Bill Muehlenberg: What gives with The Liberal Party and Mandatory Vaccinations?

It gets to be quite worrying when science fiction begins to merge with the real world. What was that line from one of the Stars Wars films? “So this is how liberty dies… with thunderous applause”. Covid alarmism is revealing all sorts of interesting – and alarming – developments. The latest involves Prime Minister Scott Morrison flipping back and forth in a matter of hours on Covid vaccinations.

His rather reckless talk Wednesday morning about mandatory vaccines received such a huge public backlash that by the afternoon he had to do a major backtrack and basically say. ‘Oh, I did not really mean it would be mandatory’. Never stop speaking out – your voice matters.

He had said that he wanted at least 95 per cent of Australians to take the vaccine, and he also said on 3AW radio that he would like the vaccine to be “as mandatory as possible.” Then by the afternoon he had changed his tune because of the massive outcry, playing down this desire for nationwide compulsory vaccinations.

Don’t get me wrong: I am neither a hard-core anti-vaxxer nor a hard-core pro-vaxxer. But talk of mandatory jabs always bothers me. And we know darn well if Morrison and others say, ‘Oh it is not really compulsory’ that it sure will be. Sure, you can “choose” not to, but then you won’t be able to do most basics of life: travel, get various government payments and benefits, and have various work choices. Consider what one Australian medical bigwig has said:

I believe a person who refuses to be vaccinated should not be allowed to travel interstate or overseas, nor be allowed to travel on public transport without a face mask. And when it comes to the private sector, businesses could refuse these anti-vaxxers from visiting their retail outlets, gyms, movie cinemas, restaurants, bars or nightclubs. As a precedence, state governments have previously banned children from attending childcare if they are not vaccinated. Similar restrictions could be placed on Australians who refuse to take the COVID-19 vaccination.

Hey, why don’t we just line up all these recalcitrants and shoot them already! Let’s stop pussyfooting around! The fascist mindset of so many of these folks is just bone-chilling. We have so many mini-Hitlers living and breathing amongst us, and they are oh so proud of their ugly authoritarian bent.

Consider what a few others are saying about this. This news item is all rather scary:

Australia’s Deputy Chief Medical Officer Nick Coatsworth has raised the possibility of restrictions for people who refuse to get the COVID-19 vaccine when it is available, if proven successful. Speaking at a press conference on Wednesday, Dr Coatsworth said rules like ‘No jab no pay’, which would restrict government payments, could be brought in to ensure more Australians are immunised against the coronavirus He mentioned regulations around international and interstate travel, and even moving within the community, would need to be reviewed. Australian pubs and restaurants could also refuse entry to people who refuse to get vaccinated. 

And Greg Hunt has just confirmed that there will be consequences for such recalcitrance:

Australians could face being turned away at the border and having their welfare payments withheld if they refuse to receive the COVID-19 vaccine, Federal Health Minister Greg Hunt has warned. Mr Hunt said he would ‘not rule out’ banning Australians from entering the country if they had not received the jab as he fielded a series of probing questions from A Current Affair host Tracey Grimshaw on Wednesday evening….

New South Wales One Nation leader Mark Latham on Wednesday evening hit out at suggestions vaccine take-up could be made compulsory. ‘As predicted: the Dictatorship of the Health Bureaucrat, unelected officials where the control over our lives has gone to their heads,’ Mr Latham wrote on Twitter. ‘How about we wait until a vaccine is finalised – after human trials – and the impact on children, the elderly, pregnant women etc is assessed by medical experts, rather than Scott Morrison jumping the gun.’ 

Hmm, I thought the Liberal Party was supposed to be all about liberty, and freedom of choice for individuals. I must have mixed them up with some other party. Sure, some conservatives will argue that we already have various mandatory measures in place for public health and safety such as things like seat belts. But having to wear a seat belt is NOT in the same league as having something forcibly pumped into your body. Yes, both entail a clear diminution of our freedoms, but the latter is far more serious and potentially dangerous for the individual than the former.

Demanding that everyone be vaccinated for something that has a 99 per cent survival rate sounds like it is all about control – not medicine. It is like the meme making the rounds on the social media: “I had a joke about COVID, but there’s a 99.98% chance you won’t get it.”

The truth is, when the state forces people to receive a mandatory vaccine or else, we have moved well beyond health care into the arena of tyranny. “But it’s for your own good” they will intone. Hmm, where have we heard that before?

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92 Responses to Bill Muehlenberg: What gives with The Liberal Party and Mandatory Vaccinations?

  1. min

    What makes anyone think , apart from hope , that a vaccine will be available next year ? Stage 4 is often the barrier that many do not pass . Four years to date is the shortest period for a vaccine to pass . How are they confirmed as reliable and valid in such a short time.?

