C.L. : Sequel flops at the box office

The Ukrainian impeachment hoax is over and Donald Trump won. What was that – about 48 hours? Panic must have flooded Nancy Pelosi’s office like cortisol in the veins of Corn Pop when the President breezily announced he would release the unredacted transcript of his conversation with Volodymyr Zelensky. The result is not merely a nothing burger but a nothing meal for Democrats. Trump supersized their order with a free nothing cola, nothing fries and a slice of nothing pie. In a staggeringly stupid replay of the Russian interference hoax, the Democrats sought to cover up their own crimes by directing the media to look instead at the President’s response to the egregious treason committed by one of their own: on this occasion, Joe Biden on behalf of his misfit son, Hunter. It’s like somebody in Hollywood decided to remake Waterworld.

By now, the parallels between the Russian and Ukraine cons are more amusing than enraging. Both involved high level Democrat collusion with foreign powers to benefit senior party aristocrats (both self-appointed heirs to Barack Obama). Both involved large amounts of gratuitous payola finding its way into family accounts. For both principals, when revelations about illegal conduct loomed – owing to the unforeseen failure of their national campaigns – thus imperiling what remained of their ambitions, “sources” and “whistleblowers” (meaning Democrat Hiroo Onodas in the administration) got word to journalists to start framing Donald Trump for their sins. Alas and incredibly, as Vice-President, Joe Biden boasted – on camera – of making Ukraine an offer it couldn’t refuse in relation to aid monies and a troublesome prosecutor threatening his son’s shady ‘business’ associates. As Secretary of State, Hillary Clinton also boasted on camera of her loyalty to Russia. On that occasion she stopped just short of doing for foreign minister Sergei Lavrov what Monica Lewinsky did for her husband.

When the senior Biden christened his boy, he could not have known Hunter’s prey in adulthood would be cocaine, his dead brother’s wife and dirty money paid by a Ukrainian gas company. And that points to another parallel between these two fake narratives: the sheer weirdness of the families involved. The Bidens alone make the Kardashians look like the von Trapps. There is a reason President Trump keeps winning and it isn’t complicated: his opponents and their media servants are pathologically odd and they lie all the time as a matter of policy. There was a time when the big lie plays would have worked too; back when the electorate saw only the occasional hard copy headline or crawling chyron every few days. Now, the lies never last and the repudiations – like the Zelensky letter – are available for all to see in mere hours.

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199 Responses to C.L. : Sequel flops at the box office

  1. stackja

    Dems keep making DT great.

  2. Tim Neilson

    All true, C.L, but there’s the “mist” element that other commenters have noted.

    That is, even though each allegation is revealed to be ludicrous to anyone who looks, because they’re incessant, vague and numerous, they create an impression that there’s something wrong.

    And that’s all that’s intended. The Dems want ordinary voters to have a vague impression that there are some unanswered allegations against Trump that the voter just can’t quite remember, but feels must be there because there’s been such a lot of media fuss.

    The orange God-Emperor is more likely to be able to defeat that tactic than any other politician I can think of, but he shouldn’t be underestimating the rat cunning of his opponents (and I’m sure he isn’t).

  3. mh

    Tomato meter 85% , American audience 28%

  4. Tintarella di Luna

    And yet the Bezos Bulletin headline is Trump-Zelensky readout is devastating indictment of our president (at least they now say ‘our’)

  5. Bruce of Newcastle

    You have to think some analyst in the DNC would have vetted this strategy before going with it. The Biden scandal is so clear and obvious. Biden even bragged about stiff-arming Ukraine to protect his kid. On video!

    Either the entire DNC brains trust is wasted by too much weed or they did it for a reason.

    The obvious reason is to ease Joe out of the primaries without him going rogue.

    And the idea of Joe going rogue with the IG report and Durham in the background would be sufficiently horrendous for the Dems to do almost anything to avoid it. Could you imagine what would happen if the VP from the Obama years did a deal to squeal for immunity? It would be the biggest political event since Charles I was separated from both his kingship and his noggin.

  6. Arky

    It might be entertaining to read a post like this, but no different than you can hear on Fox, on on the flip side, on CNN.
    I would like an actual analysis of what happened. A timeline of all relevant events plus an outline of the actual laws involved. Good luck getting that with everyone taking one side or the other.
    I would like the same done with the Biden allegations.
    None if this is being taken seriously and the media has completely abdicated it’s role.

  7. stackja

    Tim – Voters who trust Dems can expect ruin.

  8. Arky

    It is possible that President Trump attempted to leverage military aid in order to have something ready in case Biden was his opponent.
    I can’t tell, because the reporting is shit.
    It is possible he did this, and it breaks some laws, I can’t tell, because the reporting is shit.
    It is possible he did this, but it did not break any laws, I can’t tell because the reporting is shit.
    It is possible the timeline of events clears Trump, I can’t tell because the reporting is shit.
    It is possible that at this time nothing can be determined for certain, I can’t tell because the reporting is shit.
    And exactly the same goes for Biden.

  9. stackja

    Arky – MSM reporting since 1960s.

  10. Roger

    ABC still running with it.

  11. Bruce

    A couple of things NOT prominently broadcast on THEIR ABCess:

    Joe Biden’s son, Hunter Biden, joined the board of Ukrainian energy company Burisma in April 2014, according to RSB bank records. Hunter Biden had little background in energy. Over a 16-month period, Burisma paid $3.1 million to a bank account associated with Hunter’s business.

    Joe Biden led the Obama administration’s policy toward Ukraine when he served as vice president. Biden helped shape Ukraine’s energy and anti-corruption policies, issues that directly impact Burisma.

  12. littledozer

    Either the entire DNC brains trust is wasted by too much weed or they did it for a reason.

    If you read this its probably what is going on here.

    https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2019/09/25/its-not-about-biden-deep-state-response-to-ukraine-call-now-makes-sense-trump-questioned-crowdstrike/

  13. C.L.

    Arky, believe it or not I read dozens of articles on the things I write about and won’t draw conclusions until I’m convinced of how a story or, in this, case a ‘scandal’ will pan out.
    This is an obvious con and it’s already dead in the water.
    If various particulars of the affair interest you, Google is a click away.

  14. Karabar

    Arky
    If you had been following Qanon, you would have read months ago that this trap was being prepared, and Nancy jumped right into it, or was pushec by the squad.

  15. C.L.

    If you read this its probably what is going on here.

    That makes little sense.
    If Crowdstrike is the key to unlocking Democrat criminality during the first hoax, why would they want to draw attention to it?

  16. Roger

    A couple of things NOT prominently broadcast on THEIR ABCess

    Go fishing for Trump, catch a Biden instead:

    Hunter Biden was on the board of Ukraine gas company Burisma at the time a prosecutor was set to investigate Burisma for losing $1.8 billion in aid funding. Joe Biden took a trip to Ukraine and later bragged about getting the prosecutor fired. Unlike Trump, Biden did pressure Ukraine, telling then-President Petro Poroshenko he would withhold a $1 billion loan unless Poroshenko fired the prosecutor. Biden actually bragged about the quid pro quo, seemingly implicating former President Barack Obama in the deal.

    More here.

  17. candy

    Perhaps Ms Pelosi organised it to rid herself of Biden to make way for the Indian lady, or she felt that Biden is a total loss and has to go.
    The incident seems to have come of the blue? like they were scrolling for something on Biden?

  18. Fisky

    Hey m0nster, I think we found a new hobby for you to waste the next 2 years of your life on!

  19. egg_

    Perhaps Ms Pelosi organised it to rid herself of Biden to make way for the Indian lady, or she felt that Biden is a total loss and has to go.
    The incident seems to have come of the blue? like they were scrolling for something on Biden?

    Swapping Grey Beard for Blood Eye?

  20. Louis Hissink

    Isn’t the first rule in propaganda to accuse your opponent of your own crimes ? Chronic case of feet shooting.

  21. Mother Lode

    On that occasion she stopped just short of doing for foreign minister Sergei Lavrov what Monica Lewinsky did for her husband.

    Yes.

    Close, but no cigar.

  22. littledozer

    If Crowdstrike is the key to unlocking Democrat criminality during the first hoax, why would they want to draw attention to it?

    Fair point, I haven’t seen Crowdstrike mentioned except at CTH. Is there any attention on the Crowdstrike issue?

    When Trump mentions favour its in relation to Crowdstrike, the Biden bit is thrown in as the “other thing” clearly a secondary consideration.

    Maybe they aren’t drawing attention to it per se but the threat of investigation inspired a last ditch effort at removing Trump?

