Open Forum: March 31, 2018

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1,634 Responses to Open Forum: March 31, 2018

  1. Rae

    I am allergic to some grasses, but especially to the flowers on our May bush. Zyrtec sends the allergy rash and the sneezing away.

  2. Entropy

    Although I do like Arky’s theory.

  3. None

    Haha. One day Arky I’m going to gather up all your posts, publish them in a book, and make a motza. Hopefully you will do that before me.

  4. Mitch M.

    The aye aye’s ball joint finger is a pretty good specialisation.

    So good that frequent repetitive behaviors will induce osteoarthritis. There are a plethora of examples in our bodies of “good enough but not well designed.” Where “good enough” is typically, “doesn’t catastrophically hinder reproductive success.” The problem with intelligent design is that there are so many potential pathologies arising from our design and the typical response is akin to “the whole creation is gripped by original sin” or some such amorphous non-refutable claim.

    Put more brutally …

    A glance at any human being should be enough to dispel the notion it is the work of an intelligent being.
    John Grey, The Immortalization Commission.

  5. Elizabeth (Lizzie) Beare

    But I’m guessing again …

    I reckon so. There may be a level of ‘re-booting’ but how can we really tell? It is best not to model the human brain too closely on the little we know at present, semi-mechanistically (using ‘processes’). Also, giving oneself over to a guru-led experience is pretty suss in my opinion. There are too many people around who really get off on mind-fucking others for me to see it as recreationally healthy.

  6. egg_

    Plasts’ role in biology/evolution can’t be overlooked.

  7. Mitch M.

    Homosexuality has a prevalence rate similiar to many developmental hiccups that can arise. I’m not confident we need an evolutionary based explanation to account for these developments. It may simply be a case of “shit happens”, so in the case of homosexuality they are trying to return to their roots. After all, can we use evolutionary theory explain Downs or childhood leukemia or childhood brain tumours? Can intelligent design explain those? In either case we are story telling and I don’t find the stories convincing.

  8. Gab

    Muslim beauty queen will become the FIRST Miss England contestant to wear a hijab – and reveals she might NOT take part in the competition’s swimwear round

    Naturally, she’s got it in the bag. Or at the very least, runner-up.

  9. Arky

    Homosexuality should be viewed solely as a very low probability reproductive strategy for certain sub- standard types who might, none- the- less contain some genetic information worth preservation, from a purely survival view.

  10. Infidel Tiger

    Yes, it attracts cerebral types. My first husband, the Lefty Philosopher, is veering towards Buddhism and the abnegation of being in his more recent years.

    Buddhism is all the rage these days, but it has been repackaged as “mindfulness”

    It is being heavily pushed at self help and business conferences and in all our schools. The kids at my sons school are all encouraged to start each day with some “mindfulness colouring in”.

  11. Snoopy

    and reveals she might NOT take part in the competition’s swimwear round

    Allah be praised.

  12. None

    Haha. One day I’m going to gather all of Arky’s posts, publish them in a book, and make a motzah. Hopefully Arky will do that first.

  13. Mitch M.

    Homosexuality should be viewed solely as a very low probability reproductive strategy for certain sub- standard types who might, none- the- less contain some genetic information worth preservation, from a purely survival view.

    That might be true. At least it would explain fashion.

  14. egg_

    From the standpoint of physics, there is one essential difference between living things and inanimate clumps of carbon atoms: The former tend to be much better at capturing energy from their environment and dissipating that energy as heat

    Enter the plastids – Green energy is yet to replicate.

  15. Mitch M.

    Buddhism is all the rage these days, but it has been repackaged as “mindfulness”
    It is being heavily pushed at self help and business conferences and in all our schools. The kids at my sons school are all encouraged to start each day with some “mindfulness colouring in”.

    Most of those studies are examples of why psychology is absurd. Poorly designed, confirmation bias written all over them. In any event “mindfulness” is nowhere near the heart of Buddhism. People who equate mindfulness with Buddhism haven’t read enough Buddhists.

  16. Stimpson J. Cat

    I can say that God is in no way secretly, inherently or invisibly on or in my heart.

    This is the funniest thing I have read all day.
    How exactly would you know?
    You don’t even know what your arteries, ventricles or atriums would look like.
    How would you know whether an omnipotent, omniscient being responsible for the creation of everything was present in there as well?

    A more important question is why the f$ck would he bother being in your heart?

  17. There are a plethora of examples in our bodies of “good enough but not well designed.” Where “good enough” is typically, “doesn’t catastrophically hinder reproductive success.”

    ‘Good enough’ sounds awfully like it satisfies some particular purpose while not catastrophically hinder reproductive success (another purpose).

  18. egg_

    So good that frequent repetitive behaviors will induce osteoarthritis.

    Balanced against: if you don’t use it, you lose it.
    Viz Nuns’ senility study.

  19. DrBeauGan

    There are good biological reasons for replication being a sloppy process where things go wrong every so often, because once in a blue moon they accidentally make an improvement.

    Homosexuality is a case where they just went wrong.

  20. Ƶĩppʯ (ȊꞪꞨV)

    I love the way words like “rules” and “laws” come into these discussions.

    Me too. When the early moderns ‘banished’ teleology they nevertheless made reference to laws of nature, as if they hand any causal power themselves.

    these are mere words to describe what we observe. things behave in repeatable and predictable behaviour. the description of these behaviours we call rules and laws. the reality is these laws do not have independent existence such that an external being is required to enact them or breath behaviour into them. They are just a description, one that is proving to be highly accurate, but not indisputable.

    you can argue some deity made these law or it requires a deity to enact them, but that adds nothing in the way of usefulness or predictability. And that is the power of science, its usefulness and ability to predict.

  21. egg_

    Although entropy must increase over time in an isolated or “closed” system, an “open” system can keep its entropy low — that is, divide energy unevenly among its atoms — by greatly increasing the entropy of its surroundings. In his influential 1944 monograph “What Is Life?” the eminent quantum physicist Erwin Schrödinger argued that this is what living things must do. A plant, for example, absorbs extremely energetic sunlight, uses it to build sugars, and ejects infrared light, a much less concentrated form of energy. The overall entropy of the universe increases during photosynthesis as the sunlight dissipates, even as the plant prevents itself from decaying by maintaining an orderly internal structure.

    The biologists’ Achilles’ heel.

  22. None

    Homosexuality should be viewed solely as a very low probability reproductive strategy for certain sub- standard types who might, none- the- less contain some genetic information worth preservation, from a purely survival view.

    How would you preserve it? 🤔

  23. Mitch M.

    I reckon so. There may be a level of ‘re-booting’ but how can we really tell?

    We can easily tell by looking at the behavioral and imaging results weeks if not months after the trip. That’s the big issue here: one trip is enough to induce long lasting behavioral changes. Something happened, that is certain. A recent study found remarkable success with a quarterly dose of LSD for cluster headaches. Longstanding reduction in symptoms. It is not just trips. I have long thought of the impact of psychedelics to induce long lasting behavioral changes as being akin to conversion experience in religions.

    Another issue here is beware of the naturalistic fallacy. I don’t know why people think that brain of neurotypicals is the ideal brain. Human brains are a mess and it doesn’t take a neurobiologist that long to realise that evolutionary dynamics have left modern humans with a predisposition to behavioral disorders. Given what we know about the pace of encephalisation that is not surprising, especially given that the neurotransmitters so often invoked to explain psychopathology and neuropathology, ie. acetylcholine, dopamine, norepinephrine, and serotonin, are produced in brain stem nuclei far from the frontal lobes and must send very long axons, some of those axons can take up to 25 years of age to be fully developed.

    Before 2050 the use of cognitive enhancing drugs will be common place. There are already a great many people taking advantage of modern science to maintain and\or enhance their brain function. I have no problem with that, that is the future.

  24. Stimpson J. Cat

    I’ve been there Stimps.

    Actually, I really don’t think you have.
    At all.
    I used to literally eat acid for breakfast.
    Not that it’s a competition or anything.

    😁

  25. Senile Old Guy

    Stimpy: You don’t even know what your arteries, ventricles or atriums would look like.

    ? Another of your fantasies?

    Saying that God exists because we can talk about him is one of the sillier arguments I have heard.

  26. They are just a description

    Sure, causal power is in the things themselves, but that is what the early moderns who rejected teleology specifically denied.

  27. Senile Old Guy

    Calli, I didn’t see anything amiss in your comment. Perhaps a bit subtle for me.

  28. Mitch M.

    They are just a description, one that is proving to be highly accurate, but not indisputable.

    Exactly. There are those that argue what we call “natural laws” don’t exist. As one physicist quipped: our laws are not a description of reality but rather a description of our observations.

  29. None

    Naturally, she’s got it in the bag. Or at the very least, runner-up.

    She should be made to parade without her make-up on at the very least. I mean you just never know these days.

    https://youtu.be/oYok9ZLPZMs

  30. disorders

    Another word that betrays purpose.

  31. Stimpson J. Cat

    “mindfulness”

    It’s another name for self control.

