Václav Klaus discusses mass migration

Migration is the biggest issue of our time and may well be about to put an end to Western Civilisation. Here below is part of an instructive interview with Václav Klaus by Grégoire Canlorbe who gets to the heart of the issue: “Supply and Demand” in Mass Migration.

Václav Klaus, former President of the Czech Republic. (Image source: European Parliament / Pietro Naj-Oleari)

Grégoire Canlorbe: People are often defined by a common worldview rather than by genetics or where they live. In view of the situation in the Czech Republic, do you agree?

Václav Klaus: I would return the issue to the defense of the Nation-State. I truly believe in the Nation-State, therefore I am so critical of the continental ambitions of many European officials. I do not believe in the European Union or the European integration. This is for me the starting point.

For me, the Nation-State is the only possible way to have democracy. Democracy simply cannot exist at a higher level, as in continents, let alone global democracy in the world. So, my starting point is the Nation-State, the defense of the Nation-State, and the fighting continental integration.

In this respect, I am in favor of Trump. Donald Trump is not my cup of tea personally, intellectually, but his position on many issues is a positive one. I especially think of his refusal to sign the Paris Agreement, his important speeches like that in Warsaw in the summer or that in the United Nations in September, defending the Nation-States, culture, traditions, habits, mores and behaviors, lifestyles. It is something that I feel is with Trump, something that Hillary Clinton would never, never say.

Canlorbe: It is sometimes argued that mass immigration in the West is slowly changing class struggle into race struggle, substituting race consciousness for class consciousness. In addition, the dominant form of the class struggle would not be anymore that between “labor and capital” within each nation, but that between the “cosmopolitan” elites of the EU and the European peoples.[1] Your thoughts?

Klaus: For me, the “race struggle” is not the issue, and especially the “class struggle” is a term non-existent in my thinking. We were educated in terms of discussing the class struggle, because our teaching was based on the Marxist political economy. We finally understood how wrong the whole ideology is. I believe that after the fall of communism, I never used the word “class.” Maybe it is an overstatement, but the term “class” is for me intellectually forbidden and non-existent. For the same reason, I would never speak of the “race struggle.”

I am, however, absolutely critical of the mass migration in Europe. It is clearly not a spontaneous process. It is something which is organized by the European Union’s political elites. If you have read my book Migration of Peoples (not yet translated into English), you will probably have realized that I stress a distinction between mass migration and individual migration. Mass migration creates cultural, social and political conflicts, shocks and tensions. It undermines the structure of society that has been gradually developed over centuries, maybe even millennia.

Individual migration is evidence of considerable individual courage and of a certain taste for adventure. Usually, it is an act prepared in the long term and the product of an individual or family will. It means, for an individual, that he would like to get out of a cultural, civilizational, religious, geographical, or climatic entity with the full consciousness of a migrant who leaves for another world, an environment that will be foreign to him, to which he will have to adapt, and in which he will have to integrate and evolve.

Mass migration is a totally different phenomenon. The gregarious nature of mass migration makes decision making much less important than it is during individual migration. Mass migration remains a risky act, but mass migration increases the courage in an individual that is necessary for any migration. Mass migration also has the effect of changing the objectives of migrants. The goal is no longer to be assimilated into the new world, but to strengthen one’s old way of life.

What is new with mass migration, is the willingness of migrants to benefit only from the advantages available to them. Also at work often is the will to extend one’s home world to one’s host country and to transform it gradually according to one’s own tradition. Such a transformation is not the primary intention of every migrant. But this intention encourages political or religious activists.

The mass migration that we are witnessing today in Europe does not involve the individual, but the crowd, the collective, the group. Mercy towards the migrant’s individual suffering makes sense only with individual migration. Crowd, mass behavior does not deserve the same consideration. Though, I should remind that I am not fighting the migrants. I am fighting the European political elites, starting with Jean-Claude Juncker and Angela Merkel. Those are my opponents, my enemies.

The poor man coming from Somalia or Syria is not my enemy. He is a victim, and not just a victim of the tragic situation in his own country, but the victim of the wrong assumptions of the multiculturalist European elites who are organizing the mass immigration into Europe. As an economist, I always endeavor to analyze a given situation in terms of supply and demand. The demand for mass migration does not come from the ordinary citizens, but from the European officials. The supply in mass migration, which comes from the migrants, exists only as a result of this policy intended to change the structure of the European society.

