they take.

  15. Infidel Tiger

    These shops deliberately strayed into Iranian waters. Liberian flagged, UK owned ships.

    This is a puppet show. Iran is desperate to increase the price of crude and is using every trick in the book to do so.

  16. Infidel Tiger

    … what are Australia’s reserves of petrol and diesel?

    Only what’s in our car tanks.

  17. Percy Popinjay

    Quick question, in case this all blows up what are Australia’s reserves of petrol and diesel?

    Zero.

  18. Dear Percy Popinjay, never you mind about that.
    Priorities are sure to be:
    1 Federal politicians;
    2 Defence Force
    3 State Police, Ambos & Firies
    4 Farmers and Truckies LAST
    After LAST, Voters

  19. mh

    Australia should be energy dominant.

    But we’re not.

    Because we’re shit.

  20. Zulu Kilo Two Alpha

    Priorities are sure to be:
    1 Federal politicians;
    2 Defence Force
    3 State Police, Ambos & Firies
    4 Farmers and Truckies LAST
    After LAST, Voters

    1 – QWERTY personnel
    2 – Any other minority who considers themselves oppressed.
    3 – Politicians
    4 – Defence forces
    5 – State Police, Ambo’s and firies

    Farmer’s, truckies and voters will be told they’ll just have to make do.
    (Cite you the Greenie that told me that, in the event of an energy crisis, farmers could always go back to horse drawn machinery…)

  21. Infidel Tiger

    Australia should be richest and most energy powerful nation in human history.

    But we are governed by the worst people on earth.

  22. Ivan Denisovich

    Quick question, in case this all blows up what are Australia’s reserves of petrol and diesel?

    As of 2018:

    Since the revelation in March last year that Australia’s national security could be threatened by the fact that the country has fuel reserves of just 43 days’ supply………………………….

    the Australian Parliamentary Joint Committee on Intelligence and Security (PJCIS) and the International Energy Agency (IEA) both expressed concern that Australia was the only country not to comply with the IEA international energy program treaty that requires member countries to hold “crude oil and/or product reserves equivalent to 90 days of the previous year’s net imports”. In fact, Australia had been non-compliant since March 2012

    To the rescue!

    Responding to warnings about fuel security, the Government announced last May a Liquid Fuel Security Review but inexplicably stated that this “should not be construed as Australia having a fuel security problem”. Perhaps this befuddled thinking was the reason why the review has faltered…………………….

    The Government then announced it would purchase up to 400 kilotonnes of oil tickets from the Netherlands in 2018–19 and 2019–20 at a cost of $23.8 million to comply with the IEA mandate by 2026. This, however, is now estimated to add only 3.8 days to our fuel stockholding because our ever-increasing domestic demand raises the amount that is mandated.

    In any case, the 90-day mandate is meaningless because all that Australia has is a promise of fuel, meaning that Australia has bought oil stock tickets from another IEA member country.

    A “ticket” “is a contractual right to purchase or release oil, where the seller agrees to reserve a predetermined quantity of oil for the period of the contract, in return for an agreed fee”.

    In other words, it assumes that the oil will be available and supply lines will be open during a global oil emergency.

    http://www.newsweekly.com.au/nwmobile/article.php?id=58396

  23. jupes

    From the stupid UK Foreign Minister:

    He said “freedom of navigation must be maintained” and warned of “serious consequences” if the situation is not resolved quickly.

    We are not looking at military options,” he added. “We are looking at a diplomatic way to resolve this situation.”

    Weak. As. Piss.

    I’d sack that fool in a heartbeat. The Mullahs will be high-fiving after that.

  24. Bemused:

    I wonder if the Four Nags of the Apocalypse will make their way to the Middle East to give their support to Iran?

    As Human Shields, if past intellectual endeavours give us a clue.

  25. max

    Neocon Wet Dream: regime change in Iran

    Lossers are going to be American ordinary people and poor people around the world if price of oil go to $150 for more than 3 months

    The problems began when the U.S. government abandoned its founding policies of a limited-government republic and non-interventionism and instead became a national-security state and embraced a foreign policy of empire and interventionism. This is what gave the country a huge, permanent military establishment, both domestically and in foreign countries. It also gave the nation assassinations, torture, coups, regime-change operations, alliances with dictatorial regimes, installation of dictatorial regimes, sanctions, embargoes, illegal invasions and occupations, undeclared wars, wars of aggression, terrorism, a war on terrorism, out-of-control spending and debt, and, of course, the destruction of American liberty and privacy.

  26. John Constantine

    If only human initiative and ingenuity could discover a way to extract hydrocarbons from the trillions of tonnes of oil and gas shales that Australia is built on.

    Or to monetise the trillions of tonnes of coal hydrocarbons.

    Like the Americans did with their tight hydrocarbons that are obviously so different to ours.

    Just as well yarragrad was sly enough to sign up to borrow loanshark finance from the Tyrant’s belt and road to build a gas import plant, saving all the hassle of drilling for their own fuel.

    Comrades.