  32. Arky

    And that is the power of science,

    ..
    Was it science that got us to the moon, or the decision to do it?
    Was it Science that lead to the discovery of the new world, or the decision to go?
    Was it science that lead to electric motors, or some idiot screwing about with a kite in a thunder storm?
    It seems to me a lot of science is very elegant explanations by clever men about things discovered or done by complete lunatics.
    It also seems a strange world whereby we decide to do something and it eventually happens. A path opens up.
    Going to the moon was an absurd idea for tens of thousands of years.
    Then when we decided to do it and it could be done.
    We should make a similar decision to go to the stars.
    Once we decide to do it we will find a way.
    Then once that is accomplished, we should look at intergalactic travel.

  33. Bruce of Newcastle

    I used to literally eat acid for breakfast.
    Not that it’s a competition or anything.

    I used to buy acid in road tankers if that helps at all.
    And I’ve process modelled a whole million tonne a year acid plant.
    Got the temperatures and pressures right too.

  34. Ƶĩppʯ (ȊꞪꞨV)

    By the way I suggest that if you talk of God then that in itself would suggest God exists even if you personally don’t think he does.

    we can talk about pink unicorns and green dragons. perhaps god is hanging out with them….

  35. Stimpson J. Cat

    ? Another of your fantasies?
    Saying that God exists because we can talk about him is one of the sillier arguments I have heard.

    I really don’t think that’s what I said.

  36. Senile Old Guy

    California again demonstrates that it is the state where common sense goes to die.

    The Register: “A California judge has ordered major coffee chains to put a cancer warning on their beverages.

    Los Angeles Superior Court judge Elihu Berle ruled this week that, under state law, Starbucks and other coffee chains will have to put up a notice that compounds present in coffee can cause cancer. The judge said that, under California’s Proposition 65, coffee chains are required to carry the signs.”

    “The Court concluded that Defendants failed to meet their burden of proof by preponderance of evidence on their affirmative defenses of ‘no significant risk level’, First Amendment, and federal preemption to avoid the requirement of cancer hazard warning labels as to the existence of acrylamide in brewed coffee,” Berle wrote in his decision.”

  37. Senile Old Guy

    I really don’t think that’s what I said.

    I foolishly tried to respond to two different comments in one post. That was someone else.

  38. Ƶĩppʯ (ȊꞪꞨV)

    It’s another name for self control.

    kind of but that’s not really the main purpose in buddhism.

    Mindfulness is a tool for discovering the nature of mind. you can do this by looking at a flower or your own finger. but for the overwhelmingly vast majority of people this yields no startling insights, neither does mindfulness.

  39. Stimpson J. Cat

    I used to buy acid in road tankers if that helps at all.
    And I’ve process modelled a whole million tonne a year acid plant.
    Got the temperatures and pressures right too.

    Someone always takes it too far.

    😁

  40. Bruce of Newcastle

    We should make a similar decision to go to the stars.

    Unfortunately the speed of light sucks.
    It’s too slow.
    Even electronics people have problems with it.
    Gravity sucks too.

  41. H B Bear

    How many weeks before the calls to sack Buckley start again?

    And then Eddie gives him another contract extension.

  42. Arky

    evolutionary dynamics have left modern humans with a predisposition to behavioral disorders.

    ..
    What seems to you like a behavioural disorder in the advanced civilised urban society of today will likely stand me in good stead in ten years time after the complete collapse of Western civilisation.

  43. cohenite

    God is entropy. Beat entropy and you have the universe by the knackers.

  44. Stimpson J. Cat

    kind of but that’s not really the main purpose in buddhism.

    Who was talking about Buddhism?
    What kind of Muppets shave off perfectly good heads of hair and wear orange?
    Seriously.

  45. Infidel Tiger

    Some wonderful photos of Iraqi & Syrian Christians attending Good Friday mass here:

    https://twitter.com/sahouraxo/status/979811105953468417?s=20

    Would have been a million plu more of them, but George W Bush is a stupid xunt who must burn in Hell.

  46. DrBeauGan

    The planets don’t go around the sun because of the law of gravity. The law of gravity is our explanation of why the planets go around the sun. It’s a language thing.

    Likewise purpose in biological systems is a language thing. Banning its use in formal descriptions is a way of making it hard for the uninformed to deduce that their favourite ideology is true.

    There is a case for banishing causes from science for the same reason. Aquinas and Dover have built unsustainable structures on that particular choice of language. Physicists don’t need it.

    The idea that the universe obeys natural laws or follows rules is another example of this muddle about reality and language. The universe just is, and does what it does. The rules and laws are just part of the language we use to figure out what it’s going to do next.

  47. Mitch M.

    kind of but that’s not really the main purpose in buddhism.

    Yes, in Zen self-control is an illusion and the goal is to see through that illusion. Hence my previous comment that mindfulness is Buddhism co-0pted and distorted by the demands of our culture.

    Was it science that got us to the moon, or the decision to do it?

    It was science that made it a reasonable decision. Prior to that it was a dream. Inter-galactic travel is at present just a dream and there is not one iota of evidence to indicate it is a reasonable decision.

  48. Arky

    Unfortunately the speed of light sucks

    ..
    Nearest star only four light years away.
    With atomic fission blasts propelling a drone there it should be completely possible.
    The only thing required is the will to begin assembling the extremely large vessel to harvast the nuclear blasts without destroying the drone.
    We could start tommorow.

  49. Tel

    And I’ve process modelled a whole million tonne a year acid plant.
    Got the temperatures and pressures right too.

    Let me guess… they built it in China?

    No… India?

  50. Stimpson J. Cat

    That was someone else.

    Was it God?

  51. Arky

    Likewise purpose in biological systems is a language thing.

    ..
    Describe the how. Not the why.

  52. Ƶĩppʯ (ȊꞪꞨV)

    ‘Good enough’ sounds awfully like it satisfies some particular purpose while not catastrophically hinder reproductive success (another purpose).

    personification is by product of a self aggrandising process called a person.

  53. None

    Science is simply a human activity. It is just something humans do.

  54. Arky

    I’m wondering if it would be possible to design some type of atomic rocket.
    Whereby uranium in a gaseous state was feed into a engine that compresses it to the point, sub critical but still throwing out enough energy to propel a spaceship.
    A kind of controlled atomic explosion.

  55. Arky

    If man decided tomorrow to go to the stars it would transform the global economy and politics.
    A massive international undertaking.

  56. DrBeauGan

    None
    #2675372, posted on March 31, 2018 at 7:48 pm
    Science is simply a human activity. It is just something humans do.

    And aren’t we all bloody lucky that a rather small number of human beans have chosen to do it?

  57. None

    The universe just is, and does what it does

    But of course. I just am. I fo what I do. Oops I just ran over your grandma. Hey I think I might just help myself to your car. Yessss I just is.

  58. Mitch M.

    Nearest star only four light years away.
    With atomic fission blasts propelling a drone there it should be completely possible.
    The only thing required is the will to begin assembling the extremely large vessel to harvast the nuclear blasts without destroying the drone.
    We could start tommorow.

    You are forgetting biology. Even current astronauts have clearly measurable changes in gene activity and are prone to a number of pathologies that are inexplicable. A major concern with even going to Mars is radiation though I don’t know how important that is far from the Sun because the main concern is solar flares. It isn’t just radiation, we are evolved for earth gravity and serious issues can arise in the absence of that gravity. That’s why I think that we can’t populate on Mars because the fetus will most probably undergo spontaneous abortion. Suck on that Elon Musk you silly little dreamer.

    What seems to you like a behavioural disorder in the advanced civilised urban society of today will likely stand me in good stead in ten years time after the complete collapse of Western civilisation.

    A behavioral disorder is a maladaptive response to the current environment. What you are arguing is that you can see a possible future were those disorders become adaptive. That may be true especially when we consider that highly intelligent people are more prone to be non-conformist, experiment with drugs, and create their own moral structures. I don’t “seem” anything, these behavioral disorders are maladaptive.

  59. cynical1

    Homosexuality should be viewed solely as a very low probability reproductive strategy for certain sub- standard types who might, none- the- less contain some genetic information worth preservation, from a purely survival view.

    “How would you preserve it”?

    Two lezzies and a turkey baster…

  60. a language thing.

    Causes, purposes, systems, and so on, are only ‘language things’. That ‘language thing’ is doing a lot of work.

  61. Leigh Lowe

    The Register: “A California judge has ordered major coffee chains to put a cancer warning on their beverages.

    So small boutique cafes using the same beans and roasting techniques are not a cancer risk.
    Only large corporates.

  62. Senile Old Guy

    That was someone else.

    Was it God?

    Who? Apparently we can only talk about things that actually exist. Also, due to relativity, the faster we talk about things, the slower they happen. (I might have got that last bit muddled.)

  63. Ƶĩppʯ (ȊꞪꞨV)

    Yes, in Zen self-control is an illusion and the goal is to see through that illusion.

    its a bit more than the illusion of self control. it’s the illusion of mind and reality itself.

  64. Ƶĩppʯ (ȊꞪꞨV)

    Causes, purposes, systems, and so on, are only ‘language things’. That ‘language thing’ is doing a lot of work.

    no that language thing is doing a lot of describing. descriptions are condensations of information.

  65. egg_

    “Our exciting findings don’t just extend back the record of life living in hot springs by 3 billion years, they indicate that life was inhabiting the land much earlier than previously thought, by up to about 580 million years,” says study first author, UNSW PhD candidate, Tara Djokic.

