Question climate change in school, or how to get expelled

Last week I received this email from a Cat reader:

I’ve come across an event – teaching climate change in schools – that may need greater attention and inquiry, and that it may be of interest to you.

My daughter attends a well off primary school in Sydney’s lower north shore. I attended a ‘meet the teacher/parent’ night, where this years’ Unit of Inquiry was announced to be climate change. The whole course – from what I’ve read- is presupposing the most dramatic of CAGW, and the children are being asked – for a first project – to find a photo of the horrible impact of CAGW.

I have raised this with the school, and asked why they are presupposing CAGW. The school denies it is, but does not represent any contrary claims – and I had to introduce Ian Plimer’s book “How to get expelled from school” as a resource to them.

This concerns me greatly. My daughter is already talking of lone polar bears afloat on icebergs drifting in a sea of CAGW. I’ve been trying to redress the imbalance, but the whole course is weighted to the ‘pro’ argument, there is little opposition.

For a school such as this one to hold the values of inquiry and debate, yet simultaneously teach without opposition CAGW, leads me to think they are either being mandated to do so, or there’s an unwritten directive?

I think this deserves greater attention – does the syllabus demand CAGW be taught?

So young minds are being exposed to extremist propaganda.

Then yesterday Deadman reported that his 17 year old had gotten himself into a spot of bother:

My 17 y.o. son, at a packed electoral meeting in the Town Hall for young people today, could not help himself when Nick McKim brought out the ol’ 97% lie—of the supposed consensus of scientists who support the pseudo-scientific conjecture of AGW—and, when he had the microphone in hand, said “Please stop lying; the 97% statistic if f*cking bullshit, and you f*cking know it, you c*nt.”
This was, he concedes, a tad rude but The Greens of all people should appreciate the triumph of feelings over rational argument.

Yes, well. What’s happening next? Alfred tells:

I have just received a phone call from one of the assistant principals of Hobart College bidding me to meet her tomorrow morning to discuss my uncivil language at the electoral meeting.
I shall provide a report.

Deadman is supporting his son.

Well, it will be interesting to hear Alfred’s report of this morning’s meeting when he comes home from school today because I just had a call from one of the vice principals, Vanessa Warren, who wants me to attend a hearing with her and my son (and, perhaps—for she was not too clear—, the principal as well). She spoke of suspending* Alfred for what she asserted was grossly offensive language. I put it to her that Alfred was not there as a representative of Hobart College and that no impartial observer would have reason to believe that he was representing the school thereat but she maintained that he was “right in the middle of a large group” from the school which, apparently, gives the school authority to determine speech codes in public fora. I also told her that I (and judicial precedent) did not consider Alfred’s robust and admittedly intemperate words to be remarkably offensive, but that made her even more breathlessly incoherent.
At some stage tomorrow I shall probably feel obliged to mention that I have ’blogs and I’m not afraid to use them.

* suspending! what a threat!

Excellent.

I do have to say, however, that calling a Greens politician a “cunt”, while probably satisfying, is over the top and deserving of some reprimand – although expulsion is probably an over-reaction.* Especially given that young excitable minds should not be exposed to extremist left-wing views during school hours. What were they thinking?

For those wanting to engage in a letter writing exercise, Grigory Potemkin has very kindly provided the details. Please be civil and sign your real name in any letters.

*Even by our very lax – some might say “low” – standards we don’t approve of such language here at the Cat.

Update: Alfred describes the meeting he had today (emphasis added):

Today I had a meeting with one of the Vice Principals of Hobart College to discuss my actions at the electoral forum on Tuesday. From what the VP said, it seems that the main cause for alarm is my language in calling the knowingly deceitful Nick McKim a liar, as calling someone a liar is worse then calling someone a c*nt. After agreeing with me that she has no right to take away my rights, the VP confined me to a room by myself. (Another member of the staff later admitted to me that he didn’t know it existed.)
I managed to record the forty minutes of conversation between me and the VP and, for the last twenty minutes or so, a social worker (or the like), wherein I learned that the school had had some contact with Nick McKim’s office—but she provided no further details (I was so astonished that my eyebrow went up a sixteenth of an inch and my monocle slipped from my eye-socket). She had no intention to advise my parents, by the way, until I insisted that she call my father.

This is starting to look like a ‘Politician bullies school boy’ story.

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670 Responses to Question climate change in school, or how to get expelled

1 2 3
  1. stackja

    So young minds are being exposed to extremist propaganda.

    Usual procedure nowadays. But I agree some words should never be used though.

  2. C.L.

    I do have to say, however, that calling a Greens politician a “c—”, while probably satisfying, is over the top …

    Not at all.

  3. Badjack

    Most people think c–ts are useful so the young lad got a bit mixed up

  4. Gab

    This concerns me greatly. My daughter is already talking of lone polar bears afloat on icebergs drifting in a sea of CAGW. I’ve been trying to redress the imbalance, but the whole course is weighted to the ‘pro’ argument, there is little opposition.

    For a school such as this one to hold the values of inquiry and debate, yet simultaneously teach without opposition CAGW, leads me to think they are either being mandated to do so, or there’s an unwritten directive?

    Of course, the precedents are all there for such brainwashing. Think Mao, Hitler, Stalin, the Kims of North Korea, madrasas etc etc etc

    How else does the Left ensure compliance to and longevity of their Marxist ideology without brainwashing the youth of a nation?

  5. .

    The school exposed young minds to politics and got a political reply. They literally asked for it.

    That ought to be the end of the lesson for the low information administrators.

  6. JC

    Even by our very lax – some might say “low” – standards we don’t approve of such language here at the Cat.

    Sinc, there should be no limitations as to what people use when describing the human trash. The c bomb is perfectly apt.

  7. the sting

    I would ask his principals,if they have ever seen a mare in charge of 40 stallions.

  8. .

    To sum up my position, Alfred is this school’s “Three-Eyed Fish”.

    http://simpsons.wikia.com/wiki/Blinky

    They just didn’t like that a contrived situation got horribly out of their control.

  9. Rabz

    I do have to say, however, that calling a Greens politician a “c*nt”, while probably satisfying, is over the top and deserving of some reprimand

    Oh, bollocks.

  10. For a little historical background on Alfred’s sceptical bent, see his 2011 review of his class on “the Impact of Climate Change”.

  11. boy on a bike

    According to the ABC broadcasting guidelines, Deadman’s sprog was perfectly within his rights to use such offensive language. The rationale is thus:

    1. Young people swear a lot these days
    2. Sprog was surrounded by young people
    3. Therefore, swearing is fine
    4. Especially if it was used in context (which I believe it was)

    Case closed. The principal’s complaint goes into the 95% rejection rate for ABC complaints.

    Given that the ABC is such an important, national broadcaster beloved of luvvies, I see no reason why we should not follow the ABC precedent and let sprog off without any sanction whatsoever.

  12. Aaron

    There’s a lot of this sort of insidiousness going on in our schools. I was observing a colleague teach a class last week and the topic was ‘Invasion of Australia’ which supposedly occurred in 1788. The term ‘invasion’ is a ex post facto label the Left has imposed in order to redefine an historical event to satisfy contemporary prejudices. She was adamant despite some queries from students that it was a ‘settlement’ or ‘colonisation’ but it is concerning that some teachers use the classroom as a bully pulpit to enforce dogmatic ideas rather than as a forum for robust discussion and intellectual development.

  13. Grumbles

    The thing is tho, several of the pro CAGW claims have been thoroughly debunked, and yet they still spout them, how do we get them to stop making claims that they know to be untrue? I totally understand the emotion from someone so young. A good question to the principal might be along the lines of he was obviously lying so what should my son have said?

  14. Bear Necessities

    My advice to the parent of the Lower North Shore school is to inform regular donaters to the school of the school’s ciruculum regarding climate change. Hopefully these donaters to the school have a skeptical attitude to climate change. Maybe these donaters can then inform the school that there are no more donations until the climate change circulation is based changed.

    If this doesn’t work then find another private school which has a more balanced CC ciriculum.

  15. Driftforge

    Sinc, there should be no limitations as to what people use when describing the human trash. The c bomb is perfectly apt.

    No. Using inspecific language in that manner reflects poorly on the capacity speaker, even while making a point. Far better to develop the rhetorical skill to specify precisely the nature of the abomination before him.

    Some time listening to some Hannan, some Farage …

  16. A Lurker

    I would suggest that if Alfred had used polite words then he would have been ignored, and his point lost into the forgettery of the Left. So good on him for taking up arms against the enemy of reason.

    p.s. Alfred should be reminded that his namesake would have employed more than polite words to defeat the Danes…

  17. .

    Perhaps Driftforge, but he was at his wits end and sometimes you’ve to tell people to stop talking shit.

  18. Driftforge

    ‘Invasion of Australia’

    As long as it is properly regarded as successful and comprehensive, I have no objection to this.

    The suggestion that the previous owners have any standing right to the place if there was an invasion is ridiculous.

    Losers.

  19. cynical1

    The Principal would probably howl with laughter if a Deveny or Darlin’ Clementine used similar language
    about Mr Rabbit.

    Get out the cluebat.

    And hit a few home runs…

  20. .

    Yes cynical, this is a complete and utter crock.

  21. Driftforge

    Perhaps Driftforge, but he was at his wits end and sometimes you’ve to tell people to stop talking shit.

    Not sure that it is necessary to talk shit in order to get others to stop doing so.

    For Alfred, if you want to read up on an available rhetorical approach to taking down a Green .

  22. .

    You assume they’re gonna let him talk. This isn’t Q&A and where poor behaviour wins over the public to the other side.

  23. Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

    Alfred is being made a political football by his school, as are all children subjected to outrageous Green propaganda masquerading as ‘education’. Many of us at Catallaxy have put forth our opinions to Alfred on the Monday Open Forum regarding this, where he will find a number of good suggestions concerning his response, or non-response. As Alfred is a minor, his father has a role in addressing any issues or sanctions the school may raise.

    Moderation in language use (Twitter Greenies could certainly use some) is a useful lesson to learn young. We have a swear jar in our house for all intemperate rellies and other miscreants within our family and outside of it. The F word is worth a dollar; the C word is never heard, and would garner $5 at least. Lesser words have correspondingly lesser penalties. The jar is always empty regardless, and no-one ever pays their fines (except us; we pay out when the kids keep tab). I suppose there is a lesson to be drawn from this regarding language use.