  27. John Constantine

    The poms have proscribed hezbollah, so there is that.

    https://www.aa.com.tr/en/europe/uk-moves-to-proscribe-hezbollah-and-affiliates/1402362

    Australia just goes along with our drug importing smoke smuggling security guarding cartels so as to not offend anybody.

    Cousin Comrades.

  28. John Constantine

    It was put to me by a sweating, stumbling, smiling -in-rictus individual that whar Australia has is purer and far more useful than actual physical diesel fuel reserves.

    Australia has a signed convention with their transnational community of nations, where our signed paper can be fairly and equally shared for fuel in the event that fuel triples in price and becomes otherwise unavailable.

    Either the emperor has no fuel and nobody ever says anything, or we have paper we can wave and proclaim:

    “Fuel in our Time”.

    Comrades.

  29. mareeS

    We were away recently in Laos with an Israeli colonel. They are ready, Britain is ready, US is ready, Iran not so much.

    Iran can’t scrub up to this challenge.

  30. duncanm

    Infidel Tiger
    #3112049, posted on July 20, 2019 at 6:56 pm

    These shops deliberately strayed into Iranian waters. Liberian flagged, UK owned ships.

    Uh huh..

  31. The Mullahs want a shooting war, it’s the only thing that can get Trump out in 2020.
    The Mullahs need Trump out in 2020 or else they have to agree to Trumps non prolefaration demand.
    If he isn’t out and they don’t agree to his demands, Iranian people will have suffered enough to revolt.
    If he isn’t out and they agree to his demands, then they look weakened to the Iranian people who will eventually revolt.

    They n(the Mullahs) have to help get Trump out. John Kerry told them so and so did Frog Macron and Heil Merkel and Godfather Putin.
    The Mullahs wouldn’t do any of this if they weren’t encouraged by Kerry and the Euro trash.
    The Euro Trash were/are making a lot of money from the JCPoA agreement.

    So much for so many, hinges on 20-20.

  32. Frank Walker from National Tiles

    PB
    #3112001, posted on July 20, 2019 at 5:04 pm

    The real narrative behind all this will never be permitted an airing here.

    PB is trying to say that Iran is provoking the UK into a war with Iran at the behest of Israel.

    Israel controls Iran, which has a “secret” nuke programme and has vowed to nuke Israel.

    16D chess indeed.

  33. Oh come on

    The US needs to issue clear red lines. This administration will stick to them, unlike the previous one. If US military personnel are killed as a consequence of Iranian military action, then there ought to be a US military response.

    I generally agree with Tucker Carlson’s perspective on what ought to be done about Iran, but Carlson is wrong to portray any military confrontation with Iran as a prelude to total war and an Iraq-style ground invasion, regime change etc etc. No. Iran’s wings can be clipped if they misbehave. This has happened very many times in the past without the situation resulting in a full scale war.

    Carlson seems to like Tulsi Gabbard. He’s had her on his show several times and seldom disagrees with her. She may be right in her anti-war stance in some respects, but she also advocates going back to the terrible JCPOA (the ‘Iran nuclear deal’ brokered by Obama). Tucker never challenges her on this. I think her support for Obama’s Iran deal means her judgement is questionable. Trump was completely correct to ditch the JCPOA.

    Iran is engaging in brinkmanship with the US and it’s playing the game well so far. However, it is nevertheless a risky game to play.

  34. Tator

    I can recall a time in 1988 when the mullahs mined the Straights of Hormuz and got lucky with an US frigate hitting one. The end result was Operation Preying Mantis where the US took out Iranian naval and intelligence facilities on two inoperable oil platforms in the Persian Gulf, and sank at least three armed Iranian speedboats, one Iranian frigate and one fast attack gunboat. One other Iranian frigate was damaged in the battle Only US casualties were 2 crew from a AH1 Cobra crash.
    It will be interesting to say the least to see what hardware is utilised if any military response by the US is undertaken, or even if the UK who are still to form an executive government after May’s resignation. They may see this as an opportunity to give their new F35Bs a hit out on the HMS Queen Elizabeth using a similar proportional response as Op Preying Mantis.

  35. Ivan Denisovich

    she also advocates going back to the terrible JCPOA (the ‘Iran nuclear deal’ brokered by Obama). Tucker never challenges her on this. I think her support for Obama’s Iran deal means her judgement is questionable. Trump was completely correct to ditch the JCPOA.

    Melanie Phillips:

    A few days ago, Britain’s Daily Telegraph revealed that in 2015 the British authorities had uncovered a Hezbollah terrorist plot. The key point was that this had been kept secret until now.

    In a bomb factory on the outskirts of London, a total of three metric tonnes of ammonium nitrate was discovered — more than was used in the 1995 Oklahoma City bombing that killed 168 people — stashed in ice packs.

    This was apparently no rogue plot, but part of an international Hezbollah operation laying the groundwork for future attacks.

    The London cell was uncovered by MI5 and the police in September 2015. The British were reportedly tipped off by the Mossad. The suspicion is that the British government kept the discovery secret because they were heavily committed to the Iran nuclear deal brokered by President Barack Obama, which was agreed to the following month.

