Our man in London

I’m struggling to follow the chain of logic that connects Alexander Downer to the Clintons’ and then onto an effort to impeach Donald Trump.

In the very first instance I don’t understand why the local left are so excited by the Australian government agreeing to assist the Americans in investigating the origins of the Mueller probe. I would normally expect such a thing to be so routine that the US needn’t even ask.

Okay.

Let’s start with this tweet.

 A “wannabe spy”? The man was the Australian High Commissioner to the UK. It was his job to pass on information to the Australian government – does that make him a spy? Hard to say. But so far Alexander Downer was doing his job. Then “Clinton errand boy”? Again I don’t understand how telling the Australian government who, in turn, told the American government that Mrs Clinton was compromised by the Russians could help Mrs Clinton. To the contrary, her email problems dogged her over her entire candidacy.

But to my mind – this is the strangest part of the story:

A few days later [Papadopoulos] wound up on the front page of The Times calling on British PM David Cameron to apologise for denigrating Trump’s immigration policy. Three days later, Erika emailed to say Downer was “eager to get acquainted” and talk about “US-Australian relations”. Four days later the three gathered at the Kensington Wine Rooms. Downer, “oozing ­aggression”, told Papadopoulos: “Tell your boss [Trump] he needs to leave my friend David Cameron alone.”

Alexander Downer “oozing ­aggression”? At this point what was already a long and complicated story simply loses any and all credibility.  Now I don’t doubt that Downer may have said to Papadopoulos that Trump should lay off Cameron. But “oozing aggression”? Nah. Bullshit.

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69 Responses to Our man in London

  1. C.L.

    Downer, “oozing ­aggression”

    Ahahahahahaha.

    “Tell your boss [Trump] he needs to leave my friend David Cameron alone.”

    Or what?

  2. Up The Workers!

    I’ll need to go back and have a fresh look at Downer in his fishnet stockings and high heels to reassess just how “aggressive” he really was.

    Maybe he sported an ‘aggressive’ shade of lippy at the time?

  3. stackja

    The Dems get into trouble and the MSM rush to the defence.
    First HRC emails so MSM created ‘Russia crisis’.
    Now Joe Biden’s son business so MSM create ‘Ukraine crisis’.
    “The sky is falling!”

  4. Howard Hill

    Downer in a dress with lipstick on and wearing a 3 day growth would look aggressive to anyone. I shit myself just thinking about it.

    And now something to clear your head after reading this

  5. Howard Hill

    Oops take two!
    And now something to clear your head after reading this

    [NSFW – Sinc]

  6. Suburban Boy

    Why did the Australian High Commissioner agree to meet with some no-name pissant from the US? Why did Downer take the meeting himself rather than send some underling? What did that have to do with Australia or its relations with the UK?

  7. C.L.

    Daryl McCann’s analysis of this confusing mess at Quadrant is worth reading.
    IMO, either Downer’s report to US intelligence was prompted (very possible) or he blundered into a broader mess in real time and was simply used as an idiot-of-opportunity by the FBI. The more important question has always been, who, if anyone, was prompting the leadership of the FBI? There are only two possibilities: President Obama himself or James Comey – acting in a wink-wink way as a phony ‘patriot’ to protect his boss and his likely successor – Clinton – and stymie the ‘threat’ of Trump.

  8. C.L.

    Why did the Australian High Commissioner agree to meet with some no-name pissant from the US? Why did Downer take the meeting himself rather than send some underling?

    Good question. Self-interest and ego. But also something else, I think. Consider the words supposedly he used and the reported extent of Papadopoulos’ gossip: “Tell your boss [Trump] he needs to leave my friend David Cameron alone.” Sounds like something scripted for a wider audience. British intelligence, for example. I wouldn’t be surprised if Downer was wired for sound.

  9. Infidel Tiger

    Meeting in a bar for drinks on official business is highly inappropriate.

    If Downer was acting on Australia’s behalf the meeting should only have taken place in a formal setting with witnesses. Highly unusual behavior.

    I don’t see Downer as a spy though, more of an idiot patsy.

  10. mh

    But “oozing aggression”? Nah. Bullshit.

    Downer may have mentioned the things that batter.

  11. Bruce of Newcastle

    Downer, Halper and Mifsud are all associated with a MI6 old-boys network.

