Men are more caring than women

There is a fallacy out there that women tend to be more caring and empathetic. For example Cristina Talacko of the NSW Women’s Council wrote in wrote in the Australian (arguing for gender quotas) that

Women are usually more empathetic and more giving. We are forced to be resilient, persistent, resourceful and adaptable as, historically, business and political environments have been built by men for men, and women have had to learn how to navigate and negotiate better for themselves.

One often hears this caricature as a reason for greater ‘diversity’ as if more diversity is always better. And trans-women adopt these characteristics immediately on transitioning.

But is it so? Who have tended to sacrifice their lives in war and in rescues – men or women?

Now the results are in. Vaccine hesitancy is rife among women, particularly younger women.

Vaccines are an example of a positive externality – they benefit the community at large. And men are happily going and having their shots while women are being self-indulgent and resisting. Men are being more caring than women.

Do something for your country – go and have the covid vaccine and soon.

About Lucius Quinctius Cincinnatus

I'm a retired general who occasionally gets called back to save the republic before returning to my plough.
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207 Responses to Men are more caring than women

  1. mh says:

    You cock.

  2. 132andBush says:

    Fuck off, you moron.

  3. Riversutra says:

    You are an idiot. My early twenties daughter and her friends point blank refuse to be test subjects for an experimental vaccine. They prefer to have healthy children in time and don’t want to be the next thalidomide generation.

  4. Lucius Quinctius Cincinnatus says:

    I’ve struck gold with mh, 132andBush and Riversutra the antivaxxers on this site who are the usual conspiracy theorists and anti-science and irresponsible. You’re the reason this country will be locked down for longer, at huge cost, while the rest of the world starts opening up. Talk about ignorant and self indulgent. Your early twenties daughter has no idea about the efficacy of a vaccine and she is just plugged into her equally ignorant social media friends

  5. TailgunneR says:

    I’m just here for the ratio.

  6. Lucius Quinctius Cincinnatus says:

    I’m sure your daughter will eat experimental organic vegan food made by some nutter who has poor hygiene but she will ignore medical researchers and the considerable evidence from the tens of millions of doses of covid vaccines already distributed

  7. mh says:

    Fuck off

  8. Lucius Quinctius Cincinnatus says:

    mh you have such a broad vocabulary

  9. H B Bear says:

    Lucius says “antivaxxer”. He loses.

  10. H B Bear says:

    mh you have such a broad vocabulary

    But he’s right.

  11. TailgunneR says:

    You’re the reason this country will be locked down for longer,
    The sheep says BAAAA!!

  12. TailgunneR says:

    ignore medical researchers
    Like Fauci and the crew from the Wuhan Biowarfare lab? Probably best to ignore them with extreme prejudice.
    Is Jane Halton your current squeeze, LQC?

  13. Figures says:

    GAGF.

    Getting you and your loved ones a vaccine is altruistic in the same sense that sacrificing your baby to Moloch is altruistic. It’s actually the most selfish thing you can do because you’re putting your ego and desperation to fit in with (an incredibly evil) society above actually important things like your health and the health of your loved ones.

    The only people who believe these vaccines are: a) safe; and b) effective are people like Monty, Numbers and public health “experts”. That is, people who are wrong about everything.

    It’s truly astonishing that there are ‘libertarians’ who still believe that even though governments and the health industry lie about literally everything else, when it comes to vaccines, they are all angels.

    Hint: they are not. In fact, it’s *because* useful idiots like you have such an emotional attachment to these useless and dangerous concoctions that governments and pharma companies actually behave *worse* when it comes to vaccinations than literally any other issue. There is not one word said by any doctor or politician regarding vaccines (not just COVID vaccines) that is remotely possible, let alone true.

    Let’s start with the claim that only “one in a million” people have a severe reaction. You see, there is no way for this claim to be true because there isn’t even a definition of when a reaction is indeed severe (as opposed to moderate or minor).

    Doctors make the bizarre claim that vaccines can indeed cause X but cannot possibly cause lots of X. For example, if your children slept poorly for a couple of nights after their shots your doctor would have told you “that’s perfectly normal – happens with most kids” but if your children slept poorly for a week, a month or a year following their shots the doctor would have told you “don’t be silly! Vaccines can’t cause poor sleeping patterns! The SCIENCE says so!”

    The most astonishingly brazen lie along these lines is with seizures vs epilepsy. How on earth they can admit that vaccines cause seizures (which they do admit) but claim that they can’t possibly cause epilepsy is one of history’s great questions. But an even greater question is how on earth they have gotten anybody to swallow this impossible nonsense.

  14. mh says:

    Vaccine hesitancy

    We get it. You got the directive and had to post something using the term ‘vaccine hesitancy’.

    Now off you go, Quinny. Your job is done.

  15. Figures says:

    ignore medical researchers

    Wow! Imagine using these perpetual wrongologists as some kind of authority. Unless you’re Monty of course. He wouldn’t think twice about it.

    considerable evidence from the tens of millions of doses of covid vaccines

    What does that even mean? What evidence? Other than a self-fulfilling prophecy, what evidence do you have that any of these vaccines have had any kind of a positive impact?

    And where is the evidence that proves they are safe? Do you really believe, even for a millionth of a second, that every single reaction you have heard about on the news is exhaustive of every reaction (be they minor, moderate or severe (however you want to define those things)) that has actually occurred? And if they are not in any way exhaustive then why bring up the “millions of vaccines given”? You have the denominator (the number of vaccines given) but not the numerator (the actual number of reactions) so you can’t possibly make a sensible claim about their relative safety.

    Nobody has the slightest clue what percentage of reactions get reported. For any vaccine. It could be as little as 1 per cent – or lower. And you can’t say “well surely most “severe” reactions get reported” because those are the ones that doctors are the most afraid of admitting are connected to vaccines.

    As I say above, if the vaccines can cause headaches, fevers, fatigue, respiratory symptoms etc then you have to accept that they can and will cause severe versions of any of these things. Not to mention the more unusual symptoms (eg blood clotting).

  16. Colin Suttie says:

    “ Do something for your country – go and have the experimental, unproven vaccine and soon.”

    You first. Let us know how the side effects have been in about 10 years or so. Twat.

  17. duncanm says:

    this is fun..

  18. Eyrie says:

    Another useless post by LQC. Why do you do it , Sinc?
    Thank Christ I was never in the Army to be ordered around by fuckwits like this.

  19. Richard says:

    No that our Border controls and quarantine protocols and contract tracing procedures are all bedded down, it’s actually a fact that the covid vaccines are a greater threat to the Australian populace in 2021 than they actually covid virus is. More Australians have died in this country this year from the AZ vaccine than have died from the virus. None have died from the Pfizer, but that is an experimental treatment and it is unknown what unforeseen effects on the human biology might ultimately be caused by it.

    And then we also have the tangential benefit of having no immigration into our country for the last 14 months. O – goose eggs. What’s not to like? We’re safe from the virus, our homeland has ceased being dispossessed from us, why is there any necessity to take a killer vaccine or an experimental gene therapy?

  20. Damon says:

    If the AZ vaccine had been properly tested, the problem with blood clots would have been detected before its release to the public.

  21. Rosie says:

    Oh it’s Monty.

  22. Indolent says:

    “Vaccine hesitancy” the dominant MSM narrative at the moment. Congratulations on swallowing the propaganda whole.

    Has it ever occurred to you that women may be empathetic and cautious at the same time? Or even, heaven forbid, think for themselves and not be swept up in the agitprop like you appear to be?

  23. Figures says:

    You’re the reason this country will be locked down for longer

    You’re truly contemptible aren’t you?

    There is basically zero overlap of (what you call) anti-vaxers and the people who want (or ever wanted) to be locked down.

    Indeed, back in March 2020 “anti-vaxxers” were pretty much the *only* group of people consistently opposing lockdowns. And now idiots like LQC are blaming *us* for the lockdowns that they themselves wholeheartedly supported!

    It takes an awful lot of chutzpah to be an LQC or a Monty or a Numbers.

    Here is what we should do. No. Here is what the government should have done back in March 2020 – and I said so at the time.

    Cut the ABC by 100 per cent. Because why not? Plus they were the worst when it came to the hysteria. Tell the rest of the media that no small business would be locked down for a second but the government would be happy to lock down any media outlet (and the individual journalists contained therein) for the rest of time if they continued the scaremongering.

    Sack every public health bureaucrat. Because why not? Ban the AMA. For the same. Tell pharma companies that they would be liable for any injury caused by their vaccines. And that liability would be of the criminal kind if there was a *single* shortcut to be found in any of their testing.

    Review the testing done for all vaccines on the infant schedule to look for any similar shortcuts.

    Tell state governments that if they harmed their economies in any way in order to reduce the spread of a non-existent disease then they would commensurately lose access to GST revenue.

    Ban all PCR testing (not that they are “tests” anyway).

  24. 132andBush says:

    Yep, just stand there, gibbering and pointing at me while stammering out the unfounded slur of “antivaxxer”.

    I have already stated my stance re all this.
    I have no problem getting the vaccine in the future if I think I need it.

    I will not be guilt tripped into getting the vax by an over fed, underworked, pencil necked poindexter and his minions.

    Fuck off.