The goal of the European elites is not to favor the propagation of Islam or the rise of Islamic terrorism. It is to create a new European man. They have understood that they will not be able to do it out of the material at their disposal. People like you and me are not the right persons to become the new European man. When I want to provoke the European elites, I say that they want to create a Homo Bruxellarum. This is, I believe, a strong term. [Laughs.]

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47 Responses to Václav Klaus discusses mass migration

  1. A very sensible fellow, nails what ails us in the western democracies quite well.

  2. Stimpson J. Cat

    Where are all the Open Borders Libertarians hiding?
    Unlock your doors, unbolt your gates, throw open your garages to the seething tide of diverse humanity.
    I have millions of wonderful friends who want to live in your backyard.
    And your front yard.
    And your bedroom.
    Come and smell the culture my friends.
    I love the smell of culture in the morning.

  3. Crossie

    I am fighting the European political elites, starting with Jean-Claude Juncker and Angela Merkel. Those are my opponents, my enemies.

    Eventually all of us will have to fight them as well or their deciples here. We have all been judged by our betters to be unworthy and that’s why the huge annual immigration numbers. Who needs the boats when they are flying them in daily by the planeload?

    The only comfort I take in the whole situation is that the “Homo Bruxellarum” project is much more advanced in Europe than here and when troubles start in earnest we may learn from them and not let things progress to that level.

    The saddest thing is that the mass migrant populations may have been much better off if they were helped to fix their own countries. However, free money in the form of welfare is a powerful motive.

  4. Sinclair Davidson

    Fascinating. You’ve managed to quote someone approvingly even though he is critical of Trump.

    More seriously – this sort of argument is just crap. How is it possible to support individuals but not a lot of individuals? When does individual migration suddenly transform into so-called mass-migration?

  5. “When does individual migration suddenly transform into so-called mass-migration?”
    Maybe:
    -when leaders like Merkel pretend there are no borders and they can’t do anything about 1.5 million people walzing into your social security system
    or,
    -when elites tell the indigenous population (as in Germany) that they have to adapt to the migrants?

  6. RobK

    “When does individual migration suddenly transform into so-called mass-migration?”
    I think it’s as simple as Claus says; its the “intention” of the individual to integrate into the new culture. The mass migrant, for various reasons, namely political troubles and demographic issues,(push factors, if you will), are uprooted en masse and resettle taking their culture and a mindset of persecution and in many cases a realization that they will impact any host culture (whether intentional ot not) due to welfare and structural impact on on the host.
    I think Claus is suggesting that what he refers to as the EU elite, are intent on the creation of a pull factor for reasons of creating a structural change in the nations of the EU, which has demographic and poltical issues of its own, that the bureaucrats appear to want to address by importing a human resource.
    I think there is an additional element responsible for this mass migration; that is an historical factor borne from colonialism and particularly its rather abrupt ending after WW2. There was old colonialism for hundreds of years, then a big push to independence which left new nations ill prepared for self governance and the EU colonialists feeling somewhat guilty culturally, with a massive unfulfilled desire for egalitarianism for all. An embarassment of riches.
    I agree with Clauss that nation sovereignty and culture is paramount for democracy, because people need a sense of belonging and nations can develop political and cultural ideas in healthy competition with other states.

  7. Rohan

    More seriously – this sort of argument is just crap. How is it possible to support individuals but not a lot of individuals? When does individual migration suddenly transform into so-called mass-migration?

    I guess it’s the difference of the individual going through the long and arduously bureaucratic immigration process. You know, where they have to satisfy the country in question that they are a healthy law abiding individual, able to support themselves through gainful employment and the willingness to have a decent go of it.

    Mass migration is just a free-for-all at the border because of Free Stuff for Life™ via government Share-the-Wealth™ schemes.

    BTW Sinc, speaking of politician leaders, are we nearly at Political Greatness yet? I’m dying to know.

  8. Eddystone

    Individual migration is evidence of considerable individual courage and of a certain taste for adventure. Usually, it is an act prepared in the long term and the product of an individual or family will. It means, for an individual, that he would like to get out of a cultural, civilizational, religious, geographical, or climatic entity with the full consciousness of a migrant who leaves for another world, an environment that will be foreign to him, to which he will have to adapt, and in which he will have to integrate and evolve.

    Mass migration is a totally different phenomenon. The gregarious nature of mass migration makes decision making much less important than it is during individual migration. Mass migration remains a risky act, but mass migration increases the courage in an individual that is necessary for any migration. Mass migration also has the effect of changing the objectives of migrants. The goal is no longer to be assimilated into the new world, but to strengthen one’s old way of life.