    The one for Alfred is that lefties give no quarter.
    Use your intelligence and future career to destroy them, Alfie. Bring them down.

  24. caveman

    Would have like to be there. Think those words would have etched into the minds of those attending, cant shake that loose, forever Nick will be now remembered as a lying tnuc.

  25. boy on a bike

    I’d be tearing strips off the school for failing to teach him rhetoric.

  26. .

    Moderation in language use (Twitter Greenies could certainly use some) is a useful lesson to learn young.

    You just don’t get it do you?

    These people are contemptible, microcephalic idiots who don’t give air to dissent, won’t listen to reason and don’t deserve civility.

    Whatever they are called is simply a demonstration of non metaphysical karmic principles.

  27. .

    boy on a bike
    #1196391, posted on February 20, 2014 at 11:27 am
    I’d be tearing strips off the school for failing to teach him rhetoric.

    A brilliant reversal tactic.

  28. Rabz

    … and don’t deserve civility.

    Too bloody right. Why is this such a difficult concept for various sanctimonious twats commenting here to understand, FFS?

  29. James of the Glen

    Marginally O/T : the regional city council some kilometres from here is gearing up for the WWF/Fairfax “Earth Hour” in March by arranging, prior to Earth Hour, activities for young children in the city’s civic centre.

    I’d be interested in suggestions Cats may have to tackle the council over this brainwashing of the very young.

  30. Gab

    Alfred should just quote a few Marxisms at the VP and the matter would be closed.

  31. Eddystone

    boy on a bike
    #1196391, posted on February 20, 2014 at 11:27 am
    I’d be tearing strips off suing the school for failing to teach him rhetoric.

    FIFY

  32. .

    Please explain why I have to be civil to enemies of civilisation like this:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G880gxjj9dI

    Thank christ I left school years ago. My response would be now “You have no credibility you imbeciles, shut up and get a real job” etc.

    Schools do not offer education, they offer rigidity and inculcation. Teachers are “correct” because they are in a position of authority. Which is what the Finklestein laws wanted politicians to become like.

  33. JC

    BOAB is right. We should apply the ABC standard. If a conservative humping a dog is fun and done in jest, then calling out the human trash is fine. It’s intemperate but certainly okay. Furthermore it’s true.

  34. Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

    These people are contemptible, microcephalic idiots who don’t give air to dissent, won’t listen to reason and don’t deserve civility.

    Of course I get that, Dot (and Rabz?).
    My point, made in every one of my comments on Alfred’s situation, is that language is contextual.
    The context of Greenslime is talking shit. Alfred gave it back to them. No problem.
    Except at school now. Enter Deadman.

  35. .

    James of the Glen
    #1196399, posted on February 20, 2014 at 11:34 am
    Marginally O/T : the regional city council some kilometres from here is gearing up for the WWF/Fairfax “Earth Hour” in March by arranging, prior to Earth Hour, activities for young children in the city’s civic centre.

    I’d be interested in suggestions Cats may have to tackle the council over this brainwashing of the very young.

    They are probably using this as a way of cheaply fulfilling directives ordered to them by their relevant State DLG.

  36. Robert O.

    Interesting to see how Mr. McKim fares in the election shortly. Unfortunately for the electorates around the country, green science is turning out to be an total oxymoron. I would have thought with the realisation that the hockey stick projection was based on an erroneous statistical procedure and most of the models have failed in predicting actual climate data, that this would have started to descend the propaganda chain including schools, politicians, MSM etc., Just think of what could have been done usefully with the money wasted on climate change projects, bureaucracy and so on.

  37. JC

    Dot

    Don’t mention Finkelstien. Whenever I hear the word Finkelstien I want to reach for the Fisk Doctrine.

  38. nic

    I think we need to be mindful that Alfred is 17 and is facing possible school sanctions. Will such sanctions effect his future or University entry? Personally, Im not going to suggest something that I, as an older adult would say. He’s 17. He has to deal with the issue on the basis of ‘rights’ such as natural justice. Telling them to fuck off etc may not help him at all. I don’t want the responsibility of suggesting something that makes me ‘feel better’ when in reality a young bloke has to wear the consequences.

  39. .

    Rain in the food bowl again. Because of cyclonic activity sweeping in from the Pilbara and Kimberly.

    I wonder if Ms Umbridge knows about this factoid of Australian meteorology – and that warming means more drought breaking rains etc.

    These people are clueless poppets.

  40. Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

    I’d be interested in suggestions Cats may have to tackle the council over this brainwashing of the very young.

    If in the evening, attend with floodlights. And protest placards at any time of day.

  41. James of the Glen

    I’ll check, dot. TY.

  42. James of the Glen

    I rather thought the pile of tractor tyres, Lizzie.

  43. .

    You’re right nic.

    I have said that all along. There are ways to upwardly manage these ignorant, peter principle morons.

  44. Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

    Just think of what could have been done usefully with the money wasted on climate change projects, bureaucracy and so on.

    Sounds to me like an excellent ‘school project’ in any ‘climatic’ curriculum.

  45. Senile Old Guy

    Especially given that young excitable minds should not be exposed to extremist left-wing views during school hours. What were they thinking?

    If you read Alfred and Deadman’s accounts you will see this event was not during school hours.

  46. Squirrel

    “A Lurker

    #1196367, posted on February 20, 2014 at 11:13 am

    I would suggest that if Alfred had used polite words then he would have been ignored, and his point lost into the forgettery of the Left. So good on him for taking up arms against the enemy of reason.

    p.s. Alfred should be reminded that his namesake would have employed more than polite words to defeat the Danes…”

    That is a good point, but using language which should be left to attention-seeking comediennes is only playing into the hands of the smarmy, sanctimonious lefties. Perhaps, after the change of government, young Mr Deadman should ask the school principal to hold a debate on the subject, where boths sides can be given equal time to present their arguments and “facts”.

  47. Demosthenes

    I put it to her that Alfred was not there as a representative of Hobart College and that no impartial observer would have reason to believe that he was representing the school thereat but she maintained that he was “right in the middle of a large group” from the school which, apparently, gives the school authority to determine speech codes in public fora.

    That’s incredible. I know schools with uniforms are all itchy about what their students do on the way to and from school because they’re recognisable and thus reflect on the school, blah blah. But to take issue with a young man acting as a private citizen exercising his constitutionally protected right to political free speech..!

    That they think suspension – ie missing out on learning, what he’s supposedly there for – is an appropriate reaction is just stupid.

  48. Senile Old Guy

    This concerns me greatly. My daughter is already talking of lone polar bears afloat on icebergs drifting in a sea of CAGW. I’ve been trying to redress the imbalance, but the whole course is weighted to the ‘pro’ argument, there is little opposition.

    Well, I’ve had no trouble redressing the balance. Just show the young ones a plot of temperature, point out that the polar bear population is increasing and the photo was used out of context. Up here in the north, I can also ask people to step outside and I then point out that the change in temperature they just experienced is many times greater than that predicted from AGW. It’s also useful to point out that for most of the last several years the BoM has predicted a greater than average cyclone season and every time I breathe easy, because they always get it wrong.

  49. Gab

    Just a pity Alfred didn’t attend the meeting with a lawyer in tow. As Obama said, ” ‘If They Bring a Knife to the Fight, We Bring a Gun’ “.

  50. ar

    The kid should have thrown a sandwich.

  51. Ant

    My own kids get doses of socialist propaganda at school.

    When they get home, I administer the intellectural enema and they’re all good again.

  52. Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

    ‘… after the change of government’.

    Hang on to that, Alfred, as I alluded to on the Open Forum.
    These ‘Principals’ may have had their day in Tasmania.
    Perhaps they should bear this in mind in relation to young Mr. Deadman.
    A political tightrope walk is coming up for you, dear ladies.

  53. Gab

    That they think suspension – ie missing out on learning,

    If you read Alfred’s blog linked by Deadman, you’ll see that Alfred would not be missing out on any “learning” but he would miss out on propaganda.

  54. Louis Hissink

    I would ask his principals,if they have ever seen a mare in charge of 40 stallions.

    Hah!, When I was in horse-riding school at the Wolfer’s school in Warriewood, one duty was to get the school horses in the morning. I had a stallion to ride, and had one of those, momentary, lapses, when I was distracted by two mares fighting each other, and then realised I tied the stallion in a stupid spot.

    Those were the days……

  55. .

    History shows us Alfred did the right thing.

    As dramatised by the bard:

    And since the quarrel
    Will bear no color for the thing he is,
    Fashion it thus: that what he is, augmented,
    Would run to these and these extremities;
    And therefore think him as a serpent’s egg,
    Which, hatch’d, would as his kind grow mischievous,
    And kill him in the shell

    Hopefully Nick Mc Kim’s career will end on the stab wounds of preferences on the ides of March!

  56. Arnost

    My daughter attends a well off primary school in Sydney’s lower north shore. I attended a ‘meet the teacher/parent’ night, where this years’ Unit of Inquiry was announced to be climate change.

    Actually – I have two kids attending a “well off primary school in Sydney’s lower north shore”… So it would be interesting to get a hint at which one – or at least understand which year has this on the curriculum (is it on the state curriculum?)…

    I was too busy to attend the recent parent teacher evening (Yes I know … mea culpa … I am a bad parent), but now that I’m thinking about this, my yr 6 kid has asked some unsual questions which had a definite greenie utopia flavour.

  57. Tintarella di Luna

    Deadman if it helps perhaps Alfred could apologise and plead that in the press of the crowd he was transported to the saleyard and hence the saleyard language.

  58. Tintarella di Luna

    That’s incredible. I know schools with uniforms are all itchy about what their students do on the way to and from school because they’re recognisable and thus reflect on the school, blah blah. But to take issue with a young man acting as a private citizen exercising his constitutionally protected right to political free speech..!

    It think Tim Wilson needs to know about this.

  59. thefrollickingmole

    I thnk the best approach would be to ask when they were inviting a skeptic to offer a rebuttal to the greenslime propaganda?

    On the offensive, ask her straight up if any dissenting voices were invited to attend, after all if it was supposed to be a debate but all those in “authority positions” on the podium manically support only one view its about as much of a debate as a Communist meeting ..

    I do have a mate who managed to subvert some of the Abbo “massacre” propaganda his boy was made to do.

    They were supposed to write on a pair of Aboriginals hung for spearing a white man in our district. The subtext was it was a terrible injustice, and all the school provided texts were from black armband historians.
    Problem was the story seemed a little incomplete.
    So my mates kid had a look (google is your friend) and found the local paper of the time had the full transcript of the court proceedings day by day, and they were online.