  2. Megan

    There is no line they will not cross in order to prove that their totalitarian overreaction to a virus was right.

    We are all paying a high price for their egregious high-handedness and will be doing so for years to come.

  3. John Brumble

    I’m not a hard-core pro-vaxxer either. I simply believe that if you let your unvaccinated kids anywhere near mine, I get to shoot them.

  4. John Brumble

    Also “Hi Alan, I’m not an antivaxxer, but…”

  5. tombell

    I believe George W Bush’s admin was behind the avian flu vax. Ended up killings lots of people and helped get him unelected!

  6. John A

    Australia’s Deputy Chief Medical Officer Nick Coatsworth has raised the possibility of restrictions for people who refuse to get the COVID-19 vaccine when it is available if proven successful.

    Notice the weasel words too!

    I believe there is still no successful vaccine for SARS1, H1N1, Avian flu or swine flu. Can anyone confirm that…?

  7. Trax

    and how exactly will they tell if you have had the vaccine or not…

    perhaps we could get a special security tattoo to allow easy access across state lines and at the entry to premises.

  8. Annie

    Does anyone remember reading somewhere about a SARS vaccine in China? Something about those who had received it reacting much more seriously to Covid-19 than those who hadn’t?

  9. Tony

    I believe there is still no successful vaccine for SARS1, H1N1, Avian flu or swine flu. Can anyone confirm that…?

    No commercially successful vaccine for SARS. A couple potential products left in freezers around the place because the disease burnt out and funding dried up. The Oxford covid vaccine is a repurposed MERS vaccine though.

    I understand that pretty much every clinically relevant influenza strain has had a vaccine of varying effectiveness.

  10. duncanm

    .. and we come back to C.S. Lewis

    “Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron’s cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.

    Annie – seems the SARS Vaccine had a bad effect on animals in trials and was abandoned when SARS vanished by itself.

  11. Ed Case

    Could be Scotty’s ETS moment, he either stands up for Compulsion, or a Gillard pops up
    and he gets rolled.

  12. Tmatsci

    Anyone wanting to force vaccination on us for corona viruses in particular should listen to this lecture presented by Dr Lee Merit presented at From DDP 38th Annual Meeting, August 16, 2020, Las Vegas, NV.

    https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/08/19/sars-cov2-and-the-rise-of-medical-technocracy-lee-merritt-m-d/

    Close to the end of the lecture she describes experimentation with virus vaccines on ferrets where the vaccine resulted in the deaths of the ferrets on a secondary viral infection. She also reports that these experimental vaccines were also given to fit young men in china and she speculates that the “face-flat” collapses and deaths of young men in the street in china were the result of the response to the vaccine.

    Does not seem to be very wise to force people to take an unproven vaccine. It is also not wise to force vaccination when as she points out we seem to ready to use proven treatments that can save most badly infected persons.

  13. duncanm

    The most instructive part of ScoMo’s first statement is that he didn’t reflexively dismiss the idea of a compulsory vaccination program.

    That tells me he does not, at his core, believe in individuals’ rights.

  14. Neil

    Perhaps unlike Howard/Costello the current Coalition govt is too gutless to stand up against Public Service advice?

    Like Rudd/Swan the Coalition lets the Public Service run the country during difficult times

  15. incoherent rambler

    so if you smoke, drink, partake of the weed, sniff the cocaine, eat meat, refuse a vegan diet or haven’t visited a GP for 30 years; then yes, you should also be labelled as a non-citizen and be forced to wear an emblem which makes it easy to identify you as a sub-human.

  16. Ozman

    Why be antivax when you can be pro-therapeutic?

    “Hours after President Donald Trump warned of “retaliation” if Indian Prime Minister Narendra Modi refused to allow the export of an anti-malarial drug being tested as a possible treatment for the new coronavirus, India said it would supply hydroxychloroquine”

  17. BM

    Don’t get me wrong: I am neither a hard-core anti-vaxxer nor a hard-core pro-vaxxer.

    I’m quite pro-vaccine. I think they are wonderful things that have saved and improved a lot of lives.

    HOWEVER. There is a cost/benefit analysis to vaccines. The potential side effects need to be assessed against the dangers of the disease that it is fighting.

    On one side of the ledger, Covid-19 is nowhere near as dangerous as other diseases such as polio or measles. And on the other side, rushing through these vaccinations massively increases the chances of unknown, long term side effects.

    To me, it just doesn’t add up. My kids are fully vaccinated to date, but I am not keen to give them a Covid-19 vaccine that has not been properly tested.