    “This may have implications for an origin of life in freshwater hot springs on land, rather than the more widely discussed idea that life developed in the ocean and adapted to land later.”

    Scientists are considering two hypotheses regarding the origin of life. Either that it began in deep sea hydrothermal vents, or alternatively that it began on land in a version of Charles Darwin’s “warm little pond”.

    “The discovery of potential biological signatures in these ancient hot springs in Western Australia provides a geological perspective that may lend weight to a land-based origin of life,” says Ms Djokic.

    “Our research also has major implications for the search for life on Mars, because the red planet has ancient hot spring deposits of a similar age to the Dresser Formation in the Pilbara.

    “Of the top three potential landing sites for the Mars 2020 rover, Columbia Hills is indicated as a hot spring environment. If life can be preserved in hot springs so far back in Earth’s history, then there is a good chance it could be preserved in Martian hot springs too.”

  66. None

    Not a small number, DrBeaugan. Quite a large number. It’s quite interesting to look into the history of science and how it’s developed. It has always developed hand in hand with philosophy and theology. When that dialogue is forced apart and ended you just get whacko climate pseudo-scientists worshipping Gaia. The greatest impetus for science came with Christianity. We’re pretty lucky the Christians took up the Graeco-roman tradition -especially the Greek given the Romans we’re just good at building roads and killing people – took up the Greco Roman tradition, transformed it and propelled to new heights.

  67. wivenhoe

    Get a load of this heap of shit

    Oh my goodness, mate, I will really have to race in an order two of those, will need a back up whilst the other is undergoing repairs of maintenance. But then, sometimes I have been known to talk total crap.

  68. Bruce of Newcastle

    Let me guess… they built it in China?

    Tel – No it’s in Australia, but I didn’t design it. I was just rebuilding an existing model in a different much better package. The old DFS model didn’t have the acid plant modelled in it, just the inputs and outputs. So I pulled up an acid plant design off the internet, put the data in and voila, it worked! It was a good check test of the new package and a useful thing for what-if analysis, which is what we used it for.

  69. Arky

    I don’t want to put words in God’s mouth, but I imagine he wants us to go to the stars.
    In order for this to occur, we must defeat the dismal green- left religion that sees us as “custodians” and instead we must see Man again as conquerer and master, subject only to God.
    Only then can we do that which must be done to make the next step in human progress.

  70. Leigh Lowe

    The great truce.
    Is it holding?
    Any skirmishes in the DMZ between Mt Druitt and Canberra?

  71. DrBeauGan

    None
    #2675376, posted on March 31, 2018 at 7:53 pm
    The universe just is, and does what it does

    But of course. I just am. I fo what I do. Oops I just ran over your grandma. Hey I think I might just help myself to your car. Yessss I just is.

    You seem to be confusing yourself with the universe, None.

    Human beings make up rules, for other human beings, about running over grandmas and thieving cars. Then we sometimes enforce them. Don’t try doing this with the universe at large.

  72. Ƶĩppʯ (ȊꞪꞨV)

    Was it God?

    people are building god even as we speak. it’s just a matter of time before we create a general AI and it will surpass our intelligence by several orders of magnitude. It will seems as a god to us.

  73. candy

    Muslim beauty queen will become the FIRST Miss England contestant to wear a hijab – and reveals she might NOT take part in the competition’s swimwear round

    She’s not bad looking, a little chunky, a bit too much makeup, but nice looking.
    I think it’s good she gets out and participates in the competition.

  74. Leigh Lowe

    She’s not bad looking, a little chunky, a bit too much makeup, but nice looking.

    Dare I ask.
    Perky?

  75. None

    You can start by describing the difference between a pink unicorn and god rather, god concept, Stimpy. Not even those who think pink unicorns exist believe that they are gods.

  76. egg_

    We should make a similar decision to go to the stars.

    Hawking Radiation from a micro black hole is a theoretical power source.

  77. no that language thing is doing a lot of describing. descriptions are condensations of information.

    Information is teleological.

  78. DrBeauGan

    dover_beach
    #2675380, posted on March 31, 2018 at 7:59 pm
    a language thing.

    Causes, purposes, systems, and so on, are only ‘language things’. That ‘language thing’ is doing a lot of work.

    Well, it’s letting us have arguments about God, the universe and everything, so yes, it is. But I agree there has to be something to be described and argued about.

  79. None

    I am part of the universe Dr Beaugan. Sadly for you I haven’t managed to transport myself into some alternative reality.

  80. Mitch M.

    Not a small number, DrBeaugan. Quite a large number. It’s quite interesting to look into the history of science and how it’s developed. It has always developed hand in hand with philosophy and theology.

    That’s atavistic. Science now progresses through improvements in measurement and technology. That was a critical issue even in the earliest period. The development of precise time keeping is essential to Science, and technologies like the microscope and computers have revolutionised Science. Without those types of things Science would stand still.

  81. DrBeauGan

    None
    #2675402, posted on March 31, 2018 at 8:13 pm
    I am part of the universe Dr Beaugan. Sadly for you I haven’t managed to transport myself into some alternative reality.

    I’m not too sure of that.

  82. johanna

    Entropy
    #2675011, posted on March 31, 2018 at 12:22 pm

    I am honk Johanna should get a cat. I recommend Devon Rex. Marvellous creatures for a cat. Real companions. Although a pair would be best to keep each other company while Johanna was out.
    Entropy
    #2675012, posted on March 31, 2018 at 12:24 pm

    ‘Honk’ should have been ‘thinking’

    Gee, thanks, Entropy.

    Why would I want to get a cat or cats? I already have several of them roaming around my place, and if I ever made the mistake of feeding one of them, it would be mine, at least part time.

    I do like cats, though, especially as they mirror my lifestyle of eating lots of meat and exerting themselves as little as possible. Alas, I do not share their ability to look good and be graceful 24/7.

    As other dwellers in medium density land will know, the small, fluffy, yappy white ‘dog’ is ubiquitous. I don’t at all mind proper dogs, but these things are more like rodents, except not as bright.

    Thus endeth the lesson on domestic pets.

  83. Stimpson J. Cat

    It will seems as a god to us.

    No, it will be a talking toaster.

  84. egg_

    God is entropy.

    Yup, the concept born of tinkering with steam engines, no less.

  85. None

    Muslim Miss England is cross-eyed, overweight, will not participate in the dance routines, music competition, swimwear, but hey yes she’s having a go. At what precisely?

  86. wivenhoe

    Gravity sucks too.

    Apparently, Bruce, that would be correct. I remember reading it on the toilet wall at the Regatta Hotel, so it must be true.

  87. Stimpson J. Cat

    You can start by describing the difference between a pink unicorn and god rather, god concept, Stimpy.

    But I don’t want to talk about pink unicorns.
    I don’t like pink unicorns.
    I am possibly scared of pink unicorns.
    I really don’t like where this is heading.
    How and why do pink unicorns come into it?
    Can it be something else not pink and not unicorn instead?

  88. calli

    At what precisely?

    Competitive Standing.

  89. Pedro the Ignorant

    Round 1 WAFL, Perth Demons vs Swan Districts. The final score is too horrifying to publish.

    Perth have developed an interesting defensive technique when the ball is heading away from their goal.

    Run in the opposite direction and then stand there with hands on their hips either watching play or looking around for the water boy/girl. Coach Earle Spalding praises his players at 3/4 time, home crowd vomits.

    If sdfc is lurking, he will be gloating his head off.

  90. egg_

    I am part of the universe Dr Beaugan. Sadly for you I haven’t managed to transport myself into some alternative reality.

    Hawking was getting onto multiverses to try to explain the Big Bang’s singularity (time existing before spacetime) IIRC.
    Chicken and egg.

  91. Ƶĩppʯ (ȊꞪꞨV)

    Information is teleological.

    Claude Shannon, upgraded information into a science back in 48.

    The fact we can even this discussion today can be traced back to Shannon.

  92. None

    I’m not too sure of that.

    So you claim to be able to see into alternate realities, Dr Beaugan? Uhuh. Any pink unicorns there? Stimpy would like to know.

  93. Ƶĩppʯ (ȊꞪꞨV)

    Muslim Miss England is cross-eyed, overweight, will not participate in the dance routines, music competition, swimwear, but hey yes she’s having a go. At what precisely?

    civilisational jihad

  94. egg_

    As other dwellers in medium density land will know, the small, fluffy, yappy white ‘dog’ is ubiquitous. I don’t at all mind proper dogs, but these things are more like rodents, except not as bright.

    Hehe, keep them for Veneztralia.

  95. Mitch M.

    Yup, the concept born of tinkering with steam engines, no less.

    Which explains why there are many descriptions of God …

    “The American philosopher David Hull has recently pointed out that physicists can readily compile a list of 20 or more different formulations of the Second Law.”

  96. None

    Hawking was also considered a galoot by other scientists, egg, who don’t subscribe to theories of everything like he did.

  97. Bruce of Newcastle

    Nearest star only four light years away.