    That deal was a baleful development. Supposedly aiming to prevent Iran from ever developing nuclear weapons, it would actually enable it to do so a few years down the line.

    Worse, by lifting sanctions it funneled millions of dollars into Iran. This enabled the regime to fund Hezbollah and global terror; expand its predatory influence in Lebanon, Gaza, Yemen and Iraq; and continue developing inter-continental ballistic missiles.

    Britain has consistently and perversely maintained that the deal would stop Iran from getting the bomb. When U.S. President Donald Trump declared the deal dead and reimposed sanctions, Britain and the European Union set out to undermine this through a special-purpose vehicle called Instex, designed to allow payments to Iran that would bypass sanctions.

    So while it was trying to continue funding the Iranian terror machine, the British government kept secret from the public a major threat to Western security being developed in their own country by Iran’s proxy army, Hezbollah, which the British government only got round to banning as a terrorist group in February this year.

    When Israel pulled off last year’s audacious raid in stealing thousands of Iranian nuclear program files from under the regime’s nose and said these revealed Iran was far closer to getting nuclear weapons than had been thought, the British dismissed this as irrelevant…………………………………

    It’s hard to see how the Iranian regime can be stopped without some kind of military action being taken against it. Those like Britain and the European Union who believe that is unthinkable and can best be avoided by the Obama deal are wrong.

    https://www.melaniephillips.com/hebollah-terror-plot-british-appeasing/

  36. roger

    To all those worried about our gov’t’s energy policy (or lack thereof), maybe we should just be a bit patient with our gov’t, and wait until Dr Bob Brown finally reveals to the gov’t which energy form he finds acceptable.

  37. Infidel Tiger

    We were away recently in Laos with an Israeli colonel. They are ready, Britain is ready, US is ready, Iran not so much.

    Iran can’t scrub up to this challenge.

    Anything Israelis say should be ignored. They are almost as bad as Arabs.

    Their interests are not ours.

  38. roger

    Infidel Tiger
    #3112158, posted on July 21, 2019 at 12:47 am

    Anything Israelis say should be ignored. They are almost as bad as Arabs.

    Their interests are not ours.

    Those selfish bastards:

  39. Infidel Tiger

    Yes they are. I understand Israel’s position, they have to live next to these loons.

    We shouldn’t give a fuck about any of this stuff and the US certainly shouldn’t.

    If Middle Easterners of any denomination or creed want to kill themselves, it is none of our business.

  40. jupes

    I generally agree with Tucker Carlson’s perspective on what ought to be done about Iran, but Carlson is wrong to portray any military confrontation with Iran as a prelude to total war and an Iraq-style ground invasion, regime change etc etc. No. Iran’s wings can be clipped if they misbehave.

    Good post OCO.

    I agree. A ground invasion would be insane. Just bomb the shit out of them – I’m talking about destroying every known military facility and the parliament – then let them sort out their own regime change.

    If the new regime wants more then give it to them.

  41. Zatara

    We shouldn’t give a fuck about any of this stuff and the US certainly shouldn’t.

    At least not if we enjoy walking.

    Oz imports 53% of its refined oil from Singapore. Over 2/3 of the crude oil Singapore imports to refine is from the Persian Gulf. Should Iran manage to shut down oil transport from the Gulf things are going to get sporty. Availability will be reduced to rationing levels and the prices will skyrocket.

    Maintaining supply security and reliability for liquid fuels in Australia

    Arguably, Trump and the US taxpayers are subsidizing much of the rest of the world’s oil supply by keeping Iran in check and the Straits of Hormuz open. Thanklessly of course.

  42. Up The Workers!

    Piece of cake.

    Once Lee Lin Chin of the SBS unleashes all 50 Shades of S.tan Grant, the problems will be fixed in no time.

  43. Robber Baron

    Trump should threaten to invade Switzerland. That will frighten the living daylights out if the mullahs. Thats where their hidden billions are kept.

  44. 1735099

    Against the mightiest military force in the world, the mad mullahs of Iran, as well as Russia and China, no longer have the geo-political power they once enjoyed beyond their strategic nuisance value.

    Reminds me of the same kind of rhetoric about “mightiest military force” that was around fifty years ago.
    It didn’t end well.

  45. The Beer Whisperer

    Ironically, this is a sign of two things.

    That both the UK and Iran are weak.

  46. The Beer Whisperer

    jupes
    #3112169, posted on July 21, 2019 at 3:14 am
    I generally agree with Tucker Carlson’s perspective on what ought to be done about Iran, but Carlson is wrong to portray any military confrontation with Iran as a prelude to total war and an Iraq-style ground invasion, regime change etc etc. No. Iran’s wings can be clipped if they misbehave.

    Good post OCO.

    I agree. A ground invasion would be insane. Just bomb the shit out of them – I’m talking about destroying every known military facility and the parliament – then let them sort out their own regime change.

    If the new regime wants more then give it to them.

    WWII was the end of direct war. It was replaced by proxy wars which have been largely replaced with covert war. Declarations of war were about honour, which is largely a quaint notion in the 21st century.

    99% of 21st century wars will never be declared.