  25. Diogenes says:

    You’re the reason this country will be locked down for longer,

    If you truly believe this, I have a really nice bridge to sell you.

    Listen to what those well-known anti-vax nutters Prof Brendan Murphy* and Fauci** say, lots of ‘mights’, ‘coulds’, and ‘hopes’ in other words – weasel words.

    There is no long term (ie 5 year+) evidence that they are safe.

    *google his most recent 60 minutes interview
    ** search youtube for any interview re vaccines & opening up he has given this year

  26. calli says:

    Nice trolling.

    Young women might be hesitant over fertility issues. Let’s face it, the thing hadn’t been trialled long enough for long term effects.

    Your point over dopey veganism is well made. It’s something most of them grow out of. Damage to reproductive organs, not so much.

  27. Shaun says:

    “the antivaxxers on this site”

    Lucius, you lost the argument the micro second you typed that phrase. The truly sad thing is that the idiots throwing that word around have no idea why they are wrong.

  28. Roger says:

    Listen to what those well-known anti-vax nutters Prof Brendan Murphy* and Fauci** say, lots of ‘mights’, ‘coulds’, and ‘hopes’ in other words – weasel words.

    Speaking of Fauci, he’s now open to the posibility that the virus could have been created in a lab, something he emphatically denied a year ago. He’s got more positions than the Kama Sutra.

  29. twostix says:

    I’ve struck gold with mh, 132andBush and Riversutra the antivaxxers on this site who are the usual conspiracy theorists and anti-science and irresponsible. You’re the reason this country will be locked down for longer, at huge cost, while the rest of the world starts opening up. Talk about ignorant and self indulgent. Your early twenties daughter has no idea about the efficacy of a vaccine and she is just plugged into her equally ignorant social media friends

    🤣

    Ok boomer.

    We’re not taking the vaccine, so no more round the world trips for you before the aged care home beckons, hope you enjoyed the last five trips on the Grand Tour (on our dime).

  30. 132andBush says:

    And just for the record “Figures “ is an anti vax loon.

    I’m merely exercising my right to decide.

    The implication of coercion is evident in your comments.

    You absolute x#nt of a human.

  31. Kneel says:

    “Let’s start with the claim that only “one in a million” people have a severe reaction.”

    Yes – amazing that we are expected to believe that the virus “spike” protein can cause blood clots in heavily infected individuals (people falling dead in the street video from China), yet the mRNA and retro-virus vaccines, which produce the exact same protein, is “safe”.
    Amazing that vaccine development protocols developed over decades to ensure safety are by-passed and for a virus type that every attempt to create a vaccine against for the last 70 years never got past animal trials, despite making anti-bodies – because they caused a worse reaction to the real virus, caused severe reactions that are comparable to infection by the virus, or caused auto-immune responses far worse than the consequences of the virus itself.
    We have no, none, zero, zip information on the long term consequences of using this virus, and several indications that for women the immune reaction generated can also target a protein that helps regulate placental attachment, thereby inducing miscarriages and potentially leaving them sterile.

    FFS, this isn’t airborne Ebola virus that kills 80% of those infected, it’s a really bad cold that is relatively “novel” for most peoples immune system, and so somewhat more dangerous. Remember, as South Park so eloquently put it “Only 99.9% of us will survive”. Check the stats, average age of death for COVID is higher than average life expectancy in almost every country! No, I don’t want people to die – far from it, it’s a tragedy that anyone dies from this disease, or indeed any other cause. But some perspective here please – more people have died from car crashes in Australia in the last 12 months than died from COVID, even with some places locking down travel and state borders closed.
    “If it saves one life…” is it NOT worth it where it costs 10 people their life! It is NOT worth it where it puts the country into a huge amount of debt that will take a decade or several to pay back. Sorry, it just isn’t – and that includes if it kills me.

  32. Bruce of Newcastle says:

    Well there’s always HCQ/azithromycin/zinc as an alternative.
    Did I just hear a distant head explosion from the direction of LQC’s farm?

    Vaccines are a perfect libertarian option. You choose to have it, you’re protected. If someone else doesn’t have it and they get infected that’s their problem not yours.

  33. twostix says:

    Last charge of this species of the boomer ‘male’ before he disappears into the aged care home: “We’re way more in touch with our feminine side than women are!”, “we’re the real women!”

    You complete fag.

  34. twostix says:

    In the giant prison colony of Australia, as in any prison there are three types of inmates:

    Those who refuse to become institutionalised
    Those who go along to get along
    Those who become house boys and collaborate with the authorities to crush the first group for their own personal gain:

    “Hey everyone, it’s their fault the warden wont let us out of lockdown and return our arbitrarily removed privileges! Get them!”.

    The warden smiles.

    (and in return rewards them with trips outside the prison).

  35. SIMON NICHOLAS MORGAN says:

    Nobody seems to be commenting on the Telegraph report that Big Pharma had gained 9 new billionaires due to this scamdemic.

    Nice little earner, clearly. And because our governments are now so stupid I’m investing every cent in Pharmaceuticals come the next ‘horror’ chill from China.

  36. Scott Osmond says:

    Wow! young women are resisting the scare campaign? and here I was thinking that women, young ones in particular were herd creatures who could easily be manipulated by whoever had control of the media. Ladies, I owe you a heart felt apology. Maybe, the genetic therapy one might have something to do with it? Concerns about what future effects a new and untested genetic therapy might have on reproductive prospects?

  37. H B Bear says:

    Thank Christ I was never in the Army to be ordered around by fuckwits like this.

    +1 The army doesn’t have a great record with soldiers and vaccines. mh advice is apt.

  38. Woolfe says:

    The latest carrot is that we “may” be allowed to fly interstate if there is an outbreak (1 case) . And then be quarantined of course.

  39. Scott Osmond says:

    At least with the closure of international flights, well for some, the population replacement program supported by our traitorous poloticians has been slowed if not stopped. Also, the backdoor immigration system run by the universities has been put on hold.

  40. Up The Workers! says:

    Good idea.

    Look on it as a very late-term abortion.

    Save the planet by extincting yourself.

    The people in Mogadishu-by-the-Yarra extolling the manifold virtues of Socialist Syphilis/Peking Pox vaccination, are the same ones who already have the signatures of 820 innocent dead people (10 times more than all the other States and Territories combined) on their C.V.’s.

  41. Richard says:

    Do something for your country – go and have the covid vaccine and soon.

    Has the cat been hacked by The Guardian?

  42. Rohan says:

    Lucy, do you by chance drive a hermatically sealed soft top Miata?

  43. Figures says:

    And just for the record “Figures “ is an anti vax loon.

    Why do you play their game? If people had listened to us “loons” back when the Biosecurity Act was legislated, none of this would have happened.

  44. Pyrmonter says:

    @ LCQ – disagree on the sexual characteristics argument, but … on the anti-vaccine matter, full marks.

    A bunch of Cats must think the UK, US and Israel have suppressed news of mass death.

  45. Up The Workers! says:

    Funny, isn’t it, how long-haired, sandal-wearing beardie-cyclist unemployable Mung-Beaners are all 100% against genetically modified food organisms, lest they develop a third head, or a superfluous eyeball,or a capability for rational thought, yet they are all in favour of the rest of us getting jabbed with genetically modified RNA “vaccines” (lethal blood-clotting ones and otherwise) in order to allegedly ward off Labor Leprosy/Bolshevik Botulism/Chi-Com Cough/Leftard Laryngitis/Dodgy Dan’s Distemper and can see no contradiction with that.

    G,M.O.’s – Lethal one day; Mandatory the next

  46. Shy Ted says:

    It’s not just the vaccines they’re hesitant about.

  47. 132andBush says:

    Pyrmonter says:
    May 24, 2021 at 10:04 am
    @ LCQ – disagree on the sexual characteristics argument, but … on the anti-vaccine matter, full marks.

    Speaking of pencil necked poindexters.

  48. Kneel says:

    “Funny, isn’t it, how long-haired, sandal-wearing beardie-cyclist unemployable Mung-Beaners are all 100% against…”

    Yeah – and also funny how they want you to get a vaccine passport, yet in the US right now it is NOT a criminal offense to have unprotected sex with someone even when you know you have HIV/AIDS, it is illegal to discriminate based on HIV/AIDS status for employment etc etc, but not for COVID vaccine status.
    Weird, right?

  49. Snoopy says:

    Nobody seems to be commenting on the Telegraph report that Big Pharma had gained 9 new billionaires due to this scamdemic.

    It’s actually good news. They’re so content with their new-found wealth that they have no need to flog booster shots for future variants.

  50. JC says:

    Just sad. Typical comment from a parasite with zero understanding of the real world.
    Shouldn’t be here.

  51. jupes says:

    One often hears this caricature as a reason for greater ‘diversity’ as if more diversity is always better.

    Well said LQC.

    Do something for your country – go and have the covid vaccine and soon.

    Go and get fucked.

  52. Bar Beach Swimmer says:

    We’re not taking the vaccine, so no more round the world trips for you

    +1

    Kneel, Bruce & twostix – all great posts!
    Someone I know wants to visit, or have visit, their rellies overseas. So without everyone getting the jab neither they can go or the other ones can visit (they can’t afford to pay for quarantine). The inference was that my vaccination status is hampering what they want to do.

  53. 132andBush says:

    BBS,
    So you’re getting pressure?