    In a staggeringly stupid replay of the Russian interference hoax,

    Agreed, suggests the same people to me. The leaker whistleblower only had hearsay information.

  23. Arky

    It wasn’t a criticism of you, CL, but if you are going to write a piece then in the comments section tell me to google the topic, what is the point of your piece? So now I know how you “feel” about Biden.
    Fuck off you idiot.

  24. Arky

    Seriously mate.
    If you write something that has no more content than I can see myself in ten minutes of Tucker, then just add your feelings, then tell me to use google, you can fuck right off.

  25. FelixKruell

    when the President breezily announced he would release the unredacted transcript of his conversation with Volodymyr Zelensky

    When do we get to see this unredacted transcript?

  26. The United States and the Ukraine signed a Treaty when the President was William Jefferson Clinton to cooperate on investigating criminal matters that had mutual connections.

    President Trump was entirely correct in asking if the Ukraine Government had information on Crowdstrike, the outfit that was supposed to have investigated the supposed Ukrainian hacking of the DNC computer.

  27. pete m

    Arky, this is a good take on the call.

    Biden camp will say prosecutor deserved to be axed.

    Trump will say you don’t threaten aid to get a political opponent axed. Especially when it also involves said opponent checking into your son.

    Here is the link to ny sun take tap

  28. Tim Neilson

    Tim – Voters who trust Dems can expect ruin.

    Yes. The danger is they’ll take the rest of the USA with them. If it wasn’t for that I’d see it as a kind of socio-political Darwinism and be all in favour of it.

  29. mizaris

    Hey m0nster, I think we found a new hobby for you to waste the next 2 years of your life on!

    Beat me to it Fisky. Wondering where munty was myself.

  30. Infidel Tiger

    Even a blockhead like Arky should be able to understand this:

    https://twitter.com/KimStrassel/status/1176865141574340608

  31. Frank Walker from National Tiles

    Where are the Mueller indictments?

    monty?

    Bueller?

  32. FelixKruell

    Still waiting on that unredacted transcript CL…

  33. Tim Neilson

    Still waiting on that unredacted transcript CL…

    notafan
    #3168035, posted on September 26, 2019 at 2:25 pm
    Read the transcript of Donald Trump’s call with Volodymyr Zelensky

    Do you want a hard copy posted to you Felix?

  34. notafan

    Was up on the SBS website 7 hours ago!

  35. FelixKruell

    So little attention to detail here…

    What was released was not a transcript. And not unredacted.

    It was:

    CAUTION: A Memorandum of a Telephone Conversation.· (TELCON) is not a verbatim transcript of a discussion. The text in this document records the notes and recollections of Situation Room Duty “Officers and-NSC policy staff assigned t_o listen.and memorialize the conversation in written form as the conversation takes place. A numper of factors can affect ‘the accuracy of the reco�d, including poor telecommunications connections and variations in accent and/or interpretation.
    The word “inaudible” is used to indifate portions of a conversation that the notetaker was unable to hear.

  36. The Beer Whisperer

    Trump is brilliant.

    He got the Dumbocrats to demand the transcript, which as expected, contains nothing of substance except diartibes against Dumbocrats for being corrupt and stupid, thus revealing there corruptedness and stupidness with the whole world watching.

    It’s just about the biggest own goal of all time.

  37. notafan

    So show us where the record is marked ‘inaubible’ etc

    you just want to pretend that something is not there

  38. The Beer Whisperer

    FelixKruell
    #3168105, posted on September 26, 2019 at 3:40 pm
    So little attention to detail here…

    What was released was not a transcript. And not unredacted.

    Straws, grasping.

    Nothing can change the obvious fact that Trump baited the idiots to commence impeachment proceedings without evidence and it blew up in their faces big time.

    They literally drew attention to a conversation which completely and utterly trashes them.

    It’s literally the biggest rake ever built.

  39. Arky

    Arky, this is a good take on the call

    ..
    Pete.
    I’m not after someones take.
    That is my complaint.
    I’m not bagging CL here (until he told me to go goggle).
    I have read the five page transcript. Three times.
    I have listened to about twenty hours of coverage from both sides.
    It is all woeful and partisan.
    Now I understand that after the Mueller report “our” side is all “you can piss right off with any more of these politically motivated investigations”.
    That is my reaction too.
    But I take it everyone here wants Biden and Kerry and Obama throughly investigated?
    I do.
    Well you don’t get that without all the facts about this being investigated, including wether Trump was looking to lay the groundwork for a gotcha once Biden was the opponent for 2020.
    Now you can dismiss that possibility as much as you like and go Biden Biden Biden all the way till the cows come home. After all that is what those in the other bubble do with Trump Trump Trump.
    Until a through timeline is laid out of all these events you can’t know.
    You are not anywhere near on the homestretch on this.
    There is the first phone call when the Ukrainian was elected president. There is Guiliani. There is the exact timings of when aid was granted or suspended and correspondence as to why.
    And then there is Biden and Kerry. In the Ukraine and in China.
    Everything must come out.
    I think Trump will be OK.
    But the raising of investigating Biden’s kid directly after a request for military purchase. That was either clumsy, stupid or possibly nefarious. No matter how bloody obvious Biden wrong doing might look at this point, Trump should not be in this at all. What the hell is his justice dept doing, what the hell is the senate doing?

  40. Infidel Tiger

    There are no verbatim transcripts. These releases are the most accurate account you will get.

    Distraction squirrel from broken leftists.

  41. JC

    FelixKruell
    #3168089, posted on September 26, 2019 at 3:15 pm

    Still waiting on that unredacted transcript CL…

    That will never be released for a host of national security reasons. If you believe it’s a dishonest portrayal then explain why.

  42. The Beer Whisperer

    Can we have a new Catallaxianism for this?

    Impeachment grade rake 😁

  43. FelixKruell

    Notafan:

    So show us where the record is marked ‘inaubible’ etc

    You missed the point. It’s not a verbatim transcript. Even when not marked inaudible.

  44. FelixKruell

    Jc:

    That will never be released for a host of national security reasons. If you believe it’s a dishonest portrayal then explain why.

    CL claims it already has been released. So which is it?

  45. FelixKruell

    Infidel:

    There are no verbatim transcripts. These releases are the most accurate account you will get.

    That may well be the case. Especially if we don’t get to hear from the whistleblower…

  46. JC

    CL claims it already has been released. So which is it?

    Okay, lets play this game. Ignore CL and answer my comment. If it’s a dishonest portrayal explain how or STFU.

  47. Infidel Tiger

    This is as good as it gets, you poor broken man.

    Sorry it didn’t work out this time. You’ll get that roadrunner one day.

  48. notafan

    Note: The words released by the White House recounting Mr. Trump’s conversation with Mr. Zelensky look like a transcript, but the document is marked, Memorandum of Telephone Conversation, and it warns that it is not a verbatim account. Instead, it was “developed with assistance from voice recognition software along with experts and note takers listening.”

    no doubt because there in no um ahh um

    So what?

  49. Bruce of Newcastle

    The official document of the conversation is given here by Scribd insert. There are no redactions, only previous security levels crossed out.

  50. Infidel Tiger

    Sean Davis

    Verified account

    @seanmdav

    Transcript Truthers are the Birthers of Pizzagaters.

    They’re about an hour away from demanding the long-form transcript birth certificate.

  51. Arky

    What was released was not a transcript. And not unredacted.

    ..
    So what?
    That is the only evidence left from that conversation.
    The exact sequence of events from when military aid was first offered, the new president of Ukraine elected through to when the President became aware that his calls were leaked are the relevant facts. And have not been outlined anywhere I can find.
    Both sides have been planning and spinnning hard on this with the aim of firing up their bases for 2020.
    The entire media is in the bag for one side or the other.
    You will need to make an active effort to get the entire story.
    Stop being sheep and make an effort.

  52. Infidel Tiger

    Sean Davis

    Verified account

    @seanmdav

    Transcript Truthers are the Birthers of Piz zagaters.

    They’re about an hour away from demanding the long-form transcript birth certificate.

  53. dover_beach

    Distraction squirrel from broken leftists.

    Indeed, and so far as the ‘whisteblower’ is concerned, “The IG’s review found “some indicia of an arguable political bias on the part of the Complainant in favor of a rival political candidate”.

    Dear oh dear.

  54. Ƶĩppʯ (ȊꞪꞨV)

    Beat me to it Fisky. Wondering where munty was myself.

    lecturing his insulin resistant cells to ingest more doughnuts

  55. Bruce of Newcastle

    Maybe Trump should have a conversation with the Prime Minister of Kenya too?
    A few tweets afterwards and there’d be at least a month of entertainment.