    I haven’t done the sums for a while but it’s very unlikely a probe, even a tiny one, could get to Proxima Centauri in less than a century. A century would require an average velocity of 0.043c, which is just under 13,000 km/s. The fastest ever spacecraft we’ve built pulls 70 km/s, most of that from gravity assists.

    To get to 13,000 km/s takes 1 g of thrust for 2.2 weeks. A bomb powered spacecraft would have to be big to survive the impulse of each detonation. So you’d be talking of what? A detonation per minute? That would be 22,100 nuclear devices, even if you didn’t plan to slow down at the end of the journey.

    As someone said, space is big. Also no one is going to allow twenty two thousand nuclear weapons in orbit…

  98. Stimpson J. Cat

    Stimpy would like to know.

    I f$cking hope not.
    There better not be.

  99. Stimpson J. Cat

    Hawking

    Daleks can never be trusted, even if they assume human form.

  100. DrBeauGan

    I want humanity to go to the stars too, Arky. It may take some time.

  101. H B Bear

    Perth Demons have been shit for decades. I am just old enough to remember their glory days in the 70s. Used to be able to get a great hamburger at the oval in those days.

  102. Stimpson J. Cat

    The great truce.
    Is it holding?
    Any skirmishes in the DMZ between Mt Druitt and Canberra?

    The battlefield has shifted Leigh.
    It is now the sticky pages of Quadrant that shall bear witness to wamen on wamen carnage.

  103. Steve trickler.

    They should film this clip again. This time in downtown Riyadh.



  104. Pedro the Ignorant

    They even ran out of hot chips at Lathlain today, H.B.

    Added insult to the horrible standard of play.

  105. Leigh Lowe

    Ƶĩppʯ (ȊꞪꞨV)

    #2675417, posted on March 31, 2018 at 8:23 pm

    Muslim Miss England is cross-eyed, overweight, will not participate in the dance routines, music competition, swimwear, but hey yes she’s having a go. At what precisely?

    civilisational jihad

    Absolutely correct.
    Hollow out and destroy everything.

  106. Arky

    Information is teleological.

    ..
    If you see a bit of wooden comb on an archeological dig you immediately know you are looking at a comb.
    You don’t have to explain or go through some torturous process to find out what it is for or why it was made.
    No matter what its origin, you know a comb when you see it, both the how and the why.
    Likewise, when you trip across a universe containing life it should be bloody obvious why it’s here. Espeacially when you are that life.

  107. Leigh Lowe

    The battlefield has shifted Leigh.
    It is now the sticky pages of Quadrant that shall bear witness to wamen on wamen carnage.

    As if the poor old codgers at Quadrant haven’t suffered enough.

  108. DrBeauGan

    None
    #2675416, posted on March 31, 2018 at 8:23 pm
    I’m not too sure of that.

    So you claim to be able to see into alternate realities, Dr Beaugan? Uhuh. Any pink unicorns there? Stimpy would like to know.

    Depends on what you mean by reality, None. There’s the universe outside our heads, and the pictures of reality each of us builds inside our heads, then there’s the common language we use to try to tell each other about the things inside our heads.

    You’ve said enough to tell us about what’s inside yours. Calling it an alternative reality isn’t entirely unreasonable. It isn’t much like what’s in mine.

  109. Claude Shannon, upgraded information into a science back in 48.

    And information is still teleological.

  110. egg_

    who don’t subscribe to theories of everything like he did.

    Uber skeptic here doesn’t subscribe to most basic Physics Scientific fantasies, like the Higgs boson ‘God particle’ – being determined by Statisticians.
    Theoretical Physicists are already searching for even smaller particles and want an even bigger CERN machine, IIRC.

  111. Arky

    As someone said, space is big. Also no one is going to allow twenty two thousand nuclear weapons in orbit…

    ..
    You tug it out of the solar system first.
    Time and will is all that is required.
    Once fully commited to the project solutions will be found.
    If part of the solution is our grandchildren will recieve the benefit, so be it.

  112. candy

    but hey yes she’s having a go. At what precisely?

    At fitting in, I would say.
    Most girls dream of winning a beauty competition.

    It’s not a bomb making competition.

  113. None

    It would be wonderful if humans could reach the nearest star. That’d be something I’d really love to see before I die. Even if it was an unmanned spacecraft. Then, as the whole globe watches on and marvel’s iat human achievement, some f****** feminazis on Twitter will go into meltdown over a shirt.

  114. DrBeauGan

    Theoretical Physicists are already searching for even smaller particles and want an even bigger CERN machine, IIRC.

    Let them have their fun, Egg. It’s turned out to be much better than letting military men or religious folk have their way with our money.

  115. Arky

    As someone said, space is big. Also no one is going to allow twenty two thousand nuclear weapons in orbit…

    ..
    I’m sacking you as the projects public relations manager.
    They aren’t “nuclear weapons”, they are “atomic engines”.
    Also, why would you need twenty two thousand? Show me your working out on that.

  116. egg_

    DrBeauGan
    #2675438, posted on March 31, 2018 at 8:40 pm

    If we can afford to surpass the ‘God particle’ (read aether), I’m all for it.
    Bird would love this thread.

  117. H B Bear

    They even ran out of hot chips at Lathlain today, H.B.
    Added insult to the horrible standard of play.

    LOL you’re a trooper. Onya,

  118. Infidel Tiger

    It would be wonderful if humans could reach the nearest star.

    I’m one of the dumbest people here, but we are all aware that a star is actually a really really hot nuclear explosion right? If we want to cook people, can we not just douse them in petroleum or chuck them on a volcano?

  119. Nick

    As if the poor old codgers at Quadrant haven’t suffered enough.

    Lest we forget the readers.

  120. Rae

    Hawking was also considered a galoot by other scientists, egg, who don’t subscribe to theories of everything like he did.

    Hardly a galoot. Susskind disagreed with Hawkings views on what happens to matter in black holes.

  121. Zulu Kilo Two Alpha

    Grace Mugabe’s luxury farm is invaded by locals mining for gold two years after she illegally forced them off the land in Zimbabwe

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5562621/Grace-Mugabes-luxury-Zimbabwe-farm-invaded-locals-mining-gold.html#ixzz5BJnsoQke
    Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

    What goes around…

  122. None

    At fitting in, I would say.
    Most girls dream of winning a beauty competition.

    Refusing to participate in most of the competition is not fitting in.

  123. Mitch M.

    Daleks can never be trusted, even if they assume human form.

    Confronted with modern technology even Daleks can be defeated.

  124. Arky

    I would imagine as the velocity increases you could detonate each atomic engine closer to the shroud part of the starship.
    It would surf sucessive blasts.
    It might be over a mile long, with a large radius “sail” to ride the blast.
    Uranium is what? A hundred thousand or a million times more energy dense than kerosene?
    You can’t have interstellar travel without atomic energy.

  125. Bruce of Newcastle

    You tug it out of the solar system first.

    I suggest you build a 1 km diameter optical and IR space telescope at L2 Arky, and use it to directly image Proxima Centauri b first. Once your telescope is up and running you’ll be able to see if it’s worth going there. Is it gravity locked like the Moon? You’d see one side hot and the other cold. The atmosphere, if any, can be analysed from the spectrum.

    A 1 km space telescope would be much cheaper than a space probe, and we could almost build one now if we asked Elon to launch the bits for us.

    Btw going anywhere in our current solar system would be a whole lot easier and there’s lots of interesting places to go to. In a millennium or two after we’ve done all the Royal Caribbean tours of Mars, Europa and Titan, and we’re bored, maybe then we might think about going further.

  126. zyconoclast

    Caveman
    #2674934, posted on March 31, 2018 at 10:44 am
    Apparently people of no appearance robbed a fish and chip shop in Yarraville the other day

    They battered the door down to get in apparently.

    You left too may behind.

    Occupants were victims of a salt and batter.
    Information came from a reliable sauce.
    Investigators were mislead by red herrings.
    The scale of the crime has left police floundering.

  127. egg_

    people are building god even as we speak. it’s just a matter of time before we create a general AI and it will surpass our intelligence by several orders of magnitude. It will seems as a god to us.

    Middle-aged PS frumps can argue for wage equalidee with it, when it’s not having elevenses at the local barista’s.

  128. Ƶĩppʯ (ȊꞪꞨV)

    And information is still teleological.

    information is perception. Our perceptions are quantised. you can neither escape the embodiment of your perceptions nor the quantisation, so I don’t see where any teleology comes into it, other then as just another idea not grounded in the above.

    What Shannon did was create some mathematical rigour around information. Any teleological view of information adds nothing of use to the concept. However creating some science around the notion of information allows us to talk about it across vast distances in real time. Now that is phenomenal.

    if we look at the etymology of information. According to google we get
    latin informare. formation of the mind. teaching.
    Old French informacion, enformacion “advice, instruction”
    the root inform:
    early 14c., “to train or instruct in some specific subject,” from Old French informer, enformer “instruct, teach” (13c.) and directly from Latin informare “to shape, give form to, delineate,”

    the core of the word is ultimately about ones transmission of distillation of some experience. I am just not seeing what value there is to saying information is teleological.

  129. johanna

    Heh, enjoyed the several commenters who belong in the Brighton super mare Home for the Bewildered
    (or are simply lazy) asking about where the ‘perky tits’ meme came from.