  54. Bar Beach Swimmer says:

    132andBush says:
    May 24, 2021 at 10:40 am
    BBS,
    So you’re getting pressure?

    Bush, I would say a passive form of it. But I stood my ground 😎
    https://youtu.be/nvlTJrNJ5lA

  55. 132andBush says:

    Haha
    Excellent.

  56. m0nty says:

    The Cat is at its best when the OP challenges the stupidity of the commenters. Very entertaining!

  57. Kneel says:

    “…as if more diversity is always better.”

    Some diversity of opinion and thought would be an improvement, no doubt. Especially in the media.

    As famously said “Free speech is hard. Free speech means standing up for right of a man to speak – a man who’s ideas make your blood boil, a man who is advocating at the top of his voice that which you would spend a lifetime opposing at the top of yours.”
    Free speech means nothing if it doesn’t apply to those you vehemently disagree with. If you are confident that you are on the “right side of history”, then let your opponent speak and watch him laughed off the stage – only those who are too timid, too unsure of what is correct, want to restrict your speech. They should be ignored. The answer to “bad speech” is “good speech”, not the denial of your basic human right to think as you choose and to speak your mind.

    Health choices are the individuals responsibility, no-one else’s. They alone bear the consequences of what they take in. Who knows YOUR health better – you and your own doctor, or some pencil-pushing geek in Can-braaah (sic)? Make an informed choice about what is best for you and those you are responsible for – they are the ones that matter most to you, they are the only ones you have control over, the only ones you should have control over. Let others make their choices as they see fit. That is diversity. That is freedom. Without these, you may as well be in China being welded into an apartment because you have a cold. Better to die on your feet than live on your knees, cowering in fear at a disease that 99.99% of people under 60 survive.

  58. Roger says:

    Have you grasped the concept of adverse reactions yet, monty?

  59. 132andBush says:

    The Cat is at its best when the OP challenges the stupidity of the commenters. Very entertaining!

    Care to define that stupidity?

  60. m0nty says:

    The COVID vaccine is a classic free rider problem. Cats are always going to be the free riders in that scenario, as they lack emotional intelligence.

    You’re welcome, by the way.

  61. Judge Dredd says:

    Remember that we are the majority, and the likes of LGBTQC, Monty, and his ilk are the minority. Even in the USA only 38% have taken the not-vaccine. Even in their CDC, Fauci admits only half the workforce in the CDC have taken it (you know it’s much less than that, because they lie).

    The people pushing this here on this site want to force everyone to get the not-vaccine, or are clearly paid shills wanting others to follow the elite’s orders.
    Use logic, remember they don’t really care for you, they are desperate that you don’t think for yourself.
    We, that refuse the experimental not-vaccine, are the majority.

  62. Bar Beach Swimmer says:

    monty at 11:10am
    from what I understand, you have health problems. So you’ve decided that the jab is the best course for you. Good on you for being proactive about your health and your circumstances.

    I, otoh, do not have health problems and have decided the opposite.
    No free rider there, just weighing up reality.

    btw, how about a discussion on free riders, as you put it, and the tax and transfer system?

  63. Tintarella di Luna says:

    The plow is calling – get ye back there

  64. 132andBush says:

    as they lack emotional intelligence.

    Gibberish

    The COVID vaccine is a classic free rider problem

    Oh, like socialism?

  65. Lee says:

    @ LCQ – disagree on the sexual characteristics argument, but … on the anti-vaccine matter, full marks.

    Why am I not remotely surprised that you agree with LCQ, Pyrmonter?
    I suspect that you’re still very sore at Turnbull being dumped.
    That’s assuming you ever voted Liberal.

  66. 132andBush says:

    And monty,
    Put the underpants back on the inside.
    It’s not a flattering look.

  67. Bruce of Newcastle says:

    The COVID vaccine is a classic free rider problem.

    That’s a fallacy M0nty. As I said, it’s entirely your choice – you get the vax and you are protected. Therefore it doesn’t matter a hoot whether someone else has had it or not.

    It’s clear that this virus is very mutable, like influenza, so it isn’t ever going to be exterminated like small pox or polio (the latter isn’t quite, due to some hold outs in places like Pakistan).

    As for governments saying no air travel until people are vaccinated, that’s also a complete furphy. A dictatorial pronouncement with zero basis in fact or science, for the reasons I gave. So don’t blame people who haven’t had it for your inability to go on planes – that is entirely due to stupid government edict.

  68. harrys on the boat says:

    From speaking to family and friends in the UK, my take on why they’ve taken the jab so readily is they’re broken. The lockdown, no social life, no going out, no sport, no holidays has broken them. Mates who lived for the pub, I messaged last week asking how the first pint was, all replied they haven’t bothered to go. There’s no banter on messaging anymore, no piss taking, no pictures of fun times, no football chat, hardly anything. They are broken. Taking the jab has fuck all to do with health, it’s a way out of the hell they’ve been living in.

    They’re just waiting desperately for June 21st, and they’re not optimistic about that anymore.

  69. m0nty says:

    That’s a fallacy M0nty. As I said, it’s entirely your choice – you get the vax and you are protected. Therefore it doesn’t matter a hoot whether someone else has had it or not.

    The free riding is on enough citizens getting vaccinated that we can declare herd immunity to prevent further lockdowns and increase consumer confidence so that the economy can recover. We vaccinated citizens take the one in a million chance of a blood clot to benefit you recalcitrants.

    You’re welcome, comrade.

  70. Roger says:

    From speaking to family and friends in the UK, my take on why they’ve taken the jab so readily is they’re broken.

    Very, very sad, harry.

    A broken & compliant populace.

    Just what that Communist bitch – Prof. Susan Michie – advising the UK government was aiming for.

  71. 132andBush says:

    Interesting how this is morphing.

    Let’s exclude the anti vax conspiracists for a sec. They are allowed to think what they want and do what they want so long as it doesn’t affect anyone else.

    Those of us who are healthy and choosing not to vax now and wait to make sure the vaccines are safe or indeed necessary are suddenly starting to be labelled as “free riders” or “not doing something for the country”.
    What’s next ? “Enemy of the people “? And the people who get it are the heroes of the nation.

    Get the vaccine if you want.
    Just don’t start with the labels, you fuckers.

  72. Rosie says:

    No Monty people in the non vulnerable category don’t have to worry about getting an asymptomatic ‘case’ of covid.

    Healthy under fifties aren’t free riding.

    What cl said on his thread. Vaccine for those who want it, some sensible protections *hygiene* for the vulnerable in aged care and hospitals and open the borders.

    Won’t happen because politicians have painted themselves into a no case corner.

  73. Roger says:

    What’s next ? “Enemy of the people “? And the people who get it are the heroes of the nation.

    That is indeed one of the four basic solutions to the free rider problem:

    Appeal to people’s altruism.

    The flip side of that is to shame the alleged free riders.

  74. 132andBush says:

    Won’t happen because politicians have painted themselves into a no case corner.

    Spot on.
    This was the obvious outcome, evident from this time last year.

  75. Roger says:

    That’s for argument’s sake, mind you.

    But that’s where people who cite the free rider problem in this context will likely end up.

    Exempli gratia this post and some of the comments on it.

  76. Annie says:

    Kneel @ 11.02am:

    Very well said.

  77. Rosie says:

    Yep.

    I was so angry when Dan called the death of a woman in her nineties a tragedy I actually wrote to local member.

    He at least had the courtesy to send me a personal response.

    My 90 ex mil suffered through more than six months of zero family contact.

    Stuff you tragedy Dan.

  78. m0nty says:

    That is indeed one of the four basic solutions to the free rider problem:

    Appeal to people’s altruism.

    The flip side of that is to shame the alleged free riders.

    Cats have no emotional intelligence, so they don’t understand altruism or shame.

    They might understand being excluded from certain other public goods, or being taxed higher. I wonder if sporting organisations or entertainment venues will start blocking the non-vaccinated from attending their events.

  79. Boambee John says:

    m0nty says:
    May 24, 2021 at 11:10 am
    The COVID vaccine is a classic free rider problem. Cats are always going to be the free riders in that scenario, as they lack emotional intelligence.

    Better than lacking actual intelligence, like you.

  80. Rosie says:

    Come on Monty, explain how people under fifty including your children, not getting vaxxed, is free riding.

  81. Boambee John says:

    Those of us who are healthy and choosing not to vax now and wait to make sure the vaccines are safe or indeed necessary are suddenly starting to be labelled as “free riders” or “not doing something for the country”.
    What’s next ? “Enemy of the people “? And the people who get it are the heroes of the nation.

    Remember that the fat fascist fool munty has previously applauded US DemonRats who called for the preparation of “enemies lists” of people who worked for the Trump administration in any role.

  82. m0nty says:

    I did that at 11:47, Rosie.

  83. Roger says:

    Cats have no emotional intelligence, so they don’t understand altruism or shame.

    I grant the possibility, again for argument’s sake, that some Cats may lack emotional intelligence.

    To jump from that to all Cats lack emotional intelligence is fallacious.

    You ought to bone up on fallacies, formal and informal, if you’re going to attempt to make arguments here and be taken seriously.