    Ties That Bind – Stefan Halper, Joseph Mifsud & Alexander Downer (& Papadopoulos) (May 2018)

    George Papadopoulos and Joseph Mifsud reportedly both worked at the London Centre of International Law Practice.

    Downer has direct ties to UK Intelligence firm Hakluyt where he served on the Advisory Board from 2008-2014.

    Halper has a close association with former MI6 Head Richard Dearlove.

    Halper has connections to the UK Intelligence firm Hakluyt through Jonathan Clarke, with whom he has co-authored two books.

    Tinker, Tailor, Clapper, Carter, Downer, Halper, Spy (Steyn, May 2018)

    Well, there’s more circumstantial evidence of Mifsud’s ties to British intelligence, including multiple meetings with, inter alia, Claire Smith of the UK’s Joint Intelligence Committee.

  12. Ubique

    Meeting in a bar for drinks on official business is highly inappropriate.

    Agreed. Not just inappropriate but unseemly and wrong.

  13. JC

    Get a load of the fishnet stocking wearing twerp. The tough guy.

    “Tell your boss [Trump] he needs to leave my friend David Cameron alone.”

    He deserved a good barroom beating for that alone.

  14. Chris M

    Papadopoulos appears to be correct if you were to do some research Sinc.

    The man was the Australian High Commissioner to the UK.

    Right there is a clue – why would a high Commissioner go out of his way to request a one-on-one meeting with a lowly US campaign volunteer he had never met before? Papadop had zero influence at that point, he was just chosen as a useful pawn and fed a bit of gossip to kick things off

  15. Gerry

    I understand that he passed on the Papadopoulos info to the US Ambassador to the UK before it got to Canberra.

  16. Roger

    Meeting in a bar for drinks on official business is highly inappropriate.

    Indeed.

    “Tell your boss [Trump] he needs to leave my friend David Cameron alone.”

    What does that have to do with Australia’s interests?

    An he then went on to have an unauthorised official discussion with the American chargé d’affaires in London.

    What a foolish appointment in the first instance. These appointment are too important to be sinecures for paty political hacks like Downer.

  17. Sunni Bakchat

    Bruce of Newcastle bells the cat on Downer.

    There has been plenty of press in the US showing the relevant linkages. Downer clearly picked his side. It now seems Australia (America’s greatest ally) seems somewhat embarrassed by it all.

    It seems obvious that Downer preferred Clinton over Trump’s brand of conservatism. That Cameron’s narcissistic conservatism was far more palatable than trump’s conviction politics. From memory this was not dissimilar to the contest between Howard and Downer. Which of course saw Downer humiliated.

  18. Behind Enemy Lines

    Our man in London
    Posted on 11:46 am, October 2, 2019 by Sinclair Davidson
    I’m struggling to follow the chain of logic that connects Alexander Downer to the Clintons’ and then onto an effort to impeach Donald Trump.

    There’s a lot of squid ink, but it isn’t that complicated. The Democrats don’t just hate Trump, they fear him and are desperate to keep him from revealing their illegal antics. That’s why they’ve spent the last three years trying to smear him, distract him, and eventually get rid of him by impeachment.

    In 2016 and probably earlier, the Obama administration (via Democrat party operatives in the FBI, DoJ and CIA, aka ‘deep state’) were abusing NSA intercepts to spy on domestic political enemies. The Trump campaign was eventually alerted to this. The deep state insiders weren’t prepared for discovery. Their assumption was that no one would find out, and even if someone did find out then Hillary would win and look after them. After someone (NSA Chief Rogers?) blew the whistle, the deep staters needed to drum up an excuse and a cover up in a hurry. To do this, they chose ‘Russia’ as their ex post facto justification for illegally spying on US citizens. The next step was to begin smearing individuals related to the Trump campaign as Russian spies or go-betweens. To get this rolling, the deep state team reached out to friends and agents abroad (Mifsud, Halper, Downer and/or Downer’s staff). There is credible evidence that these three appeared to try to entrap Papadopoulos and Carter Page into saying something that could tie Trump to Russian interference. At the same time, the deep state were also leaking their pseudo-intelligence to undermine Trump and help Clinton in the 2016 election.