    A bit more searching found some other material.
    Basically 2 non-local blacks had speared the bloke to rob him, he lived long enough to identify them as “not locals” and local Aborigines tracked them down with the police. There was no doubt who the perpetrators were, or why they had done it, and hanging seems to have been an appropriate sentence.

    Now he had a problem, if his boy wrote a “this is shit” report for the assignment hed get marked down..

    So he wrote 2 reports (little wanker), one based on the schools sources which was all hearts and flowers and the other based on the trial transcript (funny how the school “source materials” missed that) which stated they got what they deserved.

    He passed.

    My mate complained to the school but they pretty well blamed the “curriculum” and the material they were supplied with.

  60. From Wiki

    Before entering parliament, McKim worked as a wilderness guide and advertising executive.

    Nick McKim served time in prison after being arrested during the Farmhouse Creek Blockade in the early 1980s.

  61. Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

    My ten year-old nephew was shocked, absolutely shocked, when his much-loved Auntie Lizzie said that it was irresponsible to vote Green. All of his teachers in his poverty-area school vote and teach Green. Auntie Lizzie then had a few explanatory words with him. And helped his Dad to move and change schools (sometimes the only way out for individuals; hard luck on those left behind though).

  62. Demosthenes

    I thnk the best approach would be to ask when they were inviting a skeptic to offer a rebuttal to the greenslime propaganda?

    For them, it would be like the AMA inviting a homeopath to speak at their cardiothoracic surgery conference.

  63. cohenite

    One of the main methods and tactics used by AGW is children. Getfuckedup for instance.

    I suggest Alfred use the 10:10 video to justify his language.

  64. Bruce of Newcastle

    The photo of the lone polar bear on an iceberg was photoshopped of course. There is a version with a penguin.

    I would like to see one of polar bear surrounded by feathers and bloodstains, but alas I can’t find one.

  65. Hopefully Nick Mc Kim’s career will end on the stab wounds of preferences on the ides of March!

    Unfortunately that is unlikely. Denison is likely to be a simple 2:2:1, returning all three party leader and the hangers on in the majors.

    Quite a few of the other Greens will be sweating the preferences though. Braddon is gone, Lyons and Bass will be tight.

    Barring strangeness, we can expect a 14-7-3-1 (Lib-Lab-Grn-Pup) result + or – 1 in each case.

  66. Baldrick

    Alfred used the word c*nt directed towards McKim.
    The use of that word in the context of that meeting has been peer-reviewed by the ‘Cats’ and found to have been used in an appropriate manner.
    Case closed!

  67. Lysander

    I love “Low standards” as it means you always meet them. 🙂

  68. boy on a bike

    Let’s parse what sprogo said:

    “Please stop lying

    ;” – these clowns have been lying for years. This is a statement of fact.

    the 97% statistic if f*cking bullshit,

    also correct, assuming that “f*cking bullshit” means something that is an immense untruth

    and you f*cking know it,

    This assumes that they know they are lying. They might be so wedded to their religious convictions, they don’t actually f*cking know it. So he could be pinged on this.

    you c*nt.”

    These CAGW have compared us to holocaust deniers. They have done their best to destroy anyone that gets in their way. They have called for public servants who are “deniers” to be sacked. They have called for deniers to be given a tattoo. Sprog is correct – they are c*nts.

    So he is totally correct on 3 out of 4 points. He should be corrected on point 3 – he should have said “and you should f*cking know it”

  69. boy on a bike

    97% of CAT reviewers believe it’s OK to call this prick a c*nt.

    Actually, as it is 69 comments out of 69 so far, it’s 100%.

  70. Ubique

    Surely the progressives should be applauding the initiative and courage shown by this young man in challenging the establishment and questioning orthodoxy.

  71. Gab

    Next time just use “mussel” as a substitute for “crunt”, after all this has been approved terminology by gillard and Slipper.

  72. johanna

    Just as well P J Keating didn’t attend Alfred’s school. He would have been expelled before he got from the gate to the classroom on Day 1. Our ex PM’s foul mouth would make a wharfie blush.

    Of course, it’s different when they do it.

  73. boy on a bike

    He fought the power.

    He took on a bunch of religious nutters.

    He spoke truth to power.

    They should make him school captain.

  74. Mater

    Deadman,
    Propose they use it as a learning experience for all by debating the issue. However, don’t debate the climate science, you’ll get nowhere. Schools don’t have an abundance of so-called climate scientists so that would only end in a battle of hearsay (been done to death). Instead, get them to debate the 97% claim itself and the so-called research behind it. You don’t need to be a climate specialist to investigate this, merely a statistician. A half-competent statistician would destroy the claim in minutes and the Maths Department in the school might benefit in the process. Your son’s work is basically done.

  75. nilk

    Yes, the CAGW propaganda is all through the schools. I took my girl from a state school and put her into the catholic system.

    Bad call, Ripley. But, also a steep learning curve for both of us. The ‘tolerance’ and pc brigade are even more robust in the newer school, and I’m saving up a few of the notes home to parents detailing homework exercises, the ubiquitous ‘worksheets’ with some gobbledygook that is supposed to be educational, and examples of grammar that would make Deadman cry.

    Add to that, my girl is learning to navigate the waters populated by sharks and prissy knowitalls of all ages, and that there are things We Don’t Speak Aloud.

    Such as, “There’s no such thing as global warming. My mum says it’s just weather.” That caused an attack of the vapours for the teacher last year, and occasioned some garbled comeback.

    The upshot is that my respect for the teachers and the school plummeted, and we are encouraged to do more study at home.

    And don’t get me started on last year’s “Healthy Eating” project.

  76. Baldrick

    Well now we even have a precedent … F*uck you c*nt on social media from 2013.

  77. .

    boy on a bike
    #1196506, posted on February 20, 2014 at 1:01 pm
    He fought the power.

    He took on a bunch of religious nutters.

    He spoke truth to power.

    They should make him school captain.

    Good luck. The teachers usually choose an absolute kowtowing spiv if not a worthy athlete.

  78. JC

    Wow… I wouldn’t have lasted long at that fucking school.

    I think the interesting take in all this is that we’re seeing people fighting back against the human trash. They were never prepared for it and don’t like it one bit.

    Go harder on them as the scum deserve it.

  79. dan

    Bad language, bad manners and just appalling behaviour by a child in an adult environment. I disagree with the Greens and would agree they are basically fascists but recently my local senator met me to discuss an urgent problem which neither major party’s representatives were interested in, and he put a firecracker under them and solved it.

    In life you need to be able to negotiate with people even if you don’t particularly respect them. I manage a lot of these situations in professional life and have won some adequate outcomes. I don’t know that any punishment would be helpful for anyone but swearing in people in public is just stupid.

  80. cohenite

    Cook’s consensus of 97% is dealt with here, notably in the comments which Cook participates in.

  81. Bruce of Newcastle

    97% of CAT reviewers believe it’s OK to call this prick a c*nt.

    You are oversimplifying Boab. Yes he is a cnut but no you should not call him that. You should call him an ideological warrior with an unsubstantiated hypothesis which recent science disproves. Always be polite and use lots of syllables. It works better, and they faces screw up interestingly when they try to understand what you just said.

  82. This assumes that they know they are lying.

    The false (and fallacious) “97% consensus” which the mendacious, mean-minded, misanthracist, mealy-mouthed, maleficent, mulcting, maniacally misanthropist McKim and others like to mention has been thoroughly debunked. It is unforgivable for an MP (and, until quite recently, minister of education) who claims to speak authoritatively on such a matter to be ignorant of that debunking. Either he knew that the “97% consensus” is a lie, and mischievously repeated the falsehood, or he did such minimal research on the issue whereof he pretends to have more than average knowledge that his lazy cluelessness might be fairly considered to constitute such wilful ignorance that, from his making no attempt to test the validity of his own pronouncements, it amounts to deliberate deception.

  83. Pickles

    Any news from the front?

  84. Gab

    The false (and fallacious) “97% consensus” which the mendacious, mean-minded, misanthracist, mealy-mouthed, maleficent, mulcting, maniacally misanthropist McKim

    Magnificent.

  85. Menai Pete

    Doesn’t he know that only Greens are allowed to use THAT word?

  86. elhombre

    Reminds me of the song Kris Kristoffason and Johnny Rotten did together .. “You don’t send me flowers no more you f*cken c*nt”

  87. Michel Lasouris

    It was the final observation I find hard to accept. The adjectives describing the Speaker were quite acceptable.
    But to refer to the speaker in terms of ladies private parts is wrong…The lad should have paused and said ” I’m so angry at your blatant lies, I was going to call you something you are not. You see that descriptive is very useful to we chaps, however you you are patently, totally un-useful.
    Easy to think of these things afterwards I suppose

  88. MT Isa Miner

    Deadman, jumped in before reading. Before I saw that many cats have already given you the drum.

  89. Gab

    Any word? I want to know if Alfred was shipped off to the gulags for intensive climate change therapy.

  90. Des Deskperson

    ‘Just as well P J Keating didn’t attend Alfred’s school. He would have been expelled before he got from the gate to the classroom on Day 1. Our ex PM’s foul mouth would make a wharfie blush.’

    I imagine Keating would have been a right little suck hole teachers pet at school.

  91. Hawkeye P.

    “I do have to say, however, that calling a Greens politician a “c*nt”, while probably satisfying, is over the top and deserving of some reprimand.”

    Oh dear. May I make a suggestion? How about:

    “Tut, tut. Next time call the esteemed Green pollie something a little less profane and a tad more accurate, like a ‘scum-sucking oxygen thief’.”

    Are we good?

  92. Vicki

    Not surprised that a “lower North Shore” school is teaching this rubbish. The Cat reader’s daughter, and the two kids of Arnost (@12.04) probably attend the same one as my two grandkids.

    I have already recounted how my heart was broken when I could not persuade my cherished grandson that he should include “Australian values” in an assignment. He had been asked to discuss what characterises an Australian citizen & what are the processes of naturalisation. He was afraid to refer to Australian values “in case he might offend someone”!

    Thank god my granddaughter, who is fiercely independently minded, refuses to accept anything she doesn’t agree with, and is seemingly genetically sceptical. At least that’s one for Rational Thinking & one for the PC brigade.

    Deadman, good luck with Alfred. It’s about time the Left got a good kick in the nether regions.