  47. duncanm

    and numbers — as you well know, the big difference in this case is the motivation of the local population.

    Iran, by all accounts, is not behind the Mullah’s.. and Vietnam was still in post-colonial reunification mode.

  48. Fair shake of the Sauce bottle

    Once Lee Lin Chin of the SBS unleashes all 50 Shades of S.tan Grant, the problems will be fixed in no time.

    Whoah there. Let’s not go full retard at the first drop of a tanker. We should though escalate this to Level 1 QandA panel discussion turned lecture. If only the Qld voters weren’t so deplorable.

  49. Roger

    I understand Israel’s position, they have to live next to these loons.

    We shouldn’t give a fuck about any of this stuff and the US certainly shouldn’t.

    Alas, our feckless politicians have ensured that we are utterly dependent upon oil flowing out of the Strait of Hormuz.

  50. Tel

    A “ticket” “is a contractual right to purchase or release oil, where the seller agrees to reserve a predetermined quantity of oil for the period of the contract, in return for an agreed fee”.

    In other words, it assumes that the oil will be available and supply lines will be open during a global oil emergency.

    From Holland to Australia … what could possibly go wrong?

    There’s also an assumption that once the oil gets to Australia, we can figure out what to do with it.

  51. Tel;

    From Holland to Australia … what could possibly go wrong?

    And for those who have a stash of fuel/genset, the government will confiscate them and probably gaol you for being a ‘hoarder’.
    The coppers will be on the lookout for a replacement for the Duty Sergeants beer fridge.

  52. Mater

    Priorities are sure to be:
    1 Federal politicians;
    2 Defence Force
    3 State Police, Ambos & Firies
    4 Farmers and Truckies LAST
    After LAST, Voters

    Wrong.
    First priority will be South Australia’s enormous diesel generators.
    They best have this over and done with before summer.

  53. Mater:

    Wrong.
    First priority will be South Australia’s enormous diesel generators.
    They best have this over and done with before summer.

    And to fuel them, they will be going over the fuel distributors delivery dockets and then turning up at farmers tank farms with tankers.
    And coppers.
    Armed coppers.

  54. Iampeter

    You may be sure PDT has no wish to enter a conflict with Iran, but you may also be almost as sure that he will not hesitate to take Iran on if the US is pushed too hard.

    You mean like threatening Iran with consequences, then having a drone shot down, then launching an attack, then cancelling the attack, proving to the world that you’re threats are empty?
    The one thing you can be sure about is that Trump has no clue and his administration is a shambling mess.
    His cowardly appeasement of America’s enemies is prompting them to get more and more aggressive.

    The real narrative behind all this will never be permitted an airing here.

    Yawn.
    I’m pretty sure your kind post here every now and then since the cat is such a rich source of useful idiots to recruit. Pretty sure one of your kind even got a guest post here once. It was about the alt-right and how they are totally a deep political movement and not just a re-branding of Neo-Nazi ideas. Totally. Wink, wink.
    It got lots of support too. The suckers here loved it.

    So you should give it a go. Sadly, I think you’ll find you have a lot more support here than you realize.

  55. feelthebern

    57 comments & Saudi Aramco not mentioned yet.
    That is the carrot the House of Saud is dangling in front of the Brits right now.
    Suckers.

  56. stackja

    Jimmy Carter decided Iran didn’t need the Shah. What could possibly go wrong?

  57. roger

    Jimmy Carter decided Iran didn’t need the Shah. What could possibly go wrong?

    Every time some Democrat loser seizes the White House some other shit hole around the world starts to cause trouble.

  58. ME watcher

    It would be a very large error to assume Iranians “hate” their government. In fact the bumbling approach of trump and MBS is almost certainly building cohesion. Iranians have spent long periods under pressure since the 1950s. They know what they really hate and that was the Shah and Savak.
    Trump won’t commit troops to anything as nasty as another war in the ME. If MBS allows trump to roll him into it we will see a terrible outcome.
    These are not rhetorical games Mr Kates.

  59. Muddy

    Iampeter
    #3112323, posted on July 21, 2019 at 11:58 am

    The one thing you can be sure about is that Trump has no clue and his administration is a shambling mess.

    I hope to eventually be at least half as effective an analyst as you are. It’s a lofty goal, for sure, but I’ll give it a red-hot go.

  60. John Constantine

    Obviously we need a social licence to buy fuel once it is rationed.

    Or we all buy windmill powered cars, because wind is free.

    And sun powered cars, because sun is free.

    As our elite say, we will all be so much happier when we can all sit down around the communal campfire in the dirt and sing songs in solidarity with our beloved leaders, like the Internationale, and the other song.

    In Cheerful Squalor.

    Comrades.

  61. John Constantine

    https://reneweconomy.com.au/the-absurdly-high-cost-of-tasmanias-switch-to-diesel-1163mwh-35521/

    The only thing dearer than diesel gennies to run the grid is having nothing to run the grid.

    https://www.hydro.com.au/water

    Tassies hydro dams coming out of winter at 40% capacity, as long as spring storms run off wet hills the diesel mightn’t be needed.