    Besides, there’s already an effective vaccine for healthy people under 50, with something like a 0.02% chance of serious side effects. It’s called catching the bloody virus! And unfortunately the groups most at risk from the virus will probably also have much greater chance of serious side effects from any vaccine, so I’m not convinced it would help them either.

  18. incoherent rambler

    For something that impacts such a small section of the population, all efforts would be better directed at an effective treatment rather than a vaccine.
    Get real guys. It aint ebola.

  19. Iampeter

    What gives with The Liberal Party and Mandatory Vaccinations?

    Um, shouldn’t you be asking, what gives with The Liberal Party and the creation of the Climate Office?
    Or, what gives with The Liberal Party and the RET?
    Or, what gives with The Liberal Party and Emission Trading schemes?
    Or, what gives with The Liberal Party and the mandatory gun buybacks?
    Or, what gives with The Liberal Party and middle class welfare?
    Or, what gives with The Liberal Party and regulating immigration? Marriage? Etc?
    Or, well, you get the picture…

    If you’re concerned with “the fascist mindset of so many of these folks” then you have much bigger problems than some mandatory vaccinations.

  20. BM

    Trax
    #3553718, posted on August 20, 2020 at 12:33 pm

    and how exactly will they tell if you have had the vaccine or not…

    Maybe the un-vaccinated could wear a yellow star on their clothing, for ease of identification?

  21. What concerns me more about this vaccine is that it’s being rushed, it’s a competition as to who gets in first. When anything is rushed and/or becomes a competition, it’s a recipe for disaster. And when it comes to vaccines against the likes of the flu, it’s never a given that things will work as planned. If it was so easy, why do we need a different strain of vaccine every year?

  22. kraka

    “Hmm, I thought the Liberal Party was supposed to be all about liberty, and freedom of choice for individuals”

    you forgot the (sarc)

  23. Ceres

    Yep. I’m from the government and I’m here to help. They might not hold you down but they can hold you hostage unless you agree to the jab. All for a deadly disease that you don’t know you have until you are tested for it (in 99% of cases).

  24. Some History

    Where have we been the last few decades? People have been warning about an ever-expanding nasty streak in Public Health for years. Public Health is now effectively a partner with the State. Why has it been given so much political power? With more and more political power has Public Health gotten nastier and nastier. This is terribly reminiscent of the catastrophic Eugenics era (America and Germany)of a century ago where the medically-aligned also led the way.

    For example, For Your Own Good: The Anti-Smoking Crusade and the Tyranny of Public Health by Jacob Sullum
    https://imgur.com/Daa8aD6

    Sullum’s book was published over 20 years ago. The assault on smokers for non-conformity (not quitting) was nasty back then. In the last 20 years the assault has just gotten nastier and nastier. It’s the antismoking crusade of the last 30 years that highlights the extent to which Public Health has gained political power. Public Health with its HQ, the World Health Organization, is totalitarian in disposition. The more governments abide by Public Health proclamations, the more governments, too, become totalitarian.

    Public Health is constantly comparing large groups or considering the population as a whole. Relying on the shallow “medical model”, proponents sift through statistical comparisons galore. Life reduced to statistics, statistical methods that were pioneered by Eugenicists. Nowhere in this Public Health model is the idea of the “individual”, let alone “individual autonomy”, to be found. Public Health only thinks in terms of groups or population. Public Health cannot but be totalitarian because its “solutions” apply to entire groups or the population where all members must conform to the “solutions”. With political power, that totalitarianism becomes coercion to conform. It cannot abide “transgressors”; penalties must be applied to non-conformers. Troubling now is that Public Health speaks as if it owns the population, an experimental quantity at its complete disposal. That’s what happens when Public Health is given way, way too much political power.

    There may or may not be a vaccine but government/Public Health have signalled how they will approach.

  25. PaulW

    For something that will be “as mandatory as possible” as Scomo has said there are plenty of side effect and issues with this vaccine that the government and media are not mentioning

    “The press release for Monday’s publication of results from the Oxford vaccine trials described an increased frequency of “minor side effects” among participants. A look at the actual paper, though, reveals this to be a marketing spin that has since been parroted in media reports. (The phrases “minor side effects” or “only minor side effects” appeared in writeups from The New York Times, The Wall Street Journal and Reuters, among other outlets.) Yes, mild reactions were far more common than worse ones. But moderate or severe harms—defined as being bad enough to interfere with daily life or needing medical care—were common too. Around one-third of people vaccinated with the Covid-19 vaccine without acetaminophen experienced moderate or severe chills, fatigue, headache, malaise, and/or feverishness. Close to 10 percent had a fever of at least 100.4 degrees, and just over one-fourth developed moderate or severe muscle aches. That’s a lot, in a young and healthy group of people—and the acetaminophen didn’t help much for most of those problems.”

    https://www.wired.com/story/covid-19-vaccines-with-minor-side-effects-could-still-be-pretty-bad/

  26. Bronson

    I vote for all politicians and health bureaucrats to be vaccinated first as part of the human trial to ensure any product is safe for the rest of the comunity.