  56. dover_beach

    As Sohrab Ahmari wonders, what exactly was Hunter Biden doing on the board of a Ukrainian energy company for 50K a month? Zero concern from our corrupt media.

  57. dover_beach

    Couldn’t have had anything to do with his dad being VP of the USA. No, no, don’t be silly.

  58. notafan

    The official document of the conversation is given here by Scribd insert. There are no redactions, only previous security levels crossed out.

    Dosn’t matter BoN

    it isn’t good enough

    even if 45 were to release a recording there would be but but buts

  59. Rebel with cause

    Trump signalling that he will wipe the floor with Joe Biden.

  60. FelixKruell

    JC:

    Okay, lets play this game. Ignore CL and answer my comment. If it’s a dishonest portrayal explain how or STFU.

    No idea if it’s dishonest. I wasn’t on the call.

    We have a whistleblower though, who might be able to shed more light.

  61. FelixKruell

    Arky:

    So what?
    That is the only evidence left from that conversation.

    So CL asserted there was an unredacted transcript. That’s my point.

  62. thefrollickingmole

    Felix is challenging the veracity of every court transcript, reporters shorthand notes or conference notes ever taken.

    Because “Might not be verbatim”.

    Felix knows ‘baten
    Hes a master ‘bater.

  63. Dr Fred Lenin

    The student activites who run the DNC are no match for Trump , he is streets ahead of them ,he is used to dealing with the toughest meanest hugriest bastards on the planet , New york bankers ,realtors and construction unions and contactors , these people would chew up the clever politicians of DNC and spit them out like fish bones, they probably own a lot of them , Tammany Hall has a traditional bribe taking ethis ,it is probably still endemic .

  64. jupes

    It is possible that President Trump attempted to leverage military aid in order to have something ready in case Biden was his opponent.

    Even if this is true, the “something ready” will be evidence of real corruption.

  65. C.L.

    What was released is being called a memorandum or summary of a transcript.
    Or just ‘the transcript.’
    It is exactly what was demanded – to the extent that those who called for those specific passages to be released find themselves with nowhere to go.
    As the paramount executive authority, Trump has every right to ask Ukraine to investigate established criminality in relation to both the Russia hoax and a former Vice-President running a pay-for-play racket on behalf of his son.

    The bottom line: the hoax is dead on arrival. The real story is the Biden family accepting bribes from Eastern Europe and China. That’s the story they’re trying to swamp.

  66. FelixKruell

    Frolicking:

    Felix is challenging the veracity of every court transcript, reporters shorthand notes or conference notes ever taken.

    Court transcripts? No. Those things are written as transcripts by independent third parties.

    Reporter and conference note takers? Hell yes. It’s like board minutes that leave out all the juicy stuff.

  67. Frank Walker from National Tiles

    You’re trying too hard Felix.

  68. stackja

    C.L. – The swamp trying to swamp DT, to save the swamp? I couldn’t agree more.

  69. FelixKruell

    CL:

    What was released is being called a memorandum or summary of a transcript.
    Or just ‘the transcript.’

    Only by those, like you, who are pretending it’s an actual unredacted transcript.

    The document itself describes itself more accurately.

    As the paramount executive authority, Trump has every right to ask Ukraine to investigate established criminality in relation to both the Russia hoax and a former Vice-President running a pay-for-play racket on behalf of his son.

    Not if it amounts to a campaign finance law violation. That’s the true bottom line.

  70. JC

    We have a whistleblower though, who might be able to shed more light.

    I’m calling that a concession. If the traitorous piece of shit ( who you call a whistleblower) had anything that differed it would have been front page news yesterday afternoon on CNN, as the transcript came out in the morning.

    Kruell, STFU as you’re making yourself look moronic.

  71. JC

    Not if it amounts to a campaign finance law violation. That’s the true bottom line.

    It doesn’t. Please shut up.

  72. JC

    Campaign finance laws deal with financing campaigns, you dildo.

  73. C.L.

    It is possible that President Trump attempted to leverage military aid in order to have something ready in case Biden was his opponent.

    Nope. The transcript shows he didn’t – and that is accepted. He asked the Ukrainians to assist Rudy Giuliani in his investigation; he didn’t ask the Ukrainians to conduct an investigation of their own. They had run an earlier investigation into Hunter Biden’s associates but this was shut down by Vice President Biden – who boasted about doing so on camera.

  74. Arky

    Not if it amounts to a campaign finance law violation. That’s the true bottom line.

    ..
    Instead of repeating cable TV talking point, find, copy and paste the relevant legislation, then point out how it might have been broken.
    Then do the same for Biden.

  75. John of Mel

    C.L.

    That makes little sense.
    If Crowdstrike is the key to unlocking Democrat criminality during the first hoax, why would they want to draw attention to it?

    Because they didn’t know what exactly DJT talked about on that call?
    The mysterious whistle-blower has a second-hand recollection of the conversation. Which makes it possible that it was leaked distorted on-purpose either to out more leakers in the WH or to set the trap for the Democrats (or both).

  76. Percy Popinjay

    I want to see an unredacted transcript of the showdown between Joey B and Corn Pop.

  77. Twostix

    Weird how podestas and bidens and clintons were crawling all over Ukraine energy companies right at the same time as podestas and bidens and clintons were using the state dept to stage a coup there.

  78. Arky

    he didn’t ask the Ukrainians to conduct an investigation of their own

    ..
    This isn’t asking them to investigate?

    “I would like you to do us a favour… I would like you to find out…”

    ..
    Isn’t find out a synonym for investigate?
    This is what I am talking about. You have to make an effort to get away from your own sides narrative. When you do, you can try to see the whole picture. When we do, I am pretty sure Trump comes out OK.
    But don’t think that there is nothing there.

  79. John of Mel

    The Intelligence Community Inspector General (ICIG) Michael K Atkinson is the official who accepted the premise of a hearsay ‘whistle-blower‘ complaint.
    The Dept. of Justice Office of Legal Counsel rebuked Atkinson’s interpretation of his responsibility in regards to the complaint.
    In 2016 Atkinson was the Senior Counsel to the Assistant Attorney General of the National Security Division of the Department of Justice (DOJ-NSD). That makes Atkinson senior legal counsel to John Carlin and Mary McCord who were the former heads of the DOJ-NSD in 2016 when the “stop Trump” operation was underway. Which might explain his motivation behind handling this complain.

  80. C.L.

    Only by those, like you, who are pretending it’s an actual unredacted transcript.

    No, it’s being called a summary, a memorandum or just “the transcript” everywhere. There is nobody reputable positing a new conspiracy theory about secret passages.

    Vice-President Biden illegally caused to be shut down an investigation into his drug-addled, bribe-taking son (on camera) and Trump requested Ukraine assist Giuliani to establish what went on.

    It will be recalled that Democrats investigated Donald Trump Jr over a meeting in Trump Tower – which turned out to be yet another air burger. Even left-wing journalists, however, acknowledge that Hunter Biden was being paid bags of money to curry favour with the VP of the United States. When Ukrainian authorities took action, Joe Biden forced them not to interfere with the continued payment of those monies to the Biden family.

  81. FelixKruell

    JC:

    Campaign finance laws deal with financing campaigns, you dildo.

    Yes it does. You get a sticker.

    Now, try and think. Is there such a campaign on foot now?

  82. FelixKruell

    Arky:

    Instead of repeating cable TV talking point, find, copy and paste the relevant legislation, then point out how it might have been broken.
    Then do the same for Biden.

    Sure. 52 U.S. Code § 30121. Contributions and donations by foreign nationals

    (a) ProhibitionIt shall be unlawful for—
    (1)…; or
    (2) a person to solicit, accept, or receive a contribution or donation described in subparagraph (A) or (B) of paragraph (1) from a foreign national.

    Soliciting political dirt or information, can be a form of contribution. As Mueller found. Trump in his call solicited such information from the Ukraine. And has since described that as his intention too. Sounds like enough you justify an investigation…

    As for Biden, I have no idea. But if you think he’s guilty of the same, then explain why.

  83. Gab

    This latest impeach-o-rama really damaged Trump’s chances at the next election. Poor Donald, in the hours since the impeach’r’us mob made their announcement, Trump’s campaign raised $5 million .

    Please. Demrats, please continue.

  84. FelixKruell

    CL:

    No, it’s being called a summary, a memorandum or just “the transcript” everywhere. There is nobody reputable positing a new conspiracy theory about secret passages.