    It came from Our Princess Lizzie, who told us that her tits are still perky after breastfeeding four children. This is the kind of information that every Cat and Kitteh needs to know.

    I *may* have promulgated this important information subsequently, by addressing her as Princess Perky Tits. It’s just possible.

    As any barrister knows, if you open the door, expect people to walk in.

    Princess Perky Tits.

  130. Infidel Tiger

    Joh, how many joos have you boned?

  131. Ƶĩppʯ (ȊꞪꞨV)

    Anyway time for more perky tits

    Betiana Distanza hailing from Argentina

  132. Stimpson J. Cat

    CERN

    I don’t trust those evil robe wearing devil worshipping money hoovering freaks.
    They should be nuked from orbit.
    Them and all the Nazi gold.

  133. information is perception. Our perceptions are quantised. you can neither escape the embodiment of your perceptions nor the quantisation, so I don’t see where any teleology comes into it, other then as just another idea not grounded in the above.

    Information is about something. Aboutness is teleological.

  134. egg_

    evil robe wearing devil worshipping money hoovering freaks.

    At least, they’re a notch above ‘climate scientists’.
    Sounds like Robyn 100m Williams’ garb on TGGWS debate.

  135. Bruce of Newcastle

    Also, why would you need twenty two thousand? Show me your working out on that.

    Arky – The assumption was that you’d go at 0.043c which gets you to PC in a century. Lightspeed is roughly 300,000 km/s, so 0.043c is 12,900 km/s.

    I took the acceleration of 1 g as an assumption. Nice round figure. Pleasant. V=at says that 13,000 km/s takes 13,000,000/9.8×3600=368 hours, or 2.193 weeks.

    Then you make the assumption the spacecraft is big, so the bombs move it rather than blowing it to bits. So you’ll need to fire them off one after the other to sustain acceleration at 1 g. I have no idea how big the spacecraft needs to be or how big the bombs are. But a bomb is a unit of one bomb, whether it is a 2 kt tiddler or a Tsar Bomba. So I assumed you’d let off one per minute. That would require 2.193x168x60=22,109 nuclear devices big or small.

    You changes your assumptions and you do your arithmetics. For a fun story read Footfall by Niven and Pournelle. I’m sure Pournelle, who worked in aerospace, would’ve done the calcs for his “Old Bang Bang”. SF writers are careful as fans give them a hard time if they get something wrong.

  136. zyconoclast

    I just thought of another one.

    Suspects were peppered with questions.

  137. John Constantine

    The robots go to mars first, take as long as they take to dig the warrens underground for the people, mine for the water ice, set up the nutrient tanks.

    Then instead of breeding pairs of humans, the genetic material and the biobag tlexiau tech is delivered to the robot creche next.

    Prime time for actual adult humans is just before Mars turns into lord of the flies.

  138. egg_

    information is perception

    The robots doco on Aunty recently was interesting.

  139. Leigh Lowe

    Infidel Tiger

    #2675455, posted on March 31, 2018 at 9:14 pm

    Joh, how many joos have you boned?

    Please.
    The embers are fading.
    No petrol.

  140. DrBeauGan

    Ƶĩppʯ (ȊꞪꞨV)
    #2675457, posted on March 31, 2018 at 9:16 pm
    Anyway time for more perky tits

    Betiana Distanza hailing from Argentina

    I like her hat.

  141. egg_

    Prime time for actual adult humans is just before Mars turns into lord of the flies.

    We could send a bunch of Richo’s heads-in-jars and save weight.

  142. Ƶĩppʯ (ȊꞪꞨV)

    Information is about something. Aboutness is teleological.

    information is about our perceptions and how we compress them into concepts and back out again so we can transmit them to each other.

    when your only tool is a hammer, everything seems to be a nail.

  143. John Constantine

    Ala phantasy about Mars and space of course.

    Their Left is hysterically and suicide bent all for eternal decolonisation.

    I have seen activist lawyers weeping and howling in rage at the feeling that mankind may try and escape into space to get away from the totalitarian global hellhole the left has planned for communal Earth.

    The debate about the educational programs for the children of Mars would be civil war style.

    Only eternal Stalin worship, totalitarian communism will be ever allowed to leave earth, if mars has no words for anything except the narrative of the Cause, the left will still not tolerate human nature and the potential to desire freedom.

  144. John Constantine

    Betting would be on Mars being colonised by clones of the Eternal Chairman of the Chinese Communist Party.

    Even when they get head transplants perfected, the thousand year old chairman will need some way of making sure he isn’t dependant on any one planet for his genetic continuation.

  145. Rae

    Trending on Youtube at the moment: WESTWORLD Season 2 – Official Trailer

    Starts 22 April2018.

  146. johanna

    Elizabeth (Lizzie) Beare
    #2675267, posted on March 31, 2018 at 5:58 pm

    I rather think they are trying to suppress a knowledge of God that is written on the heart, so to speak, however faintly.

    The movement that is life, the pulse of the blood, the beings that we are with minds of extraordinary beauty and facility. Our language. Cognition. Things numinous, which mystics reach for but for which mysticism is a blind man’s folly. That ‘within’ of us that none of us ever escape. The hold of the self and the imperfect reach – something faint, Roger – that belongs with the coming of light and breath. And the darkness comprehended it not. There is nothing better than ‘we are such stuff as dreams are made on’. We have no idea what that is.

    More sludge from Princess Perky Tits.

    What does this drivel mean?

  147. DrBeauGan

    Only eternal Stalin worship, totalitarian communism will be ever allowed to leave earth, if mars has no words for anything except the narrative of the Cause, the left will still not tolerate human nature and the potential to desire freedom.

    That’s part of why a successful event in space led to feminist outrage at a bloke’s shirt.

  148. Zulu Kilo Two Alpha

    I like her hat.

    Hat? What hat?

  149. egg_

    information is about our perceptions and how we compress them into concepts and back out again so we can transmit them to each other.

    Like how we live in an achromatic world and human perception superimposes our perception of colour.

  150. DrBeauGan

    I agree with Arky that getting off Earth is going to require getting rid of green lefties.

  151. John Constantine

    No more stale pale males to ever escape the gravity well of earth again.

    No racism in space, only quota diversity.

    The left would never allow another voyager space probe to leave without all querty genders represented, and a plea for any military power finding the probe to assault and genocide earth for racism.

  152. pete m

    Bruce of N, forget speed – just learn how to fold space. Dune style.

    perky or plain bouncy?

    bouncy wins!

  153. egg_

    The left would never allow another voyager space probe to leave without all querty genders represented, and a plea for any military power finding the probe to assault and genocide earth for racism.

    That’s what the B-Ark is for.

  154. egg_

    perky or plain bouncy?

    Bejigglin’

  155. John Constantine

    Dunno who came up with the concept that Alien Intelligence is on a collision course with Earth and is only a couple of decades out. and there is no reason to suspect it is friendly.

    Only instead of coming in from space, we are ticking down the decade or two until we crack true artificial superintelligence.

    Skynet, programmed by suicidal humanity hating godless commie swampfilth.

    Comrades.

  156. DrBeauGan

    The fundamental issue in getting humanity into space is getting rid of lefties. Any suggestions on how?

    I’d prefer something that didn’t involve turning them into mulch..

  157. Arky

    So I assumed you’d let off one per minute. That would require 2.193x168x60=22,109 nuclear devices big or small.

    ..
    So it’s 22 bombs.
    Make it 44 and we can stop when we get there.
    Or make it 88 and we can get there in a lifetime.
    Or: make it staged: start stockpiling bombs er… atomic engines an eighth of the way out. A quarter, half way etc.
    Explode them as the ships pass each stage.
    An interstellar railroad.
    Might take fifty years to build the first stage.
    Twenty the next.
    Five the next.
    Etc.

  158. Snoopy

    Wasn’t one of Dot’s heroes testing a spaceship engine?
    What happened to that?

  159. Bruce of Newcastle

    I agree with Arky that getting off Earth is going to require getting rid of green lefties.

    Send them to Titan. More oil and gas on Titan than Earth has. The lakes and seas are LNG, and the atmosphere is so dense that wind turbines would work even better. Paradise! Pity about the lack of oxygen, but greens aren’t fussed about details.

  160. John Constantine

    The problem would be equally acceptably solved using the B-Ark solution.

    All totalitarian godless commie one universe government types could be sent off on the great colony ships to preach Stalin to the multiverse.

    Leaving the proles behind to battle on in peace and freedom.

  161. Frank

    I’d prefer something that didn’t involve turning them into mulch..

    Sterilisation is the most humane thing, given the incidence of the qwerties it may even have the benefit of being self administered.

  162. Ƶĩppʯ (ȊꞪꞨV)

    Information is about something. Aboutness is teleological.

    there is this mind blowing AI tool called word2vec.

    you feed a large corpus of language into a blank neural network and it creates a n-dimensional vector for each word based on its frequency of usage in relation to other words in the corpus. commonly 300 dimensions are used.

    the network can then be queried with simple questions. the famous one is
    King – Man + Woman
    and it spits out Queen.

    how can it possibly know this, given it was blank and nowhere in the corpus is there an explanation of king or queen?