    Why Downer allowed himself to get drawn into the biggest scandal in US political history, I don’t know. Maybe he really is as stupid as the ALP used to claim.

    Before anyone starts yelping about conspiracy theories, remember that the DoJ IG Michael Horowitz already has an open investigation into FISA (spying) abuses by both the Justice Department and the FBI. Evidently it’s going to be released fairly soon.

  19. Infidel Tiger

    I think we all hope to live long enough to see Downer hanged.

    It would make much of the last few decades worth it.

  20. C.L.

    I agree with BEL’s timeline.
    That’s what happened.

  21. Infidel Tiger

    I saw some clueless clickbaiter typing yesterday “Why would a right wing Downer help Let wing Hillary?”

    Indeed. Therein lies the answer my clickbaity friend. Perhaps you have all your labels wrong.

  22. Bruce of Newcastle

    I suspect one reason why Trump was doing introductions on the phone with the Ukraine PM and with ScoMo is that the DoJ isn’t getting any cooperation from the Pommy intel community. So Barr has to get the evidence from the other end of each pipeline instead.

    The British intelligence establishment is almost certainly more lefty that the US counterpart, and we know just how deep the US swamp is.

  23. Entropy

    What makes this a bit smelly is:
    * Downer wanted to meet a low level Trump campaign worker in an unofficial setting
    * Downer told the US about what happened before he told Australia.

    The subsequent Australian advisory to the yanks smells like an attempt to clean up the mess.

    Apart from that, I suspect Downer should probably sue Rowan Atkinson for basing his Johnny English character on him without attribution.

  24. littledozer

    Why Downer allowed himself to get drawn into the biggest scandal in US political history, I don’t know. Maybe he really is as stupid as the ALP used to claim.

    Apart from Bernardi, nobody connected with the Liberals considered Trump a chance and were all Clinton boosters.

    “I think Hillary Clinton’s a very smart and engaging woman.

    “I could have said that. I mean I can’t remember saying it, but I could have said it.” – Downer

  25. Win

    What’s the sainted Kim Beasleys take on all this. He resigned in 2016 ,so he must have some inkling as to what was going on.

  26. Roger

    Apart from Bernardi, nobody connected with the Liberals considered Trump a chance and were all Clinton boosters.

    Including Jim Molan, let it be noted.

  27. Old School Conservative

    Entropy, Johnny English may stumble a few times but always wins the battle and the lady.
    No comparison to Downer there.

  28. I think we can discount all the lower echelon American hoohah on this, and especially the stuff about Alexander Downer. The Mueller business is an American problem, one that eventually will hook Donald Trump in something resembling a testicle-grip, politically if not judicially. The embarrassing issue for Australia isn’t that Downer (while high commissioner in London) passed along some material from George P, but that the later request for assistance in conducting Mr Trump’s witch-hunt against Mueller came from the president, and was therefore partisan and political, rather than from the justice bureaucracy. It was not a normal agency to agency request. Trump wouldn’t understand that critical difference, or care. We should expect our prime ministers to be fully sentient, however.

  29. Infidel Tiger

    Including Jim Molan, let it be noted.

    Molan would always back the War Machine.

    Eternal war and chaos is the globalist’s agenda.

  30. Sunni Bakchat

    To Richard Laidlaw. The reason trump made the request was clearly to go around the agencies. Agencies he considers to be infested with a Marcusian ideology. I fail to see how Trump has been other than entirely exonerated by the Mueller investigiation.
    A little known fact is that the relevant US whistleblower regulations governing admissability of whistleblower evidence was amended not twenty hours before the recent whistleblower complaint. The regulation in substance was changed to allow third party complaints. Otherwise known as hearsay in legal circles.
    Far from being a witch hunt by Mr Trump; We’re dealing with bureaucrats who are placing their own political interest ahead of the nation. The post modern theorists who dreamt all of this feel good ideology up must be laughing in their graves.

  31. Delta

    Try this: Australian diplomat whose tip prompted FBI’s Russia-probe has tie to Clintons

    One question worth asking is why the hell should Australia’s tax payers money be “invested” in the Clinton foundation? And what do our ex-politicians get in return? Ha – maybe just maybe some people didn’t want to see their gravy train dry up>

    Oh wait – nothing to see here folks. Just move along.

