How will the Taliban’s bullshit stories be recorded now?

Like the gallows of Nuremberg prevented Germans reporting the ‘war crimes’ of the Allies…

Australia’s decision to close its embassy in Afghanistan by the end of this week could impede investigations into alleged war crimes by ADF troops who served there, the Office of the Special Investigator has warned…

OSI director-general Chris Moraitis told a Senate estimates hearing on Tuesday that closing the embassy could make it more difficult to prepare briefs of evidence into the alleged unlawful killing of 39 Afghan prisoners and civilians by Special Forces soldiers between 2005 and 2016.

“Clearly having access to Afghanistan and witnesses in Afghanistan is important, therefore the closure of an embassy would not be ideal. However, we have contingencies to deal with and we look forward to what comes in the future,” Mr Moraitis said.

 
Meanwhile, Endless Warrior Greg Sheridan Stan Grants the withdrawal’s historical meaning:

The decision to withdraw Australia’s embassy from Afghanistan, and operate on a fly-in, fly-out basis, is one of the most depressing and telling signs of the utter, abject failure of 20 years of Australian, and Western, policy in ­Afghanistan. It is contemptible and pathetic, and a massive indictment of everything that is wrong with the Western strategic personality.

How do civilisations fail? It is often said they lose resolve and confidence, a sense of self belief, of purpose. They also lose the ability to do complex things in moral and operational grey zones, which requires steadiness and low-key, agile and sustained engagement.

 
I’ve read St Augustine, Gibbon and Shirer – and many other chroniclers of collapse besides – and have never encountered this “often said” PowerPoint presentation. The ‘civilisation’ that has failed is the Afghani one – clearly – and, more broadly, the Islamic world that allowed that country and many others to become unsalvageable toilets. As for the West and lessons learned, history shows that civilisations not only fail because they don’t know when to fight. Some fail because they don’t know when to quit.

This entry was posted in War and peace, Western Civilsation. Bookmark the permalink.

30 Responses to How will the Taliban’s bullshit stories be recorded now?

  1. Roger says:

    The decision to withdraw Australia’s embassy from Afghanistan, and operate on a fly-in, fly-out basis, is one of the most depressing and telling signs of the utter, abject failure of 20 years of Australian, and Western, policy in ­Afghanistan.

    The most serious failure was putting Western troops on the ground there to begin with.

  2. a happy little debunker says:

    ‘Failures’ to bring Afghanistan into the ‘civilised’ world

    The first Persian Empire, 5th century BC
    Alexander the Great, 330BC
    The Arab Caliphate, 7th century
    Mongol Empire, 12th century
    Tamerlane (Timur) and Mughal Empire, 13th century
    The Sikh Empire invasion, 1837-1838
    The British Empire x 3, 1838-1842, 1878-1880 and 1919
    The Soviets x 3, 1929, 1930 and 1979
    The Coalition of the willing, 2001

    It is not the civilised that has failed Afghanistan, but Afghanistan that has continually failed to be civilised…

  3. Tom says:

    Ouch! Stan Grant is now a verb.

  4. calli says:

    I’ve read St Augustine, Gibbon and Shirer – and many other chroniclers of collapse besides – and have never encountered this “often said” PowerPoint presentation.

    Lol.

    Perhaps in the author’s ever diminishing bubble spheres it is “often said”.

    Pop!

  5. theleftfootkick says:

    Way back when the first President Bush took military action in the middle east, an old WW1 digger in Tasmania at the time was asked what he thought about it, (he was 103 at the time), one of the things he said, rough quote ‘the middle east people, don’t like other people in their lands’. He went on to say, if they are going to go in, then do it and get out quick, it will only end in a bad way, if they hang around’.

  6. Spurgeon Monkfish III says:

    How will the Taliban’s bullshit stories be recorded now?

    It’s a satisfactory outcome if they aren’t. Just hurry up and close the embassy, you imbeciles.

  7. Professor Fred Lenin says:

    Read the history of the SS Einsatzgruppen of the Socialist Hitlers gang if you want war crimes , this persecution of special forces on incidents happening in a hot war situation is bullshit . The globalist left trying to demonise the honest military to make the crimes of their socialist comrades of today and the past .
    Einsatzgruppen murdered over one million people by hooting in mass murder Aktions in Eastern Europe ,mostly Jews read the history ,you will be shockedat te coldblooded way the murders were conducted by the supporters of National Socialism .

  8. Pyrmonter says:

    The Lad should read more widely: George Macdonald Fraser essayed the sort of mess people get into in Afgahnistan presciently.

  9. Des Deskperson says:

    To ‘Stan Grant’

    Provisional definition:

    ‘To attempt to disguise banal and unoriginal thinking through self-conscious, superficial and clumsy displays of erudition.’

