Why you must side with Donald Trump on impeachment

Since I was asked in a recent post about why we have been avoiding the impeachment story, let me say for myself that there is no there there to discuss. The Democrats and their enablers in the media are apparently willing to destroy the American system of government for some short-term gain in the right to formulate policy, which will ruin the balance of forces that maintain stability. I spent enough years in a political environment to see how things are done, and they are done behind closed doors where agreements are reached with the shake of a hand and then everyone else plays their part in allowing the agreed outcome to come about. There is nothing necessarily corrupt or dishonest about politics.

The one thing that is absolutely necessary is for the representatives of the various interests to be led by strong-willed people who know what they want to achieve and understand when they have gone as far as they can go, given the state of play. No decision I have ever been party to was constructed out of corrupt motives, although there has been quite a lot of political profiteering that has gone on.

Among the reasons I dislike Keynesian economics so much is that it turns governments into dispensers of wealth. Rather than producing value-adding goods and services, people can become very wealthy by being on the receiving end of public funds. There may seldom have been a gravy train as thick as the moneys being lashed out to supposedly prevent global warming, but that is how things are done. Windmills and solar panels, for all their waste and harm, are what the population really seems to want. Self-interest is the soul of politics and it’s not always enlightened.

But the Democrats’ relentless attacks on Donald Trump have gone beyond anything anyone has seen before. None of this is in dispute so far as I am concerned:

  • Barack Obama was at the centre of a cabal of insiders who did all they could by using various government institutions (such as the FBI) to undermine the electoral process to stop Donald Trump from becoming president;
  • There has been a continuous process to prevent and inhibit the Republicans from governing through illegal and unconstitutional actions;
  • Hillary Clinton was the most corrupt and stunningly incompetent politician ever to run for President – the Clinton Foundation was an open non-secret;
  • Joe Biden specifically admitted that he had forced the Ukrainian government from investigating his son who was for reasons unrelated to his knowledge and abilities on the board of a Ukrainian business, receiving millions of dollars, solely because his father, Joe Biden, was the Vice-President;
  • When Mueller could not find any evidence that the 2016 election had been tipped towards Trump by some kind of Russian interference, the Democrats turned on a dime to invent an absurd story about Trump applying pressure on the Ukrainian political system as a means to subvert Joe Biden’s run for the presidency;
  • The media are deranged in their fanatically biased distortions of the events of the day. There is virtually never a positive story in regard to Donald Trump. The ABC is a sewer of lies and distortions, but still remains better than any of the mainstream networks in the US.

And on it goes. Politics is a hard business and often very hard on those who get involved, but also often very lucrative. But the impeachment has reached a new and stunningly high-grade level of corruption. If the Democrats are allowed to succeed in what is essentially a coup, the United States will enter some form of socialist one-party state – not like the Soviet Union, more like Argentina – in which “the will of the people” will be an utterly meaningless expression with no actual reality on the ground.

If this does not worry you to the very depths, then you have no idea what democracy is and why in trying to preserve our way of life you must side with Donald Trump.

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66 Responses to Why you must side with Donald Trump on impeachment

  1. a happy little debunker

    Joe Biden specifically admitted that he had forced the Ukrainian government from investigating a Ukrainian business whilst his son was on the board.

    Fixed it for you.

    But a couple more nuggets wouldn’t go astray
    1. Bill Clinton’s 1999 Treaty with Ukraine on Mutual Legal Assistance in Criminal Matters, such as potential corruption by Americans in Ukraine.
    2. No evidence from the supposed ‘whistle-blower’ nor the IG despite both giving closed door testimony to Adam Schiff and the Intelligence Committee and it’s subsequent classification as secret by Adam Schiff.
    3. The real threat is the requested investigation into CrowdStrike & the Dems are working overtime to distract the public from that requested investigation.

  2. As an avid reader and follower of US events, I totally agree with every point in your article. Pres. Trump has had to contend with the most outrageous attacks of any leader in my lifetime. Utterly complicit is the disgraceful media in the US, lies, rumours, scandals and opinions are all projected as truth or ‘bombshells’ against the man. The old newspaper adage “never let the truth get in the way of a good story” has been worked to the maximum. The really weird part is that the Demonrats as we now call them project on to him everything they have done, are doing and will continue to do. We ought to invent a stronger word to replace hypocrite as the defining word. Even when Biden openly told everyone that he had blackmailed the Ukraine to get rid of the investigator looking at his son, it was glossed over and some in the media even say it never happened. The ‘cool aid’ must have a powerful hallucinogenic added in vast doses.