  62. 1735099

    and numbers — as you well know, the big difference in this case is the motivation of the local population.

    No difference.
    Like people everywhere they simply want to live in peace.
    That was what the Vietnamese wanted, and now they have it.
    The USA needs simply to butt out.

  63. John Constantine

    https://www.afr.com/business/energy/south-australian-government-to-privatise-jay-weatherills-diesel-generators-20181016-h16ph4

    The Marshall Liberal government in South Australia will privatise a bank of fast-start, diesel-powered generators put in place by former premier Jay Weatherill in 2017 under an energy fix-it plan for a fragile electricity grid, as it also warned that the cost of Labor’s energy package had blown out by more than 50 per cent to $815 million.

    South Australia will open a tender process for private owners to operate the taxpayer-funded diesel generators for 25 years, so they can be part of the grid, rather than sit idle and be turned on only if emergency electricity supply is required, which was at the centre of the Weatherill package.

    Converting these to run on gas would be a damn fine thing to do, Yesterday.

    Comrades.

  64. Tel

    The one thing you can be sure about is that Trump has no clue and his administration is a shambling mess.

    Says the Hillary supporter, pretending to be Randian.

    Another day, another dollar at the Earnest Voice troll farm, huh?

  65. Rockdoctor

    The Government then announced it would purchase up to 400 kilotonnes of oil tickets from the Netherlands in 2018–19 and 2019–20 at a cost of $23.8 million to comply with the IEA mandate by 2026. This, however, is now estimated to add only 3.8 days to our fuel stockholding because our ever-increasing domestic demand raises the amount that is mandated.

    Wow the stupid here is so breathtaking it’s amazing. I don’t have Military background but if a pleb like me sees issues with redeeming these tickets in event of full scale war or global disaster… We elect these people?

  66. Iampeter

    The one thing you can be sure about is that Trump has no clue and his administration is a shambling mess.

    Says the Hillary supporter, pretending to be Randian.

    Wait, you think you can support Trump, the guy who gave us trade regulations, attack on tech companies and trillion dollar spending bills, but still oppose Hillary? I get it. She’s not left wing enough for Trump supporters.

    Oh this upcoming election is going to be a blast.

    I hope to eventually be at least half as effective an analyst as you are. It’s a lofty goal, for sure, but I’ll give it a red-hot go.

    But Muddy you are already a deep political philosopher.
    A truly brilliant mind!

  67. RobK

    purchase up to 400 kilotonnes of oil tickets from the Netherlands
    Formalised exposure.

  68. John Constantine

    The process of having meetings and flying overseas and doing dinners and being party to transnational frameworks and signing communal conventions:

    This is how we end up with paper fuel, instead of fuel fuel.

    To a certain mindset, one process is clean and pure and progresses so many narratives at once that holding a clean signed form representing fuel is the way of the future.

    Actually preparing a strategic reserve for a physical substance, or converting State diesel gennies to run on Australian gas or even removing the ban on exploring for australias own fuel– all these things are individualist and old economy.

    Collateralised debt obligations represented house mortgages and were just fine, right up until they were presented for payment.

    Collateralised fuel obligations please everybody in good times.

    Once the supermarkets are looted of all food the night of the first blackout and no trucks have fuel to do restocking, the starving times begin.

    As their left know, the faster the majority of the proles are culled, the better off the elites are.

    Why did their andrews government invest in shipping containers full of assault rifles for their paramilitary bodyguards?. Cheaper to gun down the excess and disposable than prepare to maintain them on rations.

    Stalingrad didn’t need diesel.

  69. mh

    Its great to see the US economy going from strength to strength.

  70. Oh come on

    You mean like threatening Iran with consequences, then having a drone shot down, then launching an attack, then cancelling the attack

    Limp beater remains extremely angry that Trump didn’t order the carpet bombing of Tehran in retaliation for them downing an ageing drone. Real libertarians like limpy love them some war.

  71. Lee

    Whatever President Trump does or doesn’t do, the left and other haters will attack him regardless.
    You can bet that if a lefty advocates a particular course of action against Iran, and PDT goes ahead and carries it out, same lefty will savage him for doing precisely that.

  72. Another day, another dollar at the Earnest Voice troll farm, huh?

    No, these monkeys work for peanuts.

  73. sfw

    Australia could easily get agreement from farmers and other landholders for fracking and whatever other methods, all we have to do is go the the US system where landowners get a portion of the profits from the minerals extracted from their property. For some reason this never occurs to anyone, especially those on the right. If you suggest it they start blathering about ‘crown rights’ etc, and that it can’t be done. Bullshit, it could be done but for some reason this is one aspect of property rights they refuse to discuss.

    Give a farmer a sniff of a revenue stream and see how quick opposition would die away.

  74. Muddy

    Iampeter
    #3112370, posted on July 21, 2019 at 1:28 pm

    But Muddy you are already a deep political philosopher.
    A truly brilliant mind!

    Thank you for the compliment. I may have misjudged you.