  9. RobK

    Rohan,
    To be fair to Sinc, didn’t he say “potential” greatness.
    He may have had that, once.

  10. A Lurker

    When does individual migration suddenly transform into so-called mass-migration?

    Amazing that this has to be explained to an academic – scrub that thought, of course it needs to be explained to an academic… D’oh!

    Individual migration

    Possession of Passport
    Possession of Visa (depending on country)
    Possession of sufficient funds that proves you are self-supporting.
    Proof of acceptance at a university in your new country, or proof of acceptance that you have an employer in your new country.
    Abiding by whatever health checks are demanded by your new country.
    Filling out all the correct documentation that ensures you meet the entry requirements as an immigrant.
    Obtaining verification from your new country that you have adhered to all legal requirements.

    Mass-Migration
    Mass Migration

  11. stackja

    Australia accepted many migrants in the 1940s/1950s. I don’t remember as much trouble as recent ‘migrants’ coming into Australia have created. The same seems true in Europe with recent ‘migrant’/’refugees’ seemingly only interested in taking and not giving.

  12. duncanm

    More seriously – this sort of argument is just crap. How is it possible to support individuals but not a lot of individuals? When does individual migration suddenly transform into so-called mass-migration?

    really?

    He explained it.

    Individualism (ie: self motivation), vs. following a crowd.

    Its as simple as that.

    Having said that, not all mass-migration has been bad. Think ten pound poms and scots to Australia, post-war migrants, etc.

  13. Colin Suttie

    “More seriously – this sort of argument is just crap. How is it possible to support individuals but not a lot of individuals? When does individual migration suddenly transform into so-called mass-migration?”

    Did you mean “la la la la I can’t hear you”?

  14. Indolent

    When does individual migration suddenly transform into so-called mass-migration?

    When it’s sponsored and organised into mass invasion, as was, and is, the case the Europe.

  15. RobK

     Think ten pound poms and
    Selective and by invitation.

  16. duncanm

    Think ten pound poms ..
    Selective and by invitation.

    yes — but mass migration none the less.

    I think its the sort of successful mass migration that Europe has not seen (certainly not in modern history).

  17. Elizabeth (Lizzie) Beare

    Having said that, not all mass-migration has been bad. Think ten pound poms and scots to Australia, post-war migrants, etc.

    Good point. I think Boer Farmers might also be included in this – with the proviso that they settle throughout Australia and not just in one area where they both isolate and dominate. Note that this is different from settling in smaller communities of ethnic origin – such settlement is the usual pattern in any migration ‘chain’.

    I think the distinction between mass and individual migration is a useful one to make in theoretical terms and that there is a practical outcome. It is particularly relevant concerning desire for assimilation to the host culture vs. transference of the culture of origin.

    The nation state arose as a protective device. Just as fortified castles did once. But castles only protected elites in their dominance, not the peasants surrounding when invaders came. Fortifying borders via the nation state included all within the protective circle. Shakespeare put the process well in ‘This England – a fortress built by nature for herself, against infection and the hand of war’, a ‘natural’ geographical state (more or less; the Scots and Welsh and Cornishmen disagreed and Irishmen are still wondering). Doesn’t libertarian philosophy see the protection of the nation (comprised of free individuals) as a bounden duty? Mass immigration conflicts with this duty; individual immigration does not.

  18. RobK

    successful mass migration that Europe has not seen 
    I agree. I also wonder if the demographic issues the EU has can be solved by importing human resource without massive upheaval. Even the slower post colonial migration to EU was straining the culture but it generally managed. Certainly migration and energy policy are bringing major fundamental, radical changes.

  19. RobK

    “More seriously – this sort of argument is just crap. How is it possible to support individuals but not a lot of individuals?
    Sinc knows how to push peoples buttons.

  20. Crossie

    -when elites tell the indigenous population (as in Germany) that they have to adapt to the migrants?

    In other words, without the consent of the governed.

  21. duncanm

    How is it possible to support individuals but not a lot of individuals?

    ref. Life of Brian: “We’re all individuals!”

  22. Dr Fred Lenin

    The Roman Empire was destroyed by mass migration,civilisationn as people knew it was destroyed. It took hundreds of years to restore civilisation much of it based on the Roman model . The problems of these illegal entrants lies in their home countries ,bringing them to a civilised country only creates problems which should not exist. Save the children spends a fortune of other peoples money advertising the fact that some 100,00 kids a day die and their “loving parents “go on to breed another kid to die , the money would be better spent on birth control ,,and if the “macho”peasants won’t use it ,let them stew in their own juice . Sink a few boats full of illegal entrants let them drown ,they will get the message ,a few hundred welfare seekers drowning would fix the problem .