  3. Iampeter

    The Democrats and their enablers in the media are apparently willing to destroy the American system of government for some short-term gain in the right to formulate policy, which will ruin the balance of forces that maintain stability.

    Except, amazingly, it’s the exact other way around.
    It is Trump and his conservative enablers that are prepared to destroy the American system of government for shot-term gain.
    Conservatives have already lost all remaining shred of credibility of being an alternative to the left by supporting the disastrous and statist Trump Presidency.
    By failing to remove Trump they now lose all credibility as being the lesser corrupt of the two mainstream movements.

    The only question remaining is, what’s the plan now guys? We’ve already got plenty of corrupt and left wing movements. Do we really need another one? Especially one as religious and politically illiterate as conservatives?

  4. Mother Lode

    Except, amazingly, it’s the exact other way around.

    Taking that sentence claiming Steve is 180 degrees wrong, and then correcting for OmPoida’s unfailing 180 degrees wrongology, I would have to say OmPoida’s comment incontrovertibly and resolutely endorses Steve’s post – even if he himself does not.

  5. PeterM

    “the disastrous and statist Trump Presidency”

    Can we have please have one of those here in Australia?

  6. Professor Fred Lenin

    The corrupt thieving decromats are compulsive liars like most criminals are ,they are the same sort of people as the remoaners in the UK,they are globalist fascists ,wonder how many the mongrel schwartz(soros)_ owns ? He owns a few hundred MEPS body and soul in Brussels ,If Trump isnt betrayed by the RINOS ,
    He will be re elected ,the globalists will lose the congress thenhe can exact the Peoples Revenge on the criminal plotters . The way the decromats are behaving these days explains why the USA had a civil war,the decromat gang then were the same as the gang now ,Tammany Hall nationwide. They make the alp look marginally better ,not a lot better but a little .

  7. All the Democrats are doing is playing a game of distraction, hoping against hope that something material comes along. In the meantime the best they can do is to try and lay doubt and find someone that has even the slightest chance of at least challenging Trump.

    But everything the democrats have done so far has turn to shit and it looks like their current efforts will be even worse. They are now turning undecideds against them and even Democrats supporters are becoming jaded. It’ll be really interesting to see the black and Hispanic vote next time around.

    There’s also almost a year of Brexit and new trade deals and jobs to be created between the UK and US to make the Democrats tremble even more. No doubt the media are hard at work manufacturing another ‘bombshell’ come election time.

  8. candy

    One thing you can ‘admire’ about the Dems is that they never give up – lie, make stuff up, bribe witnesses, anything is considered righteous as long as Trump is gone.That’s why the Bolton issue is a bit more serious and I feel somewhat concerned. It’s not a psychiatrically disturbed middle aged woman making up stories about Kavanaugh, but a fair dinkum republican who used to work closely with Trump. I’m not seeing 100% loyal republicans here.

    I think if Trump is impeached he will give the whole thing up. He’s amazingly tough but to carry on after being impeached I think he would just leave and start his own party. I don’t see him a person who will ever let himself be at the mercy of bullies and liars. He would start something afresh.

  9. Simple Simon

    There has been a continuous process to prevent and inhibit the Republicans from governing through illegal and unconstitutional actions

    Ummm……

    The following might be a somewhat more felicitous phrasing:

    There has been a continuous process through illegal and unconstitutional actions to prevent and inhibit the Republicans from governing

  10. W Hogg

    I’m still yet to see an official explanation of why Trump666 enlisting foreign aid to investigate his election opponent is a high crime, but the Steele dossier is not. What is the Democrat position on why they are not unanimously calling for the indictment of Illary Crimton?

  11. Faye

    I am most certain that if President Trump is impeached (coup) the veteran Patriots will come out in no uncertain force.