  27. Neil

    f you’re concerned with “the fascist mindset of so many of these folks” then you have much bigger problems than some mandatory vaccinations.

    Without regulation there would be anarchy. The question is where do you draw the line. I am in agreement with one thing with my leftie enemies. Gun control. I am for animal control as well. I would ban pit bulls and Rottweilers if i was in govt

    But the current vaccine policy has leftist tendencies which the current Coalition govt goes along with.

    Takes balls to stand up to the Public Service which appears to be running the country at the moment

  28. Ed Case

    That won’t work, parasites will do anything for money.
    What might work is forcing GPs and their families to have it.
    The backlash would be epic.

  29. Ed Case

    Rottweilers are okay, a big dog is always good to have around.
    The essential bit of information you may be missing is that they weren’t bred to pull Butcher’s carts up hills, as claimed by Wikipedia, Rottweilers are a German Cattle Dog.
    Go in their yard and they won’t let you out, a few nips may be needed to convince.
    Solution: don’t go in their yard or try to pat them over the fence.

  30. John Bayley

    I vote for all politicians and health bureaucrats to be vaccinated hanged from lamp posts first as part of the human trial to ensure any product is safe for the rest of the community.

    I think the corrected statement above is a better way to go. Certain to focus their collective (pun intended) minds.

  31. duncanm

    I’m quite pro-vaccine. I think they are wonderful things that have saved and improved a lot of lives.

    ditto. But I don’t get the flu vaccine. Don’t see the risk/reward being there. Both risk and reward are so low for their intended purpose.

    I see the greatest risks in being jabbed in the arm with a sharp object (pain, infection), and the most likely reward being that I get to chat up a hot nurse. Both are equally unlikely.

  32. Justinian the Great

    Libertarians need to think this issue through carefully and communicate wisely lest they end up lumped in with the lunatic anti-vaxxers that are against children being immunised against measles, mumps and rubella. Not only do these idiots endanger their own children’s lives they endanger others. I don’t have a problem with more or less forcing parents to vaccinate their children. The difference is that the aforementioned viruses are of a known lethality, the vaccinations are of a known efficacy (97%, 88%, 97% respectively) and after hundreds of millions of doses / patients throughout the world over many decades it is of a known safety risk. A vaccination/s for COVID-19 will presumably involve a lot more uncertainty regarding efficacy and safety including any long-term side effects. If the efficacy is low (e.g. flu vaccine ranges from 20% to 60% depending on year, strain and personal circumstances) and the risks unknown or comparatively high then the case to not vaccinate is very different to the case against MMR vaccinations. A lot will depend on the clinical trials, honesty and transparency of findings. A vaccination that is harmless (as safe as the flu shot) and for the common as well as personal good should be supported and incentivised. A vaccination that entails unacceptable risk relative to the benefit should not be compulsory but be a decision made between patient and doctor. The point I am labouring on is going down the libertarian anti-vaxxer rabbit hole is a dumb way to raise legitimate concerns and caution while keeping an open mind to the clinical evidence and potential community benefit (e.g. no lockdowns, hospitals back to normal, borders open, safer aged care facilities, schools open). Keep an open mind I say.

  33. feelthebern

    I believe a person who refuses to be vaccinated should not be allowed to travel interstate or overseas, nor be allowed to travel on public transport without a face mask

    I believe a person with a peanut allergy should not be allowed to travel interstate or overseas.
    The risk to themselves & others is on par with COVID19.

  34. Neil

    I think some dog breeds are fighting dogs breed to fight. They should be banned.

    But back on topic. Who is running the country? The Public Service or the Coalition?

  35. A Lurker

    As 2020 progresses more and more authoritarians and wanna-be totalitarians come tumbling out of the closer. To be honest, it’s not only been illuminating, but rather concerning too.

    I think the next State/Federal elections will be the first ones in my life where I will deface the ballot sheets.

  36. Professor Fred Lenin

    The DANDEMICin Victoria has them all running scared ,frightened people do stupid things ,calm dow comrades ,we will overcome the DANDEMIC soon

  37. Ed Case

    The Public Service are always running the Country.
    They did a good job of it up until c. 1975, fell away in recent times.
    The Coalition is what we get when the Labor Party tries to run the Country.

  38. A Lurker

    As 2020 progresses more and more authoritarians and wanna-be totalitarians come tumbling out of the closer. To be honest, it’s not only been illuminating, but rather concerning too.

    I think the next State/Federal elections will be the first ones in my life where I will deface the ballot sheets.