  32. a happy little debunker

    Downer says that Papadopoulos told him ‘the Russians might release some information which could be damaging to Hillary Clinton’.

    This would be a fairly uncontroversial piece of gossip.

    What prompted Downer to relay this gossip to the American chargé d’affaires & then include it on diplomatic cables (reportedly to the surprise of Australia’s PM & senior colleagues)?

    Clearly Downer’s reporting of this gossip was unusual and out of the ordinary for any Australian High Commissioner.

    This is not to say Downer possessed some super secret spy like inclinations – but an explanation as to why this uncontroversial, every day, piece of gossip was treated so differently to every other piece of gossip has yet to be addressed.

    Follow the white rabbit.

  33. I_am_not_a_robot

    Anyone interested in hearing George Papadopoulos’s first-hand account of his meeting with Downer (from ~40:00):

  34. Dr Faustus

    The man was the Australian High Commissioner to the UK. It was his job to pass on information to the Australian government – does that make him a spy? Hard to say. But so far Alexander Downer was doing his job.

    Downer indeed dutifully passed the information about Russia/Hillary on to the Australian government. So, job done.

    However it appears that he also subsequently went freestyle and, on his own initiative, reported the conversation onto the US Government – presumably knowing and intending that it would feed back into the Clinton campaign.

    …Alexander Downer took the then prime minister, Malcolm Turnbull, and senior colleagues by surprise when he relayed information to the American chargé d’affaires in London in July 2016 about his now infamous conversation with George Papadopoulos…

    Guardian Australia understands Downer’s conversation with Papadopoulos was recorded in a diplomatic cable back to Canberra.

    But the first senior players in Canberra knew of Downer’s conversation with America’s top diplomat in London about Russia obtaining damaging information about Hillary Clinton from her emails was when the Australian government was contacted subsequently by the Federal Bureau of Investigation for more information. That diplomat-to-diplomat conversation, sources insist, was unauthorised.

    This is from the Guardian, so hardly a disinterested source. But (if for no other reason than it has not been denied) it does suggest that someone in Canberra is leaking against Downer and there may be some factual basis behind the story.

    Assuming the leakage is not fake news, the fact that Downer was acting as an independent agent during the US Presidential campaign is probably a legitimate matter of concern for the A/G and the Trump Administration.

  35. Indigo

    I read Mark Steyn’s interview with Papadopolous some time ago, and I though then Downer could get into hot water over his meeting. I don’t think Downer likes Trump.

  36. For what possible reason was Alexander Downer, Australian high commissioner to the UK, a diplomat of ambassadorial rank, so insistent on meeting a nobody and stranger like Papadoupolous for a night on the tiles, and then drawing claims planted by Mifsud, an existing DOJ asset, from the bloke?
    You would have to be a gullible naif not to see a set up here.

  37. EJ.

    Follow the money..Plenty to read here.

  38. Who in the Australian Government did like President Trump. Not very many, they weren’t backwards at letting the media and public know their feelings. Julie Bishop gave a ton of Aust. taxpayers money to the Clinton Foundation and before her Julia Gillard. There are a pack of them that are Globalists and they like prestige and money. Trump just might spoil their gravy train and I hope to God he does.

  39. Dr Fred Lenin

    Looks to me like Downer was being a typical elitist smartass globalist , who as they usually do outsmarted himself, trying to ingratiate himself with the criminal clintons as the elites love to do , look at Giliard giving our money to the crooks and creating a new well paid career, to let her aywhere near “ejykayshun “ is a bloody insult to peoples intelligence. Just as Dowers appointment to London was ,cushy jobs for the “retired “ career politicians . Downer is an absolute fool ,always has been , hes the type the Uniparty recruit , the establishment wont punish him in any way ,they hate and fear the likes of Trump, he is not in the global fascist loop ..

  40. Ian of Brisbane

    Downer has always been full of himself. If you want to know more, read George’s book. Its quite illuminating.

  41. TERRY ANDREWS

    You seem to only know half the story. Your bullshit is very premature

  42. Crossie

    Infidel Tiger
    #3173140, posted on October 2, 2019 at 12:22 pm
    Meeting in a bar for drinks on official business is highly inappropriate.