  84. Ƶĩppʯ (ȊꞪꞨV) says:

    Cats have no emotional intelligence, so they don’t understand altruism or shame.

    trolls have no self-awareness

  85. Bruce of Newcastle says:

    The free riding is on enough citizens getting vaccinated that we can declare herd immunity to prevent further lockdowns

    You’ll be waiting quite a while then M0nty.

    Five reasons why COVID herd immunity is probably impossible (18 May)

    There’s no flu herd immunity, and that is a similar virus in its mutability and transmission. And we’ve had effective annual vaccines for a couple decades.

  86. m0nty says:

    Righto Roger, I grant that some Cats have had the shots and said so, and some others have probably had the shots and are keeping schtum about it for fear of a pile on. Bravo to those hardy souls. The rest of you lot are mostly mentally stunted individuals who lack compassion.

  87. Scott Osmond says:

    I’m going to be very interested in health outcomes over the next 10 years. Especially the jab recievers vs those who exercised a bit of wait and see. It’s not as if we have bodies piling up or anything.

  88. Roger says:

    The rest of you lot are mostly mentally stunted individuals who lack compassion.

    And so you choose vincible ignorance once again.

  89. Rosie says:

    No you didn’t.

    I see no politician in Australia making a claim that herd immunity is the desired outcome.

    Covid free is the current policy.

  90. m0nty says:

    Five reasons why COVID herd immunity is probably impossible (18 May)

    The five reasons are:

    It’s unclear whether vaccines prevent transmission
    They don’t, but that’s okay, they prevent long COVID and the vast majority of deaths. Once you cop a transmission in the wild post-vax you don’t tend to get it again.

    Vaccine roll-out is uneven
    An entirely temporary issue.

    New variants change the herd-immunity equation
    Every story about this I have read is that existing vaccines work just as well against new variants. The variability has been in ease of transmission, nothing else.

    Immunity might not last forever
    Sure, booster shots are a feature of most vaccines. Not an issue.

    Vaccines might change human behaviour
    Another temporary non-issue.

  91. Bruce of Newcastle says:

    The rest of you lot are mostly mentally stunted individuals who lack compassion.

    LOL. I am triggered because you won’t cut you left pinky off. All religious peoples must cut their pinkies off for Gaia! To show their commitment to the herd community. Pinkies are a crime against the universe!

    We are getting so much of this sort of fascism from the Left these days.

  92. Figures says:

    Cats have no emotional intelligence, so they don’t understand altruism or shame.

    You would murder your own children if the government told you to.

    And then you would call yourself “altruistic” and think you were morally superior.

  93. TailgunneR says:

    mentally stunted individuals who lack compassion.


    Are we back to being nanna killers again?
    Oh noes!

  94. Rosie says:

    That just means that the well established vulnerable cohort would be wise to get vaccinated.

    We don’t even need ‘herd immunity’

  95. m0nty says:

    I see no politician in Australia making a claim that herd immunity is the desired outcome.

    Covid free is the current policy.

    Herd immunity is the stated goal of the vaccination program, Rosie. “COVID free” means no community transmissions to non-vaccinated citizens, which is the desired outcome of opening up under herd immunity conditions.

    The US CDC estimates that 50% of Americans will be vaccinated in a month’s time, reaching 70% in a further two months and 85% by mid-October. 70-85% is usually the range to declare herd immunity. You’ll see life getting back to normal in America by then.

  96. jupes says:

    A bunch of Cats must think the UK, US and Israel have suppressed news of mass death.

    4,647 Americans died from Covid vaccines betweeen December 14, 2020, through May 17, 2021.

  97. Pyrmonter says:

    @ Monty – the goal will surely become ‘no serious illness from COVID’. We’re unlikely to extinguish it entirely; but with UK-like levels of vaccination would reduce it LSSA nurse to a minor one, comparable to the common cold.

  98. Mater says:

    The free riding is on enough citizens getting vaccinated that we can declare herd immunity to prevent further lockdowns and increase consumer confidence so that the economy can recover. We vaccinated citizens take the one in a million chance of a blood clot to benefit you recalcitrants.

    Monty, have you regressed?
    I thought we got over this ‘herd immunity’ and ‘risk to others crap’ already when they admitted that “The vaccine lowers symptoms. It does not stop you from getting the virus, nor does it prevent you from spreading it”?

    m0nty says:
    February 22, 2021 at 11:03 am

    Why would that be justified if you only pose a risk to yourself?

    Struth, you make a good point. There are two responses to this:

    a) Many of the restrictions being talked about are related to travel, which is fair enough as other countries and states have different vaccination regimes and timelines so they retain the right to prevent introducing extra potential vectors of infection;
    b) Domestic restrictions or fines should probably be confined to health services, because unvaccinated COVID sufferers will be an unwarranted burden on the health system and anti-vaxxers should have to pay their way given they are being deliberately stupid about it.

    Mater says:
    February 22, 2021 at 11:17 am

    b) Domestic restrictions or fines should probably be confined to health services, because unvaccinated COVID sufferers will be an unwarranted burden on the health system and anti-vaxxers should have to pay their way given they are being deliberately stupid about it.

    Same with:
    Motorcyclists, Race car drivers, Parachutists, Smokers, Illicit Drug takers, etc?

    The list of people choosing to partake in higher risk activities is VERY long Monty. In fact, just utter stupidity is a large factor in healthcare patients. Have we, are we, going to exclude them from the ‘universal healthcare system’?

    Ironically, you are putting forward the very best argument against a universal healthcare system and the welfare safety net. If people had to pay for the medical results of their individual choices, they may make ‘better’ choices. But at this point in time, everyone (in theory) pays upfront for the healthcare system, so they can continue to deliver it, without reference to the cause of the problem.

    m0nty says:
    February 22, 2021 at 11:25 am
    Mater, I don’t think the domestic restrictions will be applied anyway. It’s a good argument you make, and it will probably prevail.

    The main reason I am pushing back on this one is that anti-vaxxers are just so aggressively and militantly stupid. I don’t want the Cat to be infected with anti-vaxxism because it removes the challenge of commenting here. Don’t become so boringly foolish, Cats! Retain at least a few brain cells to rub together, it’s more fun that way.

  99. Pyrmonter says:

    Auto-correct – ‘it’s burden’

  100. Bruce of Newcastle says:

    Life is pretty normal in Florida already, or so I hear.

    But we’ll all be saved when everyone is driving electric cars and don’t eat meat.
    The Left keep coming up with stupid mantras just like this.

    You do realize that half the population is fed up with Lefty rubbish don’t you M0nty? And that piling more on just make people rebel? I am not an anti-vaxxer, and I’ve said many times I intend to get the Pf or Mo vax when it is available. But you are making even me distrust the stuff, by your arrogant attitude.

  101. 132andBush says:

    Pyrmonter says:
    May 24, 2021 at 12:00 pm

    What is your point?

  102. Pyrmonter says:

    @132

    Hundreds of millions of doses of vaccine have been administered: where is the catastrophe that is supposed to follow?

  103. Dave in Marybrook says:

    dulcet et decorum est
    pro patria coactus

    Shove it, LCQ

  104. BM says:

    Geez, when the left aren’t championing St Brittany’s Crusade, they’re vehemently complaining that people want the right to consent to what is put in their bodies.

    And they don’t even see the irony.

  105. jupes says:

    https://www.reuters.com/article/factcheck-vaers-deaths-idUSL1N2LV0NY

    You are using a far-left news outlet to ‘fact check’ data from a US government agency.

    Fail.

  106. John Smith101 says:

    Hundreds of millions of doses of vaccine have been administered: where is the catastrophe that is supposed to follow?

    Here’s some short term ones, from one jurisdiction over a relatively short time period. It will be months or years before the longer term problems show up.

  107. m0nty says:

    Monty, have you regressed?
    I thought we got over this ‘herd immunity’ and ‘risk to others crap’ already when they admitted that “The vaccine lowers symptoms. It does not stop you from getting the virus, nor does it prevent you from spreading it”?

    Guess what Mater, the flu vaccine works exactly the same way.

    As for those quotes of mine, they were referring to government restrictions. My speculation today was about whether private operators like the AFL or music venue companies would choose to apply their own restrictions to minimise the extra costs of babysitting the non-vaxxed.

  108. jupes says:

    Hundreds of millions of doses of vaccine have been administered: where is the catastrophe that is supposed to follow?

    How many vaccinated women have given birth?

    Maybe you aren’t old enough to remember Thalidomide.

  109. 132andBush says:

    Pyrmonter says:
    May 24, 2021 at 1:04 pm
    @132

    Hundreds of millions of doses of vaccine have been administered: where is the catastrophe that is supposed to follow?

    Can you point to any comment I have made stating there will be a catastrophe?

    Stating I’m being cautious about taking a hurriedly developed vaccine to protect me from a virus I have no existential fear of is NOT putting on a tinfoil hat and shouting doom.
    Your use of this straw man does nothing for your dubious reputation on this blog.

  110. m0nty says:

    You are using a far-left news outlet to ‘fact check’ data from a US government agency.

    Fail.

    You are using a video posted to Facebook by swivel-eyed loons to ‘fact check’ data from a US government agency.

    Fail.

  111. PeterW says:

    Free Rider

    That would be anyone demanding that others be locked up/down and vaccinated so that he can feel safe.