  39. Lurks

    John Brumble says
    I’m not a hard-core pro-vaxxer either. I simply believe that if you let your unvaccinated kids anywhere near mine, I get to shoot them.
    …………………………..
    Get away, So what you are saying is that you have vaccinated your kids who are now immune but you will shoot any who are not immune…… Just WTF are you saying…. People like you are a problem

  40. Mullumhillbilly

    Relax ! The ‘mandatory’ comments were just a ploy to have you sighing with relief and supporting lockdowns when the vax fails to appear over the next two years.

  41. Karabar

    This is a doctor talking to other doctors about this issue.
    Note the depth to which she has researched hydroxyclroquine with zinc and an anti-bacterial.
    Note her explanation as to why masks are nonsense.
    Also note the extensive bibliography at the end.
    https://youtu.be/sjYvitCeMPc

  42. Jac

    Is anyone concerned about the possible permanent damage to health that is appearing as a result of even symptomatic cases of Covid -19?

  43. mem

    Megan
    #3553699, posted on August 20, 2020 at 12:25 pm
    There is no line they will not cross in order to prove that their totalitarian overreaction to a virus was right.

    We are all paying a high price for their egregious high-handedness and will be doing so for years to come.

    +10

  44. Damon

    The government want to vaccinate at least 20 million people with something that is, at best, a rush job. Does anyone think 20 million to one against adverse reactions is a safe bet?

  45. Ed Case

    Yeah, he loves those kids so much he’ll shoot some other kids and get locked up for 20 years while strangers raise his kids.
    A very plausible comment.

  46. Ed Case

    20 million to one odds sounds good.
    Plenty have bled to death from aspirin, Cinnamon and Slippery Elm are also potent blood thinners,
    how many unintentionally drink themselves to death every day?

  47. Neil

    The Public Service are always running the Country.

    From 1996-2007 Howard/Costello ran the country. Costello turned down the pink batts scheme that the Public Service wanted to do as a climate change policy because he said the govt has no experience in putting in roof insulation. The PS tried again when Rudd/Swan was in govt and Labor went for it.

    Brendan Nelson went against PS advice and ordered the Super Hornets

    Since 2007 the PS have been running the country

  48. Beachcomber

    In the Covid-1984 war on Reason and freedom, it needs to be repeated over and over and over again that:

    The world is suffering from a massive delusion based on the belief that a test for RNA is a test for a deadly new virus

    There is no proof that a virus is being detected by the “Covid-19” rt-RNA PCR test procedures and no evidence that a deadly new virus exists. The so-called virus SARS-CoV-2 has never been isolated and shown to be a pathogen.

  49. Fred

    I’m pro-vaxxer, but I wouldn’t get a covid vaccine. It’s a virus that is completely harmless to the vast majority of people.

    I’d be more worried about being jabbed with a vaccine that has had minimal testing and unknown side-effects.

    Vaccinate Scott Morrison’s wife and kids first and lets see if there’s any side effects.

  50. Beachcomber

    It is not possible that a true vaccine has been developed for “Covid-19”. A vaccine should developed using antigens from an isolated, purified virus. But SARS-CoV-2 has never been isolated. Presumably, the supposed antigens are created artificially from proteins based on portions of the RNA that is claimed to come from the virus. Do you get that? The “vaccines” are based on a supposition, that is based on a supposition, that is based on an erroneous assumption! This is typical of the “science” that underlies Covid-1984.

    The idiots and bureaucrats that rule Australia are criminally irresponsible for demanding that every Australian must be injected with this snake oil.

  51. Ozman

    I am pro-therapeutic!
    My vax I use on the floor.
    Grow up children!
    Doctor gets flu vax. Every year doctor gets flu. This year no flu. ?

  52. Beachcomber

    Vaccinate Scott Morrison’s wife and kids first and lets see if there’s any side effects.

    I wonder if Morrison’s missus had words with him yesterday after his display of totalitarian idiocy.

  53. Ozman

    Beachcomber
    #3553872, posted on August 20, 2020 at 2:11 pm

    With you all the way!

  54. David Bidstrup

    Before the Prime Minister or any other health bureaucrat endorses or mandates any Covid vaccine they might benefit from reading “The Illusion Of Evidence-Based Medicine” by John Jureidini and Leemon Mc Henry where they warn against accepting medical trials at face value, (“Months left in race to vaccine”, August 20, 2020).

    The rush to cash in on a vaccine is a great incentive to fudge research and leave innocent people at the risk of harm. Any employer or government who mandates vaccination needs to be very sure that they are not risking lawsuits if there are adverse effects and any person who is coerced into being vaccinated to keep or get a job should be careful and ask the right questions before allowing it to be done.