    Yet you didn’t even use those terms. You called it an ‘unredacted transcript’. And when called out on it, you show your disdain for the truth. It’s not a transcript. And it’s not unredacted. It is by its very nature redacted.

    As for Biden, if he’s done those things, he should be investigated and tried. But it’s interesting that you damn him with less evidence than we saw about Trump today.

  85. Tel

    Not if it amounts to a campaign finance law violation. That’s the true bottom line.

    So let me get this straight … there’s evidence of blatant corruption … and the President wants this investigated because you know he swore an oath to support and defend the US Constitution … but if it should turn out to be actual corruption, that would be an unfair disadvantage to Trump’s opponents who seem to be behaving as if they are indeed corrupt.

    Oh yeah … and campaign finance law.

    Did I miss anything important there? I’m struggling to understand this.

  86. calli

    We don’t need m0nty any more.

  87. Tel

    Could you imagine what would happen if the VP from the Obama years did a deal to squeal for immunity? It would be the biggest political event since Charles I was separated from both his kingship and his noggin.

    If one of the top security prisons was unable to keep a relatively healthy Pea Dough File alive for more than a few weeks, then it’s unlikely that an old man suffering from regular confusion and bleedy eyes would last long enough to testify. The whole thing would be over much quicker than Charles I and with less ceremony.

  88. Arky

    Why did you redact the section?
    Jesus. They really do do what they accuse others of.
    Here is the entire law:
    ..

    It shall be unlawful for–

    (1)  a foreign national, directly or indirectly, to make–

    (A)  a contribution or donation of money or other thing of value, or to make an express or implied promise to make a contribution or donation, in connection with a Federal, State, or local election;

    (B)  a contribution or donation to a committee of a political party;  or

    (C)  an expenditure, independent expenditure, or disbursement for an electioneering communication (within the meaning of section 30104(f)(3) of this title);  or

    (2)  a person to solicit, accept, or receive a contribution or donation described in subparagraph (A) or (B) of paragraph (1) from a foreign national

    ..
    The point being, the bit you left out, is IN CONNECTION WITH AN ELECTION.
    You have to prove that President Trump was doing it to gain an advantage in an election.
    This is why you need an entire timeline of events.
    If he did not or could not use this information in an election, it is irrelevant.

  89. JC

    According to Kruell, you can now be absolved of any criminal act by simply running as a candidate for the presidency.

    This is going swimmingly.

    Even more absurdly, seeing Trump is also a candidate , it absolves him of anything illegal… because he;s a declared candidate too.

    I’ve seen really stupid arguments, but this one is up there at the top.

    I think we’re done here.

  90. Arky

    In other words, there are many reasons why one world leader might ask another to investigate one of their own citizens, even a political opponent.
    Even though the optics might be bad, which is why Trump should have avoided it, there are possible acceptable reasons to do it.

  91. mh

    I think we’re done here.

    Yep. I think there are comments on here from people looking for attention only.

    Sad.

  92. Frank Walker from National Tiles

    JC
    #3168293, posted on September 26, 2019 at 6:30 pm

    According to Kruell, you can now be absolved of any criminal act by simply running as a candidate for the presidency.

    This is going swimmingly.

    Even more absurdly, seeing Trump is also a candidate , it absolves him of anything illegal… because he;s a declared candidate too.

    I’ve seen really stupid arguments, but this one is up there at the top.

    I think we’re done here.

    What a beclowning of Felix.

    Solid gold, JC.

    Felix had so much more potential greatness above that of house troll.

  93. FelixKruell

    Tel:

    So let me get this straight … there’s evidence of blatant corruption

    No, there’s a right wing conspiracy theory around it. No evidence yet. But if trump thought there was, he could ask the doj or the fbi to investigate. Before he tried to solicit information from the Ukraine, as a favour. And without needing to send his personal lawyer along.

  94. FelixKruell

    Arky:

    Why did you redact the section?

    Because those sections make the foreigner guilty, not the president.

    Oh and sub (B) doesn’t require an election.

  95. FelixKruell

    JC:

    According to Kruell, you can now be absolved of any criminal act by simply running as a candidate for the presidency.

    Care to quote where I said anything like that. At all? Making shit up again?

  96. FelixKruell

    Arky:

    Even though the optics might be bad, which is why Trump should have avoided it, there are possible acceptable reasons to do it.

    Agree. That’s why it needs to be investigated. Together with whatever the whistleblower has to add.

    To repeat – the call summary on its own merely justified an investigation. Not impeachment.

  97. Beachcomber

    There was a time when the big lie plays would have worked too; back when the electorate saw only the occasional hard copy headline or crawling chyron every few days. Now, the lies never last and the repudiations – like the Zelensky letter – are available for all to see in mere hours.

    I’m not so sure. The ABC-TASS media are running all-out for the attack on Trump for abuse of power. The corruption of the Democrat Bidens has disappeared into the leftist media black hole of cover ups.

    Fake news with complete disregard for the truth. It’s the only news that many people see and it still works.

  98. Beachcomber

    Just to be clear. In the ABC-TASS media world blatant Democrat Biden corruption is OK and not to commented on. Requesting help to investigate the Democrat corruption is criminal and impeachable.

  99. C.L.

    Beach, polls continue to show the US public has no trust at all in their media.
    The standing of the media has declined even further over the past four years. This is the big mistake in crying wolf as often as the Democrats have. Nobody listens to them any more. When you accuse the President of the United States of being urinated upon by prostitutes, you can never recover from that.

  100. JC

    Care to quote where I said anything like that. At all? Making shit up again?

    Every comment you’ve posted here has been reaching to that, you dildo.

    As I said, we’re done here.

  101. C.L.

    It wasn’t a criticism of you, CL.

    You can criticise me whenever you like, Arko. I deserve it.
    We’re good, my friend.

  102. Gavin R Putland

    Dear Cats,

    Trump is flogging a dead horse. Warren is now the Donkeys’ front-runner:
    https://www.businessinsider.com.au/warren-surges-ahead-of-biden-looking-like-2020-democratic-frontrunner-2019-9

    #JustSaying.

  103. Beachcomber

    When you accuse the President of the United States of being urinated upon by prostitutes, you can never recover from that.

    Well, when you put it that way……. I hope you’re right C.L.

  104. Frank Walker from National Tiles

    Warren is really hard left.

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/zackfriedman/2019/06/17/elizabeth-warren-student-loan-debt-forgiveness/#7f2258b05e7b

    The possible justification is that the loans were predatory, along with the Colleges.

  105. Bruce of Newcastle

    Trump is flogging a dead horse. Warren is now the Donkeys’ front-runner:

    Pocahontas? Speaking Bull will have her work cut out. Voters know Liawatha very well already.

    Gavin – Trump wants Warren to be the candidate. He doesn’t want Joe who has valiantly tried to stay within cheroot spitting distance of the centre, unlike her.

    Remember that one reason why the DNC undercut Bernie was that he was a bonkers lefty who came across as honest. Warren is a bonkers lefty who doesn’t come across as honest.

    With Warren lefty blue collar men will stay home in droves (or vote Trump) as will black voters. I doubt Hispanics like a fake Indian much either.

  106. mh

    Warren is the most authentic.

    Which doesn’t say much for the others!

    😄 🍿

  107. Bruce of Newcastle

    Incidentally Bernie has blotted his record since the last election. Earning millions in book sales and deals whilst damning rich people will do that for you.

  108. Empire 5:5

    Go fishing for Trump, catch a Biden instead:

    Excellent summary, Bruce. There’s so much drivel upthread it’s embarrassing. Folks be mesmerised by manufactured narratives.

  109. FelixKruell

    JC:

    Every comment you’ve posted here has been reaching to that, you dildo.

    Then it should be easy for you to find one…Just one will do

  110. Empire 5:5

    With Warren lefty blue collar men will stay home in droves (or vote Trump) as will black voters. I doubt Hispanics like a fake Indian much either.

    Or these kind of Indians:
    https://youtu.be/W0tSE5wPPM8

    Probably the most epic intro 45 has ever received. Modi would be a great pro wrestling MC.

  111. Empire 5:5

    Gavin R Putland
    #3168406, posted on September 26, 2019 at 8:06 pm
    Dear Cats,

    Trump is flogging a dead horse. Warren is now the Donkeys’ front-runner:
    https://www.businessinsider.com.au/warren-surges-ahead-of-biden-looking-like-2020-democratic-frontrunner-2019-9

    #JustSaying.

    You’re missing the point. The objective isn’t the opposition candidate. Whoever that may be, it will be a controlled asset. The objective is to destroy the machine that sponsors them. That includes the DNC, MEC and Silicon Valley.