    There is nothing teleological about this apparent miracle. All the network does is compress information into vectorised concepts which can be mathematically manipulated. the vectorisation mathematically encodes simple relationships between how words are used.

    In this case concepts are the compression of sufficient number of phrases.

    This give tremendous insight into how our minds work.

  163. Snoopy

    Was it Arky who likened Dot’s engine to being locked in a shipping container and continuously running up and bouncing off a wall?

  164. Arky

    I took the acceleration of 1 g as an assumption. Nice round figure. Pleasant.

    ..
    Unmanned you could do twenty g. Fifty g.
    ..
    Don’t fuck about.

  165. johanna

    Infidel Tiger
    #2675455, posted on March 31, 2018 at 9:14 pm

    Joh, how many joos have you boned?

    A lady never tells.

    But, in passing, I will remark that intense is good, and memorable.

  166. Snoopy

    All totalitarian godless commie one universe government types could be sent off on the great colony ships to preach Stalin to the multiverse.

    “Here you are. Welcome aboard the Mayflower II. Yes it does look like a helicopter. Weird, hey?”

  167. Elizabeth (Lizzie) Beare

    Hairy gets like this sometimes, Arky. I just gently lead him inside, sit him down, get on my computer for a phone number of the right sort of tradie and call a man in to fix it. Worth every cent for staving off hidden health costs.
    Not that it’s any of my business, but I really hope you don’t explain it to Hairy in those terms.

    Of course not, Marcus. I am very aware of tender egos.
    It is all done simply to take a load off his shoulders.
    Just making a helpful phone call as a helpmeet should.
    To free him up to other more important things.

  168. Gab

    Some wonderful photos of Iraqi & Syrian Christians attending Good Friday mass here:

    We have a large Zimbabwean Catholic contingent in our parish. And they have lovely singing voices too

  169. None

    The fundamental issue in getting humanity into space is getting rid of lefties. Any suggestions on how?

    I’d prefer something that didn’t involve turning them into mulch..

    you can always tell him that you’re going for a ride on Elon musk’s orbiting Tesla. But mulch is also equally eco-friendly.

  170. JC

    Joh

    Your father would be sorely disappointed. Recall how you once told us how much hates joos. Don’t tell him, because at his advanced age it could kill him.

  171. egg_

    there is this mind blowing AI tool

    Driverless trains and trams are here, cars next.
    Cadillac, etc. already have driver ‘assist’ packages that are virtually an auto pilot.

  172. Dr Faustus

    Los Angeles Superior Court judge Elihu Berle ruled this week that, under state law, Starbucks and other coffee chains will have to put up a notice that compounds present in coffee can cause cancer. The judge said that, under California’s Proposition 65, coffee chains are required to carry the signs.”

    Orange juice, especially commercially produced orange juice, has a significant methanol content. Methanol is a Proposition 65 agent, “known to the state to cause cancer or reproductive toxicity“.

    Starbucks needs to escalate and petition Judge Fuckhead to get a warning label slapped on every carton of one of California’s major exports.

  173. JC

    I’d prefer something that didn’t involve turning them into mulch..

    Mulch is good, as it’s carbon neutral.

  174. zyconoclast

    Muslim beauty queen will become the FIRST Miss England contestant to wear a hijab – and reveals she might NOT take part in the competition’s swimwear round

    she’s fat. watch the organisers do a double back flip to accommodate her

    Agree. Her fatness is the reason she won’t wear a bikini.

  175. DrBeauGan

    But mulch is also equally eco-friendly.

    True, None. It’s the screams as they got turned into mulch that would upset me. I know, I’m a softy.

  176. JC

    Driverless trains and trams are here, cars next.
    Cadillac, etc. already have driver ‘assist’ packages that are virtually an auto pilot.

    and planes…. don’t forget that segment.
    So are Beamers and Mercs. But I don’t think they are completely so. Beamers have around 40 seconds of drive free. I don’t think there are any production models that are on complete autopilot.

  177. the network can then be queried with simple questions. the famous one is
    King – Man + Woman
    and it spits out Queen.

    how can it possibly know this, given it was blank and nowhere in the corpus is there an explanation of king or queen?

    There is nothing teleological about this apparent miracle. All the network does is compress information into vectorised concepts which can be mathematically manipulated. the vectorisation mathematically encodes simple relationships between how words are used.

    Teleology all the way down. Notice how the network does not generate the meaning given to the words in the corpus. Without teleology, the network wouldn’t be able to discover the meaning and thereby the answer.

  178. zyconoclast

    German woman, 32, who was blocked from becoming a police officer because her fake breasts ‘posed a health risk’ wins six-year court battle to make force review its policy

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5563797/Woman-32-blocked-joining-police-fake-boobs-wins-six-year-court-battle.html#ixzz5BJ6mXAUk
    Follow us: @MailOnline on Twitter | DailyMail on Facebook

    Join the ADF and they will give them to you free because if they dont you will have a mental health issue.

    Servicewomen given breast implants to boost morale

    Australian Defence Force spends $640,000 on gender identity treatment for transitioning troops

    Marise Payne defends taxpayer funded sex change surgeries

  179. Infidel Tiger

    Driverless train, tram, bus, plane… no problem.

    To me a driverless car represents everything that is wrong with western society. It scares me witless that anyone would want this. Cars are freedom baby. Less than 5% of cars sold these days are manual. Kids are holding off getting their licenses.

    Everything is fukt.

  180. JC

    I’m not sure about that, Artiste, although you make a fair point. Could you imagine Australian governments with the power to control traffic flow, speed etc? A bully state would bully us endlessly.

    It’s really strange how kids aren’t rushing out to get licenses these days.

  181. Arky

    To me a driverless car represents everything that is wrong with western society. It scares me witless that anyone would want this. Cars are freedom baby.

    ..
    Driverless cars are public transport by stealth.

  182. zyconoclast

    Muslim beauty queen will become the FIRST Miss England contestant to wear a hijab – and reveals she might NOT take part in the competition’s swimwear round

    Naturally, she’s got it in the bag. Or at the very least, runner-up.

    Good one.
    Deliberate?

  183. DrBeauGan

    Everything is fukt.

    How do you feel about smartphones, IT?

    To me a driverless car, like a smartphone, gives me more freedom, not less.

  184. zyconoclast

    Homosexuality should be viewed solely as a very low probability reproductive strategy for certain sub- standard types who might, none- the- less contain some genetic information worth preservation, from a purely survival view.

    How would you preserve it? 🤔

    Buggered if I know.

  185. 2dogs

    The fundamental issue in getting humanity into space is getting rid of lefties. Any suggestions on how?

    Give everyone their own choice of society to live in: communists in communism, capitalists in capitalism, etc. It will all sound very fair at the start.

    Then the lefties will die of starvation.

  186. Snoopy

    It’s really strange how kids aren’t rushing out to get licenses these days.

    What kid needs a car when your girlfriend’s mum lets you ‘sleep’ over?

  187. Arky

    Renewable energy is deindustrialisation by stealth.
    Education is indoctrination by stealth.
    Mass migration is genocide by stealth.

  188. DrBeauGan

    Driverless cars are public transport by stealth.

    Only if they go where they want to go instead of where I tell them.

  189. Bruce of Newcastle

    Unmanned you could do twenty g. Fifty g.

    Arky – Engineering is built around 1 g for some reason. It’s possible to build for high gee, but high gee needs higher impulse therefore more mass to survive the blast. An Orion drive spacecraft needs a lot of small impulses rather than a few large ones. Nothing we could build would survive even a small hydrogen bomb. Materials just aren’t tough enough – and the energy released would vaporise the base plate rapidly if the bombs weren’t very small.

    Operation Plumbbob was the nuclear test series where a manhole cover was blown skywards. It left the top of the test shaft at about 66 km/s. The cover was 2,000 lb of armour plate, but the shaft was 500 ft deep, so the distance would’ve shielded the steel from the direct radiation. That detonation was 300 t – a very small nuclear detonation. The other fun thing is the propellant was actually 2 tonnes of vaporized concrete. Shows you just how powerful even 300 tonnes of TNT is, that it can turn a 2 t block of concrete into gas.

  190. max

    On this, the eve of Easter Sunday, I declare that I am sick of sermons that talk only of a forgiving, merciful God.

    I read recently a sermon by Newman in which he asks the question: ‘Why did Christ show Himself to so few witnesses after He rose from the dead ?’

    ‘Because He was a King

    The sermon went on to develop an idea of Christ who gave himself to a chosen few only, and who required reverence from others.

    Often, He was curt.

    He did not permit the world to approach Him rashly, or curiously to gaze on Him….. Christ’s second sojourn on earth (after His Resurrection) was in secret.

    Newman emphasises that In a Christian’s course, fear and love must go together. ‘And this is the lesson to be deduced from our Savior’s withdrawing from the world after His Resurrection.’

    At last, religion for adults. One tires of the Sunday soft serve every week.

  191. 2dogs

    Cars are freedom baby

    But driverless cars more so. Not only can you get from A to B when you want, also regardless of what state you are in, and no need to pay attention during the journey.

  192. Leigh Lowe

    IT … don’t ask.
    Johanna… don’t tell.

  193. DrBeauGan

    2dogs
    #2675515, posted on March 31, 2018 at 10:17 pm
    The fundamental issue in getting humanity into space is getting rid of lefties. Any suggestions on how?