  12. tombell

    The National Popular Vote bill would guarantee the Presidency to the candidate who receives the most popular votes across all 50 states and the District of Columbia. Explanation. It has been enacted into law in 16 jurisdictions with 196 electoral votes (CA, CO, CT, DC, DE, HI, IL, MA, MD, NJ, NM, NY, OR, RI, VT, WA). The bill will go into effect when enacted by states with an additional 74 electoral votes. See map. We authored the National Popular Vote bill, and are the non-partisan, non-profit group that employs national and local representatives, on a year-round basis, to meet with state legislators, officials, voters, organizations, and the media in order to pass the bill.

    STATUS: AK AL AR AZ CA CO CT DC DE FL GA HI IA ID IL IN KS KY LA MA MD ME MI MN MO MS MT NC ND NE NH NJ NM NV NY OH OK OR PA RI SC SD TN TX UT VA VT WA WI WV WY

    This is how it pans out. 74 more electoral college votes needed. No constitutional amendment needed. NYC and LA run the joint…

  13. Tom

    The problem is: a) the corruption of the news media, which has abandoned the public interest as its reason for being; b) voters aren’t allowed to give their verdict for another 10 months.

    If the Democrats don’t abandon their campaign to annul election outcomes they don’t like, there will be a second American civil war. In the meantime, their treacherous power grab may end up robbing them of political power for a generation – the unforeseen long-term consequence of their misbehaviour the Obama years.

  14. Zatara

    Utterly complicit is the disgraceful media in the US,

    Dave, lets not leave out the role of the international media.

    It has been enacted into law in 16 jurisdictions with 196 electoral votes (CA, CO, CT, DC, DE, HI, IL, MA, MD, NJ, NM, NY, OR, RI, VT, WA).

    And it has absolutely no validity in a national election, as the Federal Election Commission will tell them, and then the Supreme Court will tell them again if they are slow witted.
    Want to change the rules regarding Presidential elections? Amend the Constitution… and that isn’t going to happen.

  15. 1735099

    that there is no there there (sic) to discuss.

    There there, Steve.
    Your angst is running away with your keyboard.
    Settle down.
    The dog is pissing on your swag.
    Trump is an old fashioned NY mobster.
    He assaults women and skites about it.
    Most of his associates are behind bars.
    He represents everything that is corrupt in US society.
    The Yanks got what they deserved.

  16. Shy Ted

    ScoMo on the National Press Club today. Perfect opportunity to make a few points to the meeja and crack a few heads in questions. He won’t.

  17. Elderly White Man From Skipton

    Kates, as usual, ignores all the actual evidence and asserts that Trump’s appalling actions are somehow someone else’s fault. Right now his former staff are queueing up to confirm his guilt. I suppose Kates will find that Bolton, Kelly etc are Democrat stooges.
    “Republicans don’t want to hear from Bolton. That sad truth is clear. As for Trump, in a rare moment of honesty, he confessed that Bolton should not talk because “he knows some of my thoughts.”
    https://thebulwark.com/normalizing-trumps-abuse-of-power/

  18. Gavin R Putland

    If Trump is removed from office:
    (1) He will be removed by a process expressly provided in the Constitution;
    (2) He will removed by delegates elected just as directly, and just as democratically, as those who elected him in the first place;
    (3) His behavior will have been rancid enough to turn a substantial fraction of his own party against him; and
    (4) He will be replaced as President by a member of the same party.
    So cut the crap about a coup.

  19. (3) His behavior will have been rancid enough to turn a substantial fraction of his own party against him;

    I find it amazing how people consider Trump’s delivery of his promises to the working people of America, as well as broader delivery of promises he made regarding international issues, as rancid behaviour.

    And these people can also read the minds of Republicans?

    Trump Derangement Syndrome is quite a sight to behold.

  20. Bruce of Newcastle

    If Trump is removed from office:
    (1) He will be removed by a process expressly provided in the Constitution;

    The process the Dems have been carrying out is unconstitutional, as has been pointed out by Mr Dershowitz and others.

    (2) He will removed by delegates elected just as directly, and just as democratically, as those who elected him in the first place;

    True in theory. In practice the Republicans would be going against the wishes of their constituents.

    (3) His behavior will have been rancid enough to turn a substantial fraction of his own party against him; and

    Totally wrong. Trump’s approval is 94% amongst Republican voters. The fraction that are against him are the elites who are betraying their own voters.

    (4) He will be replaced as President by a member of the same party.