  112. 132andBush says:

    m0nty says:
    May 24, 2021 at 12:25 pm
    Five reasons why COVID herd immunity is probably impossible (18 May)

    The five reasons are:

    It’s unclear whether vaccines prevent transmission
    They don’t, but that’s okay, they prevent long COVID and the vast majority of deaths. Once you cop a transmission in the wild post-vax you don’t tend to get it again.

    Monty,
    Given the above, how is my choosing to not vax immediately going to impact on you in ANY way shape or form?

  113. m0nty says:

    Monty,
    Given the above, how is my choosing to not vax immediately going to impact on you in ANY way shape or form?

    See this is what I mean about Cats lacking emotional intelligence. Bushy here can’t even comprehend that I don’t want him or people like him to suffer or die due to their own stupidity.

  114. Terry says:

    ‘So don’t blame people who haven’t had it for your inability to go on planes…’
    This presents as much more of a problem of the limited availability of space between the armrests than the vaccination status of “others”…

    If an expeditious return of international travel is the objective, then “Lord Lard-Arse” might find it more feasible to lobby the airlines for pressurised cargo decks than to attempt to trample on the rights of others.

    Then again, he could also just F#(% Right Off!

  115. Richard says:

    Pyrmonter says:
    May 24, 2021 at 1:04 pm
    @132

    Hundreds of millions of doses of vaccine have been administered: where is the catastrophe that is supposed to follow?

    Patience my dear Pyrmonter, patience.

  116. Dot says:

    You failed first year economics and your business is ripping off the AFL’s IP and chatting to teens in the internet

    “I am now a vaccine expert”
    “You lot lack empathy”

    You complete and utter fuck up.

  117. MACK says:

    “University of Newcastle senior lecturer in health sciences Jennifer StGeorge, one of the team who ran the study, published in the Journal of Child and Family Studies, said fathers were shown to be more supportive of the child’s exploration of the world.
    The research found that playing rough with dad was more effective in helping toddlers learn to control their emotions, when compared to playing with mum, which tended to be calmer. The study, which included 64 sets of parents and their children, aged 18–24 months, revealed higher quality father-child “rough-and-tumble play” helped a child’s overall development and wellbeing, including social competence”.

  118. Dot says:

    All in all, the vaccines were useless, as were the lockdowns.

    No one ever did serological testing of the deceased, the COVID numbers were inherently fraudulent. Or how the PCR cycles have been brought down.

    Complete bullshit with the pretence of truth.

    It’s just a cold. Like SARS or MERS. Or about 30 strains of the common cold, like N95 Coronavirus, which common houseflies carry.

    Yes, you can die of a cold.

    This was used to threaten US voters – vote Trump out or we will keep you locked down.

    Also, let’s destroy civil liberties and lock down the world economy – 16 months and counting.

    Great work, eggheads.

  119. m0nty says:

    Dot, you’re a lawyer, you are in no position to pot people over the worthiness of their profession.

  120. Mater says:

    As for those quotes of mine, they were referring to government restrictions.

    Yes, and your comment clearly acknowledges that it’s now a personal issue, not a community safety issue. So stop trying the emotional blackmail bullshit.

  121. Richard says:

    Lucius Quinctius Cincinnatus says:
    May 24, 2021 at 8:16 am
    You’re the reason this country will be locked down for longer, at huge cost, while the rest of the world starts opening up

    You’re a libertarian? This is not the type of comment that I would equate with one.

  122. Rex Anger says:

    Bushy here can’t even comprehend that I don’t want him or people like him to suffer or die due to their own stupidity.

    Wot? As compared to your mendacious ideology?

  123. Mango Man says:

    I’d imagine that a few Lucius critics here would have made fine leaders of the Inquisition that saw off Galileo. I wonder how many are rusty bikes?

  124. jupes says:

    You are using a video posted to Facebook by swivel-eyed loons to ‘fact check’ data from a US government agency.

    Que?

  125. 132andBush says:

    See this is what I mean about Cats lacking emotional intelligence. Bushy here can’t even comprehend that I don’t want him or people like him to suffer or die due to their own stupidity.

    Lol

  126. Shaun says:

    “The rest of you lot are mostly mentally stunted individuals who lack compassion.”

    Oh. My. God. Such virtue signalling. I bet you got a tattoo to show everyone what a hero you are, right? Either that or you’ve framed evidence of your jab and display it prominently.

  127. m0nty says:

    I bet you got a tattoo to show everyone what a hero you are, right?

    No, but I have a scar.

    You’re welcome.

  128. 132andBush says:

    Mango Man says:
    May 24, 2021 at 2:10 pm
    I’d imagine that a few Lucius critics here would have made fine leaders of the Inquisition that saw off Galileo. I wonder how many are rusty bikes?

    There’s a big difference between telling someone to take his opinions and jam them up his sanctimonious arse.
    v
    Advocating he be thrown in jail for having said opinions.

  129. Figures says:

    Hundreds of millions of doses of vaccine have been administered: where is the catastrophe that is supposed to follow?

    The perpetual dishonesty of vaccine fanatics.

    How on earth is the above supposed to be a sensible metric of anything?

    Lots and lots of people have died fighting in wars, and yet humanity still carries on existing. So according to Pyrmonter, war is harmless.

    I could (and will) point out that I haven’t seen any health catastrophe as a result of COVID either (other than the totalitarian and economy wrecking responses) but you will just say “oh but lots of people have told me that it is really bad so it must be”.

    All you have to base your beliefs in the dangers of COVID on are opinions Pyrmonter. Nothing else.

    In fact, whilst many people have directly witnessed people getting sick *immediately* following vaccination (we just have no idea how many) not one person in the past 14 months has witnessed someone getting sick *immediately* following wild virus infection. To put it another way, we know for a fact that the vaccine is causing significant damage (we just don’t know how much) but we have absolutely no idea if the virus has caused a single person to get sick.

  130. Figures says:

    You’re welcome.

    Not good enough champ. Anything less than 20 doses of each kind and you’re nowhere near safe to be around.

  131. m0nty says:

    Figures, you are remarkably erudite for a dumb person. So much education, so little wisdom.

  132. Lee says:

    Geez, when the left aren’t championing St Brittany’s Crusade, they’re vehemently complaining that people want the right to consent to what is put in their bodies.

    And they don’t even see the irony.

    True.
    And you can bet that most of those same people are pro-abortionists who maintain a woman’s right to what she does (or doesn’t) with her own body.
    Except when she doesn’t want a vaccine.

  133. twostix says:

    Millions of thousands of doses of Pandremix were administered during swine flu, it took nearly five years of research, fighting and investigation to prove that every 1/18000 children who received it was brain damaged by it.

    GSK and their mates in the UK health authorities spent those five years stalling, derailing and maligning the victims (overwhelmingly children – nearly 1000) and researchers who were studying it.

    GSK to this day still run yearly astro-turf campaigns in their bought and paid for media outlets pretending that their paid off ‘Science!’ shills have discovered there was no link.

    You know zero about anything m0nty. You’re just a dumb midwit prole tween in a mans body.

  134. Bar Beach Swimmer says:

    I’d imagine that a few Lucius critics here would have made fine leaders of the Inquisition that saw off Galileo

    Lucius’ critics, by and large, are a live and let live mob We’re not saying don’t get the jab if you want it; we’re saying we don’t want it. Galileo’s critics are more reminiscent of those insisting that everyone must get it.

  135. Figures says:

    Figures, you are remarkably erudite for a dumb person. So much education, so little wisdom.

    Translation: I’ve demolished literally every argument you’ve ever made but you just know I must be wrong because feelings.

  136. Megan says:

    I collect autoimmune disorders like other people collect stamps or Model A Fords. Up to nine and counting. I had my first regular flu jab last year with no problems, had this year’s version and my immune system went into gibbering overdrive. I’ve been struggling for weeks.

    None of my disorders are terminal but they have had a serious effect on my quality of life. Both my GP, and the Prince’s also to my surprise, have advised us against getting any COVID vaccination in the near future.

    Should I ignore that advice in order to make LCQ and his utterly predictable supporters here feel less scared? Should I put aside my own well researched risk assessment for the sake of everyone else?

    The reek of their actual cowardice seeps from every virtuous pore.

  137. Epicurious says:

    This Lucius keeps on proving he is an ignorant dipstick. Do some research other than what your media mates are feeding you. Sinc time to stop this idiot’s posts.

  138. m0nty says:

    Millions of thousands of doses of Pandremix were administered during swine flu, it took nearly five years of research, fighting and investigation to prove that every 1/18000 children who received it was brain damaged by it.

    “Brain damaged”, um no. The issue was narcolepsy, which is a disease of the immune system.

    The chance of something like that cropping up with the COVID vaccines and affecting you personally is infinitesimal compared to the risk you are taking by not getting vaccinated until the Lord God Himself descends from Heaven to assure you that the vax is divine enough for you to accept into the sacred temple of your body.

  139. twostix says:

    Anybody who can read this report of the Pandremix disaster of 2009, from the highly respected British Medical Journal, and not see the exact same problems playing out on a global scale right now – with the same people doing the same shit things, needs their goddamned head read.