    Give everyone their own choice of society to live in: communists in communism, capitalists in capitalism, etc. It will all sound very fair at the start.

    Then the lefties will die of starvation.

    The communists have already worked out that communism can’t work if there is a non-communist part of the world. They are quite right about this. Their mistake is in thinking it could work if it were universal.

  194. Arky

    Nothing we could build would survive even a small hydrogen bomb.

    ..
    Do I have to think of everything?
    I’m just a high school teacher.
    Capture an asteroid and engineer it into a spacecraft. Vaporise as much of it as you like.

  195. Infidel Tiger

    How do you feel about smartphones, IT?

    A blessing and a curse.

    They are so very helpful but have destroyed human interaction and societal decency. I am a victim of them myself.

    One thing that is great to see is that e-books are not catching on like I thought they would. People like the tactile realism of paper.

  196. Nick

    IT … don’t ask.
    Johanna… don’t tell.

    Ssh or we can expect rooting oneupwomanship stories ad nauseum

  197. Infidel Tiger

    But driverless cars more so. Not only can you get from A to B when you want, also regardless of what state you are in, and no need to pay attention during the journey.

    You understand what travel is, but have no deeper understanding of what a car represents.

    If I could offer you a pill that made you feel drunk or a bottle of Gin what do you take? Would you rather have your semen medically removed from your ball sac or work up a sweat making sweet love to a flight attendant in a highway motel, do you pay the hourly fee or let the cold hand of science relieve you?

  198. johanna

    JC
    #2675499, posted on March 31, 2018 at 9:55 pm

    Joh

    Your father would be sorely disappointed. Recall how you once told us how much hates joos. Don’t tell him, because at his advanced age it could kill him.

    What a sickening pig you are, JC, to wish death on my old man.

  199. DrBeauGan

    The good thing about eBooks is that you can read them in the dark. I buy about ten eBooks for every paper book.

    I agree about a blessing and a curse. They probably said the same about paper books in Gutenberg’s day. Anything new falls under the same rubric.

  200. Arky

    There are a bunch of small moons funking up the solar system just waiting to be rigged with hydrogen bombs and turned into interstellar spaceships.

  201. egg_

    Driverless cars are public transport by stealth.

    Phased traffic lights, etc. already do that – essentially packet switching of humans.

  202. Bruce of Newcastle

    I read recently a sermon by Newman in which he asks the question: ‘Why did Christ show Himself to so few witnesses after He rose from the dead ?’

    Over 500 of them. I wouldn’t call that “few”.

    Max – If you want some more solid teaching the Ligonier guys do good Reformed exposition of the Bible. The talks at their conferences are on the website as videos, with a transcript if you want to read instead. About 30-40 minutes worth each, from memory.

  203. Harlequin Decline

    zyconoclast
    #2675450, posted on March 31, 2018 at 8:58 pm
    Caveman
    #2674934, posted on March 31, 2018 at 10:44 am
    Apparently people of no appearance robbed a fish and chip shop in Yarraville the other day

    They battered the door down to get in apparently.

    Someone said they all had mullets. Others said is was flake news.

  204. JC

    Joh

    You’re either too drunk or too stupid to understand. No one is wishing death on your father. In fact it’s the opposite. I’m advising you to not ever tell him you were bonking jooish dudes by the boatload in case it kills him.

    How many Woody Alan’s have you bonked by the way? Round it off , if you can’t recall the exact stat, in multiples of 10.

    What’s ironic is that you’re sort of admitting this information would be detrimental to his health. How odd.

  205. egg_

    Give everyone their own choice of society to live in: communists in communism, capitalists in capitalism, etc. It will all sound very fair at the start.

    Hippy communes never seem to further than an hour from a 7-Eleven.

  206. Bruce of Newcastle

    Oops, very few of the videos have transcripts…sorry the first one I checked did, but then the next 5 I picked randomly didn’t. I shouldn’t jump to conclusions!

  207. max

    Thanks, Bruce. Looks interesting.

  208. cohenite

    Powering a Starship With a Black Hole

    1 Ion drive
    2 Laser accelerated solar sail
    3 Daedalus type fusion drive
    4 Bussard Ramscoop

    All present considerable obstacles.

  209. Gab

    ‘Twas deliberate, Zycon. Just my weird sense of humour 🙂

  210. zyconoclast

    ‘Twas deliberate, Zycon. Just my weird sense of humour 🙂‘Twas deliberate, Zycon.

    Not weird.
    I like a pun as much as the next person. Maybe more.

  211. JC

    And you know, Joh.. concupiscence/lust (I’m being very diplomatic here) is one of the 7 deadly sins. I’d be really careful and try to lead an exemplary life from here on. Just a little advice.

  212. Snoopy

    But driverless cars more so. Not only can you get from A to B when you want, also regardless of what state you are in, and no need to pay attention during the journey.

    .05 will apply driverless cars. You can be sure of that.

  213. JC

    .05 will apply driverless cars. You can be sure of that.

    You can bet on that… and all the passengers too.

  214. Ƶĩppʯ (ȊꞪꞨV)

    Teleology all the way down. Notice how the network does not generate the meaning given to the words in the corpus. Without teleology, the network wouldn’t be able to discover the meaning and thereby the answer.

    word2vec compresses phrases, ie the context in which words are used into vectors. the magic is that words become points in n-dimensional space whose distance between each other can be measured and encode relationships between words. so we do simple vector arithmetic to find relationships. Like USA – Washington + France = Paris

    what each of the n-dimensions means, nobody can say, neither can the network tell you. there are far more than the typical used 300 dimensions in the english language. yet forcing the network to compress down to 300 dimensions captures the entire body of english. if space is a problem you can 200 or 100. the only change is accuracy.

    the relationships comes from people saying and writing things, not from anywhere else. If I invent a language, say klingon. And feed the network enough examples. It will learn klingon relationships. teleology never enters the picture. This is pure information theory.

    How one uses word2vec is that one takes the weights in the network and inserts them into the first layer of another network and bingo it now “knows” everything the original network “knows”. the weights are just numbers, they could represent anything.

    In theory if we could identify the weights in one human neural network and we copy them to another human, the recipient would know exactly the same things as the original.

  215. Arky

    We could engineer Uranus into a star ship.
    The solar system would be better of without that brown and windy planet.

  216. Steve trickler.

    Well done Ladies and Orchestra. It worked!

    Homage to a soundtrack unknown to most of the populace.



  217. Infidel Tiger

    Can we talk about how Mitch Marsh is the worst all rounder in history?

  218. egg_

    what each of the n-dimensions means, nobody can say, neither can the network tell you. there are far more than the typical used 300 dimensions in the english language. yet forcing the network to compress down to 300 dimensions captures the entire body of english. if space is a problem you can 200 or 100. the only change is accuracy.

    Sounds similar to RADAR motion prediction algorithms, where space is horizontally scanned in columns which are the layered in the Z axis. A form of self-drive car technology.

  219. Ƶĩppʯ (ȊꞪꞨV)

    How one uses word2vec is that one takes the weights in the network and inserts them into the first layer of another network and bingo it now “knows” everything the original network “knows”. the weights are just numbers, they could represent anything.

    google translate uses another type of network called seq2seq. you feed it matching translated phrases from 2 languages and it compresses the relationship between phrases into an n-dimensional function. where n might 1000. feed it enough examples and the network can start translating phrases it has never seen.

    Siri, google home, alexa use the same methodology, compressing audio signal into an n-dimensional function and back out into textual phrases. pure mathematics.

  220. Like USA – Washington + France = Paris

    the relationships comes from people saying and writing things, not from anywhere else. If I invent a language, say klingon. And feed the network enough examples. It will learn klingon relationships. teleology never enters the picture. This is pure information theory.

    We know the answer ‘Paris’ is right because Paris is to France as Washington is to the USA. Relationships are teleological; A is related to B in this or that manner. That is pure teleology.

  221. Ƶĩppʯ (ȊꞪꞨV)

    How one uses word2vec is that one takes the weights in the network and inserts them into the first layer of another network and bingo it now “knows” everything the original network “knows”. the weights are just numbers, they could represent anything.

    I used to think about the question how the hell does one part of the brain know what signal is coming from a sense like the eye or the ear and what that signal means. The answer it has no idea what it means, but because the neurons compresses the signal down into a function and the signal has a compressible pattern, it seems as though the brain “knows” stuff. For this reason we can plug an eye into a part of the brain that has never had input from an eye and the subject learns to see.

    So in a sense meaning doesn’t exist as other than the compression of a compressible pattern from a stream of information.

  222. google translate uses another type of network called seq2seq. you feed it matching translated phrases from 2 languages and it compresses the relationship between phrases into an n-dimensional function. where n might 1000. feed it enough examples and the network can start translating phrases it has never seen.

    Bolded imply teleology.

  223. Ƶĩppʯ (ȊꞪꞨV)

    We know the answer ‘Paris’ is right because Paris is to France as Washington is to the USA. Relationships are teleological; A is related to B in this or that manner. That is pure teleology.

    really? a neural network sees a train of identical electrical spikes. where did it come from, the eye or the ear? what is that train of spikes representing? what in the train of spikes in itself is anything other than a train of electrical spikes to identify what it represents?