    He will uncontitutionally and unjustly be denied the right to take his case to the voters in Nov 2020. Which is what the Dems are after since Pence has the charisma of a bowl of oatmeal.

    So cut the crap about a coup.

    Oh it’s a coup alright. Hopefully the coup plotters will be receive justice. I think it is unlikely. Which probably means the end of the USA as a democracy: it will essentially be a fascist oligarchy of the leftist elites.

  21. Bruce of Newcastle

    (The poll is Quinnipiac from yesterday. You have to read right down to the 94% number because for some reason they don’t headline it. It’s a mystery.)

  22. candy

    If he is removed it will because of disloyal Republicans who simply don’t like Trump as their President and moving with the Dems is in their interests, personal, financial, career-wise.

    I imagine they deplore the deplorables and hate representing them. A bit low for them to mix with. As with Democrats, they dislike the ordinary folk trying to make a better life for themselves.

    What a stupid moustache that Bolton chap has. He looks ridiculous. Like a moustache wearing a man.

  23. bollux

    The only thing Trump has done has exposed the communists in the Democrat Party and the M.S.M and now they are exposed for all to see. Biden did exactly what the Left are accusing Trump of and the media shows no interest. Lines from a hastily written draft copy of a book written by Bolton and sponsored by the NYT has suddenly appeared as “evidence”. Where was this during the Democrat investigation. These people make it up as they go.

  24. NYT has suddenly appeared as “evidence”.

    As I pointed out earlier, the MSM just creating another ‘bombshell’.

    If Bolton did have any evidence, why wasn’t he called up by the Democrats during their initial investigation? I would assume that if what is in his book is true, he would have breathlessly run to the Democrats to show what he had available, given that he doesn’t appear to like Trump.

  25. candy

    If Bolton did have any evidence, why wasn’t he called up by the Democrats during their initial investigation?

    I think Bolton’s main aim is financial gain, with a bit revenge thrown in.
    The Dems let it wait till the best time to sell his book which is probably coming up very soon. A kind of arrangement that suits Bolton and the Dems, with the Dems just hoping the “evidence” will convince impeachers to impeach.

  26. FelixKruell

    Wow a whole post on the impeachment!

    ..and NONE of it goes to the actual accusations and charges that led to the impeachment.

    Why are you so studiously avoiding this? Do you dispute that Trump did what he was accused of? Or do you acknowledge what he did, but not think it wrong or worthy of impeachment?

  27. PeterM

    Here’s a thought. The House has apparently rushed to impeach without taking enough evidence, and now wants the Senate to make up for their deficiencies. How about the House asks to withdraw the articles so that it can resume the inquiries in the House and put more comprehensive articles together?

  28. Leo G

    His behavior will have been rancid enough to turn a substantial fraction of his own party against him

    High Crimes against the sense of entitlement of congressmen.

  29. candy

    Here’s a thought. The House has apparently rushed to impeach without taking enough evidence, and now wants the Senate to make up for their deficiencies.

    I think inveigling/waiting Bolton to publish and all that comes from that. Their last hope in this undemocratic process to take down the President is via Bolton.

  30. Elderly White Man From Skipton

    Among the reasons I dislike Keynesian economics so much is that it turns governments into dispensers of wealth.
    Again, Kates ignores Trump’s total and abject betrayal of those who elected him.
    “the government’s gross debt—the measure of cumulative borrowing that candidate Trump referenced when he announced his candidacy in 2015—currently exceeds $23 trillion and will be approaching $24 trillion as voters go to the polls later this year.” – https://thebulwark.com/trumps-unkept-fiscal-and-spending-promises/

  31. PeterM

    EWMfS, do you think that even if Trump has broken some of his election promises, that he should be impeached? Really?

  32. PeterM

    EWMfS, do you think that Vcie Presidents should be above the law? That Biden should not have been investigated even though there seems to have been cause for concern?

  33. Some people simply hate Trump because he represents everything that politicians generally are not, especially those on the Left and the supporters of the Left. Trump is one who keeps his promises (as best as he can despite massive obstruction), looks after the things that actually matter (the workers and the country as a whole) and doesn’t bow down to Leftist dogma and crap (globalisation, global warming etc).