  75. sfw:

    Australia could easily get agreement from farmers and other landholders for fracking and whatever other methods, all we have to do is go the the US system where landowners get a portion of the profits from the minerals extracted from their property. For some reason this never occurs to anyone, especially those on the right.

    An interesting inversion of reality.
    You are such a fuckwit.
    We’ve argued for just the exact same system here for years to get the farmers on side with fracking.
    Now shoosh – adults are talking.

  76. Dr Fred Lenin

    A suggestion to the SA laboral uniparty guvmint ,if there is still coal at Leigh ‘creek build an efficient Japanese type power station there, five times bigger than the one the left wing of the uniparty blew up ,,that will solve your problems ,call it the” wongwetherill memorial filthy coal burning real power station “ that’lllarn the left wing of the uniparty Then you can make the carpetbaggers pay for the removal of the ugly bird killing windmills and musks little pretend battery ,and stop solar panels from putting little bits of power into the grid spoiling the continuity . you are either on the grid or off it ,. your choice . Make owner payed compusory annual safety checks of all solar panels a introductory fee of $500 per 8 panels to be charged to be used to repair the damage power insanity has caused to the grid.

  77. duncanm

    1735099
    #3112358, posted on July 21, 2019 at 1:07 pm
    Like people everywhere they simply want to live in peace.
    That was what the Vietnamese wanted, and now they have it.

    .. of sorts.. but along for the ride came government surveillance, disappearing of ‘subversives’, re-education camps and other such fun stuff.

  78. egg_

    You mean like threatening Iran with consequences, then having a drone shot down, then launching an attack, then cancelling the attack

    If the resident (sock puppet?) troll disagrees, it must be right.

  79. egg_

    Limp beater

    LMFAO!
    Teh Left in a nutshell.

  80. Boambee John

    Rockdoctor at 1315

    Wow the stupid here is so breathtaking it’s amazing. I don’t have Military background but if a pleb like me sees issues with redeeming these tickets in event of full scale war or global disaster… We elect these people?

    The ones who draw up the policy are not elected. They “brief” the elected vacuous nongs who announce the policy.

  81. Iampeter

    Thank you for the compliment. I may have misjudged you.

    Oh you misjudge everything. Something tells me the only judgement you’re capable of is the misjudging kind.

    See PB, your kind are very welcome here.

    Limp beater

    LMFAO!
    Teh Left in a nutshell.

    The left supports trillion dollar spending bills, trade regulations, etc.
    You know, like Trump and his supporters.

    But don’t let that stop you from throwing around political terms you don’t understand.

    The CatallaxyFiles – home to the religious and the politically illiterate arm of the left wing.

  82. Iampeter

    Oh and some worse people too, it seems…*cough* Muddy *cough*

  83. egg_

    How many Iampeter dim bulbs can Musk’s WBB supply?

  84. sfw

    Winston, I’ve also argued it for years.

    What is wrong with you? Are you retarded or have Aspergers or similar? I make a short simple statement and your response is juvenile, to say the best.

    By the way if you want to link your name to website, make sure the link works or delete the link.

  85. Zulu Kilo Two Alpha

    Like people everywhere they simply want to live in peace.
    That was what the Vietnamese wanted, and now they have it.

    Achieved by the comprehensive violation of the Paris Peace Accords, and a conventional invasion of South Viet Nam.

  86. Mitchell Porter

    Reposting a comment that accidentally went to the open thread…

    feelthebern
    #3112327, posted on July 21, 2019 at 12:06 pm
    57 comments & Saudi Aramco not mentioned yet.
    That is the carrot the House of Saud is dangling in front of the Brits right now.
    Suckers.

    Exactly how does Aramco factor into what is going on? Are you saying Britain seized the Iranian tanker in order to win Saudi favors??

  87. sfw:

    By the way if you want to link your name to website, make sure the link works or delete the link.

    Go root your boot.

  88. Frank Walker from National Tiles

    roger
    #3112339, posted on July 21, 2019 at 12:33 pm

    Jimmy Carter decided Iran didn’t need the Shah. What could possibly go wrong?

    Every time some Democrat loser seizes the White House some other shit hole around the world starts to cause trouble.

    Oh please. What happened during Bush I’s tenure as President?

    This is demented thinking, that the Republicans have a right to rule. We’re not even from the same country as the Dems. and GOP. Are you going to seriously suggest that Carter, Obama and Clinton did not legitimately win?

    This is the exact tribal braindead nonsense that Iamputrid is trying to warn us off.

  89. Frank Walker from National Tiles

    Can you imagine Trump, Reagan, Goldwater, Eisenhower or Lincoln seriously suggesting that the GOP are the only legitimate party to hold public office in America?

  90. David

    No one is or will do anything because the UK seized an Iranian tanker two weeks ago. If they had any brains they would have been escorting their oil tankers near Iran.

  91. Hey Donald!

    Stop screwing around and glass the place.
    If you don’t do it , they will probably do it themselves*

    * What is this big red button do?

  92. mh

    #MIPA Make Iran Persian Again.

    Iranians need to reclaim their land from the Arabian Muhammadens.

    Death to the Mullahs!

  93. Oh come on

    What happened during Bush I’s tenure as President?