  23. duncanm

    . The problems of these illegal entrants lies in their home countries ,bringing them to a civilised country only creates problems which should not exist.

    this is probably the crux.

    Mass migration from civilised countries works.

    Mass migration from uncivilised countries does not.

    In all cases — the lowest common denominator wins

  24. The poor man coming from Somalia or Syria is not my enemy. He is a victim, and not just a victim of the tragic situation in his own country, but the victim of the wrong assumptions of the multiculturalist European elites who are organizing the mass immigration into Europe.

    Don’t agree. All individuals are responsible for their actions. If the poor Somalian has enough “nous” to get himself and his family into this country, he will be aware that this country (and any other western country) has an entirely different culture and/or political system than the one he/she has grown up in. Tribalism, above all, fosters an understanding of the tremendous force of differences of culture and belief. The emigrant may not be an “enemy” as such, but neither is he a “victim”. He makes a clear choice with all its implications of assimilation.

  25. manalive

    When does individual migration suddenly transform into so-called mass-migration? …

    Most people recognise mass immigration when they see it.

  26. tezza

    I understand Sinc’s reservation about the individual migration/mass migration distinction, and think A Lurker offers some reasonable clarification. But something additional is necessary to make a really useful distinction.
    It is provided by Paul Collier’s empirical analysis in his book ‘Exodus’. The real difficulty comes from mass migration from ‘culturally distant, low trust societies’. (This often means, in practice, poor and conflict-ridden Muslim societies, but not always. Collier’s own initial expertise was as a development economist specialised in Nigeria.)
    People from low trust societies in mass migration movements stick together more than usual among other migrants, and continue to manage low trust by their source country’s practices: arranged marriages, early marriages, FGM, honour killing, gangs etc. The diaspora of mass migrants from low trust societies attracts more mass migration from the source countries (because it greatly lowers the cost of migration to fellow countrymen, through lowering the costs of finding one’s way in the receiving society). There is very little exit from the diaspora into the broader receiving country community, relative to the large inflow of continuing migration.
    Pretty soon, you end up like Sweden, France, the UK or Melbourne.

  27. Tel

    The poor man coming from Somalia or Syria is not my enemy. He is a victim, and not just a victim of the tragic situation in his own country, but the victim of the wrong assumptions of the multiculturalist European elites who are organizing the mass immigration into Europe.

    Don’t forget the airplanes loaded with weapons shipped in by Western governments that ended up in the hands of Jihadists like ISIS.

    http://insider.foxnews.com/2015/05/18/2012-dia-docs-weapons-moved-libya-syria-benghazi-attack-planned-memorial-911

    Judicial Watch obtained the memos by suing in federal court.

    “The Obama administration says it was a coincidence that [the Benghazi attack] occurred on 9/11. In fact, their intelligence said it wasn’t a coincidence, and in fact, specifically the attack occurred because it was 9/11,” Judicial Watch President Tom Fitton said.

    Another 2012 DIA memo predicts the rise of ISIS and the establishment of a caliphate 17 months before President Barack Obama called ISIS “jay-vee.”

    A third DIA memo, dated Oct. 5, 2012, leaves no doubt that U.S. intelligence agencies knew that weapons were moving from Libya to Syria before the attack that killed four Americans.

  28. Tel

    How is it possible to support individuals but not a lot of individuals?

    How is it possible that drinking a glass of water can be good for your health, but trying to drink a bathtub full of water will kill you?

    It’s a mystery… there’s no solving something as complex as this.

  29. Mak Siccar

    I think the wrong terms are being used. We should, instead, be talking about controlled and uncontrolled migration. Controlled migration is where we, the host country, select the type and number of immigrants – uncontrolled migration is clearly the opposite of this. Inevitably, mass migration falls into the latter category and brings all the problems with it that we have seen occur in Europe. The destruction of the sovereignty of countries by this means is beyond reprehensible and can only be described as treasonous.

  30. Deplorable

    I believe the term we should use is politically motivated mass invasion, immigration is fine when the rules are followed and therefore enhances the host country. Lifetime welfare must be removed from the table and strict conditions before citizenship may be granted after 10 years legal residency.
    The green filth and their lackeys the union thugs of the labor party want uncontrolled mass invasion by those who would be labor voters.