  34. bollux

    Fact: The promised aid to Ukraine was delivered [sept. 12th]before the due date [sept 30th]
    Fact: No complaint ever came from Ukraine.
    Fact: Trump is accused of what Joe Biden bragged about.
    Fact: Even if there was a shred of evidence, which there isn’t, it is not an impeachable offence. If anything, the administration slowed funding because the Europeans wern’t pulling their weight [regarding funding].
    Fact: Trump released his transcript immediately.
    Fact: Trump explicitly ordered “no quid pro quo”.
    Fact: Democrats said he would be impeached even before his inaugration in 2016.

  35. Gavin R Putland

    Me at #3305353:

    If Trump is removed from office…

    Note the first word. So if other commenters didn’t like my point (3), all they had to say was “That’s a big ‘If’!”
    And if they had cited Trump’s approval rating among GOP voters as evidence that it’s a big ‘If’, that would have been fair enough.
    Nothing in my last post tells you what *I* think of Trump. To divine that, you have to look elsewhere.

  36. Elderly White Man From Skipton

    PeterM: No. I don’t think Presidents or Vice Presidents should be above the law. In fact I don’t think anyone should be above the law. This is precisely why I think Trump is such a danger.

  37. Fisky

    Hey look! Metro’s back.

    Hi Wayne!

  38. Lee

    Again, Kates ignores Trump’s total and abject betrayal of those who elected him.
    “the government’s gross debt—the measure of cumulative borrowing that candidate Trump referenced when he announced his candidacy in 2015—currently exceeds $23 trillion and will be approaching $24 trillion as voters go to the polls later this year.” – https://thebulwark.com/trumps-unkept-fiscal-and-spending-promises/

    It’s funny how when conservative governments have a large debt but the economy is otherwise humming along very well, according to lefties like you, it’s a bad or terrible thing, but when it’s a left wing government it’s terrific economic management.

    EWMS – anything to say about U.S. debt under Obama rising from 10.9 t0 just under 20 million, and all with nothing to show for it?

    I thought not!

  39. Kneel

    ” It has been enacted into law in 16 jurisdictions with 196 electoral votes (CA, CO, CT, DC, DE, HI, IL, MA, MD, NJ, NM, NY, OR, RI, VT, WA).

    And it has absolutely no validity in a national election, as the Federal Election Commission will tell them, and then the Supreme Court will tell them again if they are slow witted.
    Want to change the rules regarding Presidential elections? Amend the Constitution… and that isn’t going to happen.”

    Err, no.
    Electors vote for their preferred candidate.
    Electoral colleges then send a representative to the national “election”, where they vote.
    They are supposed to vote as the voters indicated, but are not required to.
    By changing state law in the indicated way, they can change the outcome, if that is what they want to do – it is legal and constitutional. Not very “good” as far as the actual electors are concerned…

  40. Whenever Steve Kates posts, the same pack of idiots stick their heads up.
    Steve, are they co workers?

  41. PeterM

    EWMfS @ 2:11:

    PeterM: No. I don’t think Presidents or Vice Presidents should be above the law. In fact I don’t think anyone should be above the law. This is precisely why I think Trump is such a danger.

    OK, so there was some indication that a VP HAD broken laws (even the Obama people were concerned – at least about managing the spin) so do you think Trump should have looked the other way? Or should he have made enquiries, or caused enquiries to be made?

    I accept that you think Trump is a danger, but unless you can point to some actual laws that Trump has broken I’ll put that down to TDS

  42. Cui Bono

    More bombshells please. Makes the msm more redundant.

  43. Elderly White Man From Skipton

    Winston: I my case I have never worked in the public service in my life. So that would be a no. I’m just a conservative who believes institutions and rule of law are important and I believe Trump is now and has always been a spiv and a grub.
    Kates, on the other hand, is a lifetime Canberra lobbyist and public servant and – he says – ex Communist (why is that such a common . trait with the gullible?)

    PeterM: It’s the Constitution and the Senate is required to judge abuse of power. I have made my own judgment on the impeachment question from the evidence given in the House and expect evidence from Bolton and others would only confirm that. But in my opinion the Ukrainian capers are not at all the worst of his misdeeds.

  44. 1735099

    I accept that you think Trump is a danger, but unless you can point to some actual laws that Trump has broken I’ll put that down to TDS

    Do they have laws against sexual assault in the USA?