  10. C.L. says:

    My dear Pyrmonter, did I say nobody had essayed the sort of mess people get into in Afghanistan presciently?

    Or did I say that I’d never come across Sheridan’s buzzword-laden committee-speak in a treatise on civilisational failure?

  11. Professor Fred Lenin says:

    I re read this ,isnt it awfull that the globalists wont be able to use the embassy staff to record the “evidence” the Taliban have concocted in this fit up .
    The global snowflakes will of course go there in person to chat to their Taliban friends , may I suggest the feminists and lesbians be sent for this task ,they would have a very interesting time with these extreme muslim mysogeniss, might even be converted into being women .

  12. Terry says:

    ‘…may I suggest the feminists and lesbians be sent for this task ‘

    So, who will volunteer into harm’s way to locate and rescue the missing lesbian platoon? (presuming they’ve kept their heads. of course).

  13. Woolfe says:

    How will the Taliban’s bullshit stories be recorded now?

    Well we could send Bruce Pascoe over to chronicle them?

  14. jupes says:

    OSI director-general Chris Moraitis …

    So the organisation with the sole purpose of jailing diggers is of such size and importance that it has a director-general. What an appalling waste of money and resources.

    Dutton needs to shut down this clown show today.

  15. jupes says:

    OSI director-general Chris Moraitis told a Senate estimates hearing on Tuesday that closing the embassy could make it more difficult to prepare briefs of evidence into the alleged unlawful killing of 39 Afghan prisoners and civilians by Special Forces soldiers between 2005 and 2016.

    They have been doing this for months now. On average, four OSI staff for one digger. What have these traitors been doing every day? Even with the enemy’s evidence bullshit, there will only be a limited amount of evidence available. As most of these alleged events occured a decade or so ago, if they don’t have the evidence now, they are not going to get it. Unless of course they were using the time to coach the Taliban. In which case, the OSI staff are the ones who should be charged.

  16. Old Lefty says:

    Meanwhile Nine media drops its allegations of murder against Roberts-Smith at the eleventh hour. By now, of course, he has already had to shell out handsomely on lawyers’ fees to contest the claim. The process is the punishment.

  17. Tezza says:

    CL is unfair to Sheridan’s article, which at some length goes on to make thoughtful points about the lessons from failure of open-ended commitments to nation-building cf time limited military support with more modest objectives, and sustained broader assistance from offshore. Whether Sheridan is right or not we can think about for ourselves once we consider Sheridan’s arguments and examples, but CL’s put down is unwarranted.

  18. Bruce says:

    “It is not the civilised that has failed Afghanistan, but Afghanistan that has continually failed to be civilised…”

    Before Mo’s Marauders showed up to “make an offer that could not be refused” (at scimitar-point), that part of the world was BUDDHIST.

    NOTE WELL that the “Taliban” (translates as “students”) systematically destroyed ANYTHING that was not in “accordance” with their nasty little book.

    Thus, for starters, the utter destruction of the huge Buddha statues at Bamiyan, and video thereof broadcast globally as a “lesson”.

    Note also that the Saudis have been steadily erasing any evidence of anything pre-Mo, for several decades.

  19. Ed Case says:

    a happy little debunker says:

    It is not the civilised that has failed Afghanistan, but Afghanistan that has continually failed to be civilised…

    The problem here is a lack of understanding of misused terms.
    Civilised, Barbarian, and Savage are Scientific Anthropological terms of the 19th Century.
    Darwin used these terms in their correct context, which is:
    Savages are Hunter Gatherers
    Barbarians are people that use Farming, but have no system of Writing, and Civilised are those that have a System of Writing.
    So, Afghanis are Civilised, and we should have stayed the fuck out of their country.

  20. PeterW says:

    civilize (v.)
    c. 1600, “to bring out of barbarism, introduce order and civil organization among, refine and enlighten,” from French civiliser, verb from Old French civil (adj.), from Latin civilis “relating to a citizen, relating to public life, befitting a citizen; popular, affable, courteous,”

    savage (adj.)
    mid-13c., “fierce, ferocious;” c. 1300, “wild, undomesticated, untamed” (of animals and places), from Old French sauvage, salvage “wild, savage, untamed, strange, pagan,” from Late Latin salvaticus, alteration of silvaticus “wild,” literally “of the woods,” from silva “forest, grove” (see sylvan). Of persons, the meaning “reckless, ungovernable” is attested from c. 1400, earlier in sense “indomitable, valiant” (c. 1300

    barbarian (n.)
    early 15c., in reference to classical history, “a non-Roman or non-Greek,” earlier barbar (late 14c.) “non-Roman or non-Greek person; non-Christian; person speaking a language different from one’s own,” from Medieval Latin barbarinus (source of Old French barbarin “Berber, pagan, Saracen, barbarian”), from Latin barbarus “strange, foreign, barbarous,” from Greek barbaros “foreign, strange; ignorant,” from PIE root *barbar- echoic of unintelligible speech of foreigners (compare Sanskrit barbara- “stammering,” also “non-Aryan,” Latin balbus “stammering,” Czech blblati “to stammer”).