  31. Deplorable

    Tel
    #2672203, posted on March 28, 2018 at 10:04 am
    How is it possible to support individuals but not a lot of individuals?

    How is it possible that drinking a glass of water can be good for your health, but trying to drink a bathtub full of water will kill you?

    It’s a mystery… there’s no solving something as complex as this.

    Love your work Tel.

  32. max

    “The mass migration”

    did not exist before 1900 — before welfare state.

    did not exist before 1990 — before american imperialist decide to destroy few states.

    end welfare and warfare and mass migration will stop.

  33. Stimpson J. Cat

    How is it possible to support individuals but not a lot of individuals?

    Surely some South Africans were against Apartheid.
    They can’t all have been bad.
    We should try to take some White farmers.

  34. RobK

    “The mass migration”

    did not exist before 1900 — 
    I think australia did have some issues with Chinese during the gold rush. Not sure of numbers.

  35. Bad Samaritan

    Just the other evening some local teenagers held a party and invited a number of friends round for a pleasant time. Meanwhile a wannabe Angela Merkel type went on-line and advertized it as a “house party with free booze and free everything else; all welcome to trash the joint” whilst giving the address and detailed instructions on how to get there.

    When the hordes arrived to devour everything in sight; to indeed trash the joint; to abuse and brutalize the inhabitants of the house in question, a sometime sensible Economics Prof was heard to ask “What’s the difference between individual invitations and a mass invasion?”; the implication being that none exists

    And that is the state of Academia today.

  36. Deplorable

    And that is the state of Academia today.

    Bravo

  37. Sinclair Davidson
    #2672066, posted on March 28, 2018 at 3:21 am

    Fascinating. You’ve managed to quote someone approvingly even though he is critical of Trump.

    More seriously – this sort of argument is just crap. How is it possible to support individuals but not a lot of individuals? When does individual migration suddenly transform into so-called mass-migration?

    Someone once said you have to be an academic to be this stupid. I always knew Sinc to be an academic, but I didn’t think he was this stupid (or maybe he isn’t, he knows what he’s saying is more than wrong, but he can’t/won’t get past his ideology).

    Look mate, migrants in general need time to adjust to their new nation homes and often need help from their hosts. Much of that help comes from others who arrived before him. This adjustment can take years and often does.
    We need some time to adjust just moving from one city to another, one state to another. Moving from one culture to another, new language etc etc etc takes time.
    I hope even academics understand and accept this.

    So, some analogies:
    Why is individual tuition or small teacher student class sizes more manageable than say 100 students to one teacher?
    Why is a dinner party for 2 couples more manageable than a big bash for 200 people?
    Why has the processing of thousands through Manus etc caused so much headache and controversy, but the processing of individual migrants through airports are hardly heard from?
    Why is individual service from a salesman different to the service one gets at the boxing day sales?

    If the World of nations were stores, your nickel and dime stores would be in Africa, your $2 shops would be in Asia, your high quality exclusive stores would be the Western nations.
    I don’t won’t Western nations to turn into $2 stores by having permanent Boxing Day Sales. I want those who migrate to us to have high quality, exclusive service.
    Those who are familiar with the culture and speak the language won’t need much assistance from our sales staff. Those who don’t speak the language will need some assistance.

    The reason why people want to migrate to the West is because the West is the better store. More quality for themselves and their kids.
    I don’t want to turn us into Sams Warehouse. Apparently Sinc does.

  38. Roger.

    More seriously – this sort of argument is just crap. How is it possible to support individuals but not a lot of individuals? When does individual migration suddenly transform into so-called mass-migration?

    Ask the man in the street and he’ll point you to some interesting suburbs for you to visit, Sinc.

  39. Mass immigration is sometimes called invasion

    Just sayin’

  40. mareeS

    Such an interesting statesman.

  41. mh

    More seriously – this sort of argument is just crap. How is it possible to support individuals but not a lot of individuals? When does individual migration suddenly transform into so-called mass-migration?

    Sinclair’s thinking reminds me of something:

    There are some ideas so absurd that only an intellectual could believe them.

    ― George Orwell

  42. Roger.

    Mass immigration is sometimes called invasion

    Mass Immigration + Multiculturalism = Colonisation.

  43. Kneel

    “ref. Life of Brian: “We’re all individuals!” ”

    I’m not.

  44. jupes

    When does individual migration suddenly transform into so-called mass-migration?

    So why male models?

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