    What are you referring to? Just out of curiosity. H W’s most consequential foreign policy foray looks pretty solid in hindsight – kick Saddam out of Kuwait and neuter his regional ambitions, but no regime change nonsense. I’m no Bush 42 fan, but given what his son wrought and what Obama screwed up colossally, HW’s decision not to topple Saddam looks shrewd to me.

  94. Phill

    Who needs war in Iran? The fighting in this thread is bad enough.

  95. roger

    Can you imagine Trump, Reagan, Goldwater, Eisenhower or Lincoln seriously suggesting that the GOP are the only legitimate party to hold public office in America?

    I was not suggesting implementing a one-party system.
    The Democrats in America, like the Left (Labor/Greens etc.) here and elsewhere, are extremely dangerous fools, but the (immense) danger they pose to the respective nations these parasitic fools infest is still second to the danger of nations opting for a one-party system.
    It is the Left which ceaselessly fantasises about- (and, wherever it can, implements) a one-party system.

  96. egg_

    Can you imagine Trump, Reagan, Goldwater, Eisenhower or Lincoln seriously suggesting that the GOP are the only legitimate party to hold public office in America?

    Yes.
    Ditto the Dems, presumably.

  97. Shane

    Scott Adams take on this is a lot more positive than all of the above armchair doomsayers.
    In his opinion the mullahs are just acquiring bargaining poker ships before starting the discussion process.

  98. Zatara

    No one is or will do anything because the UK seized an Iranian tanker two weeks ago. If they had any brains they would have been escorting their oil tankers near Iran.

    If they had any brains the only way to view the Iranian navy would be from a glass bottom boat.

  99. Mother Lode

    All belligerence aside, I hope what we see from Trump is a more judicious use of threat and promise. His experience in making deals differs from career politicians whose deals consist of divvying out the wealth and propert (and freedoms) of others, and only dealing with people like themselves.

    His advantage is that he has defined his own Presidential style. Others have sought to act (or at least seem) Presidential and one part of this is quickly on the Military option when the bad guys do bad stuff – even if only lobbing a few missiles at the capital.

    The proximate issue – the taking of the British tanker – is not really worth the life of a single American serviceman.

    After the American drone was shot down he was not looking to draw red lines or such.

    Simply put, if the Iranians are trying to provoke the US now it is because the timing suits them. Good reason not to leap – yet.

    Another thing to be wary of is that thanks to years of rather loose immigration policy and modern technology, there will be thousands of wild-eyed dupes prepared to launch domestic attacks in the US and elsewhere. The conflict will not be far away and remote. A couple of bits of infrastructure taken out – plus an appropriate umber of dead children – and the uncertainty of what might happen next and where means fertile ground for quislings. I don’t thing the Democrats hunger for losses like that, but their reflexes will not be denied.

  100. Iampeter

    This is the exact tribal braindead nonsense that Iamputrid is trying to warn us off.

    Stop concern trolling Frank Walker from trailer trashville.
    You’re as much a tribalist as the other clueless leftists that post on this right wing blog for some reason.

    And one of the nuttier ones too.

  101. gowest

    It is incredible what trump has achieved in 2 years – a couple of carrots to the US energy sector and the US has multiple energy sectors producing and exporting. The same thing would happen here if the govt stopped being so greedy looking for cash to support their migrant funded pay rises.. Look at him now, he just smiles as Iran’s clerics try anything to stay in power. The message is simple – Strangle Strangle until you stop building nuclear bombs – you want to stay in power – you can, just dont build bombs and scare your neighbors – they dont like it!.
    UK, Germany, Australia, China etc – you want the oil its your problem.

    Dont know why we dont import from the US and undercut Singapore – wouldnt that be fun.

    You want US “help” you gotta pay… Looks like NK 2.0

  102. Luke

    Trump shouldn’t do anything. He should force England to lean on the EU and every other morally righteous oil poor country to fed for themselves.

    Force England and the EU to show that they don’t have the functioning military force that they keep pretending to have.

  103. Tel

    Limp beater remains extremely angry that Trump didn’t order the carpet bombing of Tehran in retaliation for them downing an ageing drone. Real libertarians like limpy love them some war.

    His other job is at CNN.

  104. rickw

    Trump shouldn’t do anything. He should force England to lean on the EU and every other morally righteous oil poor country to fed for themselves.

    Force England and the EU to show that they don’t have the functioning military force that they keep pretending to have.

    Trumps strategy is a good one. When I was last in Tehran, the only non-Chinese engineers and technicians there were French and German.

    Let the EU step up!

  105. Frank Walker from National Tiles

    Everyone can now kick Iamputrid to the curb.

    He is an irredeemable reprobate.

  106. Frank Walker from National Tiles

    OCO – the idea that bad foreign policy shit only happens to the Dems is fucking retarded. Trump was Dem. sympathiser for a long time and they pulled the same shit in Korea as what happened to Clinton.

    Saddam seized Kuwait – apparently, that could only happen if a Dem. was in office.

    Not only are the parties flawed, moreso by leaders like Nixon or Clinton, but the parties have had at least six iterations.