  93. handjive

    The previous GreenLaboUr government, in conjunction with the Climate Commission, CSIRO, BoM & various other govt. climate quangos, felt so threatened by Ian Plimer, they created a website specifically to dis-credit his book, “Responses to Professor Ian Plimer’s 101 climate questions“.

    Sadly, the new Abbott government has continued the evil tradition of persecuting anyone who disagrees with the climate consensus, by maintaining the website.

    This could answer the question regarding the ingrained teaching of AGW in the education system.

  94. Jessie

    JC 11.39

    OT
    I find it ironic that some racially mixed Aborigines use public art to call out their greater genetic component, labelling their forebears trash.

    Habitus – Habitat presents thought-provoking works such as Fiona Foley’s politically loaded and provocative work Signpost II (the derogatory words ‘white trash’ spelt out in thrift store clothing; literal ‘white trash’ on the pure white sands of Fraser Island)

    Richard Bell, another artefact of racial mixing copulation.
    There is some precedence for Alfred’s comments.

  95. A Lurker

    Bad language, bad manners and just appalling behaviour by a child in an adult environment.

    @ Dan, I question your assumption that it was an adult environment.

  96. Ranga

    You never give your enemy something they can then use against you.
    That is exactly what this young lad has done. I hope he learns from it.

    They can now go into a meltdown about the bad language and conveniently ignore the rest of what he said.

  97. Nanuestalker

    Sorry Alfred but while your profanity isn’t wrong it detracted greatly from any point you may have wanted to make. Everyone lets their frustration get the better of them from time to time, particularly as teenagers. Learn from this own goal but in the meantime, let you father tell the powers to be at your school to get fucked.

  98. Rudiau

    Deadman.

    it amounts to deliberate deception.

    It is. It also amounts to teaching what to think and not how to think.

  99. Alfred’s home now; he was told not to bring his bag to school tomorrow (when he and I go thither to attend his disciplinary meeting), since he’ll not be attending any classes thereafter nor, he was told, will he be attending school on Monday and Tuesday, probably—this forecast, nota bene, is before we attend his hearing.
    Today, after his meeting with the assistant principal (and a social worker or the like), he was restricted to a room by himself for rest of the school day; he was allowed a break after recess had ended, and another after lunch. He’ll provide further details soon.

  100. Infidel Tiger

    The science is settled and so is Alfred’s punishment.

    Discussion over.

  101. Infidel Tiger

    Punishment: 5 day weekend..

  102. nic

    Deadman, sounds like internal suspension. Ring the Dept of Education and see if you can find their rules/guidelines. You may find that a student cannot be detained from class without the parent informed beforehand etc. Don’t be fobbed off by the Deputy, once you find out the rules, ask to see the Principal, insist. get them on procedural issues, tell them you will be taking the matter up with their superiors.

  103. Ainsley H.

    ok this site is now with my mum, that is, in the Dont Swear category. I work for a tough and rough industry in which c-t is pretty fuggin typical – basically, the blokes swear like troopers, often sounding bloody adorable as they do it. I have men swearing and apologising and swearing all over again-cos they’re blokes not pajamaboys, they’re Australian to the bone and they don’t/can’t/won’t use the sleazy passive-aggressive cant of the elite suited servants i protect them from. There’s a time/place i know, and it’s probably not from a teenager. However, we are Aussies and historically we make no claims of being refined, articulate or easily shocked-not even girlies like me. In all the apparent crudeness i see an honesty startling to foreigners and maybe some metro collared-shirt types but like Oz it is beautiful in its harshness, plus its important when truth is at stake. This also beats the utter s-t out of living silent in some mealy-mouthed culture watching it go down the drain.

  104. Gab

    Today, after his meeting with the assistant principal (and a social worker or the like), he was restricted to a room by himself for rest of the school day; he was allowed a break after recess had ended, and another after lunch. He’ll provide further details soon.

    So he was ganged up on and bullied by two authoritarian adults and then socially excluded from his peers as punishment all because he exercised his right to free speech in this (alleged) democracy.

    Hope you turn up with a lawyer tomorrow mumbling about compensation for mental anguish and emotional pain inflicted upon Albert in today’s mini communist trial.

  105. Toiling Mass

    Ant (#1196440)

    My ‘t’ went astray.

    Or as Senator Cameron would say.

  106. nilk

    My mate complained to the school but they pretty well blamed the “curriculum” and the material they were supplied with.

    That’s because the schools are provided with crap. Each year I provide the teachers with wonderful online resources they’ve never heard of. And books to read…. the readers available per the schools are crap with a capital “K”, so I ignore the reading list and supply my own.

  107. In not completely unrelated news, half of Tasmania’s teens are functionally illiterate (but they do know we’re doomed by rising seas and angry sharks).

  108. johninoxley

    Well done Alfred. Had he called him a lady’s dicky, the greenslime, without a doubt would not have known it was him being referred to.

  109. calli

    bullied by two authoritarian adults and then socially excluded from his peers as punishment

    What complete and utter bullsh*t.

    Sounds like Room 101 is next for Alfred unless he recants.

  110. DrBeauGan

    Adults really should have outgrown linguistic taboos. I read the dictionary of obscene and scatalogical terms when I was fifteen and the sheer absurdity of there being words too terrible to say or print became obvious. The only objection to swearing is the poverty of language it connotes. In the context of the occasion Alfred’s speech was effective and this is the only proper criterion. Good for him and good on deadman for supporting him. This is righteous stuff and the beginning of the end for green fascism. They are scum and telling them so is a public obligation. Use whatever language works in the context as Lizzie says.

  111. .

    Social worker? What a fucking joke.

    This is bad advice, but I’d simply be openly hostile from now on.

    Dr BeauGan, I agree.

  112. Mike of Marion

    Oh Alfred!! His ‘punishment’ reminds me of the time I was flicked from a Catholic Secondary School because I refused to wear the school cap at specified times and places and I used it to polish my shoes at morning assembly. They were the days!!!!!

  113. .

    half of Tasmania’s teens are functionally illiterate

    Don’t worry, they were never going to get a job anyway.

  114. Gab

    I’d like to know by what right the school has any say over what a student does off-campus when not representing the school and out of school hours. Sounds like the college is being run by a mob of fascists.

    I imagine had Alfred directed his intemperate language instead at a Liberal / climate skeptic politician/shock jock, Alfred would by now be celebrated at the college. Such is their hypocrisy.

  115. DrBeauGan

    Alfred, that counts as a win. 🙂

  116. .

    Indeed Gab. I bet this school would have encouraged protest against Howard etc., with a lack of civility too.

    I wonder if the AP has breached HER code of conduct?

  117. Rabz

    half of Tasmania’s teens are functionally illiterate

    Anyone who knows anything about Tasmania and its inhabitants would not be the least bit surprised to hear this.

    If it’s any consolation, the national rate is a staggering 36%.

  118. Toiling Mass

    If we are going all early-British-kings then Alfred could call the greeny a Cnut.

  119. Jim Rose

    So what? I wrote worried high school science essays on global cooling. I survived.

  120. Gab

    Supportive College Environment Policy

    Hope Deadman has a copy.

    code of beHaviour

    The College aims to be a harmonious community where everyone is able
    to enjoy and value learning, work effectively and participate positively, free
    from interference, in all aspects of campus life.
    Our responsibilities as a College Community:
    • we all have a right to learn
    • we all have a right to be safe
    • we all have a right to a clean environment and good health
    •we all have a right to be treated with respect and consideration.

    Our Supportive College Environment Policy incorporates a structured
    sequence of consequences for breaches of the Code of Behaviour.

    http://education.tas.edu.au/academy/hobartcollege/Documents/Student%20Information%20Booklet%202014.pdf

    Clearly they expect this to extend to all areas of student life, on and off-campus.

    Deadman, did you perchance actually sell Alfred to this college? And if so, what price did you get? 🙂

  121. feelthebern

    This is really disturbing.
    From what Deadman & Alfred say about the school, its pretty laid back on discipline.
    So when a bunch of kids, some in uniform, some not, attend a public meeting, not a school assembly, and one of them says/yells something inappropriate, what right does the school have to discipline him?
    Isnt it for the police to pursue if someone makes a complaint (which the cops would not).

    What is the difference with what Alfred did & the following:
    A bunch of kids (some school aged, some not) playing basketball at a public court (not school grounds) after school.
    One of them yells something inappropriate to a member of the public.
    Does the Vice Principal then have the right to exclude the kid from classes?
    Of course not.
    It’s either all in, or its all out.
    Otherwise, I reckon Alfred is being bullied.
    I would contact my local Freedom Commissioner.

  122. Armadillo

    Makes me wonder what the consequences would have been if Alfred were an adult? Nothing I would suspect.

  123. Gab

    I reckon Alfred is being bullied.

    Yes and I’m beginning to wonder if McKim is related to/in relationship with any of the staff at the college.

  124. feelthebern

    McKim is in a relationship with fellow Green, Cassy O’Connor.
    According to Wiki.

  125. Empire Strikes Back

    Enjoy your long weekend Alfred. Thanks for sticking up for reason and calling out bullshit. You give me great hope for the future.

    Say what you mean and say it mean. People who act like dicks should expect to be treated as such.

  126. Anyone who knows anything about Tasmania and its inhabitants would not be the least bit surprised to hear this.

    the national [literacy] rate is a staggering 36%.

    At federation, across Australia the percentage of 5-14 year olds who could read and write was 80%, “an increase of some 4% from 1891; it would rise to the acceptable level of 90% in 1911”. (ABS)
    Before and after WWII literacy was edging close to 100%, in days when many teachers in primary schools had no more than a T.Cert. When I was at primary school even the dumb kids could read; now some lecturers with three or more degrees are semi-literate. I shudder to relate the example of a lecturer in the Faculty of Education at the University of Tasmania (with a doctorate in education, of course) who would refer to an academic paper which she and a colleague had written as “Steve’s and my’s paper”.

  127. Notafan

    I’m imaging the phone calls, the emails, the meetings of VPS and department beaurocrats,.the escalating of issues and seeking of advices.
    It’s a storm in a teacup that will suck up hundreds of man hours,
    A senior secondary college with 4 vice principles, no wonder Tassie’s broke.
    He’s had a one day internal suspension already for crying out loud. Hope you have some good books to read then you will have spent your time more fruitfully than in the classroom, sounds like, Alfred.

  128. Armadillo

    Yes and I’m beginning to wonder if McKim is related to/in relationship with any of the staff at the college.