    In October 2009, the US National Institutes of Health infectious diseases chief, Anthony Fauci, appeared on YouTube to reassure Americans about the safety of the “swine flu” vaccine. “The track record for serious adverse events is very good. It’s very,very, very rare that you ever see anything that’s associated with the vaccine that’s a serious event,”1 he said. Four months earlier, the World Health Organization had declared H1N1 influenza a pandemic, and by October 2009 the new vaccines were being rolled out across the world. A similar story was playing out in the UK, with prominent organisations,including the Department of Health, British Medical Association, and Royal Colleges of General Practitioners,working hard to convince a reluctant NHS workforce to get vaccinated.2 “We fully support the swine flu vaccination programme … The vaccine has been thoroughly tested,” they declared in a joint statement.3

    Except, it hadn’t.

  140. Megan says:

    The chance of something like that cropping up with the COVID vaccines and affecting you personally is infinitesimal compared to the risk you are taking by not getting vaccinated until the Lord God Himself descends from Heaven to assure you that the vax is divine enough for you to accept into the sacred temple of your body.

    And in one short paragraph you have proven beyond any doubt that you are just a steaming dog turd on the great footpath of life.

  141. twostix says:

    M0nty now shilling for GSK and Pandremix! 🤣

    That’s the exact line GSK they were running in their press releases as the studies were reported on during 2014 and courts started awarding damages to victims. “No no, it wasn’t our shit untested vaccine – waved through with the complicity of national governments and health agencies that caused 1300 (known – almost all children) people to get brain damage, but their immune system’s reaction to Swine Flu!”.

    You absolute prole.

  142. m0nty says:

    Chance of developing narcolepsy from Pandremix: 0.002%
    Chance of dying if you caught H1N1 while unvaccinated: 0.02%

    Everything in life is a risk. Breathing in and out is a risk. Vaccines are a risk, but it is a far bigger risk to stay unvaccinated. We are talking orders of magnitude here, it’s not even a contest.

  143. twostix says:

    The chance of something like that cropping up with the COVID vaccines and affecting you personally is infinitesimal compared to the risk you are taking by not getting vaccinated

    There is zero risk to me if I catch covid19. We’re not all gamma-male slobs like you who will die if we catch a bad cold – you prolish clown.

    On the other hand, you have zero knowledge or idea of what these highly experimental treatments are doing to people and you won’t know for years.

    Or tell me, why are decade long clinical trials forced upon drug manufacturers for every other drug on they make, if the ‘risk’ of anything going ‘wrong’ is infinitesimally small? Why can they not simply test them on the public – as with this one?

    Imagine the clown world we are now in where beta male bugmen like m0nty are shilling for global mega corps and dismissing government rules and regulations and science as useless!

    I’m dying here! It’s literally an IQ test!

  144. Bar Beach Swimmer says:

    Monty, snide remarks do not an argument make.

  145. twostix says:

    Pro-experimental vaccine covidian: “If it saves just one life (read: mine), 1000 children’s lives being completely ruined by brain damage would be worth it!”.

  146. Lee says:

    I’d imagine that a few Lucius critics here would have made fine leaders of the Inquisition that saw off Galileo. I wonder how many are rusty bikes?

    This from a sanctimonious authoritarian, telling everyone he or she should take the vaccine.
    Stuff the lot of you!

  147. m0nty says:

    There is zero risk to me if I catch covid19.

    That is just not true. You may want it to be true, but it is not.

    You got lucky so far. One day life will roll you snake eyes, and you’ll squeal like a stuck pig and call for mummy. Until then you can pretend you are bulletproof, but you just look like a dickhead.

  148. twostix says:

    You got lucky so far. One day life will roll you snake eyes, and you’ll squeal like a stuck pig and call for mummy. Until then you can pretend you are bulletproof, but you just look like a dickhead.

    m0nty, after 14 months of study, the science is in you anti-science global-corp shilling bugman loon. 0% risk to healthy men under 50.

    Stop projecting your pathetic apartment-bound computer loser, physical frailness onto all of human kind.

    We’re not like you.

    It’s just you and old people at risk. Like all illnesses.

    So off you trot and have your highly experimental pre-treatment. Good luck and god speed.

    But I see you. That’s not what you’re after. What you want, is after a lifetime of seething watching normal healthy people living life like we’re ‘bulletproof’ (aka normally), is us all of us normal healthy people to (be forced to) join you in taking this experimental concoction – which you must have, and we don’t need, so if it goes wrong for you, it goes wrong for all of us.

    Fail.

    No.

  149. Rosie says:

    No one saw off Galileo, he dies, an old man, of natural causes.

  150. m0nty says:

    It’s just you and old people at risk. Like all illnesses.

    LOL. You are shitscared of vaccines. Don’t worry 26, no one is going to hold you down and force you, you and your precious bodily fluids are safe.

    Until you breathe in something nasty one random day. Better for you to not go outside.

  151. Figures says:

    Chance of developing narcolepsy from Pandremix: 0.002%
    Chance of dying if you caught H1N1 while unvaccinated: 0.02%

    Except that you also have to take into account the probability that you might catch H1N1 (which is significantly less than 100 per cent). That is how non-morons do maths Monty.

    You’re welcome for the lesson.

    Of course, that assumes your numbers are correct – which they’re not. There was zero evidence anybody died as a result of the H1N1 virus because without challenge, rechallenge (and dechallenge if applicable) then there is no meaningful way to prove causation.

    We have challenge, rechallenge events associated with vaccines – ergo we know for certain they cause injuries.

    You got lucky so far. One day life will roll you snake eyes, and you’ll squeal like a stuck pig and call for mummy.

    Twostix is being extremely kind to people like you here. He is using the official figures even though there are no challenge, rechallenge events associated with COVID to prove that it has caused any harm.

    But maybe I’m wrong Monty. Do you have one? Just one mind. Just one solitary case of someone (observably) contracting the virus, immediately getting sick, getting better and then observably contracting the virus once more and immediately getting sick.

    If you can’t find just one solitary case of this then we have no choice but to conclude – using science (I know you love science) that there is no evidence that COVID has caused any harm whatsoever.

  152. Figures says:

    Until you breathe in something nasty one random day. Better for you to not go outside.

    Says the guy who has been petrified of not wearing a mask for the past 14 months!

    Unbelievable. How do you have so much chutzpah?

  153. calli says:

    m0nty says:
    May 24, 2021 at 12:19 pm
    Righto Roger, I grant that some Cats have had the shots and said so, and some others have probably had the shots and are keeping schtum about it for fear of a pile on. Bravo to those hardy souls. The rest of you lot are mostly mentally stunted individuals who lack compassion.

    That is demonstrably untrue.

    My husband has had his first jab. He decided that this was the right thing for him to do for a number of reasons.

    Not one single commenter here has made a disparaging remark about his decision or asked me why I didn’t maaaaaake him stop. And for that I respect them all and value them greatly.

    This is what personal choice and personal responsibility is all about.

  154. Ed Case says:

    The first 4 substantive comments, didn’t read further as excessive laughter has been known to be fatal:

    1. You cock.
    2. Fuck off, you moron.
    3.You are an idiot.
    4. GAGF

    Here’s the deal:
    Women network and Men don’t [Gays excepted, but they luuurve the idea of breeders being sterilised by vaxxes.{Not that I’m suggesting the CovidVaxx will sterilise women, I’m not, but hey, that’s what some Internet loons are saying}].
    Even Lezzos wanna have kids [blecccccchhhh], so whatcha gonna do about that, Hunt?

  155. Ed Case says:

    Addendum:
    Old Boilers are having the Vax in droves, so Hunt is clearly concerned about Jabbing all Women of childbearing age.

  156. Beertruk says:

    Maybe you aren’t old enough to remember Thalidomide.

    My thought as well.

    Munts now shrilling for Thalidomide.

  157. Rosie says:

    Aw Calli they’re just scared of your mighty arm.

    Actually quite a few people have commented that they and or their spouses have been vaccinated, without attracting comments.

  158. Albatross says:

    Lucy you’re an absolute brainlet dickhead.

  159. Albatross says:

    Lucius Quinctius Cincinnatus says:
    May 24, 2021 at 8:16 am
    I’ve struck gold with mh, 132andBush and Riversutra the antivaxxers

    You are a massive tool. You are the worst poster here, bar none.

  160. Frank says:

    Chance of developing narcolepsy from Pandremix: 0.002%
    Chance of dying if you caught H1N1 while unvaccinated: 0.02%

    Everything in life is a risk. Breathing in and out is a risk. Vaccines are a risk, but it is a far bigger risk to stay unvaccinated. We are talking orders of magnitude here, it’s not even a contest.

    Hysterics and innumeracy at the same time. Tenfold is an order of magnitude, but please, do continue to haughtily lecture about relative probabilities.

  161. Dot says:

    Until you breathe in something nasty one random day. Better for you to not go outside.

    ???

    He’s not scared of catching a virus because he’s young and healthy.

    You moron.

  162. Dot says:

    ‘elf experts:

    Anti vaxxers ruin herd immunity for us all.

    The new vaccine should be taken by all.

    The new vaccine doesn’t confer herd immunity and infection or vaccination doesn’t stop reinfection.

    Oh dear.

  163. Ed Case says:

    Government by Gaslighting.
    There’s always someone who won’t conform, how long before they start publishing names and addresses?