    From the Dictionary on Etymology.
    Those terms predate Darwin by centuries, and he was not using them correctly.
    Let’s not be silly.

  21. Primer says:

    Afghanistan was lost the minute the west stayed to make it like the west.
    The history of Imperial Empires and Communist Imperial Empires over centuries in Afghanistan taught the bright Harvard boys nothing…..as usual.

    We went there so Al Q couldn’t be run from there as govt department, when the Taliban run the place again we’ll see how that worked out.

  22. Ed Case says:

    Hi PeterW,
    nowhere did I suggest that Darwin invented those Terms, merely that he used those Terms in their correct context and meaning.
    The rest of your comment is tendentious drivel.

  23. PeterW says:

    nowhere did I suggest that Darwin invented those Terms, merely that he used those Terms in their correct context and meaning.

    Not inventing those terms means that he is not at liberty to change their definitions to suit himself.
    If you wish to claim otherwise, then cite your authority.

    The rest of your comment is tendentious drivel.

    … and perhaps you should look in the mirror for that. Attempting to critique foreign policy using a weak semantic argument. 🙄

  24. PeterW says:

    Darwin used these terms in their correct context, which is:
    Savages are Hunter Gatherers
    Barbarians are people that use Farming, but have no system of Writing, and Civilised are those that have a System of Writing.
    So, Afghanis are Civilised, and we should have stayed the fuck out of their country.

    No. They were not and Darwin did not.
    Definitions copied from the Dictionary of Etymology show that these terms are centuries older than Darwin, and not “scientific” terms in the way that you claim. Unfortunately, something about copying the definitions has attracted the attention of the Mod-Bot.
    “Savages” are wild, untamed, literally, “those who live in the woods”.
    “Barbarians are foreigners. Not Romans, not Greeks. Not like us.
    “Civilised” people are ordered, refined and courteous.

  25. PeterW says:

    Oh and Ed?

    A mate of mine is a veteran with multiple tours over there. He describes discovering a group of women gathered sitting around a well in rural Afghan. The interpreter explained that a child had fallen down the well. As the child was a girl, and girls are not important, the Afghan men could not be bothered getting her out.

    The women were waiting for her to die.

    That, and other neat little habits like keeping 12yo boys around for sexual purposes, don’t fit within any definition of “civilised” that I know of. I don’t care if they could write better than Homer and Shakespeare combined.

    Now maybe, just maybe, there are good arguments for adopting a different military strategy… but dodgy claims about “scientific” language aren’t a good start.

    Old-mate insists that they were doing damned good work….. the problem has been the hand-wringers who wanted it done without paying the cost in blood. Ours or theirs. Preferably theirs.

    The blunt answer is that you don’t go to war unless you are prepared to pay the damned price.

  26. Robber Baron says:

    These beta males envy alpha males.

  27. Des Deskperson says:

    ‘So the organisation with the sole purpose of jailing diggers is of such size and importance that it has a director-general.’

    Moraitis was formerly Secretary of the Attorney-Deneral’s Department.

    Hs ‘total remuneration package’ – salary, employer super contribution, car, and various other perks – in that job was $775,910 p.a.

    His current ‘package’ is almost certainly the same.

  28. Timothy Neilson says:

    Hs ‘total remuneration package’ – salary, employer super contribution, car, and various other perks – in that job was $775,910 p.a.

    So we’re paying some ponce about the same as the official remuneration of the POTUS to run the enemy’s propaganda for them?
    Too stupid to survive.

  29. Timothy Neilson says:

    As for the West and lessons learned, history shows that civilisations not only fail because they don’t know when to fight. Some fail because they don’t know when to quit.

    True no doubt, though the only examples that immediately spring to mind are the Athenians at Syracuse and Operation Barbarossa (if the latter can be counted as the action of a “civilisation”).
    But I really don’t think that’s the West’s main problem. We could keep fighting in Afghanistan for centuries and not do anywhere near as much damage to ourselves as we do with “multiculturalism” etc.

  30. Oscr says:

    There never seemed to be much reason for getting involved in bringing civilisation to Afghanistan at the same time as Islam was being imported into Australia.

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *

This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Learn how your comment data is processed.