    Biden’s corruption is just a brick in the wall. That’s why you are being enticed to focus on the red dot. They are terrified folks will start contemplating the edifice.

  112. Arky

    You can criticise me whenever you like, Arko. I deserve it.
    We’re good, my friend.

    ..
    I’m a bit cranky.
    Sorry.

  113. Empire 5:5

    Feline is a fat lez sockie, right? There can be no other so obtuse.

  114. Empire 5:5

    C.L.

    A timely high quality short form analysis. More please.

  115. Jannie

    Biden was never a serious contender, front runner or not, too easy to laugh at. Maybe Kamala Harris or some other leftist loon outed him, who cares. Elizabeth Pocahantas Warren would be easy for Trump. Anybody is easy for Trump except maybe Tulsi Gabbard, and she is not in the inner democrat elite circle.

  116. Zatara

    Obtuse tactics, red herrings, and distraction squirrels….

    Has anyone ever seen munty and felix in the same room?

  117. Herodotus

    Since the original ploy has fallen on its face, they are now all going on about “the cover up”.
    Both the BBC and its mini-me ABC are on the case.

  118. Jannie:

    Biden was never a serious contender, front runner or not, too easy to laugh at. Maybe Kamala Harris or some other leftist loon outed him, who cares. Elizabeth Pocahantas Warren would be easy for Trump. Anybody is easy for Trump except maybe Tulsi Gabbard, and she is not in the inner democrat elite circle.

    Perhaps the odds of Queen Michelle being a surprise nomination “To Save The US” should start shortening. The effort put in to create a Race War has to have a payout somewhere.

  119. Iampeter

    So C.L. posts a thread, with the usual hilarious tone of authority, suggesting an “unredacted transcript” was released clearing Trump. But what was released was the highly redacted notes taken during the phone call.
    The redaction is totally legitimate, this being a conversation between presidents, but this of course doesn’t really prove anything one way or the other, so the whole point of this thread is wrong.
    When this is pointed out, C.L. doubles down. Typical Cat.

    But the bigger story is the total misreading of what is happening here by conservatives and Trump cultists.
    There is no doubt as to what Trump was doing here. Everybody knows.
    Just like there’s no doubt what the purpose of something like the Clinton Foundation is.
    It takes truly dishonest people to pretend that there’s a great mystery/conspiracy to “get the president” or something here.

    Whether or not there’s enough to impeach doesn’t really matter either since it’s highly doubtful democrats would be stupid enough to do so.
    They are much better off with republicans “running things” because they get a lot more of their policies passed this way.
    Only the hopeless, durr-hurr-durrs, of the conservative movement could categorize this setup as “brilliant” but then this is a movement of people who have no clue what’s going on.
    Also, democrats have a better chance winning the election running against Trump.
    Given his endless scandals and brazen corruption, the dems can run anyone against him and he will be the Hillary Clinton candidate no matter what.

    This is going to be a fun election season as conservatives oppose corrupt leftist democrats by supporting corrupt and leftist Trump.

  120. mh

    Iampeter joins the Hollywood celebs

    But the bigger story is the total misreading of what is happening here by conservatives and Trump cultists.
    There is no doubt as to what Trump was doing here. Everybody knows.

  121. mh

    Also, democrats have a better chance winning the election running against Trump.
    Given his endless scandals and brazen corruption, the dems can run anyone against him and he will be the Hillary Clinton candidate no matter what.

    😆

  122. Tom

    There is no doubt as to what Trump was doing here. Everybody knows.

    Bwahaha!!! Inside the mind of a demented leftard: they all “know” what Trump is doing. They’re all about as intelligent as retarded DNC conspiracy theorist Adam Schiff.

  123. Tel

    There is no doubt as to what Trump was doing here. Everybody knows.

    He was trying to get Joe Biden busted for being corrupt … draining the swamp like he promised to do.

  124. mh

    The House of Representatives is set to take a two-week “recess” vacation after announcing its so-called “impeachment inquiry” against President Donald Trump in response to him having a routine conversation with Ukraine President Volodymyr Zelensky.

    The Dems must have so much impeachment material to work with.

  125. Fisky

    lol I can see Iampeter is a Transcript Truther. Are there any Leftist positions you DON’T agree with Iampeter?

  126. Zatara

    There is no doubt as to what Trump was doing here. Everybody knows.

    You would have to be pretty dense not to. The man tells you right up front, then he does it.

    You might want to study up.

  127. C.L.

    The transcript is an unredacted copy of the exchange demanded by Democrats.
    Unfortunately for them, it exonerates Trump and the affair is now over.

    Trump had every right to ask Ukraine to cooperate with an investigation into the criminal activity of drug-addict and extortionist Hunter Biden.

    The dogs will bark for weeks but Trump’s caravan has already moved on.

  128. FelixKruell

    So the whistleblower complaint adds some interesting context, and raises some questions:

    1. Rudy Giuliani was involved in this, up to his neck. How does that gel with Trump simply asking the Ukrainians to help with a legitimate US government investigation? Giuliani works for trump. Not the US government.

    2. If this was just a routine request for assistance on a US government investigation into corruption, why was the call summary locked away in a classified system, rather than the usual record keeping system?

    3. The various meetings before and after the call between Trumps people and the Ukrainians give weight to the quid pro quo that was merely suggested during the call.

    Definitely enough here for a thorough investigation. But still well short of impeachment material.

  129. Infidel Tiger

    The “whistleblower” wasn’t even there!

    This is all secondhand info.

    Russia failed. Ukraine will fail. Maybe Estonia is worth a try.

  130. Infidel Tiger

    One thing I agree with though is that Giuliani is poison.

    Get rid of him.

  131. struth

    Iamananarchist embarrasses himself yet again.

  132. FelixKruell

    Infidel:

    The “whistleblower” wasn’t even there!

    True. But the inspector confirmed his second hand account with multiple first hand witnesses.

  133. Frank Walker from National Tiles

    But still well short of impeachment material.

    Finally some sanity.

  134. FelixKruell

    Frank:

    Finally some sanity.

    Only from my side I’m afraid. I made that point yesterday.

  135. classical_hero

    This was clearly a set up by the White House. How on earth could this have gotten out otherwise? They got the leaker to think that President Trump did something wrong so to get the media and Democrats to commit electoral suicide. They knew that there was nothing wrong with the phone call and they had evidence that they will show the corruption of the Biden family. Now we’re talking about the corruption of the previous administration that would have been off limits until this “whistleblower” came out.

    Remember that President Trump said that the leaks are real but the news is fake. The leak finder squad set up by the previous AG Sessions is working a treat.

  136. C.L.

    well short of impeachment

    Well it took 24 hours but thank you for acknowledging I’m right.

  137. stackja

    White House plumbers again?

  138. Iampeter

    The transcript is an unredacted copy of the exchange demanded by Democrats.
    Unfortunately for them, it exonerates Trump and the affair is now over.

    It’s a heavily redacted copy of notes taken during the call by those in attendance. It is not a “transcript” in the proper meaning and is not “unredacted.” This is probably all that there is in terms of record and it doesn’t exonerate Trump, it just doesn’t provide a smoking gun for further impeachment theater.

    Bwahaha!!! Inside the mind of a demented leftard:

    You seem confused. I’m not a Trump supporter.

    He was trying to get Joe Biden busted for being corrupt … draining the swamp like he promised to do.

    Yea and the Hillary Clinton Foundation is just a legit charity. You’re adorable.

    Are there any Leftist positions you DON’T agree with Iampeter?

    LOL! That’s what I’m asking YOU clueless leftards.

    You haven’t really figured out politics or where you and Trump supporters sit, have you Fisky?

  139. None

    Trump will not get impeached.
    Next.

  140. dover_beach

    CL, you are wrong. This died at the focus group screening stage and never made an official release.

  141. mh

    Liberty Quote
    The future does not belong to globalists. The future belongs to patriots. The future belongs to sovereign and independent nations who protect their citizens, respect their neighbors and honor the differences that make each country special and unique.

    — President Donald J Trump

  142. classical_hero

    The usual suspects are at it again. For them if President Trump cured cancer they’d find a way to criticise him.

  143. dover_beach

    Think of the mice, classical_hero.

  144. Fisky

    But Iampeter, from your supporting Hillary over Trump, to advocating Merkellian open borders, to raging for Trump’s impeachment, etc, there isn’t really any disagreement between you and the Left.

  145. FelixKruell

    cL:

    Well it took 24 hours but thank you for acknowledging I’m right.