    Have you done a quick Google to try and establish any links Deadman? I’m assuming if there was a group of students from the College, then they were encouraged to attend the meeting. By whom? And why?

  129. feelthebern

    I reckon there will be some people at the school who will be deleting pictures off their FB, instagram etc as we speak.

  130. Mike of Marion

    Long weekend imposed before a meeting with legal guardian – is that in order?

  131. feelthebern

    Someones twitter if anyone is interested.

    https://twitter.com/NickMcKim

  132. Armadillo

    LOL. It would be hilarious if Deadman found some inconvenient posts or tweets. Let’s see how they like it when others delve into what they do in their own spare time.

  133. Today I had a meeting with one of the Vice Principals of Hobart College to discuss my actions at the electoral forum on Tuesday. From what the VP said, it seems that the main cause for alarm is my language in calling the knowingly deceitful Nick McKim a liar, as calling someone a liar is worse then calling someone a c*nt. After agreeing with me that she has no right to take away my rights, the VP confined me to a room by myself. (Another member of the staff later admitted to me that he didn’t know it existed.)
    I managed to record the forty minutes of conversation between me and the VP and, for the last twenty minutes or so, a social worker (or the like), wherein I learned that the school had had some contact with Nick McKim’s office—but she provided no further details (I was so astonished that my eyebrow went up a sixteenth of an inch and my monocle slipped from my eye-socket). She had no intention to advise my parents, by the way, until I insisted that she call my father.
    Further reports, which will necessarily be lengthy, will be available on my blog, eventually, detailing what happened today (with a transcript of the recording, when I am able) as well as the meeting tomorrow with dad to discuss my future “punishment”.
    I thank people for their advice, support and encouragement.

  134. feelthebern

    https://www.facebook.com/NickMcKim

    And a facebook page.
    So many happy, smiling people on it.

  135. Tintarella di Luna

    Deadman, sounds like internal suspension. Ring the Dept of Education and see if you can find their rules/guidelines. You may find that a student cannot be detained from class without the parent informed beforehand etc. Don’t be fobbed off by the Deputy, once you find out the rules, ask to see the Principal, insist. get them on procedural issues, tell them you will be taking the matter up with their superiors.

    yep,yep,yep — get ’em with their own policies, procedures, complaints guidelines and all the paraphenalia attendant on bureaucriosis . Probably gathering dust on a shelf somewhere. Go get ’em.

  136. .

    the main cause for alarm is my language in calling the knowingly deceitful Nick McKim a liar, as calling someone a liar is worse then calling someone a c*nt. After agreeing with me that she has no right to take away my rights, the VP confined me to a room by myself. (Another member of the staff later admitted to me that he didn’t know it existed.)
    I managed to record the forty minutes of conversation between me and the VP and, for the last twenty minutes or so, a social worker (or the like), wherein I learned that the school had had some contact with Nick McKim’s office—but she provided no further details

    Alfred you are pure political dynamite.

    Events may surround you that are out of your control now.

  137. Mike of Marion

    Well done Alfred. The VP is about to be introduced to the blow-torch!!!!

  138. Armadillo

    wherein I learned that the school had had some contact with Nick McKim’s office

    Astounding.

  139. feelthebern

    Errrr….why would this happen?
    wherein I learned that the school had had some contact with Nick McKim’s office

    Pretty sure this is a breach of your privacy.
    But for one your teachers to do this, wrong.

    Imagine how the Mercury would implode if a teacher got in touch with Tony Abbotts office, to tell them how they handled a shoe thrower (hypothetical of course).

  140. I would have thought calling a Green a liar was a tautology…

  141. Gab

    I managed to record the forty minutes of conversation between me and the VP and, for the last twenty minutes or so, a social worker (or the like), wherein I learned that the school had had some contact with Nick McKim’s office—but she provided no further details (I was so astonished that my eyebrow went up a sixteenth of an inch and my monocle slipped from my eye-socket).

    LOL A chip off the old block, you is.

    I look forward to your colloquy reportage anon.

  142. johanna

    Wow, they put you in solitary confinement?

    What a bunch of tin-pot dictators.

    I’m guessing that they weren’t expecting any push-back on this. I bet they are consulting lawyers and senior bureaucrats as we speak.

    The core question, it seems to me, is what legal right they have to punish you for something that (a) happened outside school hours and off the premises; and (b) did not attract any other sanction – you were not arrested or even ejected, AFAIK.

    It wouldn’t surprise me if they are on thin ice legally.

    Anyway, trust you are not letting it get you down too much. What you did was not exactly prudent, but who is prudent when they are 17? I certainly wasn’t! 😉

    Besides, if they start disciplining every act that 17 year olds do outside school that they don’t approve of, there won’t be many left in the classroom.

  143. Fisky

    (I was so astonished that my eyebrow went up a sixteenth of an inch and my monocle slipped from my eye-socket).

    Bwhahahahahahaha! Gold

  144. feelthebern

    Steve from Brisbane is a bit snippy ’bout this thread.
    3 comments.
    That’s good for his blog isn’t it.

  145. Bruce of Newcastle

    Well done Alfred. If you have difficulties please let us know. I have Ms Warren’s work email from your college’s website should it be necessary, but from your comment it sounds like she is keeping it low key enough for now.

    The Greens are liars, but in some cases this is because of ignorance, though it is hard to think anyone who used Mr Cook’s “97%” figure can be in ignorance, so transparently false is it.

    There is a lot of material around if you need scientific support, not least the American Meterological Society who last year surveyed their own members – meterologists! – and found about half did not agree with the IPCC’s position.

    The 97% consensus myth – busted by a real survey

    Another useful resource is David Evans’ “The Skeptics’ Case” which lays out the position of climate sceptical scientists like myself. Dr Evans has serious cred since he has 6 university degrees and used to work for the Australian Greenhouse Office in Canberra. There’s a link to a pdf version at the bottom of the post.

  146. Not just State and federal law; I shall be quoting the ?UN Convention on the Rights of the Child? tomorrow:

    Article 2
    1. States Parties shall respect and ensure the rights set forth in the present Convention to each child within their jurisdiction without discrimination of any kind, irrespective of the child’s or his or her parent’s or legal guardian’s race, colour, sex, language, religion, political or other opinion, national, ethnic or social origin, property, disability, birth or other status.
    2. States Parties shall take all appropriate measures to ensure that the child is protected against all forms of discrimination or punishment on the basis of the status, activities, expressed opinions, or beliefs of the child’s parents, legal guardians, or family members.

    Article 13
    1. The child shall have the right to freedom of expression; this right shall include freedom to seek, receive and impart information and ideas of all kinds, regardless of frontiers, either orally, in writing or in print, in the form of art, or through any other media of the child’s choice.
    2. The exercise of this right may be subject to certain restrictions, but these shall only be such as are provided by law and are necessary:
    (1) For respect of the rights or reputations of others; or
    (2) For the protection of national security or of public order, or of public health or morals.

    Article 14
    1. States Parties shall respect the right of the child to freedom of thought, conscience and religion.

    Article 28:
    2. States Parties shall take all appropriate measures to ensure that school discipline is administered in a manner consistent with the child’s human dignity and in conformity with the present Convention.

  147. Fisky

    There is a strong case to be made that multiple UN Conventions have been violated. War Crimes might be involved. The entire management of the school must be brought before a hastily-convened tribunal at once!

  148. Andrew

    Perhaps had he worn a T-shirt saying “Fuck Tony Abbott666” or written a blog calling for the glassing and sexual mutilation of Brendan Nelson, his wife and children they would have cut him more slack for his political views? Everybody knows that Green politicians are untouchable saints.

  149. Diogenes

    This is rife everywhere (sadly)
    Case in point the new national technologies curriculum…
    this one of the year 7 objectives
    “analyse the properties of networked systems and their suitability and use for the transmission of data types” and “use structured data to model objects and events that shape the communities they actively engage with” or a year 9/10 objective

    “evaluate their solutions and existing information systems based on a broad set of criteria including connections to existing policies and their enterprise potential. They consider the privacy and security implications of how data are used and controlled, and suggest how policies and practices can be improved to ensure the sustainability and safety of information systems”

    The first part of each objective makes sense and as a long time Software Developer (& reasonably new teacher) I could actually teach it … but they then seem to tack sustainability or communities on the back half which turns it into unteachable gibberish.

  150. Mike of Marion

    Deadman,

    By 1100 Hrs 21 Feb, it will be “all a big mistake and it never happened”. VP will be saying that ‘can we move on’ and …

  151. cohenite

    Nick McKim is a he?! I thought all greens were women even the men.

  152. Notafan

    Mr McLie on twitter says he doesn’t care how much the NBN costs the Liberal government, it’s Tasmania’s future
    Not just a liar, a stupid liar from the mendicant state.

  153. Tintarella di Luna

    I shall be quoting the ?UN Convention on the Rights of the Child? tomorrow:

    Deadman, totally someone after my own heart. Sock it to them. If only our government heeded the sentiments of that Convention we’d have less spiritually stunted, brutalised children and those that the ones that survive. Stead, serene and deadly.

  154. motherhubbard'sdog

    Should have called him McQuim, except it probably would have gone over his head 🙂

  155. I’m eagerly anticipating Alfred’s report (which may take some days to finish). He just mentioned that the social worker at his meeting this morning told him that the electoral forum he attended was not a school function and she agreed that he had every right to speak as he did. Yet at no time did she oppose his being punished by the school for what he said.

  156. Pickles

    Here we have another little fella from Tassie taking on unlimited power. Shades of Boon and Ponting. This is all going very very well Alfred. You are doing the Lord’s work.

    And someone from the school has been in contact with McKim’s office prior to your summary hearing, sentencing and solitary confinement? Exxxcssellent.

  157. .

    He just mentioned that the social worker at his meeting this morning told him that the electoral forum he attended was not a school function and she agreed that he had every right to speak as he did. Yet at no time did she oppose his being punished by the school for what he said.

    …and since when can schools foist social workers on kids without their parents permission (and seemingly at the behest of a Greens politician)?

  158. DrBeauGan

    Go for it deadman! Use the creeps’ own sententious crap against them.

    Alfred, you seem to have got right up their noses at negligible personal cost. This is righteous work.And Psmith is a good rôle model. 🙂

  159. feelthebern

    For those wanting to engage in a letter writing exercise, Grigory Potemkin has very kindly provided the details. Please be civil and sign your real name in any letters.