    History is littered with examples of people being harmed by dodgy “medical science” and this might just turn out to be another one.

  55. Karabar

    #3553911, posted on August 20, 2020 at 2:34 pm
    Then of course there is always the possibility that the jab will include a RFID chip.
    I understand this is technically feasible.
    Does anyone know for certain?

  56. Ed Case

    The Feds would never chip humans.
    It would be unethical [and the High Court will so declare]…

  57. Boambee John

    tombell
    #3553711, posted on August 20, 2020 at 12:30 pm
    I believe George W Bush’s admin was behind the avian flu vax. Ended up killings lots of people and helped get him unelected!

    Gerald Ford in 197506, bequeathed to the world Jimmah Cattah.

  58. Lizzi55

    Its really very simple, your health is your own responsibility, you are not responsible for the health of others.

    Anyone who says otherwise is either deceived or brainwashed (acting out of fear) or has ulterior motives (that have nothing to do with solving a health problem).

  59. Neenee

    tombell
    #3553711, posted on August 20, 2020 at 12:30 pm
    I believe George W Bush’s admin was behind the avian flu vax. Ended up killings lots of people and helped get him unelected!

    Unelected at the end of his second term!

  60. Alex

    1. The medical big-wig is a nobody
    2.The alleged virus has never been isolated and passed Koch’s postulates test, never.
    3. No isolation and purification then no test can test for it and no vaccine to prevent it.

    Hit and Miss science jut like global warming. Who would want to be a young person nowadays?

  61. LBLoveday

    An article by

    a medical scientist who works for one of Australia’s leading medical research organisations, has been in therapeutic quality management and regulatory affairs working with the TGA in conjunction with international regulators for over a decade and spoken on therapeutic quality management at Australian and international conferences

    in The Spectator:
    .
    https://www.spectator.com.au/2020/08/a-coronavirus-vaccine-great-but-make-it-safe-effective-and-reliable-please/

  62. Penny

    Dr Delores Cahill is very informative about vaccines. She designs vaccines but has reservations about flu vaccines, she is also a proponent of HCQ regime, obviously YouTube don’t like her. I have listened to her on the “Delingpod “ podcast

  63. Colonel Bunty Golightly

    If you are so stupid as to refuse a vaccine that could save your life and the life of those around you don’t expect any sympathy from me. Just like when they said they would restrict welfare payments to those who refused to vaccinate their kids it was fairly obvious that when money is involved the moral principle will always take a back seat. Wasnt long before all the freedom fighters lined up their kids for the jab once money was on the table. Just get it wankers!

  64. Some History

    Colonel Bunty Golightly

    You sound more like Colonel Bunty Goblindly

  65. Ellen of Tasmania

    “You must understand that our epidemic has waned – and has been replaced with an irrational, unscientific Casedemic.”

  66. Colonel Bunty Golightly

    What people dont seem to get is that everything you do is constrained by a set of rules. To drive a car you must register it and get a licence. To build a house you need permits and approvals. To be a worker means you are required to undergo safety training. To get your welfare you need to follow certain rules and fill out certain forms (I don’t know much about that one as I have never bludged off anyone in my life). You are not allowed to kill people just because you don’t like them or simply feel like it. All these things are for the protection of the community at large. Why is being required to have a vaccine to protect yourself and the community any different?

  67. Ƶĩppʯ (ȊꞪꞨV)

    the uniparty of davos keeps accidentally dropping the mask

  68. pbw

    I’ve heard John Brumble’s comment, in essence, from others, and it makes no sense.

    If your kids are vaccinated, what’s the problem with unvaccinated kids? If they get the virus and come to school or kindy, your kids are protected by the vaccine, aren’t they?

    The response is usually along the lines that the vaccine is not 100% effective, and vaccinated kids can still get the infection. Then why have the vaccine? Well… the vaccine makes the infection less serious. So, if you child gets a milder dose of the illness, won’t he come away from that with even better immunity?

    None of this make any sense. But it does reinforce a totalitarian mindset in parents.

    A dose of wild measles confers lifetime immunity. Measles vaccine confers about five years of immunity. This may be a measles special, but there has been an outbreak of vaccine mania, against which there seem sot be no vaccine. In France, only 3 vaccines were mandatory in 2017, but eight were added in 2018. I’m sure that has solved an enormous number of health problems.

  69. Tony

    @pbw

    If your kids are vaccinated, what’s the problem with unvaccinated kids?

    Immuno-compromised people, kids with cancer or kidney transplants etc. Vaccines don’t work if you don’t have many T or B cells. Also, the deliberately not vaccinated population are free riding on everybody else. Once enough people become free riders, the whole thing falls apart.