    I’ve been making that point here since Wednesday. I see attention to detail isn’t a once-off problem with you…

  146. FelixKruell

    Classical:

    The usual suspects are at it again. For them if President Trump cured cancer they’d find a way to criticise him.

    Or, if Trump turned up at the kremlin with an Aldi bag full of $100 bills, loudly demanding Putin hack the Democratic Party servers for the 2020 election, I suspect I’d come on here and see Trump still being defended. Because he’s Trump. You have to ask yourselves – is there anything trump could do that would cause you to stop supporting him? Any laws he could break that would cost him your support?

    I am no fan of Trump. But I support several of his policies. I don’t like the way he denigrates the institutions of government, or the way he goes about being president. It’s uncouth, and disrespectful to the office. He also lies, constantly. I’m also no fan of the Democrats. But I see a nuanced position isn’t really understood here.

  147. dover_beach

    FelixK, there is nothing to be critical about Trump in this matter. Nothing at all.

  148. Mark A

    I don’t like the way he denigrates the institutions of government,

    Make those institutions behave as they should, i.e. act impartially, fairly and properly and then there would be no need to chastise them or as you put it “denigrate” them.

  149. Beachcomber

    Make those institutions behave as they should, i.e. act impartially, fairly and properly ……….

    Better still, shut them down! Too much government is destroying the West.

  150. FelixKruell

    Dover:

    FelixK, there is nothing to be critical about Trump in this matter. Nothing at all.

    Nothing? Nothing at all? Asking a foreign leader to help him with a matter that at the very least gives the president a personal benefit, even if it was truly as part of a legitimate government investigation into corruption? Asking that leader to coordinate with your personal lawyer, rather than the fbi or some actual government investigatory body? And doing so in the context where that leader might think military aid was tied to delivering on this favour?

    Wow…

    Even if we trust Trump did all of this for honourable intentions, the way he did should be criticised. And has been by plenty of republicans, and staff at the White House by the lengths they went to in order to supress the record of this conversation.

  151. FelixKruell

    Mark:

    Make those institutions behave as they should, i.e. act impartially, fairly and properly and then there would be no need to chastise them or as you put it “denigrate” them.

    He’s done the opposite. He demands personal loyalty from leaders of government institutions that are meant to be impartial. The DOJ. The FBI. The Federal Reserve. The EPA. The list goes on and on…

  152. dover_beach

    And doing so in the context where that leader might think military aid was tied to delivering on this favour?

    Today:

    Kenneth P. Vogel
    @kenvogel
    The Ukrainians weren’t made aware that the assistance was being delayed/reviewed until more than one month after the call.

    In other words, a nothingburger.

  153. FelixKruell

    Dover:

    The call included enough indications that future help was reliant on doing a favour. They didn’t need to know about the previous aid being held up.

    Is there anything trump has done or could do that you think would warrant criticism?

  154. dover_beach

    Sure, he’s been very lax on building the wall, for starters.

  155. C.L.

    LOL.
    Even if true … stop the presses!
    A US president makes cash payments contingent upon helping a US administration prior to an election! Gosh, that’s never happened before … Obama to my sarcasm: ‘Hold my beer.’

    State Dept. confirms $400 million Iran payment conditioned on prisoner release.

  156. Mark A

    FelixKruell
    #3169116, posted on September 27, 2019 at 3:38 pm

    Mark:

    Make those institutions behave as they should, i.e. act impartially, fairly and properly and then there would be no need to chastise them or as you put it “denigrate” them.

    He’s done the opposite. He demands personal loyalty from leaders of government institutions that are meant to be impartial. The DOJ. The FBI. The Federal Reserve. The EPA. The list goes on and on…

    You are talking nonsense, or are blinded by partisan views.

  157. FelixKruell

    CL:

    A US president makes cash payments contingent upon helping a US administration prior to an election! Gosh, that’s never happened before … Obama to my sarcasm: ‘Hold my beer.’

    Helping the administration/country? Sure. Helping the president personally? A new low.

  158. FelixKruell

    Mark:

    You are talking nonsense, or are blinded by partisan views.

    I’m basing that off trumps own words. His own tweets. Funny way to be blinded by partisan views.

  159. Mark A

    FelixKruell
    #3169152, posted on September 27, 2019 at 4:28 pm

    Mark:

    You are talking nonsense, or are blinded by partisan views.

    I’m basing that off trumps own words. His own tweets. Funny way to be blinded by partisan views.

    Sorry, in what way is Trump asking them to be subservient to him?
    So far all I could detect is that he is trying to compel them not to be the lackeys of the Dems, as they were and are at the moment.
    If you read the current situation differently then yes, you are being partisan.

  160. Iampeter

    But Iampeter, from your supporting Hillary over Trump, to advocating Merkellian open borders, to raging for Trump’s impeachment, etc, there isn’t really any disagreement between you and the Left

    Trump is just as left wing and corrupt, maybe even more so, than Hillary. Supporting Trump and his policies, regulating trade, immigration, trillion dollar spending bills, farm bailouts twice the size of the auto bailouts, etc, is left wing. Trump and his supporters are left wing. You are a left winger.

    Me opposing a leftist like Trump is NOT left wing. Me supporting things like rights-protecting government and capitalism, concepts you have no grasp of, is NOT left wing. These things all make me what’s called a “right winger.”

    Anyone who needs this explained to them doesn’t really understand politics.

    You are a politically illiterate leftist, Fisky.

  161. dover_beach

    It’s curious that an investigation blocked by Biden re his son’s obvious corrupt dealings only makes it into the news, even though Biden is on camera boasting about his leaning on the Ukrainians to stop it or bye bye US1B, because Trump says its OK to reopen the investigation.

  162. cohenite

    Trump is just as left wing and corrupt, maybe even more so, than Hillary.

    Anyone who writes and believes that is a fucking moron.

  163. Iampeter

    And another thing Fisky, just because I oppose Trump, doesn’t mean I support Hillary.
    This is another example of the child-like, baby-level, gasp of the subject that you have.

    Trump is just as left wing and corrupt, maybe even more so, than Hillary.
    Anyone who writes and believes that is a fucking moron.

    Yea because someone who wants to centrally plan the economy as much as Trump does is totally not a leftist.

    Like I said in that post, anyone finding such a statement to be so shocking, doesn’t know anything about politics.

  164. C.L.

    Helping the president personally? A new low.

    You don’t know much about American history, do you?
    I suggest you read one of the better biographies of Lyndon Johnson.

    The US President is executive supremo in their system; any favour (with contingent reward) likely to benefit the electoral standing of an incumbent and/or the national interest of the US may be seen as a personal favour. Such ‘personal favours’ have been purchased in one form or another for 200 years.

  165. cohenite

    centrally plan the economy as much as Trump does

    You’re either an idiot or taking the piss; Trump has deregulated the fucking economy; that’s why they have the best economy in the world and are energy sufficient.

  166. C.L.

    Marc A. Thiessen in the Washington Post:

    It got almost no attention, but in May, CNN reported that Sens. Robert Menendez (D-N.J.), Richard J. Durbin (D-Ill.) and Patrick J. Leahy (D-Vt.) wrote a letter to Ukraine’s prosecutor general, Yuriy Lutsenko, expressing concern at the closing of four investigations they said were critical to the Mueller probe. In the letter, they implied that their support for U.S. assistance to Ukraine was at stake. Describing themselves as “strong advocates for a robust and close relationship with Ukraine,” the Democratic senators declared, “We have supported [the] capacity-building process and are disappointed that some in Kyiv appear to have cast aside these [democratic] principles to avoid the ire of President Trump,” before demanding Lutsenko “reverse course and halt any efforts to impede cooperation with this important investigation.”

    So, it’s okay for Democratic senators to encourage Ukraine to investigate Trump, but it’s not okay for the president to allegedly encourage Ukraine to investigate Hunter Biden?

    And then there is Joe Biden. In 2016, the then-vice president threatened to withhold $1 billion in U.S. loan guarantees to Ukraine if the government did not fire the country’s top prosecutor, Viktor Shokin. According to the New York Times, “Among those who had a stake in the outcome was Hunter Biden … who at the time was on the board of an energy company owned by a Ukrainian oligarch who had been in the sights of the fired prosecutor general.” The Post reports that it is “unclear how seriously Shokin — who was under fire by U.S. and European officials for not taking a more aggressive posture toward corruption overall — was scrutinizing Burisma when he was forced out.” But what is clear is that Biden bragged about getting him fired, declaring last year: “I looked at them and said, ‘I’m leaving in six hours. If the prosecutor is not fired, you’re not getting the money.’ Well, son of a b—-. He got fired.”