    If Downer was acting on Australia’s behalf the meeting should only have taken place in a formal setting with witnesses. Highly unusual behavior.

    I don’t see Downer as a spy though, more of an idiot patsy.

    Downer doesn’t look good in either scenario.

  43. Cynic of Ayr

    I suggest you all, especially you, Sinc, go over had have a look at what Michael Smith News has dug up on Downer.
    This feller makes all of you look like rank amateurs, with no information.

  44. Frank

    I don’t see Downer as a spy though, more of an idiot patsy.

    Easy to imagine Downer thinking of himself as a spy however.

  45. Crossie

    An he then went on to have an unauthorised official discussion with the American chargé d’affaires in London.

    What a foolish appointment in the first instance. These appointment are too important to be sinecures for paty political hacks like Downer.

    I thought that’s where the government sends its useful idiots, they can’t do much damage there.

  46. Crossie

    The British intelligence establishment is almost certainly more lefty that the US counterpart, and we know just how deep the US swamp is.

    Hard to tell the difference between the current crop and Burgess, Philby et al.

    After the election I hope Boris gets to clean out that vipers nest.

  47. Tel

    THANKS TERRY STOP TELL US WHERE TO GET THE OTHER HALF OF THE STORY WOULD LOVE TO KNOW STOP DO YOU THINK DOWNER WILL TALK MESSAGE ENDS

  48. Leo G

    Easy to imagine Downer thinking of himself as a spy however.

    Agent Double-Oh Dreben, with licence to shill.

  49. John Comnenus

    There’s only one curious key detail that has never been explained – why did Downer go straight from the Papadopoulos meeting and report the matter directly to the US Deputy Ambassador at the US Embassy? Why did he not immediately report the issue through a cable to DFAT and let CANBERRA advise Washington through the normal officialDiplomatic and intelligence five eyes channels? Downer only got around to cabling Canberra weeks later and Canberra never forwarded that information to Washington according to Devin Nunes the former head of the US House Intelligence Committee. That seems interesting to me. It just looks like our chief diplomat in the UK was working for someone other than Australia. I’m sure Alexander has a perfectly reasonable explanation.

  50. Jock

    The interesting thing is that US intel and FBi seemed to need this meeting as the dossier was crap. Many strange things happened. Why did Downer meet a junior apparachik (of 28) in a wine bar? Why then wait two months if the stuff said was important? What was said? What downer reported or what Papadopolous said. Downer has credibility, and one could ask; is that the reason he set up the meeting?

    The strangeness of the many aspects of this are of course the reason Barr and Trump are interested. Who was masterminding this in the CIA, FBI and DNC?

  51. Shy Ted

    If ScoMo knows what’s good for him, the LNP and the country he’ll hand Downer over on a plate.

  52. Empire 5:5

    Downer’s job was to launder intel.

    The only question I’m interested in: who in the cabinet knew about it?

  53. Perfidious Albino

    Breitbart and AoS have been all over the Downer angle for some time (I know some Cats must know this). The meeting with Papadopolous was set up by someone else in the Australian High Commission in London, an attractive, young, female intelligence operative who was also present at the meeting. I’m more concerned by what this implies about our security intelligence community than surprised by what it suggests about Downer.

  54. Muddy

    Cynic of Ayr’s direction to Michael Smith News makes for some intriguing background reading.

  55. Delcon

    Alexander Downer “oozing ­aggression”? At this point what was already a long and complicated story simply loses any and all credibility. Now I don’t doubt that Downer may have said to Papadopoulos that Trump should lay off Cameron. But “oozing aggression”? Nah. Bullshit.

    Well, either Downer or George P. are full of shit. Do you surmise it must be the latter based on him saying Downer was aggressive? First of all, there is a cultural difference: what might not be aggressive for an Aussie, may be so for someone from another culture. Secondly, maybe Papa was judging Downer on his attitude rather than behaviour.
    In any case, if I had to determine which of the two doesn’t have any credibility re this issue, my money would be on Downer.
    Why did he meet him in the first place?
    Why did he report this meeting, a report which sparked a two year major investigation which resulted in nothing: obviously, Downer was too quick to report, which suggests an anti-Trump bias. As others have commented, the Turnbull government for which Downer worked would have almost definitely assumed a Hillary victory is certain. It is clear that this whole move by the Australians was of an anti-Trump nature.
    If Downer was anti-Trump, and I would say that is undeniable, why would George P. *not* sense some sort of hostility which he may have interpreted as aggression. So, no, Sinc., not “bullshit” IMO.
    Finally, of Downer and George P., one is happy to openly tell their side of the story, while the other pretends this incident, widely talked about in America and now increasingly here, is a non-issue and keeps very discrete and quiet about it.
    As I said, one side between Downer and George P. sounds and appears very sus here, and it’s not necessarily George P.