    Wouldn’t emailing have a smaller carbon footprint? McKim would approve.
    [email protected]

  160. JMH

    I’ve been following this thread with interest.

    I’d say Alfred and Deadman are holding the aces on the face of what has been disclosed so far.

    Go get ’em, guys! Apply the blow-torch and apply it long and hard. This is simply wrong – and disgraceful.

    I look forward to reports after the interrogation tomorrow. Perhaps, then, into a more public forum with this sad and sorry tale. Who is the current Opposition Education portfolio holder – and is he any good? It seems an incident such as this might be a worthy addition to an election campaign.

  161. mizaris

    Stable doors come to mind here – has not the young man already been publicly excluded, victimised, held in confinement, bullied and had to undergo an attempt at intimidation???? Why was this done to him whilst he faced the VP alone??? Would this have occurred if the parent had been present at the first “interview” and why was the parent not invited to this interview? If the school was really concerned with anything they would/should have had first contact with the parent/guardian. That they interviewed the young man without a parent/guardian present stinks to high heaven of (green) bullying. Why is the school ACTIVELY DISCOURAGING the expression of an independent and informed opinion, completely contrary to their stated “creed”???
    Sick ’em Deadman and congratulations on a wonderful son – you should be well proud of him!!

  162. Michael Ferguson (a former federal member for Bass) is the Shadow Minister for Education, JMH, he has degrees in Applied Science and Education, and he seems to have a clue about his portfolio; Alfred and I had a meeting with him three years ago to discuss the compulsory indoctrination of AGW in schools. He kindly told us then that seeing me on television back in the 90s had inspired him to get into politics.

  163. mizaris

    Yet at no time did she oppose his being punished by the school for what he said.

    Well she’s just a cnut then isn’t she.

  164. rebel with cause

    You can find the Tasmanian Department of Education’s discipline policy here

    The school may also have its own discipline policy.

  165. mizaris

    The school may also have its own discipline policy.

    Which it has no right to apply to a student out of school, out of uniform (if such exists), in a public place and not representing the school.

  166. Carpe Jugulum

    This could be fun to drop in on.

    Retweeted by Nick McKim

    Mercury [email protected]·1h
    Join our live blog with @NickMcKim tomorrow from noon to 1pm #politas | The Mercury: http://www.themercury.com.au/news/tasmania/join-our-live-blog-with-greens-leader-nick-mckim-tomorrow-from-noon-to-1pm/story-fnj4f7k1-1226832909026?sv=fc5d24edfb9db773cab90e378c84ac68#.UwWaJTHGqWo.twitter … via @themercurycomau

  167. JMH

    Deadman
    #1196813, posted on February 20, 2014 at 6:00 pm

    That sounds healthy, Deadman. Perhaps, after the the outcome of tomorrow’s meeting is known, another little whisper into his shell-like might possibly be on the cards? Grist to election campaign mill and all that.

  168. Craig Mc

    As much as I agree with Alfred – including the unsolicited character reference – I don’t agree with the crudity. Alfred needs to read someone like Mark Steyn where he’ll find far more entertaining and TV friendly ways to humiliate liars.

  169. mizaris

    pah! He’s 17 and that’s what 17year olds say

  170. mizaris

    …They shouldn’t, of course. They should have been educated to use a wider vocabulary.

  171. Beef

    Who called the politician a cnut?

    Who called the cnut a politician?

  172. Goanna

    It’s a long game Alfred.
    Now you have them in contention (let the trout run before you sink the hook.)
    Reel ’em in and good luck.

  173. nic

    Deadman, from rebel’s link:

    4. Where ‘time-out’ involves out-of-class time, the following should be noted:

    o Time-out should be one stage in an explicit discipline plan involving fair warning systems which all students and their parents understand. The procedure and the organisation of the procedure should be well thought out beforehand.
    o The time-out place or room should be comfortable but uninteresting. It should not be so public that it calls attention to the student (such as outside the principal’s office).
    o A time-out room should not be regarded as a punitive environment – the value of time-out is deprivation from normal participation in class, contingent on behaving in an appropriate way.
    o The student should be readily observable and supervised.
    o The student should understand that return to class is contingent on a negotiated agreement to behave in an appropriate way.
    o Time-out will not be effective if the student does not want to return to class or views time-out as an escape from an undesirable situation.
    o Interaction between a student and the supervising teacher should be emotionally neutral: the aim should be for the student to devise a plan that negotiates re-admission to class.

    This seems to imply that time out is for class-based transgressions. What Alfred is presumably accused of did not occur in a classroom of any sort. I hope they haven’t impinged upon their rules .

  174. ev425128

    Not going to provide advice – there’s plenty of that in the thread, and Alfred & Deadman already have the situation well under control – just an observation in response to Nanuestalker’s post.

    Alfred’s message may well be crowded out by the profanity in the minds of the “adults” present, but the message will be all that the younger people at the function heard – forcibly presented.

    Good luck, gents.

  175. johanna

    Hmm, the Department’s discipline policy is an interesting read.

    First, it makes it pretty clear that suspension is not a first resort – rather it is for when other measures (such as detention) have failed. IOW, unless Alfred has significant form, even if they had the right to discipline him, suspension is way OTT.

    Secondly, suspension can only be authorised by the Principal, not the Vice Principal.

    Thirdly, it all has to be documented, and is subject to FOI.

    Fourthly, it can be appealed to the Ombudsman.

    Fifthly, they seem to be using the “bringing the school into disrepute” clause, which is so vague as to be almost meaningless, and anyway doesn’t seem relevant.

    An individual school discipline policy cannot override the Department’s policy – it can only flesh it out, as it were.

    I wouldn’t like to be the person defending the school’s actions in this case.

  176. nic

    The school may allege that actions damaged ‘ the name of the school’ but then says this:

    7. “In a State school” includes situations where the student is: involved in school activities; travelling to and from school; and identified with the school by wearing the school’s uniform, participating in inter-school events, or otherwise representing the school. (Obviously, it is impossible for a principal to directly control the behaviour of students when they are outside the immediate supervision of school staff, such as when they are on a school bus, when they are involved with volunteer sports coaches or when they are on community-based placements.)

  177. nic

    First, it makes it pretty clear that suspension is not a first resort – rather it is for when other measures (such as detention) have failed. IOW, unless Alfred has significant form, even if they had the right to discipline him, suspension is way OTT.

    That’s my reading of it too.

    Secondly, suspension can only be authorised by the Principal, not the Vice Principal.

    Not sure on that. I think earlier it states Principal or his nominee.

  178. Empire Strikes Back

    Green’s leader taken to task by fearless schoolboy, for telling lies. Edufascists shoot the messenger.

    Free Alfred. He is innocent.

  179. Armadillo

    Free Alfred. He is innocent.

    Indeed. He’s Australia’s version of ‘Pussy Riot’ (except he used another term).

  180. johanna

    Nope, it specifically says that the Principal cannot delegate the task of authorising a suspension. Obviously, if the Principal is away, the Acting Principal assumes the role.

    The Principal could authorise it based on a recommendation from someone else, but the actual decision is theirs and theirs alone.

  181. Senile Old Guy

    She had no intention to advise my parents, by the way, until I insisted that she call my father.

    Well, well, well. As a father, I would now be asking questions. As others have said, this woman is on very thin ice and I would be testing it for cracks. I have rarely had issues but when required I take up the issue politely but very, very firmly. (Being polite makes it harder for them to dodge the issue.) Also, have your arguments and evidence prepared.
    They usually don’t expect it. (I am not being inconsistent. I can disagree about the language but still say she is out of line.)

  182. MT Isa Miner

    Alfred

    #1196746, posted on February 20, 2014 at 4:58 pm

    I managed to record the forty minutes of conversation between me and the VP and, for the last twenty minutes or so, a social worker (or the like),

    Further reports, which will necessarily be lengthy, will be available on my blog, eventually, detailing what happened today (with a transcript of the recording, when I am able) as well as the meeting tomorrow with dad to discuss my future “punishment”.

    Alfred, we are backing you against the harridan/s.

    Trouble is, like most socialists fire-ants bureaucrats there are a lot of them when you stir them up. The fact that you exist and are still talking makes you a stirrer.

    Never give anyone any ammo to use against you. My 2c worth would be to write up the conversations from your OWN excellent MEMORY (wink) and what a copper would call those contemporaneous notes which you are making ( wink) . Not from any listening devices if you get what I mean. Unless you got permission from them all to record their sweet nothings.

  183. Stephen of Glasshouse

    The safest place for a Greens politician to spruik their stuff is either in PICU wards or advanced dementia care facilities. It’s the only way to ensure that they are the smartest people in the room and that the audience drools over their every word

  184. mizaris

    Tell them you want the conversations recorded because you want to be absolutely certain of every point which they raise and you want total accuracy for the future law suit. You have been deprived of a full day of your education and have been publicly pilloried for having a viewpoint which differs from that of a speaker at a PUBLIC RALLY which you attended, off school grounds and out of school hours.

  185. MT Isa Miner

    ev425128

    #1196843, posted on February 20, 2014 at 6:48 pm

    Not going to provide advice – there’s plenty of that in the thread, and Alfred & Deadman already have the situation well under control – just an observation in response to Nanuestalker’s post.

    Alfred’s message may well be crowded out by the profanity in the minds of the “adults” present, but the message will be all that the younger people at the function heard – forcibly presented.

    Good luck, gents.

    That’s right. That will be what most of them remember. And a chuck of older blokes who want to cut to the chase ( in case there were any in the hall, dragged there by the women) .

    on first thought it didn’t seem like the place for the language. But you know. I wasn’t there and maybe the crap was too thick to be cut by anything else. Not that I approve of Alfred doing it. It should have been some one with no skin in the game- our tribe doesn’t have enough young ones to lose to the hunt.

  186. unless Alfred has significant form

    Nope, this was Alfred’s first alleged offence, and the assistant principal made no effort to recommend or even mention any remedial or redemptive act or any “supportive, problem-solving stance rather than a punitive one” (p. 11, Discipline Guidelines).

  187. Gab

    Nope, this was Alfred’s first alleged offence, and the assistant principal made no effort to recommend or even mention any remedial or redemptive act or any “supportive, problem-solving stance rather than a punitive one” (p. 11, Discipline Guidelines

    The college has no right to discipline him under these circumstances. It’s none of their business.

    I would like to know why the college called McKim’s office over this matter. Or was it that McKim’s office called the college?