    This weekend, Biden told reporters, “I have never spoken to my son about his overseas business dealings.” That is flatly untrue. Hunter admitted in an interview with the New Yorker that his father expressed concern about the Burisma post at least once: “Dad said, ‘I hope you know what you are doing,’ and I said, ‘I do.’” Moreover, the New Yorker reports that, “In December, 2015, as Joe Biden prepared to return to Ukraine, his aides braced for renewed scrutiny of Hunter’s relationship with Burisma. Amos Hochstein, the Obama Administration’s special envoy for energy policy, raised the matter with Biden.” That same month, the New York Times published an article about how Hunter’s business dealings in Ukraine undermined the vice president’s anti-corruption message, which quoted a Biden spokesman saying it had no impact.

    So, Biden was fully aware of his son’s involvement with Burisma when he pressured Ukraine to fire the prosecutor in 2016. He should have known that his using U.S. aid as leverage to force the prosecutor’s dismissal would create, at a bare minimum, the appearance of a conflict of interest. Federal ethics regulations require “all employees to recuse themselves from participating in an official matter if their impartiality would be questioned.” Biden violated these rules. Imagine if Trump pressured Ukraine to fire a prosecutor who was investigating a company that employed Donald Trump Jr. as a board member. No one would be giving Trump a pass.

  167. stackja

    C.L.
    #3169176, posted on September 27, 2019 at 4:58 pm

    Dems double standards as usual.

  168. Iampeter

    You’re either an idiot or taking the piss; Trump has deregulated the fucking economy; that’s why they have the best economy in the world and are energy sufficient.

    So you think an administration that is regulating trade, immigration, passing trillion dollar infrastructure bills, issuing billion dollar bailouts to victims of it’s own tariff policies, etc, is “deregulating the fucking economy?”

    You’re the kind of person that steps on a rake you were warned was there and then belligerently tells everyone laughing at you that you mean to do it, aren’t you?

  169. FelixKruell

    CL:

    That’s probably why they passed a law to stop it? Some time ago…but if you have any examples from the last few decades of another president purchasing personal favours, I’d love to hear about that sort of American history.

  170. JC

    Kruell

    Mr. Clinton also defended his pardon of Mr. Rich, the commodities trader who has lived in Switzerland for 17 years while facing charges of mail fraud, racketeering, income tax evasion and trading oil with Iran in violation of a trade embargo. Mr. Rich’s former wife, Denise, has given more than $1 million to the Clintons and Democratic causes.

    I think we’re done in this thread too.

  171. FelixKruell

    JC:

    And your link of the unredacted transcript showing that quid pro quo will follow shortly?

    Assuming it is, I think Clinton should also have been pursued and charged. But I take it you disagree? You’re fine with this?

  172. JC

    Kruell

    You’re a very stupid person. You asked CL to offer an example, which I did in substitute.

    No link. Do it yourself. You also appear not to understand what unredacted means.

  173. cohenite

    Why don’t you stick your rake up your arse; dickhead.

  174. So fucknuckle and 1amp have fizzled again?
    Too bad, so sad.

  175. Empire 5:5

    Between May 2018 and August 2019, the intelligence community secretly eliminated a requirement that whistleblowers provide direct, first-hand knowledge of alleged wrongdoings. This raises questions about the intelligence community’s behavior regarding the August submission of a whistleblower complaint against President Donald Trump. The new complaint document no longer requires potential whistleblowers who wish to have their concerns expedited to Congress to have direct, first-hand knowledge of the alleged wrongdoing that they are reporting.
    ——-
    The internal properties of the newly revised “Disclosure of Urgent Concern” form, which the intelligence community inspector general (ICIG) requires to be submitted under the Intelligence Community Whistleblower Protection Act (ICWPA), show that the document was uploaded on September 24, 2019, at 4:25 p.m., just days before the anti-Trump complaint was declassified and released to the public. The markings on the document state that it was revised in August 2019, but no specific date of revision is disclosed.

    https://thefederalist.com/2019/09/27/intel-community-secretly-gutted-requirement-of-first-hand-whistleblower-knowledge/

  176. Seco

    I’m still confused as to why everyone has to jump and investigate something every time a Deep State Hillary Booster finds the latest “scandal” to bring the walls supposedly caving in on Trump. It is clearly a tactic. The Democrats have done everything and much worse than they accuse Trump of and the media ran cover for them and didn’t bat an eyelid. Now EVERYTHING is an impeachable offence.

    You just hope there’s enough people outside of the Clinton Archipelago to see through this utter garbage.

  177. Seco

    But I support several of his policies. I don’t like the way he denigrates the institutions of government

    Government institutions in the US, just like here are run by left leaning partisan hacks. They’ve only themselves to blame as they’ve denigrated themselves. Trump is just the first person to point this out.

  178. Empire 5:5

    I’m still confused as to why everyone has to jump and investigate something every time a Deep State Hillary Booster finds the latest “scandal” to bring the walls supposedly caving in on Trump.

    To occupy the narrative. There’s bad news a plenty coming down the pipe. Every egregious lie buys days of media saturation. Days are better than hours, for them.

    The investigation into the tactics of the Russia Hoax (laundered intel>fake FISA) is wrapping up [Horowitz] with referred prosecutions ongoing [Huber]. The investigation into the origins of the Russia Hoax (the plan and perps) is underway [Durham]. POTUS has an unambiguous legal entitlement to defend himself during the impreachment* process by introducing evidence to the public. He also enjoys attorney-client privilege with Rudy.

    Of course the swamp cares not for the law. There will be a constitutional crisis. The legislature is exceeding its Article I powers and in doing so is obstructing POTUS from discharging his Article II responsibilities. That will place the microscope on the SC and it’s capacity to resolve the crisis and fulfil its Article III duty. National Security will be invoked by both sides, but only POTUS holds DECLAS power.

    It will be entertaining.

    * the process whereby a harassed POTUS defends himself from a dogmatic exhortation by a corrupt legislature.

  179. Iampeter

    Of course the swamp cares not for the law.

    LOL who are you talking about? No one who supports Trump can level such a thing at anyone else. To not understand this means you are either being dishonest or simply have no idea about politics.

    Anyway, Trump apologists follow a predictable process for defending Trumps random scandals:
    Stage 1 – Play dumb, deny and conspiracy theories – Nothing happened! Anything could be in that bag of money! It’s the Deep State out to get im!

    Stage 2 – Projection and hypocrisy – Democrats are corrupt too! They’re the swamp! (note: none of this is wrong, it just can’t be leveled at anyone by Trump supporters)

    Stage 3 – Belligerent acceptance and doubling down – You’re damn right he did it! What about it?! He’s a fighter!

    Rinse, repeat.

    We are currently in stage 2 on this particular scandal.

  180. Empire 5:5

    LOL who are you talking about? No one who supports Trump can level such a thing at anyone else. To not understand this means you are either being dishonest or simply have no idea about politics.

    You know nothing about anything, as demonstrated by your failure to ever once articulate your alleged superior understanding of politics, despite numerous invitations to learn the mob. You’ve never moved beyond vacuous assertion on anything*

    You could establish your claimed superiority beyond doubt very easily:
    – clearly articulate what politics is
    – provide reference material to support your argument
    – demonstrate an understanding of how the current state came to be inc historical ref
    – offer a feasible path from here to your utopia

    But you don’t because you can’t. It’s an impossibility because you aren’t a political genius, you’re a left wing troll pretending to be a right wing genius. You hate conservatives. You’re triggered by every post on abortion, immigration and priests. You can’t resist the temptation to defend your cherished progressive shibboleth.

    You’re fake-right. I know it, you know it and everyone on this blog knows it. But you lie and dissemble like Killary. Like Killary you are a sociopathic deluded loser who erroneously believes somebody somewhere is listening to and believing your untalented deception. They aren’t.

    The feeding of the trolls may satiate your desire for attention, but don’t confuse attention with relevance. Nobody is listening.

    * muh rights protecting gummint, a home brew undergraduate synthesis of concepts beyond your grasp, is evidence of your fakeness, not superiority.

  181. Ivan Denisovich

    The real story is the Biden family accepting bribes from Eastern Europe and China. That’s the story they’re trying to swamp.

    Ann Coulter:

    The Russian collusion story was originally hatched by Hillary Clinton in the summer of 2016 to cover up the utter corruption revealed by the dump of Democratic National Committee emails on Wikileaks. As was her practice whenever a scandal threatened to engulf her, Hillary rushed out and told the press to investigate something else.