  45. candy

    Some people simply hate Trump because he represents everything that politicians generally are not,

    I know this sounds a bit silly but some people simply hate Trump because of his hairstyle, his skin complexion, his hands, or his BMI, his beautiful wife or his successful children. The cartoonists feast on these things. That he has moved USA into a better place economically is not valid to them.
    Really it’s just TDS.

  46. Lee

    I believe Trump is now and has always been a spiv and a grub.

    And if you think that his opponent at the last election – Hillary Clinton – is any better, you have another think coming.

    She has (rightly in my opinion) been described as “the most corrupt U.S. presidential candidate in history.”

  47. jupes

    I believe Trump is now and has always been a spiv and a grub.

    Here we have a self-described “conservative”, railing against the only politician on the planet fighting for conservative values.

    You sir, are a fuckwit of the ocean-going class.

  48. FelixKruell

    Bollux:

    Fact: The promised aid to Ukraine was delivered [sept. 12th]before the due date [sept 30th]
    Fact: No complaint ever came from Ukraine.
    Fact: Trump is accused of what Joe Biden bragged about.
    Fact: Even if there was a shred of evidence, which there isn’t, it is not an impeachable offence. If anything, the administration slowed funding because the Europeans wern’t pulling their weight [regarding funding].
    Fact: Trump released his transcript immediately.
    Fact: Trump explicitly ordered “no quid pro quo”.
    Fact: Democrats said he would be impeached even before his inaugration in 2016.

    You set a very low bar for ‘facts’ in support of Trump.

    And haven’t really engaged with the ‘facts’ as alleged in the articles of impeachment. Much like Kates, you’re avoiding the topic. I wonder why?

  49. Iampeter

    Here’s a thought. The House has apparently rushed to impeach without taking enough evidence, and now wants the Senate to make up for their deficiencies.

    It was Trump who refused to provide the evidence and ordered witnesses to not comply with House subpoenas, promising to “fight” this in the Senate.
    Rather than waiting for their requests to make their way through the courts and potentially trigger an actual constitutional crisis if Trump refuses to comply anyway, the House democrats decided to call his bluff and impeach him with what they had.

    It was a mistake in my opinion, but everything that is happening right now is exactly what Trump wanted.

  50. Iampeter

    … the only politician on the planet fighting for conservative values.

    The fact that any conservative could say such a thing about Trump is why conservatism is the burning dumpster fire that it is and why none of you have any credibility on anything.

    You wouldn’t imagine it possible to find more clueless leftists than BernieBro’s or Warren supporters, but here we are…

  51. jupes

    You sir, are a fuckwit of the ocean-going class.

    Not to be outdone, up pops the fuckwit of the universe-going class.

  52. Lee

    I believe Trump is now and has always been a spiv and a grub.

    Here we have a self-described “conservative”, railing against the only politician on the planet fighting for conservative values.

    So-called conservative and right wingers who rail against Trump seem to think that there is conservative or right wing alternative to Trump.

    There isn’t any.

    Only on the left.

    But I think these so-called conservative and right wingers would rather vote for even the most far-left Democrat than Trump.

  53. Fisky

    I’m just a conservative who believes institutions and rule of law are important

    What’s your position on global warming alarmism?

  54. Iampeter

    I’m just a conservative who believes institutions and rule of law are important

    What’s your position on global warming alarmism?

    OOh! Quick everyone! Deep political discourse is imminent!

  55. Lee

    I’m just a conservative who believes institutions and rule of law are important

    What’s your position on global warming alarmism?

    And on “rule of law” when Obama and Hillary Clinton were in government?

    They broke so many federal laws (or bent them) it’s not funny.

    Oh, I forgot; forget about observing the constitution and rule of law when the Democrats are running the country.

  56. Mick Gold Coast QLD

    From Gavin R Putland at 8:37 am:

    “If … “

    BZZZZZTTTTT

    You are an idiot, sorf off.

  57. Tel

    And on “rule of law” when Obama and Hillary Clinton were in government?

    They broke so many federal laws (or bent them) it’s not funny.

    If the rule of law was still operating both Hillary and Obama would be in prison for multiple crimes. Just the bombing of civilians in Yemen alone should be sufficient. Admittedly, Trump hasn’t been great on the Yemen issue but things have calmed down there a little bit, under Obama it was significantly worse.