  188. Cath

    Dear Alfred,
    You did say please, and top marks for that. Perhaps you could seek to expand your vocabulary. For example: Please stop lying; the 97% statistic is absolute donkey dust and you swiving well know it , you mewling quim. Polish your monocle as you speak and the effect will be stunning for all onlookers.

  189. Armadillo

    and the assistant principal made no effort to recommend or even mention any remedial or redemptive act or

    He swore outside of school. Remedial or redemptive action is none of their fucking business. If they have a problem with it, their complaint should be directly to Alfreds legal guardian or the police if they think Alfred has committed a crime. What gives them the right to punish anyone?

    In their eyes, his real crime is that he swore at a global warming co-religionist for sprouting bullshit.

  190. nic

    Joanna, under the heading of detention it states:

    3. Detentions are a deterrent to irresponsible behaviour or a first-level response to it. They prevent a student either from enjoying pleasant recreational activities (recess, lunchtime, recreation time or after school) or from participating in normal classes (time-out).
    4. At the most serious level, “time-out” is “in-school suspension”.
    5.3 Authority
    A principal can impose a detention on a student.

    This authority may also be delegated to teaching staff.

  191. Matt

    I’ve just received an email from my kids school in inner-city Melbourne, notifying me that a guest speaker from the Asylum Seeker Resource Centre (ASRC) will be coming in to speak to students to ‘educate and inform students about asylum seekers.’ It is also supposed to ‘complement their study of The Island by Armin Greder.’

    Although there is no cost, they are asking for a gold coin donation to go to the ASRC.

  192. ev425128

    I have a feeling that Alfred has a somewhat better grasp of language and rhetoric than the average 17yo. Likewise, I feel that he delivered his verbal broadside in exactly the manner he intended – probably imagined out before even attending the function.

    The fallout at school is the unintended consequence, but the message reached its intended target, and the message is still ringing beyond that circle via The Cat.

    Well done, Alfred. I look forward to watching your career in politics – you’re a natural.

  193. johanna

    No, nic.

    See p 10 – Authority

    “A school principal has the authority to suspend a student. If the principal is absent from the school, the acting principal has the authority to suspend. The authority cannot be delegated to any
    other member of staff. ”

    What they call “in school suspension” is under the heading of “Detention.”

    What they did to Alfred comes under the heading of “Suspension”, meaning being forbidden to attend school.

  194. nic

    Lol ok Joanna, who knows what semantics they will use when cornered?

  195. A Lurker

    it seems that the main cause for alarm is my language in calling the knowingly deceitful Nick McKim a liar, as calling someone a liar is worse then calling someone a c*nt

    That statement rang a bell…

    When you have narcissistic personality disorder, you may come across as conceited, boastful or pretentious. You often monopolize conversations. You may belittle or look down on people you perceive as inferior. You may have a sense of entitlement. And when you don’t receive the special treatment to which you feel entitled, you may become very impatient or angry. You may insist on having “the best” of everything — the best car, athletic club, medical care or social circles, for instance.

    But underneath all this behaviour often lies a fragile self-esteem. You have trouble handling anything that may be perceived as criticism. You may have a sense of secret shame and humiliation. And in order to make yourself feel better, you may react with rage or contempt and efforts to belittle the other person to make yourself appear better.

    The ‘not being able to handle criticism’ seems to be the key point – Alfred effectively burst the bubbles of several peoples’ self-esteem – going from the Greens guy to various staff at the College. Those who follow the Green religion don’t like their ideology being challenged (i.e. called a liar) and so their reaction is to go over the top with punishment.

  196. Tator

    Ok, everyone else except Alfred don’t read this or I will get in the poo with my boss. 🙂
    As one of the Cats resident Lurking coppers and Brian of Moorabbin will support this, every time the Vice principal calls you into the office from now on, take some form of voice recorder, I-phone/smart phones work wonders for this and some digital ones are’t that expensive.
    First thing you do is sit it on the desk already running and announce that you will be recording this meeting to protect your rights. People who are trying to do dodgy things hate having their efforts recorded, which is why all interrogations for indictable offences are video recorded by police now. If they refuse, walk out and demand that you have a responsible adult present namely a parent to look after your rights. You are entitled on any disciplinary meetings to have a parent present even at the school and if they deny that, advise them that you will be taking legal advice on these matters but make sure you have a lawyer willing to support you before dropping that bombshell. Shouldn’t be too hard to find one. If this happens, it should all be recorded anyway. If this crap continues, take it directly to the department heads, don’t bother with the monkeys who are just bureaucrats anyway, Education Departments tend to cover things up as we found out here in SA with numerous sexual assaults in schools and parents were not notified. One occurred whilst our current premier was minister for ed, allegedly he knew nothing as one of his staffers didn’t pass it on, staffer is still working for him on some obscene salary when he should have been sacked for that incident alone.

    Deadman, same advice goes for you, any meetings, make sure you either have a third party there to corroborate your evidence or impeach the VP’s, recording it is legal, even if it is covertly done because as one of the parties involved has given consent, it means it is legal. Crooks do this all the time to coppers, especially the bikies and try it on in before it goes to court. Most coppers already know this and record it themselves. The only time covert recording becomes an issue if it is a third party who is doing the recording and both parties to the conversation haven’t given their permission.

  197. A Lurker

    Perhaps you could seek to expand your vocabulary.


    Shakespeare
    has some wonderfully obscure words that Alfred could learn and use – and going by the dismal literacy levels in Tassie, it would take them hours (and a Google search) to work out that they had been offended.

  198. A Lurker

    there is no cost, they are asking for a gold coin donation to go to the ASRC.

    @ Matt, it’s close to Easter so buy a packet of those gold foil covered chocolate coins and donate one of those instead…

  199. A Lurker

    Hopefully this Shakespearean link works better…

  200. If this had happened when I was at school there’d have been hell to pay.

    Any kid who swore whilst identifiably a member of the school’s student body, especially in public, would have had their arse caned off.
    For doing it in public there’d have been the liklihood of suspension, or if the kid was a recidivist, expulsion.

    If I’d ever sworn, especially in public, I’d have had my behind tanned so severely by my father that I’d quite likely still not be able to sit down.

    I’d do the same to any kids of mine.

    If any school, or teacher, tries to ram political opinion down a kid of mine’s neck, there is going to be a very “robust discussion” between me and the school, not necessarily taking place at the school.

    If the Headmaster has a disciplinary meeting with a kid of mine, that is no big deal (“You’ve been pulling girls’ pigtails again, bend over for six of the best”)
    If the Headmaster has a social worker in for a meeting with a kid of mine, without any reference to me, it’ll be the Headmaster receiving six of the best, from me. (Or vice versa if it transpires the Head has boxing skills superior to mine).

    If any school even thinks of disciplining a kid of mine for use of the word “liar” as such, they’ll be answerin to me. For being rude, yes, for swearing, good heavens yes. But for use of the word “liar” as such. God help the school/teacher/headmaster, whoever.

    Just reading the above I’m riled up enough to be inclined to pop down to Hobart & get stroppy with a few VP’s.

  201. Gab

    I’m quite certain Alfred has an excellent vocabulary. Here’s an entry on one of his blogs:

    22 May, 2013
    John Cook et Alii Willfully Lie
    The lucripetous and deceitful John Cook (an unscrupulous and shameless propagandist for the silly, pseudo-scientific conjecture of anthropogenic global warming) continues to lie in order to convince the gullible that, if a plurality of supposed experts suggest that anthropogenic emissions of carbon dioxide cause global warming, then everyone else must believe that any resultant warming will be catastrophic for the entire planet. He and his overpaid collabarators falsely and fallaciously claim that “among papers expressing a position on human-caused global warming, over 97% endorsed the consensus position that humans are causing global warming.”
    See “97% Study Falsely Classifies Scientists’ Papers, according to the scientists that published them” at Popular Technology:

  202. Tator, Alfred might just have left his iPod accidentally on “record” today for the whole forty minutes of his meeting, and he’s transcribed five minutes thereof so far. He’s got as far as when the assistant principal referred to the alleged offence, saying “You unleashed personally on— it was Nick McKim, I presume.” She didn’t even know the details. She also said, “You finished off saying— calling McKim ‘a fucking c*nt’.” This is not quite accurate, but the assistant principal had little problem uttering the dread tetragram.

  203. boy on a bike

    It’s worth remembering that way back in 1991, no less a judicial authority than the unimpeachable Pat O’Shane, the darkish darling of the luvvitariat, dismissed a case of offensive language. The words used were “watch these two fucking poofters here, how they fucking prosecute me” as two police officers walked into a take away shop.

    O’Shane dismissed the case saying that the words were common usage and not offensive.

    Although I am sure you’d get hung these days for saying “poofter” in public, given that 23 years has passed and the c-word is now in common usage, it’s a bit rich to ping someone for saying it.

  204. Gab, that’s one of my posts, “posted by Deadman”.

  205. Gab

    Oh. Well I’m sure some of your vocab has rubbed off on your progeny.

  206. motherhubbard'sdog

    Deadman, play your cards right and this A-grade arsehole will go down in history as Thin Skin McKim.

  207. Elizabeth (Lizzie) B.

    The only objection to swearing is the poverty of language it connotes

    That’s the only reason we have a ‘swear jar’ at our house. I hope it is clear that it is actually a bit of a joke to make a point. Some of my, umm, more Bogan, rellies would otherwise encourage my kids to use the F word in every second sentence. Actually, in every first one on a strongly-felt issue, as in: ‘What the fuck are these fuckers coppers fuckin’ doing with my fuckin’ Licence, fuck them for fuckin’ me over. The fuckin’ cnuts’. Only the second sentence would really raise my ire in my home. I’m with Sinclair on that word when used on my own property.

    That they interviewed the young man without a parent/guardian present stinks to high heaven of (green) bullying.

    They are just following the example set by our current Australian of the Year. Absolutely nothing wrong with a child (a thirteen year old girl, in the highly public actions of this wealthy and powerful football player) being publically humiliated by him personally, named, photographed for the media, and interviewed and held in custody and interrogated by police for two hours without a parent or guardian present, on a spurious and set up claim of racism that would not walk in any Court were it to be tested.

  208. Does the scale of the crime change the nature of the crime? Try this quick Quiz!

    Imagine a beggar who is not really a beggar who falsely claims…

    Can’t find work. Family to feed. Please have pity.

    and who makes a few dollars from the scam?