  164. MatrixTransform says:

    Lucius, your’e an idiot.

    eloquent … but still, an idiot

  165. Dusty says:

    Let me be the first to say: LQC is NOT a libertarian. If you’re advocating for a government vaccine, you’re none but a government good. If you intend on using force to get somebody to take it, and blame the government thinking it’s moral to do lockdowns on people saying no, please suckstart a shotgun at your earliest convenience.

  166. MatrixTransform says:

    LQC is the kind of chap that loves counting all the things that he knows for sure.

    roll the words , empathy, diversity and vaccine into a paragraph and you got a winner.

    sometimes too often, the smartest in the room spend too much time talkin’ rather than sayin’

    we got ourselves another school-girl version of how things really are

  167. Tim Neilson says:

    m0nty says:
    May 24, 2021 at 12:25 pm

    Once you cop a transmission in the wild post-vax you don’t tend to get it again.

    And your evidence for that in relation to coronaviruses is…?
    Nil – because there’s never been an effective vaccine against a coronavirus, and even if we have hit the jackpot this time it’s way too early to tell.
    FFS m0nty, just how self-deluded are you?

    Guess what Mater, the flu vaccine works exactly the same way.

    So the purpose of annual flu jabs is herd immunity? Funny that they allow them to be voluntary then.

    Actually m0nty, the real free riders are the fat turds like you. If you laid off the doughnuts and got on the exercise bike we’d have fewer vulnerable people so the threat of the virus would be way less and we’d need less restriction.
    Compulsory diets and exercise for fat turds- NOW!!!

  168. m0nty says:

    And your evidence for that in relation to coronaviruses is…?

    It is extremely rare to catch COVID twice. There have only been a handful of documented cases.

  169. m0nty says:

    COVID-19, to be specific.

  170. m0nty says:

    Hysterics and innumeracy at the same time. Tenfold is an order of magnitude, but please, do continue to haughtily lecture about relative probabilities.

    The relevant numbers for COVID-19 I referred to earlier are one in a million versus one in a hundred, i.e. four orders of magnitude.

  171. FlyingPigs says:

    how come there is a new flu vaccine…. every year?

  172. FlyingPigs says:

    flu vac 2022 and beyond will be an interesting brew.

  173. Figures says:

    It is extremely rare to catch COVID twice.

    So you admit there’s no evidence that COVID is pathogenic then?

  174. Tim Neilson says:

    m0nty said Once you cop a transmission in the wild post-vax you don’t tend to get it again.

    I asked And your evidence for that in relation to coronaviruses is…?

    m0nty said It is extremely rare to catch COVID twice. There have only been a handful of documented cases.

    What’s your evidence about COVID-19 “post-vax”, which was the assertion you made and which I asked about?

  175. Figures says:

    how come there is a new flu vaccine…. every year?

    It’s funny how nobody ever questions this nonsense. Apparently the flu virus “mutates” into four or five new strains every year rendering our current vaccines worthless (somehow, the measles or polio or chickenpox viruses have never mutated once (at least not in a way to render vaccines impotent)).

    But hang on. If the flu virus mutated four times this year, and four times last year and the year before etc, then wouldn’t there be thousands (millions?) of flu variants all floating around from this and previous years? Getting a new shot to cover just four strains gives me the same chances of being protected from the flu than being struck by lightning. Twice. Inside.

    Like I said, nobody ever stops to ask the obvious question about what the (unstated) assumptions are. But the unstated assumption is that once a flu virus mutates into a new strain, every single one of the trillions of virus particles of the old strain magically disappears. Of course, that’s why it never gets stated – because it’s obviously ridiculous.

    If you want to actually know why flu vaccines are given every year it is because flu is a very generic disease – it’s so common and can easily be diagnosed by the patients themselves such that it is very hard for doctors to pretend that the vaccines have worked by diagnosing flu as something else the way they do for measles, polio, smallpox, etc.

    Because of this even the *official* data makes it very clear that the flu shots are completely worthless. Now, if vaccines weren’t the cultiest cult that ever culted then that would mean that they would be rejected as worthless – because even the official data shows they don’t work. But, of course, vaccines are the cultiest cult that ever culted. Everybody who believes in vaccines is the victim of history’s most astonishing level of indoctrination such that none of them can think straight.

    So what t0 do?

    Well they can’t stop them but they need some excuse to explain away the fact that even the official data shows they are useless. So they come up with this lunacy of “it’s the damn mutations!” People swallow this nonsense. Of course they do. Vaccines are the cultiest cult that ever culted. If the government stood up and said “vaccines work because I once encountered a leprechaun that told me they did” then everybody would believe in leprechauns. So instead of the (ostensible) uselessness of the flu shots being a reason not to get them, they’re actually a reason to get more of them!

    You can’t make this up.

    There is not one aspect of the vaccine paradigm that’s possible, let alone true.

  176. m0nty says:

    So you admit there’s no evidence that COVID is pathogenic then?

    They have isolated the virus. We have pictures. It was in all the papers.

    You are a paranoid fool, Figures. What other silliness do you believe in? Lizard people, crop circles, chemtrails, Lysenkoism, trepanning? That stuff is about as credible as germ theory denialism.

  177. Rex Anger says:

    They have isolated the virus. We have pictures. It was in all the papers.

    Looks like Russian disinformation to me…

    #Chortle

  178. m0nty says:

    What’s your evidence about COVID-19 “post-vax”, which was the assertion you made and which I asked about?

    Have you heard of any cases of someone getting the vaccine and than catching the virus twice? No? The onus is on you to prove that such an event has ever happened, Tim N.

  179. PeterW says:

    I’ve spent the whole of my adult life doing what is necessary to maintain decent metabolic health.

    I see no reason why I should accept a treatment that doesn’t do what a good vaccine does, so that the fat, lazy, self-indulgent hand-wringers can feel “safe”.
    If it worked, you could take it and be safe, yourself. The very fact that you don’t have confidence in that, tells me that there is something fundamentally wrong,

    I’m also not forgetting that you are the same people who supported lockdowns, despite the fact that the documented transmission of Covid in the outdoors, between people keeping minimal personal space…. is lower than that for complications from your supposedly “safe” vaccine.
    I’m not forgetting that you continue to support lockdowns despite an increasingly long list of published research showing that lockdowns are not cost-effective at saving lives…. and almost certainly cost more in quality life-years than they save.

    When I hear someone shouting that we should “do it for the country”, I am reminded of that class of people for whom the (pretence of patriotism) is one of their last refuges.

    Scoundrels.

  180. PeterW says:

    m0nty says:
    May 25, 2021 at 9:50 am
    What’s your evidence about COVID-19 “post-vax”, which was the assertion you made and which I asked about?

    Have you heard of any cases of someone getting the vaccine and than catching the virus twice? No? The onus is on you to prove that such an event has ever happened, Tim N.

    That is a lie.
    It is a lie because the onus is upon anyone selling a medical product and/or treatment , to convincingly demonstrate that it is both safe and effective. That is why we have standards for trials.

  181. Terry says:

    Montifa bleats:
    ‘You are a paranoid fool, Figures. What other silliness do you believe in? Lizard people, crop circles, chemtrails, Lysenkoism, trepanning?’

    The fallacy of guilt by association.

    It is entirely irrelevant to the safety and efficacy of these “vaccines” if Figures believes in crop circles, chemtrails, or that the moon is made of cheese (Tasty Cheddar, of course).

    In the same way that your support of identity politics, collectivism, and doughnut therapy is entirely irrelevant.

    …but do keep parading your maldeveloped logic and reason; a pristine specimen of a Dunning-Kruger dullard.

  182. Figures says:

    They have isolated the virus. We have pictures. It was in all the papers.

    Yes but you have to remember one very salient point Monty.

    You’re a brainwashed moron.

    You see, the ability to take a photo of something has literally zero connection with the ability to prove that it is the cause of pathogenesis.

    I can take photos of lots of things. The stars, trees, houses, other people, my pet dog. It doesn’t mean that those things are the cause of respiratory (or any other kind of) disease. And only an utter imbecile would think that it might.

    An utter imbecile.

    AKA you.

    If you weren’t a brainwashed moron you would have realised that showing a photo of something is an absolutely ridiculous way of proving that it causes pathogenesis.

    But, alas, you are a brainwashed moron.

    Have you heard of any cases of someone getting the vaccine and than catching the virus twice? The onus is on you to prove that such an event has ever happened

    Ummm Monty, you need to take a step back. The onus is on *you* to prove that *anybody* has gotten sick immediately following them catching the virus for the first time. And as I say above, showing a photo of something or other is not good evidence. Indeed, it’s not even good enough to be called ‘flimsy’ evidence.

  183. Figures says:

    The fallacy of guilt by association.

    It is entirely irrelevant to the safety and efficacy of these “vaccines” if Figures believes in crop circles, chemtrails, or that the moon is made of cheese (Tasty Cheddar, of course).

    All true Terry but you have to realise just how clever and witty Monty thinks he is by regurgitating this drivel.

  184. Kneel says:

    “Have you heard of any cases of someone getting the vaccine and than catching the virus…”

    Interesting, don’t you think, to look at the “cases” and “deaths” in places like India – looks awfully like something weird is going on. I mean, India had a small ‘peak’, then it was tailing off asymptotically, then they started vaccinating and – poof! – the numbers head north, big time. Nor is this confined to just India – aside from the “early” places that had it, this appears to be true for at least some significant proportion of places.