  107. Lee

    Can you imagine Trump, Reagan, Goldwater, Eisenhower or Lincoln seriously suggesting that the GOP are the only legitimate party to hold public office in America?

    No, but I think that many Democrats and much of the MSM in the U.S. believe it’s true of the Democrat party, or should be.

  108. Iampeter

    Everyone can now kick Iamputrid to the curb.

    He is an irredeemable reprobate.

    That’s right. Capitalists and right wingers are out of place on a right wing blog.
    But anarchists, central planners, proud racists, and future ISIS recruits are totally welcome.

    Makes sense.

  109. Frank Walker from National Tiles

    I am a capitalist and a “right-winger”.

    You’re not. You’ve never worked for yourself in your life.

    future ISIS recruits

    Get off the crack mate. Such a bad take. People are rabidly anti-Muslim here to a fault.

  110. Frank Walker from National Tiles

    I am a capitalist and a “right-winger”.

    You’re not. You’ve never worked for yourself in your life.

    future ISIS recruits

    Get off the crack mate. Such a bad take. People are rabidly anti-Quaran here to a fault.

  111. Iampeter

    I am a capitalist and a “right-winger”.

    No, you’re not. You don’t know anything about these terms, you are a raving lunatic that would’ve long been banned on any other website.

  112. Oh come on

    OCO – the idea that bad foreign policy shit only happens to the Dems is fucking retarded.

    I never said this. I was only curious about what you were criticising HW over. Thought it may have been Panama. HW’s leadership during the first Gulf War was pretty good.

    That’s right. Capitalists and right wingers are out of place on a right wing blog.

    Limpy, you are a classic NeverTrumper. Stop pretending you have a consistent set of principles.

  113. Frank Walker from National Tiles

    No, you’re not. You don’t know anything about these terms, you are a raving lunatic that would’ve long been banned on any other website.

    Sinclair believes in freedom of speech and conscience – and he means it.

    No no, more about you Petey.

    Do you take a taxpayer salary?

  114. Frank Walker from National Tiles

    Not you OCO. Don’t know why you took offence.

    The point is some idiot claimed that the GOP were invulnerable to tin-pot dictators testing their will.

    We don’t need cults of personality.

  115. Iampeter

    Limpy, you are a classic NeverTrumper. Stop pretending you have a consistent set of principles.

    Being a NeverTrumper is perfectly consistent with being a right winger and capitalist.
    I can’t believe that would even have to be explained, but the cat is home to the most clueless leftists on the internet.

    Sinclair believes in freedom of speech and conscience – and he means it.

    No no, more about you Petey.

    Do you take a taxpayer salary?

    Ergh, you don’t know what “free speech” is anymore than you know what “capitalist” or “right wing” is.
    You’re posts are just insanity. But then so are so many here. Just clueless leftists and cranks on what is advertised as a right wing blog.

  116. Oh come on

    Being a NeverTrumper is perfectly consistent with being a right winger and capitalist.

    Perhaps so, Limpy, but that’s not you. If you saw an opportunity to criticise Trump for being a capitalist, you’d take it. If you saw an opportunity to criticise Trump from the left, you’d take it. As I said earlier, you have no consistent principles. You are solely motivated by the belief that Orange Man Bad. You will criticise him on the basis of anything.

    Dot, our wires are crossed. I’m not offended.

  117. Frank Walker from National Tiles

    Ergh, you don’t know what “free speech” is anymore than you know what “capitalist” or “right wing” is.

    Horseshit. I agree with you in principle, you don’t like Sinclair applying his own rules and declare that I don’t understand free speech.

    Get your head outta your arse.

  118. Tel

    Iampeter explain your excellent political strategy for Australia … you know, the really right wing strategy.

    We have been waiting all this time for you to help us out, so please try to focus at a time like this. Don’t worry about Frank … he’s a nice guy, but he gets muddled easily … so you just have to simplify it.

  119. Frank Walker from National Tiles

    I am peter might be the only real conservative and libertarian in Australia.

    He carries the weight of the world on his shoulders, and he’s off to save the world.

  120. mh

    Tel
    #3113393, posted on July 22, 2019 at 9:05 pm
    Iampeter explain your excellent political strategy for Australia … you know, the really right wing strategy.

    Not sure you want to be asking Peter about Australia. He told us recently that Scott Morrison was “head of state”.

  121. Iampeter

    Perhaps so, Limpy, but that’s not you. If you saw an opportunity to criticise Trump for being a capitalist, you’d take it.

    No.

    Horseshit. I agree with you in principle, you don’t like Sinclair applying his own rules and declare that I don’t understand free speech.

    Nope.

    I am peter might be the only real conservative and libertarian in Australia.

    Um, no. I oppose conservatives and most libertarians because I oppose the left.

    Iampeter explain your excellent political strategy for Australia … you know, the really right wing strategy.

    Why don’t you actually contribute something to the discussion. What do you agree with? What do you disagree with?

    Come on, you’re a brilliant political mind, Tel. What about Palmer? What about the balance of power? Other political sounding phrases!

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