    That said, it’s never to late to come back and clean up properly.

  58. Mick Gold Coast QLD

    Oh Sweet Cheeses – there is a plague of them here!

    Not a one of them was belted senseless often enough as young adults.

  59. Tim Neilson

    It’s funny how when conservative governments have a large debt but the economy is otherwise humming along very well, according to lefties like you, it’s a bad or terrible thing, but when it’s a left wing government it’s terrific economic management.

    Yes – Obama and Rudd/Swan’s “stimulus” did work wonders didn’t they? Goose Swansteen – the world’s greatest Treasurer.

    In Trump’s case the debt is less of a percentage of GDP than when he took office.

    I’d say the increase in debt is still a bad thing, but it’s clearly arguable that Trump has improved the position in the sense of the USA’s ability to handle its debt.

  60. The BigBlueCat

    The fact that any conservative could say such a thing about Trump is why conservatism is the burning dumpster fire that it is and why none of you have any credibility on anything.

    And yet Trump is a huge fan of Ayn Rand and Objectivism. Go figure ….

  61. Kneel

    “It was Trump who refused to provide the evidence and ordered witnesses to not comply with House subpoenas, promising to “fight” this in the Senate.”

    They wanted him to appear before them without any counsel – in fact, told him he couldn’t have any. That he couldn’t call his own witnesses. That he couldn’t cross examine witnesses. That he was not allowed to confront his accuser.
    Against ALL precedent, not to mention fairness et al.

    He should and did tell them to go jump.

    Then the Dimocrats wanted very different rules compared to Clinton’s senate impeachment hearing in ’98.
    Oh yeah, they “didn’t have the time to waste” getting real evidence – there is an election at stake! – so they rushed it through the house, then sat on it for four weeks+ before sending it to the senate. They say a week is a long time in politics, but also that in comedy, timing is everything – forever funny then?

    It is worthwhile to listen to what some of the Dimocrats said during the Clinton impeachment hearing – things like “…high crimes and misdemeanors…”, “…should not be along party lines…” etc etc. In some cases, the very same individuals that railed against a perceived attack against Clinton (even though there was actual evidence he committed a crime) are now demanding Trump be impeached regardless of the lack of evidence of any crime, let alone “high crimes” (treason et al).

    Impeachment of judges and other public officials can be for minor crimes, but not the president – for him, it needs to be “high crimes”. Questioning the right of the house to compel his testimony after he has asserted executive privilege is not a crime, it’s his right and his duty to ask the court to adjudicate such matters. The house wants to by-pass that and deny him his constitutional rights and prevent him performing his duty. And if he refuses (as he did), they are using that as a reason to impeach him!

    Think about that – impeached for performing his sworn duty. Impeached for “crimes” that the “star” witnesses admit were all in their own heads, that Trump had specifically said to these witnesses were not his meaning and intent. Impeached for changing US foreign policy that has been in place for decades – again, read the constitution, it says quite clearly that foreign relations are the executives bally-wick, no one else’s – certainly not the house or the senate, let alone the public service’s!

  62. Iampeter

    Against ALL precedent, not to mention fairness et al.

    No, it’s exactly how House impeachment proceedings run. You seem to have confused them for a court of law or something. Which is exactly the kind of lowest common denominator that Trump’s team is spouting all this nonsense for.

    He should and did tell them to go jump.

    Which he did, which constituted obstruction and which in turn became another article of impeachment.

    Impeachment of judges and other public officials can be for minor crimes, but not the president – for him, it needs to be “high crimes”.

    Which is left up to the House to determine. They are not “crimes” in the legal sense. Any real crimes that Trump could be charged with would only happen after and if he is removed from office, at which point all the legal processes you are looking for would come into play.

    In short, you are completely unfamiliar with the impeachment process and as such have bought into all the nonsense talking points from team Trump.

  63. JC

    and as such have bought into all the nonsense talking points from team Trump.

    As against those talking points from the Schiff/Nadler axis.

    “Talking points”, you fucking imbecile are eggsactly what happens in a case such as impeachment. Back to your room and take the meds. Go on, scoot off.

  64. Iampeter

    As against those talking points from the Schiff/Nadler axis.

    No.

    As opposed to knowing what you’re talking about. Funny how that never occurs to you…

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