    Now there could be any number of reasons for that, but most likely (to me, anyway) is that the vaccine is not conferring immunity at the required level, and so it is like stopping taking the anti-biotics when you start to feel better instead of doing the whole course – you are applying selective pressure for the virus to mutate so as to evade the vaccines forced immune response.
    This is surely a significant issue, most especially if the vaccine reduces your innate immunity in a narrow spectrum of corona virus’ – you may be more susceptible to most variants then the unvaccinated. Even worse, if the mutations are more easily transmitted and/or more lethal, this is definitely something we want to avoid.

    For me, and aside from the risks of using a “short circuited” testing regime for any medical treatment – provisionally approved by the TGA or not – I am not convinced that, for me, it is worth it. Why? Because I rarely seem to suffer from colds and/or flu – for the last 30 years, I can recall only 2 or 3 times where I was “smashed” by such a virus and needed to stay abed for even a day or so to recover, and those were ones where people I knew were absolutely caned by it, and abed for a week or so ( and I was in close contact with them, even while they were sick!) Most times, when I do get sick from such things, it is more annoying than debilitating – sneezes, runny nose etc is about the limit of what I seem to suffer. So it seems that I may have a well trained innate immune response to such virus’, and given the extremely low mortality (and the age and comorbidity correlation too), I just don’t see the need to get a vaccine. And further, since asymptomatic transmission is, just as for most such virus’, pretty much non-existent (or at least very, very low) I don’t imagine that I would impose much risk on anyone else either, should I catch it. Travel is not an issue for me – I don’t even have a passport and have never been inclined to travel overseas, and have no plans for even interstate travel in the foreseeable future.

    Of course, this is my personal experience and circumstance, and others may reach the same or different conclusions – that is their choice, and provided they believe they are making an informed choice, it’s all good. Anyone who thinks they are doing it “for the country” is taking a big chance – such choices should be guided by a sober perusal of the relevant risks and benefits, in conjunction with a consultation and associated discussion with your own personal physician. Relying on authority to supply “general” information is foolhardy in the extreme – we are all different, and have different circumstances.

  185. Kneel says:

    “…or that the moon is made of cheese (Tasty Cheddar, of course)”

    Don’t be ridiculous – it’s Danish blue or similar, hence the mottled surface!

  186. Tim Neilson says:

    M0nty you fat idiot, you can’t possibly believe that the few months that the vaccine has been in use are sufficient for you to draw that conclusion.

  187. Tim Neilson says:

    M0nty you fat idiot, you can’t possibly believe that the few months that the vaccine has been in use are sufficient to justify your conclusion.

  188. m0nty says:

    You didn’t answer the question though Figures. What other stupid rubbish do you believe in? It’s never just one thing with fools like you, your gullibility is odds on to extend to other such garbage because you have no sense of perspective on how dumb you are.

    How about the Protocols? That’s what it usually leads to.

  189. m0nty says:

    M0nty you fat idiot, you can’t possibly believe that the few months that the vaccine has been in use are sufficient for you to draw that conclusion.

    So you have no hard proof at all then Tim N. Good to know that your abject fear is based on nothing but suppositions and apparitions.

  190. Figures says:

    You didn’t answer the question though Figures.

    ???

    How stupid are you?

    If I don’t believe you can get sick from COVID in the first place why would I claim the vaccinated can still catch it? Others have (quite reasonably) pointed out that even if you accept the dangers of the virus then the vaccine is worthless. But I go a step further.

    Now why don’t you explain how you thought photos of random biological detritus *proved* that the COVID virus was real and pathogenic?

    PS you’re an imbecile.

  191. Figures says:

    Good to know that your abject fear is based on nothing but suppositions and apparitions.

    Again, there are challenge, rechallenge events associated with the vaccine and injuries – therefore we know with 99.9999 per cent certainty that the vaccine is dangerous.

    There are zero challenge, rechallenge (not even challenge) events associated with the virus and injuries and therefore we have zero reason to believe that the virus is in any way dangerous.

    That is how science (actual science as opposed to the blind authority following that you do) works.

  192. m0nty says:

    It is amazing how arrogant anti-vaxxers are about their wrong beliefs. You’d think that being in a tiny minority of losers in life would humble them somewhat. Figures fits right in at the Cat though, the home of the Lost Cause.

  193. Fat Tony says:

    Kneel says:
    May 25, 2021 at 1:03 pm
    “…or that the moon is made of cheese (Tasty Cheddar, of course)”
    Don’t be ridiculous – it’s Danish blue or similar, hence the mottled surface!

    At the Science “meeting” that decided to dig the Mohole, a proposal was put up to prove the Moon was made of green cheese.
    (From my science (geologist) lecturer in the early 1970s – he was at the meeting & not everyone was sober).

  194. Figures says:

    You’d think that being in a tiny minority of losers in life would humble them somewhat.

    Anti-vaxers are typically wealthier and better educated than people who regularly inject neurotoxins into themselves and their children. Our kids are, of course, vastly less sick too – that’s why the government refuses to release Medicare spending data on vaxed kids vs unvaxed kids.

    We’re just better people – braver, smarter, richer. Probably better looking and better at sports too.

    Having said that I do note your hatred of any poorly treated minority. I assume you believe indigenous Australians are poorly treated so you obviously despise them.

    Why do you hate indigenous Australians so much Monty? Is it because you’re a white supremacist?

    Have you always been a white supremacist? How many hate crimes have you committed?

  195. Figures says:

    And when are you going to provide even so much as a shred of evidence that the virus is pathogenic?

  196. Timothy Neilson says:

    So you have no hard proof at all then Tim N.

    “Proof” of what you fat idiot?
    You made a big statement about immunity post-vax.
    I asked for your evidence.
    It soon became apparent that you didn’t have any.
    And now you’ve beclowned yourself even further by demanding that I provide “proof” of my request for evidence of your big statement.

  197. Timothy Neilson says:

    Why is my comment in moderation?
    Is it because I called m0nty a fat idiot?

  198. Bill says:

    UK has vaxxed about 61% of population. Covid cases are down about 96% from peak. Covid deaths are down about 99.9%. (Currently about one a day).

    Amazing that some people can actually believe the vaccines don’t work.

  199. Timothy Neilson says:

    UK has vaxxed about 61% of population. Covid cases are down about 96% from peak. Covid deaths are down about 99.9%. (Currently about one a day).

    Amazing that some people can actually believe the vaccines don’t work.

    I understand that they’ve also changed their methodologies for COVID testing and for characterising deaths as COVID related.

    That’s not any sort of proof that the vaccines don’t work, but I’d be wary of assuming that any set of government statistics is designed to tell you the truth.

  200. Timothy Neilson says:

    [Previous comment that for some reason has been blocked – here’s hoping this time.]

    So you have no hard proof at all then Tim N.

    “Proof” of what you fat idiot?
    You made a big statement about immunity post-vax.
    I asked for your evidence.
    It soon became apparent that you didn’t have any.
    And now you’ve beclowned yourself even further by demanding that I provide “proof” of my request for evidence of your big statement.

  201. Timothy Neilson says:

    S o y o u h a v e n o h a r d p r o o f a t a l l t h e n T i m N .
    ” P r o o f ” o f w h a t y o u f a t i d i o t ?
    Y o u m a d e a b i g s t a t e m e n t a b o u t i m m u n i t y p o s t – v a x .
    I a s k e d f o r y o u r e v i d e n c e .
    I t s o o n b e c am e a p p a r e n t t h a t y o u d i d n ‘ t h a v e a n y .
    A n d n o w y o u ‘ v e b e c l o w n e d y o u r s e l f e v e n f u r t h e r b y
    d e m a n d i n g I p r o v i d e ” p r o o f ‘ o f m y r e q e s t f o r e v i d e n c e o f yo u r b i g s t a t e m e n t .

  202. Figures says:

    UK has vaxxed about 61% of population. Covid cases are down about 96% from peak. Covid deaths are down about 99.9%.

    Amazing that some people don’t understand what a “self-fulfilling prophecy” is.

    When vaccine programs are introduced, diagnostic criteria usually changes. What’s more, doctors themselves are reluctant to diagnose the condition if the patient is vaccinated.

    If you understood the virus “tests” you would know that they give whatever result the pathologist likes depending on how many cycles they *choose* to run. If they run less cycles (which they typically do for the vaccinated) then they dramatically reduce the number of positive cases. Amazing that here we are 14 months down the track and some people are so ignorant and brainwashed that they haven’t bothered to learn how PCR “testing” works.

    You don’t need catallaxy you know. You can go to the IAEA website where there is a good explanation of how PCR works. Spoiler alert: when you understand it you soon realise that there is no way PCR can sensibly be used as a diagnostic test because the number of cycles the pathologist *chooses* is completely arbitrary.

  203. Figures says:

    Oh sorry Bill I should also add that there was this guy called Kary Mullis who said that under no circumstances should PCR be used as a diagnostic tool for the above reasons.

    Now this guy Kary Mullis was pretty smart. He even won a Nobel Prize in chemistry – and I know pro-vaxers love people in authority with science degrees.

    Can you guess what he won the Nobel Prize for Bill?

    It was for an invention. Can you guess what he invented Bill?

    Yes that’s right. He invented the PCR.

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