  56. classical_hero

    The OP has great instincts, especially with the potentially great PM.

  57. Amused

    Howard Hill
    #3173127, posted on October 2, 2019 at 12:08 pm
    Oops take two!
    And now something to clear your head after reading this

    [NSFW – Sinc]

    Not sure where you work, Sinc, but that place sucks and should be razed at the earliest opportunity.

  58. classical_hero

    HH, that doesn’t clear my head but fills it with pleasant thoughts.

  59. classical_hero

    A Twitter thread on the Biden corruption.

    It’s very informative and gives you the details needed.

  60. yarpos

    Rather than the impeachment saga there is a far more interesting earlier issue arising surrounding Downer and Australian contributions to the Clinton Foundation, nominally for AIDS related work. Tens of millions spent and when audited no structure or plans to use it or results to show for it. Will be interesting to see where it goes.

  61. Iampeter

    So, Downer sent details to Australia re Russia having something on Clinton therefore triggering the Trump Russia collusion investigation in America?
    What’s missing?

  62. George Pap was first approached by the UK man Stefan Halper who suggested to George that the Russians had Clinton’s emails. (Downer and Halper are connected thru Haklyut)
    An Australian woman, Erika Thompson then contacts George to discuss this issue with him.
    Thompson is Downer’s assistant and according to George Pappa she is an intelligence agent.
    Thompson was also at the time engaged to an Israeli embassy employee Cristian Cantor.

    Put simply, the American Deep state was using the vast NSA database to spy on anyone and everyone of interest to them.
    They started spying on Donald Trump going back to 2015 at least but were discovered by Gen. Mike Rogers who went to Trump Tower and told Trump about the spying.
    The very next day Trump shifted his operations to his New Jersey property.

    Papadop was lured by both Stefan Halper (UK) and Downer (AUS) at the behest of the Americans to inject the Russia has Clinton’s emails story into the Trump camp (That’s why Downer went to the Americans before he told Australia about his Papadop meeting).
    Why do that? The FBI needed a foreign angle in order to be able to go to the FARA Court to get a FISA warrant to justify their spying on Trump.

    5 minute read at the below link will clear it up for those interested

    https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2019/09/30/deep-state-impeachment-team-racing-against-time-durham-and-barr-ny-times-aids-with-australian-narrative/

  63. Iampeter

    Follow the money..Plenty to read here.

    What’s this? More disasters under the Howard government conservatives are only now discussing, avoiding the whole conservative aspect of it entirely?
    That no good Labor Foreign Minister signing away money to the Clintons!
    If only we had a good conservative government, like Howard! His ministers would never have allowed this! Oh…wait…

  64. jupes

    Why Downer allowed himself to get drawn into the biggest scandal in US political history, I don’t know. Maybe he really is as stupid as the ALP used to claim.

    No. Downer was on the advisory board of UK Intelligence firm Hakluyt. That means he hung out with high level ex-spooks.

    You can imagine Downer in a plush London club with some of these tossers regaling him with their tales of daring-do. Then it is suggested that Alexander himself could actually participate in an one of these operations. An international sting operation no less, with plenty of brownie points to be gained and no chance at all of being caught.

    Woops …

  65. jupes

    Now I don’t doubt that Downer may have said to Papadopoulos that Trump should lay off Cameron. But “oozing aggression”? Nah. Bullshit.

    Pretty shallow analysis there Sinc. Seriously.

    Anyone can be aggressive.

  66. Publius

    Sinclair- does it not strike you as odd that Downer contacted the FBI rather than Canberra. Come on man…open your eyes.

  67. Hamish Marshall

    London to a brick that Alex sweetie has been taking kickbacks from the Clinton Foundation!

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