    A dose of wild measles confers lifetime immunity. Measles vaccine confers about five years of immunity.

    For the vast majority of people who get two doses of the measles vaccine will have lifelong immunity. I think wild type measles has 1 in 1000 chance of death. Other vaccines like tetanus, Hep A etc you need boosters every 5-10 years.

  70. Penny

    Tmatsci
    Thanks for the link it’s well worth watching

  71. Judge Dredd

    Demanding that everyone be vaccinated for something that has a 99 per cent survival rate sounds like it is all about control

    It is about control. You’d have to be blind to realize this is not about the virus, as it only has a death rate at best of 1%.
    In any case the vast majority of people are much safer not taking the vaccine;
    -The big pharmas have skipped some trials to rush this out.
    -They also have exemption from being sued due to any side effects from the vaccine.
    Now why would they need to be exempt if it was so safe?
    We are all anti-vaxxers now.

  72. Iampeter

    Hmm, I thought the Liberal Party was supposed to be all about liberty, and freedom of choice for individuals

    No the question is not where you draw the line between the false alternatives of something like anarchy on the one hand and dictatorship on the other. Dictatorship is just a form of anarchy anyway and vice versa.
    The question is what do you think is the proper function of government?

    Those of us who can actually be described as “right wing” believe the function of government is to protect individual rights. That means the government runs the courts, the police, the armed forces and nothing else.
    Such a government would never be able to implement authoritarian nonsense like mandatory lockdowns, facemasks, vaccinations, etc.
    But such a government would also not be able to regulate trade, immigration, marriage, etc.
    So this kind of rights-protecting government is not what conservatives support and their sudden theatrics about “fascist mindsets,” from relatively trivial violations compared to what they actually support, is nonsensical.

  73. Judge Dredd

    If you are so stupid as to refuse a vaccine that could save your life and the life of those around you don’t expect any sympathy from me

    If you inject your kids with that vaccine, that is an evil act. There is zero chance your child would die or get complications from COVID19, compared to that vaccine.
    What you do with your own body is up to you, but coercing others to be injected through punishment, especially when it can do harm, is just wicked.

  74. Squirrel

    “…Australians could face being turned away at the border…”

    I’ll know these pricks really mean what they’re saying if they apply the same rule WITHOUT EXCEPTION to all non-Australians.

    Because this is so important that freedoms and liberties have to be trashed, non-Australians would have to be vaccinated (on a full cost recovery basis) at an Australian embassy or high commission before being given permission to travel here – we couldn’t possibly rely on a bit of paper from a non-Australian doctor claiming that someone had been vaccinated, could we…..?

  75. Leo G

    I’m not a hard-core pro-vaxxer either. I simply believe that if you let your unvaccinated kids anywhere near mine, I get to shoot them.

    Whose do you shoot first?

  76. Rex Anger

    Welcome back trolly-kins! We missed you!

    Dictatorship is just a form of anarchy anyway and vice versa.
    Incorrect. Anarchy is the total absence of organised law and legal authority. The strongest dominate, but only so long as they cow all about them. Dissent will exist,because the dominant party and/or its cronies cannot be everywhere at once. And resistance might be just as strong as them.

    A Dictatorship, on the other hand, is highly organised around a single, often unelected ruler or small cabal of same. No opposition or dissent is tolerated, and power is maintained through brutality, fear and constant surveillance. By the evidence you give us about whom and what you politically support and whom you hate, IamAVeryObviousDictatorshipFan, this is what you desire. Though like all good shills and useful idiots, you would more than likely find yourself on the pointy end of the bayonet line when the Revolution comes…

    Those of us who can actually be described as “right wing” believe the function of government is to protect individual rights. That means the government runs the courts, the police, the armed forces and nothing else.
    But you are not right-wing Petey…

    Such a government would never be able to implement authoritarian nonsense like mandatory lockdowns, facemasks, vaccinations, etc.
    How so? A government makes legislation in accrdance with its chosen policies. Courts interpret legislation to apply the law. Police and Armed Services enforce and apply law and policy.

    How do you, IamInLoveWithRightsIfOnlyICouldActuallyDescribeThem, determime how a government would make its laws and determine its polices? Particularly if its members are in favor of imposing authoritarian nonsense? Who will resist? Your limited Executive? The Judiciary? What if they all agree wth it too?

    But such a government would also not be able to regulate trade, immigration, marriage, etc.
    How so? Taking away all statutory bodies and hyper-limiting the Public Service does not change the attitudes.of the people in power, IamNotSureIHaveThoughtThisThroughBeforeIStartedShittingOnEverybodyElse.

    So this kind of rights-protecting government is not what conservatives support and their sudden theatrics about “fascist mindsets,” from relatively trivial violations compared to what they actually support, is nonsensical.