  224. Elizabeth (Lizzie) Beare

    Easter 1916. Here at Villa Chaos for Easter 2018 we have been watching the first two episodes of a Netflix series called ‘Rebellion’, about the Easter Rising in Ireland – a fitting show for Easter Saturday. The series deals with the attitudes concerning loyalty to Britain in contrast to support for the growing impetus to rebellion amongst families split by divided loyalties. It whips around the class structure in Ireland quite well. It is well done although rather slow in pace, filmed at administrative centre of The Castle and the now-iconic GPO in Dublin. The communist idealism of the rebels, the naivety yet intensity of their beliefs and their preparations, starts to shatter as the IRA are forced to shoot the occasional unarmed citizen in order to progress things. This calls the certainties of the rebellion into question, and there are hints of how bad the quarrel within Ireland is to become. As history sadly shows. Just watched a touching scene where an initially resistant priest agrees to recite the Rosary for the young rebel men who may soon die. Then I read Gab’s comment about the enthusiastic sound of Zimbabwian Catholics in her parish. Good to hear about that, after a tear for this poignant scene in ‘Rebellion’.

    We were wondering too if the casting director for that show was a woman whom we met when last in Dublin. The name seemed familiar but neither of us could recall if it was her. She was an intense, dark-haired dynamo who had a thriving business doing ITV and BBC serials like this one. Proper casting is an art that has been debased by Hollywood and the Weinstein debacle.

    Enjoyed the ongoing discussion earlier this evening here with Mitch, Dr. BG, Dover and others. My comments should be viewed there in context and also in the context of Matt Ridley’s ‘Red Queen’ outline. Good to see the Cat returning to civilised and interesting debates. Party seems to have then taken a turn to licentiousness while we were immersed in our show. Saturnalia night I guess.

    On a medical note, it is perfectly possible for female breasts to remain in good shape after breast-feeding four babies. On an empirical note, why, I know of a woman who having breast-fed two babies still managed to marry a man who liked ’em firm, natural and perky, and who still does now that the same woman has breast fed his own two children. Women who’ve never used their breasts for proper purpose and who have never experienced the full joy of being a breast-feeding female can disagree all they wish. What would they know? 🙂

    Ssh or we can expect rooting oneupwomanship stories ad nauseum

    Not from me you can’t.

  225. Ƶĩppʯ (ȊꞪꞨV)

    Bolded imply teleology.

    teleology: the explanation of phenomena by the purpose they serve rather than by postulated causes.

    Every example I have given is purely based on causal factors. the network “knows” nothing until a causal factor is fed to it. There is absolutely no a priori purpose to “word2vec”, its a pure mathematical abstraction that only has a use in very specific use cases.

    the way you use the word teleology is so general and all encompassing as to be entirely meaningless.

  226. Mitch M.

    I used to think about the question how the hell does one part of the brain know what signal is coming from a sense like the eye or the ear and what that signal means.

    Different senses have differing frequency ranges, with eyesight being the highest neural frequency. Yet as you note different brain regions can learn new information management but not as well as the dedicated areas. We have to be careful here because while we particulate sensory modes in the brain there is connectivity between different sensory “regions”.

    what each of the n-dimensions means, nobody can say, neither can the network tell you. there are far more than the typical used 300 dimensions in the english language. yet forcing the network to compress down to 300 dimensions captures the entire body of english. if space is a problem you can 200 or 100. the only change is accuracy.

    Reminded me of a thought bubble that caught me the other day. When thinking about human cognition we typically think about information going from neuron to neuron. Disruptions in neural oscillations are often good proxies for detecting undesirable issues. We don’t see information passing from neuron to neuron, we see a sustained widespread pattern of neural activity. So it occurred to me that isn’t information processing as we typically conceive of it but it does allow for multi-dimensional information management because it means a single neuron can be used in an uncountable number of potential oscillation-neuron interactions.

    There are many people who argue that the brain does not function like a computer. They also admit that they don’t know how the brain works. Therein lies the communication challenge because the person who claims to have an understanding will often be given an audience whereas the person who claims they do not know will often be ignored. That is one of the beautiful communicative strategies in religion: it claims to be able to explain Life, the universe, and everything.

  227. Entropy

    a fitting show for Easter Saturday

    The only fitting show for Easter is Ben Hur.
    Charlton Heston version of course.

  228. egg_

    In most US states where self-driving car testing is allowed, laws require that a human must always be behind the wheel, just in case.

    Now, though, California’s Department of Motor Vehicles (DMV) has announced new regulations that will let autonomous autos drive solo beginning in April – relatively speaking.

    The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration has approved the DMV’s new guidelines for self-driving vehicles; so long as self-driving cars are being remotely monitored by an operator, they will be allowed to drive anywhere in California.

  229. Ƶĩppʯ (ȊꞪꞨV)

    really? a neural network sees a train of identical electrical spikes. where did it come from, the eye or the ear? what is that train of spikes representing? what in the train of spikes in itself is anything other than a train of electrical spikes to identify what it represents?

    nothing. there is nothing whatsoever to identify what a train of electrical spikes between neurons represents. the same identical train could represent the colour blue or a curved shape or the sound ‘B’. it is 100% entirely based on its causal history what it represents.

  230. Gab

    Can we talk about how Mitch Marsh is the worst all rounder in history?

    Hell no. Get back in the corner and stay there.

  231. Ƶĩppʯ (ȊꞪꞨV)

    nothing. there is nothing whatsoever to identify what a train of electrical spikes between neurons represents. the same identical train could represent the colour blue or a curved shape or the sound ‘B’. it is 100% entirely based on its causal history what it represents.

    A neural network does not seek to represent colour or sound, it just does what it does and it just happens that sound is what it keep being signaled with and so we have continuity and consistency of perception of sound. if you disconnect the ear and plugged in an eye, the network would be confused for a while as new style of pattern is being presented and eventually you would start to see rather than hear as the network just does what it does which is compress signal.

  232. None

    It’s the screams as they got turned into mulch that would upset me. I know, I’m a softy.

    But their screams should not bother you Doctor Bogan, this is after all a godless, meaningless, non teleological existence after all, no? But if you’re suggesting that it does bother you, then you are saying that lefties should not be screaming as they’re been turned into mulch or that you should not be upset when you hear them scream. The ‘should’ word is a moral imperative and it implies that the world is somehow not as it ought to be. That also implies that the world, you, lefties, all have a purpose which all have somehow failed to achieve.

  233. egg_

    this is after all a godless, meaningless, non teleological existence after all, no?

    Did you type that, or is it a product of your voice to text software?

  234. Leigh Lowe

    IT… you are wrong, wrong, wrong.
    You said an unmolested Kookaburra would yield 1,000 runs.
    Only 488.

  235. Leigh Lowe

    Infidel Tiger

    #2675552, posted on March 31, 2018 at 11:09 pm

    Can we talk about how Mitch Marsh is the worst all rounder in history?

    Well, technically, to be an all-rounder you have to be proficient at two things.
    What are Mitch’s core competencies?
    Handing out the chewing gum and carrying the bags to the team bus?
    (I am getting right into the reprise of Warwick Todd ).

  236. Ƶĩppʯ (ȊꞪꞨV)

    if you disconnect the ear and plugged in an eye, the network would be confused for a while as new style of pattern is being presented and eventually you would start to see rather than hear as the network just does what it does which is compress signal.

    This recent discovery about the brain is a death knell to the idea of consciousness as anything independent from the brain. turn the brain off and consciousness disappears as surely as a program disappears when you turn off a computer. consciousness is 100% causal. It kills the idea of a soul stone dead.

  237. None

    Yes I actually said that, egg.

  238. None

    We’re unconscious when we sleep, zippy. Or in a coma.

  239. Infidel Tiger

    Can we talk about how Joe Burns will never be a Test quality batsman and how we have a very good batsman currently pacing around his Maroubra mansion smashing windows?

  240. Leigh Lowe

    Gab

    #2675568, posted on March 31, 2018 at 11:43 pm

    Can we talk about how Mitch Marsh is the worst all rounder in history?

    Hell no. Get back in the corner and stay there.

    Catalaxy needs to be split into a Front Bar and a Ladies Lounge.

  241. So in a sense meaning doesn’t exist as other than the compression of a compressible pattern from a stream of information.

    Self-defeating. You’re saying that meaning doesn’t exist except you are here using words to convey that this or that is a compressible pattern from a stream of information as opposed to something else.

    Every example I have given is purely based on causal factors. the network “knows” nothing until a causal factor is fed to it. There is absolutely no a priori purpose to “word2vec”, its a pure mathematical abstraction that only has a use in very specific use cases.

    the way you use the word teleology is so general and all encompassing as to be entirely meaningless.

    Not at all. I’m using the idea precisely as it was employed by Aristotle as explained earlier, teleology is about aboutness. As to their being no a priori purpose to ‘word2vec’, that is simply nonsense. It’s designed to do certain things and not others. That is pure teleology.

  242. egg_

    a sustained widespread pattern of neural activity.

    IIRC sight takes up 80% of the brain’s activity, so we’re likely processing spatial information a lot of the time.

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