    Now imagine a greenie who is not really a greenie who falsely claims…

    Carbon is killing the planet!

    and who in concert with others world wide, forcibly extracts billions of dollars from millions of people in developed nations and condemns to misery and poverty, millions of people in undeveloped nations?

    Here’s the question.

    Which pejorative term might be an appropriate descriptor for the first gentleman and which pejorative term might bean appropriate descriptor for the second gentleman?

  209. ev425128

    Exactly, Gab, and that is why I posted what I did. There is “gift of the gab” (verb, not noun) and there is eloquence. Like father, like son – in this case. And eloquence is in the ear of the beholder.

  210. nic

    Deadman, does the school concede it may not have jurisdiction if Alfred wasn’t representing the school per se? Alfred can’t be blamed for the school not having a uniform.

  211. Tiny Dancer

    How about not turning up and if it reaches some other height saying “fuck off”. It’s not rocket science.

  212. Tator

    Deadman,
    Tell Alfred to keep that up, it is not illegal to record a conversation that you are party to. Make backup copies though as there is a saying amongst my tech friends, to err is to be human, to really fuck things up takes a computer.

  213. Tiny Dancer

    Faaaaaark. Are you people turning into retards?

  214. Peter H

    What was mckims response ?

  215. Arnost

    Catching up on the thread Ainsley:

    In all the apparent crudeness i see an honesty startling to foreigners and maybe some metro collared-shirt types but like Oz it is beautiful in its harshness, plus its important when truth is at stake.

    But blood’ oath. Too right!

  216. nic, when I spoke with the ass. principal this morning, I explained that, surely, the only charge they could bring against Alfred would be one of bringing the school into disrepute* but that he was not in school, not at an official school function, and he was not identifiable as representing Hobart College—except by those from the school—because there were many other young people from various schools at the forum with some youths, perhaps, not from any school at all. She maintained, as I wrote earlier, that he was “right in the middle of a large group” from the school thus making him quite identifiable to strangers, apparently, as representing Hobart College.† It wasn’t even the naughty words which most outraged her but his referring to McKim’s lying.
    Tomorrow I might remark that what’s really bringing the school into disrepute is their insistent, unjust, politically motivated bullying of my son.

    * Section 36 (2) of The Education Act (1994), “Behaviour which is not acceptable includes behaviour which […] (f) is likely to bring that school into disrepute”.
    † for many readers of this site, I suppose, Alfred now is representative of Hobart College. Ah, well.

  217. Gab

    She maintained, as I wrote earlier, that he was “right in the middle of a large group” from the school thus making him quite identifiable to strangers, apparently, as representing Hobart College

    That does not pass the logic test. How would a stranger know which school any kid is from just becuase he’s “right in the middle of a large group”? And how would the ass. principal (I saw what you did there) know if a “stranger” could identify another stranger as belonging to a particular school?

  218. nic

    Thanks Deadman. Im just curious how a casual observer could know what school he went to, unless told…. The relevant section of the Dept of Education’s own rules states inter alia “and identified with the school by wearing the school’s uniform,”.

  219. Mike of Marion

    How did the VP actually know it was Alfred – was the VP at the function?

  220. Ripper

    How did the VP actually know it was Alfred – was the VP at the function?

    That’s the $64.00 question.

  221. was the VP at the function?

    No, a social worker and two other staff attended the forum from Hobart College with sixty or so students.

  222. Arnost

    I would like to know why the college called McKim’s office over this matter. Or was it that McKim’s office called the college?

    Now that I’ve caught up with the thread, I would like to know why a supposedly senior politician doesn’t immediately say drop the whole thing and spin this to their benefit!??

    And I’d like to know how the VP is going to avoid a charge of bringing the school into disrepute given the publicity her bullying of a poor child 😉 is bringing to her school.

    Bottom line Alfred – watch that language but use both barrels next time!

  223. Leigh Lowe

    Deadman, there is no shortage of free advice here but, as I said earlier, is it possible to force them to extrapolate from the specific of Alfred’s case to the generic.
    Ask them to specify the exact nature if the offences and badger them about whether these have been or will be school rules in future.
    It sounds like a fairly “loosey-goosey” school so they will struggle with codifying exactly what the rules are.
    Once they do, ask Alfred to check around whether any of the free-spirits at the school have ever told a teacher to get fucked, for example.
    The arbitrary inconsistencies might be interesting.

  224. Uh oh

    Deadman, stop condoning the use of your son’s foul language and just tell him to apologise. His potty mouth might be good for attracting attention at the moment but it will not serve him well in later life.

  225. Brian of Moorabbin

    Tator (@8.08pm)

    +1000000000000000000000000000001

    Good work recording the conversation Alfred.

    Now use their own words and policies to bury the bastards.

  226. nilk, Iron Bogan

    Uh Oh, so Alfred should apologise and just pull his head in and it will all blow over?

    I call rubbish on that one. The reason that we have so many of these gormless bureaucrats running rampant is because the populace are cowed and almost never fight back.

    Maybe one of those weaselly all-purpose apologies that we get from Leftards on a regular basis?

    “Oh, sorry, Miss, I didn’t mean to call him a liar. It’s just that the fantastical nature of his rhetoric moved me so that I lost my ability to think clearly and so spoke far too forthrightly for a public forum. I truly didn’t mean to cause offence, and if I did so then I apologise.”

    Something like that, perhaps?

  227. Uh oh

    No Nik, what I’m saying is that there is no need to use such foul language, especially in a public setting,

  228. Arnost

    No Nik, what I’m saying is that there is no need to use such foul language, especially in a public setting,

    I don’t think that language is an issue here… Ultimately it is either a question of a thin skinned politician narcissistically demanding some sort of payback for being embarrassed, or a sycophantic VP protecting her gay leftard idol.

  229. Brian of Moorabbin

    I don’t think that language is an issue here…

    Indeed.

    Alfred even notes that the VP was more concerned that McTnuc Mr McKim was called a liar, rather than the actual words used by Alfred (which she couldn’t even get correct… probably because she is operating off third-hand evidence [called ‘hearsay’ in legal terms, and non-admissable in court] which may or may not have come from Mr McKim’s office)…

  230. johanna

    Yeah, he could use one of those apology templates that footballers recite after they have beaten someone to a pulp while out on the town. You know, “I have let down my family, my club school, and supporters at the Cat” – that kind of thing. Oh, and the trusty standby “If I have offended anyone, I am truly sorry. It was not my intention.”

    Screw that.

    If he was minded to apologise to anyone, it would be to McKim – and that doesn’t seem to be on the table. It has nothing to do with the school. Nothing.

  231. .

    Tiny

    I agree with you more or less, however – the school isn’t willing to reveal what level of contact they’ve had with Mc Kim. Inquirin’ minds wanna know.

    I agree with you that upwardly managing these imbeciles with a “no, there will be no meeting, good day” and otherwise “get bent” may have been the correct response.

    Uh oh
    #1196986, posted on February 20, 2014 at 9:38 pm
    Deadman, stop condoning the use of your son’s foul language

    Yep, he’s ruining his life! Lulz…

  232. Beef

    Give them the luvvie apology. ‘I feel sorry for you if you are offended by my remarks’.

  233. feelthebern

    Email address is there.
    Go nuts.

  234. candy

    Ostracism is very very hard on a young person, one should never overlook or underplay that ever.

  235. Naed

    I recall getting some push-back from an English teacher when I was in Year 11 and wanted to write an opinion piece about why I believed Pauline Hanson wasn’t a racist. From memory though she was more concerned about a biased mark from the other English teacher for our year who would be grading the work. I can’t imagine that she agreed with the espoused opinion; she was just a great teacher who didn’t bring her ideology into the classroom.

    Alfred, your writing style is commendable for your age. The only issue I’d suggest you watch out for is the correct usage of ‘then’ and ‘than’. Good luck tomorrow – nolite te bastardes carborundorum!

    From what the VP said, it seems that the main cause for alarm is my language in calling the knowingly deceitful Nick McKim a liar, as calling someone a liar is worse then calling someone a c*nt.

  236. Old School Conservative

    The use of foul language at a public forum takes away all credibility from the otherwise brave and correct premise of the argument. Similarly, “F… Abbott” was wrong. Pat O’Shane’s ruling was wrong too. Arguments against the AGW pedants must stand on their own merit, and not rely on the shock value of crude words.

  237. JC

    “I have let down my family, my club school, and supporters at the Cat”

    That works and everyone knows it’s basically drivel.

  238. Arnost

    Bush lawyering here… (And sorry if linked already – but an education exercise to manage the future of a couple of hellions) the Law Handbook lays out the grounds on which a st.,urgent can be suspended:

    Grounds for suspension

    A student can be suspended by order of the principal from a government school while attending school or travelling to and from school, or taking part in any school-organised activity away from school including camps, if the student:

    – creates a danger to the health and safety of staff, students or any other person assisting the conduct of school activities (such as parent volunteers);
    – commits serious violence or causes significant damage to school property;
    – steals school property or helps others to steal or damage school property;
    – brings or sells drugs or other prohibited substances in school;
    – disobeys clear and reasonable instructions from teachers or from the principal;
    – disturbs others in the school or prevent others from learning or taking part in school life or otherwise consistently interferes with educational opportunities for other students; or
    – against or harasses other people or otherwise behaves in a way that endangers the peace and good order of the school’s program or facility.

    The government school principal may suspend a student of 15 years or above if they consistently and deliberately skips classes or does not complete school work or otherwise fails to take advantage of the educational opportunities provided by the school.

    I can’t see what grounds are available to suspend Alfred… And there is no “bringing the school into disrepute” clause there…

    http://www.lawhandbook.org.au/handbook/ch06s03s04.php

  239. Arnost

    Ahem. st.,urgent = student.

  240. .

    I bet this guy always votes for the ALP/Greens alliance.

  241. .

    The err, “old school conservative”.

  242. .

    Well Arnost, I’d demand an apology and give none.

  243. Gab

    “I have let down my family, my club school, and supporters at the Cat”

    “and will take a break to spend more time with my family”. The two bits always go together.

  244. .

    Yeah LOL, nice one Gab.

    Swearing is appropriate at times. Abbott was right to tell Roxon, in earshot of reporters, that she was full of shit.

  245. johanna

    Arnost, every jurisdiction has its own rules about school discipline. The Tasmanian Education Dept’s were linked way above. They are similar to those you cite, but not identical – and they include a reference to damaging the school’s reputation.

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