    And “the great story” about the DNC email hack wasn’t about a “vast right-wing conspiracy” — as she claimed when the Monica Lewinsky scandal broke. No, this time, it was a vast Russian conspiracy!

    At the time, the entire media laughed at Hillary’s Russian conspiracy nonsense — The New York Times, New York Newsday, the Los Angeles Times and so on. But then Trump won the election, and suddenly the Russia conspiracy seemed totally believable.

    http://www.anncoulter.com/columns/2019-09-25.html#read_more

    Fair point, I haven’t seen Crowdstrike mentioned except at CTH. Is there any attention on the Crowdstrike issue?

    I didn’t know this (from Coulter link):

    CrowdStrike was founded by Ukrainian Dmitri Alperovitch (now an American citizen apparently — because who isn’t?) and funded by the fanatically anti-Russian Ukrainian oligarch Viktor Pinchuk.

    Talk about interfering with our democracy! Alperovitch and Pinchuk sent one political party and nine-tenths of the American media off on a wild goose chase into Russian collusion that, after years of accusations, investigations and embarrassing conspiracy-mongering … turned up goose eggs.

  182. Iampeter

    You know nothing about anything, as demonstrated by your failure to ever once articulate your alleged superior understanding of politics, despite numerous invitations to learn the mob.

    LOL!

    You could establish your claimed superiority beyond doubt very easily:
    – clearly articulate what politics is
    – provide reference material to support your argument
    – demonstrate an understanding of how the current state came to be inc historical ref
    – offer a feasible path from here to your utopia

    I’ve written volumes of posts here answering all of these points.

    You are a dishonest imbecile.

  183. Empire 5:5

    I’ve written volumes of posts here answering all of these points.

    You are a dishonest imbecile.

    Link one. You’re a phoney.

  184. Iampeter

    Link one. You’re a phoney.

    LOL, you mean you didn’t Google before you made such a certain assertion?
    Here’s one thread for example. Topics covered include theory of government and immigration. Get reading. You can google the rest by using the terms “catallaxyfiles” and “Iampeter” in the same search.
    You have a lot of reading to do.

    But I’m also going to keep embarrassing you now by pointing out what your real issue here is.
    You have no counter to the fact that Trump is a corrupt leftist. This is because there is no counter.
    Conservatives are done as a political movement. Any attempts to say “but the left boo grrr” will be countered by the fact that you supported Trump.

    So instead of facing up the massive issues you need to resolve you try to obfuscate by asking me the most open ended and not even related questions.

    You’re just another exceptional individual at the cat.

  185. Empire 5:5

    Here’s one thread for example. Topics covered include theory of government and immigration. Get reading. You can google the rest by using the terms “catallaxyfiles” and “Iampeter” in the same search.
    You have a lot of reading to do.

    I took a squiz after my half time leak. It was a quick read. You work hard at the talking points and dissemble with insults but 50+ comments and there’s nothing there.*

    One link to an unremarkable op which accepts the existence of a left-right spectrum provided it is explained within individualist-collectivist parameters. Fine by me. The link is the sole support for what follows. Peter Theory. A not unappealing ideal where the state is strictly throttled in scope but well funded and competent in discharging its mandate. As an alternative to the present, incontrovertibly superior.

    – clearly articulate what politics is

    But you failed at the first hurdle. You have asserted how politics should be defined (the science of how people live together) and how it ought be practiced. Nowhere did you demonstrate an understanding of what politics demonstrably is: the seizing and wielding of power in the present within the constraints of rules consented to by institutions and powerful actors capable of retaliating with force.

    You’re a phoney. Your schtick is shellac thick. It’s kind of sad you invest so much effort pretending to be a genius on a blog, but your freedom of expression is your business, not mine.

    *Thinking maybe I was being harsh, I cross marked your effort on that thread with an associate who hasn’t been drinking and has been marking postgrad essays this weekend. Laughter ensued.

  186. Iampeter

    No way. A mindless and dishonest imbecile, who has no idea what he’s talking about, is deciding to engage in hilarious projection.
    Who could’ve predicted such a turn of events at the cat. I’m shocked. Shocked I tell you.

    Strange, there doesn’t seem to be an essay with reference materials supporting your arguments and demonstrate an understanding of how the current state came to be inc historical ref.
    That seems to be your standing requirement from me whenever I post relatively uncontroversial things like “trump is corrupt,” or “cowardly appeasement doesn’t work.”
    I’m sure you’re busy typing it right now. Such a thing takes time. I mean it’s not like you’re a dishonest imbecile who has no idea what he’s talking about and has no business on politics blogs, posting cringe inducing things like “…the seizing and wielding of power in the present within the constraints of rules consented to by institutions and powerful actors capable of retaliating with force” and pretending to be saying something that isn’t phony and shellacky.

    LOL!

  187. Frank Walker from National Tiles

    You haven’t explained shit Peter, other than how hopeless Australian conservatives are.

    They already know that here.

  188. Iampeter

    Frank, the post I link to explains entry-level politics from a right wing point of view. But that wasn’t the point. The point of the link was to demonstrate that Empire was ALSO wrong in suggesting I haven’t laid out my views. Something no one else here is required to do despite obvious and total ignorance. Like for example dismissing anything I’ve said there as “Peter theory” which proves that you don’t know what you’re talking about.
    In other words, Empire and the other exceptional individuals here are the very things they always project onto me: clueless leftists, mindlessly spouting cringe-inducing talking points and hurling insults only to cry about being insulted.

    The kind of spergs that say things like “politics is about seizing power! Institutions! Powerful actors! In the game of thrones you win or you die! etc” and think they are seriously discussing politics.

  189. mh

    Empire 5:5
    #3169993, posted on September 28, 2019 at 4:33 pm

    Good stuff, Empire.

    No need to engage with him though. We all know what Peter is – someone who has done an Ayn Rand correspondence course.

  190. Empire 5:5

    Something no one else here is required to do despite obvious and total ignorance. Like for example dismissing anything I’ve said there as “Peter theory” which proves that you don’t know what you’re talking about.

    Predictably, more dissembling from the PhoneyPony.

    You could have been a stand up man and proved your genius to the audience. Instead you played the victim card and ran from the fight. Like you always do. Which reminds me of a kid I used to know.

    He was a fat kid and a dutiful spectator of his playing peers. He never missed a home game, but always by himself. The folks were nowhere to be seen. But he wasn’t there to contribute anything of value. He was there to learn the doers how it’s done.
    “I woulda kicked a bag on that hack, McGovern. You’re useless!”
    But he had no skin in the game. He was never accountable for his shit because he knew he would never be asked to back it up. He was never going to be selected to play. Not that it made any difference to him – he was The Heckler. He was a somebody.

    The mums, dads, siblings and friends (the normal people) begrudgingly tolerated this kid, but with mixed feelings. Their moral compasses demanding compassion, the tendency was toward anger, anger that the parents would condone such demeaning habits for the convenience of an afternoon to themselves, but ultimately: pity. Pity that a child, through no fault of their own, depended on a lonely fantasy for their very sense of purpose.

    You’re that kid. You’re the fat kid with the superhero fantasy. The Heckler. The only right-winger in the village.

  191. Empire 5:5

    No need to engage with him though. We all know what Peter is – someone who has done an Ayn Rand correspondence course.

    I’ve got a lot of product to produce this weekend. It helps to limber up. The PhoneyPony is like the rowing machine. Five minutes of light’n’bright before lifting.

  192. Iampeter

    You could have been a stand up man and proved your genius to the audience. Instead you played the victim card and ran from the fight. Like you always do.

    Yes clearly. The guy talking about rights and rights-protecting government and providing links and patiently explaining over and over, entry-level political concepts that shouldn’t need to be explained on what is meant to be a right-wing blog, is totally “dissembling” and “ran from a fight.”

    Unlike you who responds by missing everything that’s being said and then attempts to woo me with your best attempt at impersonating what sounds like a character from a fantasy novel discussing politics.
    That’s real political insight! No dishonest dissembling there from someone who has no business on a politics blog.

    Can’t wait for your next brilliant point as you patronize me. Let me guess, chaos is a ladder?

    LOL! Get outta here you clueless, dishonest, projecting, leftist imbecile.

  193. Empire 5:5

    LOL! Get outta here you clueless, dishonest, projecting, leftist imbecile

    Nobody can hear you Heckler. You’re talking load and sayin’ nothin’. Nobody is watching. The roar from the crowd is for the players, not the fat kid.

  194. Iampeter

    Yes, yes. More bluster. More projection. More unintentional reveals of your miserable childhood. MOar!

    I’m just a fat kid. Therefore you win the politics.

    Brilliant! XD

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