    Says you, IamSoMuchPurerThanAllThese’Leftists’OnARightwingBlog…

    Typical Petey Smear and Petey Projections. Completely ignorant of the effects of Human Nature on amy form of organisation, because that would spoil the illusion. And a very boring and predictable attack on everyone who is not him.

  77. Kneel

    “Just get it wankers!”

    Have you been vaccinated against smallpox? If not, why not?
    There’s a damn good reason that vaccine is not part of the standard vax regime – it’s bloody dangerous, and the only time the risk is worth it is when there’s a massive uncontained outbreak, and only then because the disease if deadlier than the vaccine.

    Got info on such safety concerns for a vaccine that hasn’t even been tested yet? Thought not.

    The Gates one is an RNA vaccine – if you really want to change your cellular structure at the DNA (inc germ-line!) level without significant testing, go for it. I’ll pass.

    “‘not rule out’ banning Australians from entering the country if they had not received the jab”

    Umm, you can’t refuse entry to a native born person – no country can. Seems Mr Hunt is only opening his mouth to change feet.

  78. Bushkid

    Justinian the Great
    #3553816, posted on August 20, 2020 at 1:31 pm

    I’ve had both measles and rubella, and no ill effects at all. We all did in the 1960s.

    Only one child I’ve ever known has had mumps. None of the rest of us at the same one-teacher school (all in one room) caught it. The lad was fine, no ill effects.

    The diseases to be wary of were polio (a genuine danger) and TB (not common, and eradicated in Australia.)

    Maybe our bush childhoods gave our immune systems something to work with. Playing in the dirt, in the calf pen, working in the dairy, playing with the dogs etc was as helpful as it was fun.

  79. Eyrie

    I am in agreement with one thing with my leftie enemies.

    That’s because they aren’t your enemies, Neil. You are a leftie.

  80. Steve

    pbw said:

    “If your kids are vaccinated, what’s the problem with unvaccinated kids? If they get the virus and come to school or kindy, your kids are protected by the vaccine, aren’t they?”

    And this is exactly my thoughts too.

    Critical point – Vaccines are a critical control mechanism used the Elite to enforce *compliance*

    – it has very little to do with science or your kids well-being. Oh and it makes Pharma companies a motza. In the USA, if you kids gets killed by a vaccine or injured ( e.g. autism ) you have *zero* legal ability to sue them.

    Its a loaded dice, and we lose every time.

    Now the Libs have self destructed by going all North Korea on us, the Elites game is now completely exposed. Morrison I think means well, but is clueless to how hes being manipulated by the Elite for thier own ends.

    Notice we NEVER see any mention of Ivemectin or HCQ – the gloabalists have beeb super clear its all about a vaccine – its a control grid.

    “No jab – no travel for you.”…seriously? You have to be brain dead to think people would go with that.

    Um….I think they can take thier vaccine and inject it where the sun dont shine…the idiots. How to completely rile up a normally easy going bunch of people after months of putting up with lockdown and media circus and hysteria beyond the pail.

    Message to the Elite ( especially Bhamphomet Bill the Vaccine Would Be King…)- you have one month to shut this pathetic covid circus down.

    After that….well…..25 million seriously angry people……and….well…..history is a great teacher…..be smart

  81. Fat Tony

    Neil – just think, if you’d had a gun, you could’ve shot that fucking dog before it bit you
    And now you wouldn’t have been so…..damaged

  82. Bad Samaritan

    “John Brumble
    #3553707, posted on August 20, 2020 at 12:27 pm
    I’m not a hard-core pro-vaxxer either. I simply believe that if you let your unvaccinated kids anywhere near mine, I get to shoot them.”

    So, now you’ve accepted that vaccinating your own kids does not protect them from the unvaccinated….where to from here? You will be shooting anybody who gets near your kids? Self included?

  83. ExIronCurtain

    One more reason to vote for Pauline in every election from today on!

  84. Lee

    Dictatorship is just a form of anarchy anyway and vice versa.

    Incorrect. Anarchy is the total absence of organised law and legal authority

    And he has the gall to claim only he understand politics, Rex!

  85. Rex Anger

    We can only do what we can, Lee.

    One day it might sink in.

    Or we’ll all get our redeployment/posting orders to Eternity first…

  86. Justinian The Great:

    A lot will depend on the clinical trials, honesty and transparency of findings. A vaccination that is harmless (as safe as the flu shot) and for the common as well as personal good should be supported and incentivised.

    …and there’s the rub.
    People just don’t trust the lying bastards any more.

  87. Let’s think about it logically.

    *Hi I am from the government and I am here to hold you down and penetrate you…*

    That’s a yikes from me, dawg!

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